And to the state court it'll go.

I dont know how well itll do, if its a matter of the equivalent of the statute of limitations running out, nothing can be changed.

Though I will have to agree if PP did do wrong here, as has been suggested, it appears they very well could get away with it.

The Aurora Zoning Board of Appeals voted unanimously to dismiss our side's appeal.

You mean they didn't vote to shut the clinic down? Heavens, what a shock.

"Though I will have to agree if PP did do wrong here, as has been suggested, it appears they very well could get away with it."

only on this earth they will get away with it. they will stand before God one day and be judged for their evil works.

Is anyone surprised?

Somg. It's too late for you. I think you have been turned over to a reprobate mind. Sad. You just don't understand what's right or wrong any longer. Maybe you never have. The devil owns you, and he works through you. You will meet your death one day. May God save your soul before it's too late. Eternity is a mighty long time to be tortured. You'll burn one day, and nobody will be able to help you then.

No SoMG, I wasn't. The masters of deception will lie through their teeth.

Face it. Somg, if you are really so PC, why aren't you on Pandagon agreeing with the rest of the nut cases? You come here instead, yet you will never chance a pro lifer's mind. Huh! Why bother? What are you hoping to gain? *perplexed look on face* Perhaps you really do want your soul to be saved.[[?????]]

sorry *change* above post

Wow, Heather. Those are some pretty strong convictions. Did God give you the authority to make those judgment calls?

You'd be wise not to speak for Him, I believe.

Leah, when it comes to a being like that, I am confident in saying such things.

Your problem is with Jesus Leah, not Heather.

SoMG,
I'm not that surprised. Disappointed, yes. Loss of faith in the city government? yes. ....In Aurora, it's the blind leading the blind. I never did think it would get far as long as it was heard within the walls of a building located in Aurora. The state court will sort it out!

Leah,

Heather cares enough about his soul to warn him
about his eternal destiny.

I doubt even his "friends" care that much.

lesforlife and AB, thanks for your support. Somg, where are your "friends?" Did they all work for the abortion industry like you did? I feel that you are a lonesome soul.

I have no problem with Jesus, Jasper. It's very rude and presumptuous of you to say so.

That did not sound like a friendly warning to me, dears. More of a self-righteous declaration of so-called moral superiority. But then, I don't want to sink to the level of unfounded and presumptuous accusations, so I'll give Heather the (admittedly skeptical) benefit of the doubt.

I attended and was not too surprised that the Board of Appeals backed out on this. That was never going to be the last venue for this case.
Going to State Court and taking this out of the local officials hands is a good thing. There matters of law will be decided, not petty little administrative points --- real professionals will be involved, not retirees taking on a civic duty.
I'm still confident in the final outcome, especially because real discover of documents and depositions will be taken. Overall, there are many problems with the method that PP used to get this building built and those will be fully explored in the courts.
So, while this is somewhat dissapointing, the battle is only begun on this front. I'm confident in our counsel and the parties involved on the property owners side will not be losing interest.

This is interesting: Even though the INTRADE odds have shifted in favor of Obama winning the nomination instead of Hillary, OHIO.DEM.2008 remains high. That means INTRADE is consistently predicting the Dems will win Ohio, no matter whether they nominate Clinton or Obama.

Without Ohio, the Republicans cannot win the presidency.

Clinton and Obama are both co-sponsors of the Freedom of Choice Act.

SoMG --

Counting on winning Ohio seems to have been a problem for the Dems lately, if I recall.

Somg, why can't you answer me?

I live in Ohio.

I'm sorry Heather, what was the question again?

Did anyone see Hill-Billy crying on T.V. today? I was laughing.

Do you have any friends?

That isn't cruel... or something...

"But then, I don't want to sink to the level of unfounded and presumptuous accusations"

They're not unfounded, we are warning SoMG not to participate in abortions. If we didn't care about him, we would say nothing.

Leah, is abortion cruel?

jasper, right. Just like his pro choice "friends" who really care about him.

Nope.

I was laughing at Hitlary, because her crying was so fake. Crocodile tears.

Yep.

Description of the D&X Procedure:
These are generally called:

"D&X" procedures, an abbreviation of "dilate and extract," or
"Intact D&E," or
"Intrauterine Cranial Decompression" procedures.

They are not abortions as defined within medical science. The formal medical definition of the term "abortion" means the termination of pregnancy before the fetus is viable. However, it does fall within the definition of "abortion" which is used by most of the public.

The term "Partial Birth Abortion" was recently created by pro-life groups when the procedure became actively discussed at a political and religious level. We will generally use the medical terms in this section.

