New Stanek WND.com column, “Planned Parenthood’s unplanned pro-life advocate”
I, like everyone else who has opened Abby Johnson’s new book, UnPlanned, couldn’t put it down….
Abby’s book contains several insights, but what I gained most from reading UnPlanned was a better understanding of the abortion worker’s mind.
Abby challenged my preconceived notions from the start, literally, in her foreword…
Oh how we love to vilify our opponents.… How easy to assume that those on “our” side are right and wise and good; how those on “their” side are treacherous and foolish and deceptive. I have found right and good and wisdom on both sides. I have found foolishness and treachery and deception on both sides as well….
In all likelihood, as you look through the fence, you see faulty thinking and harmful behavior on the other side. Here’s my question for you: are you ready to look through the fence and see goodness, compassion, generosity, and self-sacrifice on the other side?
To be honest, not really. But because I trusted Abby as one of us now, and also as one speaking from experience, I decided to open my mind a little….
Coincidentally, Abby’s clinic was the first where the 40 Days for Life campaign was ever attempted.
It was intriguing to read the perspective of clinic workers observing that first historic 40 Days effort. Abby wrote….
Continue reading my column today, “Planned Parenthood’s unplanned pro-life advocate,” at WorldNetDaily.com.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
Great article!
Like I said, Abby is a very personable human being. I can’t wait to read her book!
I question what she sees as “foolishness” though. She has vilified other pro-lifers and that really disappointed me. I honestly don’t think every clinic worker is a walking demon. I know there are those who support abortion who have good hearts and mean well and are compassionate, nice people. But they are definitely deceived! no one who is good can support the dismemberment of infants. So if they’re good yet support abortion I know they are deceived. period. That is so black and white that to suggest otherwise shows that perhaps Abby’s own mind has not quite healed from her years in the abortion industry. I’m sure Abby is a personable, nice, sweet, loving person. I get the overall point she is trying to make. I just wish that while she defends abortion workers she would stop trying to vilify other pro-lifers. That is my ONLY complaint about her. After talking with other pro-lifers though I can see how she is still trying to heal and deal with the guilt she must feel after participating in abortion for all those years.
It would be interesting to hear what PP is saying about her and the book. I can just imagine – the usual attack from the Left goes something like this:1. She’s faking everything – she is still pro choice.2. She did not quit because she saw the abortion, but because her performance was not up to par and she got a poor review or was going to be let go and she is writing this “tell all” as revenge.3. She helped in many abortions, not just that one that changed her.I have not read the book yet, and I wonder if the bookstores would place a book such a groundbreaking item as this in the front of the store or in displays. It will be hidden – you will be mocked by the cashiers when you buy it. There is always a very vocal well connected minority of abortion supporters, elitist New York Times reading NPR listening non Christian urban dwellers, women mostly, Cafeteria Catholics, pagans, and college students who will see to it that the pro life movement is akin to the worst Nazis, and child abusing NAMBLA members – they are experts in demonizing us.Has PP also threatening Abby physically? I would think such a well connected and powerful institution as PP would have enforcers of a more clandestine nature like all large corporations and very wealthy individuals have. Sorry for sounding too much like a conspiracy theorist but these thoughts I cannot help have especially with all the money and prestige PP can loose because of this important book.
(Disclaimer: I haven’t read Abby’s book yet.)
Sydney,
“no one who is good can support the dismemberment of infants.”
The thing is, not all pro-abortion advocates see unborn children as unborn children. to them, an abortion is like having a mole removed. sickening, I know, but it’s important to recognize that those who call themselves pro-choice aren’t always cognizant of the choice they’re advocating. I once considered abortion to be “a necessary evil,” and it wasn’t until I became Catholic and started reading more about the abortion issue that I realized how wrong I was. Prior to my conversion, I certainly didn’t feel that I supported “the dismemberment of infants” and if I’d had that level of vitriol flung at me I might have thought twice about doing further research into the issue.
“I just wish that while she defends abortion workers she would stop trying to vilify other pro-lifers.”
