Breaking: Never before released audiotapes reveal hundreds of nationwide Planned Parenthoods offering to cover up child rape
I’ve written before that before Lila Rose came Mark Crutcher.
In 2002 Crutcher’s organization, Life Dynamics, conducted a comprehensive sting of every Planned Parenthood and National Abortion Federation clinic in the U.S.
Placing phone calls from Texas, where it is legal for one party to tape conversations without another’s knowledge, an actress portraying a 13-yr-old who had been impregnated by her 22-yr-old “boyfriend” told clinics she needed an abortion to keep her parents from finding out they were sexually involved.
In all, the actress spoke with staff at 813 PP or NAF clinics in all 50 states. Adult sex with underage children is illegal in every state, and PP and NAF clinics are mandated reporters. Yet an appalling 91% of all clinics contacted expressed a willingness to help cover up the statutory rape.
Until yesterday only a select few of those audiotapes had ever been released to the public.
But due to vast public interest in the topic of underage rape cover-up at abortion mills, particularly PPs, has decided to release them all. The home page for access is ChildPredator.com. Get background info at “Understanding the Tapes,” and then have at it with audiotapes and transcripts from PP and NAF abortion mills in all 50 states and the District of Columbia.
I asked Mark why the delay in releasing the tapes?
“We released some and not others because I didn’t want them to know everything we had,” Mark told me via telephone. “I was trying to get them to litigate.”
Mark said he called them “every name I could” to get PP and/or NAF to sue for slander, including “illegal nationwide pedophile protection ring.”
Had PP or NAF sued, Mark could have gotten information from and about them through the discovery process. “But they know that and will never sue,” he said. “I’ve finally given up on the the idea.”
As I said, there is damaging, never before heard corroboration that the abortion mill likely in your own backyard is willing to aid and abet pedophiles. So make the most of them.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
The Orlando, FL PP that’s listed on W. Colonial Drive has been relocated to Tampa Ave. Right next to an inner city elementary school, I kid you not. And across the street from “the projects”, walking distance to the Citrus Stadium and Tinker Field.
And they do abortions now. They usually schedule them for Wednesdays.
They charged $5 for a pregnancy test, when CPCs can do it for free.
Yep and if you are scheduled for an abortion – you usually get an ultrasound. But if you decide not to have an abortion, our local PP will charge you $100 anyway for that. oh – and you usually don’t get to see the ultrasound picture. If you did, more people would decide not to have their abortion…
yes – and the ultrasound at our local Crisis Pregnancy Center is free.
Good job, Jil. Redstate picked you up on this.
Imagine if this were the Catholic Church. Do you think it would be so ignored by the media? I doubt it.
When single underage girls give birth (doing the right thing?) are they asked about whom they had sex with?
And if you think that audio tapes can’t be altered, then you are truly delusional. And how can we be sure that those in the tapes are PP employees and not actors? Eh?
Do you think they should be, CC?
If the audiotapes are altered, PP is free to sue and prove the alterations in court.
CC–if there is reason to suspect an older partner, then mandatory reporting would still apply. I have a friend who teaches 3-year-olds, and has found herself in a position of mandatory reporting not for the kids but for their moms. Some moms, still underage even with a 3-year-old, were coming to parent-teacher conferences with their much older partners. It’s still statutory rape. Mandatory reporting still applies.
wow, even the abortion mill here in LINCOLN is willing to cover up child rape! Of course, this was 9 years ago….but I wonder if they did an update, how many of them would STILL be willing to cover up statutory rape/child rape?!?!?!?!?
Do you think they should be, CC
I don’t think health care providers should be inquisitors. However, if they have reason to believe that a violation of the law occured, then they should refer it to the appropriate authorities. But if you think that Planned Parenthood should be doing it, then the same process should be followed for the “blessed event.” Are Crisis Pregnancy Centers referring every girl, under the age of 18, to Child Protective Services?
wow, even the abortion mill here in LINCOLN is willing to cover up child rape!
Really, how’s that?
Morally, I think people who help pregnant teenagers should report any suspected sexual abuse. Legally, Planned Parenthood has to.
Statutory Rape statutes vary from state to state. A summary is here:
http://aspe.hhs.gov/hsp/08/sr/statelaws/summary.shtml
Mandatory Reporting in RI
Child abuse and neglect means the physical or mental injury, sexual abuse or exploitation, negligent treatment, or maltreatment of a child under the age of eighteen (18) by a person, including any employee of a residential facility or any staff person providing out-of-home care, who is responsible for the child’s welfare under circumstances indicating harm or threatened harm to the child’s health or welfare. The term encompasses both acts and omissions on the part of a responsible person.
http://www.dcyf.ri.gov/child_welfare/reporting.php
The age at which sex with a minor constitutes statutory rape varies by state, and there are state variations about who has to report statutory rape. Looking at your link, CC, it appears that medical practitioners in most states are obligated to report a 13-year-old who says she’s been impregnated by a 22-year-old. Two-thirds of US states have mandated reporting regardless of whether the adult in question is in a position of authority over a child.
More complete state-by-state info here:
http://www.hhs.gov/opa/pubs/statutory-rape-state-laws.pdf
It wasn’t a sting, it was a scam.
What is this “willingness,” on the part of the person getting the crank call, to go along with statutory rape? What is the receptionist supposed to do? Attempt to “investigate” and then follow up with a call to local police who, one suspects, would not be too happy about investigating a bogus scenario. Crutcher’s stuff was old school years ago. It shows that the Lifers are grasping at straws since the Justice Department said they won’t be investigating Planned Parenthood.
Well, if PP didn’t do anything illegal, they have nothing to worry about, don’t they.
What is the receptionist supposed to do? Attempt to “investigate” and then follow up with a call to local police who, one suspects, would not be too happy about investigating a bogus scenario.
Better safe than sorry. It’s not a mandatory reporter’s job to determine the local police’s reaction, but it is their responsibility TO MAKE THE CALL.
Yes, people, everyone dealing with minors are required, by law, to report cases of statutory rape even if it is only suspected. All of you who are trying to justify or deny PP’s behavior are aiding and abetting both perpetrators. In the end, the child is victimized over and over again. First by the phedophile, then by PP and then by you. Shame on you and shame on PP. I hope PP is busted and closed down for good and, I hope all of you who are bed partners with PP never have a child who is seduced into sexual involvement with an adult or raped.
Again – have these tapes been verified? Crutcher is an anti-choice zealot so his information could be a bit tainted. Even James O’Keefe’s videos were shown, in some cases, to have been altered. But fine, if they’re legit, let the states attorneys general take up the cause. So far, bupkis.
So, if we eliminate Planned Parenthood but set up another women’s health care group which provides abortions but is strictly monitored as to reporting of statutory rape, you’d be OK with that?
interesting that the pro-aborts keep making excuses for very bad behavior by the abortion providers.
Here in our town the school authorities looked the other way when there was a suspected teacher inappropriately dealing with ELEMENTARY school girls. as mandatory reporters, they were supposed to make the call. none did until another set of girls were abused. busted. They teacher went to jail and the administrators lost their positions and the school district was sued.
When mandatory reporters look the other way, everyone loses.
Don;t defend the bad behavior – challenge everyone to protect the kids. everyone, including PP.
I want to know why Lila Rose and Mark Crutcher aren’t doing sting videos and phone calls at hospitals where teens give birth. Is that because having a baby is good and having an abortion is bad?
Yes, people, everyone dealing with minors are required, by law, to report cases of statutory rape even if it is only suspected. Denying or justifying PP’s behavior only aides and abets both perpetrators. In the end, the child is victimized over and over again. First by the phedophile, then by PP and then by excusers. Who is for the child? Who is for justice? Before excusing and justifying why don’t you counduct your own investigations, your own stings? I certainly do before I blindly trust an organization I am going to support, defend and give money to.
PS-PP is not the only corrupt abortion provider, they are just the only brazen, deceptive, lying and, corrupt organization that gets millions of our tax-dollars while thinking and behaving as if they are above the law.
MSW4Life-
Does the MSW stand for Master of Social Work, by chance. Cause if so, we should talk. jacquefromtexas@yahoo.com
CC – Abortion covers up the evidence of the sexual abuse. Carrying a pregnancy to term and giving birth….um…doesn’t. The “proof” is always there. If abortion providers don’t uphold their mandatory reporting obligations, they are complicit in removing the evidence of a crime and sending young girls back into the very grateful hands of the abuser.
cc, why don’t you do your own sting on a hospital? Nothing is stopping you.
Meanwhile, you affirm your position which is:
Church pedophiles who abuse boys bad.
Any pedophiles who abuse girls OK.
Abortion fans believe that if young girls are coerced into sex, well, they’re just growing up so fast. But if boys are coerced into sex, stop the presses! Isn’t it strange how abortion fans claim that pro-lifers hate women, but actions speak louder than words. It is the abortion industry that hates women of all ages.
