Former Tiller intern: Abortion can be a radical act of love
I see being a doula as a political act and I believe that abortion, pregnancy, and childbirth can be a radical act of love and resistance. I’ve held the hands of thousands of people during their abortions and the compassion and love that I’ve witnessed while supporting someone during their abortion has shaped the kind of birth doula that I am today.
Being queer and actively choosing to work with queer and trans folks makes me a little different than the traditional doula (and I love that!).
~ Feminist activist, former intern for late-term abortionist George Tiller, and full-spectrum doula Kate Palmer, Radical Doula, October 11
Oct.19, 2012 6:00 am |
Post-abortion, Pregnancy |
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
Everything that is wrong, and nothing that is right. I bet in her universe the sun rises in the west and water boils at 0 degrees. I don’t know whether to be sad at her own delusions or angry at the evil she facilitates.
Kate – holding the hand of someone getting an abortion – where they kill their own innocent child, is not a radical act of love. Forgiving your enemies while hanging on a cross being executed - dying in your place to save you from your own unrighteousness - that’s a radical act of love.
May God open your eyes to real love, which is self-sacrificial for others.
Wow, what a nut. She must be using some strange definition of the word love.
Being a doula is a political act? Because having something–whatever and however–come out of your “lady parts” is an act of feminine resistance, I guess? So she’s gonna help you empty your uterus of it’s contents. If you like the contents, well, good on ya! And if you don’t, that’s cool too. And that’s Love if I’ve ever heard it.
Ghoula.
I believe that abortion, pregnancy, and childbirth can be a radical act of love and resistance.
“The issue is never the issue, the issue is always the revolution.” This is more people fighting their own natures in pursuit of a mythical paradise built on the broken bones of millions. The oldest sin goes on…
But…JDC….I slashed your tires because I *LOVE* YOU! Can’t you see that that was an act of love? You must be blinded by hate. :(
(Peeing in Ex-RINO & Hal’s Cheerios is admittedly nothing but an act of sheer resistance. :3 )
How can you work with lesbians and trans folks? They don’t get pregnant do they (and have abortions especially) I don’t get it.
I quite frankly would not want a lesbian with me while I was in labor. That would be just as bad as having a heterosexual man looking at my lady parts while in labor. No thanks. Just gross.
But most importantly I wouldn’t want a person who views my child as a “choice” or a “political statement” helping me during labor. I wouldn’t want a person who didn’t see the conception, growth and birth of my child as something precious and miraculous to be with me during those first moments when I held my warm and wet babies.
“…I’ve held the hands of thousands of people during their abortions………”
Sorry. Not buying it for one second. A few maybe, but “thousands” ?
Does she actually think people believe this crap ?
Lesbianism has never been as persecuted as male homosexuality but to the extent lesbianism has been stigmatized, the reason has to do with the feeling that they are “getting away with something” because they can enjoy sexual intimacy without risking the possibility of pregnancy.
“How can you work with lesbians and trans folks? They don’t get pregnant do they (and have abortions especially) I don’t get it.”
She does childbirth and abortion. Lesbians do get pregnant, by the way. I’m sure you could use the internet and find some examples. I would also think that some lesbians get pregnant through “legitimate rape” and might want an abortion. Many more, I’m sure get pregnant because they want a child.
The president of the Pro-Life Alliance of Gays and Lesbians got pregnant and had an abortion as a teen. She wasn’t raped, although she did feel societal pressure to have sex, in order appear straight. Her abortion was awful– she saw the remains of her child and immediately realized she’d been lied to by the “compassoinate” abortion workers.
You can hear her tell her story here: http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php?v=644414331457&set=vb.10620299&type=2&theater
But…JDC….I slashed your tires because I *LOVE* YOU! Can’t you see that that was an act of love? You must be blinded by hate.
And my ex blackened my eyes because he had my best interest at heart! If you don’t understand this form of love, you must be delusional.
“Being queer and actively choosing to work with queer and trans folks makes me a little different than the traditional doula (and I love that!).”
Yo..Kate! Listen up,
Being ‘queer’ makes you different, being perverse makes you bizarre.
The ‘killer bee’ outfit makes you a ‘free spirit’.
DenseGnome@10:38
I see the bag lady is still caught in the pull of our gravitas.
Mike saysOctober 19, 2012 at 10:11 am
“…I’ve held the hands of thousands of people during their abortions………”
Sorry. Not buying it for one second. A few maybe, but “thousands” ?
Does she actually think people believe this crap ?
Mike,
Kate toiled for the ‘late’ late term abortionist, George Tiller the killer.
By his own admission Tiller murdered tens of thousands of prenatal children. It is quite possible that Kate was an accomplice in thousands of them.
