I'm betting that they bill those ancillary services to the taxpayers, too, even in states that don't pay for elective abortions but do pay for pelvic exams, ultrasounds, bloodwork, pregnancy tests, STD tests, and a nice packet of birth control pills. I'd bet that even in those states, most of the cost of an abortion still gets picked up by the taxpayers as separate services.

Yeah, that figures. I am sure they are not the only ones spinning the numbers in their favor, but it is still really deceptive.
You really can't believe anything you read anymore....
I think what scares me more (about the issue of spinning numbers) is that so many people DO believe everything they hear that supports the opinion they already have. Doesn't anyone anymore want to know the truth??

Fresa, I wholeheartedly agree...nobody wants to hear the truth, anymore.

People are so used to hearing half-truths, misrepresentations and deceptions by the PP propaganda machine that when the real Truth comes out they do NOT recognize it, condem it outright and won't even want to consider the rationality behind it (even if supported by honest, scientific and medical findings devoid of any bias).

Abortion is the masterpiece of the Devil who is the father of lies...

I've said it before many times, but it doesn't matter that abortion is "only 3%" or even if it was a legit ".ooo1%" of their services for that matter. They have a service where they kill a person. Period. If one of the services that your company provides is to kill an innocent person, everything else you do is inconsequential. 265,943 abortions or only 1 abortion, it doesn't matter. They are an organization that kills.

Val, you're a statistician, too?

I agree with Bobby (no surprise there), but I'll add this: Even if Planned Parenthood performed NO abortions, everything else it does is equally damnable. The lobby weight and absolute advocacy of abortion, as well.

And don't forget, at the city council meeting in September, PP supporters stated the same "only 3%" stat....then, later, Trombley stated that Aurora will account for "only" 10%, then PP stated "about" 10%. DECEIVINGLY SICK!!!

If I recall properly, out west PP of the Rockies tried
to say with a straight face they only killed 8,000
a year or so.

I'll find those phony stats about their "services"
for women. Of course they don't give a whit
about unborn women!

Here we go from the Denver Post's Diane Carmen 8/26/07:

"Leslie Hanks, vice president of Colorado Right to Life, declined several requests for an interview, but Cybercast News Service reported Thursday her group has begun planning for protests and business boycotts as soon as construction begins. She told them the clinic is a "death camp."

In fact, the clinic provides life-saving cancer screening, sex education, counseling and contraception.

Leslie Durgin, senior VP of Planned Parenthood of the Rocky Mountains, said health-care services were provided to 96,848 Coloradans last year. And, yes, of the 125,046 patients served in the organization's five-state region in 2006, 8,800 received abortions - which is their right under federal, state and local laws."

If I recall properly, out west PP of the Rockies tried
to say with a straight face they only killed 8,000
a year or so.

I'll find those phony stats about their "services"
for women. Of course they don't give a whit
about unborn women!

Here we go from the Denver Post's Diane Carmen 8/26/07:

"Leslie Hanks, vice president of Colorado Right to Life, declined several requests for an interview, but Cybercast News Service reported Thursday her group has begun planning for protests and business boycotts as soon as construction begins. She told them the clinic is a "death camp."

In fact, the clinic provides life-saving cancer screening, sex education, counseling and contraception.

Leslie Durgin, senior VP of Planned Parenthood of the Rocky Mountains, said health-care services were provided to 96,848 Coloradans last year. And, yes, of the 125,046 patients served in the organization's five-state region in 2006, 8,800 received abortions - which is their right under federal, state and local laws."

"Even if Planned Parenthood performed NO abortions, everything else it does is equally damnable. The lobby weight and absolute advocacy of abortion, as well."

Amen, Jacqu!

"Even if Planned Parenthood performed NO abortions, everything else it does is equally damnable"

Excuse me? Pap smears and treatment for STDs are damnable?

Are you igrorant or do you just have a wierd hatred of other women?

