Weekend question II: What to do with granddaughter who had clandestine abortion?
I received the following email this week requesting my advice and received permission to pose the dilemma to my readers for theirs:
I am a 66yo grandmother raising my 17yo granddaughter for 7 months. She was in horrible living and abusive conditions with her father and addict girlfriend.
My conditions were that she bring her grades from D’s and F’s to passing levels so she could attend college at 19, keep her room neat, and sometimes lend a hand with housework.
In return I would give her a home to bring her friends, make sure she had spending money, clothes, transport, and most of all lots of hugs and smiles. I couldn’t take away the last 4 years of what she had been through, but I could try and make her future better.
I stressed that with me, she was always going to be considered innocent until proven otherwise and since there would be no fear factors, then no reasons to lie about anything. I would not question or police her unless she broke her curfew (she never has and her grades are all A’s) and keeps me advised of where she is and who she is with when she visits friends or the mall even thought I drop her off 95% of the time.
2 days ago she went to stay overnight at a relative’s and yesterday morning she had an abortion. She was 3 months pregnant after consensual sex with her 19yo boyfriend of 4 months….
My granddaughter has yet to contact me and won’t answer her cell. I finally texted her to catch the train and to bring her boyfriend with her because we have to talk.
I cannot put into words the strong conflicting emotions I am feeling, and at this point I do not know how and what to say so I won’t be sorry later. I need some help please. I love this child but I need to be a parent and need the words to make sure they both are aware that this is not to be taken lightly like getting caught stealing a cookie. Please can you help me?
What is your advice?
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
I am so very sorry. Sorry that your great grandchild has died. And that your granddaughter made a choice
that she will have to carry.
I am wondering if you are looking to punish her in some way?
My advice to you is to love her unconditionally. Listen to her. Be there for her if she ever needs abortion recovery services. That doesn’t mean you can’t tell her how you feel or show her the truth of fetal development. There might be an increase in drinking, eating disorders, drug abuse, feelings of guilt or anger over learning the truth that her child died in that abortion clinic. Please be watchful and welcoming.
National Helpline for Abortion Recovery
1-866-482-LIFE(5433)
Dear Grandmother,
Thank you so much for loving your granddaugther. She will need you more then ever. To let you know where I am coming from I had an abortion in 1983.
First of all believe this, She loves you. She loves her boyfriend. She got pregnant and didn’t want to disappoint you. She feels in her heart she has failed you and by having the abortion she could “hide” the fact (in her head) that she disappointed you, “I am pregnant my grandmother is going to kill me!” Why would she think this since you told her all she had to do was get her grades up, come in at the right time etc…because a 17 year old filters information differently then adults do. She knows getting pregnant was not the thing to do…it is wrong, translate to bad, translate failed you, translate you will be mad and disappointed.
Let her know you know about the abortion. Saying things like, “Honey, I want you to know I know about the abortion. I want you to know that I don’t hate you, that I love you.” Tell her you are not dissapointed in her but with the discision she made. At this time try not to say things like “you should have come to me,” there will be time to say these things and they need to be said but right now get her home.
She will be going through a lot of emotional stuff whether she realizes it or not. Let her have the space but watch her. You know her well enough so let the conversation happen in a natural way. You may find yourself wanting to talk to her about it much more then she does. Don’t do this. Call a trusted friend and talk to them. You are going to go through your own emotional ride with this too. If she is not talking about it at all bring it up everyonce in a while…don’t make it the center of your conversations. She could shut down. If she wants to talk about it….listen, just listen.
There may come a time where she is going to have to have more help. There is a lot of wonderful abortion healing help out there. I would suggest for you to go to a Rachel’s Vineyard retreat for yourself sooner then later. This will help you help her also.
You are in my prayers.
Ann Marie Cosgrove
Silent No More Minnesota
Forgiven, Healed and Set Free from an abortion
She made a mistake and ended up pregnant. She did not want to disappoint you because you are giving her a chance in life. She thought she could get an abortion and you would never know what she did. She did this to cover up and probably did this in a panic. You cannot undo what has been done. Please get her post abortion counseling and give her love and forgiveness. This is what she needs now. She will have to grieve the mistake and the loss and so will you. Forgiveness and love is what she needs now.
I agree with the others; she needs love and compassion. Some people who are post-abortive eventually get into volunteer work to feel better, and someday she might be ready for that. But for now she will be needing love to get through all the bad emotions abortion brings on. I wish more folks would tell their teenagers, “If you get in trouble, please don’t be afraid to come to me,” because I think teens expect the worst. My own mom said, “don’t come home pregnant” and I’m sure she didn’t understand how a frightened teen might take that. I will pray for your family to find healing.
If you go to youtube and search silentnomoremn I have several short 30 second videos of the abortion and healing topic. These are PSA (Public Service Announcements) I record for radio and now I have made them into videos. Watch them they may help.
Dear Grandmother,
I too am so sorry that your grandchild died.
That cannot be undone. The concern now is to “save’ your granddaughter – to save her from the downward spiral she is currently in. She may have to deal with physical, emotional and spiritual consequences in the years to come. Learn about these so you will recognize them -especially the latter.
I doubt that a 17 year old teen understands the realities of pregnancy much, nor the consequences of sexual relationships and abortion either. Her brain is just not there yet. This is a scientific fact.
When I see a 17 year old girl in these circumstances and being sexually active, I see a young girl who is crying out for love. Teens in your granddaughter’s situation are often sexually active because they are seeking love and affirmation.
I think the other commentors are quite right to suggest that you need to love your granddaughter but also you need to help her gradually to face the truth of what she has done and what she also has been led to do. I’m betting she probably feels pretty unlovable right now. But this is the time when she needs your love the most!
She probably doesn’t trust adults much either which is why she didn’t come to you. So I would try to work on rebuilding that trust. (I don’t mean to say that you are at fault in this. It seems like most of her experiences with adults in her life have maybe been mostly negative) This may be a work in progress that will take years. You might need the help of a good Christian counsellor to work with you in parenting this young person. Seek that help if possible.