The procedure is usually performed during the fifth month of gestation or later. The woman's cervix is dilated, and the fetus is partially removed from the womb, feet first. The surgeon inserts a sharp object into the back of the fetus' head, removes it, and inserts a vacuum tube through which the brains are extracted. The head of the fetus contracts at this point and allows the fetus to be more easily removed from the womb.

The exact number of D&Xs performed is impossible to estimate with accuracy. Many states do not have strict reporting regulations.

One often quoted figure was that over 1000 D&Xs had been performed annually in New Jersey. From this number, many inflated national totals were estimated. But the New Jersey figure appears to be an anomaly. A single physician in a single NJ hospital had been ignoring the regulations of the state medical association and performing D&Xs in cases not involving the potential death or serious disability of the woman.
Ron Fitzsimmons, executive director of the National Coalition of Abortion Providers, estimated (Nightline program, 1997-FEB-26) a total of 3,000 to 4,000 annually in the US -- about ten a day.
Pro-life groups uncovered an internal memo by Planned Parenthood which estimated that up to 60 (0.24%) of the more than 25,000 abortions performed annually in Virginia were D&Xs. 1 If this figure is accurate nationally, then there would be up to 2,880 D&X procedures per year in the U.S.
Referring to a Virginia state law, Bennet Greenberg, executive director of Planned Parenthood Advocates of Virginia said: "I'm not aware of a need for this bill in the first place, since this procedure is very, very rare, and I'm not aware it's ever been used [in Virginia]." 4

Sponsored

See Heather, after all the pictures, videos, etc of abortions, Leah still doesn't think abortions are cruel. Even the some of the most rabidly pro-aborts think it is cruel, but not Leah, she must have a heart made out of stone.

This IS cruel!!

Sad, yet not shocking.

I'm moving to Denver.

Most women seem to be duped into believing that it's in the best interest of a woman's health. Abortion is not health care.

heather:

Abortion is not health care.

Tell it to all the women who've survived a tubal pregnancy thanks to timely and safe abortion.

reality, ectopic pregnancy is an exception to the rule. The tube will rupture, and the woman may die.

Definition

An ectopic pregnancy is an abnormal pregnancy that occurs outside the uterus (womb). The baby cannot survive.

Jasper, do me a big favor and grow up. You don't know me. You know nothing about my heart. Pro-choicers believe that abortion is an unfortunate necessity, but not cruel.

I'm off. Knitting a scarf is much more harmless and satisfying than engaging in such discussion.

Off to Canada in 9 days!

I love each and every one of you with all my heart,

I heard (& I LOVE IT! Hitlary!!!) her choking up on the radio today. I gotta admit, I did LOL....the drivers next to me must have thought I was nuts!!! OH, if they only knew....

Anyway, thanks Heather for bringing it up... it brought yet another smile to my face today!!!

Treatment

Ectopic pregnancies cannot continue to term (birth), so the developing cells must be removed to save the mother's life.

Emergency medical help is needed if the area of the ectopic pregnancy ruptured. Rupture can lead to shock, an emergency condition. Treatment for shock may include keeping the woman warm, raising her legs, and giving oxygen. Fluids given through a vein and a blood transfusion may be needed.

If there is a rupture, surgery (laparotomy) is done to stop blood loss. This surgery is also done to confirm the diagnosis of ectopic pregnancy, remove the abnormal pregnancy, and repair any tissue damage. In some cases, removal of the fallopian tube may be necessary.

A mini-laparotomy and laparoscopy are the most common surgical treatments for an ectopic pregnancy that has not ruptured. In cases where the doctor does not think a rupture will occur, the woman may be given a medicine called methotrexate is given and monitored. Blood tests and liver function tests may be done.

Reality,

Abortion has nothing to do with surviving a tubal pregnancy, immediate abdominal surgery, aka laparotomy does. Women had this surgery long before legal abortion and still do. Over the years the surgery has become more refined by the use of the laprascope which is less invasive and patients can be discharged sooner. I took care of just such a patient last week.

AB, LOLSS!

Mary, you must be a really special nurse. My nurse's name today was Mary. She was a doll.

Leah,

Have a safe and enjoyable trip. We love you too.

Somg. It's too late for you. I think you have been turned over to a reprobate mind. Sad. You just don't understand what's right or wrong any longer. Maybe you never have. The devil owns you, and he works through you. You will meet your death one day. May God save your soul before it's too late. Eternity is a mighty long time to be tortured. You'll burn one day, and nobody will be able to help you then.