Thank God you people are a tiny red-state fringe and having no actual affect on my life whatsover. Other than raising my blood pressure on the lunch hour when I puruse your craziness for amusement.

you don't sound very amused.

Lol, rosie.

"Even if Planned Parenthood performed NO abortions, everything else it does is equally damnable. The lobby weight and absolute advocacy of abortion, as well."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Providing birth control, abstinence education, STD and cancer screenings are "damnable?"

Pro Lifers show their true colors again. "No health care or birth control for slutty women."

Anon young woman, if you think we are amusing now, check back later. We are going to be putting on a family-friendly vaudeville show!!!!!

carrie, does family friendly include gay and lesbian families? If so, it should be a great show.

Hal, if I ruled the world, it would.

Pro Lifers show their true colors again. "No health care or birth control for slutty women."
Posted by: Hal at October 17, 2007 11:43 AM
-----------------------------------------------
And all pro-choicers are named Hal.

Come-on. We all know that one person doesn't speak for an entire cause. Especially one person on a fairly anonymous internet board.

I am hoping that the previous poster only meant that PP supports abortion rights so vehemently that even if they didn't actually provide abortions, they were still "bad".

I really, really hate to think that anyone thinks that providing vital health services to woman is bad. (providing one of those services isn't abortion)

Oh that was me. I wish it wouldn't let me post if I hadn't filled in a name....

anon young woman:

May I suggest PERUSING dictionary.com instead? It may help you spell every other word correctly.

Of course, if PP closed business and hence stopped pushing immoral lifestyles and unhealthy choices, the abortions wouldn't need to be done, the rate of STD infections would decline dramatically, and guess what, maybe there wouldn't be a need for all that cancer screening too.
Pushing contraceptives and sex outside of marriage ensures they will have "clients" for years to come.

I certainly have no issue with providing pap tests, but tell me, does PP follow up when these tests are positive for cancer? Will they continue to monitor the woman with regular exams, biopsies, and possibly any surgical procedure she may need? Or will the woman, who supposedly can't get or afford medical care, need to be referred to a specialist?
Also, does PP provide full prenatal care, delivery, and post natal care as well? Does it provide childbirth classes? Again, must women who supposedly have no access to or cannot afford health care somehow manage to find the care they need for these services.

Since I would consider these above mentioned services to be a very vital part of women's health care, I would hope they would be among the services PP provides.

A private OB/GYN would be able to provide such services and then some.

Just to clarify what I said, I don't believe you can call PP damnable for providing the same services your OB/Gyn does. I am against abortion. But I have no problem with screening for STD's, providing birth control, Pap tests, etc.
I obviously don't like PP because of many issues, but take abortion out of the picture, and the services they provide are not a lot different your doctor or mine, or a health clinic.
JMO

Mary, great post! I couldn't agree more.

Hal,
That's right. Only nuns are allowed birth control. You've discovered our secret plot.

Hmmm...just wondering, IF PP "clinics" are saying they provide "healthcare" services to women, like your regular medical clinics and hospitals, only cheaper...

Are they also bound by the same strict rules and regulations governing the operation of legitimate medical facilities? (ie.VNA, Provena, Rush-Copley, Edwards, Dreyer..etc)

RSD,

Good point! With all of those STD's going around, I sure hope their sterilizing everything properly! These are just technicians, right? I wouldn't want ANY kind of test from them, let alone sit in one of their chairs!

Jacqu:

"Val, you're a statistician, too?"

Technically no. However, my husband is a Metrologist (not the weather guy - the measurment scientist). He double checks most of my "stats" post before I post them. I can do basic statistics which is what most of this is. I also refer to my "complete idiots guide to Statistics" alot!

From the Guttmatcher Institute:

September 2006 report "in brief"

Contraception use among women ages 15 - 24 who account for approx. 50% of all abortions.

