I'm curious. Did Weddington know or care that her client, Norma McCorvey, was lying when she claimed to be a victim of a gang rape? Given McCorvey's mental and emotional instability and substance abuse, did it occur to her to investigate, check for a police report, anything?
I suppose one couldn't blame Sarah is she did knowingly look the other way. A pregnancy resulting from a gang rape would have considerable more emotional appeal than one resulting from an adulterous affair, as did McCorvey's.

I wonder to how Weddington felt when the TV movie about her great "success" was a huge flop.

Also, did she share the sentiments of her husband Ron Weddington, who argued with her for Roe, when he wrote President elect Clinton and urged the use of abortion "to eliminate the barely educated, unhealthy, and poor segment of our country"?

I find it interesting that neither Norma McCorvey nor Sandra Cano(the Doe of Doe v Bolton)had an abortion.
I am willing to bet that many prochoice that post here know much of what Roe v Wade or Doe v Bolton are about.
It disturbs me that the people of this country never had a say, never had a voice or a vote about Roe v Wade.

Unless she repents, I do shudder to think what Sarah Weddington will say to God when she dies. How she will justify her legacy at that moment.

What an embarrassment to the legal profession -

Bad law, bad morals, and bad policy.

St. Thomas More pray for us.

S.

Mary, here's Weddington's spin on Norma from that Vancouver Sun piece:

Then there was her plaintiff, the woman known to the court as Jane Roe who later identified herself as Norma McCorvey. She proved to be shakier than a straw doll.

Weddington and her group of supporters thought McCorvey was sincere when she said she wanted an abortion and wanted to help other women in the same predicament.

McCorvey never did have the abortion. In the years to come, she repeatedly changed her story about the circumstances of the pregnancy, initially claiming she had been raped and then later denying it. She went through a religious conversion and several high-profile associations and various churches, eventually proselytizing on her own. She ultimately denounced Roe vs. Wade.

"Looking back, I wish I had picked a different plaintiff but you don't know all that about a person. I was young enough and naive enough that I really believed what she said."

See what happens when you vote for Republicans?

Weddington was just the mouthpiece on Roe v. Wade. Justices appointed by Republicans made Roe. v. Wade law of the land:

The Roe Court:
Burger, C.J.(Nixon'69), Douglas (Roosevelt'39), Brennan (Eisenhower'56), Stewart (Eisenhower'58), White (Kennedy'62), Marshall (Johnson'67), Blackmun (Nixon'70), Powell (Nixon'71), Rehnquist (Nixon'71).

From the Vancouver Sun on Weddington:

It now seems so long ago, she wonders whether younger women have any idea of what life was like back then.

She got a hint of this on a recent flight. She was wearing, as she always does, a button depicting a coat hanger in the middle and a slash across it, the symbol for opposition to the need for back-alley abortions.

The flight attendant kept looking at it and then finally asked Weddington, "What do you have against coat hangers?"
...........................
I'm sure that made her day...

"She was wearing, as she always does, a button depicting a coat hanger in the middle and a slash across it, the symbol for opposition to the need for back-alley abortions."

What a ridiculous thing to wear.

Jill,

Thank you.

Her hand wringing over her naivete and youth doesn't wash. This woman was well educated, an attorney, and knew her client was unstable. She could have called upon the services of private investigators. She had a cause, she had a plaintiff made to order and she wasn't going to ruin it for herself by getting the facts. Also, given the comments of Ron Weddington, you have to wonder if elitism was also a very motivating factor.
She wishes she had picked a different plaintiff? Spare me. She was only too quick and happy to use a mentally unstable substance abusing woman to further her cause.

What a ridiculous thing to wear.

Posted by: Anonymous at February 21, 2008 11:36 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I feel the same way about those moronic gold fetus feet.

Jill,

Her youth? This woman was in her late 20's or early 30's. When did she start to consider herself mature woman and legal professional, when she turned 50?

Ah Sarah Ragle Weddington, a good Methodist daughter of a Methodist pastor.
Being propagandized into making Jesus allow abortion for rape, incest, and health of the mother, by her father's version of Jesus, she simply got pregnant and decided to drop the last charade of Protestant restrictions on Jesus not allowing a murder of his creation in the womb.
Well that is what becomes of people who never had a image of Jesus as a child being held by his mother anywhere in their church.
Just one image of a cross with some flames wrapped around it representing some holy spirit that allows abortion for any reason today. Bet their "tongues are on fire"(acts2;3) now in the heaven of the Jesus that knows which sacred body is torn asunder by his Methodist division of the worshippers of the God named Jesus.
Ragle admits to the reason for her abortion was that she "was able to finish law school" and " there were other things in our life to do".
Yes, and the real reason she was pre-destined to abort was from her Jesus version, learned from her pastor father, which was based on the Jesus of health,wealth, power, and the blessings received from that trinity.
When it is time to pick up your cross and sacrifice for another, throw down that cross and know that Jesus is smiling at your abortion which allowed you to gain some health, wealth, and power. The power gained from some secular law school, from which you can impose your "personal killing Jesus",
on all Americans.
Bet her daddy was proud of her being a successful Protestant child who grew up and imposed her religious beliefs on a secular nation.
It began in the spirit/thinking of Protestants, and their version of Jesus before it was made into a secular mandate to allow the murder of God's creation.
Tis better to be a atheist then worship a God that allows his followers, the God given right, to kill life for the reason that God wants you healthy wealthy and powerful enough to impose your God upon us all.
On the bright side, all mainline Protestant religions are shutting their doors and dying out just like like abortion is a act of dying.