Cain wrote:
“When Margaret Sanger – check my history – started Planned Parenthood, the objective was to put these centers in primarily black communities so they could help kill black babies before they came into the world,”
It would seem to me PP and its supporters are for killing black babies and
for covering up the actions of pedafiles against young girls.
all the while screaming that the opposition to abortion hates women…….
As the old bomber pilots say, “If you’re not catching flak, you’re not over the target.”
So, when dear CC/Artemiserable comes out swinging, it means the B 52’s are pounding the snot out of her.
“And if you think that audio tapes can’t be altered, then you are truly delusional. And how can we be sure that those in the tapes are PP employees and not actors? Eh?”
That’s the best you have? Really? We’ve got waves of bombers over you, and you come out with a junior high school argument like that?!
Okay CC, put on your big girl pants. If the tapes were forgeries and PP were not guilty, they would have sued Mark Crutcher. Employee work hours are easily researched and voice recognition software could easily be employed to verify the ID’s of the clinic employees. Cutcher has the phone call data, including dates, times, and length of call. It’s also pretty easy to ascertain doctored tapes.
PP knows that coming out to fight would be an unmitigated disaster.
Might I suggest that you get a job as a PP spokesperson? We need you representing them, CC. We really do.
“Okay CC, put on your big girl pants. If the tapes were forgeries and PP were not guilty, they would have sued Mark Crutcher.”
To what end? It’s obvious his stunts never attracted the notoriety he was hoping for. Suing him would give him a platform he doesn’t deserve.
Right, Joan. Except PP has been caught repeatedly by Lila Rose in one series of lies after another.
PP claimed to do mammograms until people checked.
The lies go on, and on, and on….
Crutcher nailed them.
Lila nailed them.
Jill nailed them.
Keep spinning Joan. It’s pathetic, but amusing.
Yes, I’m sure they’re smarting from getting “nailed”… all the way to a 500% increase in online donations and keeping their federal funding. So, nice work to all parties involved. Looking forward to the next “sting”.
“Imagine if this were the Catholic Church. Do you think it would be so ignored by the media? I doubt it.”
There’s no doubt about it that it would not be ignored.
“Yes, I’m sure they’re smarting from getting “nailed”… all the way to a 500% increase in online donations and keeping their federal funding. So, nice work to all parties involved. Looking forward to the next “sting”.”
Wow. Are you a big fan of Charles Manson as well? Write him any love letters?
Joan,
I’m glad their donations have soared. It’s further evidence that they do not need taxpayer funding for their criminal deeds. Say hi to Charlie for me.
“That’s the best you have? Really? We’ve got waves of bombers over you, and you come out with a junior high school argument like that?!” – and what’s that then, your ‘my dad’s bigger than your dad’ argument? Waves of bombers – dont make me laugh.
“If the tapes were forgeries and PP were not guilty, they would have sued Mark Crutcher” – why would PP help to give this man’s propaganda campaign oxygen. The best way to defeat scurrilous rumor-mongering is to ignore it. Same for “PP knows that coming out to fight would be an unmitigated disaster.”
“voice recognition software could easily be employed to verify the ID’s of the clinic employees” – do it then.
“Are you a big fan of Charles Manson as well? Write him any love letters?” – and that’s why you will continue to lose.
“Are you a big fan of Charles Manson as well? Write him any love letters?” – and that’s why you will continue to lose.
What? It’s a legitimate question, considering Joan’s apparent support for statutory rape. She says she enjoys these sting operations which prove that PP supports rape. So I’m curious if she’s one of those crazies who sends love letters to Charles Manson. Does that question offend you? I’m being serious.
Yup, we’re right over the target. Got a regular troll convention here tonight. It’s truly amazing how bloodlust for killing babies causes people to accept any criminality in order to preserve the barbaric institution.
“and that’s why you will continue to lose.”
No worries there. They have inoculated themselves against failure, you see, by setting the bar for “success” so extraordinarily low, it’s practically impossible not to meet it on a regular basis. A Gallup poll shows a slight uptick in people who identify as “pro-life”? Victory! A college student “exposes” Planned Parenthood with some stupid ambush “journalism” tapes that get played on Fox News for a few days? Success!
Joan,
Success is letting you run your mouth, and enabling all the world to see the sewage that is the proabort mentality. Lila is good, but the trolls here are our greatest asset.
The problem for you John, is that Joan is saying she enjoys these sting operations because they expose scamming propagandists such as Crutcher for what they are and in fact encourage greater support for PP.
Your attempted allusion about Joan’s “apparent support for statutory rape” fails because there is nothing which proves that PP supports rape.
I was not offended by your question and while I can’t speak for Joan, I doubt that she is either. I was simply pointing out that the use of gratuitous aspersions makes you look more like the sort of crazy who would write love letters to Manson. Just like those who say things like “bloodlust for killing babies”.
You may think you’re ‘over the target’ Gerard, but we’ll simply deploy our umbrellas to deflect your water balloons.
Let’s not forget when those tapes were ‘made’ folks, 2002. It smacks of desperation that he is trying to deploy them in any meaningful way now. Feels the need to raise his profile a little does he?
Fox News? No sane and rational adult beleives what they hear on Faux News.
“Sewage” Gerard? That’d be the signs and slogans your people parade with while good folk cross the road to avoid those crazies.
Gerard, you would think that they would be against blatant and rampant corruption within the crown jewel of the abortion industry. Instead, it appears that they either couldn’t care less about it, or are actually happy to see Planned Parenthood covering up rape. Can you say Does Not Compute? Do supporters of abortion also support rape? Or is it just a knee-jerk reaction in defense of Planned Parenthood that has them saying stuff that makes no sense? Yeah, that’s probably it.
But the Charles Manson thing is still a possibility.
Reality, we don’t need these audio tapes from 2002 to know that Planned Parenthood covers up rape. We already have several recent video tapes from Live Action that prove the same thing. The question isn’t, does Planned Parenthood cover up rape? The question is, why does Planned Parenthood continue to enjoy your full support in spite of the fact that it covers up rape? It’s not just you, as you point out – Planned Parenthood online donations have increased greatly since it was proven that the organization covers up rape. Isn’t that curious?
“I was not offended by your question and while I can’t speak for Joan, I doubt that she is either.”
It was certainly nothing worth getting offended by. Or reacting to at all, for that matter. Do not answer a fool according to his folly, and all that.
A pro-abort citing the Bible to avoid defending herself to a pro-lifer is profound beyond comprehension.
“blatant and rampant corruption within the crown jewel of the abortion industry” – you would like people to believe so. They won’t.
“it was proven that the organization covers up rape” – you would like people do believe it was. They won’t.
“But the Charles Manson thing is still a possibility.” – like I said, the crazies holding the signs and praying in the street.
Yes, the ‘Gerard principle’ springs to mind Joan.
John,
Look at these people here. These are not women who suddenly find themselves in an unplanned pregnancy, and are beset by fear, confusion, etc. These are women who come here day, after day, after day to cheer with all their might for the slaughter of OTHER women’s babies.
The reason why the rape thing does not compute is because you make the mistake of assuming that their starting position is grounded in reason and mental health. What is defending rape to someone who screams at the top of her lungs daily for the slaughter of babies? What we are witnessing here is not mental illness, but human evil.
“to cheer with all their might for the slaughter of OTHER women’s babies.” – no, it’s to support their choice as to whether they want an abortion or not. Your slabs of invective cheapen your argument.
“someone who screams at the top of her lungs daily for the slaughter of babies” – and now you’re sounding hysterical.
Please, keep up these behaviours – we appreciate your help.
Unreal,
It’s very difficult to cheapen the argument that says you don’t hack apart a baby for any reason. You DO cry out daily for the slaughter of innocents, but you dress up your cries in the language of constitutional rights. We’ve seen all that before:
Dred Scott
Plessy v. Ferguson
Buck v. Bell
Koramatsu v. United States
and now Roe v. Wade
All you have is all the other evil humans had:
The assertion of the will, backed by evil men in black robes legislating such rights from the highest court in the land. That is the very definition of human evil. It’s not hysterical, any more that the hue and cry against slavery, segregation, eugenic sterilization, or internment camps. Nice try, though.
I’m not shoveling this time!
You could bury abortion fans under a mountain of rapists and they’d still salute the PP logo.
@ninek 3:47: This, exactly. It’s depressing and unfortunate that people support PP despite their willingness to cover up rape, abuse, and all manner of other sexual crimes. And to use their political power to silence anyone who speaks up for their victims.
It is not, however, surprising.
CC says: April 13, 2011 at 6:20 pm
1. “I want to know why Lila Rose and Mark Crutcher aren’t doing sting videos and phone calls at hospitals where teens give birth.”
2. “Is that because having a baby is good and having an abortion is bad?”