* Nearly all sexually active females (98% in 2002) have used at least one method of birth control. The most common methods used are the condom (used at least once by 94%) and the pill (used at least once by 61%)

* Nearly one-quarter of teens who used contraceptives the last time they had sex combined two methods, primarily the condom and a hormonal method.

* At most recent sex, 83% of teen females and 91% of teen males used contraceptives.

Now lets move on to STI's/STD's and pregnancy for the same age group:

* Of the 18.9 million new cases of STIs each year, 9.1 million (48%) occur among 15-24-year-olds

* Although 15-24-year-olds represent only one-quarter of the sexually active population, they account for nearly half of all new STIs each year.

* Each year, almost 750,000 women aged 15-19 become pregnant.

* Eighty-two percent of teen pregnancies are unplanned; they account for about one in five (about 20%) of all unintended pregnancies annually.

* Teen pregnancy rates are much higher in the United States than in many other developed countries-twice as high as in England and Wales or Canada, and eight times as high as in the Netherlands or Japan.

* There were 214,750 abortions among 15-19-year-olds in 2002

* Twenty-nine percent of pregnancies among 15-19-year-olds ended in abortion in 2002, compared with 21% among all women.

Tell me, when are all these great contraception education plans and contraception handouts going to start working?

Oh - did I forget to mention that in 2002 Guttmatcher reported that there were 15 million new STI's reported every year? That is an increase of about 4 million new STI's in just 4 years. That would be an addition of about 1 million new STI's every year. Isn't Planned Parenthood growing every year? From all of their yearly reports their numbers of clients increase.

PP just keeps reporting that teen pregnancy is down - and forget to mention that the US still has one of the highest teen pregnancy rates - but they forget to mention that the STI's are up. Either way - its business for them.

Of course, if PP closed business and hence stopped pushing immoral lifestyles and unhealthy choices, the abortions wouldn't need to be done, the rate of STD infections would decline dramatically, and guess what, maybe there wouldn't be a need for all that cancer screening too.
Pushing contraceptives and sex outside of marriage ensures they will have "clients" for years to come.

Posted by: Patricia at October 17, 2007 1:15 PM

Hahahaha! That was really funny. Because as we all know, before the existence of Planned Parenthood, there was no such thing as abortion, or STIs, or extramarital sex. Hehehehehehe. And everyone was a virgin until marriage, and life was one magical trip filled with rainbows, unicorns and fairies from birth to death......

Carol at October 17, 2007 4:33 PM,

No, I don't believe anyone believes the fairy tale you described..However, PROMOTING it is another thing! These things are running rampid since Roe vs. Wade...do some research!

I guess I just don't see how having access to information, medical exams, contraception, and treatment is promoting what you call an "immoral" lifestyle. That seems to be a fallacy, and assumes a cause and effect that can't really be connected.

Carol,

Just throwing this out there. Shouldn't all this information, access to medical exams, contraception, and treatment be making at least a huge dent in the spread of STDs and the number of unwanted pregnancies? I would think these problems would markedly decrease everywhere a PP clinic pops up.

As always Mary, great points.
Also interesting that wherever a PP opens up the abortion rates go up in that area. So much for their dedication to decreasing abortion rates.

PP has always been on a fairyland trip with all of the lies and deceptions their business is built on.
Just to name a few.
"Let's set up feeder clinics in shopping malls where teens tend to hang out." (So they can be referred to our abortion clinic when the time comes.)

"Let;s sell junk jewelry, candles and scented oils." (So they like us and trust us, so we can refer them to our abortion clinic when the time comes.)

"Let's tell them that abortion is no big deal. It's just a blob of tissue."

"There is no such thing as PAS, you obviously have emotional issues you need to deal with. Now get out of our office and don't come back, unless you need another abortion. (Then we will be happy to see you.")

"It's a difficult decision to be made between a woman and her doctor." (The only thing the abortionist really knows about the woman is her true hair color.)