On the bad side, the Protestant religion produced multi-millions of converts to abortion with no restiction except the desire to kill anything that gets in the way of their personal quest for health wealth and power.

Judiciary Crisis Resolution - Colorado Caucus -08

WHEREAS, seven of the nine current United States Supreme Court Justices have been nominated by Republican Presidents; and

WHEREAS, Justice Clarence Thomas has written his opinion that he would allow the government to permit the killing of unborn children; and

WHEREAS, Justice Antonin Scalia has publicly stated that he would strike down any law that prohibited abortion in all fifty states; and

WHEREAS, not a single justice on the Republican U.S. Supreme Court defends the personhood and right to life of the unborn; and

WHEREAS, the pro-abortion Roe v. Wade decision was written by a Republican Justice, and

WHEREAS, Roe. v. Wade was passed by a Republican majority on the U.S. Supreme Court, and

WHEREAS sixty percent of the United States federal judiciary has been nominated by Republican presidents; and

WHEREAS the federal judiciary is overwhelming pro-abortion, now, therefore

BE IT RESOLVED by the Colorado _________ Party that we recognize a moral crisis in the federal judiciary, and that the Colorado Republican Party and the National Republican Party are significantly to blame for America's judicial moral crisis, and that to address this crisis, the Colorado __________ Party should support personhood and the God-given right to life of the unborn as the strategy toward ending legitimized child killing in America.

Resolution recommended by Colorado Right To Life.

Norma McCorvey and Sandra Cano went to the Supreme Court in 2005 to tell how they were used and never helped. Surprisingly Sandra Cano didn't even want an abortion! She even had to run away from her Atty and Mother so she wouldn't be forced into one. Abortion became legal by abusing 2 women and not helping them. Abortion became legal based on lies and deceit. Abortion became legal by twisting facts and not allowing the 2 women any constitutional rights.

Here are some of Norma McCorvey's statement to the Judiciary Committee - this shows that her atty, Ms. Weddington, didn't give a rats behind about women, only her career legacy:

"I never got the opportunity to speak for myself in my own court case."

" I believe that I was used and abused by the court system in America."

"Instead of getting me financial or vocational help, instead of helping me to get off of drugs and alcohol, instead of working for open adoption or giving me other help, my lawyers wanted to eliminate the right of society to protect women and children from abortionists."

"I was living on the streets."

"I made up the story that I had been raped to help justify my abortion. Why would I make up a lie to justify my conduct? Abortion itself is a lie and it is based on lies."

"I saw women crying in the recovery rooms (of abortion clinic that Norma McCorvey worked in). If abortion is so right, why were the women crying? Even Senator Hillary Clinton on January 25, 2005 was reported by the New York Times to finally admit “that abortion is a sad, even tragic choice for many, many women.” "

"I saw filthy conditions in abortions clinics even when “Roe” was supposed to clean up “back alley” abortions. I saw the low regard for women from abortion doctors. "

"According to an amicus brief filed in my case, 100,000 women a year enter abortion recovery counseling programs. Abortion is not a simple medical procedure that is safer than childbirth, it is the killing of a human being. It produces severe psychological and emotional consequences. We can ask the children to forgive us, but the children are dead. "

"On February 22, 2005, the Supreme Court declined to take my case. I was good enough for the courts when they wanted to impose abortion on America, but I wasn’t good enough when I asked them to look at the hard evidence of what they have done to America. "

One must become even a liar when it comes to not allowing anything to stop your personal quest for health,wealth and power.
Sarah Weddington lied to Mexican authorities and said she was raped to get a "legal abortion" in Mexico. Which is the only legal reason for abortion in Mexico at that time.
Or her husband Ron, really did rape her and she never reported it to U.S. authorities. That makes her a cowardly hypocrite in the vision of women's liberation, and she should have had Ron put in jail for rape.

Valerie,

I understand Sandra Cano was a low income uneducated pregnant woman seperated from her abusive husband, and desperate to get her other children out of foster care.
She claims she saw the lawyer for help getting her children back and never wanted an abortion. The lawyer took advantage of her lack of education and desperate circumstances to further an abortion agenda without her knowledge or consent. Ms. Cano said she never even supported abortion and had no idea her situation was being used as a vehicle to legalize it.

"I feel the same way about those moronic gold fetus feet."

Except, the fetus feet are a true representation of the size and shape of the feet of a fetus.... the coat hanger was nothing more than a fabrication of the movement that Weddington was trying to promote.

