Stanek weekend question: How would Romney presidency change abortion landscape?
There are a few pro-lifers who think that because Mitt Romney is an untested convert to our side – making what I think are erroneous charges he is a wolf in sheep’s clothing – and because he holds a rape/incest exception, there’s no sense in voting for him. They say they will sit on their vote when it comes to the president.
Playing devil’s advocate, what if Romney were to moderate his position once elected president – not cave to the other side necessarily, but not do so much to advance the pro-life cause?
Romney has promised to reinstate the Mexico City policy (ban federal funding from going to overseas abortion groups), defund Planned Parenthood (if such a bill reaches his desk), and appoint strict constitutionalist judges.
That would be a lot, but what if Romney weren’t to do much more than fulfill those promises? What advances, if any, might pro-lifers nevertheless see with a simple change from the Obama presidency to the Romney presidency? What if it were Obama, for instance, who nominated our next 2-3 Supreme Court justices? Etc.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
Like it or not, they might not do much.
Roe v. Wade will be the law of the land until overturned by the Supreme Court. I believe this will happen within a few years.
They may not do much, but at least they won’t get in the way of what is being done otherwise. And taxpayer money won’t be used to prosecute (and lose the cases) prolifers and their activities. I think perfectionism is a sin, so I really think not voting just because there’s (or Romney’s) not a “perfect” candidate per se, could be a matter of sinful pride and thus give another vote for Obama.
Who is stupid enough to not vote? That makes no sense. I believe in voting but I am not yet 100% sure I will be voting for Mitt. People tell me that I’m “throwing my vote away’ or “in essence voting for Obama” but I don’t think our founding fathers ever intended us to do anything but vote our conscience. Yet I do fear a second term for Obama so I’ll probably cave and vote for Mittens. Meh. I don’t know. I just don’t know. I am conflicted.
Romney will not overturn Roe and will probably not nominate very conservative supreme court justices either. The killing will continue under a Romney presidency. And it will never end because we always settle. My greatest fear is that pro-lifers will go to sleep like they did under Bush. At least under Obama pro-lifers were rejuvenated. They were awake and fighting!
But we know what kind of SC Justices we’ll get with Obama, and thus Pro-lifers should seriously consider what kind of long-term consequences will come from another Obama presidency. That should be the reason we vote, and vote Mitt Romney.
Roe v. Wade won’t get overturned unless there is a cultural tide against it, and right now the liberal left is winning the argument against overturning it. Most people do not realize that overturning Roe v. Wade does not mean abortion will be illegal, it just means jurisdiction will go back to the states. And then abortion clinics can be better regulated. People should know that in some states abortion clinics are LESS regulated than animal/veterinarian clinics. That is a appalling. We need to chip away at the armor of lies of the pro-abortion arguments that feed into the general hesitancy/apathy of cultural change.
A sitting president has less power than we think he does.
Suppose that we elect a fiercely pro-life president — and we can dare to hope that Romney/Ryan will be the best ever.
We’d get executive promises right away — Mexico City Policy, nominations of pro-life judges, backing off of HHS participation in abortion (as much as the law allows). We’d get more cooperation of HHS with church-based charities and pro-life charities. Maybe even some assistance at crisis pregnancy centers.
That’s about all a president can do by his own pen. He might refuse to defend federal laws that prohibit Texas and Indiana from defunding Planned Parenthood.
A pro-life president would promise to sign any pro-life legislation that Congress sends him. (This would include defunding of Planned Parenthood at the federal level. Unlike Obama, who threatened to shut down all of government if the budget did give fullest funding to PP.)
The best thing that even a lukewarm pro-life president does is give encouragement to state and federal pro-life legislators. If we want real change, we need to fill Congress and statehouses with pro-life representatives.
Reagan/Bush/Bush would have done more for pro-life if we had given them some passionate legislators to lead.
Although I would like Mr. Romney to be prolife without exceptions and to publicly promote such a position, he appears to have adopted an incremental prolife platform that is practical and can be implemented. He has made promises that seem to be within the realm of being achievable. He has adopted a prolife mandate that is not offensive to most of the electorate (as the electorate currently stands on the issues). Moreover, with the American culture trending more prolife Mr. Romney will be empowered to do more to make America more prolife as the Culture supports him in his prolife initiatives.
A president cannot overturn Roe V Wade.
Romney has stated he will put a halt to Obamacare. Yes. Please.
Romney will do more than Obama. He will steer this country away from the cliff where Obama has led us. The most proabortion president who tries to save ZERO babies compared to the newly elected president who will try to save 99% of babies?
The choice is clear.
PS
Ryan is 100% prolife.
Well, Cecile Richards is definitely toast if he becomes president. We know that much.
Hopefully Planned Parenthood and Roe v. Wade are soon to go down with her.
“Playing devil’s advocate, what if Romney were to moderate his position once elected president – not cave to the other side necessarily, but not do so much to advance the pro-life cause?”
Another million or so babies are murdered…..just like the year before under Obama.
“Romney has promised to reinstate the Mexico City policy (ban federal funding from going to overseas abortion groups), defund Planned Parenthood (if such a bill reaches his desk), and appoint strict constitutionalist judges.”
Not much chance of that happening after this decision which sets legal precedence….
http://www.pewstates.org/projects/stateline/headlines/federal-court-blocks-indiana-effort-to-defund-planned-parenthood-85899425177
“That would be a lot, but what if Romney weren’t to do much more than fulfill those promises? What advances, if any, might pro-lifers nevertheless see with a simple change from the Obama presidency to the Romney presidency? What if it were Obama, for instance, who nominated our next 2-3 Supreme Court justices? Etc.”
You mean like George H. W. Bush and David Souter ? Or George W. Bush and Chief Justice John Roberts ?
Just so you will never forget….here is Mitt Romney’s true feelings on abortion….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNDsyKnQIes
Danny,
I have noticed that the video you linked to this time has conveniently left out how Mitt Romney actually governed in Massachussets.
If Mr. Romney’s does not bracket his stance on embryonic stem cell research as a separate life issue from abortion since embryonic stem cell research does not impact a women’s body in the way a pregnancy does then he will be a more prolife President than Barack Obama on the issue of abortion. However, if he does try to scuttle prolife legislation and efforts due to trying to walk this fine line he will be one a term President just like Mr. Obama is about to be. The American electorate is fed-up with the prochoice politician that bullies their positions onto the American public.
I feel like this question was only asked in order to trigger more Danny rants. I know that’s an insane suggestion, but it’s the perfect question to trigger him.
Yes, JDC,
“CC”, “Joan” and “Reality” have left us (at least for NOW) and sent “Danny” in as our “resident troll”.
“Yes, JDC,“CC”, “Joan” and “Reality” have left us (at least for NOW) and sent “Danny” in as our “resident troll”. “
Good point, Pamela. In fact, Jake actually paid us a visit last night, no doubt in a desperate bid to fill the trolling void.
“The American electorate is fed-up with the prochoice politician that bullies their positions onto the American public.”
Seriously ?? !! You do understand that the American Electorate has had the chance to vote on this issue via Presidential Elections since 1973. Next year will be the 40th anniversary of Roe v.Wade.
A Biblical Generation.
Of course, part of me is convinced “Reality” was only ever in this to win some sort of most ironically named commenter award.
“I feel like this question was only asked in order to trigger more Danny rants”
LOL !!! I don’t think ANYONE here on this site wants to do that ! But hey….you throw out something like this,.,.,with so much confirmed, historical info…on paper….recorded audio…recorded video….Massachusetts Law….that proves Romney is not only a liberal still..no matter what he says now…PLUS his LONG STANDING Pro Abortion stance going back to 1994…..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeQGObiGGqY
in 2002….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_w9pquznG4
Not to mention the Pro-Life Governor Romney allowed 100,000 babies give or take to be murdered. He did NOT defund Planned Parenthood in Massachusetts. But he DID ram down the throats of Massachusett citizens socialized medicine which made it even EASIER to get an abortion.
…..and yet I am a troll for pointing out this truth ?
LOL !!! Don’t cross my bridge without facts and evidence of your own that I am wrong. Or this troll will dine on your bones….LOL !!!!
Which Mitt are we getting ?…….
Is Mitt Romney shifting his abortion position again?
It’s fairly well-known that Romney proclaimed himself in favor of abortion rights when he ran for office in Massachusetts, then reversed himself before launching his presidential bid. But recently, the GOP nominee seems to be softening his opposition somewhat. Or is he?
Romney proclaimed himself a strong supporter of abortion rights both in 1994, when he ran unsuccessfully for Senate against incumbent Democrat Edward Kennedy, and in 2002, when he defeated Democrat Shannon O’Brien to become governor.