"We don't know what will be going into the 22,000 square foot building we are going to construct."

"We are a non-profit organization. OOPs except for the umpteen millions of dollars in profit we post every year."

"You are pregnant by your 45 year old "boyfriend"? It's ok. We won't tell anyone. Just lie on your forms and say you're name is Sally and make up a birthdate so you instanly become 18."

"Of course all of our equipment is sterilized."
(Well, once a year maybe, but we are too busy doing profitable abortions we don't have time to really get around to it."

I'm sure I have missed many more. Too many lies, so little time.

I posted this on the wrong thread!

Phil Kline already lost his job as Kansas Attorney General, he's working his way towards "Mike Nifong" territory now...

Kansas Planned Parenthood Clinic Charged
By ANDALE GROSS – 2 hours ago

KANSAS CITY, Mo. (AP) — A Planned Parenthood clinic was charged Wednesday with providing unlawful abortions and other crimes by a county prosecutor who had engaged in a high-profile battle with the clinic when he was Kansas attorney general.

Johnson County District Attorney Phill Kline charged the Overland Park, Kan., clinic with 107 counts, 23 of them felonies. Besides 29 misdemeanor counts of providing unlawful late-term abortions, the clinic is charged with multiple counts of making a false writing, failure to maintain records and failure to determine viability.

Case documents have been sealed, according to a court order. The first hearing is set for Nov. 16.

Kline's office did not immediately comment on the charges.

Peter Brownlie, Planned Parenthood of Kansas and Mid-Missouri's president and chief executive officer, said Wednesday that the group hasn't had any contact with the district attorney's office but has heard rumors for months that Kline, an abortion opponent, was planning to file criminal charges.

"I've heard nothing at all about specific charges that have been filed," Brownlie said. "We always provide high-quality care in full accord with state and federal law."

As for allegations that Planned Parenthood performed illegal late-term abortions, Brownlie said its clinic doesn't perform any abortions past the 22nd week of pregnancy.

Attorney General Paul Morrison previously reviewed all of the allegations upon which Kline's criminal charges are based and found no wrongdoing, Morrison spokeswoman Ashley Anstaett said.

"We are skeptical that these charges have any merit, and we continue to wonder how much politics influenced Mr. Kline's decision to file these charges," Anstaett said.

Planned Parenthood, Kline and Morrison are embroiled in another lawsuit pending before the Kansas Supreme Court. Planned Parenthood sued Kline, and Morrison later successfully intervened on the state's behalf.

Documents in that case remain sealed as well, and neither Kline nor Planned Parenthood have discussed it, but Morrison warned Planned Parenthood's attorneys in June that Kline appeared to still have access to copies of patient records he had obtained as attorney general. Morrison said those records were forwarded from the attorney general's office to the district attorney's office a few days before Kline left the attorney general's office.

As attorney general, Kline fought for two years to get abortion records from the Overland Park clinic and a Wichita clinic operated by Dr. George Tiller. He said he was investigating whether clinic doctors performed illegal abortions and failed to report suspected child abuse; the clinics alleged he was on a "fishing expedition."

Portions of the sealed documents were leaked to Fox News commentator Bill O'Reilly, who discussed them in a segment where he interviewed Kline days before Kline lost his re-election bid in November. Kline has denied being the source of the leak.

Kline filed charges against Tiller in December, while he was still attorney general, but a judge threw out the case, saying Kline didn't have the jurisdiction to file it.

In June, Morrison filed charges against Tiller that Morrison described as technical violations. Morrison said he found no wrongdoing at the Planned Parenthood clinic.

Morrison, an abortion-rights supporter, was a Republican serving as Johnson County district attorney when he became a Democrat to challenge Kline, a Republican, for the attorney general job. After Morrison won, local GOP activists picked Kline to take Morrison's old job.

Associated Press writer John Hanna in Topeka, Kan., contributed to this report.