Allow yourself to grieve over the loss of the child and the mistake she has made. It will help you to understand what she might experience. Abortion is never a private choice. When I counselled young women, there were several whose abortions deeply affected me personally, even though we were complete strangers.
Finally, if you are a praying woman, PRAY! Much can be attained through prayer. Regardless, we’ve got your back on this one.
God bless you and your granddaughter.
Sounds like there is nothing else to be done. You have made your choice on which side of the abortion debate you’re on and your granddaughter as made hers. It sounds like she is smart enough to know she can’t be a good mother while dealing with all that her own life has placed upon her shoulders. If you try to force your opinion on her she will reject you and close her ears to anything you have to say. She will just chalk it up to “that is what it was like when YOU were a kid”. The reason she did this on her own and hasn’t called you is because at her age it’s none of your business and she already knows what you’re going to say. Your beliefs are going to continue to drive a wedge between you two… However if you’re dead set on “educating” her your only option is to use guilt. Anything you say to her now will be seen as your attempt to make her feel guilty and that will not go over well. It sounds like she already knows the feeling of being unwanted “in her father house” and doesn’t wish to force that feeling on anyone else.
I’m not just trying to be a troll here. I have a 15yo daughter and am taking care of my 13yo niece who also has had a rough life up till now. I see lots of advice here but most of it seems to be how to convince her what she did is wrong which is fine if that is your sole intension, but it may not be the best advice if you’re looking to keep an open honest relationship with your granddaughter. Maybe by not forcing your views on abortion onto her now it will promote more open dialog and even consultation in the future…
Biggz,
The message I’m seeing from every other poster cries, “Love love love!” They encourage stopping the cycle of abuse. They speak of the only acceptable forms of tolerance and acceptance-that is, those forms which do not involve accepting a belief she cannot in good conscience accept.
The message I see from you is driving a wedge. I see you saying that she cannot have a healthy relationship with her granddaughter in which she sticks to her convictions. I see you saying that she essentially needs to shut up and not parent this child. Biggz, every other adult in this young girl’s life seems to have done exactly that, and it doesn’t sound like it was doing her any good. Your post attacks. It attacks her, implying that she is incapable of arguing a point without destroying the relationship. It attacks the other posters, twisting their words and misrepresenting their statements to make them sound angry and vicious. It attacks most of all young women by encouraging the abusive relationships that lead to abortion (with their boyfriends, with Planned Parenthood, etc).
Please, Grandmother, I cannot add to what the other posters have so eloquently stated except to add that if you’re a praying woman, prayer is your most powerful weapon now. It can help you to calm your nerves, to find your words, and through your prayers, The Lord can open your granddaughter’s heart to your words of love, comfort, and healing. And He can open your own heart to her perspective, and can help you find healing.
I am merely thinking out loud here:
It’s a parent’s job to teach a child right from wrong. Killing a baby is the ultimate wrong. If she broke curfew or was caught shoplifting, should a parent’s response be to love, love, love, her or to correctly love her by discipline? She is being taught that its better to cover things up and get sympathy for an evil act that to own up to it. Suppose she failed to study and then stole a test to cover up that fact and avoid disappointing her grandmother. If grandma acts as if the fact that she was trying to avoid disappointing her somehow mitigates a greater act of wrongdoing is teaching the child not to own up to her mistakes. There are GREATER consequences to greater mistakes. While this girl does need post-abortive help (even though she likely doesn’t yet realize it) and we love her enough to make sure she doesn’t end up suffering the drug abuse, depression that many women endure, this little girl has to know that coming to Grandma would have been the better choice because the punishment of covering it up is worse. We are downplaying the severity of this when we don’t act swiftly and severely. She could have ended up dead from the abortion and one member of the family IS dead. If we act less seriously towards this than if she had been driving drunk, we teach her that it’s not serious. There must be a punishment. This is how kids learn: rewards and punishments. This girl has learned that she can cover her mistakes by hurting others and get away with it if there is not a consequences. Grounding her and keeping her away from her boyfriend where she can’t make another mistake that she will cover up with an abortion is perhaps the most loving and wise choice. She is not trustworthy with freedom when she uses that freedom to endanger herself and kill her baby. Those who would say she’s been punished enough- I disagree. She, like all of us, made a bad choice and have to endure the consequences of that choice- but that does not mean justice. And it doesn’t teach her anything.
Now, we don’t want to be counterproductive, given that this girl will soon be on her own and needs to know that grandma only wants what’s best for her grandchildren- but it’s not best to treat her like a victim. She is a perpetrator.
Grounding her for an abortion? Are you serious?
Grandmother.
I suggest you focus on the need for honesty. All else in a relationship is naught unless there is honesty. She already knows what she did was wrong or she would not have tried hiding it.
Jill,
Thanks for sharing the letter.
To put the situation into the proper perspective:
What would you say to your grandaughter who has diliberately killed her baby two days after she/he were born?
No answers immediately come to mind.
I am reminded of a scene from one of the Batman movies where one of the villains is relating how his parents dropped him in a vat of acid when he was just a child.
He said,”Man, that was hard to get over.”
Having your heart stomped on is always painful.
Right now I am more concerned for the grandmothers well being than the grandchilds.
The grandmother understands the loss.
The grandaughter is still in denial, but eventually reality will over take her.
Time heals all wounds and time wounds all heals. [figureatively speaking]
There are somethings we just have to give to GOD and trust that HE alone is able to recover, redeem and restore that which seems hopeless to us.
I agree with Jacqueline…and truthseeker.
Yes, grounding for an abortion. What the girl did was terribly wrong. The relationship she is in, being sexually active from the start, is terribly wrong. She needs to be taught how to make better choices. Since she is already 17, there is precious little time to do that. A firm, loving hand is needed.
I agree that she is looking for love, but she is not finding it where she is looking. She is finding death. Grandma can help provide the love, and through knowing the girl’s whereabouts at all times, perhaps she can guide and teach her granddaughter what love and loving actions mean.