==============================================================
C-ompletely C-ompromised,
1. Because most hosptials do not allow their physicians and staff to perform elective surgical procedures on people too young to give their consent, informed or otherwise. And most hospitals comply with mandatory reporting requirments when underage children show evidence of having been sexually assaulted by a adult.
At PP it seems non-compliance is the rule, because PP’s prime directive is to prevent as many live births as possible and to profit by performing the abortions themselves. There is a considerable amount of federal funds involved and a lot of ‘cash’ generated to grease the sweaty palms of PP’s political pimps.
2. Giving birth to a live baby vs. choosing/electing/opting/deciding to kill your pre-natal child.
Yes! That is an accurate, life and death example of good vs evil.
C-louded C-consciousness,
Are you just being disengenuous or are you really this stupid?
Or are you permanently brain damaged from chasing one too many parked cars?
“Might I suggest that you get a job as a PP spokesperson? We need you representing them, CC. We really do.”
=============================================================
Gerard,
If PP can get the bovine scatulation for free, why would the whore house pay the bovine?
Gerard, I would like them to explain to me why they wouldn’t support someone like Charles Manson. It’s only logical that they would. He “decreased the surplus population”, did he not? And that was the founding mission of Planned Parenthood. Sure, maybe he didn’t go about it the right way, but neither does PP. So what’s the difference?
It’s kind of bizarre to see them close their eyes and cover their ears and say THERE’S NO RAPE COVER UP AT PLANNED PARENTHOOD LALALALA I CAN’T HEAR YOU. But then, is that really so different than what they do when we present the mountain of evidence that human life begins at fertilization?
“Giving birth to a live baby vs. choosing/electing/opting/deciding to kill your pre-natal child.
Yes! That is an accurate, life and death example of good vs evil”
Here’s the thing, Ken. (I could do a cute, little mockery of your name; but it’s so sophomoric). Not everybody holds to theabortion is murder standards of former Operation Rescue domestic terrorists who have no problem with the murder of post-born abortion doctors. But as you’re so smart, perhaps you can prove that hospitals do comply with mandatory reporting. While he have plenty of Lila Rose material which hasn’t produced one indictment of Planned Parenthood, we have no Lila Rose material on gynecologists and hospital staff who do deal with underage patients. And how do you figure that “non-compliance” is “the rule” at Planned Parenthood when the number of actual changes made, as a result of sting videos, is less than 20 out of 800 Planned Parenthood clinics.
But your misogynistic characterization of Planned Parenthood as “whores” and cows is very telling. Women enabling other women to exercize their reproductive freedom is, obviously, very threatening to the male patriarchy that underscroes the anti-choice movement. I do hope that the Planned Parenthood, in your area, has heavy security because former Operation Rescue domestic terrorists can pose a serious security risk….
“Gerard, I would like them to explain to me why they wouldn’t support someone like Charles Manson. It’s only logical that they would. He “decreased the surplus population”, did he not?”
Of all the twisted analogies that the anti-choice movement presents, this could be one of the most absurd. Charles Manson committed what the law defines as murder. The law does not define abortion is murder. Not even all faith communities define it as such. Science and medicine certainly does not hold that view as esteemed medical schools continue to train future physicians as abortion providers. Medical and scientific textbooks, used in public schools and universities, do not claim that a fetus is a person and they don’t claim that a termination of a fetus is “murder.”
“someone who screams at the top of her lungs daily for the slaughter of babies” – and now you’re sounding hysterical”
Love the hyperbole. These verbal histrionics (Obviously what passes for civil discourse at Franciscan University) demonstrate why the anti-choice movement is considered a non mainstream group of crazed zealots whose goal is to control women by taking away their right to an abortion, birth control, and in-vitro. (The sidewalk theater outside our PP is outstanding. You’ve got the old dudes wearing plastic fetus necklaces while holding their fetus pictures. You’ve got the old lades, way past child-bearing age, chanting the rosary. You’ve got others who shout at women entering the clinics, many of whom are just trying to pick up perscriptions. You’d think it was an SNL skit if you didn’t know better!!!)
BTW, the Senate vote of PP is today. Looks like some Republican women won’t be voting for it. And if Scott Brown values his senate seat, he won’t be, either.
CC,
“Charles Manson committed what the law defines as murder.”
Is there an objective reality outside of the law concerning what Charles Manson did? Or was it only wrong because it was against the law? In other words, had the law not condemned Charles Manson’s acts, would they have not been morally reprehensible?
“Crutcher is an anti-choice zealot so his information could be a bit tainted.”
Can you cite cases where he’s been dishonest? If strident advocacy alone warrantes suspicion of dishonest practice, then the tapes are as likely true because PP is anti-life zealots.
Logic. Learn what a categorical imperative is before arguing with people, child.
“I want to know why Lila Rose and Mark Crutcher aren’t doing sting videos and phone calls at hospitals where teens give birth.”
Better to start with a criminal organization that kills the unborn than with one that welcomes them into life.
I think you just don’t like that the transcripts vindicate pro-life claims about PP’s criminal practices. You don’t like evidence. You really, really don’t like pro-lifers being right.
It’s a hard knock life, eh?
“Let’s not forget when those tapes were ‘made’ folks, 2002. It smacks of desperation that he is trying to deploy them in any meaningful way now. Feels the need to raise his profile a little does he?”
:::sigh:::
Some folks won’t learn even when tutorials are always in the news: James O’Keefe
The technique is to bait folks like you into making stupid remarks just like that — then follow through with another round of stuff collected quite recently.
In other words, you don’t put the bait out until the gaffe is in your other hand.
Here’s the thing, Ken. (I could do a cute, little mockery of your name; but it’s so sophomoric).
It is insufferably immature and not even mildly amusing. I skip over his comments for that reason and grunt when I have the misfortune of catching one. He could be saying very profound things of social import for all I can tell, but the infantile mockery makes it impossible to know.
Jacqueline, thank you. His comments just drip with sarcasm as do the comments of Dr. Nadal which, in addition to being snarky, are blatantly insulting. Others here are capable of engaging in civil discourse. Those of us on the other side are held to a higher standard while they are given a free pass. BTW, Ken recently actually insulted a gay Irish pro-lifer the other day but that’s just Ken being Ken!
Okay CC. Ken is Sophomoric, I’m Snarky, and you’re Deadly. Shaping up to sound like some Disney character names. Yes CC, the sarcasm is an appropriate level of response to a woman who cheers for abortion and defends rapists.
Sorry John, you haven’t been sufficiently bad to get a dwarf name from the trolls.
Ken, the Sanger Sorority are pulling the prissy routine when bested by a boy. Rock on bro!
Bobby, If the Supreme Court issued a ruling permitting Manson’s activities, the Sanger Sorority here would be all for him, just as they are all for abortion, simply because it is a Supreme Court “right”,
Just as they support owning slaves because of Dred Scott
Just as they support the eugenic sterilization of the developmentally disabled because of Buck v. Bell
Just as they support making blacks ride the back of the bus and sit at separate lunch counters because of Plessy v. Ferguson
Just as they support throwing ethnic Americans into prison camps in time of war because of Koramatsu v. United States
Just as they no doubt support the concentration camps for Jews because of the Nuremberg Laws.
That’s the mantra, “It’s a right.” They never stop to ponder that all of these atrocities share one thing in common:
The law has systematically stripped whole classes of human organisms of their personhood status. Having taken away such legal protections, these classes of people stood outside of the law. History records each and every holocaust that ensued.
So, yes, they would support Charlie and his angels if they were given permission to do so by the Supremes, because they practice the same evil that he did. The only difference between the Sanger Sorority and Manson is that they have the blessings of the law, and he didn’t. I guess one really does need to be a bit discerning about one’s homicidal targeting.
“Ken, Sanger’s girls are pulling the prissy routine when bested by a boy. Rock on bro!”
Such blatant misogyny – and from an academic, too! I just don’t understand why those lil gals at Franciscan University wasting their time on a degree when their lot in life is to be happily pregant and servicing their “better half.”
And “bested” – in your dreams. And “boy” – rather, a former Operation Rescue domestic terrorist whose goals were and are to take away a woman’s right to bodily autonomy.
But abortion is still legal - so nanny, nanny, boo, boo to you.
Dr. Nadal,
Surely you don’t count me among “Sanger’s girls” simply because I don’t think mocking nicknames bode well for the pro-life argument?
I have nothing but disdain for people that promote the killing of children but name-calling, no matter from whom it comes, is in violation of the comment rules and a clear double standard.
“But abortion is still legal - so nanny, nanny, boo, boo to you.”
You kind of stepped all over my point there, CC. I try to extend a little good will to people who’s defense of human dismemberment makes me nausiated, and this happens.
Consider this my lesson learned.
“Just as they support making blacks ride the back of the bus and sit at separate lunch counters because of Plessy v. Ferguson”
Oh, please, you do realize that many of those who were champions of Civil Rights were also pro-choice as was Coretta Scott King.