Please go to www.operationrescue.org and read the thread concerning PP. There seems to be the issue of concealment of statutory rape which PP is required by law to report.

Please go to www.operationrescue.org and read the thread concerning PP. There seems to be the issue of concealment of statutory rape which PP is required by law to report.

Posted by: Mary at October 17, 2007 6:36 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yeah, but once again, Operation Rescue doesn't have any cases of statutory rape to report. All they have are tapes of people with too much time on their hands making prank phone calls.

"Documents in that case remain sealed as well, and neither Kline nor Planned Parenthood have discussed it, but Morrison warned Planned Parenthood's attorneys in June that Kline appeared to still have access to copies of patient records he had obtained as attorney general. Morrison said those records were forwarded from the attorney general's office to the district attorney's office a few days before Kline left the attorney general's office."

Posted by: Laura at October 17, 2007 6:20 PM

Whoa.....regardless of which side you're on regarding abortion, that sounds like a major violation of attorney ethics rules. I don't understand how he hasn't been disbarred, sanctioned, penalized, or SOMETHING for violating confidentiality rules like that. That guy clearly should not be a practicing attorney.

"All they have are tapes of people with too much time on their hands making prank phone calls."

Posted by: Laura at October 17, 2007 7:07
----------------------------------------------

Source???

Also interesting that wherever a PP opens up the abortion rates go up in that area.

Posted by: Sandy at October 17, 2007 6:02 PM

Um, not to point out the obvious, but if an area that previously had no abortion provider suddenly gets an abortion provider, wouldn't that naturally mean a rise in abortion rates for that area? Since, you know, there are now abortions being performed in that area? Again, you're confusing cause and effect. Women who desired abortions would have gone elsewhere before.

Just throwing this out there. Shouldn't all this information, access to medical exams, contraception, and treatment be making at least a huge dent in the spread of STDs and the number of unwanted pregnancies? I would think these problems would markedly decrease everywhere a PP clinic pops up.

Posted by: Mary at October 17, 2007 5:08 PM

I don't know about STI rates, but from what I recall, haven't teen pregnancies declined? And haven't abortion rates been declining (in the U.S. anyway) slowly year after year?

Sorry, but that 98% birth control statistic is such an old lie. I have yet to see any actual evidence for such a thing.

Carol -

As I have pointed out on numerous occasions - even on this thread - the US still has one of the highest rates on teen pregnancies in the developed countries even after a slight decline.

And abortions rates have been declining since 1995 according to the CDC. However, this may have something to do with the fact that California stopped reporting their abortion statistics to them. You can find that information at the beginning of all of their MMWR documents involving abortion. And the Guttmatcher institute reports that California is responsible for approx. 17% of abortions in the US. If you look at the Guttmatcher numbers on abortion, you will see that the numbers have not gone down. You see, reporting to the CDC is voluntary, there are no laws stating a state has to report these things. The Guttmatcher institute gathers information from state health departs every other year or so to come up with their numbers. But then again - those number are voluntary as well. There are no checks and balances when dealing with abortion statistics. Once again, all this information is listed on both the Guttmatcher website and on the CDC's MMWR's.

Also, I noted earlier on this thread that STI's have been rapidly increasing every year. According to Guttmatcher there has been an increase of about 1 million new STI's being reported every year. In 2002 there were approx 15 million new cases reported. In 2006 there were 18.9 million new cases reported. This is a significant increase.

Carol -

"Whoa.....regardless of which side you're on regarding abortion, that sounds like a major violation of attorney ethics rules. I don't understand how he hasn't been disbarred, sanctioned, penalized, or SOMETHING for violating confidentiality rules like that. That guy clearly should not be a practicing attorney."

I thought the same thing when I first heard this back in July. From what I understand state jurisdictions get referrals from the attorney generals office all of the time. None of the records had personal information on it. No names, phone numbers, address' etc. so there wasn't any confidentiality violations involved. What he did was perfectly legal. However, even though I am on Klines side, it is a bit unnerving isn't it?