I forgot to post the link to Norma McCorvey's testimony:

judiciary.senate.gov/testimony.cfm?id=1553&wit_id=4394

Mary,

You're right - here is a link to her testimony and some highlights:

judiciary.senate.gov/testimony.cfm?id=1553&wit_id=4393

"Using my name and life, Doe v. Bolton falsely created the health exception that led to abortion on demand and partial birth abortion. How it got there is still pretty much a mystery to me. I only sought legal assistance to get a divorce from my husband and to get my children from foster care. I was very vulnerable: poor and pregnant with my fourth child, but abortion never crossed my mind. Although it apparently was utmost in the mind of the attorney from whom I sought help. At one point during the legal proceedings, it was necessary for me to flee to Oklahoma to avoid the pressure being applied to have the abortion scheduled for me by this same attorney. "

"at NO TIME did I ever have an abortion. I did not seek an abortion nor do I believe in abortion. "

"How can cunning, wicked lawyers use an uneducated, defenseless pregnant woman to twist the American court system in such a fraudulent way?"

"It took me until 1988 to get my records unsealed in order for me to try and find the answer to those questions and to join in the movement to stop abortion in America. When pro abortion advocates found out about my efforts; my car was vandalized on one occasion and at another time, someone shot at me while I was on my front porch holding my grandbaby. "

"One of the Justices of the Supreme Court said during oral argument in my case �What does
it matter if she is real or not.� "

" I was in court under a false name and lies. I was never cross-examined in court. Doe v. Bolton is based on a lie and deceit. "

________________

In my opinion this is why the media and Pro-Choice never mention Doe V Bolton when talking about the legalization of abortion. They know that what they did was illegal in her case and they don't want too much attention on it. Why else would it 'Doe' until 1988 to get her own court records. Unbelievable.

"Looking back, I wish I had picked a different plaintiff but you don't know all that about a person. I was young enough and naive enough that I really believed what she said."

A twisting of the role of the courts and judiciary. Lawyers aren't supposed to "pick" plaintiffs. Clients are supposed to pick lawyers of their choice to represent their interests in situations in which the clients have been wronged. Weddington went fishing to "pick" a no-nothing "plaintiff" who could be used to further her cause. And we lawyers wonder why we're the butt of jokes....

The "law of the land" was based upon lies. All lies. Praying so hard for an end to the slaughter of the innocent.

Yllas, 12:10p, said: "On the bad side, the Protestant religion produced multi-millions of converts to abortion with no restiction except the desire to kill anything that gets in the way of their personal quest for health wealth and power."

Now, now.

FF, 11:18am

Weddington was just a mouthpiece? Please. I would hardly call arguing before the Supreme Court being some mindless mouthpiece. Weddington had an agenda and she found the perfect plaintiff. This was well planned and strategized.
By the way FF, do you think she may have shared her husband's elitist attitude?

Valerie 12:40PM

An excellent post, thank you.
I'm sure McCorvey's admitting her lie to Carl Rowan was embarassing enough without having to acknowledge the less than ethical tactics in the Doe v Bolton case.

What an embarrassment to the legal profession -

Bad law, bad morals, and bad policy.

St. Thomas More pray for us.

S.

Posted by: Anonymous at February 21, 2008 11:04 AM

"A Man For All Seasons" (1966) - An excellent movie on the life of Sir Thomas More.

Anonymous 12:44PM

Excellent point.

thank you Mary, and by the way, it's supposed to be "know-nothing", not "no-nothing"!
S.

"Weddington's pathetic legacy"

that says it all....

thats what you get when you put evil people and the law together. 50,000,000 dead.

Now Now, Jill,
It wasn't the atheist, Muslims, Buddhist, and other religious minorities that could sway American opinion to abortion being made into a right of U.S. citizens.
Reasons for abortion came forth by way of mainline Protestant religious thought/spirit and using the Word of God, to make abortion legal in the USA.
Those "religious reasons" became secularized arguments and then injected into the courts of the USA.
Since the great majority of Protestants controlled the morals of the USA, the mainline Protestant was only making his religious beliefs into de facto law.
In essence, it was God's will that abortion became legal in all Protestant nations in the world.
Abortion was made into a God given right/truth of the followers of Jesus, before it was made into a "secular right".
Ask Doug, he knows that all cultures have abortion. And so the Protestants "joined the band wagon" of all cultures, and are no different then all those cultures.
At one time Christians had a name for such cultures, they were the common pagans from which Christians came from. Today the majority,mainline Protestant follower of Christ have returned to their roots, their beginning, which always accepted abortion.
I didn't convince/propagandize/convert/ Protestant Christians to make abortion a right from God. I just am trying to make Protestants aware of who created abortion in their secular law, which was justfied by their bible interpetations of the word of God.
You must regain your God, Jill, from the great majority of Protestant Christians who made God into a mute, or approving God of abortion.
Which brings up the question, what Protestant religion were you raised in Jill?
And were you always against abortion, defying your mainline Protestant God that allows abortion of his creation in the womb?

.

thats what you get when you put evil people and the law together. 50,000,000 dead.

Posted by: jasper at February 21, 2008 1:39 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Evil people?
Would that be the Republican-appointed justices that handed down the Roe decision?
Maybe it was that EVIL Ronald Reagan, the guy who signed into law the most liberal abortion legislation in the nation prior to Roe.
Eeeeeeeeeeeevil...