There are some pro-lifers who deserve vilifying. There are sinners on both sides of the fence, and I think it’s a mistake to set up a false dichotomy where pro-lifers are always wonderful people and pro-abortion advocates are always evil. Look at Scott Roeder; although he identified as pro-life I think he deserves condemnation for committing murder.
“After talking with other pro-lifers though I can see how she is still trying to heal and deal with the guilt she must feel after participating in abortion for all those years.”
Yes, I think everyone needs to remember, she has had 2 abortions and she worked in the industry for years..it takes time to heal. I hope she allows herself that time..
Many blessings on her and Gods protection….
I listened to the webcast on Monday night and I’ve ordered the book. I’m anxious to read it all. I have read the first chapter. It was very compelling and left me in tears. God bless Abby. She’s got guts.
But I cannot see good and right and wisdom in abortion. I can’t see virtue in killing babies. So I’m not sure I can take Abby up on her challenge… I can see that perhaps there are many pro-choicers with good intentions, who believe they are helping women somehow, but even then, it surely has to dawn on them that a baby is being killed. There is no wisdom or good in that.
Joanna, I agree with you. That is why I disagree with Abby that some pro-choicers ARE deceived. They are not bloodthirsty murderers. They truly think that the unborn are not people. They truly think abortion can sometimes help women. They are not sociopaths, they are truly deceived.
Theresa, I never heard that. I never heard that she had two abortions. I pray Abby will continue to walk her journey towards peace and healing. God will surely use her to save lives.
Before Abby Johnson’s conversion, I was praying very fervently for “a big fish” specifically Cecile Richards. A very wise man said to me once, “God doesn’t say no. Sometimes God says Yes, sometimes God says Not Yet, and sometimes God says I Have Something Better in Mind for You.”
Abby was not the big fish I prayed for, but she’s a medium size fish. And, God bless her, she has cast a mighty big net. Because she’s not an easy-to-stereotype pro-lifer, her net may well catch more abortion workers than you or I could ever hope for. Pray that it holds many fish, so many that we will wonder if we can haul the net without tearing it, so many hauled in from the right side of the boat.
Ninek,
I think we’ll find that Abby is a bigger fish than we thought :)
JoAnna,
Thanks for the insight. Like Sydney, I hadn’t heard that Abby Johnson was twice post-abortive. I had heard that she was converting to the Catholic Church, and I think that as she continues in her journey we’ll see some really great things from her. A lot of wisdom and insight, I hope. :)
I would like to share these with you.
http://jeannie-ology.com/?p=8267
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http://jeannie-ology.com/?p=6225
http://jeannie-ology.com/?p=6015
Do the names Bernard Nathanson, Carol Everett or Norma McCovey ring a bell?
Concerning spirtual things, I would not have you ignorant brothers and sisters.
A change of mind/heart from the ‘dead babies r us’ mindset to one who views the prenatal child as a fellow human being is akin to being ‘born again’. [The angels in heaven rejoice every time this happens.] It is a work of Holy Spirit.
I have interacted with too many of ‘satans posse’ on this web site to be naive enough to believe that reason or logic will disabuse them of the strong delusion which they labor under. The same evil spirit that leads them to do what they do entices and incites them to hate pro-lifers, particularly pro-life christians.
I have stood toe to toe with them and looked them square in the eye and know without a doubt some of them would have killed me on the spot if they believed they could do it with impunity. [They will persecute, imprison, torture and put you to death believing they are doing GOD’s will.]
I have read enough of their babble to know they really believe what they believe.
This same kind of self deception gave us not only heathens, but also Christians, who were slave owners.
German Christians were actively involved in the systematic destruction of millions of God’s ‘chosen people’. Many more were passively involved in that they said or did nothing to resist the barbarians who were in power.
I am grateful that Abby Johnson has been deliverd from deception. I pray that she will find comlete fogiveness, redemption, healing and restoration in Jesus.
I do not doubt Abby’s sincerity, but it is unrealistic to believe that she has some ‘new’ insight that will resolve a conflict that has been raging for more than 40 years.
The ‘dead babies r us’ folks have not sinned against me.
They have sinned against the millions of pre-natal children who have been killed and they have sinned agains GOD. I have no authority or capacity to forgive them for either.
