Well...Fred appears to be fairly consistently championing a federalist point of view. I thought that was what conservatives wanted?

eh, well, despite the hype I didn't think he had too much of a chance to begin with. He hasn't been too articulate from the beginning, and its been kind of unsure as to where he stands on various issues.

Fred Thompson is too old and sick to be President.

I think the GOP will nominate Romney. Romney/Huckabee. Hillary will beat them by winning Ohio.

For Dem VP I like Wesley Clark. Clinton/Clark.

The problem with Thompson, and Clinton is that they have not been executives in government. Thompson was a senator and Clinton has served almost one term as a senator. These are not executive positions. President of the US is a big job. A candidate such a democrat Richardson or republicans Romney or Huckabee have all successfully run a state government with a democrat legislature. Pres of the US is just too big a job for inexperienced folks like Thompson or Clinton.

Thompson was a senator and Clinton has served almost one term as a senator.

Posted by: hippie at November 6, 2007 7:02 AM

Actually, Clinton was re-elected in 2006 and is in the beginning of her second term. Maybe you're thinking of Obama?

Hippie,

Excellent points.
Also, the only thing Hillary has is the name Clinton. Without it she would have been as likely to be elected a senator from New York as I would have been.
It doesn't hurt that the MSM supports her and she can always fall back on her womanhood/ victimhood when the going gets rough. Also it is great to have Bill to go running to when she needs help. Look how the media reported the last debate, the men supposedly ganged up on her. Puh-leeze. So what if they did? They aren't supposed to pick on a girl? Fie on Russert for asking about licenses for illegal immigrants. How dare he ask such "trick" questions, especially when Hillary doesnt' expect them. Can you imagine true women leaders such as Margaret Thatcher and Benazir Bhutto resorting to this victimhood tactic or running to some man to help them out? I understand that even Kate Michelman, former president of NARAL, has been so put off by Clinton's victimhood tactic that she has given her support to John Edwards.
Fred Thompson doesn't impress me much either.

Actually, Clinton was re-elected in 2006 and is in the beginning of her second term. Maybe you're thinking of Obama?

Posted by: Carol at November 6, 2007 7:26 AM

Thank you for pointing that out. I lost track since I don't live in New York.

I've been interested in her since the pundits started forecasting her run for the presidency. I don't think she'd be a bad president at all actually. Her policies seem to track fairly consistently with her husband's, and with the exception of the scandals, Clinton's presidency was a good one.

I imagine that either Clinton or Obama will pick up the nomination. I also think that whichever one picks up the nomination will tap the other for their running mate, although I've got no reason to think that other than a feeling.

Finally, my lateset e-mail from Planned Parenthood.................................................

VOTE YES!
FOR PROPOSITION 15
Tuesday, November 6 is Election Day

Planned Parenthood believes that love is most beautiful thing in the world. There are many ways to show your love. We think one of the best ways is to take good care of yourself. That is why Planned Parenthood has been providing early detection cancer screenings for years, providing both breast exams and pap smears to our clients. In a typical year we provide 1,400 treatments for women with cervical cancer/dysplasia in our service area.

We understand how devastating the effects of cancer are to this state and we are proud to provide early detection, screenings and treatment. Proposition 15 authorizes $3 billion in general obligation bonds to create the Cancer Prevention and Research Institute in Texas . Cancer has taken its toll on Texans: 85,000 Texans are diagnosed with cancer and 35,000 Texans die from cancer each year. We have an opportunity to fight back and, hopefully, once and for all end cancer. Please be a part of this movement.

Yes on Proposition 15!

...........................VOTE NO>

Fr. Pavone describes himself as the priest who likes to cause trouble. I love that man.

Have a look at the babies/children he's saved from the tubes and that he's had the opportunity to baptize.

My hero.

Father Pavone is a hero.