Don’t be so quick to assume she had the abortion because she was afraid of disappointing Grandma. Perhaps her older boyfriend just wanted no strings attached to their physical relationship and pressured her into it. They’d only been dating one month when she got pregnant, after all. We do not know what led her to her decision.
Yes, love. But teach as well.
And tell the truth. Let her know that you are sad, angry, disappointed (yes, because she was sexually active outside marriage, but even more so, that she killed your grandchild). But tell her that you still love her and always will, and so does God. Find out her thoughts and reasoning. See if she is remorseful, or has she bought into society’s lies, at least on the surface. And go from there. Help her to heal with the aid of ministries to post-abortive women, if that is where she is at. But you can’t let her go on hurting herself with unwise decisions if you can help it. In the end, however, it is her free will to choose heaven or hell.
And always, pray. Many souls have been saved through the prayers and tears of mothers and grandmothers.
Mary Rose, That’s not what I am saying at all. What I am saying is that this girl has been betrayed by almost everyone in her life and it would be better in the long run to be compassionate and understanding of her granddaughter’s current situation. I am saying her own strong feelings on abortion may not be what her granddaughter needs to hear right now and it may be better for the relationship for grandma to pick and choose her battles. I know you guys see this as a right and wrong/black and white situation but for most people it’s not. I am saying it maybe more important to solidify the relationship before you start spouting your beliefs. There is a reason she didn’t tell grandma… she doesn’t want to hear what grandma has to say. I would say your best option is to do the opposite of what she is expecting you to do. I sure you disagree with abortion grandma but what’s done is done so no need to make her feel guilty after the fact. You don’t need to convert your granddaughter to being anti-choice; you need to gain her trust. She is 17 and will be out on her own soon so it’s better in the short term to work on the relationship so you can give her guidance in the future and she will actually trust that what your saying is in her best interest.
If grandma is really all this girl has then preaching to her while she is still young won’t get you anywhere, nor will grounding or any other type of discipline. She will just run away and she will have no one. She already knows your stance “which is why she didn’t talk to you about it” and it is less important to make a point about abortion than to be the only guiding light this girl has. No 17yo listens to any adult but if you establish a good open relationship now she will listen to you later on in her life.
So, rather than punish the fetus murderer… Try being compassionate and understanding, do twice as much listening than talking. In the end she will know you care just a shade more about her than your own convictions on a topic you feel very strongly about.
Once again I’m not trying to be a troll here, I am trying to help.
“If grandma is really all this girl has then preaching to her while she is still young won’t get you anywhere, nor will grounding or any other type of discipline. She will just run away and she will have no one. She already knows your stance “which is why she didn’t talk to you about it” and it is less important to make a point about abortion than to be the only guiding light this girl has. No 17yo listens to any adult but if you establish a good open relationship now she will listen to you later on in her life.”
I agree completely. My own son went through a rough time between the ages of 16 and 19. He was rebellious, experimented with drugs and smoking. Really quite mild stuff compared to an abortion and sexual activity. Would he listen to me. Nope. But he’s 20 years old now and I can see that he’s really maturing. I Now he thinks it was rather stupid of him. And that’s because his brain is maturing and he’s maturing emotionally.
For this young woman, it may take some time but lovingly and with firmness her grandma needs to tell her why what she did was wrong. She needs to help her walk through this valley – because that’s what it is. Grandma needs to get counselling for herself and for her granddaughter. I only hope that she will come to understand and that her heart will not be hardened.
Grounding. No. Grounding a kid is for breaking curfew or disobeying basic household rules.
This goes way beyond grounding and needs other tactics.
I am sadden to see all the calls for discipline, grounding, etc. If you all read the grandma’s story/ this girl comes from a very dysfunctional home (dad and druggie girlfriend, no mention of a mother!!)
Doesn’t sound like she was raised with morals and values or faith in God and yet there is a harsh call for consequences because she should know better! Is that how God deals with you and your sin? Would you be the one ready to stone the adulteress in Jesus’s day?
Her consequences will come soon enough when she finally realizes what she did. That will be punishment enough. In fact it will be unbearable unless she finds the grace and forgiveness of God.
Those that called for unconditional love, thank you. Grandma, your heart maybe breaking right now over her actions. Yes it was the wrong choice and there is no way to undo what was done. The baby is dead. But you can help your granddaughter by loving her and guiding her and trying to give her what she has not received from her parents.
You are obviously a kind and loving person as it shows by your caring for her and taking her in. Your love speaks louder than words. SHe needs you more now than ever. Don’t reject her but embrace her. Forgive her. Lead her to God. You can tell her what she did was wrong, very wrong but you still love her and want to help her.
I pray God gives you the words that she needs to hear. God bless you.
Find out what your state’s laws are regarding the minimum age at which you can kick your kid (or grandkid, in this case) out of your house. I don’t think that women are infants and consequently, I don’t feel that they are the victims of abortion.
<blockquote>Let her know you know about the abortion. Saying things like, “Honey, I want you to know I know about the abortion. I want you to know that I don’t hate you, that I love you.” Tell her you are not dissapointed in her but with the discision she made.</blockquote>
<blockquote> The concern now is to “save’ your granddaughter – to save her from the downward spiral she is currently in. She may have to deal with physical, emotional and spiritual consequences in the years to come.</blockquote>
No.
Find out what your state’s laws are regarding the minimum age at which you can kick your kid (or grandkid, in this case) out of your house. I don’t think that women are infants and consequently, I don’t feel that they are the victims of abortion.
Let her know you know about the abortion. Saying things like, “Honey, I want you to know I know about the abortion. I want you to know that I don’t hate you, that I love you.” Tell her you are not dissapointed in her but with the discision she made.
The concern now is to “save’ your granddaughter – to save her from the downward spiral she is currently in. She may have to deal with physical, emotional and spiritual consequences in the years to come.
No.