I am only authorized to forgive them for their sins against me. As I sit here now I am not aware of any sins against me.
Apart from Holy Spirit’s leading I have no desire to break bread with these people.
Can light have fellowship with darkness?
“I have stood toe to toe with them and looked them square in the eye and know without a doubt some of them would have killed me on the spot if they believed they could do it with impunity.”
You’re really as deranged as anyone on this site ever was if you honestly think that a single pro-choice person here or anywhere has even the slightest inclination to kill you for your beliefs. I seriously can’t believe you even typed this. I guess this really is the caliber of people I’m dealing with here. What is it about actively participating in a fringe, counter-cultural movement that has experienced failure after failure for decades that causes the development of a persecution complex this strong? I’ve encountered people here who have expressed views that I consider borderline totalitarian in nature, but I’m pretty sure no one here would try to kill me if they thought they could get away with it.
Well said yor bro ken
Joan, did you ever hear of pro-lifer Jim Pouillon? He was murdered for being pro-life. Last year there were also several incidents of men pulling guns on pro-lifers at clinics and also a woman pulled a knife on a pro-lifer. Not to mention a pro-abort on this very site once wished my son dead because I am pro-life. Do I think every pro-abort wants to kill pro-lifers? No, but I certainly think there are a few in your ranks who would kill pro-lifers if they could. Absolutely. They’ve said as much.
Of course you don’t feel threatened by us Joan. We are pro-LIFE. That means we are pro the life of people we disagree with also.
And a head guy at our local Planned Parenthood came very close to me with his car, on purpose. If I stepped just 2 inches to my left, which i would usually had done, he would have hit me. (he came behind me on the alley-way – and with my hearing, I did not hear him coming… After twice his taunts, saying that I had to be careful about getting run over (and trust me – the way he said it was very menacing) - I did make a complaint to the police and he kept his distance ever since.
He no longer works there.
So really – things do happen. I don’t wish him any malice. He was just a really angry guy and he did not like us. We kept praying for him though and were cordial.
But honestly, in all the years we said hello, we never saw him smile. He was always upset and angry.
There’s nothing pro-choice about someone who would murder someone else for their beliefs. The pro-choice position is one that fundamentally respects the pluralistic nature of a free society, even if that encompasses opposing beliefs.
“There’s nothing pro-choice about someone who would murder someone else for their beliefs.”
Just as there is nothing “pro-choice” about murdering someone because of their place of residence — in the womb.
Protip, Jill: if you’re glad that pro-choicers are listening, you may want to stop bringing other issues (read: homosexuality) up. You may think that it SHOULDN’T drive them away, but it will regardless of what you think should happen. So. Why. Do. It?
I just wish that while she defends abortion workers she would stop trying to vilify other pro-lifers
Sydney,
I heard Abby speak at a Conference. She was a part of 2 talks and I heard both of them. (I even got a chance to briefly talk with her specifically about the truth to her story–she said everything is true).
I don’t think she’s “villifying” any pro-lifers, I think she just wants to see things in another way.
There are some in the pro-choice/abort side that honestly think they are doing nothing wrong. What Abby’s point has been that the approach Shawn Carney and the others she talked to used on her wasn’t to call her names or tell her she was a baby killer. They actually talked to her respectfully.
She and Shawn said that while they didn’t see eye to eye when she was working for PP, they always treated each other respectfully. They would even greet each other. He wished she could see the pro-life side and she thought he was a nice guy that didn’t understand. (I’m summarizing here).
She honestly is pro-life now, but she’s not the same kind of pro-lifer as you and I. She’s been on both sides of the fence so she sees parts of the picture we may not even be able to comprehend. (I can never understand being fine with abortion and I’m sure a good number of pro-lifers feel the same way).
The impression I got was that she recognizes how misguided the pro-abort/choice side of the argument is. She also knows just how motivated by the monetary gain of abortion places like PP are.
There ARE pro-lifers who don’t help the pro-life argument at all. Try not to take it as a personal offense. She honestly wants to help the pro-life side.
The “pro-choice” position does NOT “respect” anything.