Posted by: heather at January 7, 2008 9:06 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From Biblespot.com-

"a child born out of wedlock goes to hell, along with all of his descendants for ten generations:

Deuteronomy 23:2 A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the LORD."

Leah, despite our differences, I still hope you have a safe and great trip!

Laura, so nice to see you as always:]

"Pro-choicers believe that abortion is an unfortunate necessity, but not cruel."

You fool.

Heather,

You are very kind but I could probably be better described as an old warhorse who's seen plenty in almost 40 years of nursing in one capacity of another.

*makes a face like Mrs. Doubtfire* funny smile.

Mary, LOL! My Mary was an older woman as well, but she was so very compassionate. So many nurses lack that at times.

"Pro-choicers believe that abortion is an unfortunate necessity, but not cruel."

You fool.

Posted by: jasper at January 7, 2008 10:10 PM**************** I shall second that motion.

Pro-choicers believe that abortion is an unfortunate necessity, but not cruel."
------ Why is it unfortunate. Careful with your wording. It's a choice, right?

"Pro-choicers believe that abortion is an unfortunate necessity, but not cruel."

Just more proof at how mentally deranged pro-choicers are.

Heather,

Wherever did you get the impression I was old? :)

Elizabeth, you've gotta LOVE them always changing their wording!! They always do this to suit themselves.

Well, uh, uh. The 40 year thing, Mary:? lol.

Heather,

I watched this special yesterday on the 9/11 conspiracy theory on the History Channel. The people on there kind of reminded me of pro-choicers..in that they pick and choose which facts they pay attention to and completely ignore the ones that don't fall in line with what they WANT to believe. Making their whole logic completely backwards. It's interesting..strange, but interesting.

Just a few weird things the PC crowd spews: It's a fetus. It's tissue. It's not a baby unless it's a certain age. It's crotch-goop. It's the size of a dime, so it's not important. Let's keep abortion safe, legal, and rare. Why keep it rare? It's my body, and my body trumps the right of a fetus. It's a z/e/f. Did I miss anything? Feel free to chime in.

Wherever did you get the impression I was old? :)

Posted by: Mary at January 7, 2008 10:17 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I thought you were my age.

More: It's my uterus. It's not an easy decision. Abortion is between a woman and her doctor. What about the child's dad?

*off topic for a second* What the heck happened to Brittney Spears? Can anyone give me a quick run down?

A lot of the rabid pro-choicers are definitely out there on the fringe politically. Tonight at the meeting a few of the very few PP supporters were reading The Militant to pass the time -- it's the socialist newspaper.
http://www.themilitant.com/index.shtml

Socialists are very interested in shaping society, limiting personal freedom through empowering the government. Of course, pro-choice would be their view because how better to shape and control society than to kill off anyone they deem undesirable.

LB, right!

Oops on future review, the Militant seems to be Communist and anti-Capitalist... great folks. Yeah, a really feely philosophy that has worked so well where it's been tried...:)

heather,

I think her ex called the police because he was afraid Brittany was going to hurt the babies. I think Brittany needs some help, she may have mental-health problems.

My all time favorite: SAVE ROE! Um, Roe is pro life. Besides, I thought you guys called her a "nutty screwball." Why would you want to save her?

Heather, 10:19PM

Oh that! I suppose I wasn't exactly subtle.

Laura 10:26PM

Uh no, I'm afraid not Laura. I passed that point shall we say some years ago :)

jasper, thank you. The poor girl needs prayer. Hollyweird sucked her in.

"Tonight at the meeting a few of the very few PP supporters were reading The Militant to pass the time -- it's the socialist newspaper."

wow, they really are commies.

I think Brittany needs some help, she may have mental-health problems.

This would be the understatement of the year! And it's only January!

LB, thanks for the link.

I agree with Jasper, it seems that Brittany has some mental/emotional problems. I pray for her.

" The poor girl needs prayer. Hollyweird sucked her in."

yes, they did. She needs to move to Wyoming or Montana, away from that life.

I was just wondering, because Dr. Phil just flashed across the T.V. He said that she is much "too ill" to be interviewed.

Uh no, I'm afraid not Laura. I passed that point shall we say some years ago :)

Posted by: Mary at January 7, 2008 10:32 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The place I work is basically a co-op, and bases a percentage of the profit sharing on years of experience. I envy you.
(I live about ten doors down from a hospital. They're offering new cars as a signing bonus. I might have picked the wrong gig...)

Laura 10:39PM

Really? The first I've heard of that. I started at $4.10/hour as an RN in 1975 and thought it was a king's ransom.

Mary, LOL!

Heather, ectopic pregnancy can also be treated non-surgically with methotrexate if you catch it in time.