You got it FF, for once.
When it comes to abortion, political parties are united in their right to abortion.
It's from being indoctrinated in a God that allows abortion before they became famous for lying to Americans for a living.
Just like you FF, your ability to lie for your ideas is quite amusing. And you believe your lies which is double the amusement.
Come here doggie, I just want to talk with you before I love you to death.

You people do know that Norma McCorvey lost custody of every child she ever had?

Ironic given her links to Paul Hall, The Christian Identity Movement and their panic over the "epidemic of mixed-race babies."
Norma and her friend Paul are pictured Here: http://www.barf.org/articles/0080/

It reeks of good 'ol Jim Bob Duggar and his posts on the Stormfront White Nationalist site.

You people do know that Norma McCorvey lost custody of every child she ever had?

If you ask her children whether they would rather be alive or killed, what do you think their response would be?

Bethany,
I'm just surprised she was able to have children seeing the drinking and drugs she did. Poor kids probably have a host of health problems : (

FF 2:46PM,

I've never heard McCorvey make any claims to sainthood, and its been pointed out that she was an emotionally unstable woman and substance abuser. Whatever her failings, they seemed irrelevant to Weddington who was only too happy to exploit her situation.

Panic over an epidemic of mixed race babies? Gee, these people sound every bit as bigoted as Ron Weddington. Like Ron, do they also want to eliminate the poor, uneducated, and unhealthy?

...Resolution recommended by Colorado Right To Life.

Posted by: lesforlife at February 21, 2008 12:15 PM

Can you explain a little more about this resolution? Are you in Colorado? If so, can you give us an update on the PP Denver construction project? Thanks.

Jess, 3:43PM

You'd be surprised how well these kids do. I remember the days when there was no concern over x-rays, coffee drinking, medications, smoking, alcohol, or much of anything else. Babies did fine, not that I condone taking risks of any kind.
I did everything "right" in my first pregnancy and my daughter wound up mentally ill. I was more lax with my last two and they're fine. There are no guarantees no matter what. :[

FF 2:46PM

This is the first I've heard of this website. Exactly what kind of posts does Jim Bob put on there? I checked and couldn't find any. This shocks me, he's been portrayed as such a family man(obviously with 17 kids) and devout Christian, not to mention all the publicity and help they rec'd with their home.

The world is rapidly being divided into two camps, the comradeship of anti-Christ and the brotherhood of Christ. The lines between these two are being drawn. How long the battle will be we know not; whether swords will have to be unsheathed we know not; whether blood will have to be shed we know not; whether it will be an armed conflict we know not. But in a conflict between truth and darkness, truth cannot lose.
Bishop John Sheen (1895 - 1979)

Eliminating children based on their race... wow now that sounds Nazi-ish. So that's the legacy Norma is going to leave behind.

mk, I hope you weren't supporting the notion that people of European decent are somehow better spiritually then others

Jill,

Thank you.

Her hand wringing over her naivete and youth doesn't wash. This woman was well educated, an attorney, and knew her client was unstable. She could have called upon the services of private investigators. She had a cause, she had a plaintiff made to order and she wasn't going to ruin it for herself by getting the facts. Also, given the comments of Ron Weddington, you have to wonder if elitism was also a very motivating factor.
She wishes she had picked a different plaintiff? Spare me. She was only too quick and happy to use a mentally unstable substance abusing woman to further her cause.

Posted by: Mary at February 21, 2008 11:37 AM
..........................................

Now the nut job has joined your camp. Ironic.

FF 2:46PM,

I've never heard McCorvey make any claims to sainthood, and its been pointed out that she was an emotionally unstable woman and substance abuser. Whatever her failings, they seemed irrelevant to Weddington who was only too happy to exploit her situation.

Panic over an epidemic of mixed race babies? Gee, these people sound every bit as bigoted as Ron Weddington. Like Ron, do they also want to eliminate the poor, uneducated, and unhealthy?

Posted by: Mary at February 21, 2008 3:45 PM
........................................................

Of course! That is the whole point Mary. Do you get some enjoyment from people suffering in poverty? Women and children are the vast majority of people living in poverty. Having more children than you can provide for is the path to poverty and the trap to staying there.
Oh! I can hear it now. Women that dare to enjoy their sexuality deserve the punishment of poverty. And their children too.

The world is rapidly being divided into two camps, the comradeship of anti-Christ and the brotherhood of Christ. The lines between these two are being drawn. How long the battle will be we know not; whether swords will have to be unsheathed we know not; whether blood will have to be shed we know not; whether it will be an armed conflict we know not. But in a conflict between truth and darkness, truth cannot lose.
Bishop John Sheen (1895 - 1979)

Posted by: mk at February 21, 2008 4:19 PM
..........................................

How funny! I inherited some of my grandma's books, letters, notes etc.... She had some pamphlet from Sheen. Along with one about the Red Menace. Fear mongering was all the rage amongst some of her generation.
Sally's maternal grandma (1904-1972)

Yllas: On the bad side, the Protestant religion produced multi-millions of converts to abortion with no restiction except the desire to kill anything that gets in the way of their personal quest for health wealth and power.

Jill: Now, now.