No. You DO NOT kick a granddaughter out of your house because she had an abortion!! Did you miss the part about the granddaughter’s abusive upbringing??
Unless that is how YOU spell “unconditional love” Austin Nedved then by all means abandon your loved ones.
Find out what your state’s laws are regarding the minimum age at which you can kick your kid (or grandkid, in this case) out of your house. I don’t think that women are infants and consequently, I don’t feel that they are the victims of abortion.
“Let her know you know about the abortion. Saying things like, “Honey, I want you to know I know about the abortion. I want you to know that I don’t hate you, that I love you.” Tell her you are not dissapointed in her but with the discision she made.”
“The concern now is to “save’ your granddaughter – to save her from the downward spiral she is currently in. She may have to deal with physical, emotional and spiritual consequences in the years to come.”
No. Let’s keep in mind who the actual victim is here.
Do tell.
Sorry, I’m still trying to figure out how the formatting works, sseing as HTML no longer seems to work. I think some work still needs to be done.
Tell her that you are not mad at her, but you are disappointed in her, both for the abortion and for hiding it and the pregnancy from you.
Reinforce your unconditional love for her, and tell her that if she ever gets pregnant again, to come to you first, and you will help her find a way to make everything right without abortion involved.
It’s not a time for punishment. If she were a young child and had disobeyed you by running away from home, and had consequently been abducted by a pedophile, but miraculously came home safely, who in the world would punish her for running away to begin with? She did something wrong, but has paid a terrible price for it, far worse than any grounding you could dish out.
Tell her and the boyfriend to use condoms every single time if they are going to be sexually active – no matter what your religion teaches about contraception, I have to think using it is never as bad of a sin as abortion.
Remind her that the best way to avoid the consequences of sex and bad relationships is to be abstinent, and that a man who cares about her will respect her wishes (either to be abstinent or use condoms).
I agree that right now isn’t the time to worry about your personal beliefs, as hard as that is to hear. It isn’t about pro life or pro choice, it’s about a scared 17 year old girl who chose to do something she thought was right. I’m sure it wasn’t easy for her. So listen to her. Love her dearly. And be there. Talk about sex. Tell her it should be treated with caution. And get her on birth control, no matter how much you don’t want her to need it. It’s much better than the alternative.
Seems to me this young girl has been allowed to do what she pleases for too long, and perhaps the best thing for her would be some clearly set boundaries. She needs the adults in her life to actually be adults and give her some parenting.
It doesn’t matter what she WANTS to hear right now. It matters that someone tells her the truth. A child is dead and another one is very wounded. That is the truth. It has nothing to do with feelings or “beliefs” about abortion.
She has mistaken sex for love, like most young girls do when they lack a real father and a real mother. She needs, first of all, to know that she is loved and that she is far more valuable and precious than she can comprehend. She needs to know that she has a Heavenly Father who will not abandon her or reject her. She needs to understand her worth as a daughter of the King.
Then she must deal with the reality that she made the tragic choice to kill her baby. It’s not about making her feel sufficiently guilty — it’s about accepting the truth so she can be honest with herself and heal.
I agree with all those who have said to Grandma, above all, let her know that she is loved. At the same time, the abortion cannot be swept under the rug or diminished in order to spare anyone’s feelings. Only the truth will set us free — but first, it might make you miserable for a while.
Love is not coddling or handling with kid-gloves. Love speaks the truth so that the darkness will be dispelled. No more lies. Tell her the truth in love.
Biggz
If your old enough to have a 15 year old daugher than you should have a better concept of time than a 17 year. The post says that her granddaughter was 3 months pregant so she had 6 months left. Biggz in your mature opinion what is 6 months in the life of a an individual is it asking too much of a 17 year old to gvie 6 more months of her own time so that a baby can be born and not killed. Do you even have a mature opinion? Or is your philosophy if it’s an inconvenience well golly gee we can always kill it. You’ve been posting here for awhile so I know your brain is firing on all cylinders. What in God’s name is wrong with your heart?
moderators
Would you like for me to rewrite my post? Is that what edit this means or am I just being given the opportunity to edit?
I think she should go to counseling and the grandmother should go as well. And I would screen that counselor VERY well before I took her.
I would like to know how many of you giving advise has had an abortion(s)?
“Tell her and the boyfriend to use condoms every single time if they are going to be sexually active – no matter what your religion teaches about contraception, I have to think using it is never as bad of a sin as abortion.”
Read: Forget your convictions, regardless of their grounding. Simply give in because she’s not abstaining. Because not using condoms is just as bad as killing your baby.
No, no and no. Throwing your convictions to the wind heedlessly when they are challenged is NOT the answer.
And just a comment on the discipline line: I like to believe there is something between “kid gloves” love and kicking the teen out of your house. There is expressing your sadness, your disappointment, your pain without making her into a demon. She did something which was wrong. Something which she believed would fix another wrong. It had devastating consequences on another human, consequences which she must, over time, face. They should be introduced to her, with care, from the first conversation about her abortion. There are ways of introducing a truth without completely destroying her trust… Her shaky and guarded trust. I hope and pray that you will be able to discern the best manner in which to proceed. And I pray that you do not allow your convictions to fall to the wayside because they were challenged.
Have you considered the possibility that those relatives she went to stay with badgered, pressured, coerced, and manipulated her into an unwanted abortion. They pressured her not to tell you because they knew you would interfere with their plan to get her aborted. They had her stay with them a few days to make should she wouldn’t leak it to you, and to make sure to keep the train rolling on the track they wanted it on; towards abortion. In other words, for a few days at least, they made sure your granddaughter would only hear pro-abortion messages. Then once the abortion is over, they’ve won. They got they wanted.
If they want to cut off her relationship with you, then they want more than her baby, they want her heart. Or maybe they’re afraid she’ll get pregnant again, and not abort this time.
Either way, you want her to know that you welcome her back. Tell her that if she ever finds herself pregnant again, she can come to you. At some point, you may want to take her to a Crisis Pregnancy Center to find out what they offer to women and girls who are pregnant. Maybe not now, because it would be too raw to know how unnecessary it was to kill her baby.