(So can normal pregnancy, of course.)

(I live about ten doors down from a hospital. They're offering new cars as a signing bonus. I might have picked the wrong gig...)

In Aurora, they have billboards up that say, "Buy a house, get a Mercedes." Yup..it's in the garage. It's in the heart of downtown Aurora that's basically abandoned besides the casino..so I think it's an incentive to get people to move there.

Heather 10:36PM

I think the poor woman has completely snapped. She lost custody altogether of her children. Maybe now she'll be put in a hospital and get some desperately needed treatment. Its despicable that the woman is a public laughingstock when what she desperately needs is help.

...and the BIG sign on bonus is that Tom Weisner will be your mayor!

A mini-laparotomy and laparoscopy are the most common surgical treatments for an ectopic pregnancy that has not ruptured. In cases where the doctor does not think a rupture will occur, the woman may be given a medicine called methotrexate is given and monitored. Blood tests and liver function tests may be done.

Posted by: heather at January 7, 2008 10:01 PM------------------------------------------------------------- SOMG, thanks for the info that you just COPIED from my factual post.

Laura 10:39PM

Really? The first I've heard of that. I started at $4.10/hour as an RN in 1975 and thought it was a king's ransom.

Posted by: Mary at January 7, 2008 10:42 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I have three hospitals, about 20 private medical facilites, 5 convalescent homes and 1 Dry-out facility within 5-6 minutes of my home. I've been giving it some thought.

Mary, sad and true. I don't see Madonna rushing to her side.

Elizabeth, WOW! Very cool.

Laura 10:48

I think you should go for it. You certainly will never be unemployed. In fact, you'll have these folks fighting over you, not to mention a new car. :)

Laura --

Are you actually thinking about getting into the nursing profession? That is a profession about saving and caring for lives. I really shudder at the thought --- of course you'd just be in it for the money, right?

Heather,

K-Fed will have full custody but I give him credit for giving Brittney every chance and not trying to keep the boys from their mother. He seems to get no gloating satisfaction from winning full custody or from what's happened to Brittney. Its obvious she just can't manage and as I said I hope she gets help and can have a normal relationship with her children.

Mary,

It is unfortunate how she's losing it at such an important time in her children's lives. My daughter is about the same age as her boys..and I couldn't imagine not experiencing everything with her and seeing her face all the time. Let alone having the police bust down my door and have her ripped away from me. It's too bad she has chosen such a ridiculous way of life over her children.

Mary, Hollywood seems to glamorize these young women who are going to pot. When Nicole Richie's weight plummeted to 88 ponds, she was splashed across the cover of every magazine. Lindsey Lohan smashes her car while drunk, and she too is in every magazine. Let's not forget Paris Hilton's jail time, Kate Mosse's cocaine abuse, and the mysterious death of Anna Nicole Smith. The media almost makes this atrocious behavior look appealing and attractive.

I think they are partially to blame. The worse the behavior, the better the publicity.

Elizabeth, I agree. It's sad.

pro-lifers shut down Obama rally:

http://christiannewswire.com/index.php?module=releases&task=view&releaseID=5270

First primary votes - Giulian leads, Romney 2nd among Republicans.

Democrats - Obama by a landslide. Just the rawest, barest beginning.

Heather,

People love other people's drama.

jasper, HOOORAAA!

Elizabeth, true. Get this. Leave it to Tyra Banks to bring a super waifish, Nicole Ritchie onto her talk show. Tyra remarked "Don't you think you are too thin?" Nicole "No. I've always been thin." "I just gained weight after kicking my heroin addiction." Tyra went on "But you DO get more job offers being so tiny." Nicole "Yes. That's true." *as she smiled* Talk about a confusing message. Tyra will kick them off of "Top Model" if they are an ounce overweight.

*okay* sorry for going off topic. Just wanted to make a point about how messed up our society is.

I know..she always applauded the "plus-size" models on her show..but always gave them the boot...twas very confusing to me.

Oh, and that Janice Wickedson! {Dickenson] Have you ever seen such a nasty woman? She's had 2 abortions.

I disliked her even MORE after hearing that.

Another thing that's interesting about Tyra Banks is...she's always talking about other people's weight..making an issue about it. But when they brought her weight up..it was like "umm, NO you didn't." She can dish it out..but she just can't take it I guess.

Janice Dickinson is a crackhead..for real..well she was. She was a model I guess...but I think she's hideous..inside and outside. (On a side note: you know everybody's going to get all huffy with us talking about people's looks don't you heather? :gasp:)

May I offer you some letters?

Try CNN, MSNBC, CSPAN, and PBS - they seldom cover trivial garbage.