I once read a statistic that lesbian women in a certain demographic reported having sex with men at a greater frequency than the hetersexual women in the same demographic. That might sound weird, but I’ve also seen tons of my so-called gay friends have flings with the opposite sex. A lot of the so-called lesbians I know also get crushes on guys and try to date them, then, disillusioned again, turn back to their dysfunctional same-sex relationships. As I’ve said before, a lot of people “hide out” in same sex relationships but by my observation they aren’t any more functional or healthy that any opposite sex relationship I’ve observed. I have two friends right now, both “gay marriage” promoters who’ve had both male and female relationships in the last 5 years and if you ask them, they don’t self-identify as bi, but as lesbian.
Adding to instances of rape, like PP’s mentioned: I have heard of plenty of lesbians getting pregnant through IUI/IVF, so if she attends births, she may have encountered a few. Not to mention the pregnant “man”, since she said trans…
Ninek, I have heard that too. Girls who identify as lesbian have a higher rate of teen pregnancy than their straight counterparts, as well.
SM, from personal experience, I would wager that alcohol consumption plays a part in that! In college one of my lesbian friends dirty-danced a guy at our local pub and he had to walk away from her! He came up to me, “I’ve never had a girl do that to me in public! much less a lesbian!” Can you imagine her outrage the next morning if he’d taken advantage of her tipsy friskiness?!
Choosing to subjugate one’s will over another to the point of death….you mean like the pogroms? slavery?
The most sorrowful thing I have read in a long time: helping to kill children is a political act.
THAT, my friends and trolls (btw…miss you!), is the purest face of evil U have looked upon in a long time…..since the debates.
marxism. it’s about weakening our current society so that when we proletariat 99% finally rise up in revolution, the cultural hegemony will not be strong enough to fight back!
to weaken society, disintegrate these three: nuclear family, Christianity, and commerce.
not very original. but these kids, who all resemble each other, feel like they are oh so ‘different.’
really, very predictable.
Radical feminists have often been accused of spreading fear and hostility toward men. They have been a dismal failure at it. If you’re scared of something and hate, you usually want to STAY AWAY from whatever you’re afraid of. 3 million unplanned pregnancies per year means the rad-fems have failed at scaring girls and women away from boys and men.
2 words
Mentally ill
she uses the word radical but a more appropriate term is probably antisocial.
hippie says:
October 19, 2012 at 5:15 pm
she uses the word radical but a more appropriate term is probably antisocial.
(Denise) The group to which I refer is usually termed “women’s libbers” or “radical feminists” or “feminist extremists.” They are often seen as trying to terrify women of men and create women’s hostility against men. It seems to me they’ve failed completely. If they were successful, many more women would refuse relationships, especially INTIMATE relationships with men.
The rad-fems often have an extremely negative view of sex. If they were effective, we wouldn’t have many abortions because female celibacy would sweep the land.
This is somewhat OT, but why are people here arguing as if homosexuality was genetic? (Re-read what many have posted here) It has never been proven, much less does it make sense since genes require heterosexuality to pass on to another generation. Kate is a woman, and whether she likes it or not, whether her feelings/attractions are biased a certain way, her body is fully compatible with the opposite sex. She just sounds like an incredibly confused young woman in need of God.
Mark Rabich says:
October 19, 2012 at 5:45 pm
This is somewhat OT, but why are people here arguing as if homosexuality was genetic? (Re-read what many have posted here) It has never been proven, much less does it make sense since genes require heterosexuality to pass on to another generation. Kate is a woman, and whether she likes it or not, whether her feelings/attractions are biased a certain way, her body is fully compatible with the opposite sex. She just sounds like an incredibly confused young woman in need of God.
(Denise) I hope she steers clear of INTIMATE relationship with the other sex because of the likelihood such would lead to abortion.
That quote makes me very, very sad. Not sure what a Doula is, but anyway.
Ed,
A doula is a woman who assists a woman during childbirth. She’s not a midwife in that she doesn’t deliver the baby, but she is very knowledgeable about the birth process, how to help prepare for it, how to go through it, and what to do postpartum.
In Kate’s case, she assists women during abortions, too. That’s where the whole holding hands part comes in.
TY :-) I suppose if a woman is going to have an abortion, then it’s (possibly misguided) compassion to hold her hand through it, but to call an abortion an act of love??? Poor poor girl. I suspect self delusion shields her from the horrific reality of abortion.
This beast could have just as easily killed the mother’s too out of love if Tiller had asked her to. She is a freak who gets off associating herself with serial murder.
The rad-fems often have an extremely negative view of sex. If they were effective, we wouldn’t have many abortions because female celibacy would sweep the land.
Of course, it doesn’t work because it arises from abnormal psychology, and most people are normal psychologically. A crazy person can’t make sane people crazy by just telling them their crazy ideas.