“Just as they no doubt support the concentration camps for Jews because of the Nuremberg Laws”
Oh, right. The majority of Jews (including rabbis) support a woman’s right to an abortion. So they also support concentration camps. Abe Foxman was so right when he articulated his distate for how the mostly Christian anti-choice movement compares abortion to the Shoah.
“You kind of stepped all over my point there, CC.”
You’re right. Sorry. I was lowering myself to his level and that’s obviously what he wants. Lesson learned, Jacqueline.
“He [yor bro ken] could be saying very profound things of social import for all I can tell, but the infantile mockery makes it impossible to know.”
==============================================================
C-ringing C-oward and Jacquie-in-the-botch,
Mockery is all you and your comments warrant.
You are lost in a fantasy world where ‘passive non-violent resistance’ is the equivalent of a msguided muslim missle walking into a Russian airport and detonating a bomb that maims and kills children, women and men.
By your metric Ghandi would be a terrorist for resisting the government in India.
Your are a malignant misinformationalist. You are sold out shills for barbarians.
You only care about other females as long as they agree with your self centered whorld view.
I have some respect for intellectually honest people with whom I disagree.
Hal comes quickly to mind.
But you are neither an intellecual nor honest.
Offer up something besides your regurgitated leftist/feminist/humanist tripe and I will give it all the thoughtful consideration it deserves.
Until then you will continue to be cannon fodder [methphorically speaking] for even a simpleton like me.
As for the Irish pro-lifer who professes to be a homosexual, please be specific in how I insulted him. I suggest you first consult a dictionary to inform yourself as to exactly what constitutes an ‘insult’.
To artificial flowers like yourself, all one has to do to ‘insult’ you is contradict your baseless assertions.
“Better to start with a criminal organization that kills the unborn than with one that welcomes them into life”
What courts have convicted Planned Parenthood of running a “criminal” organization?
“Can you cite cases where he’s been dishonest?”
Other than in the court of anti-choice opinion, his audio tapes don’t prove anything. James O’Keefe’s Brooklyn ACORN tape was proven, by the Brooklyn AG, to be false. so far, nobody has held these audio tapes to any legal scrutiny. And gotcha media, by those with an agenda, is highly suspect. Crutcher is not NBC or even Fox News. he is an anti-abortion zealot whose aim, like that of the anti-choice movement, is to bring down Planned Parenthood by any means necessary.
And BTW, how do we know that a call wasn’t put through to police? Did Crutcher leave a number where police would be able to contact him? And if they did (and they wouldn’t have been too happy about using their time and resources on a crank call to PP) would Crutcher admit it? But what was the receptionist supposed to say other than provide information on services provided by PP? And if it just an informational call, the receptionist would not have asked for a return phone number of any other identifying information. There are lots of holes in Crutcher’s scenarios.
Jacqueline,
I don’t doubt your pro-life orientation for a second, and am not referencing you in the Sanger Sorority. Mild descriptive terminology such as trolls, etc, do not cross the line. As for CC, she has a fair number of deleted comments for crossing WAY over the line, so you’re not commiserating with a Girl Scout there (or maybe you are, as they’re in bed with PP too).
As for my fiestiness, I’m responding to the deadliest of all apologetics here. These are the champions of the greatest genocide humanity has ever known. All in all, Ken’s comments and mine are rather mild when stacked against the hate-filled venom that spews forth from Sanger’s girls (and guys) here. But sorry, I don’t encounter evil wearing a Prozac smile.
You are lost in a fantasy world where ‘passive non-violent resistance’…
Really?
Operation Rescue, the anti’s who blockaded clinic entrances, targeted Yakima in 1988. “All of a sudden people surrounded the entire building. There were vans backed up to the entrances, blocking all the doors. Some anti’s put bicycle locks around their necks and bolted themselves to the bumpers of the blockading vehicles. We felt ambushed. It was really scary and we couldn’t evacuate – there was no way to get out,” recalls Ellie Lambert.
http://www.fwhc.org/take-action/20years.htm
And you might try offering up something other than irrelevent biblical quotes and condescending ad-hominems or rightwing/anti-choice/Christianist tripe.
Ken,
Mock me, a sidewalk counselor, bioethicist and pro-life activist all you please. You just continue to make yourself look ridiculous. You should seriously consider growing up. It’s not amusing, rather it’s counter-productive and incredibly annoying.
Dr. Nadal,
Thanks- I don’t want to prove my pro-life street cred around here, but I had to make sure I wasn’t being lumped in with Sanger. The worst insult I ever got was when I sent Cecile Richards a sympathy card on the loss of her mother (I have a great burden for Cecile and pray for her- so I wanted to love on her) and she sent me back a thank you note calling me “Planned Parenthood family” and saying that she would honor her mom’s legacy by “continuing to fight for the rights of women.” Worst insult ever. :)
CC,
Your logic is impeccable. Because Corretta supported abortion that means what, exactly?
You stake your claim to kill on a Supreme Court ruling. By your logic, all of the aforementioned rulings are as morally acceptable. Now, if you can’t accept that just because the Supremes decree something, that makes it morally acceptable, then you have given up your biggest card in the game. I don’t expect logic from someone who revels in having killed her own child, but then don’t make a pretense of it either.
By the way, Ken, I stopped reading your post yet again when I saw that you bestowed upon me a nice little mocking moniker that’s not even clever, so attempts to insult me will fail.
C-racked C-rockery,
The new report from Yakima is all very interesting but there is nothing in there about a death, an injury, damage to property or even a missed appointment.
We have one unconfirmed report of a person who says she could not get out of the building. If that assertion were in fact true you would be showing us a newspaper article stating that some activist had been charged with ‘wrongful imprisonment’.
Please try again. Remember you are searching examples of ‘terrorism’ or ‘violence’.
Please give an example of an ‘irrelevant biblical quote’.
I plead guilty to being condescending. I have already stated my reasons for the ‘condescension’.
If the ad-hominem attacks are not slanderous or libelous, but indeed are accurate, then I would say they are relevant and warranted.
You accuse me of being a ‘terrorist’ but you can not provide a single example of ‘terrorism’ on my part. That is an ‘ad hominem’ attack, slander and libel.
Don’t fret though. I forgive you and I pray that you will hear the ‘pop’ and the veil of darkness will be removed from your understanding and you will see the light.
Not for my benefit but for yours.
But I will not stop mocking and ridiculing you and your inane gibberish as long as you continue to offer it up for consideration.
Jacqueline,
If you’re done with your pro bono defense of the trolls, perhaps your pro-life sentiments might kick in to take them to task over their denials of truth. In so doing, you can help correct yet another thread derailment. Right now it’s looking like manners over morals.
As interesting as the tapes sound I will NOT be visiting a site called ChildPredator.com. Not gonna happen.
Anyways it is very possible that Planned Parenthood told the girls that they will cover it up in order to get them to report it; otherwise they would go elsewhere. Whether or not they are lying to them and would actually report it is unclear.
Even if it’s true, while it would be appalling indeed, it is not as bad as slaughtering babies for profit, which they do publicly and openly, though understandably using more palatable terms to describe it. It’s a bit ironic to debate whether or not an organization whose primary trade is murder is corrupt.
Touche, Gerry. Touche.
I totally will. I am scrambling though to finish my CV. My major professor is recommending me for a fellowship and I need it. He just came in my office and told me. I hope this isn’t expediency over morals. :)
Jacqueline says: April 14, 2011 at 10:42 am
Ken,
Mock me, a sidewalk counselor, bioethicist and pro-life activist all you please. You just continue to make yourself look ridiculous. You should seriously consider growing up. It’s not amusing, rather it’s counter-productive and incredibly annoying.
===========================================================
Jacqueline,
If you stand too close to folks like CC then you may sustain some collateral damage from the incoming barrage or you might take some friendly fire.
You would be well advised to distance yourself from the ‘dead babies r us’ trolls who frequent this site just as you have demonstrated the ability to distance yourself from me.
I would not want you to catch any arrows intended for me.
[Hal, I am speaking metaphorically using military terms.]
@gerard nedal
Do you think, just maybe, that the people who “investigated” the claim that Planned Parenthood performs mammograms knew exactly which individual clinics did not offer them, and called them specifically?
It doesn’t mean that Planned Parenthood doesn’t offer mammograms, it means that those specific ones that were chosen for phone calls didn’t offer them, and the “investigators” knew that in advance
‘dead babies r us’– See! That crap right there! You seriously don’t see how annoying this is? It’s this sort of impaling a plastic baby doll with wire hangers and squirting it with red paint and attaching it to a sign and parading it at marches and in front of abortion mills that makes normal pro-lifers look crazy. You’re the type of guy the press interviews while ignoring the other 250,000 who says smarmy crap and makes us look petty and deningrates the message.