Now Janice is making fun of Tyra's weight! I guess they aren't pals anymore. *go figure* Janice went on to bash Queen Latifa. She said "That's a fat woman who shouldn't be in magazines." *gasp*

I love PBS...I watch it allllllll freaking day. seriously..sesame street..barney..all of that. It's great stuff.

Elizabeth, she looks pretty nasty with those collagen lips. I can't stand her!

I love CNN and PBS.

Come on Lauraaaaaa...you know you love some trivial garbage. You drool at other people's personal train wrecks.

Elizabeth, hahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

Imagine this: Tell Laura that Tyra Banks and Janice Dickenson are pro life. She'd be telling us about what a couple of fat, washed up, losers they both were. LOL!

I'm don't think Tyra is pro abortion. I'm hoping not.

See. Abortion and evil go hand in hand. Janice is evil.

Well, good night all.

Regarding this question whether abortion is cruel:

It's always cruel when people decline to use their bodies to support other people's lives. It's cruel to deny a patient the use of Heather's kidney just because Heather prefers not to make the sacrifice.

Was Thidwick the Big-Hearted Moose (Dr. Suess) cruel when he expelled the critters from his antlers?

I can't believe the posts on here have now been downgraded to talking about the likes of Brittney Spears, Lindsay what's her name, Paris Hilton , ad nauseum.

WHY ARE PEOPLE SO FRIKKING OBSESSED WITH THESE IDIOTS ?????

Take Brittneys kids away from her AND her jerk husband and put them in a NORMAL home with NORMAL parents and be done with it. It's the only chance they have for a decent life.

Celebrities are the only other thing, next to abortion, that infuriates me.

OMG I'm so excited about our next video.

I would donate a kidney.

Mike, you're right. Let's not forget that Hollywood does indeed influence a lot of people though. If Hollywood didn't matter so much to people, we may not have as many eating disorders out there. Why did Ms. Magazine collect 5000 signatures from celebrities in a feeble attempt to make abortion more acceptable? ...Just sayin.

Mike,

That's what happens late at night lol.

Mike 2:11am

Come on. So what's wrong with a little lighthearted bantering? That's all it is. There are certainly serious discussions on this blog, and some get a little heated at times. It gives everyone a nice break and a little enjoyment. I see no problem with it.

Evidently, Elizabeth !
That's the problem of my living on the west coast. I'm always 2 or 3 hrs. behind the discussions here and still at work when the good stuff is going on !

I would run for public office just to get a measure on the ballots that would ban celebrity media coverage. It's a pathetic commentary on the interests of the citizens of this country when every time you turn on the TV, or the radio, open a newspaper, or are standing in line in the grocery store, that the first thing that is thrust at you are these imbecilles, their sordid lives, their sexual escapades, drug use, arrests,their plastic surgeries, eating disorders, yada, yada, yada...

It boggles my mind to the extreme, that any sane, rational thinking human being is even REMOTELY interested in these fools.

Mike,

I agree, we give these people entirely too much credence. I would love to know their credentials in the area of science, climatology, geography, etc. yet we actually care about the opinions of these people on such matters as global warming, worse yet, they think we should listen.
My favorite were their threats to leave the country if George Bush won. Who else would put up with them and why do they think any of us give two hoots if they leave the country?
If nothing else, they do provide us with entertainment, intended and not, so what the heck, sit back and enjoy.

Tyra will kick them off of "Top Model" if they are an ounce overweight.

Heather, if they can't dunk a basketball they probably wouldn't make it in professional basketball either.

Elizabeth, to Heather: People love other people's drama.

Heather, have you ever thought about being in your own reality show?

Celebrities are the only other thing, next to abortion, that infuriates me.

Mike, then you must be a saint.

The number of people going slow in the fast lane pretty much has me thinking that these are "The End Times."

Doug

Tyra will kick them off of "Top Model" if they are an ounce overweight.

Heather, if they can't dunk a basketball they probably wouldn't make it in professional basketball either.

Posted by: Doug at January 8, 2008 7:30 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Oooooooh! I've got it!
A reality show where fat supermodels play basketball! Each week the loser gets fed through a woodchipper. Joel McHale is the host.
I'm gonna go pitch this concept...

Laura tries to be funny again.@@

Elizabeth, to Heather: People love other people's drama.

Heather, have you ever thought about being in your own reality show?

Posted by: Doug at January 8, 2008 ----------------------- Why yes.

Doug, I guess that means that you find me interesting.

Heather, I like that great big gun attached to your hip.

Everybody's interesting here, but I do like you.