“I will preserve and protect a woman’s right to choose,” he said in a 2002 debate with O’Brien. “And I do take exception to Shannon characterizing my view as being any different than hers in this regard; The Boston Globe recently reported there’s not a paper’s width worth of difference between our two positions in this regard.”
But that changed halfway though Romney’s term as governor. He says his conversion came after he talked to a Harvard scientist about embryonic stem cells. Now, he says his position is to oppose almost all abortions.
“My own view is that I oppose abortion except for cases of rape, incest, and where the life of the mother is threatened,” he told conservative radio host Hugh Hewitt Aug. 24.
But that’s slightly different from what he told CBS that same week.
“My position has been clear throughout the campaign,” he said. “I’m in favor of abortion being legal in the case of rape and incest, and health and life of the mother.”
So in that interview, Romney added one more exception — for the woman’s health.
The Romney campaign won’t say the candidate misspoke, but a spokeswoman does say he doesn’t support an exception to protect the health of the pregnant woman. That’s because other abortion opponents, including GOP vice presidential candidate Paul Ryan, insist it creates too large a loophole, since health often encompasses mental health, too.
“The health exception is a loophole wide enough to drive a Mack truck through it,” said Ryan on the House floor during a debate in 2000 on a bill to ban the procedure some call “partial birth” abortion. “The health exception would render this ban virtually meaningless.”
Hey Ryan…..are you SURE which Mitt you are running with ?
He’s back. . . .
http://benhemoth.deviantart.com/art/Here-s-Johnny-50103097
LOL !!!
Love Jack. Great movie.
But in the words of the Joker (as portrayed by Heath Ledger) ……
“I’m not a monster….I’m just ahead of the curve.”
I know you all think I am some sort of monster (after all you call me a troll….right?) for pointing out the truth that Mitt is nothing more than a fraud….in a long line of Republican frauds since Nixon. And what makes me a worse monster in your eyes, is my pointing out that because you have NO reason to believe Romney because you all can read and watch his lies and flip flops and look over his socialized healthcare plan in MA….all you can do to justify such an nauseous, hold your nose vote for Romney is simply …..HE’S BETTER THAN OBAMA.
But you will come around to my side by the end of his 4 years……
….and that does not make you a monster any more than me…..I was just ahead of the curve.
Pamela says:
October 27, 2012 at 1:05 pm
Yes, JDC,
“CC”, “Joan” and “Reality” have left us (at least for NOW) and sent “Danny” in as our “resident troll”.
Could it be something akin to birds flying away when they sense an earthquake coming? Maybe they sense a political earthquake this November.
Ooooof……this doesn’t look good Romney fans…..this is from a CNS interview not long ago.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJU7XDcquUk
So we have FOUR exceptions for abortion according to the soon to be President Mitt Romney….
Rape
Incest
Health of mother
Life of mother
Hey Paul Ryan….what do YOU think of the health exception that your running mate “Tricky Mitt” just declared on CBS?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsQXibYtuFM
Oooof….hhmmm……well….I guess that made for some INTERESTING conversation with the Romney team and consultants after Romney just went and made not one but TWO exceptions that Ryan and all you will watch Mitt drive a MACK TRUCK through.
Oh…and how about what Mitt said about abortion is a matter of the courts…..as if to say just what he did in Massachusetts that he is going to do NOTHING during his presidency concerning abortion or overturning Roe v Wade ?
BBRUMMM…..BRUM….BRUMMMM…. Look out folks…here comes Mitt in his Mack truck.
LOL !!!!
Anything to get rid of Planned Parenthood. Not perfection. But it is a helluva start.
Danny, don’t go away mad. Just go away.
The question is whether Romney would veto pro-life legislation brought to him by a Republican congress. I think he would sign it. Anyone care to bet on what Obama would do?
Second, the all important matter of judicial appointments and appointments to various administration posts, not only to SCOTUS but for all openings that POTUS appoints. A HUGE deal!
“Could it be something akin to birds flying away when they sense an earthquake coming? Maybe they sense a political earthquake this November.”
Well Reality has been gone for a looong time but the others seemed to disappear around the time of Obama’s downturn in the polls, and I doubt that’s a coincidence.
Danny, what is your solution?
“So we have FOUR exceptions for abortion according to the soon to be President Mitt Romney….
Rape
Incest
Health of mother
Life of mother”
While not perfect, if we could get that, it would save about a million lives a year, which is a whole lot more than most pro life legislation.
“Could it be something akin to birds flying away when they sense an earthquake coming? Maybe they sense a political earthquake this November.”
That, or the fact that the level of discussion here has deteriorated to a point where it’s rarely worth participating.
” “CC”, “Joan” and “Reality” have left us (at least for NOW) and sent “Danny” in as our “resident troll”. ”
I miss Reality, I liked him. I also liked Doug, he hasn’t been around for ages either. I don’t want Danny as a replacement lol
“So we have FOUR exceptions for abortion according to the soon to be President Mitt Romney….
Rape
Incest
Health of mother
Life of mother”
Most people in the country also has those exceptions, right or wrong. I honestly think a president would be unelectable without them. As hippie said, even with those exceptions those views would save a million babies a year.
joan,
“Could it be something akin to birds flying away when they sense an earthquake coming? Maybe they sense a political earthquake this November.”
That, or the fact that the level of discussion here has deteriorated to a point where it’s rarely worth participating.
Ah, but like the birds returning to Capistrano, here you are!
1) “Health of the mother” (expandable language, used by liberal lawyers) is practicallt the way Doe v Bolton got through the expansion of abortion through all 9 months. This is now supposed to be a closet conservative position?
2) My ballot (absentee, already sent) had FOUR Candidates for President, and a WRITE-IN option. There is a true, faithful-to-the-platform ticket that will seek to end abortion. They do not just give lip service to this in order to deceive, I mean gain, a constituency to vote for them. And that is the Constitution Party’s Virgil Goode / Jim Clymer ticket.
3) If we elected Constitutionalists for CONGRESS, the President’s position would be virtually irrelevant. By allowing bellicose media to keep our attention on the Presidential race as primary, we are losing the overall game. (Republican Presidents appointed judges who voted for pro abort precedents, so this whole part of the argument is mystifying as well. Roberts, for example, voted to keep ObamaCare rolling, the most egregious pro abort act to ever come down the pike.)
4) Mitt Romney PASSED the precedent for ObamaCare at the state level in his state. This is more dangerous than even the current President, what with the opposition he currently faces in implementing this statist monstrosity that will not only end up with requiring us to pay for abortions, but eventually seek to force abortions … and euthanasia. Take 4 minutes and listen to this exvellent analysis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=4R4KtYVF-74
As things stand, you better vote for STATE-LEVEL Representatives and Senators who will use legal NULLIFICATION against unConstitutional federal acts. It is and will be needed, and is our legal, nonviolent recourse to what is coming down the pike. More surely, if we are deceived by swallowing this “two party” slate served to us.
Romney has stated that he will overturn ObamaCare. Here’s why: ObamaCare has been partly dismantled, and opposition (inlcuding some overtures to Nullification) is brewing in numerous states. What Romney does not state so loudly is that he is FOR the same thing as ObamaCare, but at a state level, state by state (and perhaps funded by the federal government as a carrot and stick, and, as always, a way to get their will imposed through the state governments).
Remember, please, that RomneyCare is already a reality in Mass. state. And he has stated he is still in favor of this. If such government health care is instated, personal prolife positions and other legislation is overridden. Remember this. Let it sink in. See.
Oh, Puh-leeze! Isn’t it possible that a Republican president could get “health of the mother” codified into what normal people think it means? Ie, not whatever the profit-motivated abortionist says, but, if the woman doesn’t have an abortion RIGHT NOW, she will DIE? People support this exception because they think it means the mother will DIE if she doesn’t have an abortion. Not because she will be under stress due to her pregnancy.
I agree that Pro-lifers can not be complacent with a Romney-Ryan administration, but I cannot condone perfectionist IDIOTS that allow Obama to be re-elected by NOT voting for Romney. For the love of 3,000 babies a day, vote for Romney and then keep lobbying for pro-life policies to a FRIENDLY administration!!!
I am siding with Danny. You all make me sick. Really. You can’t stand anyone to point out that Romney is a neo-con which is EXACTLY what we’ve had for a long time. How many babies are dead now, huh? Oh but yeah, he is “better than Obama”. Carla had her abortion under a “pro-life” president. How did a “pro-life” president stop Carla from having an abortion? Abortion continues because we don’t get serious.
I realize Romney is “better than Obama” but OPEN YOUR EYES. Seriously. Mitt implemented obamacare (different name but same thing) in his state! But oh, see no evil, hear no evil right? You don’t want to know facts cause you all have your own brand of GOP “hope and change”.