“It doesn’t mean that Planned Parenthood doesn’t offer mammograms, it means that those specific ones that were chosen for phone calls didn’t offer them, and the “investigators” knew that in advance.”
===============================================================
The best you can deduce is that the clinics that were called do not offer mamograms.
You can only speculate as to the motives of the callers and what they knew about the PP’s they called.
But you can bet your sweety bippy that C-reepy C-rawler would offer up links to PP’s that offer mamograms if there were any.
C-owgirl C-ounterfeit has the bovine scatulation, but she ain’t got no beef.
Jaqueline,
I think it is admirable that you are praying for Cecile and guinely displaying love and compassion towards her, especially in her time of loss. Sadly, had you indicated that you are pro-life, not pro-choice on the condolence card or in response to the thank you note (it was appropriate that you did not), your compassion would of likely been misconstrued as mocking or insult to a grieving family :( I guess it’s better for them to welcome the condolences under the impression that you were one of them, than for your message to be rejected and hated as a pro-lifer.
Exactly, Rachael. I thought about writing something, but everything I could write indicating I didn’t support anything they do would have negated the message that I was truly sorry for her loss. I thought about sending a scripture card, but then that would have reinforced the lie that you can be a faithful Christian and support PP. So I just picked a generic card and said, “I am sorry for your loss.”
Jacqueline,
People been have making that lame arguement since SCOTUS gave us Roe v Wade. The same argument was made to abolitionist who were more direct in their speech and actions.
Are you suggersting the direct approach prolonged slavery and ushered in the civil war?
If you are then you have a naivete when it comes to bigots.
The best you can do is to make them expose themselves by their own words and deeds and reasonable people will draw the correct conclusion.
I am not at all concerned about the ‘movement’, the ‘message’, the ‘image’ of pro-lifers. They are not the ones being murdered on a daily basis.
I suggest you empathize and sympathize a little more with the victims.
If being sweeter than Jesus were ‘the’ successful strategy, then we would not be having this conversation.
Do whatever GOD gives you the grace to do the way HE gives you grace to do it.
I applaud your efforts. I hope they are effective.
The people who come to this site are not a captive audience. They are just as free to stay as they are to leave.
There are many different expressions of the same gift. You have your ways. I have mine. May GOD direct and bless us both as we plan our ways and HE directs our steps.
God hears the cry from the blood of innocent babies against abortion.
He gave me a song the title is: BLOOD OF THE INNOCENT
I AM TRYING TO GET THE SONG PLAYED ON RADIO STATIONS
Hear/Download @
http://www.cellware.com/track/blood-of-the-innocent
Watch video @
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MfHRlj3tO4
Words posted @
http://godgivesmesongs.blogspot.com
Join cause @
http://www.causes.com/causes/360975-stop-abortion/about?m=4237c946
God bless you,
Brenda Farley BMI Author/Artist
*sighs* I told myself I’d stay out of this argument, but here I go…
‘dead babies r us’- See! That crap right there! You seriously don’t see how annoying this is? It’s this sort of impaling a plastic baby doll with wire hangers and squirting it with red paint and attaching it to a sign and parading it at marches and in front of abortion mills that makes normal pro-lifers look crazy. You’re the type of guy the press interviews while ignoring the other 250,000 who says smarmy crap and makes us look petty and deningrates the message.
I agree, this petty name calling and non-sense comparisons aren’t productive or appropriate for dialogue. Ask yourself, am I just looking to belittle and breakdown the opposition or actually trying to engage them in dialogue and debate to change their hearts and minds. Also, if I were in their position, I would of closed my ears and hardened my heart when others started calling me degrogatory names and started to insult me. How do you expect to change hearts and minds this way? There is such a thing a tough love, but tough love doesn’t include belittling or breaking down the other person. The insults and petty name-calling have got to go.
Along with his keen intellectual acumen, Ken’s powers of prognostication are superlative.
FACT: Some Planned Parenthood Clinics DO Provide Mammogram Screenings
Waco, TX Planned Parenthood “Provides Life-Saving Mammogram Screening And … Diagnostic Testing.” From Planned Parenthood’s Website
And word to Dr. Nadal. Prior to Roe, I felt that abortion was morally acceptable. I and many others continue to hold this opinion. The SCOTUS decision is, therefore, irrelevent vis-a-vis my sentiment. Obviously, it could be overturned by the newest conservative additions to the court stated that it is “stare decisis.”
Texas Department Of State Health Services Lists Planned Parenthood Clinics As Breast Cancer Service Providers. The Texas Department of State Health Services includes Planned Parenthood of Central Texas in Waco in its list of Breast and Cervical Cancer Services providers. [Breast & Cervical Cancer Services Clinic Locator, 2/15/11]
Waco, TX Planned Parenthood Newsletter Announced A Partnership With BCCS To Provide Mammograms…
As a Texan, Ken should be aware of this…
And C-reepy C-rawler – so funny I forgot to laugh. Grow Up.
And word to Dr. Nadal. The SCOTUS decision is irrelevent to me as I have always believed that abortion is morally acceptable. I’m not alone in this position which is held by various faith communities. Obviously, the SCOTUS decision can be changed but the newest conservative members of the Supreme Court say it’s stare decisis.
Wow. I haven’t read all the comments but for something the pro-choicers/pro-aborts deem not important (at least based on the comments I did read they don’t seem to find these audio tapes too much of a worry) they sure are commenting/commented a lot. Just my personal observation.
Until law enforcement acts on the tapes, they are meaningless.
CC says:
April 14, 2011 at 11:58 am
Until law enforcement acts on the tapes, they are meaningless.
Now you’re just making me even more curious, CC. If they’re so meaningless, why did you and the other pro-choicers/pro-aborts suddenly post so many comments? If you just simply don’t care about the tapes and all that, why give it the time of day?
Until law enforcement acts on the tapes, they are meaningless.
I think I get it. It’s like you pro-aborts say,
“Until babies are wanted, they are meaningless.”
Janet, Zing!!!
You know, there are perfectly nice people in their 60’s who weren’t able to get a college education for one reason or another. Then you see someone here who wasted her education and is basically the oxygen thief she accuses unwanted babies of being. She looks down her nose at the proletariat, all the while goose-stepping with her black claw held high as she chants: “Abortion uber alles! Abortion uber alles!”
I sent links to the childpredator report to CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NBC and Fox. Anybody want to bet that no one picks it up?
C-anned C-orn,
Excuse me, but claiming to do something and actually doing it are NOT the same thing.
If you had taken the time to comprehend the ‘info’ you profferred as ‘proof’ you would have noticed that it is PP is ‘partnering’ with BCCS.
Waco, TX Planned Parenthood Newsletter Announced A Partnership With BCCS To Provide Mammograms…
It is unclear who is actually doing the mamamograms and cancer screening.
Also the site was ‘Last updated February 16, 2011’
When did Lila Rose release those incriminating video clips?
Ah, Yes. January 2011.
It is call reto-active damage control.
Once the jackass is out of the barn how can we make it seem like the barn was not to blame and in fact may serve many other beneficial purposes, like storing hay.
“Quick buy some hay and build a loft and store it up there.”
Not to worry I will call the PP in Arlington and schedule a pap smear and a mamogram for my wife and/or daughters.
IF, and that is a big IF, PP actually provides these services on site, then I will get a list of services and costs and compare them to what my family physician’s charges for the same services. Then I will us an FOIA request to see how much PP is compensated for these services.
My youngest daughter could probably pass for 14.
Maybe I will see if they will schedule her for an abortion with me posing as the father.
That should be interesting.
C-oC-onspirator,
Be sure and give them a call and let them know we are coming.
I want to make sure they are functioning under normal operating procedures when we arrive. Would want to give them the opportunity to say this was an aberation.
Deanna, I’m not taking that bet, lol!
CC says: April 14, 2011 at 11:50 am
“As a Texan, Ken should be aware of this…
And C-reepy C-rawler – so funny I forgot to laugh. Grow Up.”
=============================================================
C-lassless C-ritter,
What can I say, some things just get past me.
What with tendin to my oil wells, my cattle ranch, gunfights, shoein my horses, repairin my bubbamobile, keepin my wife barefoot and pregnant [that woman can buy some shoes], wachen re-runs of ‘COPS’, defendin the border [them Okies are sneaky], and rememrbrin the Alamo, life gets complicated.
I just have to depend on folks like Mark Crutcher and Lila Rose to keep a wary eye on the whorehouses down hyar,
As far as gettin groad uhp is consernt. Ah like to thank I am just young for my age.
mah momma, GOD bless her departed soul, wuz a bit mor direkt in her opinion of me. She said ah wuz emmatoor.
I aint as good as oncst wuz, but I am still good oncst as I wuz. [That’s my story and ahma stikin toit.]