Carol and Valerie,

In 1997 the CDC reported that half of all women having abortions had one previous abortion and 52% had had 2 or more previous abortions. How can this, and the high number of STDs be possible with more education, better medical care, and more easily available contraception?

Valerie, excellent posts.

Anonymous,

How can you be so certain these women would have gone elsewhere for abortions? Also,if abortion wasn't so available, would they have been more careful about preventing an unwanted pregnancy?

Valerie:

Has it occured to you to read the rest of the Guttmacher report? It goes on to say:

1. The reason teen pregnancies are higher in the US than other developed countries, esp. Western European ones, is that they have a much more realistic and enlightened attitude towards teen sex and sex in general. In Europre, sex is natural, teens will experiment - so teens are encouraged to be responsible by using reliable birth control - most European teens use a method similar to Norplant.
As long as some Americans (look in mirror, here, many PL's) continue to think that shame and blame, guilt and abstinence ed are appropriate responses to teen sex, then we will have higher preg rates - thus higher abortion rates.

and simle logic and a bit of medical journal reading will get you to:
2. STI rates: Better early detection (people used to die from syphilis because it wasn't detected until too late), better education about STI's (thanks in part to PP practitioners who actually ask the right questions and educate teens and others about STI detection and prevention and other sex ed prorams which do same) and better access to clinics like PP, yes, the rate of STI's REPORTED has increased.

3. There are also more teens due to population increase so we need not just numbers, but rates. The population increase is mostly due to immigration legal and illegal, and in some cases if poorer and illegal, this may be first chance at health care.

4. Abortion #'s seem to have remained steady, though the rate has dropped.

For citations, #4 is from the American Journal of Nursing - May 1966 - Septic abortion Crisis Care

While you are looking things up try "correlation" versus "causation." It's a very important disctinction.

Um, not to point out the obvious, but if an area that previously had no abortion provider suddenly gets an abortion provider, wouldn't that naturally mean a rise in abortion rates for that area? Since, you know, there are now abortions being performed in that area? Again, you're confusing cause and effect. Women who desired abortions would have gone elsewhere before.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 17, 2007 7:20 PM

Ummmm. No. The abortion rate went up for PP only when they opened their feeder clinics. They garnered almost 100% of 700 additional abortions performed in a single year in a metro area. No other clinics "benefited" from their referral system.

It's like a crack cocaine dealer coming into a school yard. They introduce the drug to kids, the kids try it, like it and buy more. Would the kids have tried drugs if the crack cocaine dealer wasn't soliciting them in the school yard??

I think not.

valerie:

Take a closer look at those AGI statistics. (http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html)

"Forty-six percent of women having abortions did not use a contraceptive method during the month they became pregnant. ... About half of unintended pregnancies occur among the 11% of women at risk of unintended pregnancy who did not use contraceptives in the month they became pregnant."

That's an awfully small segment of women to be producing half the country's abortions. Clearly, the 89% of women who use contraception are at a much smaller risk of abortion than the 11% who don't.

Jill:

No matter how you want to spin those abortion numbers...

3% of total services provided

8% of total clients

25% of pregnancy test clients (NOT 1 in 3)

...it's still only a small part of what Planned Parenthood does.

Murdering teenage boys was only a small percentage of what John Wayne Gacy did too.

Tossing Jews in furnaces was only a small part of what the Nazis did.

Just the pie chart in itself is significant for those with eyes to see...if you knew that an actual pie contained only 3% arsenic, feces, or some other foul, pernicious substance, would you eat it, or feed it to anyone you cared about?

I don't think so...

Why does PP emphasize that only 3% of the services it provides are abortions? If there's nothing wrong with abortion, and the American people either wholehheartedly support it or are totally indifferent, depending on who you talk to, then what does it matter if its 3% or 50%?

