CNN’s Don Lemon scolds black community for out-of-wedlock births
And Number One, and probably the most important: Just because you can have a baby, it doesn’t mean you should, especially without planning for one or getting married first.
More than 72% of children in the African-American community are born out of wedlock. That means absent fathers. And the studies show that lack of a male role model is an express train right to prison.
And the cycle continues.
~ CNN’s “No Talking Points” host Don Lemon admonishing the black community to “clean up your act”, BuzzFeed, July 28
Jul.31, 2013 6:00 am |
Pregnancy |
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
I wonder if Don Lemon is equally concerned about the high abortion rate in the African-American community.
The message needs to be tightened up and even more direct. Don’t tell them not to have children out of wedlock because that leaves the door open to abortion and reliance on contraception that will fail.
The real message should be: “Keep your pants on until you’re married. Respect yourself and your future wife and abstain from sex. That’s what a man does.”
“And a man, if he does conceive a child with a woman, would never abandon his child or seek to have his child killed, and would not abandon his child’s mother.”
Translation: All you poor African Americans need to get your s*** together and stop havin’ babies. Don’t you see that you can’t do it without a man? If you have a child out of wedlock, that child is definitely going straight to prison.
…
Lemon’s lecture screams of elitism. It’s not that I condone sex outside of marriage, but this sort of c*** isn’t helping. How about empowering the black women who find themselves in difficult situations, reaching out and helping them to build themselves up, rather than telling them how worthless and crummy they are.
Also, it is NOT a direct line from “born out of wedlock” to “absent father”; naturally there is a correlation, but it is a self-fulfilling prophecy to act like getting pregnant outside of marriage means a free pass for the man. This sort of thinking just increases the burden on the mother without placing any of the responsibility on the father, who as we can recall, is an equal partner in the lifegiving act.
/rant
Some conservative news people have recently claimed that Obama has done nothing to address the problem with the African American community “having babies” or the “birthrate” for single mothers. Sure he has! It’s called abortion. Whether they intend to or not, speaking about these issues in this way obviously make it seem as though the real problem is that more people don’t abort their children.
“Express train to prison” for fatherless children. Could not have been said better.
PP and the abortion movement is anti-poor people. They see poor people in the same way that they see the mentally and physically disabled: undesirable.
Eugenics is alive and well and supported by those it seeks to eradicate. Huxley was right in forward to Brave New World - the people’s happy and ignorant embrace of their servitude and eventual extinction happened within 100 years.
I don’t like the “express train to prison” comment. I think it paints a hopeless picture for kids (both black and of other races) who had an absent/abusive/otherwise inadequate father. You CAN make a good life for yourself, even if you didn’t have a decent dad. And haven’t we had a few presidents raised by single mothers? Man, give people a little hope why doncha.
I pretty much agree with MaryRose for the most part. I also think that people are forgetting the systemic inequalities that disproportionately affect the black community in the US. It’s not as simple as “the kids are fatherless, that’s why”. Problems in our criminal “justice” system contribute massively to these kids growing up without their fathers, for one.
We are not on express trains anywhere, but we may be on slow busses (to prison?) with lots of stops, some which transfer to express trains, others to other slow busses headed the same direction, and others to busses headed to a completely different destination. My dad lost his dad at a very early age. He grew up to become an amazing person. But not before he got into plenty of trouble as a kid, which I do at least in part attribute to his fatherlessness.
Here it is: Kids actually have to get in trouble, as in intervention, negative reinforcement, people telling you that it is NOT ok because you are better than that. Not the “don’t judge,” “it’s just x,y, and z – normal kid stuff” crud that happens these days. Sure, certain behavior is “normal” for kids, but not right, and then normal for parents, teachers, etc. to take corrective measures. You know, standards.
The secular world can’t seem to make sense of how to love and value a person while simultaneously disapproving of their behavior and disciplining them. It’s really not a contradiction.
“Kids actually have to get in trouble, as in intervention, negative reinforcement, people telling you that it is NOT ok because you are better than that. Not the “don’t judge,” “it’s just x,y, and z – normal kid stuff” crud that happens these days. Sure, certain behavior is “normal” for kids, but not right, and then normal for parents, teachers, etc. to take corrective measures. You know, standards.”