Caitlin,
Perhaps you could point us to the PP’s that actually have mammogram machines. Perhaps Cecile Richards or Barbara Boxer might point us to the PP’s with mammogram machines. Perhaps Susan G. Komen, who has given millions to PP might point us to the PP’s with mammogram machines.
Why are they so impossible to find?
If you believe what you have said, then Live Action had reduced your work. They have eliminated over half the states in the nation. But to warn you, I just called Planned Parenthood’s headquarters in NYC and spoke to a very pleasant woman named Elizabeth. I told her that my wife is looking for centers that do mammograms (true) and asked if PP does mammograms, and if so, how is payment arranged (Insurance, etc).
Elizabeth told me that PP DOES NOT DO MAMMOGRAMS ANYWHERE. They offer light breast exams during a gynecological work-up and refer for mammograms. She then offered me the numbers of several hospitals in NYC that do mammograms.
So, there you have it, straight from PP headquarters in NYC.
C-ounterfeit C-owgirl,
You are long on bovine scatulation and short on beef.
“If you’re done with your pro-bono defense of the trolls”
It’s actually just a defense of what is right. Nowhere have I seen Jacqueline defending the actual pro-choice people who comment here – just the fact that name-calling is immature and ineffective to boot. Ken’s comments – and yours – may be mild when stacked against the sins and crimes of others, but that doesn’t make them right. That wouldn’t hold up in a court of law and I assume it wouldn’t hold up if you were defending yourself to God. Yes, yes, I know – Jesus threw those tables over. God wiped out most of the world in a flood, too – doesn’t mean it’s right for you to do.
As for threads getting derailed into manners over morals, there’s a pretty easy way to avoid that: mind your manners.
Alexandra,
You don’t see the comments that get deleted because of their vulgarity. Believe me when I tell you that those who bleat about name calling are the ones posting the deleted materials. It’s what libs do best, accusing others of doing the very thing they do in order to deflect the conversation. I indulged it on this thread to demonstrate the point.
Gerard, I see some of them. They are awful. But they don’t make your comments any more right. And, pragmatically, what do you do with them? You delete them. You certainly don’t listen much to them. Which is what someone who disagrees with you – and even some people who agree with you – do, at least internally, when you indulge in “witty” name-calling.
Why sully and disguise your own ideas and arguments by smearing them with mud?
And “bleating about name-calling?” are Jacqueline, Rachel C., and I doing that? And are we the ones posting the deleted material? No, and no.
Some Planned Parenthood Clinics DO Provide Mammogram Screenings
Waco, TX Planned Parenthood “Provides Life-Saving Mammogram Screening And … Diagnostic Testing.” From Planned Parenthood’s Website
FACT: A mammogram screening is not, in fact, a mammogram. A mammogram screening is when they do a tactile breast exam and refer you elsewhere for an actual mammogram if they feel anything suspicious.
FACT: If you go to the Waco PP website, they say the following:
“Ask your health care provider, health department, or staff at your local Planned Parenthood health center about where you can get a mammogram in your area.”
Nowhere on their site do they say that they provide mammograms at their location.
Why don’t you call them and ask, CC?
Gerard,
If my comments violate the rules then just delete them just as you would the ones from the ‘dead babies r us’ mob. I respect your judgement and your authority.
If you draw the lines clearly enough, even I can learn to color within them.
===================================================================
Alexandra,
Prov 28:4 Those who forsake the law [of God and man] praise the wicked, but those who keep the law [of God and man] contend {1624} with them. [Prov 29:18.] AMP
From the hebrew OT:1624 garah (gaw-raw’); a primitive root; properly, to grate, i.e. (figuratively) to anger: KJV – contend, meddle, stir up, strive.
“Yes, yes, I know – Jesus threw those tables over. God wiped out most of the world in a flood, too – doesn’t mean it’s right for you to do.”
That is not a very good argument.
If Jesus did it then it may be entirely right for me to do it as well, unless HE is telling me NOT to do it.
HE is afterall the firstborn among many brothers of whom I am numbered. HE is our example.
You would have been better served to argue that even Jesus, being LORD over all creation, complied with the ‘rules’ [at least most of them and, when HE did not, I am sure the FATHER was instructing HIM otherwise.].
I have used only two monikers on this site: 1. ‘kbhvac’ and 2. ‘yor bro ken’ until I finally got a clue about the mechanics of how this website functions. Then I dropped the ‘kbhvac’ and stuck with ‘yor bro ken’.
Once, I even banned myself from commenting for 30 days for going over the line, as I understood the line [30 days in the cooler].
At times I have been as critical of my ‘brethren’ as I have of the ‘dead babies r us’ folks.
At times I have mistaken a friend for a foe. [Sometimes the mistake was understandable.]
Why I did it just today when Jacqueline was defending halfCoCked.
I admire Jackies compassion, but it was misplaced.
I didn’t have time to read through all comments so I don’t know if this was answered, but it was asked and didn’t get answered promptly so I’ll drop it in: I don’t know about every state, but those that I am aware of all have mandatory reporting at hospitals too. If an underaged girl gives birth in a hospital she MUST sign a legally binding form that states who she believes the father to be and that form is filed with CPS and/or police. Without that form being submitted the hospital is legally prohibited from billing for any and all birth related procedures so hospitals are VERY good about getting it signed. Can you imagine if PP had to record a sworn statement on who the father was of every underaged pregnant women they saw was before they could bill?
Gerard,
Thanks for doing the digging.
“I [Gerard] just called Planned Parenthood’s headquarters in NYC and spoke to a very pleasant woman named Elizabeth. I told her that my wife is looking for centers that do mammograms (true) and asked if PP does mammograms, and if so, how is payment arranged (Insurance, etc).
Elizabeth told me that PP DOES NOT DO MAMMOGRAMS ANYWHERE. They offer light breast exams during a gynecological work-up and refer for mammograms.”
[A co-worker of mine went to a costume party dressed as a ‘mammogram machine’. He had a large cardboard box drapped over his shoulders with two holes cut in the front and a hand printed sign offerring ‘Free Breast Exams’. Is that how they do it at PP?]
C-ounterfeit C-owgirl,
Yall payin atinchin?
Do you want me to duplicate Gerard’s efforts here in ‘cowtown’ or will you just acknowledge that Gerand got the ‘offical policy’ straight from the whores mouthpiece?
Hey Ken – please reign in the name-calling! Moderators – since when are we allowed to call people whores? use the words cowtown;calling people names by changing their own moniker?
Gerard – regarding the deleted posts… maybe listing the name-calling without siting who is saying it and under what context will give people a better idea of what not to do. Please. This has been allowed to go on far too long.
Making a point is one thing, making a crass point with name-calling and no manners is another. Let’s participate with more charity, ok? Moderators – more enforcement of the ground rules, please. Thank you and God bless.
“the whores mouthpiece?” – Is “Ken; referring to Planned Parenthood or pro-choice women?
Ken, KBHVAC, former Operation Rescue activist arrested in the Pacific Northwest for blockading clinics, accuses pro-choice women of being whores.
Here’s the thing, Ken. As a former child protective worker with a Masters Degree, I dealt with abusive fathers and boyfriends. Virtually every word that emanates from your quiver full of venon reflects an underlying hatred of women – if not an actual psychosis. I actually did Family Court Studies regarding child custody issues. I met with guys like you who articulated the same kind of toxicity. The judges, after reading my reports, awarded custody to the mother. Nuff said.
Rest assured I will be notifying the Arlington Planned Parenthood about you as you are a threat. Despite your efforts to remain secret, you have a huge footprint on the web. But that’s what you want, so it’s all good.
BTW, I am very, very impressed with the decency and humanity of most of the posters here. These folks come from an honest, heartfelt conviction – albeit one that I don’t agree with. These are people who actually care about poor women. If not for the abortion issue, we would be on the same page. They never resort to name calling and vicious ad-hominems which I, sadly, have resorted to. It’s actually been a “teachable moment” reading some of the comments on this blog. It’s enabled me to see another side of the pro-life movement. Sadly, Ken and Dr. Nadal are not in that category.
Not everyone has been decent, for sure – but everyone here is a member of the human family. Thank you for recognizing everyone’s humanity.
I hope that one day, we can recognize all of our human family, defend it and welcome it (even those whose views and style of commentary we disagree with), including the unborn.
Joy, I read Ken’s comments – maybe I’m missing something – but I believe he’s calling Planned Parenthood itself a whore.
Correct me if I’m mistaken.
The “whore” would be PP; the woman who talked to Gerard would be the “mouthpiece.”
Still unacceptable. That is the point. As bad as we know PP to be, it serves nothing to have inflammatory language like that. Not needed, not wanted, harmful to the discussion.
And CC reporting Ken to the local PP as a threat is also reprehensible.
Goodness – this is ratcheting up the rhetoric, and resulting in more than mud-slinging. That is the point. As decorum decreases – the shrillness increases – enough to have people taking action like that.