:: laughing ::

Plenty of Catholics have abortions too. If a woman sees it in her interest as far as health, you're nobody to tell her different, yllas.

As far as Protestants, etc., if you want to really know what a failed Christian is, look in the mirror.

If you want less "Catholic bashing" as you often refer to, never tell anybody that you're Catholic.

yllas: Ask Doug, he knows that all cultures have abortion. And so the Protestants "joined the band wagon" of all cultures, and are no different then all those cultures.

No, Protestants are people, like people everywhere, and there is great commonality within people around the world, something you seem to frequently pretend is not true.

For all your religious pretensions, about all you're doing is giving religion a bad name and favoring the Pro-Choice side with your posts.

Doug

Sally, 7:30PM

Your rambling has nothing to do with my post but I will ask you this question. Why after 35 years of legal abortion do we still have poverty?

Sally 7:17PM

Sure, after your side got done exploiting her and perpertuating her lie for your own agenda.

"I wanted to shake his hand to see if he was vigorous and sharp. I was very reassured that he had a really good strong handshake."

How awfully disturbing. Is it just me, or is there a slough of people anticipating the deaths or retirements of these judges? This is sick! Imagine what they must feel. They read the same stuff we do. They have families that read it, too!

It's truly sad to me that agendas have become more important than people. (well, I guess it has been going on for some 35 years now).

I'll never get used to it!

I agree with you, Carla, "Unless she repents, I do shudder to think what Sarah Weddington will say to God when she dies. How she will justify her legacy at that moment."

Lord, please have mercy on her soul.

There goes Doug, assuming about my religion.
It's your parents religious superstitions (Methodist and Quaker) that made Protestant Christians nothing more then some pagan God, that allows what pagan Gods have always wanted humans to do; murder their own as a sacrifice to something on this world. You know Doug, health wealth and power. The Protestant God blesses you with those, or you not doing something right, and since Jesus wants his followers that allow abortion, to be healthy, wealthy and powerful enough to make his need for abortion invade the secular laws of a nation.
Sarah Weddington was a perfect example of such Methodist pick and choosing some lines from her word of God book, to make Jesus the God that allows the death of his defenceless human being in the womb of the mother.
Do you not agree with her Doug and her Jesus that allows the murder of human beings in the womb of another human being as a giving up, a sacrifice, to the Jesus that wants you healthy,wealthy and powerful enough to force her religious thoughts upon a secular nation?
I like you Doug, your a person who had enough intelligence and broke away from your superstitious parents peasant like thoughts, about some God that allows death for millions before they cause any trouble in the world from being unwanted by Jesus, first and foremost.
Now you wander about being Spyderman, and correctly mistakes of science that produced a job for ya Doug.
Your such a simple minded failed Protestant filled with simple thoughts about the world and cultural myths made into truth for Doug.
And absolute truth gushes forth when Doug knows that all cultures allowed abortion from times beyond the history of writing.
Of course it is a absolute truth that all cultures worshipped their version of the Flying Spaghetti Monster that allowed the act of abortion as neither good or bad, right or wrong, or any thoughts outside being able to think in one direction towards killing your own creation.
Right Doug?
And what about the atheist caveman that allowed abortion Doug, or the killing from being unable to give up some food for a child in the klan?
I like you Doug, your a walking, talking, failed Protestant that struts about with your chin(see pic of Doug) out, and proclaims all cultures have abortion in them so deeply, one might be intelligent enough to then think that is why Jesus was insane, hated, and destroying the all pervasive right to murder their children that aren't wanted.
Ain't it fun Doug, not being able to think outside your Protestant box your parents put in your mind. Then think you have actually broke free of their superstitious Jesus that allows the death of millions of human beings for their health(see Sally and death sex or FF), wealth(see Weddington), and the power gained from the first two legs of their trinitarian God.
Now, Doug, you know I'm writing the truth about Protestants and their religious beliefs, which were used to destroy cultures that allowed,encouraged, and invented some form of God that justified the all pervasive aborting,infanticide, and plain old murder of their off spring.
I like you Doug, your the perfect example of what happened to millions of Protestants in the last century who abandoned the superstitious mudering God, and becomes a pre-Christian philosophy which is one of the easiest philosophies to live by. A simple minded person who can be motivated to change any decision by increasing pleasure or reducing pain. A plain jane Hedonist incapable of knowing anything beyond his body.