Post abortion counseling is in order here. Crisis Pregnancy Centers can help with this too. She needs counseling to help with what’s happened, plus hope for the future to know it can be better.
God bless you Grandma for being there for your precious granddaughter and helping her get her life on track! Carla and Ann Marie are experts on this subject and can help you tremendously.
Last Thursday night (Aug 5), there was a young African American girl who had an abortion who received the Love and Forgiveness of our Heavenly Father. Her story is very encouraging and can be seen here by selecting “Lexi’s Testimony” in the scroll down window (between Aug 5 and July 31).
I’m praying that your granddaughter will soon be restored in her relationship with you and her Heavenly Father; that she will know the Love, Mercy and Acceptance of our Precious Lord; that she will be used to help many of her friends to choose Life for their children; and that she will be used to counsel and restore other post-abortive moms in their recovery.
“No. Let’s keep in mind who the actual victim is here.”
Actually, there are TWO victims at least in every abortion – the mother and the baby (and probably a father too although often he doesn’t realize it). The baby dies to be sure. But the mother dies spiritually and is often harmed either physically and/or emotionally.
We dont have all the gory details here but it seems to me that this young woman has come from an abusive background and has no involved mother to provide a female role model.
Good heavens. Have some heart. There are women in mental institutions after having abortions and some attempt suicide. This girl needs help to turn her life around, not another abandonment. :(
Austin: I’m still learning the new commenting format myself, but I don’t believe you need to use html anymore. There is a format bar at the top of each comment. So if you highlight a section of your post and click “B” – it should all be published bold, etc.
Myrtle: Yes, you now have the opportunity to edit your posts once they’re up, if you see a misspelling, etc.
Well said, Mary Rose. Thank you.
Grandmother
You can email me
carla@jillstanek.com
I am praying for you and your granddaughter.
Yes Carla, I agree. Mary Rose’s comment was very well done. I believe there is a great deal of wisdom in what she has written.
Let your granddaughter know you love her no matter what, and that you’re always there for her to come to, especially when a pregnancy arises. Don’t scold her; she’s going through hell right now. Talk through the whole thing, the three of you.
One thing I’d like to say that no one else has said is that I don’t think you should assume anything about the boyfriend. Don’t assume that he was supportive of the abortion unless you know that he was, and don’t assume that he hasn’t already realized that having sex when they did was a huge mistake. Don’t assume that he’s the problem here, because while he might be part of the problem, he might also be on your side.
I agree with the other posters who said this girl is having sex because she is SCREAMING out “I want to be loved!!!” That just broke my heart typing that. What she did was wrong. Yes, it was wrong. But it was done in desperation. And in her naivete she had sex then had an abortion. I think this girl needs to be told the truth about her baby and what happened, she needs to be loved unconditionally, and yes, she needs to be kept in the house a little more. Do not allow this girl to put herself in the same situation twice. She should not be any place alone with her boyfriend where the two CAN have sex. You know girls often seek replacement pregnancies after abortions so please grandma, please parent this child and make her accountable to you concerning her whereabouts. My mother was a WARDEN with me and I am so THANKFUL because I was able to give my virginity to my husband…no abortions, no STD’s and no emotional scarring! My prayers are with this young girl and her family. So sad.
Grandma,
Don’t assume anything. Talk. You know why she had the abortion – she, for whatever reason, didn’t want to have a baby. You need to find out the particulars. Was she coerced by her boyfriend, his family, her friends? Then you need to counsel her about the downside of listening to any opinion that does not point her to Christ. Is her conscience seared to the point that she feels no sorrow or remorse, or that she did anything wrong? Then you need to point her to her need for Christ. Is she emotionally undone by what she did? Is she sorry, knowing that it was wrong? Then you need to point her to Christ who pardons and forgives.
She will only understand her value if she understands that the only thing that makes any of us valuable in God’s sight is the mercy of Christ.
That being said — out of love, she must understand that although your love is unconditional, your rules are not. She must be held accountable for what she has done. Yes, she appears to be crying out for love, but does love allow a child to break the rules? If a two year old really wants to stick her finger in the electric outlet, do you allow it because you love them? Or do you enforce a basic rule of safety? Love protects. Love shields and guards.
She has lost your trust – she must know that she has to work to rebuild it and accept any sanctions you deem necessary due to lack of trust. If you continue to enable her to betray your trust, you have done no better than the situation you rescued her from. She needs to know that someone is going to hold the line. You won’t curtail her behavior by enabling it, you will only find that it repeats itself.
Grandma
Find out who advised her to have the abortion and should she need counseling due to having an abortion send the guilty party or parties and the provider of the abortion with a nice little bill. Since they have the audacity to advise her to have the abortion see if they have the audacity to pay for the damage they done to her pysche. This is the beauty of civil court.
The grandmother should tell her that she supports her choice, and that she will be there for her. What else is there to say? It wasn’t the grandmother’s choice, nor did she have any say to begin with. The grandmother could choose to shun this girl, and that would probably be consistent with the rest of the people in this girls life. Or, she could support this girl and tell her that she chose to exercise her right to get an abortion. I mean, this doesn’t seem like a difficult situation. The girl chose to have an abortion, people will either support her (the right thing to do), or shun her (the wrong thing to do).
Jake,
You have no idea what you are talking about.
How about the grandmother be there for her and tell her how sad she is that her great grandchild died in the abortion?
Support her and stand firm in the conviction that abortion is wrong!
The “difficulty” after abortion is the realization that abortion has taken a life. The horror of that alone can drive women to drink, and use drugs, become depressed and sometimes suicidal. Abortion is never risk free.
Grounding her for an abortion? Are you serious?