Actually, kids don’t have to get in trouble first. You can intervene in populations that are more vulnerable to crime and other issues when they’re young and try to set their paths correctly in the first place. It obviously won’t catch everyone, but I think positive reinforcement beats negative reinforcement any day. I’ve said it before on here, it’s much easier to do this stuff before they get into drugs, get into gangs, etc, because once you’re in the life it’s much more difficult to get out.
“The secular world can’t seem to make sense of how to love and value a person while simultaneously disapproving of their behavior and disciplining them”
Nope. Plenty of secularists think that some behavior is unacceptable and should be discouraged. Many are just less likely to fully agree with Christians about what behavior is unacceptable or not.
“Actually, kids don’t have to get in trouble first. You can intervene in populations that are more vulnerable to crime and other issues when they’re young and try to set their paths correctly in the first place. It obviously won’t catch everyone, but I think positive reinforcement beats negative reinforcement any day. I’ve said it before on here, it’s much easier to do this stuff before they get into drugs, get into gangs, etc, because once you’re in the life it’s much more difficult to get out.”
Ok, sure, I meant “get in trouble” for initial bad behaviors – hopefully before the point when kids are in gangs, etc. and ideally far before we are talking in trouble with the law. When my kids hit someone, I intervene. When my kids do something great, I notice. Just noticing what they did well is too little. And waiting til they beat someone up is too late. (Well, it’s never too late!)
OK, Jack. Some secular folks have an understanding of how discipline complements love. Unfair generalization perhaps. In my experience, MANY play the “kids will be kids” card.
“Ok, sure, I meant “get in trouble” for initial bad behaviors – hopefully before the point when kids are in gangs, etc. and ideally far before we are talking in trouble with the law. When my kids hit someone, I intervene. When my kids do something great, I notice. Just noticing what they did well is too little. And waiting til they beat someone up is too late. (Well, it’s never too late!)”
Oh, yeah, kids should definitely be corrected if they’re doing something wrong or that will have lifelong consequences for them. I disagree with a lot of the “interventions” and “getting in trouble” that a lot of people seem to advocate for at-risk youth. Throw them in jail, let them see how they like it? “Tough on crime?” Well, okay, it might work for some kids but I got some of my best criminal hook-ups by being put in juvenile detention. It seems like people don’t bother looking at the *why* kids are doing things when they’re committing crimes. “Tough on crime” sounds nice but in reality this country has the worst recidivism in the western world and we have more of our population in jail at any point then pretty much every other developed country combined. We’re obviously doing something really, really wrong.
The fact is that being raised by a single mother CORRELATES with ending up in prison. There is a connection there.
Of course, as with adoption, anything negative said about single motherhood rubs some people the wrong way because with abortion legal, they always think THAT will be the alternative rather than not getting pregnant out of wedlock in the first place.
he meant to say ride to prison, not right to prison-correct?
Ok-this is the exact kind of racist commentary from Blacks and Whites which is against Blacks. it’s racist. I don’t think just because Black people say this kind of things about their own skin-kind that it’s not racist. Saying abortion should be legal for poor black women sends a mean message. Poor Black women don’t need P.A.S.S. anymore thank do, poor women of any race. to Man-up doesn’t mean paying for your woman’s, and your child’s abortion-a mean new kind of mental racial slavery is being prejudiced against not only the Black people, but the human race as a whole. It is disappointing to see and hear this commentary being allowed in television. Thank God for men like Ryan Bomberger and Walter Hoye.
Best ‘rant’ I’ve seen in some time MaryRose. Accurate and well said.
^If that kind of endorsement does not make one pause and reconsider what one has said no endorsement ever will.
Just because Reality is devastatingly wrong about abortion and some other issues doesn’t mean he’s wrong about everything. If MaryRose believes what she says, she’s not going to suddenly change her mind because Reality agrees with it.
And personally I believe what makes sense and what is supported by evidence, for the most part. It matters not to me if someone who holds repugnant views agrees with me, because that doesn’t change reality.
Lol Hitler was apparently pro-animal rights and by some reports was a vegetarian, doesn’t mean I start eating animals because someone awful agreed with me.
Smile Jack life is short.