I KNOW presidents don’t overturn supreme court rulings but they nominate the justices who do. And you know full well what I meant, Carla.
I get the compelling argument that we won’t survive 4 more years of Obama. And I agree with you all. That is why I am so conflicted about how to vote. But the fact that you all just close your eyes to FACTS about Mitt Romney and how he might not be the knight in shining pro-life armor you all make him out to be just infuriates me. And when anyone tries to point out FACTS to you you post things like “Don’t go away mad. Just go away.” OH HA HA HA HA. Like, how funny! Good grief. Open your eyes people and know WHO you’re really voting for. If you have to vote for Mitt because we won’t survive any more Obama, fine. But stop fooling yourself that this is some pro-life victory and things will be hunky dory under Mitt. The Fed will continue, the NDAA will stand and abortion will continue.
And sorry, it won’t let me edit that. I just re-read and it sounds way angrier than I really am. Sorry! Not really ANGRY just completely flabbergasted.
No, I get what you’re saying Sydney. I actually agree with the non-insane things that Danny says. And I can’t stand Romney/Ryan almost as much as I can’t stand Obama. But come on, what are the choices here? Really, I don’t get what you or him expect? I think people tend to talk up Mitt because they are afraid that if they don’t, Obama will end up elected again. Romney is literally the only choice to get Obama out, as little as I want to vote for him I really don’t see another choice.
Uh, guys it seems that Romney simply misspoke on the matter of the health exception: http://www.lifenews.com/2012/08/31/romney-opposes-pro-abortion-health-of-the-mother-exception/
For the record, I’m under no delusions that Romney is some sort of savior but yes, better than Obama is a valid reason to vote for him.
And honestly, WHAT ARE OUR CHOICES?! I didn’t like Romney when he became the stand-out. I didn’t believe his “conversion” when I first heard about it-ESPECIALLY after RomneyCare. But what alternative is there? A guy who voted 4 TIMES for INFANTICIDE?! A guy who justified those votes by calling the children “a fetus outside the womb”? Believing Mittens and his “conversion” after considering a bill about embryonic stem cell research is a whole heckuva lot more appealing to me than thinking that he doesn’t deserve my vote and that Mr. Obama-Infanticide might be re-elected because he has legions of people who think they’re voting for the next American Idol behind him with as little thought as possible put into their vote.
I don’t know what I expect either Jack. I mean, I AGREE with WHY pro-lifers are voting for Mitt. It isn’t that I don’t want people to vote Mitt and that I want Obama re-elected. I guess I just want people to keep their eyes open. Pro-life conservatives seemed to go to sleep under Bush and look at all the bad things that happened. I don’t want that to happen again under Romney. I fear that we think we have a “conservative” in the WH and we go to sleep and become complacent. I just want us to all go into a Romney presidency with our eyes wide open. I want us to really put the pressure on Romney so that he knows he can’t wiggle an INCH without us being all over it. And I feel like when people refuse to hear any of the not so good facts about Romney that they will go to sleep or blindly support him no matter what when he is president.
People were posting things on facebook like “Thank you President Bush” and not being sarcastic about it! At the end of his second term there were all these memes floating around praising Bush. For what? Needless wars and bloodshed? For the Patriot act? for more debt? What exactly were we to praise him for?
At least under Obama we’re wide awake, on our toes and ready to pounce!
I do get the worry about complacency for sure Sydney. And I agree about Bush and how pro-lifers acted while he was in office. All we can hope for is that the last four years have scared pro-lifers enough to keep working as hard as we have been.
I think we’re going into this with our eyes wide open. Like it or not, the life issue will go nowhere as long as the economy is the number one issue. With Obama it’s going to be “second verse, same as the first.”
Sydney M:
We really have grown lazy in our society…to the point where many people do not want to take the time to do the hard work of democracy; i.e. going to meetings, participating in political forums, writing letters, making phone calls, etc. Instead we want to elect one guy and PRESTO! he is to be everything each one of us wants and we can go on with our lives. Well, if the last four years have taught us anything it should be the inherent danger of elevating the presidency to the level of expecting a messiah.
I think the point here is that between Obama and Romney which of the two will ultimately do more for the pro-life movement. Everyone knows Romney will do better. Surely no one really expects Romney to use the bully pulpit every day to hammer down on pro-aborts. About all we should realistically expect is for Romeny as POTUS to support legislative efforts of his party. If we do the hard work in the trenches with our local reps and our senators to get them to pass pro-life legislation and vote only for pro-life appointees this is where the rubber meets the road and we should expect Romney to honor their wishes. We will see what happens.
hippie said….
“So we have FOUR exceptions for abortion according to the soon to be President Mitt Romney….
Rape
Incest
Health of mother
Life of mother”
While not perfect, if we could get that, it would save about a million lives a year, which is a whole lot more than most pro life legislation.
Really hippie you need to get off the dope. You do know that a million babies are murdered in this country a year…..year after year. And they are murdered because of …..
Rape
Incest
Health of Mother
Life of Mother
Are you guys that stupid? I’m seriously disturbed and angry now. Those four exceptions let slide a VAST NUMBER of abortions. So many that Mitt Romney’s VERY OWN VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE Paul Ryan said would make worthless a law he was trying to pass to stop Partial Birth Abortion….in his OWN WORDS…..a loophole big enough to drive a MAck Truck through.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsQXibYtuFM
Watch the video of Ryan if you do not believe me. Yet Mittens wants to make a Mack Truck size exception for Health of Mother (which a doctor or abortionist can claim for ANY reason)…plus Mittens double down and says Life of mother as well….which can mean anything.
So what kind of New Math could any of you employ to say that those four exceptions would save EVERY SINGLE BABY ABORTED EACH YEAR….and bring the number to ZERO….when those exceptions let 100,000’s be murdered each and every year?
Danny,
I’m seriously disturbed and angry now.
NOW??
If Romney doesn’t win the election, it will take another 40 years to have another chance to overturn Roe v. Wade. If Romney doesn’t win the election, Catholic charities will be CRIMINALIZED by the HHS mandate. If Romney doesn’t win it will be four more years of the most actively pro-abortion president ever. THIS IS NOT A JOKE, DANNY. You once compared yourself to Jeremiah. Somehow I can’t see Jeremiah acting as a demented clown, jumping up and down and laughing as he figuratively throws his own feces at us.
xalisae said…
“And honestly, WHAT ARE OUR CHOICES?! I didn’t like Romney when he became the stand-out. I didn’t believe his “conversion” when I first heard about it-ESPECIALLY after RomneyCare. But what alternative is there? A guy who voted 4 TIMES for INFANTICIDE?!”
Are you truly that ignorant or that desperate or both? Mitt Romney vote 4 TIMES AS WELL FOR INFANTICIDE AS GOVERNOR OF MASSACHUSETTS !!! Each and every year for 4 years he upheld his campaign promise to not stand in the way of a woman’s right to kill her baby….to commit infanticide.
Here was his promise on video that he kept. …..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_w9pquznG4
For the love of God…watch and LISTEN….he said that he would do NOTHING to make it harder for a woman to have an abortion….he would NOT change the Pro Choice laws of Massachusetts in ANY WAY….he referenced his mother who ran for Senate on a Pro Abortion platform.
And he did just that and allowed in his 4 years 100,000 plus babies to be butchered.
Mitt Romney is a sick, twisted, pathological lier. You should NEVER under any circumstance as a clear thinking, moral person….and particularly if you are a Christian….support a mentally ill person such as Mitt Romney even if it is against Barack Obama. Mitt Romney stood aside for 4 years and let babies get butchered. He is an accessory to murder. In the eyes of the law there is no difference if he did the deed or stood by and let it happen particularly if he had foreknowledge that the murder was going to take place. He said time and again…he was not going to stand in the way of infanticide. That makes him a cold blooded murderer.
And now he is lying again….because he is mentally disturbed. You have to be to be a baby killer…..you have to be in order to be a Mormon. You have to be to even think that with DECADES OF RECORDED history you can lie to the American people with no fear of repercussions from your Republican base. Yet he KNOWS he owns you with his lies.
You are as pathetic as he is. You vote for Romney you will have the blood of babies on your hands.
Hans….as someone who was chosen to be a contributor on this site….stop attacking me and attack my facts.
Do the math. A million babies are aborted in this country a year. You have two VERY IGNORANT people who posted that if Mitt Romney allows those 4 exceptions that were noted above that a MILLION babies would be saved.
The Math is IMPOSSIBLE and it makes everyone including ME who are Pro Life look stupid and diminishes our stand against infanticide. I HATE STUPID PEOPLE. I HATE FEARFUL PEOPLE. I HATE IRRATIONAL PEOPLE. I HATE PEOPLE WHO COP OUT TO A TYRANNICAL SYSTEM THEY KNOW IS BROKEN.