Carol,

Her health care plan, which I now understand was really Bill's, was a failure.
She hired private detectives to intimidate women who accused her husband of everything from adultery to sexaul assault into silence.
What leadership qualities does she display?
I mean, she can't even handle an unexpected question, giving two different answers in two minutes, as John Edwards or Barack Obama, pointed out, you know when they "ganged up" on her. I have heard that Obama is now speaking out against Hillary's "victimhood" tactic, a tactic true leaders cannot fall back on. A tactic, by the way, employed by Bill during the Lewinsky scandal.
Carol, you are considerably more optimistic than me.

Yes on Proposition 15!

...........................VOTE NO>

Posted by: heather at November 6, 2007 8:00 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

You want people to vote NO on a proposition that would provide $3 billion for cancer prevention and research?
Do that thing where you call yourself a "medical professional" again...

Heather,

Since the bonds constitute debt, Texas taxpayers will have to spend pay $4.1 billion to spend $3 billion for the research and prevention.

The big winners are the investors who will collect the $1.1 billion difference.

Spending needs to come from the budget, not bond issues.

Anything Planned Parenthood has to say is a lie. They are contributing to causing breast cancer. Look at that cheesy opening line. They are all about love? Who do they love? They don't love children. That's a given. They don't love women. Who does that leave?

Laura, Laura, Laura,

You want people to vote NO on a proposition that would provide $3 billion for cancer prevention and research?

I don't think she means say no to cancer research. She means say no to Planned Parenthood. Ask me for three million dollars for cancer research that planned parenthood isn't involved with, and I'd vote yes...

You're such a nut!

MK, that's exactly what I meant.

The truth is not even $3 billion will go to research and prevention. There will be start up costs, and staff, paper pushing bureaucracy etc. Then they will dole out the money, what is left of it, for projects that really could be supported now through the many medical research institutions already in Texas such as in the many universities.

Much of the money will be lost to well, um, the well connected.

And most disturbing, likely none of the money will go to treatment of those actually suffering from cancer who have little access to healthcare services.

Ask me for three million dollars for cancer research that planned parenthood isn't involved with, and I'd vote yes...

You're such a nut!

Posted by: mk at November 6, 2007 8:33 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Cancer research funds are cancer research funds.

I gave money to a cancer research fundraiser headed by Laura Bush even though I regard her as a 21st-century Eva Braun.

Laura,

I gave money to a cancer research fundraiser headed by Laura Bush even though I regard her as a 21st-century Eva Braun.

Weren't you all up in arms because Mother Teresa took money from some mafia guy? Don't the same rules apply to her as you?

Mk,

Ask me for three million dollars for cancer research that planned parenthood isn't involved with, and I'd vote yes...

You're such a nut!

Posted by: mk at November 6, 2007 8:33 AM

It is not $3 million,

it is $3 billion,

I mean $4.1 billion.

Even Joe Leiberman, ultra-liberal, recognized that we give food and water to disabled people.

Thompson has never had my endorsement for this very reason.

$4.1 billion means about $200 per person.

That is a big tax that guarantees no service to anyone.

Weren't you all up in arms because Mother Teresa took money from some mafia guy? Don't the same rules apply to her as you?

Posted by: mk at November 6, 2007 8:52 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

That wasn't me.

hippie, that's correct. I just can't see giving one penny to Planned Parenthood. They seem to want all of this credit. I'm also willing to bet that this money will just go toward more abortion services.

Planned Parenthood needs $$ to pay for all of these lawsuits that were won against them.

Jacqueline,

I may not agree with Joe Lieberman on many issues, but I greatly admire the man as a true statesman.

Laura,

That wasn't me.,/i>

Well, all righty, then...

Okay guys,

I am sorry I was wrong, the $3 billion in bonds will cost $4.6 billion not $4.1 billion.

Would you buy a $3000 used car on your credit card at high interest so you could pay $4600 for it?

If Texas wants to spend $460million more per year for cancer research, they can just give it to the research facilities that already exist in Texas instead of wasting so much on interest payments on bonds.

Prop 15 is a constitutional amendment to create a new bureaucracy. It is not just a one time expenditure.

Would you buy a $3000 used car on your credit card at high interest so you could pay $4600 for it?