That is why it’s important to nip this stuff in the bud.
Joy, if you would like to take up the discussion with the moderators directly, please do so via email. Thanks.
C-ounterfeit C-ounselor
1. “Rest assured I will be notifying the Arlington Planned Parenthood about you as you are a threat.”
2. “Despite your efforts to remain secret, you have a huge footprint on the web. But that’s what you want, so it’s all good.”
3. “Ken, KBHVAC, former Operation Rescue activist arrested in the Pacific Northwest for blockading clinics, accuses pro-choice women of being whores.”
==================================================================
1. I only just barely graduated high school, but I am pretty sure you just threatened me.
Please search the archives of Jill’s site. There is a photo of me there somewhere. It might be helpful to the folks at PP to have another ‘person’ to be on the lookout for. Please ask them to post my photo next to Lila Rose. I would be honored to be numbered in her company.
2. You do realize that you just contradicted yourself.
How does one make an effort to remain ‘secret’ and participate in a public forum on a daily basis?
3. I plead guilty as charged, except the last article, ‘accusing pro-choice women as being whores’. I use the term whore in a non-gender specific manner so it would include pro-choice men as well. It would be sexist to use it any other way. You seem to obsess over the ‘sexual’ connotation of the term and miss the fullness of it’s meaning. But then that fits the profile of an organization that is all about sex, all the time. You have chosen your bedfellows, don’t complain about the bed you have chosen to sleep in.
ps: While you have the Arlington PP on the phone you might inquire as to the nature of the mammogram services they offer and how much they charge. It might just be a teachable moment for you.
pps: Where do I send the check for the pseudo psychotherapy rendered? I would not want to be accused me of being a dead beat. As I recall this is the second time you have examined me and rendered a diagnosis. Just put it all on the same bill.
ppps: The words ‘former child protective worker’ imply that you are no longer employed in that capacity. I certainly hope that is true. With your inherent biases it is difficult for me to imagine you being able to offer an objective opinion to the court. I pity the poor men, women and children who may have sufferred as a result of your ‘expert’ testimony.
pppps: How does a ‘child protective worker’ overlook pedaphilic predators preying on young girls? How does a ‘child protective worker’ enable sexual predators to continue to prey on young girls?
I would like to contact you via email. I don’t know how to do that – so please advise.
My lovely husband just surprised me by wanting to take me out for dinner. I’ll continue later if possible or tomorrow.
Thank you!
Kel,
Please forgive me for inadvertently dragging you into my dispute.
Yes. PP is the ‘whore’.
But there are a lot of ‘whores’ who populate the organization and who promote the whore’s agenda and protect the whore from deserved scrutiny. There is a spirtual component to the understanding of the word that is much more important and relevant than the sexual understanding. The sexual is the symptom, the spiritual is the disease.
OT:2181 zanah (zaw-naw’); a primitive root [highly-fed and therefore wanton]; to commit adultery (usually of the female, and less often of simple fornication, rarely of involuntary ravishment); figuratively, to commit idolatry (the Jewish people being regarded as the spouse of Jehovah): KJV – (cause to) commit fornication, continually, great, (be an, play the) harlot, (cause to be, play the) whore, (commit, fall to) whoredom, (cause to) go a-whoring, whorish.
OT:6948 qedeshah (ked-ay-shaw’); feminine of OT:6945; a female devotee (i.e. prostitute): KJV – harlot, whore.
NT:4204 porne (por’-nay); feminine of NT:4205; a strumpet; figuratively, an idolater:KJV – harlot, whore.
NT:4205 pornos (por’-nos); from pernemi (to sell; akin to the base of NT:4097); a (male) prostitute (as venal), i.e. (by analogy) a debauchee (libertine) KJV – fornicator, whoremonger.
NT:4204 pornee, pornees, hee a woman who sells her body for sexual uses
1. properly, a prostitute, a harlot, in the N.T. universally, any woman indulging in unlawful sexual intercourse, whether for gain or for lust: Matt 21:31 f
2.metaphorically, an idolatress ; Rev 17:1,5,15 f
NT:4205 pornos, pornou, ho a man who prostitutes his body to another’s lust for hire, a male prostitute, 1 Cor 5:9-11
My my, hasn’t this thread advanced from the original topic about some 9 year old bogus tapes!
joyfromillinois,
‘cowtown’ is a term of endearment for Fort Worth, Texas. The stockyards and meat packing plants were the mainstay of the local economy for many years.
As to whores and harlots please see preceding post.
Suggest you read all CC’s comments before you reach a conclusion about the appropriateness of the terms.
C-ontessaC-ookoo has publicly associated herself with PP and she is proud of the association.
When referring to PP and the people who joyfully serve the ‘whore’, I use the term advisedly.
I do not cast it about promiscuously, but with with calculated consideration.
If it is slanderous or libelous to refer to the organization as a ‘whore’ and a ‘whorehouse’ then show me where it is an inaccurate characterization.
It’s enabled me to see another side of the pro-life movement.
That is nice to hear, CC. There are lots of sides of the pro-life movement, like any other movement. For the vast majority of my life we probably would have had just about EVERY belief in common – including those on abortion. Someone here called me a whore, another said I sold my soul for an orgasm (lol), an anonymous commenter back in the day when they were allowed asked if the reason I was unmarried was because my vagina wasn’t ready to be (a riff on the idea of vaginas having monologues and therefore opinions, etc). Another commenter posited that because I think divorce should be LEGAL, for ANYBODY, I am incapable of loving a spouse unconditionally. Through it all, over a few years now I guess, I still engaged in idle discussion, but I considered myself nothing like those people, and was quietly relieved to have nothing in common with them – even when some of them proved to be intellectually sound and logically consistent. At a certain point, my mind was changed, but I did not become pro-life until I felt in my heart that I COULD change and still remain the same “me” that I always was. It was the consistent, loving, compassionate example of two people in particular that finally allowed me to catch my heart up with my mind.
I’m not saying this so that you will be like “OH HAY SUPER AWESOME! Some people are pro-life and not jerks so I will be, too!” It doesn’t work like that. It’s just important for you to know that there is, for example, a late-twenties woman living in upper Manhattan (formerly Queens, originally Brooklyn), currently drinking a beer after hauling home today’s groceries from the farmer’s market; who shops local, recycles, volunteers, listens to NPR and This American Life; who knows how to weld and can drive a 24′ truck and wears vintage dresses (not when welding! only sometimes when truck-driving); who has had an unplanned pregnancy that she was totally NOT THRILLED about (understatement) and which did not end in a live birth, but also didn’t end in heartbreak and emotional ruin; who is agnostic and okay with it; who respects you and values you and thinks it would probably be awesome to meet you; who is pro-life.
Hi Joy. All moderator contacts can be found on Jill’s home page under “Team.”
You don’t see the comments that get deleted because of their vulgarity. Believe me when I tell you that those who bleat about name calling are the ones posting the deleted materials. It’s what libs do best, accusing others of doing the very thing they do in order to deflect the conversation. I indulged it on this thread to demonstrate the point.
I guess we’ll have to believe you because you deleted the “evidence,” but that doesn’t explain why someone–perhaps not you, but someone–deleted my comments on a prior thread.
I haven’t engaged in such outrageous behavior as I’ve seen in this thread, yet I’ve had my comments deleted.
What gives here?
Full Disclosure: I now screen grab my comments.
Someone is deleting only parts of appropriate comments and leaving other parts.
mp, this deletion of your comments – can you tell me which thread, and how recently? I’m not finding your comments pending anywhere. Let me know, please, if your comments haven’t been publishing. We have been having some issues with that lately and have a web programmer looking into it. Thank you.
mp, this deletion of your comments – can you tell me which thread, and how recently?
Every comment I made in the thread entitled “Officially Excommunicate Planned Parenthood supporters,” April 5, 2011, 4:57PM is tagged “Your comment is awaiting moderation.” Specifically, the comments at 6:19, 6:31, 6:39, 6:43 and 8:02PM.
The comments now print for me, but I’m unaware if they print for anyone else.
Not that it matters to me or anyone else–the thread is now dead–but before G_d I defy anyone to find that I engaged in outrageous behavior.
Curiously and perhaps coincidentally, some of the comments involve the egregious behavior of another individual, whose identity should be obvious to anyone here who has the ability to read.
CC says: April 14, 2011 at 5:29 pm
“Sadly, Ken and Dr. Nadal are not in that category.”
===================================================================
CuCumber,
Gerard should not be placed in the same category as myself.
It is not fair to him.
His good nature and calm demeanor make it extremely difficult for him to be confrontational.
But even GOD’s patience is not infinite.
BTW, I am very, very impressed with the decency and humanity of most of the posters here. These folks come from an honest, heartfelt conviction – albeit one that I don’t agree with. These are people who actually care about poor women. If not for the abortion issue, we would be on the same page. They never resort to name calling and vicious ad-hominems which I, sadly, have resorted to.