The rad-fems often have an extremely negative view of sex. If they were effective, we wouldn’t have many abortions because female celibacy would sweep the land.
Of course, it doesn’t work because it arises from abnormal psychology, and most people are normal psychologically. A crazy person can’t make sane people crazy by just telling them their crazy ideas.
God help her.
If the time ever comes when science can prove that homosexuality is genetic, I wonder what the hard core gay activists will think about women who knowingly abort a child because they know it’s gay.
Will this beast and others like her suddenly change their minds and demand that the child deserves to be saved ?
For all the noise they make about discrimination against gays and their liberal views about “choice’, will this change how they think about aborting gay babies ?
Mike says:
October 20, 2012 at 11:13 am
If the time ever comes when science can prove that homosexuality is genetic, I wonder what the hard core gay activists will think about women who knowingly abort a child because they know it’s gay.Will this beast and others like her suddenly change their minds and demand that the child deserves to be saved ?For all the noise they make about discrimination against gays and their liberal views about “choice’, will this change how they think about aborting gay babies ?
(Denise) There’s already been a film made about this scenario called “Twilight for the Golds.” A husband tells his wife, “The test shows that he’s likely to be intelligent, left-handed and . . .” He adds that he will probably be “like your brother.” Should she abort or have the little gayby?
I won’t spoil it with the answer.
Now you can rent-a-doula to hold your hand for an abortion so you can feel better while you pay to have a speculum inserted, have your cervix forcibly dialated, your uterus is curetted to mutilate, dismember, torture and murder your unborn baby while he/she is trying to run away to save his/her life and then powerful suction is applied to vacuum out your uteurs. Oops, forgot one more thing the abortionist is supposed (doesn’t mean they always do) to piece the baby, etc together to make sure he/she got it all. Wow this is sick.
BTW, reseach by CDC or NIH (I believe) says that probably 80% of those who label themselves lesbians within a 2-3 year period have also been having sex with men and also neither homosexuals or lesbians mean the same thing when you say “long-term monogamous relationship”, those who will tell you the truth will laugh when you ask if they really want “MARRIAGE”. Go to massressistance.org see pictures of what really is promoted and celebrated at ”gay and dyke pride parades”. Real eye-opening stuff for those who think they just want what everyone else wants.
Chad take a deep breath and walk away from your computer. NO true prolifer believes in taking the “law into their own hands”. Mods take it down it may be a troll plant doing this to cause trouble. We don’t condone villence in the womb or out of the womb.
Chad, nice try. No one is buying it.
I don’t know JDC and ProlierL; Chad did qualify it to the ones who kill born alive infants. If you can’t kill them then who can you kill?
Sorry ProliferL; that was a typo on your name above.
That’s ok truthseeker. I couldn’t spell “violence” but typed “viilnence”.
truthseeker, I may be wrong but Chad’s comments seemed like a set-up to me wanting someone to take the bait trying to get a prolifer to say we need to “take out” abortionists. Yes, they are a detestable breed I admit but they are so low life they are NOT worth going to prison for. All the abortionist I knew about when I worked in healthcare were bottom of the barrel butchers that could not build a decent practice on their own so they went after the money and went into the “baby butcher” business. It is a gory, “blood money” business. They were the kind of guys that creeped you out when you had to work with them and when you found out they were abortionist it made sense. We have so much to pray and work for this election, ts. Mitt Romney is not perfect and not my first choice but what we have in the Oval Office right now is someone in bed with PP, NARAL and Emily’s List, So I pray we can get the most pro-abort president to ever occupy the WH out of office in a couple of weeks. Please pray prolifers because they are going to throw everything including the kitchen sink at Romney, Ryan and the RNC. It is going to get even nastier. Pray for the protection of the candidates and their families also. If you are in love with killing unborn babies, I think there is probably nothing you wouldn’t do. Pray that no one on our side will do anything out of order either because it will be used as a weapon against us I guarantee you.
I agree with you completely ProliferL. His comments did strike me as possibly being a ‘setup’ . Especially as a first time commenter. OOOPS! I guess I took the bait. I’ll try not to get strung along by him if he trolls :)
Would it be possible to decrease abortion by encouraging young ladies to form relationships with each other instead of males?
Could same-sex relationships be a kind of safeguard against problem pregnancies?
The term “lesbianism” is actually somewhat hard to define. The extent to which such female-female relationships are erotic or physical might be less important than that they take precedence over the male-female relations that lead to pregnancy.
Of course, abstinence is always preferable. Platonic friendship aren’t usually marred by jealousy as romantic or erotic relationships are. More emphasis on intellectual friendship is urgently needed to combat the many problems caused by sexuality.