It allows the total destruction of every member of the human race.
Mother in Texas, I have never met Abby but I was friends with her on facebook. She was constantly bashing pro-life organizations by name, claiming they want to kill abortionists (not true) and getting angry with anyone who called her on it. I finally had to delete her from my friends because I was tired of reading her constant complaints and downright lies she posted about pro-life organizations. Thats what I’m referring to.
But now finding out she is post-abortive, plus when you consider all her years at PP it makes much more sense to me now. I have no doubt her conversion is genuine. But as Dr. Nadal told me during a phone conversation we had, its one thing to know you’re forgiven and its another to FEEL forgiven. What kind of guilt and sadness must she feel over the loss of two of her children and knowing she participated in the murder of many children through the years at PP. Plus several pro-lifers pointed out to me, its going to take time to deprogram from the PP mindset. Thats not gonna happen overnight.
So I am def going to buy this book and read it. I am praying for Abby. I think she will be a huge champion for life. I hope she continues on her journey towards total peace. She still obviously has a lot of healing to do.
it was one pro-lifer dressed as the Grim Reaper and another holding a large placard of an aborted baby
Did you read that, Randall Terry?
Considering that whenever it is pointed out to some on the pro-abortion side that abortion is murder, their retort is that it’s not murder because murder is a legal term and abortion is legal, I have no doubt that some of them would kill pro-lifers if it was not considered “murder” to do so. The violent reaction of some pro-aborts toward pro-lifers at the abortion mills, as well as the angry and violent reaction to the San Francisco Walk for Life is proof of that. Take a look at these photos from the first SF Walk for Life (WARNING: vulgar and disturbing images at this link):
http://zombietime.com/walk_for_life/
I would say that pro-aborts fall into four main categories:
1 – Apathetic pro-aborts. The largest percentage of pro-aborts are those people who close their ears and close their minds whenever the issue comes up. They just don’t want to hear about it; they typically assume that whatever claims pro-lifers make about the unborn child and abortion are lies, and just want to leave what they believe to be “well enough” alone. Talking to them about abortion is like trying to convince a brick wall.
2 – Well-intended pro-aborts. The next largest group of pro-aborts is people like Abby Johnson who seem to genuinely believe that in taking part in abortion they are truly helping women. Frequently they are deceived by deceptive slogans like “right to choose”, and are convinced that the unborn child is nothing but a “blob of tissue”, at least until they learn otherwise.
3 – Angry pro-aborts. The next-to-smallest group consists of angry, hateful, and irrational people who insist that pro-lifers/conservatives/Republicans/Christians are evil monsters who are out to ruin their lives. There is very little reasoning with these people.
4 – Diabolical pro-aborts. The smallest group, these are completely rational evil people who have full knowledge of abortion and completely understand that abortion is killing and probably should be considered murder and yet they support it anyway out of malice. We should not confuse pro-aborts from the other three groups with these people.
I would say that pro-lifers fall into similar groups:
1 – “Justice” pro-lifers – I think it’s safe to say that most pro-lifers are motivated by justice, that is, they support the right of innocent life to exist, but not the rights of the guilty. This is why they are anti-abortion but pro-death penalty.
2 – “Consistent Life Ethic” pro-lifers – The next largest group is people who are against taking any human life, be it an unborn baby or a mass murderer. Usually highly religious, this is the group most heavily represented at the March for Life and Walk for Life.
3 – “All or nothing” pro-lifers – The branch of the pro-life movement which demands that all abortion be outlawed immediately and oppose any laws or actions which lower or restrict abortion without completely outlawing it. Sometimes these more militant folks clash with the above listed groups.
4 - Violent pro-lifers – A tiny sliver of the pro-life movement, condemned by the rest of it, will resort to violence. But of course the media presents these people as rank-and-file pro-life activists.
I work with an amazing woman who used to work at PP. She became a Christian during the time she worked there. It is a PP where abortions are not taking place. She was typically at the front desk and never did the actual “counseling” in the “back room.” She says that most people who work there truly do not fully grasp all that happens at PP nationwide, or that they are the #1 provider of surgical abortions nationwide.