There goes Doug, assuming about my religion.
It's your parents religious superstitions (Methodist and Quaker) that made Protestant Christians nothing more then some pagan God, that allows what pagan Gods have always wanted humans to do; murder their own as a sacrifice to something on this world. You know Doug, health wealth and power. The Protestant God blesses you with those, or you not doing something right, and since Jesus wants his followers that allow abortion, to be healthy, wealthy and powerful enough to make his need for abortion invade the secular laws of a nation.
Sarah Weddington was a perfect example of such a perfect Methodist, whose pick and choosing some lines from her word of God book, to make Jesus the God that allows the death of his defenceless human being in the womb of the mother.
Do you not agree with her Doug and her Jesus that allows the murder of human beings in the womb of another human being as a giving up, a sacrifice, to the Jesus that wants you healthy,wealthy and powerful enough to force her religious thoughts upon a secular nation?
I like you Doug, your a person who had enough intelligence and broke away from your superstitious parents peasant like thoughts, about some God that allows death for millions before they cause any trouble in the world from being unwanted by Jesus, first and foremost.
Now you wander about being Spyderman, and correcting mistakes of science that produced a job for ya Doug.
Your such a simple minded failed(make that successful) Protestant filled with simple thoughts about the world and cultural myths made into truth for Doug.
And absolute truth gushes forth when Doug knows that all cultures allowed abortion from times beyond the history of writing.
Of course it is a absolute truth that all cultures worshipped their version of the Flying Spaghetti Monster that allowed the act of abortion as neither good or bad, right or wrong, or any thoughts outside being able to think in one direction towards killing your own creation.
Right Doug?
And what about the atheist caveman that allowed abortion Doug, or the killing from being unable to give up some food for a child in the klan?
I like you Doug, your a walking, talking, failed Protestant that struts about with your chin(see pic of Doug) out, and proclaims all cultures have abortion in them so deeply, one might be intelligent enough to then think that is why Jesus was insane, hated, and destroying the all pervasive right to murder their children that aren't wanted.
Ain't it fun Doug, not being able to think outside your Protestant box your parents put in your mind. Then think you have actually broke free of their superstitious Jesus that allows the death of millions of human beings for their health(see Sally and death sex or FF), wealth(see Weddington), and the power gained from the first two legs of their trinitarian God.
Now, Doug, you know I'm writing the truth about Protestants and their religious beliefs, which were used to destroy cultures that allowed,encouraged, and invented some form of God that justified the all pervasive aborting,infanticide, and plain old murder of their off spring.
I like you Doug, your the perfect example of what happened to millions of Protestants in the last century who abandoned the superstitious mudering God, and becomes a pre-Christian philosophy which is one of the easiest philosophies to live by. A simple minded person who can be motivated to change any decision by increasing pleasure or reducing pain. A plain jane Hedonist incapable of knowing anything beyond his body.
You go Doug, your such a force of nature that millions have tread your path before you were even formed in the womb.
Luckily for you Doug, Jesus has a plan for you, since he didn't use you for a sacrifice to the continuing of your mother's health, that was endangered by your mother allowing your parasitic eating away in her body, and allowed you to burst forth upon the stage of life to become a person who knows "no one has a good argument" against your parent's God, "they just think they do".

mk, I hope you weren't supporting the notion that people of European decent are somehow better spiritually then others

Jess,
I don't understand...where did you get this?

Sally,

How funny! I inherited some of my grandma's books, letters, notes etc.... She had some pamphlet from Sheen. Along with one about the Red Menace. Fear mongering was all the rage amongst some of her generation.
Sally's maternal grandma (1904-1972)
Posted by: Sally at February 21, 2008 7:42 PM

Your grandmother sounds like a wise woman. Perhaps you should read those pamphlets.

You're never too old to learn...

Oh Oh, Sally is finding Catholic literature amongst her deathsex klan members.
She only kept them to preach about the evil Papist conspiracy that was taking over the world.
Did you find her membership card in the Know Nothing party next to her picture of FDR smiling while telling Leo Crowley, wartime Alien Property Custodian, " You know this is a Protestant country, and the Catholics and Jews are here on sufference(tolerance of something prohibited). It is up to both of you to go along with anything I want at this time". The word "both", refers to the Jew Secretary Of State, Henry Morganthau.
Now Sally, it's not acceptable to be a bigot about Jews anymore, but Catholics is another matter in your family of natural born, anti-Catholic, deathsex klan members to this day.

To update on Norma McCorvey's children. Her first child was raised by her mother. Her second child was raised by the father with a mutual agreement that she not interfer in that child's life. And she gave the third up for adoption. I applaud her for doing what was right for her children. This is what Pro-lifers believe women can do when they experience unwanted pregnancies. I find it ironic that the person who brought up her children is pro-choice. Isn't the pro-choice side suppose to be sympathetic to women who do are poor and can't afford children? Isn't the pro-choice side suppose to be tolerant of other people's lifestyle as well? The point is that her children are alive and were raised by people who loved them and were capable of it. Norma had a difficult life but she has corrected that life and is now trying to do good with her life instead of drinking/smoking it away. Again - I applaud her for her courage to stand up against a group of people who like to find faults in those they disagree with all the while giving their loyaltiy to someone in the same position but chose abortion. Whatever happened to choice?

Great post, Valerie.
Loyalty. Pro Choicers seem to show a genuine lack of empathy for the most heartbreaking of stories and situations, judging some of the comments lately, they don't want to be shown pictures of aborted babies, or hear one word of regret from anyone who has had one, they don't REALLY want to get messy with the most atrocious of abortion clinic conditions but they will defend the scum abortionist forever.
Loyal to lies.
Loyal to Abort and Shut Up.

And yllowass shows up to vomit all over the board yet again - he/she continues to remind me how disgusting antichoicers are so frequently are ....

Your rambling has nothing to do with my post but I will ask you this question. Why after 35 years of legal abortion do we still have poverty?