I will not let these statements slide. But you should not either. Jill chose you to contribute to this site. You should be honored…. now live up to it and attack the silly things these people say and not me who…even if I do impolitely for obvious reasons… back up everything I say with FACTS and EVIDENCE that is UNASSAILABLE.
If Romney doesn’t win the election, it will take another 40 years to have another chance to overturn Roe v. Wade. If Romney doesn’t win the election, Catholic charities will be CRIMINALIZED by the HHS mandate. If Romney doesn’t win it will be four more years of the most actively pro-abortion president ever. THIS IS NOT A JOKE, DANNY. You once compared yourself to Jeremiah. Somehow I can’t see Jeremiah acting as a demented clown, jumping up and down and laughing as he figuratively throws his own feces at us.
Horse crap John. Roe v Wade will NEVER be overturned. Mitt Romney will be the most INACTIVE Pro-Life President ever. (Remember the pathetically Pro-Life Reagan who in the 80-‘s used to phone in his statement to pro-life marcher’s who would then broadcast them to the crowd over a microphone…..
Here you go……from the past……Reagan sounds JUST LIKE ROMNEY……
Reagan was not as obsessive about anti-abortion legislation as he often seemed. Early in his California governorship he had signed a permissive abortion bill that has resulted in more than a million abortions. Afterward, he inaccurately blamed this outcome on doctors, saying that they had deliberately misinterpreted the law. When Reagan ran for president, he won backing from pro-life forces by advocating a constitutional amendment that would have prohibited all abortions except when necessary to save the life of the mother. Reagan’s stand was partly a product of political calculation, as was his tactic after he was elected of addressing the annual pro-life rally held in Washington by telephone so that he would not be seen with the leaders of the movement on the evening news
Meet the new Pro-Life Boss…..same as the Old Pro-Life Boss.
You’re getting owned by that horrid, pathological liar. You and your kind Jack are making Conservatives and Pro-Lifers look like the complete idiots I guess you are.
Eh are you speaking to me? You didn’t quote my comment.
Look Danny, this is a lost battle but I guess I’ll try. Somewhere around 5% of abortions are due to “exception” reasons. There are about 1.3 million abortions a year. 5% of 1.3 million is like 65,000 I believe. Much better than three million. If all abortions were banned except for “exceptions” (which I honestly think is a nearer goal than a total ban), then over a million babies a year would be saved. Of course, I am under no illusion that a magical ban will come around by putting Romney in office, but no matter how much you cry and scream about it, his administration will be slightly better for getting pro-life goals met than Obama.
It’s basic stuff here, Danny, that you aren’t understanding. I don’t think you should be calling people stupid. Glass houses, stones and all.
And I am not a Christian but I am almost positive that y’all aren’t supposed to hate people, didn’t Jesus say that was akin to murder? That you murder the person you hate in your heart? That makes you as bad as Romney, I suppose, if you hate most of the people on this blog.
Oh yes this is the verse I was thinking about. Not ambiguous at all.
1 John 3:15 Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life in him.
Oooooppppsss sorry Danny.
“Criticize ideas, not people.”
Just putting this out there, Danny.
I CAN post annoyingly CAPITALIZED AND BOLDED posts with relevant BIBLE verses TOO.
John 13:34-35 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another. By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.
1 Corinthian 13:4-7Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
Leviticus 19:17You shall not hate your brother in your heart, but you shall reason frankly with your neighbor, lest you incur sin because of him.
1 John 4:20 If anyone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen.
I think Danny might need to do some praying :P
I think it’s called shotgun argumentation. If you make lots of arguments (no matter how fallacious), the other person hasn’t got a hope of responding to all of them. Every good conspiracy theorist knows how to do it.
Yeah, or the Gish Gallop, I think is another word for it. You win if they can’t answer all your ridiculous claims!
JDC, I posed the questiion knowing Danny types would answer but hoping to be helped to make the point that even if Romney does not turn out to be a pro-life champion, he will be leagues better than Obama. He will be as sunlight is to darkness. Obama is a pro-abortion activist, with a goal of not expanding abortion in the U.S. but worldwide. He also ignores scienece to promote human embryo destruction on our tax dime.
BTW, I too, wonder what happened to Joan and CC. I thought all along they were paid to incite trouble here and promote abortion. Perhaps they’ve been instructed to give all their attention to promoting Obama on websites more likely to be visited by his base.
I think it is most likely that Joan and CC are busy stumping for Mr. Obama.
Roe v Wade will NEVER be overturned.
DANNY, DID GOD DIRECTLY TELL YOU THIS? IF NOT, HOW DO YOU KNOW THIS? COULD IT BE THE SAME WAY YOU KNOW HOW I DEEP DOWN FEEL ABOUT ISSUES?
Mitt Romney will be the most INACTIVE Pro-Life President ever.
DANNY, DID GOD TELL YOU THIS, TOO? IF NOT, HOW DO YOU KNOW THIS? COULD IT BE THE SAME WAY YOU KNOW HOW I DEEP DOWN FEEL ABOUT ISSUES? BTW, I’LL TAKE AN INACTIVE PRO-LIFE PRESIDENT OVER A VERY PSYCHOTIC, CHILD AND WOMAN HATING, NARCISSISTIC, OVER-THE-TOP-ACTIVE PRO-ABORT PRESIDENT ANY DAY.
GOD HAS NOT SPOKEN TO ME, BUT OBAMA’S NEXT MOVE WILL TO GIVE OUT A FREE SMART PHONES AND HAPPY MEALS WITH EVERY ABORTION BECAUSE THE NUMBER OF ABORTIONS HAVE DROPPED THIS MONTH. DO NOT ARGUE WITH ME BECAUSE I AM SERIOUSLY DISTURBED AND ANGRY NOW. DON’T MAKE ME ANGRY. YOU WOULDN’T LIKE ME WHEN I’M ANGRY. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bnh2AplyKi4&feature=fvwp&NR=1
OH, HAVE YOU HEARD WHO ROMNEY HAS CHOSEN FOR HIS VP? I BELIEVE HE IS 100% PRO-LIFE.
Navi said…
I think it’s called shotgun argumentation. If you make lots of arguments (no matter how fallacious), the other person hasn’t got a hope of responding to all of them. Every good conspiracy theorist knows how to do it.
NOW…someone shows up with some intelligence ……I hope.
So tell me Navi….armed with what SOUNDS like at least some background in logic….what argument have I made that is FALLACIOUS ?
My overall general thesis is that Mitt Romney is going to (on the things that really matter) DO the things you do NOT want him to do or that you elected him for….will DO NOT do the things you want him to do….and the rest of the things he will be WOEFULLY INADEQUATE.
I have, with post after post, backed up EVERYTHING…..E V E R Y T H I N G with….
Evidence….both written and recorded
Facts….both written and recorded
Legal…both written and recorded
Historical…both written and recorded
Constitutional
Biblical
And not one single person here has been able to refute my facts and evidence….while many have AGREED with some…most….or all.
And yet they get their feelings hurt when I rail against them…when even in the face of ALL this incontovertible proof that Mitt Romney is a mentally disturbed, pathologically lying, incompetent, fraud who is also a member of a secretive cult….
these foolish peoople are going to vote him into the most powerful office….IN THE ENTIRE…WORLD…..simply because they erroneously thing with faulty logic and outright self delusion that he is somehow going to be BETTER than Barack Obama.
So I dare you…..Mr. Shotgun Argument….refute my facts…..refute the truth.
Tell us all what I have said that is FALLACIOUS…which for those of you who do not know the meaning of the word….Mr Shotgun Argumentation just stated that I make logically unsound, deceptive and misleading arguments or testimony.
I want it point by point….navi….and back it up with your own evidence.
Otherwise….just go back to name calling like the rest of these folks.
Mea Culpa to my statements of “Hate”. My passion that was stirred by some of the most outright stupid and illogical statements on this site got the better of me.
I HATE what stupid people do. I HATE what irrational people do. On both the Left and the Right. It is hard to separate the sinner from the sin…..even when that is me.
Mea Culpa.
OH, HAVE YOU HEARD WHO ROMNEY HAS CHOSEN FOR HIS VP? I BELIEVE HE IS 100% PRO-LIFE.
praxedes…..that was cute….capitalizing and making bold all of those words. Still covering up for the fact you have no evidence to support that Mitt Romney is NOT a liar, a fraud, is NOT pro-abortion…..regardless of his choice of running mate.
In fact…you just got fooled by one of the oldest political tricks in the book. Choose a running mate to give to the base the “red meat” they slobber for so as to keep them off of the President’s back.
Good cop….bad cop. LOL !!! And you all have fallen for it yet AGAIN !!!
So tell me praxedes….what Vice President…since Roe v Wade….has ever made a dent in that issue ?