Yes, Carla, ground her. Protect her from herself and teach her that there are consequences for abusing trust and exploiting freedom. Why is abortion considered less heinous that if she did something less dangerous- like throw her baby in the trash can and walking away? One merits a punishment and the other does not? Unlike grown women who make choices that hurt others and bear the consequences, this girl is a child that still needs to be taught right/wrong and that actions have consequences. She will have plenty of pain for this (which is horrible, because adults can’t always protect kids from themselves), but now is a good time to start. Breaking curfew merits grounding, lying merits grounding, but putting her life in danger and killing her child doesn’t merit some protecting her for her own sake?
I am sadden to see all the calls for discipline, grounding, etc. If you all read the grandma’s story/ this girl comes from a very dysfunctional home (dad and druggie girlfriend, no mention of a mother!!)
And this is an acceptable excuse for killing a baby? Had she smothered her child after birth the court wouldn’t buy her unfortunate background as a get-out-of-jail free card for killing the baby, but you think she should have no consequences for betraying the grandmother’s trust, putting her life in danger and killing her baby? Her background doesn’t change what she did and now is the time to state teaching her right from wrong. If she didn’t know any better, she wouldn’t be hiding it, would she? And whether she knew better is irrelevant, this girl is a danger to herself and others and needs serious help. If we use abusive childhoods and such as a rationale to ignore the bad deeds of being, we could set free 99.99% of people in prison today. People might have had it rough, but it’s not an excuse to rape, steal and murder. This girl has no excuse, either. To love her properly is to teach her that she can’t do bad things to get out of situations she creates.
Actually, there are TWO victims at least in every abortion – the mother and the baby (and probably a father too although often he doesn’t realize it). The baby dies to be sure. But the mother dies spiritually and is often harmed either physically and/or emotionally.
You know what- I have had enough of people treating perpetrators like victims. It undermines the true victims and really insults me as a woman. While it would make me feel better about everything, and all loving and compassionate, to see women as victims of abortion, the truth is that women CHOOSE abortion. They PAY for abortions. They make a decision that kills another person. THAT person is the victim. Your claiming that women are victims because they suffer from their choice is like claiming burglar is a victim because he cut himself trying to escape. That a rapist is a victim for being caught and sent to jail- that a murderer is a victim because he was kneed in the groin by the person he killed. The suffering that women endure, while severe, is a natural consequence of doing something that is severely evil. It sucks. Luckily the Lord is abounding in grace and mercy to try to restore what we’re done to ourselves. But that only comes with acknowledging the need for forgiveness and healing.
All that being said, yes, there is a widespread chosen deception of this culture that women buy in order to abort- yes, abortion clinics lie- yes, coercion happens- but the truth is objective and must be objectively taught.
By the way, I am very sorry for people who made bad choices and are suffering the consequences. I’ve made so many bad choices that I’ve lost count- and I am glad that when I recognize that fact, people are around to help me climb out of the mess I created even though I am solely responsible for this mess. But I would never, ever call myself a “victim” of my own choices. Yes, there are consequences that I have to endure that might seem harsh compared to my bad choices. Like 5 days of agony in sunburn seems a bit much for forgetting to reapply sunscreen- but it’s a NATURAL consequence. I’m not a victim. Likewise, even when I do things with good intentions that have bad consequences and I have to endure them, that seems unfair, too- but once again, I am not a victim. I made choices. They didn’t work out so well, but I made them. I took some bad advice and made a bad choice, a 60K choice that I will pay a mortgage on for the next 25 years. Am I a victim? Nope. I just made a bad choice. I have so many examples but in none of them do I expect people to not hold me personally responsible.
This young woman is a victim because she was deceived into thinking that abortion would solve something. She is a victim because abortion is evil and she is the victim of that evil. When she realizes the full extent of her responsibility in being there, paying for it, allowing it she WILL understand her part in the death of her own child.
Any woman who is forced or coerced or lied to and deceived into abortion is a victim, no?
Sorry. Totally disagree with the whole “grounding” thing as well, Jacque. You killed your child? Well, go to your room!
If you do not appreciate the word victim here then don’t use it. I can almost understand your need to be punitive, Jacque. Whenever I screwed up in my house my father would say, “Well, you really pi**ed in your hat this time, Carla.” There was judgment and condemnation void of love and compassion for a daughter. A fellow human. There was never enough penance in my house. Nothing I could say or do to be back in my parent’s good graces.
The only ones who can understand what I am about to write are other post abortive women who have been forgiven. But please try. There is a Darkness of Soul to abortion. When you realize the weight and gravity of what you have done you are in a very dark place. I remember the nights of sobbing endlessly, rocking on my bed inconsolable over what I had done. I remember the suicidal thoughts and the desperate attempt to escape the pain of the truth of my daughter dying in that clinic. I remember the screaming in my head all while my mouth was smiling. The pain was real and it was hell on earth. There seemed to be no escape.
Then there they were. The ones that held out their hands to me, smiling and loving and gently drawing me close to them and leading me to Him. The Only One that really knew and understood where I had been and what I had done. He was there. I cried out to Him and He answered me. He rescued me because he loved me. He hung on the cross for my abortion. I repented and He forgave freely. I was led into the light by women who knew the same Darkness of Soul and couldn’t bear to see another sister in pain.
It is ENOUGH to love someone and listen to them and wait patiently for them to come to the end of themselves so you can lead them home.
Surely I agree with all the comments that said to show the girl unconditional love, even though you don’t agree with her decision.
Looking forward for an update on this story, I hope the girl was able to accept the gravity of her mistake and get some help and healing.
Carla,
Sorry- I want to agree with you, but I have too many years of talking to abortion-minded women and unrepentant post-abortive women to get past what I have seen. I am not invalidating your experience AT ALL, but my experiences with so many women from so many walks of life (and other cultures, countries, etc) is equally valid and applies to this case-
I disagree that women are victims of thinking abortion solves something- in most cases, in spite of the additional problems that it creates, abortion absolutely solves what it was intended to solve: The woman does not want to be pregnant because it would interfere with her life someway (school, work, etc) and becoming unpregnant fixes this. And when she aborts, she succeeds in hiding the pregnancy and carrying on with life, albeit with depression and other problems that inevitably arise. The woman may not have wanted the side-effects of the abortion and was likely unaware of them, but she nonetheless addressed the immediate problem. The woman did not want to be pregnant. And she got what she wanted, but just with the lies of the enemy that everything would return to normal.