October 21, 2012 at 7:14 am
“Would it be possible to decrease abortion by encouraging young ladies to form relationships with each other instead of males? Could same-sex relationships be a kind of safeguard against problem pregnancies?”
No, because same sex attraction is an abnormal kind of psychology. It is very hard as well as egregiously immoral to try to induce abnormal psychology.
Check out this Huffington Post article on lesbian love. Pure comedy gold.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/glenda-corwin/scheduling-sex-benefits_b_1662045.html
“When I first heard about “lesbian bed death” I was puzzled. What’s the point in coming out if you’re not going to have sex? Because let’s face it — being lesbian isn’t just about having wonderful emotional connections with other women. It’s about having sex with them. That’s what gets us in trouble with the rest of the world. So how could we walk away from something we fought so hard to have?
At first I was overwhelmed, and a little depressed, about how many of my lesbian clients and friends were rarely — if ever — having sex with their partners. But when I started doing research on this subject, I found reason to hope. There’s some evidence that a minority (maybe 20 percent) of long-term lesbian partners sustain sexual intimacy after 10 or 20 or more years together. Through surveys and interviews, I’m finding the secret of their success.”
Got that? less than %1 of women are lesbian. And only 20% are sexually active. If you guessed abnormal psychology, you got it right. But you are right that it is a libido killer.
We don’t have to use the word “lesbian.” We could just encourage females, particularly teen girls and young adult women, to devalue relationships with males in favor of relationships with females.
I recall reading a “Dear Abby” letter from a teenaged girl who signed herself “Nice Girl.” She liked being with boys and dating them. However, she intended to remain a virgin until she married. She did not have any sort of sexual activity with boys. She wrote, “I end up going to movies with my girlfriends.” The problem was that she regarded this negatively. Her chastity meant she found herself in female company when she wanted male company. Perhaps it wouldn’t have been difficult to be “Nice” if she thought being with “girlfriends” was BETTER than dating boys.
We’ve got to find a way to encourage teen girls and young women to regard themselves as living enjoyable lives even if they have no romantic or sexual relationship with a male if we want to decrease the destructive sexual activity rampant in our society.
In Victorian England, private consensual male homosexual relations were a criminal offense. There was no law against lesbianism. The reasons for this are disputed. One story is that Queen Victoria said, “Lesbianism doesn’t exist. Women aren’t capable of such things. I will not sign anything that impugns the honorable tradition of women’s love.”
Even if the story is apocryphal, it points out a truth: the tradition of strong, intense female-female relationships (whether sexual or not) have served as a safeguard against the illicit female-male relationships.
We could just encourage females, particularly teen girls and young adult women, to devalue relationships with males in favor of relationships with females.
Uh, huh… um,… well,… all I have to say is that people aren’t going to be signing up for this brainwashing anytime soon because it screams crazy idea to anyone sane! Like I said, you can’t sell crazy ideas to normal people. You can sell them stuff they already want. Selling them stuff they hate, um, no. You would have more luck selling fundamentalist religion. At least it has a long long track record of fairly high rates of chastity. Take your pick. You have got Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Confucianism, Hinduism, Buddhism, heck even confirmed Atheism. Teens who are convinced atheists have the lowest teen pregnancy and abortion rates. All with a stronger performance than the crazy crap you are selling which additionally adds psychological damage to the equation.
”There was no law against lesbianism.”
right, because what would be the point? As modern research has discovered, only 1% of women are lesbians and only 20% of lesbians are sexually active. It seems it would be crime if one person were forcing the activity, but that is already a crime called assault.
“you can’t sell crazy ideas to normal people”
Yet abortion has been sold to the masses.
“Teens who are convinced atheists have the lowest teen pregnancy and abortion rates. All with a stronger performance than the crazy crap you are selling which additionally adds psychological damage to the equation.”
So, hippie, let me get this straight, you expect us to believe that you won’t support something which teaches something you appear to agree with, over one which is supposedly more successfully at a given outcome, even if it does not teach it?
I have good reason to dispute the veracity of your claims, even if you did not author them. They are fundamentally illogical.
As for “psychological damage”, I have yet to understand how delayed gratification and acceptance of the reality of the male/female complementary can ever be considered unhealthy. Again, this just sounds like the typical politically correct nonsense sold to an unthinking public to me.
I am not convinced that your argument is not more about yourself and your personal need to feel morally superior than others, having presented very little in the way of sensible reason.
Woe to them that call good, evil and evil, good.
The simple fact of the matter is that it is usually boys and men who push for the type of sex that impregnates. Thus, if you really want to decrease abortions, you must persuade females to be happier with either solitude or same-sex company than male company.
Mark,
I think you missed hippie’s point.
You may be right xalisae, I retract the post.