Yeah….that’s what I thought.
Jill said…..
Obama is a pro-abortion activist, with a goal of not expanding abortion in the U.S. but worldwide.
And Mitt Romney is a Pro-Choice INACTIVIST…..meaning….he will honor his Pro Choice mother and his own political legacy as a Senatorial Candidate and as Governor of Massachusetts by not tarnishing his deeply held Pro Choice belief through any kind of action to restrict a woman’s right to choose to kill her unborn child.
Just because his WORDS make it possible to “CHECK MARK” some voter guide passed around in your church…as they are in millions of churches…so as to make it easier to steer your vote to the guy with the most “CHECK MARKS” concerning your personal political views….does not mean nor confirm that he is what you are told he is.
You have to LISTEN to the man….not once…not twice…but for 20 years PROUDLY….PROUDLY MIND YOU...tout his pro-choice stance. You have to just read his socialized healthcare plan in MA and LISTEN AGAIN to his own words how he WISHES his plan would become the model for the WHOLE NATION. And guess who took him up on it…..Barack Obama.
You all know this deep down if not outright….you are simply voting for a white Obama. And one that is a better liar than him…..as if I would live to see that day….and yet that day has arrived.
And it is shamefully sad to see good people hoodwinked yet again…simply because out beside Romney’s name on the ballot is the letter…. R
I knew…but never to this extent….how powerful one letter of the alphabet could be. I knew whole WORDS could be powerful…..but one letter ?? !!
Yet one letter is more powerful than 2 decades of political, historical, oral, written and video recorded documentation that Mitt Romney is a pathological liar and a fraud….particularly concerning the abortion issue.
And yet they get their feelings hurt when I rail against them
Proof, please. I don’t see where you have hurt anyone’s feelings here but I can’t speak for others. Please take note, you don’t hurt my feelings. I feel sorry for and am worried about you. I sincerely think you might benefit from counseling and medication. Make sure you have a healthy diet, get enough exercise and sleep, and stay away from illegal drugs and alcohol. All this anger and hate you hold certainly is not good for you to say nothing of your family.
praxedes…..that was cute….capitalizing and making bold all of those words.
Thank you for your compliment but I don’t think it was cute at all. I was attempting to look angry and all-knowing. How did I do? Actually, I think over-capitalizing and over-bolding looks just as stupid and arrogant when I do it as when you do.
Good cop….bad cop. LOL !!! And you all have fallen for it yet AGAIN !!!
Didn’t I mention? Romney will die in office. I know this the same way you know everything about the future!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!! And you have ignored my immense knowledge yet AGAIN!!!
I will never answer a question of yours until you answer all of mine. Why all the avoidance, young grasshopper? That’s what I thought. People avoiding dealing with their own issues and insecurities and refusing to take a good long look in the mirror is older than good cop/bad cop.
Yeah. I briefly considered doing that, but I realized it’s not worth my time.
Proof…sure praxedes. Troll…angry, delusional..disturbed….I’m not responding to you anymore….you are besmirching a good man….etc…etc…
These are some of the very words spoken against me…..not my evidence. And that is evidence of hurt feelings. When you can’t attack the facts with your own and prove them false…but attack the messenger or just go away…..then yes…your feelings are hurt.
Just as it is proof when you tell me….
Make sure you have a healthy diet, get enough exercise and sleep, and stay away from illegal drugs and alcohol. All this anger and hate you hold certainly is not good for you to say nothing of your family.
Passion is not necessarily anger. Righteous indignation is also not necessarily unwarranted anger. My family is fine. I’ve already told you I do not drink, smoke and have never taken drugs….yet you are so full of empty arrogance for your stand towards Romney and you offer no evidence or proof that I have misspoken or lied about Romney that all you can do is snarkingly attack me by inferring I am unwell….when it is clear you like many others on this site are deluding yourself over Romney over the boogy man Obama. So WHO really needs the psychotropics my friend for after all…..doing something over and over again and expecting a different outcome is a definition of insanity.
Didn’t I mention? Romney will die in office. I know this the same way you know everything about the future!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!! And you have ignored my immense knowledge yet AGAIN!!!
Once again….empty snark from someone who is impotent when it comes to providing historical facts of their own. I know Roe v Wade will never be overturned because history proves time and again…along with Biblical history proves time and again….when a nation instills as religious and or civil law infanticide that country never repents nor survives. America is no different. I stated that case and have provided a modicum of evidence because the historical and biblical record is so immense that you can do that homework on your own….it is too much for this forum.
I will never answer a question of yours until you answer all of mine. Why all the avoidance, young grasshopper? That’s what I thought. People avoiding dealing with their own issues and insecurities and refusing to take a good long look in the mirror is older than good cop/bad cop.
I’m sorry…what are you talking about? You were the one that brought up the fact that Romney is an ok guy because he chose Ryan. Pray tell what am I avoiding. I fear no man, nor you…nor any fact or truth.
Be a man and not a snarky child and ask me anything you wish that you feel I have left unanswered….either any personal info about me…my political views…my religious views….etc.
Seriously…if God knows all my secrets….what could I possibly fear about you knowing anything or not. Ask away.
Yeah. I briefly considered doing that, but I realized it’s not worth my time.
Yeah…that’s what I thought. You take the time to attack me….but you don’t have the time to refute one point of mine…..not one. Takes maybe one or two sentences…..a couple dozen words?
Pathetic
Jill, thanks for responding to my point. Tyler, my guess is you’re right about the whereabouts of joan and CC.
Danny, if you think you know for sure that Roe will never, ever, ever be overturned you’re being ridiculously arrogant. In 1992, in the case of PP v. Casey, we were just one vote away from overturning it. In fact, it has been reported that Justice Anthony Kennedy, was very close to actually voting overturn. So it is absurd to suggest such an event will never happen again, but with a slightly different outcome.
doing something over and over again and expecting a different outcome is a definition of insanity
and yet here you are once again talking with all of us idiots expecting us to come to our senses. . . . . .
I’m not responding to you anymore….
That’s okay. You’re still not hurting my feelings.
Be a man and not a snarky child and ask me anything you wish that you feel I have left unanswered….
I guess I could legally do this but getting a sex-change goes against my beliefs. I answer snark with snark. Deal with it.
Ask away.
Why? You just told me in the same post that you are not responding to me anymore and I’ve already asked questions that you have avoided. Be a man of your word now, Danny.
I’m amazed that people still seem to be reading Danny’s rants. Why read someone screaming about all that is wrong in the world when the only solution they offer is repent (something I already do daily) and don’t vote (which is really bad advice).
“I’m amazed that people still seem to be reading Danny’s rants.”
At this point, I usually just skim them. :)
“I guess I could legally do this but getting a sex-change goes against my beliefs.”
:) This made my day.
I hear you, Lrng. Me thinks I still have some holes in my head.
Either that or I’m avoiding housework and exercise!
It’s not just that Romney is “better than Obama.” Romney is better than Obama in every single category of political policy and leadership.
– Economy,
– fiscal responsibility and deficit reduction
– bipartisan cooperation,
– foreign policy leadership,
– life issues,
– religious freedom,
– resume and track record of successful leadership,
– personal life and charity,
– etc.
Obama supporters seem to believe that
– “free” contraception is necessary for our country’s recovery
– taxpayer funding of Planned Parenthood is necessary for national success
– our economy is founded upon more borrowing and increasing debt.
Danny,
Like JDC, I can only bear skimming your comments. You would no doubt liken it to squinting at the Sun, what with your brilliant truth and logic.
“Pride goeth before the fall”, for both you and Obama. Which is why I’m much more comfortable with the slightly awkward Romney, someone I could sit down and have a root beer with.
Danny, please look up these three individuals on the internet: Linda Gibbons, Mary Wagner, and Graham Preston.
After you have done that, look in the mirror, and then ask yourself if you have done enough to stop abortion.
These people have sacrificed a lot for the preborn.
With that said, if your point is that politicians should be trying at all times to generate a mandate so that pro-abortion laws can be struck down, I agree with you. If you have another point please say it. Please don’t forget to be constructive when you criticize – even Denise tries to do that.
Please provide some ideas that Mitt or the next President could do in order to bring about a more prolife nation.
Praxedes said….
doing something over and over again and expecting a different outcome is a definition of insanity
and yet here you are once again talking with all of us idiots expecting us to come to our senses. . . . . .
LOL !! You think I am wasting my time with you and the other Romney-bots? I’m just laying down the ground work for when you guys are complaining you got hoodwinked by Romney so that you can remember that someone did warn you with evidence and facts.
I’m not responding to you anymore…. That’s okay. You’re still not hurting my feelings.
Ask away.