Oh you were joking. Lol, it’s hard to tell if someone is joking in text sometimes.
“Smile Jack life is short.” – hang on! I thought you had some sort of majickal key to eternal life?
Jesus does…I don’t think Jack has asked to borrow it.
(is this a reference to the Key Maker?)
I have to, when I was a kid. Lol.
Well, that is good news Jack because I don’t think he ever asks for the key back. He has infinite copies of it. But if you want to return it unused…well, that is a different story… a short story in fact.
If this is just going to turn into another thread where you poke at me because of my lack of religious beliefs, I’m not really interested in going there. Let’s go back to talking about the single parenthood problem in the black community and what can be done about it.
Tyler – makes a comment about a comment Reality made.
Jack: are you making comments about me again.
Tyler: No, Jack I am responding to Reality’s comment.
Jack: are you making fun of my lack of religion now.
Tyler: No, I am just responding to your previous comment.
Jack: Ok, as long as you are not talking about me. I hate it when people talk about me. Or when the conservation is about me. It seems all people can talk about is me, me, me. I just don’t like it when people talk about me. Tyler, are you going to apologize now?
I have no idea what you’re going on about.
and yet
“Jesus does…I don’t think Jack has asked to borrow it.”
“that is good news Jack because I don’t think he ever asks for the key back.”
I thought I would try to save us some time tonight.
I usually use myself as an example in my comments because I don’t like to inadvertently offend people by using them as examples. For all I know I would offend MaryRose so I didn’t want to use her in my comment, but I wanted to make the point that her comment doesn’t suddenly become wrong because Reality agreed with it. I didn’t think you were talking about me, Tyler. The rest of your comment is simply wrong.
Reality, just for you—- our life in these pre-glorified bodies is short.
I feel that reality doesn’t shift for “Reality”‘s opinions ;) No offense was/would be taken for such an acknowledgement. :)
Deep Tyler, deep. So deep I almost moistened the tip of my nose when I tried to dip my head into it :-)
Jack, I think I understand now the limits that you like to place on your arguments. Indeed, your self-restraint is admirable – your desire to only make statements about what you have had first hand experience of or solid scientific support for makes your statements very persuasive and reflects a high level of maturity and humility.
Yes, the fact that Reality agrees with a statement does not make that statement wrong. A very insightful, if not a bit of an eccentric, observation.
You’re on a roll today MaryRose – (genuine) *applause*
I don’t really do anything different than everyone else does on this website, just share my opinions. I like that I get insulted for it so often.
But thanks for trying to understand why I comment like I do, Tyler, I do appreciate it.
Reality – stop telling fibs and your nose won’t be as big as it is. Perhaps, then you will be able to acknowledge the depths of human experience.
“stop telling fibs and your nose won’t be as big as it is.” – more fairy story stuff? Only pinocchio knows where his nose goes ;-)
“you will be able to acknowledge the depths of human experience.” – I do, hence the moniker I use.
Reality, while your wit is sharp, your moniker is by far your best joke to date. ;)
Many tales that you call fairy share more truth than does your thrust and parry.
I was quite young when I first noticed how some people laugh when they find themselves in certain situations.
And I’ve explained previously why I don’t bother setting up a website to link to my moniker….. :-)
“I was quite young when I first noticed how some people laugh when they find themselves in certain situations.”
What are you talking about?
Sometimes people laugh over weird things, I’ve noticed. I laugh when I get physically hurt, my ex thinks it’s the creepiest thing lol.
Over time I have found that some ‘old wives tales’ may contain an element of truth Tyler. But while fairy tales may be analogous, or even said to be parables, regarding situations one might encounter in life, they are in and of themselves totally unbelievable.
You’re on the right track Jack. Within the realm.
Explain! Now I’m curious and I can’t figure out what you’re referring to lol.
sssh, I’ll tell you later Jack, when no ones ‘listening’.
Lol, I’m so slow. I am sure it’s not that difficult to figure out what you’re referring to but the joke went over my head.
It’s not a joke Jack. It’s an observation of peoples behavior.
And you are not slow!
I imagine a tiny Reality on Jack’s shoulder, speaking into his ear, and on the other shoulder a tiny Tyler speaking into his other ear.