Thanks for admitting that CC. Such a confession makes your criticism of others’ name-calling more credible. I hope I haven’t offended too much myself (believe me, there were times when I was gritting my teeth trying to hold back at some of your more vicious and outrageous comments. The urge to reply in kind to such things is strong).
My only real intent has been to get you to think and ditch the ad hominems in favor of solid arguments. If you can refrain, so can I.
Now as to illogical arguments — first you say abortion is OK because it’s legal – now you are claiming that Roe v. Wade doesn’t mean anything to you. In other words, it doesn’t matter whether abortion is legal or not, because youve alway believed it is moral. So youre giving up your previous argument then? Because they’re in complete contradition to each other.
Or are simply you trying to say that abortion isn’t the crime of murder because the law doesn’s say it is? Once again, that means nothing, especially since a number of states recognize the killing of unborn children as murder. That’s why Scott Peterson was charged in CA for two counts of murder – one for his wife Laci and the other for the unborn son Conner. Now if Laci had aborted her child at the same age, the law wouldn’t have called it murder. Madness.
One more thing. I’d appreciate it if you’d ditch not only the ad hominems but the ad ecclesiams too. Particularly since it’s almost Holy Week. OK?
Hi mp,
Ok, I checked, and it looks as if your comments were removed most likely due to the use of a particular term, the appropriateness of which was in question, but not because they were “outrageous.”
Again – if your comments don’t go through or if comments are removed and you would like to know why, please email the moderators, which you’ll find under “Team” on right side of the homepage. Thanks!
mp,
The comments that were taken down used a term that Jill and I discussed as having no place on the blog. Jill stated that she would step in and state this unequivocally if it came to that. You should know that several other people’s comments were taken down if they contained the term in question.
I don’t know what other comments you may be referencing, but multiple links in one comment will often trigger the spam filter. Let us know immediately if you get a message stating that your comment is being held for approval. My blackberry alerts whenever I get an email.
“His good nature and calm demeanor” – I didn’t know there was a joke of the day competition!
We can always count on Alexandra lecturing pro-lifers about civility but somehow shes always absent when pro-aborts are doing it. She was converted by people treating her nice, not because unborn babies are being murdered. Sounds like like she could flip anytime back to pro-abort if a pro-lifer calls her a name… shakey grounds to be pro-life on…
As always, jasper, you remain my biggest fan.
I was not converted by people being nice. I was converted by people being right. But I could not see that they were right until at least some of them were decent – not even to me, necessarily. Just in general, consistently. The vast majority of my friends are pro-choice, and I am treated more nicely by lots of pro-choicers than by, say, you. Oh well.
Incivility is a distraction from an argument. When I was on shaky logical ground, I would seize on the incivility of others to talk about that instead. The incivility of pro-lifers left me an out in every debate, because almost without fail SOMEONE would jump in and say something rude, and then we’d be talking about that instead. Not being on shaky logical ground at this point, I see no need to distract myself with the flailing incivility of people who are desperately trying to smoke-and-mirror their way through a debate. When rudeness is thrown out there to mask poor logical reasoning, I am of the opinion that the most effective response is to zero in on the logical reasoning anyway, because the illogical arguments are the real problem. When rudeness is masking the truth, then the rudeness itself is the problem. I’m not interested in lecturing anyone, but in finding and solving the problem.
Not to mention, I have no real interest in making sure that pro-choice people are presenting their arguments in compelling and inclusive ways. What should I do, cry about how no one will listen seriously to pro-choice arguments if they’re all caked in profanity and insults? Please. I’m annoyed by logical inconsistency and I vastly prefer listening to arguments that don’t consist solely of personal attacks, but that’s just for the intellectual stimulation that comes from debating people who actually know how to debate.
CC said: “It’s actually been a “teachable moment” reading some of the comments on this blog. It’s enabled me to see another side of the pro-life movement. Sadly, Ken and Dr. Nadal are not in that category.”
Holy moley, talk about a new low. Pretending to respect the other pro-lifers on here in order to goad them into bashing Ken and Gerard? Wow. Just wow. After all of the insulting posts, all of the hate-filled sarcasm, all of the complete dismissals of any pro-life argument immediately out of hand as ridiculous, stupid, or based solely on misguided religious beliefs… CC all of a sudden respects some of the pro-lifers here and has learned from them! Amazing! Now let’s all talk about how much we hate Ken and Gerard. You are something else, CC.
BTW, I am very, very impressed with the decency and humanity of most of the posters here. These folks come from an honest, heartfelt conviction – albeit one that I don’t agree with. These are people who actually care about poor women. If not for the abortion issue, we would be on the same page. They never resort to name calling and vicious ad-hominems which I, sadly, have resorted to.
CC
Thank you for this. :)
Hi John,
I agree with your analysis. Quite frankly, Brooklyn kid that I am, I do not aspire to being “nice”. That’s code for fighting a battle with one hand tied behind one’s back. As I said, I don’t encounter evil with a prozac smile.
CC’s tactic here reminds me of a line from the movie, Becket:
“Sincerity is a tactic, on occasion, I’ve been known to use it myself.”
Nevertheless, we’ll see if CC’s newfound Rogerian unconditional positive regard for everyone but Ken and me is genuine, or a tactic.
One Brooklyn kid to another, I’m curious what you feel is gained by NOT being nice. How many people have been stung into submission by your barbs? Those on shaky logical turf gain distraction by their insults; what do those on solid ground gain?
What is lost by being civil? No one has answered that yet.
Personally, I feel that being not-nice is actually like going into a fight with mittens on. It dulls your arguments and renders them soft, fluffy, and kind of funny-looking to the person you’re swinging at.
I have no god telling me it’s ok to call someone an allegedly witty derogatory name so long as I do it in his defense, so all I have are the rules and truths my parents taught me: even if you’re right, it’s still wrong to be mean. And once you’re wrong, you’ve lost the high ground. And even if you’re still logically right, it’ll be harder for people to believe it when you’re down there in the mud with them, where the fight is really just about who’s dirtier. Hold onto what’s right.
I’m no shrinking violet. I work in a male-dominated, blue-collar industry where millions are on the table. Tensions run high and insults fly fast. It’s tough to offend me – I don’t exactly have delicate sensibilities. But I have never seen anyone be MORE respected after getting nasty. I have never seen anyone eager to rush to understand the points of someone who’s berating everyone else at the table – people just go, “What a jerk,” and remember the names, and forget the arguments. Rudeness is an unwise strategy when gaining support and changing minds is the end goal.
Evil wins if you’re not insulting people, you see.
“I’m annoyed by logical inconsistency and I vastly prefer listening to arguments that don’t consist solely of personal attacks, but that’s just for the intellectual stimulation that comes from debating people who actually know how to debate.”
Well, this isn’t really rocket science, we can murder pre-born children legally in this country and it’s wrong, that’s why I’m pro-life. If you prefer intellectual masterbation, thats fine, but not all pro-lifers need to use that tactic…
Thanks Jasper.
Alexandra, I really don’t need a lecture about how to deal with evil people, with an evil agenda, who come here filled with all manner of vituperation with the sole purpose of derailing one thread after another. So thanks, but no thanks. I’m not attending a tea party. Argue however you see fit, but if people can’t get the obvious because I respond to evil, malicious people with a rebuke that might not sound “nice”, then nothing will get through to them.
I expect that people are intelligent enough to get it. You might also note that men and women go about doing life differently, and respond differently. So John was correct in his analysis in how CC is succeeding in actually getting people to argue for her getting the kid glove treatment, despite her evil, narcissistic rants. I suggest that you spend some time analyzing your own behavior here.
I have no intention of being anything other than who and what I am. If that’s not “nice” enough, I suggest you consider the magnitude of the malevolence Joan, CC, and the rest of the Sanger Sorority represent, and save the Miss Manners routine for more appropriately sedate subjects. I’m not interested.
Jasper, with the comment about crappy logic I was referring to, quite obviously, the vile and insultingly-worded pro-choice arguments that so frequently pass for pro-choice “debate.” People can be wrong without being completely nonsensical, and those types of discussions are easier for me to have because logical rightness/wrongness is more easily proven than (and yet, if God is truth, exactly the same as) moral rightness. If someone wants to keep screaming about anti-sex priests, I find that more tiresome. That’s not intellectual masturbation.
Gerard, if you ever feel up to answering my questions, I’d be interested in hearing your response. I dont believe this is about tea parties or men and women being different, and I’m not interested in lecturing or being lectured. I also disagree that nothing will get through to people who skip over insulting comments – you are welcome to re-read and remember that I was ardently pro-choice and easily ignored the comments of those who insulted me, yet “something” got through to me.
I would appreciate knowing what of my own behavior I should be analyzing. I am nowhere near perfect but I do always try to be and do the best I can, and am always up for improvement!