Hippie, I agree that issuing paper to pay for stuff is bad.

On the used car, though, people do that all the time, though perhaps not on a credit card.

For an auto loan, $3000 borrowed at 10 2/3% interest for five years makes the total repayment $4600.

Doug

Question of the day:

Financing (Credit):

Exploitation of Poor People Who Have No Other Means With Which To Buy?

or

Tax on Stupid People That Don't Know Math?

Discuss.

Doug,

you wrote

"On the used car, though, people do that all the time, though perhaps not on a credit card.

For an auto loan, $3000 borrowed at 10 2/3% interest for five years makes the total repayment $4600."

Doug

Posted by: Doug at November 6, 2007 2:36 PM

The question is would YOU do that? Should educated folks like state legislators do it?

If you want to spend $400 million or $300 million a year or whatever you can get the legislature to approve, fine. At least the money will go to the project.

This bond issue guarantees the 34 cents of every dollar will go to investors and not to the project the voters approved.

Okay, sorry, I have to get this off my chest.

What is the point of teaching (educating) people if they can't use the info to make rational choices when the time comes?

This is like 5th grade math!

I think of all the people who say people need access to education, looks like the education doesn't make much difference if state legislators can't come up with a better way to use tax money than to enrich investors.

I can't tell you how much time I used in my English classes emphasizing to the students the value of Math. I told my ESL kids who went to school all day and worked all evening, If you only have time to do homework for one class, do your math homework!

Innumeracy is at least as dangerous to democracy as illiteracy.

Okay, sorry, I just had to say that. I feel better now.

Thanx for your patience.

The question is would YOU do that? Should educated folks like state legislators do it?

:: laughing :: Hippie, for me that would be an exceedingly large HECK NO. Yet many state legislators are already doing that kind of thing in spades.
......

If you want to spend $400 million or $300 million a year or whatever you can get the legislature to approve, fine. At least the money will go to the project.

That'd just be that much more money the gov't had to borrow, no?

This bond issue guarantees the 34 cents of every dollar will go to investors and not to the project the voters approved.

I'd say most of the $3 billion would go to the project, and of course the interest goes to the investors. It's borrowed money, and lenders are gonna want some compensation - especially in these days of debts being repaid with much cheaper Dollars. It's not a good thing, but deficit financing is much more the rule than the exception for gov'ts in the US these days.

Doug

Hippie: Innumeracy

Hoo-Aah! Rockin' word there, Hippie.

OMG Father Pavone. I NEED to rant.

The Terri Schiavo case was when I officially rejected the pro-life movement. Abortion has always had a certain distance to me, as I knew it was unlikely a choice I would ever have to make (although there is still the issue of wanted pregnancy threatening my health or life...but I digress). I always thought, yeah abortion is bad, lets find a way to have less of them. But almost EVERYONE will have to face end of life issues; both my parents had to make the descion to discontinue feeding tubes when my grandfathers died, and I anticipate that someday I'll have to make choices about my parents, spouse, child, and someone I love will have to make a wrenching choice about me. These choices are incredibly complicated and personal. Niether the government nor creeps like Father Pavone has any business getting involved.

I felt so sorry for Michael Schiavo. If I was in Terri's state, I would totally want my husband to let me go to God, and move on with his own life. I've told him that. It would be totally unsurpising if Terri told him that. I know my parents respect me enough to honor my wishes and his. They would never parade me for their own glorification and petty agenda and need for control like the Schindlers. That father was a controlling jerk and the mother was a blithering idiot and it was as plain as day to all of the normal people out here in regular America who don't surrender our minds and souls to "leaders" like Pavone who manipulate people like sheep for an agenda. I'm sorry what happened to their daughter but when you parade your child like that for the whole world and ignore her wishes to get back at her husband you lose my friggin' sympathy. And they are still milking it as pro-life spokespeople. My parents would NEVER EVER do that to me. At least Terri got to chose her husband; she was born to those awful parents.