Murdering teenage boys was only a small percentage of what John Wayne Gacy did too.

Posted by: mk at October 18, 2007 9:05 AM

Molesting children is only a small percentage of what Catholic priests do. Should we close Catholic churches?

Oh Esther,
You're so witty! What would a thread around here be without the redirection of the conversation to pedophile priests instead of actual discussion of the topic?

Hi Esther.

"Molesting children is only a small percentage of what Catholic priests do. Should we close Catholic churches?"

Here is the difference. Part of the "services" that PP offers is abortion. The CC does not offer a child molestation service. Those priests who molested boys were not asked by the CC to do so, nor does the CC approve of it. Authentic Christianity condemns the act of child molestation. PP condones and encourages the performing of abortion. It would be a different story if these abortions were going on behind Planned Parenthood's back and they were speaking out against it. Unfortunately this is not the case. God love you, Esther.

Hi Esther.

"Molesting children is only a small percentage of what Catholic priests do. Should we close Catholic churches?"

Here is the difference. Part of the "services" that PP offers is abortion. The CC does not offer a child molestation service. Those priests who molested boys were not asked by the CC to do so, nor does the CC approve of it. Authentic Christianity condemns the act of child molestation. PP condones and encourages the performing of abortion. It would be a different story if these abortions were going on behind Planned Parenthood's back and they were speaking out against it. Unfortunately this is not the case. God love you, Esther.

Posted by: Bobby Bambino at October 18, 2007 2:37 PM

Nope. Using your logic, all Catholic churches should be closed. God love you, Bobby.

"Nope. Using your logic, all Catholic churches should be closed."

Could you take me through my argument and show me this? I can't quite see it.

MK and Bobby Bambino,

Actually, the examples you give of "rationalizations" in your posts of 9:05am and 9:12am are not so far fetched.
When the members of the Manson "family" were on trial for what can only be described as the bloodthirsty slaughter of the 8 month pregnant actress Sharon Tate and her friends, a defense lawyer for one the accused argued his client should not be judged by actions that involved such a minuscule portion of her life, a couple hours one night, but rather by the more positive aspects of most her life otherwise.
Not surprisingly, the jury didn't quite see it from that perspective and sentenced her and her cohorts to death, which was later commuted to life imprisonment.

"My heart was really hurting," said Revina, who said a technologist would not let her look at the ultrasound screen during her $179 examination. "They said it was a clot of blood.... When I reached for the screen, she pushed the escape button and pushed my hand away."

So much for this woman's choice to see her baby.
Any comments pro-choicers? Anyone??

Just go ahead bury your head and keep supporting these lies.

Sandy- if credible, that behavior is unacceptable. Personally, I had no problem with this. My technician asked if I would like to see the ultrasound, I said I would, and she showed me. No problem.

Erin,
What do you mean "if credible" why is it that everytime anyone brings anything to the table on this issue you question it like someone was just making it up.

Did you see a beating heart on your ultrasound?
If, so how did you feel about that?

Have you ever read Lime 5 or Blood Money? I suppose you would just think these two books are all fallacy as well.

Nope. Using your logic, all Catholic churches should be closed."

Could you take me through my argument and show me this? I can't quite see it.

Posted by: Bobby Bambino at October 18, 2007 2:52 PM

Of course you don't see it. God love you, Bobby.

So please show me. Enlighten me. I'm open and willing to learn. If you can show me, I'll believe you. God love you, Esther.

I think that the picture of Gerri Santoro is fake.

Heather,

Fake or not, I think this woman should be treated with considerably more respect and not cruelly exploited. She is dead, let her rest in peace. This isn't the way I would want the world to see me or any woman dear to me.

Mary, actually, I believe it's real. I just couldn't resist a little "tit for tat." According to them, all of our pictures are fake. I agree. Leave that woman alone!

Heather,

Good point. Has the authenticity of this picture ever been called in question?

Sorry,

I meant to say into question.