I'm quite proud of Focus on the Family for their stance on a homosexual judge. No one ought to be denied a nomination because they're homosexual.

But I'm slightly confused: why were they protesting Focus on the Family?

I think they didn't feel McCain was PL enough to justify voting for Vannah.

Misguided? Misdirected? Fringe? Wierd?

Wouldn't their efforts promoting the PL cause be much better utilized in their local church, stirring the believers to physically peaceful yet spiritually violent prayer and activism against abortion providers in their immediate area?

The only way to have changed the results of last year's election would have been for the Christian Church, including members from each Christian denomination, to vote for McCain.

I don't see what these two thought there were going to accomplish.

Wasn't ARTL prominent in the mountain top sign in Denver during the Dem convention? Or am I getting my groups confused???

Yes, Andy, that was ARTL, doing something great in that case.

"Upon the death of late-term abortionist George Tiller, Bob Enyart was quoted in the Los Angeles Times as stating, "If a Mafia hit man gets killed, people recognize it's an occupational hazard."

I have steered clear of making such statements, because good people get killed as "occupational hazard[s]," too, and I don't want to go there."

Have You steered cleared so that people wouldn't take your quote out of context and distort it as you have Enyart's quote?

Had you sought some context you would clearly understand that he wasn't talking about good people that work dangerous jobs.
He was referring to evil violent people who eventually have a violent end. Those who live by the sword, then eventually die by the sword.
While we do not promote or endorse a gang banger getting killed... if he keeps up that lifestyle long enough we would certainly not be surprised if he met a violent end to his own life.
God gave the government authority and the command to punish evil doers severely, swiftly and certainly. Much as God tells parents not to provoke their children to wrath, when government fails to punish crime, people are provoked to wrath and tempted to seek personal revenge.
This temptation motivates some parents when the man who molests their child goes unpunished. It also motivates some to seek personal revenge against an abortionist who murders innocent kids.
Taking personal vengeance is evil and should be punished... but if the government punished evildoers properly, many fewer people would be tempted to take personal vengeance.
The man who murdered Tiller is fully guilty. The government is also guilty.

Well, Vannah, since the Bible clearly says that homosexuality is wrong (an abomination), we should not support putting homosexuals in positions of authority. Also, Focus on the Family is a pro-family organization - you know, marriage is one man and one woman, with no perversions.

I think the purpose of protesting Focus on the Family is to encourage them to only support candidates that are 100% pro-life, as any pro-family organization should. I may not personally be so invested as to protest Focus - I'll do my best in other areas - but I admire the depth of conviction and the lengths they have gone to to hold James Dobson to his word. There are many different ways to stand up for the babies - we each need to do our part!

My question is why wouldn't anyone protest Focus on the Family?
Dobson is a self-appointed Guru of Everything who thinks that people stripping in front of each other in gyms for phys ed is an important part of growing up (as I read in one of his columns 10 years ago).
He says it's OK for married couples to use artificial contraception.
He also supported _Gonzalez v. Carhart_, a Supreme Court ruling that said that abortion is a fundamental right and all but one form of late-term abortion are legal.

Jennifer,

Are you for living by punishment or exclusion based on all acts called abominations in the Old Testament?

"Are you for living by punishment or exclusion based on all acts called abominations in the Old Testament?"

This is a moot point since homosexual behavior is clearly condemned in the New Testament.

Hi Ed,
Here is a link that will give you a better understanding of why these Christians were at Focus on the Family.

http://artlaction.com/release/20080825/james-dobson-violates-pledge-made-invoking-god

This is a link that will answer your question about John McCain's pro-choice record:

http://artlaction.com/release/20080825/james-dobson-violates-pledge-made-invoking-god

How far have we fallen when Christian's will support leaders who are willing to kill even one innocent kid. When George Bush gets to heaven, do you think God will commend him for being pro-life as Jim Dobson has? or do you think he might focus on the 111,801 children that were directly killed with his approval in the name of "exceptions?"

darrelb,

And where exactly would that be?

Romans 1:18-32

18The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
21For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

24Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.

26Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. 27In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

28Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.
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Emphasis mine

Well, Vannah, since the Bible clearly says that homosexuality is wrong (an abomination), we should not support putting homosexuals in positions of authority.

Posted by: Jennifer at June 15, 2009 4:03 PM

There are lots of things that the bible says are wrong and an abomination. Do you suggest applying all things the bible condemns as a litmus test for those in positions of authority?

I am not interested in the personal lives of government officials, unless they choose to tout their personal life as a sort of identity politics merit badge. I am only interested in the policies they support, their voting record or court rulings, and relevant experience. One's sexuality, whether considered an abomination or not, does not indicate to me how well or poorly a judge will perform. Now, the judge's position on homosexual marriage would provide some necessary insight, but I would be interested to know how any potential person of authority felt about that.

Darrellb, I understood his context, and it is true that violent people are more prone to suffer violent ends than nonviolent people.

But good people still die at the hands of murderers, so as I stated in my post, I steer clear of making blanket statements such as Enyart's.

Ahh, We thought so. It seems you forget to continue or to digest what follows.

Romans 2:1-3
1Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.

2But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things.

3And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?

Another "blanket statement" goes:

"All who take the sword will perish by the sword"

Jesus-Matthew 26:52

Pain, you make Darrelb's point
We are not to judge evil, if we are "doing the same thing" (that would be a hypocrite.)

This is ridiculous. John McCain has an excellent pro life voting record, especially when you stack it up against Barry. If McCain was President we certainly wouldn't have this culture of death since almost everyone Barry has appointed to cabinet or other jobs has been rabidly pro abortion.

Does anyone remember the Matthew25 network? That "Christian" group that said Barry was "pro life" and that he would work to "reduce abortions."

Now that was something to be offended about.

Pain @ June 15, 2009 7:01 PM
--------

Do you really think Romans 2:1-3 means don't judge? Or does it mean there should be no hypocrisy in judgement?

Let's take the passage you provided, but we'll skip the Old English of the KJV and use the NIV. Additionally, it would be wrong to cut someone off in the middle of their argument. In this case Paul provides the completion of his argument in Romans 2:11:

1You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things. 2Now we know that God's judgment against those who do such things is based on truth. 3So when you, a mere man, pass judgment on them and yet do the same things, do you think you will escape God's judgment? 4Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, tolerance and patience, not realizing that God's kindness leads you toward repentance? 5But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God's wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. 6God "will give to each person according to what he has done." 7To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11For God does not show favoritism.

-----

So this is avoiding being hypocritical - and seeking the good, judging in truth. True repentance puts God in charge of all of your life. Condemnation is not from others, but from our own failings, which is who we're responsible for - ourselves. But to repent and offer yourself to God is to trust in truth (John 14:6).

If you do that, then you'll see the one who's doing the judging is not the repentant believer, but actually the in-dwelling Holy Spirit. John 16:7-11:

7But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. 8When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: 9in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; 10in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; 11and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.

-----
So it is not about judging others, but repenting and submitting yourself to God to let the Holy Spirit work through you to bring about conviction of the prince of this world and all those who follow him in doing evil.

Joanne,

"John McCain has an excellent pro life voting record"

http://artlaction.com/release/20081012/john-mccains-tragic-pro-abortion-record

I just love that saying he has on his shirt: "Truth is Hate to those who Hate the Truth".

"If a Mafia hit man gets killed, people recognize it's an occupational hazard."

I would prefer: "If I.R.A. terrorists get blown up by their own bombs in Belfast, people recognize it's good riddance to rubbish."