Call it “denial” or whatever you want. She was there for a well-paid, part-time job that offered FULL benefits. She became stuck working there because of financial reasons.
She realized quickly she could NEVER tell anyone at church where she worked because of the *gasps* and judgment she would receive.
She eventually quit her job at PP and came to work for me (I am the director of a Pregnancy Center).
We need to reach out to those who work on the “other side.” We even invited the local director of our PP to visit our pregnancy center. She spent two hours at our center, and was a very impressive woman. We, in turn, were invited to visit their PP office.
Those who work at PP are NOT our enemies. Satan is our enemy. Period. If you are a Christian, it is your job to love each and every one of those people who work there or anywhere in the abortion industry. It is God’s job to draw them out.
Well said Robin…
lovely Robin!
Ok..I just got the book so I have not read it yet, but in more then 2 articles today(one is in Christianity Today) I read the press picking up on something Abby said :
“She says she has been ridiculed for her opposition to engaging in any type of illegal activity or using violence.”
I have been doing Pro life work for over 20 years and I do not know one person who advocates violence. Troubling…
“Here’s my question for you: are you ready to look through the fence and see goodness, compassion, generosity, and self-sacrifice on the other side?”
That is what we are called to do. It is called humility – before God but that must go even to Man. Even our lord said “Father, forgive them for they know not what they do”. Yes, they destroy infants. But they don’t see the humanity there. Or his words to us that they will put you out of the synagogue and even kill you and think they are doing God’s will.
The righteous can too easily become self-righteous and hate sinners instead of the sin. Abortion becomes an excuse to vilify clinic workers. The goal of saving lives is shouted down – literally – by vitriolic and loud, but foolish speech.
They aren’t manical psychopathic killers – they think they are doing something good, and probably do good elsewhere. But they are so bent that they are fixing the situation by killing. But even in history before they knew better, doctors would spread infection and do things like bleed people – and this was to help, not hurt.
When they look through the fence, they can see no small amount of evil on our side.
“To be honest, not really.”
By the standard we judge, we will be judged. If so, and if you aren’t going to look for Jesus in everyone – including abortionists are they not justified in treating every pro-lifer like Tiller’s assassin?
Do not think you can sin elsewhere, and we all sin, and simply plead before the bema seat that “but we were pro-life”.
I do not look for Jesus in abortionists.
They know exactly what they are doing, they see the bodies of the tiny babies that they suck out of women’s wombs everyday.
I DO pray for them though!!
I shall leave the final judgment up to God.
TZ, explain to me where in the Bible it is told to us to “look for Jesus in everyone”. Where does it say that?
Sure many abortion clinic workers think they are doing good. There are even abortionists who feel dread and guilt over what they do but think if they don’t do it “women will do it themselves and die”. And then there are others like Tiller and Carhart who glory in the little limbs they rip out of women’s wombs. Not all pro-aborts are EVIL incarnate. Not all pro-aborts have any shred of good in them either. You can’t lump all pro-aborts in one category or another because they are PEOPLE and they are all unique.
But don’t be deceived. Evil exists and evil people exist. We should be loving and continue to pray for these lost souls but we should not let down our guard or be less than discerning. The Bible says whoa to those that call evil good.
For sure we are ALL sinners in need of Gods mercy no matter what side of the issue we are on. As a post abortive person who has been forgiven I would be the first to admit that and I hope show the mercy I have been shown, but we also need to remember that evil does exist…
As for Abby, like I said the other day, she has lost 2 children to abortion and worked in the industry for years…it must be hard being thrown out there in such a public forum so soon after her conversion.. I continue to pray for her protection and healing and that her eyes remain on Jesus, mercy Himself! …many blessing on her!
Theresa, read that same article. I’ve been pro-life since I was 8 and doing pro-life work since I was 13. I have marched in marches for life, prayed outside of our local PP, volunteered at Birthright and I have NEVER seen violence or heard anyone be violent. I have never seen any kind of illegal activity advocated. In fact when we are peacefully protesting or marching it is the pro-choicers who throw bottles at us from their cars, scream, curse, tell us they’re going to find us and kill us (had one college aged boy tell me and some other women he was going to rape us as we walked to our cars… yeah, pro-choice boys are soooo pro-woman!)