Why? You just told me in the same post that you are not responding to me anymore and I’ve already asked questions that you have avoided. Be a man of your word now, Danny.
Uhhhh….Praxedes….if you had better reading skills you would have realized that those words were not for you. You asked for evidence of my having hurt people’s feelings and I was quoting what people said towards ME….not me to YOU.
You honestly think …as you read this….I am not responding again to you? What do you think I have been doing for dozens of posts…..even right now? Trust me Bubba…there ain’t NOTHING you can say that can make me stop responding to you. On the contrary…the more crap that comes out of your mouth…the more I am compelled to respond to it. LOL !!! You’re the one that should quit because you embarrass yourself with the lack of hard evidence to prove I am misstating anything Mitt has said or lied about. You and the others here have put forth NO EVIDENCE whatsoever other than the lies out of his mouth concerning his GOOD character, because you can’t. However…I understand why….it’s hard to defend a pathological liar….when there is SO MUCH video tape of him lying for the last 20 years.
So…with that misunderstanding out of the way….I will offer to you the chance to ask me anything about anything…even if it is personal. There still is the question you posed that I somehow did not answer something you asked of me…and you made me out to be some kind of coward.
So man up and ask.
Be a man and not a snarky child and ask me anything you wish that you feel I have left unanswered…. I guess I could legally do this but getting a sex-change goes against my beliefs. I answer snark with snark. Deal with it.
Really praxedes….what does having a sex change have to do with anything I said above.
So…..you think you would have to have a sex change to go from being a child (no sex status mentioned….child is generic you know….) to a man?
Even when you do snark…praxedes….you screw it up.
JDC said…
“I guess I could legally do this but getting a sex-change goes against my beliefs.”
This made my day.
Uuhhhh JDC…read my above post….
…you should not be laughing when someone screwed up their snark by believing in something wrong. Sex change to go from being a child (neutral sex word) to a man?
HAHAHAHAHA….that was so funny I forgot to see if it made sense.
Sorry JDC you just made MY day. LOL !!!
“I’m amazed that people still seem to be reading Danny’s rants.”
At this point, I usually just skim them.
Yeah JDC…all those words with so many provable facts hurts doesn’t it?
Del said…..
It’s not just that Romney is “better than Obama.” Romney is better than Obama in every single category of political policy and leadership.
– Economy,
– fiscal responsibility and deficit reduction
– bipartisan cooperation,
– foreign policy leadership,
– life issues,
– religious freedom,
– resume and track record of successful leadership,
– personal life and charity,
Oh goody….now something we can discuss…..
Here are VERIFIABLE FACTS….PLEASE….by all means….DO NOT BELIEVE A WORD I AM ABOUT TO SAY…..LOOK IT UP YOURSELF…..
On the Economy….seeing as how we only have data for Massachusetts we have to start there…..
When Romney left MA ….MA was
47 out of 50 in job creation
Romney had increased taxes and fees by 750 million per year.
Increased MA long term debt
Outsourced MA jobs to China and other countries (which he was good at at BAIN)
Manufacturing jobs DECLINED in MA at TWICE the national rate.
Fiscal responsibility and deficit reduction….
See above about debt.
Bipartisan Cooperation
BIG TIME WIN here. That’s because he was a Pro Abortionist like his Democratic partners across the aisle AND with bipartisan help he passed OBAMACARE….oops….I mean ROMNEY CARE.
Foreign Policy Leadership
Really ? When did the Russians blockade Long Island MA ?
Life Issues.
ROTFLMBO !!! Really ? Mr. I WILL NOT ALTER A WOMAN’S RIGHT TO CHOOSE ? He allowed over 100,000 babies to be aborted in MA during his tenure.
Religious Freedom.
Huh ? I despise Obama…but I am still going to the same church during his 4 years in office….not one time has my priest been forced to NOT preach the Gospel. Not sure about the fear there.
Resume and track record of successful leadership.
You mean under Bain Capital….where Romney simply comes in guts companies in trouble and takes his cut. Or guts the company and puts it back on the market in a diminished state. Of when offshoring jobs. What has Romney ever CREATED as it concerns a product or service? His father made cars. What has Romney ACTUALLY created as a product?
Personal life and charity.
Here we go…..the ONE THING that Romney is better at than Obama.
Well….just as the old Meatloaf song goes…..
“So don’t be sad….
‘Cause 1 out of 8 ain’t bad”
LOL !!!!
Praxedes is a woman, she cannot be a “man” however you wanna define that, nor would she want to. She’s a pretty awesome woman!
Things are just flying over your head tonight, aren’t they Danny?
Danny, it’s a real problem when you wax all triumphalist when you can’t even account for the gender of folks around here.
Who’s going to trust your point of view on more significant matters?
Wow, I missed the brawl.
anyway, on the health of the mother loophole, I sit corrected, that is a loophole big enough to drive a semi through, but only as interpreted by nutty folks. As I have mentioned before, Germany has those loopholes applied to first trimester abortions but the system of requiring referrals and prolife counseling as well as actually prosecuting doctors that violate it works to reduce abortions a lot. In Germany restrictions on first trimester abortions are stricter than ours on late term abortions. Basically, if Americans were allowed to vote, it is about what they would vote for and would reduce abortions to levels similar to theirs, so, about 75% reduction and that is in the 1 million a year ball park.
rasqual said….
Danny, it’s a real problem when you wax all triumphalist when you can’t even account for the gender of folks around here.
LOL !!! Ok…..so praxedes is a woman. My bad.
So I guess by your icon up there rasqual your either a cop or a milkman. Hard to tell.
And would that be a female milkman (milkwoman…lady…whatever) or a police woman…..like you know…Angie Dickinson. Did I just date myself there? Old school reference…LOL !
Oh…..and it is hard NOT to be triumphant when nobody shows up with any facts or evidence of their own to refute my claims and charges….other than empty snark and HAR HAR praxedes is a woman.
But I am not being triumphant…..just confidently armed with the facts about Romney.
Religious Freedom.
Huh ? I despise Obama…but I am still going to the same church during his 4 years in office….not one time has my priest been forced to NOT preach the Gospel. Not sure about the fear there.
Do you think religious freedom is only for church? What good is preaching the Gospel if we’re not allowed to put that faith into practice in ALL areas of our life? Are you really unaware of the HHS mandate? There are about 37 lawsuits and the DOJ argues that once you become a business owner, you check your conscience rights and religious freedom at the door.
http://www.becketfund.org/hhsinformationcentral/
Having thus armed yourself, you imagine you’ll dissuade anyone here from voting for Romney? Folks who, I’d imagine, may be using a different calculus?
One of your issues — Danny — is that you imagine your facts imply parity between the candidates that others do not find implied by those and other facts.
There are other minds in the forum, who do not share your pessimism. You seem to imagine that somehow, you’ve forced them to gaze into your cynical abyss, and they can no longer honestly deny the horrors you describe there. But that’s not how minds work. Many minds here have already priced their own objections to Romney into their vote — and it weighs against Obama. They’ve inoculated themselves against your hypercynicism by long ago injecting a solid dose of their own — and then overcoming it to do what citizens do in an imperfect world.
Your continuing insistence that the candidates are exactly, precisely equally vile is pathological, Danny. First, it’s so unlikely as to be impossible. It’s like asserting that two fingerprints of the two people who happen to be standing next to each other in line at the bank, are identical. Second, it’s hubristic — no one else can know facts that you do not happen to know. You know all. Third, it’s irrelevant. Your remarks are of no consequence, and you’ll remain in a masturbatory world of self-congratulation on being so right in a world full of idiots. Your actions are not consequential here.
Just stop with the hubristic silliness. Your facts don’t matter as much as you suppose, because other people understand facts you haven’t considered — haven’t considered not because you’re abnormally stupid, but because like every other human on the planet your knowledge is not complete and, like every other human on the planet, you could learn from others too if you’d show some epistemic humility.
rasqual said…
Your continuing insistence that the candidates are exactly, precisely equally vile is pathological, Danny. First, it’s so unlikely as to be impossible. It’s like asserting that two fingerprints of the two people who happen to be standing next to each other in line at the bank, are identical. Second, it’s hubristic — no one else can know facts that you do not happen to know. You know all. Third, it’s irrelevant. Your remarks are of no consequence, and you’ll remain in a masturbatory world of self-congratulation on being so right in a world full of idiots. Your actions are not consequential here.
First of all…if you or anyone here is voting for either candidate because one or the other might be a nicer or better person personally deserves what they get. I do not care in the least whether or not the Cult man puts more of his millions to charity than the Great Pretender. That is completely irrelevant to what either the two men will do in office.