Um what? Lol.
Oh I wouldn’t equate Tyler with evil temptation LifeJoy ;-)
I think LifeJoy is saying she/he thinks you are well balanced Jack.
I’m so confused today.
Low bio-rythms Jack?
What? Lol. Seriously, I have no clue what people are talking about today.
Reality and Tyler tend to have that mind-numbing effect. :P
Lol, that’s true sometimes MaryRose. I’m quite fond of the both of them though, most of the time.
They’re alright, I guess ;)
Always an interesting group of folks on Jill’s blog, and it wouldn’t be the same without Reality. :-D
And Tyler adds something, too, I suppose ;)
In all seriousness, though, I’m glad they’re both here.
I like pretty much every person who comments here. Even the pro-choicers.
It’s not a full moon or anything is it? :-)
If I said I was just a pigment of your imagination would you accuse me of using colorful language?
Now you’re just trying to be confusing! But I understood that one lol.
Goodness, Reality, are you usually trying to be understandable? That’s new to me! ;)
I wanted to write a poem called “literacy is overrated” but I just couldn’t find the words.
The elated eremite enthusiastically expressed his effusive erudition exclusively to ennobled eccentrics enthused with such edifying experiences.
Sometimes things are new, sometimes we just haven’t seen them before ;-)
Excellent research on the effects of fatherhood on the website fatherhood.org. I think the organization is the National Fatherhood Initiative headed by an A. A. man (I think his name is Roland Warren). The effects of fathers and fatherlessness impacts pretty much every area of maternal-child health beginning with the prenatal period along with impacting the physical, mental, emotional, social, and economic health, levels of educational achievement and overall wellbeing of children from infancy, childhood, adolescence to adulthood. There is powerful research confirming that everything from prematurity, truancy, dropout, incarceration, and graduation rates are impacted by fathers or fatherlessness for most children. Yes, some children beat the odds like my husband but most do not (his siblings did not) and even though he has beat the odds and became a awesome husband and father he still suffered some consequences from having a deadbeat father. Not always possible, but children still do best with their biological father and mother in a healthy, stable marriage.
FWIW: Scandal plagued politico Anthony Weiner enjoys a “100%” rating from an abortion legalization group and rates a “0” from an abortion criminalization group.
Hmmmm. . . .
Prolifer,
There is a distinct difference, though, between what you said and what Lemon said. The tone of Lemon’s lecture was very aggressive and not particularly helpful, whereas your comment above addresses the facts and opens the discussion up to ways to assist the children who, through no fault of their own, are at a disadvantage from the get-go.
I’d like to point out that I was born out of wedlock. My parents got married days after having me because my mother was insured under her father’s healthcare while unmarried. There are all sorts of reasons a child may be born out of wedlock and not all of them result in a “deadbeat dad.” I do not condone sex outside of marriage. That said, it isn’t merciful or just to condemn all of a woman’s decisions based on a single error in judgment, especially not when that woman so needs your assistance and guidance over your condemnation of her whole being. It is possible, as you have shown above, to condemn the sin without “throwing the baby out with the bath water” (in more than one way!).
@ MaryRose: Also, it is NOT a direct line from “born out of wedlock” to “absent father”; naturally there is a correlation, but it is a self-fulfilling prophecy to act like getting pregnant outside of marriage means a free pass for the man.
I think you speak of the baby momma syndrome. The onus unfortunately falls on the black female. If once around does not teach why do it twice or three or seven times, and why for the love of God engage in cat-fights with other females over that deadbeat?
You will not change the deadbeat but starting with you may actually be more resolving of the predicament you are in. That is the lesson to be learned from Don Lemon’s quest.
“… children still do best with their biological father and mother in a healthy, stable marriage.”
Many Christians in the pro-life community refuse to acknowledge this and simply point to the exceptions and unwittingly condone divorce and out of wedlock pregnancy. Children without their biological father and mother in a healthy stable marriage are twice as likely to engage in teen sex and significantly more likely to become pregnant and turn to abortion.