I don’t know why Abby continues to spew nonsense like this. I hope she will sort it all out in her mind and think before she speaks. She is a deeply troubled woman.
Whatever you did to the least of these…
Sorry ladies. I don’t like abortionists either but they are nonetheless human, and made in the image and likeness of God. Deluded, sad, miserable humans who run and hide from Truth by engaging in immoral behaviors. Christ died for those sins, too, so that we ALL might be reconciled to Him.
We can and should decry their decision to do Satan’s work both to their face and elsewhere. This does not detract from the fact that we must look for the image of God in them and speak to that goodness.
As for Abby Johnson’s statements, I don’t know any violent pro-lifers personally, but I am certainly aware that they are out there. I would imagine that her efforts and notoriety would result in a higher likelihood of running into them and hearing them spew vitriol.
Mary Rose, how do you know that there are “certainly” violent pro-lifers out there? Who told you that? Pro-choicers?
No one is saying an abortionist is less than human or not created in the image of God. They are still sons of Adam though, with a sinful dark heart. The Bible says the heart is “desperately wicked” and deceitful! How does it do an abortionist who is lost and in need of redemption any good to sugar coat the travesty he/she commits and pretend they are okie dokie? Certainly we should be kind and loving, NO ONE IS SAYING WE SHOULD BE MEAN AND NASTY but you and Abby sound like you want pro-lifers to go “oh well, she aborts babies all day but she’s really okay. She’s a sweetheart” HUH?
Someone who aborts children is definitely enslaved to their father the devil. How will they see their need for a Savior if everyone acts like pro-lifers must pretend like abortion is no big deal and whitewash everything?
“She says she has been ridiculed for her opposition to engaging in any type of illegal activity or using violence.”
Can someone please tell me EXACTLY where this was said or printed?
Even if she DID say it, there ARE people in the pro-life movement who are the extremists. They do believe they are completely justified in killing doctors. That has been proven. One of the things Abby says is there are total extremists on both sides of the issue.
I have read the book. I see some people bashing Abby Johnson for something that may have been completely taken out of context. And some people who are judging her without even knowing her personally. Talk about hurting our own.
Sydney,
Why does respecting the abortionist’s humanity mean being buddy-buddy to you? Why is it that I can’t remember that even an abortionist is a human and still make it clear that I do not support his/her choice to kill babies for a livelihood?
When you make statements such as, “Not all pro-aborts have any shred of good in them either,” it makes me nervous. Yes they do. Every human was made in the image and likeness of God. We ALL have good in us. Including those who commit murders daily. Including Hitler, Stalin, Sanger, and Tiller. All of us.
I’m not about to be extra nice to those whose incredibly damaging and evil behaviors I decry, but I am also not about to forget their humanity.
And yes, there are those whose actions do not reflect well upon the pro-life community. There are those who, in their misguided minds, believe that the best course of action involves the murder of abortionists or planting pipe bombs in Planned Parenthood affiliates. They aren’t exactly exemplary models of our movement but because they affiliate themselves with us, it is understandable that Abby Johnson would make such statements as she has.
Honestly, you’d think that I’d said something big and awful rather than simply acknowledging that there is good and evil on BOTH sides.
Abby sound like you want pro-lifers to go “oh well, she aborts babies all day but she’s really okay. She’s a sweetheart” HUH?
I have yet to see Abby say or write this. I haven’t read her book, yet, but I’ve been to two of her talks and talked to her personally. I’ve also read some of her blog entries.
She is against killing babies, but she recognizes there might be ways of getting more people on our side than what we have been using–other ways that could prove quite effective.
She is now pro-life. She has stated this. She said her change of heart is exactly that. She simply sees the humanity in many of the abortion works. She’s been on both sides. She has a perspective not everyone in the pro-life movement has.
Tearing her down isn’t going to get rid of abortion. It’s not going to help our side.
We can’t let our sense of humanity get drowned in our outrage/anger over abortion.