In that regard, we are all victims, I guess. The enemy lies to us and we buy it. But does that lower our responsibility? I don’t think it does. And I think parents are obligated to teach responsibility in spite of temptations, lies, and the like- parents have to teach kids how to live in the real world and that they will endure consequences. I am not talking about grounding for the purpose of instilling guilt and remorse so much that this girl has to be protected from herself. She can’t be trusted with freedom. I would straight chain my kid to a pipe in a crawl space if that’s what it took to keep them from potentially killing themselves or others.
I have spent the last 20 years being a post abortive woman.
The responsibility of a woman who takes the life of her child through abortion is what forgiveness is about. There is no forgiveness without the soul searching and the YES I DID THAT. No matter the circumstances, no matter the coercion and outright lies and deceit……I was there. My daughter died because of me. That is the only way to freedom that this post abortive mom has found. I will carry this burden until the day I die and THAT is the consequence for what I have done.
Thank you God that I am forgiven and set free and can type out my thoughts to you, Jacque!! Even if we don’t agree on everything. :)
I am not mocking or making less of that pain, Carla, I’m not. I am grateful that in all my many mistakes, I have managed to not make that particular one- or even kill someone by carelessly driving while texting or in a tragic accident. I’ve been very fortunate. On the other hand, I’ve made so many mistakes you’ve been fortunate to avoid- it sucks that only one mistake is what we are discussing here. It makes me come across as pointing fingers and condascending, when I am not. What I say applies to me, too. If I ever hurt/killed someone as a teenager and risked my life, I would hope my parents would do what it took to protect me and others.
I am sorry for your pain, but claiming the pain you feel is justice is like saying an attempted rapist shouldn’t be jailed because he caught his penis in the zipper and it hurt. It’s like saying someone who punched someone else in the face should have no penalty because she broke her hand. The consequences you suffer are a side-effect of a choice you made- It sucks, but those consequences are not a punishment- they are natural consequences that you wouldn’t have endured if you made another choice. But natural consequences do not justice make. If wallowing in the pain, sickness and degradation of our sins was a just punishment for them, Christ would have have had to come and die. So if I drove drunk and killed someone, I know I would suffer horribly emotionally with my responsibility for that death more than anything anyone could do to me. but I am still guilty of manslaughter and there is still a debt to pay. I wouldn’t use my immense sorrow and emotional agony as justification to avoid a penalty. I know abortion is harder for so many, many reasons than this scenario, but I don’t see how you can suggest no debt for a child that would be punished for stealing a 5 from Grandma’s purse. What did she learn?
I too am glad you are forgiven and set free. It’s hard for me not to be misperceived as condemning given that I’ve never endured what you have. I just don’t buy that woman on the whole are victims here. This is where Feminists for Life (to whom I pay dues and am glad to do so), we disagree and where I think they are at odds with feminism. If abortion once again becomes illegal, women should be charged with a crime for breaking the law. I understand I am in the minority for this view, but I think it’s the only view that acknowledges that women are human beings like men and are liable for their own decisions, not mindless, easily manipulated, ignorant waifs that can’t be held responsible for their own choices because we’re the weaker sex. I don’t see this as me because calloused, only intellectually honest.
I would have to agree with you that you are in the minority.
I am not curled up in a ball sobbing all night long anymore, thinking of ways to end my life. The debt was paid by Christ and the emotional turmoil I went through was the consequence.(Not enough you say.) I carry the weight of the death of my daughter. I do not wish that burden on anyone.
I get this feeling, Jacque that yes you do think there ought to be more punishment for me and others like me. That what we have been through is not enough. That there should be more punitive consequences. You believe that the emotional anguish of REALIZING what was done in an abortion is not enough. That is your opinion and you are welcome to it. All I can say to that is I am grateful I didn’t turn to you in my darkest hour.
Jacqueline, I think you’re overlooking an obvious point here: Abortion is legal – drunk driving, thievery, murder, etc., are illegal. This distinction matters to this particular debate for 2 reasons: 1) There is no legal debt to be paid for an act which is not legally a crime. As far as society is concerned, this young woman has done nothing criminal. 2) Because abortion is legal, everybody is confused beyond belief. Some women do have abortions and repeat abortions fully knowing exactly what they are doing. They know they are killing another human being and their hearts are calloused. But many more women, especially young women, do not understand the gravity of abortion in any shape or form. They have been lied to by society, time and time again, told that abortion is NOT wrong, that it is merely a choice like any other. They are deceived, manipulated, coerced, abused. They make their “choice” out of a state of ignorance and deception – NOT malevolence.
I am as prolife as they come (I don’t even support IVF), but I acknowledge that as long as abortion remains legal, it will also remain a gray area for many many people. While it’s possible that this young woman knew exactly what she was doing (killing another human being), chances are she bought the lie that a fetus is only a potential baby and not yet a real person. “Punishing” someone for doing something that is legal, is counterproductive and quite frankly, heartless. She needs love and compassion. Someday, like Carla, she will understand what she has really done, and what that time comes, she’ll be horrified that society said it was a-okay, that the courts said it was legal.
The last thing she needs is to be stoned by a group of angry pharisees.
I don’t know what your grand-daughter needs. However, if I were you, I would need a quiet funeral for the baby. I would probably ask my grand-daughter if she had named the baby or would want to name the baby. If the answer were negative, I’d ask her permission to name the baby and to have a priest lead family and friends in prayers for the baby and her parents. I would seek prayers along the lines of baptism by desire, also.
Then, I’d sue the abortion clinic for providing poor healthcare (especially inadequate mental health screening) to your granddaughter and for the wrongful death of your great-grandchild.