Thanks for your comment Eric. I have seen the fallout of out-of-wedlock births and divorce in my work with women and teens for many years, so I know this is true and the research backs it up. People need to know that by 2 years of age about 80% of children born out of wedlock will not have a ongoing relationship with his/her father (this goes on in divorces but not at such a high rate). I’ve seen a statistic that about 60% of minority children born out of wedlock have never even spent time in their father’s home. My husband (whose parents divorced when he was 2 so he wasn’t born out of wedlock but still suffered paternal abandonment) didn’t until he was 12 years old when he spent one summer with his dad because his dad’s girlfriend invited him (his father didn’t extend the invitation his girlfriend did, he said she was a kind woman who wanted him to know his dad). One of his siblings didn’t meet their dad to know who he was until 8 years of age. Talk about a ticket to poverty and usually a difficult life; you better believe it. Children were meant to receive part of their identity by having a loving, stable relationship with both of the parents that created them. Like I said a few beat the odds like my husband, most don’t.
Thomas,
Don Lemon’s quest certainly didn’t appear to be to actually assist or educate women at all. His quest seemed to be to chastise them for daring to get pregnant.
Quite frankly, I’m sick of “men won’t change so women have to” arguments. Women, raise your sons to respect you. Men, raise your sons to respect women! Young men, learn your value outside of your sexual conquests. Young women, respect and love yourselves enough to STOP seeking validation from young men. The blame falls on everyone here, and the responsibility to change likewise. Lemon’s quote above puts ZERO blame on the men, and compounds the problem. Essentially, he says, “You’re all just a bunch of worthless women who keep yourselves in the slums by making bad choices, and that’s what you’ll always be.” I understand that he was ‘imploring’ better choices, but without any mercy, the message is negated.
Lemon’s opinion lacked a desire to help. Oh, thank you, all-knowing CNN host, thank you so much for teaching these women the error of their ways. I’m sure they are eternally grateful that you place blame squarely on their shoulders without bothering to offer assistance. Blech.
Prolifer,
For the record, there isn’t a thing you’ve said with which I disagree. It’s absolutely important to have both parents present whenever possible. A child needs and deserves to be raised by a loving mother and father both. But is it sufficient to shame the women who have had the courage to keep and raise the child when the father left? Your posts indicate, as usual, your heart for those in need. The original quote…not so much.
MaryRose,
I am always a proponent of hearing the message and not paying attention to the form in which it is delivered. Some concentrate on the form to avoid looking at themselves but truthfully – it is with ourselves THAT WE HAVE TO START.
I do not think that Lemon was proposing that women change for the men, rather he was being brutally honest about the state of affairs in the black community. I don’t think you can argue that he was putting forth any fallacies about single-motherhood and it’s implications in this community.
Women hold power. Black women have allowed themselves to be referred to as the “fiance” for much too long MaryRose. It is time to change that, precisely by standing up to the deadbeats and “kicking them to the curb.”
Don’t be upset with Lemon. Sometimes the form of delivery hurts but it is time to get some thick skin and take care of the children’s future. Best…
I hear you Thomas R. and I do think “women hold power”. You can choose to NOT be the forever “fiancé” or the one-night stand or the ”shack up” partner.
” I am always a proponent of hearing the message and not paying attention to the form in which it is delivered. Some concentrate on the form to avoid looking at themselves but truthfully – it is with ourselves THAT WE HAVE TO START. ”
I disagree with this. Messages in poor form end up just preaching to choir, rather than reaching who you want to reach. No one likes being talked down to like a little child or treated like they are stupid or selfish, and if your message comes across like that it’s not going to be heard no matter how truthful it is.
And I think people are making a huge mistake when they ignore certain realities about the world they live in to act like the reason the black community has a higher rate of single motherhood is just due to deadbeat dads. Like I said before, injustice and inequality with our criminal “justice” system is a large part of it.
Perhaps Jack. We all have prisms through which we filter messages from others and as long as we continue to apply these prisms, we will never hear the message. Even messages delivered in good form (whatever that means) may escape us due to precisely, our own insecurities about ourselves.
My view of justice follows one simple premise: justice is incidental to law and order (Hoover said this). Read anything you wish into this statement.
Prolifer, if it were not for a woman you would not be engaged on this platform today. Women, in other words, hold the key to life. And, also remember that women are the “neck to a men’s head” (I think you understand this analogy). LOL.