And yes, there are most certainly violent pro-lifers. I don’t agree with their tactics but they do exist.
MaryRose, where am I not making myself clear here? I AGREE WITH YOU that abortionists are made in the image of God. You can move past that point now. I AGREE WITH YOU.
Where in the Bible does it say that everyone has a “shred of good” in them? The Bible I read says all mankind is born fallen, estranged from God, God’s ENEMY, lovers of their father the devil. Please show me the verse that says someone living a wicked life in direct violation of God’s Word has “good” in them.
I can look at an abortionist and feel compassion and not hate. I can pray for him/her. I can know that God can take that wicked life and transform it and use it to His honor and glory. But I will NEVER look at someone who pulls arms and legs off defenseless human beings and say “Hey, you have good in you!” Until the Holy Spirit resides in someone there IS NO GOOD. Thats biblical.
Sydney,
You can look at someone, say, “There is absolutely zero good in you,” and still feel compassion for them?
Where in the Bible does it say that until the Holy Spirit resides in one, he or she is without good? I’m willing to accept that I’ve gotten myself into a losing argument, but I don’t see it, honestly. I can’t think of anything that is NOT good about God. If we are made in His likeness, how can we possibly be without ANY good in us? I am trying to make it clear that I am open to what you have to say here but I don’t agree at this time.
I want to make it explicitly clear that I do not believe that there is anything redeeming about abortion. It is the abortionist I am not so willing to write off. I think that it would be very difficult to exist as a human without a shred of good. Does he never treat his wife with love? That’s a good action. Does he never sacrifice for his children? That is a good action. How can anyone be completely devoid of all good?
You know in re-reading our discussion here MaryRose I think we are thinking the same thing its just not getting across that way. I do think there CAN be good in someone but not that they ARE (or are doing) good when they do abortions all day. I know what I’m thinking but I can’t seem to articulate it properly.
I mean, are you prepared to say that Hitler was good? Because he might have been kind to his secretary or hugged his mom that he was good? Just because a human being has the capacity to do something good does not mean he IS good. I also think Hitler COULD HAVE BEEN good. There is that ability in all of us to either be good or evil. We have free will. I think there are those that absolutely make the choice to be evil. It does not mean they can’t ever be redeemed or restored. Look at St. Paul who murdered thousands of Christians including women and children. And God redeemed him and used him mightily. So I guess I can look at an abortionist and say that they have the propensity deep inside them to do good . Like a seed. But that seed can’t push up through that hard heart rooted in evil without the Holy Spirit. Any one can put on a show but God sees the heart. Someone can pretend to be good and truly have an evil heart. Someone can seem evil but deep inside still has that seed to do right. God sees the heart.
I once read where the pro-lifers protesting a certain clinic (that used to be an old church) would shovel the snow for the abortionist whenever there was a snowstorm. They would greet the abortionist and be very kind to him. He was so shocked at their kindness he eventually left the industry. I don’t know if he converted but he stopped killing, praise God. So I know the point you are trying to make is that we should be loving towards the pro-abortion side. We should be kind and treat them as fellow human beings and not as monsters. I agree. No one is out of reach of God’s redemption.
Sydney,
*Big sigh of relief*! I’m so glad to hear that! It didn’t seem very consistent with what I’ve read of your posts before to think so aggressively uncharitably.
I think we can say with some confidence that Hitler was not a good man. I’m sure he did some good things, but I would say they were greatly dwarfed by the horrible atrocities he committed. I think we can safely say that his mind & soul were not in a good place. I feel similarly about abortionists, in that I believe they act at times in good ways but that their hearts and souls are in a very bad place. I think they bring evil into the world, and are doing the work of Satan, plain and simple. Very few people are the villain in their own story and I would say that most abortionists have deluded themselves into believing that although they know they are taking lives, they are still doing good. Of course, we know this to be untrue, but that is the sometimes frightening nature of the beast-delusion.
;-) So we do agree MaryRose. We did a little dance here on this thread to arrive at the same destination.
Yes. Next time we dance, we’ll have to try and choose the same tune ;)
here is one of the articles
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2011/januaryweb-only/prolifechallenges.html