I am looking at it from overall effectiveness. And Mitt Romney’s short political history should give NO ONE any confidence whatsoever that he will manage the economy any better than Obama. There may be a sugar high from tax cuts and such….but that will not stop the impending doom that is coming from the combined load of the National Debt and interest on it….Social Security….Medicaid….Medicare….and Defense Spending. Romney has already stated that he is not touching SS for the vast majority of people and will get nowhere in the Senate for even being able to offer a private option for taxpayers of a certain age and younger. He has already stated that he will INCREASE Defense Spending….much less any mention of cutting VA benefits. Medicaid and Medicare are off the table. He is completely lying when he said that HE….HE will create 12 million new jobs…..(maybe so….but just how many more burger flippers and Wal Mart greeters do we need).
So on the economy….just what will he…can he…possibly do to make things substantially better. He sure sucked in MA….what makes you think he can do better with the nation at large?
On abortion….he still holds his Pro Choice views in his heart while lying about his conversion to Pro-Life. And is on tape talking about 4 exceptions…one of which, health of the mother….that his running mate Paul Ryan said would make any legislation banning partial birth abortion worthless…..wide enough to drive a Mack truck through.
On repealing and replacing (UH OH…what the heck does THAT mean…sounds like a Clintonian weasel word) Obamacare. This from the man who inspired Obamacare in the first place. LOL !!!
So….I guess we ARE back to voting for Romney because he is a better guy personally than Obama. Just a shame that he will be NO better and NO more effective at not only running the country but healing its ills. And in the end….this is why you vote for one guy or the other…..because you are quite certain that one will actually be more EFFECTIVE than the previous President…..not just because he gives more in charity…or that he SEEMS to be a nicer guy.
Although I never see anyone as being a “nicer” guy who is a pathological liar.
Lrning said….
Do you think religious freedom is only for church? What good is preaching the Gospel if we’re not allowed to put that faith into practice in ALL areas of our life? Are you really unaware of the HHS mandate? There are about 37 lawsuits and the DOJ argues that once you become a business owner, you check your conscience rights and religious freedom at the door.
Of course I have heard of those mandates….but so what? The government is only NOW catching up to what has been going on in the Corporate World for a long time. Where do you think the camel’s nose in the tent…so to speak…of civil gay unions and health benefits and gay worker’s rights came from …..THE CORPORATE WORLD !!
Here’s the rundown…. http://www.hrc.org/files/assets/resources/2012_BuyersGuide.pdf
So you get Mitt to kill the mandates and the Corporations continue its policies as if nothing happened. Much less what is happening in the liberal churches to strengthen those Captains of Industry resolve to continue to put in place workplace policies that do the same thing as the HHS mandates.
You guys really need to wake up to the fact that it is not only government that is evil…it is the unelected, and increasingly unaccountable Corporate World where you spend more of your money than you ever do in taxes to the government who is eroding the morality out of this country in spades.
But that’s hard to fight or protest against isn’t it ….after all…you all worship Capitalism too much to protest the Corporate World. Like that would really matter…..through Mergers and Consolidation, through offshoring and becoming Global companies beholden to no one…much less America….they know they have you by the sensitive parts. Plus as the banks did to us in 2008….you hurt us…we take down the economy….and how will you feed and house your family if you lose your job over your crusade against gay rights in the workplace or being able to share your faith in the workplace.
Welcome to American Fascism….where BIG GOVERNMENT meets BIG BUSINESS. And we get crushed between them.
Nice deflection, but I don’t buy it. No corporation is able to demand that all other corporations and institutions provide immoral health coverage to their employees. That is what the US government is doing through the HHS mandate. So those few corporations and institutions that managed to get this far without providing those coverages are now screwed.
It’s very sad, actually, that your cynicism has taken you so far down that you can’t even work up passion to fight for religious freedom. I think religious freedom is one of the few things the US has had going for it.
Nice deflection, but I don’t buy it. No corporation is able to demand that all other corporations and institutions provide immoral health coverage to their employees.
My naive little Lrning. You are not “lrning” enough. As someone who holds two degrees…one of which is a B.B.A. in Marketing and Management and have managed retail firms for over 15 years from high end jewelry to consumer electronics…you do not understand the pressure corporations are under to compete for talent. Particularly when compensation packages such as health care and pay are stagnating. So you compete on the more intangibles…such as workplace environment….including gay friendly work place policies.
So…yeah…technically you are correct. IBM could not mandate to GE to include in their workplace packages gay rights and abortion polices or even anti Gospel policies. But when one sees high quality talent going over to the competition they are compelled to follow suit. So in effect the same thing happens as if it were a blanket, nation-wide mandate.
It’s not cynicism when I’m right and have the facts to prove it.
But don’t believe me like I said. The proof is there. Google is your friend.
Check this out….
The Human Rights Campaign has its latest Corporate Equality Index out and the progress continues. This year, 305 corporations get a 100% score on equality for gays and lesbians, up from 260 last year and 195 the year before. This is great news to everyone except the anti-gay bigots, of course. The Worldnutdaily has an article that lists all 305 companies so their readers can avoid them.
As I posted above here is a link to the full index and report for 2012.
http://www.hrc.org/resources/entry/corporate-equality-index
Dude….you really need to get out more in info-land and educated yourself as to the TRUE state of the world and America. It ain’t all about BIG BAD GUBBERMINT….it’s even more so in the Corporate World brought to you by C A P I T A L I S M……that you all keep feeding with your disposable income.
Not saying socialism is better…..but you need to stop worshiping capitalism and realize Satan has totally captured that system of economics as well through his useful idiots in the corporate world.
Gay friendly policies improve the workplace environment because then your company is not the target of endless news stories about some poor employee at your company whose gay partner has cancer and is unemployed and uninsured etc. Appeasement stops the shakedown and harassment for a while.
Gay friendly policies are just kind and good for your gay employees.
Gay friendly policies improve the workplace environment because then your company is not the target of endless news stories about some poor employee at your company whose gay partner has cancer and is unemployed and uninsured etc. Appeasement stops the shakedown and harassment for a while.
That’s right. It’s sad though that so many here blame the Bad Ol Boogy Man Goobermint…when the candle is burning at both ends….with Big Business at the other end…..and us in the middle. But you can’t rail against Big Business because you will be labeled as Anti-Capitalist or an Occupy Wall Street freak,
So in effect the same thing happens as if it were a blanket, nation-wide mandate.
I call b.s.
You think that because a huge number of corporations cave to the sinful pressure of the world that a government mandate requiring almost ALL companies and institutions to do the same despite religious objections is no big deal? You don’t see that as a violation of religious freedom worthy of fighting? You think a “fact” filled response is “everyone else is already doing it so it ain’t no big deal that the few remaining institutions and companies get dragged into the immorality as well.”
Dude…you really need help discerning the difference between facts and opinion. Seriously. You keep complaining that no one is disputing you with facts. I don’t disagree with the facts you present, I disagree with the conclusions you draw based on those facts. You seem to think your conclusion (opinion) = fact. It’s laughable.
You can just keep spouting and ranting that the whole world, government and corporations included, are evil. I’ll just keep fighting an unjust mandate that prevents good people from living the Gospel. And I’ll keep fighting to save unborn lives.
but you need to stop worshiping capitalism
Ummm, I don’t worship capitalism. Given your love of “facts”, perhaps you could quote what I said that gave you that impression. I don’t think it’s too much to ask that you realize that everyone posting on this blog is an individual with a unique perspective.
and realize Satan has totally captured that system of economics as well through his useful idiots in the corporate world
God was willing to spare the wicked for the sake of just 10 righteous people. But not you. To hell with everyone, right? Everyone involved in business is evil because you said so.
I’m sure we’re all very interested in hearing how you’ve isolated your life from capitalism. Please share.
<Sigh>
You think that because a huge number of corporations cave to the sinful pressure of the world that a government mandate requiring almost ALL companies and institutions to do the same despite religious objections is no big deal?
It’s only no big deal to me simply because whether or not you have a government mandate…..the corporations are doing it regardless. The simple fact of the matter is…..IT DOES NOT MATTER.…and …..YOU CAN’T DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.
Kill the Government head….and you are left with the Corporate head. And with so many Big Business Executives rotating in and out of Government….it doubly does not matter. They carry their sinful ideas into business from government and they carry them from government into business. And if they don’t personally….then their lobbyists do it for them.
I disagree with the conclusions you draw based on those facts. You seem to think your conclusion (opinion) = fact. It’s laughable.
<Sigh> again…..
The Human Rights Campaign has its latest Corporate Equality Index out and the progress continues. This year, 305 corporations get a 100% score on equality for gays and lesbians, up from 260 last year and 195 the year
195….then 260….then 305….
Do you see the trend there? Do you think it will DECREASE anytime soon…seeing as how corporations are fighting for that coveted spot so as to attract talent?