Posted by: Mary at February 21, 2008 8:13 PM
*********************
Obviously because poor wome choose to have children.

"50 Million Dead" because of Roe v Wade.
What a joke! Do you think that we would have
all those people here today if that decision
had never been made? Ridiculous.There would
still have been an awful lot of them.
And how would we have provided for all of
them even if there had been no abortions?
Anti-choice people never have that answer.

Robert -

I have that answer.

Responsibility. If we kept responsiblity in our lives we wouldn't have that amount of unwanted pregnancies. We wouldn't have over 18 million new sexually transmitted infections reported every year and we wouldn't have a generation of women who loath their bodies instead of respect them.

Haven't you seen the latest trend in TV movies lately? You know, the movies that are based on true stories. All of them have to do with teenaged girls feeling like they have to "put out or get out." and they are ridiculed and chastised if they get out. It was just 20 years ago when you were expected to get out and never date a boy who gave you that altimatum - now that altimatum is expected and girls must put out to be considered dateable. It is such a horrible trend that even Oprah has had several shows on this and the news is reporting the highest number of Gonorrhea and Syphillis amoung people aged 15 - 24.

The reason we have so many abortions is because we have been told that we can have all the sex we want and if you use contraception you won't get pregnant and if you use condoms you won't get sick. The people who told us this have been wrong and now we have a gross amount of dead human's and an epidemic of STD's that no one will admit to.

TR, 9;12am

So it looks like Ron Weddington was wrong when he said abortion necessary to "eliminate the... the poor segment of our country".

"50 Million Dead" because of Roe v Wade.
What a joke! Do you think that we would have
all those people here today if that decision
had never been made? Ridiculous.There would
still have been an awful lot of them.
And how would we have provided for all of
them even if there had been no abortions?
Anti-choice people never have that answer.

Posted by: robert berger at February 22, 2008 9:38 AM

Robert Berger,

As Valerie said so well, it's called "taking responsibility".

I have an extra bedroom in my house and plenty of food. I also have hand-me down clothes that are like new. There's one answer to your question.

There goes Doug, assuming about my religion.

No, yllas, that's really not true. I don't know what your religion is. You may claim to be Catholic because you're often going on about "Catholic-bashing," but I just note your behavior on these message boards.

If anything I'd say you are insecure, and seeing insult and slander, etc., where there often is none. You're really just feeling your own inner doubt, etc. My opinion. If there is "bashing" here, it's you, ranting and raving about Protestants, etc.

If anything I'd say you really don't need to go on and on about Protestants, for the sake of the Protestants on this board. I'm an agnostic, so for my sake go ahead and knock yourself out, but you're in the wrong about religions in general, quite often.
......

"no one has a good argument" against your parent's God

Again, this is just you making up silly stuff. The negative cannot be proven. If you are nothing more than illogical, then what's the point?

You don't even get to gods or a god, all you do is project your own bitterness and ill-feelings.

I do not think it's about religion for you, at all.

Doug

Robert Berger: "50 Million Dead" because of Roe v Wade. What a joke! Do you think that we would have all those people here today if that decision had never been made? Ridiculous.There would still have been an awful lot of them. And how would we have provided for all of them even if there had been no abortions? Anti-choice people never have that answer.

Yeah, there would be more people, no doubt about it. Some of them would be provided for, well enough, and some would not. To a point, we don't provide for the people we have now, well enough.

We don't know how a given pregnancy would have turned out, what type of person would have resulted, how they'd be cared for, etc. There'd be some good, and there'd be some bad. No reason to not allow women the freedom they now have in the matter.