You don’t have to say a word to your grand-daughter, except that you love her and that you will help her bring any future babies to term and help her to keep those babies or to find excellent adoptive parents for them–as she would choose. Your actions in grieving for her loss and in condemning the abortion clinic will speak for you as to your opinion as to how abortion took the life of your great-grandchild and injured your grandchild.
We’ll pray for your family.
I am sorry for your pain, but claiming the pain you feel is justice is like saying an attempted rapist shouldn’t be jailed because he caught his penis in the zipper and it hurt.
This is what you think of my pain? This is your opinion of my abortion experience, Jacque? You equate it with a rapist getting his penis caught in his zipper and now his penis hurts and because it hurts he shouldn’t go to jail? Wow.
I did not claim the pain I feel is justice. It is enough for me to believe that God is just, He has already judged me PAID IN FULL by Christ’s blood and He will end the evil of abortion.
The concept you cannot seem to grasp is grace. Amazing grace.
I did not claim the pain I feel is justice. It is enough for me to believe that God is just, He has already judged me PAID IN FULL by Christ’s blood…
Amen, Carla. Our repentance was never enough. Christ took our punishment for sin – death – upon Himself.
I wrote a lengthy response, but it’s just not worth it. And I’m also tired of people painted as a monster because I’ve seen to much to keep a cozy delusion. You want to see things a certain way. So do I. I’ve simply spent enough time in enough evil places to know that because I want things to be a certain way doesn’t make them so (i.e. women as mindless victims of circumstance). And there is nothing wrong with you keeping that viewpoint about women even if it’s not true- it’s not doing harm, if anything, it’s doing good. So who am I to mess with that?
Go forth and do more good things, Carla. You always have and will continue to keep my full support in your efforts to help women suffering after abortions.
Jaqueline –
I find myself squarely in the minority with you, and as I said earlier, Grandma should do some research by talking. No one can assume this young girl feels any sorrow or remorse for her actions yet, or that she ever will. Is she a victim? Once again, only she (and maybe Grandma) knows. Did she really believe the lies, or deep down, did she know (as I believe every woman knows at a visceral level) that she was killing her child. Crying victim in many cases is one more way to avoid accountability.
If Grandma loves her granddaughter, discipline IS in order. Without discipline bad behavior is likely to be repeated and/or become worse behavior. Discipline and punishment are not bad when administered in LOVE. Grandma can not count on her granddaughter feeling bad about what she did (at this crucial moment)- especially if she uses the ‘lies’ as her excuse for her behavior. What loving parent would allow their child to engage in dangerous, life threatening behavior without stepping in and administering discipline? The granddaughter violated grandma’s trust. She broke grandma’s rules. There must be a consequence. Yes, looking forward, she will endure the ultimate suffering of acknowledging what she really knew all along, but grandma (who obviously wants to prevent more heartache for this child) can’t rest on that right now.
That being said, the law (discipline) can be administered with grace (undeserved kindness). When boundaries are violated, stronger boundaries need to be put in place. That doesn’t mean that grandma can’t hold her ‘baby’ when she’s hurting, or forgive her for doing wrong, or love on her unconditionally. Unconditional love doesn’t mean freedom to break the rules. She’s <this> close to being on her own in this world. Please, PLEASE! Grandma – With all due love for your granddaughter being given – hold her accountable for her actions!!! At the very minimum she might consider what consequences she might endure as a result of her decisions. At some point that can’t help but be beneficial.
Carla – I thank God that your experience led you to the realization of what you actually did. I also thank Him that you have experienced His love and forgiveness – what a beautiful thing it is! By disciplining her granddaughter, maybe this good grandma will prevent her from having another abortion – at least for the time she remains in her Grandma’s house. But grandma can’t save her soul, or convict her of her sin, or be the Holy Spirit in her life, so at the minimum she needs to carry out what scripture mandates to parents, Love along with discipline is a part of that mandate.
Hi Grandma,
You have gotten many replies to your crisis. One thing that I would like to suggest is to try to focus on the sin that led your grandaughter to the greater sin. That is premarital sex led her to the pregnancy which led her to the abortion. Focusing on establishing self respect and a desire to save herself for the right man and for the right time. She is only 17 – she is also at great risk of contracting a sexually transmitted disease (today 1 in 4 teenagers have one).
Lakita Garth has a great video on this topic. Perhaps you can view it and see if you think it would be appropriate for your granddaughter to view. Her feelings will be validated which is so important for women especially teenagers. (I got the video from amazon.com for a presentation that I am giving on this very subject).
Best wishes for a very successful relationship with your granddaughter.
Sincerely,
Barbara
My prayers are with this family. Raising teens is hard enough without having abortion thrown in the mix. Praying together as a family and a Christian counselor might be a good place to start.
As far as discipline goes. . . the fact that abortion is legal gives women (and men) the impression that there is nothing wrong with having an abortion. It is an uphill battle to teach young people this when we are fighting against what society (and our President!) tells them.
I think, slowly introducing heart-to-heart talks with the teen might help. If the granddaughter meets the grandma with anger, wait until another time to talk but don’t clam up because you fear she may get upset. Grandma needs to stay calm and loving but firm at all times. If the teen refuses to talk, tell the teen she needs to set up a time to talk within the next week or so. This gives the teen control of when the talks happen without sweeping it under the carpet. If the teen refuses to talk after the given time period, there does need to be a consequence like maybe taking something away.
House rules (curfews, no alone time with boyfriend, etc.) need to be respected though and there needs to be consequences if these rules are not followed otherwise Grandma will be enabling. This teen may be so used to running without consequence that Grandma may have to be the one to use the ’tough love’ method. I totally believe you are doing a disservice to a young person if you don’t require responsibility for their actions. Grandma may just be the key to this teen’s recovery and future happiness.
I do agree that once abortion becomes illegal (not if but when), women and the men involved in abortions need to be held equally accountable. There needs to be some sort of punishment like we expect for other criminals but as it is currently many people are confused on the topic.