Medical science proved afterward that Terri did not suffer; her brain was so withered that she had no capacity to even know she was dying. She was also completely blind, which sort of discredits all of the "follow the bouncing balloon" crap and photos of her sweetly gazing at her mother as evidence of her conciousness. Of course "ProLife" people will come up with some way to say "BUT SCIENCE IS LYING AND IS A CONSPIRACY AGAINST US!", because ProLifers are never big on facts they don't like when their emotions are invested. You know, Abortion causes Breast Cancer, the Pill is an abortifacient, NFP couples have low divorce rates, yada yada. Lies. Lies. Lies. But they are useful to an agenda so if God himself came back and told ProLifers they were full of crap they still wouldn't believe it, because Truth is sacrificed to the Agenda.

If Father Pavone or his ilk EVER tried to interfere with my family life, I would ... I don't know what I would do but it probably would land me in jail. That man is an asshole, a liar, a propagandist, a user and manipulater of weak and stupid people, and people like him actually having a say in any way in my life or death or family scares the crap out of me and keeps me VERY active against the official pro-life movement. The only good thing that probably came of the whole Terri Schiavo tragedy was that America got to be horrified by the extremism and dishonesty of the "ProLife" and the movement to usurp our own medical choices.

ARRRGH!

Yeah, Father Pavone is the MAN!

DrunkenFlicka,

Don't be so certain about what Terri's mental function was based on the appearance of her brain.
People have been found to function normally with minimal to no brain tissue, and science has been at a loss to explain how. Were you to look at these brains in a science lab or autopsy chamber, you would say they were totally incompatible with life, much less normal function. A recent case was discovered in France, where only a skull full of fluid could be found in an otherwise normally functioning man.
Its entirely possible Terri had more brain function, including sight, than her autopsy would indicate.
Ever hear of savants? How exactly does one explain them? Withdrawn, unresponsive, apparently retarded people who are playing piano concertos, solving complex math problems, and correlating dates and days going back centuries.
The more we learn about the brain the less we know.

Jaqueline,
Care to sober up DrunkenFlicka?

DrunkenFlicka,

While you have the right to rant, I hope it may sink in that Fr. Pavone continues to pray for folks like you. And me.

"NFP couples have low divorce rates, yada yada. Lies. Lies. Lies."

Since you went there, care to show how that is false?

Urgh...I think DrunkenFlicka will wake the sleeping dragon that is Jacquie....

May there be some form of mercy when she gets to you, DF. She's brutal. I wouldn't mess with her, ever. *cowers behind her desk to escape the wrath of the Completely Catholic Texas Tyrannosaurus of Pro-life Pain*

I've never really had an opinion of the Terri Schiavo case. I really wondered why Michael just wouldn't allow Terri's parents to just take care of her so that he could move on with his life (I mean, if he really wanted to leave her, he could've divorced her, right?). Alas, I was never informed enough on the topic to really make a judgment. I don't see why she had to die if she truly wasn't responsive (if you can't comprehend suffering, how can you suffer?). If food and water was all she needed to survive, well then, I can't see denying that to her, especially when her parents were willing to continue that care. Urgh, so tough, but not my place to make the decision.

Well, All I will say is that I don't want to be kept alive in a PVS. Not ever. I don't want a G-tube. I want hospice care at the end of my life. I hope that my wishes will be respected.

DrunkenFlicka you are so sad. I'll pray for you.

On the NFP statistic:

Couple to couple league took a survey of the divorce rates of people who work for them. They found a 1% divorce rate. They "assumed" that in the general population that it could not be more than double that, so they came up with the widely circulated statistic that NFP couples have a 2% divorce rate. It was literally pulled out of their ass. Even reputable, conservative Catholic publications like Crisis Mag have admitted that statistic is unreliable (they also did a report on divorce among conservative Catholics a while ago, and although there is no statistic, there is plenty of anecdotal stories of marital discord among NFP couples). My own experience with Conservative Catholic Couples is equally mixed.