So pray tell….how can you draw a more FAVORABLE conclusion based on the facts you say YOU AGREE WITH ME on?
but you need to stop worshiping capitalism
Ummm, I don’t worship capitalism. Given your love of “facts”, perhaps you could quote what I said that gave you that impression. I don’t think it’s too much to ask that you realize that everyone posting on this blog is an individual with a unique perspective.
Sure you do. You sure are not fighting for socialism. You guys rail about Obama being a socialist and/or Marxist. You rail against his “socialized” healthcare plan (while ignoring that Romney inspired Obama with his own “socialized” healthcare plan in MA).
So much HATE for socialism….because you worship capitalism. Come on….it’s been that way in this country forever…but particularly with the advent of socialism and Marxism in the late 19th century. For crying out loud….we’ve been sending men to die for capitalism since after WWII starting in the Korean War and going on through this day….(defeating Islamofascism is not just about ideology….it’s about keeping trade routes open…particularly over oil)
Don’t get mad….be proud of your belief in it. But be honest. It does cloud your senses when it comes to discerning what is going on the in the Corporate and Banking world.
Not to mention….it is the only economic system that allows anyone the ability to get filthy rich if they so desire and work at it hard enough and smart enough. However….it is the EASIEST system because of its focus on the accumulation of wealth to make anyone pass the eye of the needle test. You know…..this one…..
I’ll say it again–it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!” Matthew 19:24
Like any good medicine….it can always be abused to the detriment of the user. And today capitalism is being abused like never before. And there have never been so many camels going through that needle as opposed to the number of rich people (and remember….rich is relative….almost EVERYONE is richer than the rich man in the Bible) in America…..all made possible by Capitalism.
Be careful what you root for.
So pray tell….how can you draw a more FAVORABLE conclusion based on the facts you say YOU AGREE WITH ME on?
1) I’m not talking about gay and lesbian equality. I’m talking about the HHS mandate requiring coverage of contraception, abortion-inducing drugs, and sterilization.
2) The facts I agree with you on are related to Romney’s voting and governing history regarding protecting unborn life.
3) Your statement “the corporations are doing it regardless” so “it does not matter” “if you have a government mandate” is false if there is even one corporation/institution that isn’t doing “it”. I care that that one corporation/institution have the freedom to not do “it”. And judging by the 37 lawsuits representing over 100 plaintiffs, there is more than one that wishes not to be involved in this particular area of mandated immorality.
4) The fact that you don’t care that our government is mandating that Christians act against their conscience and faith because you prefer to look at the world with such a broad brush that individuals and their personal walk with Christ are invisible is quite lamentable.
5) “You can’t do anything about it” = false. I can vote for the man who has promised to get rid of this unjust mandate. And I will.
Sure you do. You sure are not fighting for socialism. You guys rail about Obama being a socialist and/or Marxist. You rail against his “socialized” healthcare plan (while ignoring that Romney inspired Obama with his own “socialized” healthcare plan in MA).
So much HATE for socialism….because you worship capitalism.
Nice try, but severely lacking in “facts”. Please quote my post where I “rail against” socialism and socialized health care.
I’m sure we’re all very interested in hearing how you’ve isolated your life from capitalism. Please share.
Sure…..I give to Caesar what is Caesar’s. What is not Caesar’s is my mind. I am neutral to capitalism and any other ism. As long as you do not abuse that ism. Communism could work if men were not sinful. Monarchism….which we will revert to at Christ’s Second Advent….could work too…if it were not for man’s sin.
As long as whatever ism does not endanger my family on a personal and local level….I could not care less. However…once it does…..then I’ll deal with it on a local and personal level. My life is in God’s hands. If He is going to allow my death through a takeover of America by some outside force or internal takeover…so be it. My mind and heart are always with Him….to the best of my abilities and always acknowledging my failures from time to time.
I do not wish for this…..but….Presidents and Caesars come and go and I will give to them what is theirs. My mind and heart belong to God.
You guys are always talking about fighting…..LOL !!! what a joke. You can’t even coordinate and are not courageous enough to boycott your Federal Taxes and starve the National Beast of its lifeblood. That would be a fight….that would be a revolution. Look at all those Muslim countries. Regardless of the fact they are electing Islamofascists into power….at least they had the cahones to rise up by and with force and drive out their corrupt leaders. You guys are afraid of going to jail over non payment of your hard earn dollars to a government you fear and who abuses and wastes your dollars which is nothing but a representation of your hard work. In effect…you ALL work for the government for more than HALF the year….for the distinct pleasure of having them screw you. And the best you can do is vote.
The Founding Fathers would be ashamed.
The government knows this….the corporations who the Supreme Court have said are individual people which means they can spend BILLIONS of dollars getting their paid for shill into office also know this.
Which is why voting is a complete waste of time. The corporations will just do an end run around any politican in their way if they disagree with them or they will carry the water for the politicians whom they support. And vice versa.
It’s called Fascism folks.
You guys are afraid of going to jail over non payment of your hard earn dollars to a government
Danny, are you writing from jail? Do you pay taxes? Hahahaha! I love the “you guys”! Seriously, your refusal to recognize individuals in favor of ranting against some fictional composite character is dang funny! And “fear”? You rant against “the corporations” and “the government” instead of recognizing individuals. What are you afraid of…that you might actually see some goodness and holiness?
Aw, y’all miss me. How sweet. I miss you too, well some of you. I’ll be back soon.
p.s. I hear Mittens is urging people to leave New York and go stay at their second or third homes.
Y’all be safe now.
Lol, what’s up Reality? Were your ears burning? Hope you are well.
I’m very much at wits end because your silence on issues that I’ve brought up in the past says what??????
CONCEPT I: There are defined ‘mood swings’ during pregnancy(2) and another (1)post-partem. Each of these is specifically linked to periods of high zinc use in a developing child. Why is this not basic biological knowledge? [Because zinc is a ‘natural element’ and firms cannot patent/profit-from it = no research.]
CONCEPT 2: GMO’s impact on animal (and likely) human fertility by robbing the eater of basic nutrients. GMo’s are made only by America’s Monsanto. Could this cause some-to-many miscarriages? If ‘yes’, then Monsanto becomes #1 abortion provider/birth-defect-king/etc over PP.
CONCEPT 3: All humans must grow in an environment. What good is it (after decades of effort) to ‘save’ kids from abortionists’ greed only to have them die from a too toxic environment? [I have sent a few videos on the impact of planned-future development of Alberta tar-sands. They have not found a ‘home’ here. BTW both candidates favor this energy-source for North-American self-sufficiency in energy production. Canadians will pick-your-pockets …. count-on-it!]
Bet you didn’t see this coming, something like a hurricane, eh?
you really need help discerning the difference between facts and opinion. Seriously.
It is a fact that Roe v. Wade will never be overturned.
It is a fact that Danny knows what I deep down feel.
It is a fact that Danny has hurt others’ feelings here. He knows for a fact he has hurt people’s feelings based on the words they choose.
It is a fact that all prolifers who vote for Romney are stupid fools.
It is a fact that Romney owns prolifers who vote for him.
It is a fact that all Mormons are mentally disturbed.
It is a fact that Romney will be NO better and NO more effective than Obama.
It is a fact that I will come around to Danny’s side by the end of 4 years
It is a fact that prolifers who vote for Romney believe Romney will single-handedly save all unborn children from abortion.
It is a fact that Danny HATES STUPID PEOPLE, HATES FEARFUL PEOPLE, HATES IRRATIONAL PEOPLE AND HATES PEOPLE WHO COP OUT TO A TYRANNICAL SYSTEM THEY KNOW IS BROKEN.
It is a fact that Danny is a Christian in spite of hating so many people.
If all these facts confuse you, just remember this simple fact: It is a fact that all of Danny’s opinions are facts.
This thread is starting to become hilarious! Danny’s an ok guy if you don’t take him too seriously.
Praxedes, thanks for straightening out all the facts. It was getting a little bit confusing, being blinded by the shining light is Danny’s truth. :)
Romney will be the the greatest pro-life force ever to take the presidency of the United States. Beginning with the defunding of the largest abortion provider in the US. Along with being pro-life you also have to have the smarts and the spine and Romney has all of the above. He is the man for this time and I can’t wait to cast my vote for him.
I am almost certain that Romney will not be the greatest pro-life force to ever take office, not even close. I wish, but no.
truthseeker, are you just trying to piss Danny off at this point?
^Lol JDC that was literally my exact thought.
“Lol JDC that was literally my exact thought.”
Great minds think alike. :)
Just voted early in Texas for write-in candidates Virgil Goode/Jim Clymer. Roe v Wade will never be overturned as long as people keep settling for RINOs and Outhouse Republicans. Eight years of R(INO)omney would prevent the GOP from selecting a pro-life Republican candidate until 2020!