Doug

And so Doug comes full circle, and might realize that your the illogical mind, and have just condemned yourself as being illogical, in your pick and chose reply to me.Learned from being a quite bible thumping child of a God, that made abortion a act of loving sacrifice to Jesus. Do you realize that those italics around "no one has a good argument" is from you Doug, It's your words Doug. Your the illogical person who wrote those words Doug, which you now send back to me as illogical, and the old saw of not being able to prove a negative. You just argued against yourself Doug, and accused yourself of being illogical!!!!!!!!!!
Your world of trying to reason, Doug, began at your parent's pro-death Methodist/Quaker religion, which perfected picking out one line, a word, a sentence, in a paragraph, and making it fit their already made conclusions.
And now your a agnostic, which is the where the weakest mind in philosophical matters always lives , since the only thing a agnostic knows, is that he/she ABSOLUTELY doesn't know, or know.But, for real fun and chuckles, Doug might even try to explain his not sure, don't know, made up from his self wishing imagination Methodology type of God.
It's the old get off the pot, or take a poop mind. Which leads to the cowards way of life in all decisions of life where pain is avoided and pleasure is pursued as a positive gained.
But, for matters concerning his parent's religion, that made Jesus into the God that murders his own creation in the womb, their is no doubt that Doug still carries that Protestant religion in his agnostic mind of today, though a don't know, not sure, might be, it's possible as impossible possum, is secondary to his first principle of Hedonism, that measures all matters in life through pleasure gained and pain lessened.
Can't blame ya Doug, for turning out as that almost infinte number of human beings who simply want as much pleasure before you die NOT(a) Knowing(gnosis) enough, to know that you absolutlely don't know, or not know.
Hmmm, there is that "NOT" in your agnostism, and you actually run around trying to play logic games, and again are condemning yourself without knowing it from being incapable of forming a logical thought of more then one word, line, or a sentence.
Doug is a NOT, in his philosophy known as Agnosticism, and then doesn't get the ignorance of himself as being illogical enough to write that "one can't prove a negative" or NOT. See it yet Doug? I doubt you will get it Doug. I'm agnostic about your ability to "not" know your own illogical reasoning begins with a "not" "internalized" within your own chosen philosophical reasoning.
But you go Doug, Jesus has a plan for you Doug. It began at the time of your conception where Jesus decided that your not going to be "given up",sacrificed, to the health of your mother, or her wealth, or her power of just deciding if you lived or died, by the authority/truth granted her by the murdering Jesus of mainline Protestantism.
And that is why I like you Doug, because you were intelligent enough to stop the increase in numbers of the followers of Jesus, that allows abortion, by the truth,power, and glory of Jesus setting them free to murder their own creation.
Now Doug, don't try and say I'm only picking and chosing the "bad things" in the religion of the Annointed One that set his followers free to murder their creation.
All cultures/religions have abortion, and those words are yours Doug. So, you must have yourself confused again if your thinking I'm making Protestants into a "bad" religion, when they are a good religion that conforms to your own words that admit abortion is universal in world culture. And remember Doug, culture includes religion as I am using the word culture.
Think Doug, I'm not giving your parent's religion that invented a God that allows his/her followers the right to murder their creation in the womb, a "bad name".
It's a good religion, a wonderful God, that is just another invention of imagination that conforms to your fact that abortion is eternal in humankind, and to accuse me of giving Protestants a bad name is your projecting upon me to make me "bad". Get real Doug, I didn't invent your parent's religion of Methodist/Quaker, that used their holy book, taken apart, line by line, to invent the God that murders his creation, by setting his worshippers free to abort their creation.
I'm not John Wesley or George Fox, Doug, who invented some God that your parent's worshipped which created your earliest thoughts about Jesus being unable to hold you under his sway and fictions.
That's why I tip my hat to you Doug, you dropped their God that they worshipped.
Is that not a good thang Doug?
Or is it a "bad" thang, Doug, if one must use the word "bad", since Doug has used it when it suits his insult upon me from thinking I'm being "bad" writing about the Jesus that has set his faithful followers free to murder their personal creation.

.

BTW Doug, this "innner doubt" you mention about me, is more about you and your agnosticism.
See the projection Doug?
First thing a agnostic has/says/ thinks is a DOUBT.Now explain to me agnosticism without using the word DOUBT in any sentence that explains your philosophic reasoning for being a agnostic.
I doubt if one can prove God, or not prove God.
I doubt if heaven or hell exist.
I doubt knowing absolute truth because I doubt knowing absolute truth can exist absolutely.
Me doubt? What Doug?

I feel the same way about those moronic gold fetus feet.

Posted by: FetusFascist at February 21, 2008 11:40 AM

I wear those all the time. Young and old comment on them. I say how cute and sweet they are and especially tell the children that is just how their feet looked while they were still growing in momma's belly. You can see it in their eyes, the wheels are turning.

They get it.

I wear those all the time. Young and old comment on them. I say how cute and sweet they are and especially tell the children that is just how their feet looked while they were still growing in momma's belly. You can see it in their eyes, the wheels are turning.
They get it.

Hippie, I wear them too, and my kids love them. They know that they are the exact size and shape of the feet of a baby at 10 weeks gestation. I have about three pins with those feet and wear them in memory of my little one.

Bethany & Hippie -

My Mom was big in the Pro-life movement and when we were going through her stuff after she died, we found some of the originals ones - much more sturdy then what they are now. There was one pin that looked really worn out, so that is the one I wear all the time since I know those were the ones she wore.

It's kinda funny - I had never heard of nor seen the wire hanger pins until this post.

And so Doug comes full circle, and might realize that your the illogical mind, and have just condemned yourself as being illogical, in your pick and chose reply to me.Learned from being a quite bible thumping child of a God, that made abortion a act of loving sacrifice to Jesus. Do you realize that those italics around "no one has a good argument" is from you Doug, It's your words Doug. Your the illogical person who wrote those words Doug, which you now send back to me as illogical, and the old saw of not being able to prove a negative. You just argued against yourself Doug, and accused yourself of being illogical!!!!!!!!!!

:: laughing ::

Dang, yllas, I could hear that exclamation point key getting hammered clear over here. ; )

"no one has a good argument" against your parent's God

Yeah, I know part of that was my words, and it was in reply to a question about my opinion. I was asked, I answered. Heck, I'm not ignoring you - is that what you want?

The point in this thread, however, was that what argument "against a god" can there really be? How do you propose to prove there are no gods? Well, there you go - it's the logical fallacy of trying to prove the negative, or asking for it as if it's a valid point in debate. And this was on your part, not anybody else's. So when we get to "illogical" it's you, Babe.