Go ahead, pray for me. I pray all of the time. I just want you people to stay away from my family and our medical choices. I will die in a ditch to keep you from having anything to do with making laws that affect me and the people I love. I grew up in a tightly knit and loving family. I don;t need manipulative and exploitive charlatans like Pavone interfering in our lives.

honestly, I think both sides of the Schiavo case were motivated by control and mutual hatred. Michael may have been motivated by that to keep her away from her parents. Or perhaps he genuinely wanted to respect her wishes because he loved her.

Bottom line, it was none of our business. And her parents and Frank Pavone were hideous people to exploit her for the public like that.

Heather,

Make a living will and be very specific. If you have concerns where your pro-life convictions are concerned, you can contact the National Right to Life Committee for a copy of a living will.

Lyssie, 11:31pm

Excellent point. I also wondered why Michael just didn't let her parents have her. What would he care? He already had another woman and two children with her. I don't blame the guy for going on with his life, but just divorce Terri and let her family have her.
I must agree with DF on the power play but I saw it more on his part, since he did have the above mentioned option.
I just can't understant how he could otherwise watch her parents beg for her and not be the least bit moved. Let's just say that those who would argue he did this out of devotion to Terri are of a far more charitable nature than I am.

Jacque is too tired to deal with Lush Horses.

Anyone who thinks it's okay to starve and dehydrate a disabled human being for 14 days and takes sympathy on the man that did so is beyond help.

But I will point out the obvious: Trying to save your daughter/sister from a horrific 2 week death is not motivated by control or mutual hatred. It's motivated by love and concern for your daughter/sister.

And I will be 110% honest with you: I do HATE Michael Schiavo. I would gladly immobilize him in a small room for a dozen years, deny him trips outside, limit the people that could visit, take down pictures of beloved family, deny him antibiotics, let him develop bedsores, not clean his teeth, and ultimately, deny him food and water until he died a slow, agonizing, horrific death.

Anything less would be unjust.

Make a living will and be very specific.

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo! Living Wills are a deathwish that binds your family's hands. I will write a guest post for Jill on why you should absolutely NEVER complete a living will.

Get a durable power of attorney and sign over your care to someone you trust.

Jacqueline,

Good point. That's what I've done. NRLC though does have living wills for prolifers, though I have never seen one.

Mary,

Awesome! The will to live (what the NRLC calls their doc) and the Living will are different. THe Living Will has a generable presumption towards death and the Will to Live has a general presumption towards life.

The best thing to do is sign a Will to Live with NO INSTRUCTIONS so that your proxy isn't bound.

Sober Flicka,

"...although there is no statistic, there is plenty of anecdotal stories of marital discord among NFP couples)."

I agree with you, there is PLENTY of marital discord in NFP couples. I know of three personally who are in the fight for their lives against the devastating effects of pornography.

But the issue is not the marital discord; that's inevitable regardless of religion or contraception. We're talking about divorce among NFP couples. I'm familiar with the CCL observation. I'll need to look up some more on that.

But in the meantime, let's be clear that NFP is NOT a guarantee of happily ever after. On the contrary, it calls for self-sacrifice that is put into practice on a daily basis. What is utilized at one level, (physical), naturally permeates to other levels (emotional, spiritual, etc.)

I'd be hard-pressed to find someone who'll come up and say, "Use NFP and you're going to be divorce-free!" I'd ask them how did they arrive at that delusion. In my own experience, when all other doors have been shut in our "marriage house", NFP has been like the little window slightly cracked open for allowing Grace to flow through.

Peace.

Mary, thank you. Actually, I do have a living will. My father wanted to die on hospice. We honored his wishes {terminal cancer] He expired at home in his own bed. I'd like the same for myself. I don't want anyone performing a code on me when I hit 100. No way!

I do HATE Michael Schiavo.
************
What a disgusting post -

What a disgusting post

You certainly have the market on those!

I don't want anyone performing a code on me when I hit 100. No way!

Posted by: heather at November 7, 2007 11:02 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"performing a code?"

Laura, CPR. I want to be a DNR. Look it up. It's "medical talk."