Delighting in death
Why is it that the people most vocally committed to causes connected to death (abortion, assisted suicide, euthanasia) are often the same who are committed to progressive sexual causes? And why do abortion advocates frequently see it not as a necessary evil but as a positive good?…
Make no mistake: The giddy, grinning delight which the Gloria Steinems of this world display concerning abortion is driven by more than just the desire to stop rape victims having unwanted children. It is powered by the grotesque thrill which holding power over life and death brings with it….
Some people seem to take a pride in such things which cannot be explained by merely pragmatic criteria such as convenience and choice. Something deeper, something more spiritual, something more sinister, is at work here.
~ Carl Trueman, First Things, April 15
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
Ughhhhh!
Gloria have some self respect. Put down the flabby arms and lose the T shirt. Your college girl days are long gone.
We find the same cognitive dissonance in the alliance of LGBT activists with the abortion industry.
It seems that they would have no interests in common, except for the hope of “progress” via sexual license. Is there a sense of power or something related to acts of sexual selfishness?
We humans can either acknowledge God’s world or be driven to try to replicate it.
Mary… I agree with you. Gloria should put down her vagina hands before she gets out-hand-signaled by a rival gang member.
Why does it always seam like femenists and cheuvenists go hand in hand?
Anyways… I agree with this article totally. The women probably don’t really realize that their glow of power, is not from all the love they feel, but how good crushing the opposition makes them feel. Power is a high, and it get’s addictive being able to silence foes with overpriced high heels, fancy botox treatments of heavy handed celebrity endorsements of your cause. Its not a drug induced high, but it’s similar in its side effects.
power… hmmm… Yes, this is the thing. At a certain point, women have to face the truth though… like when they have had an abortion, and then they deliver a baby afterwards. The reality comes full swing then, and hits them and they have to make a decision: good or evil.
Abortion Doctors have to do the same thing, but its different. Little things happen here and there and they have to decide if they enjoy those things. By “things” I mean, they see the fetus/ embryo intelligently running from their cannula, or the Pre-mie goes into convulsions from the pain of having it’s foot hacked off. They see these things clearly, it’s just we in the pro-life movement can’t get our hands on the ultra sound footage of the gory show. Most of the time they are not recording it anyways.
Deff. more than one abortion Dr has a serial killer joy for death that keeps driving him/her further into the depths of depravity. They even enjoy watching the woman suffer as they commit the act, but have to maintain some level of professional appearance for the nurses present. Belive me, no one would listen if a pregnant woman had an abortion, and came out telling everyone that her abortion Dr. seamed to enjoy the event.
Nice feminists. Nice one. “Way to “defend women,” he, he wink wink.”
A sociopath couldn’t imaging a better way to crush dreams and create despair in their targeted victims. And rapists? Well, they LOVE to imaging their targeted victims might go through with an abortion because of them. =rapists suck and so do vampire feminazi’s.
More about Sociopathy
(anti-social or Narcissistic Personality Disorder) here: http://socioplath.blogspot.com/2011/02/pathological-lying.html
Mary: Your college girl days are long gone.
I reckon she knows it, Mary, but that did make me laugh. :P
For all the nutty analyses we run across from time to time, like that from Carl Trueman, Gloria Steinem is really just the flipside of the hardcore fringe on the other side. Individuals on both sides may be wont to like publicity, and may like to thumb their nose, in effect, at those across the divide.
Between Steinem and Trueman, for making up kooky stories, I think Trueman’s got her beat.
“And why do abortion advocates frequently see it not as a necessary evil but as a positive good?…”
They know it is evil but they delude themselves to mask the guilt.
TS: “And why do abortion advocates frequently see it not as a necessary evil but as a positive good?…”
Why the need for such pretend-questions in the first place, Truthseeker? Strawman argument much? ;)
Do you really think that pro-choicers are going to say that having an abortion is better than preventing the pregnancy in the first place?
Well, they are not. It doesn’t exist in some magical place, unconnected to all else. Where does your “positive good” come from?
“Why the need for such pretend-questions in the first place, Truthseeker? Strawman argument much? ;)”
Doug, I didn’t ask that question. That was a quote from the article. Below that quote is my response.
“Where does your “positive good” come from?”
God’s grace.
TS, of course – and I know the question is from Carl Trueman. It’s still asking and answering one’s own question, not a necessary reflection of what the “other side,” pro-choicers in this case, think.
If Carl Trueman was stating that abortion is a positive good, in his opinion, that is one thing, or, per what you said, if it’s “God’s grace,” same deal. And once again – neither of those are the real deal.
The real deal is that it’s like asking, “Why are pro-lifers so bent on enslaving women to their will?” and then saying it’s because they have a sinister malaise of the Spirit.
Anybody can say anything like that, and it boils down to a bunch of BS. Instead of this pretend-stuff, how about we look at what people actually say, rather then lamely try and make up things about them?
Doug, I don’t know Carl Trueman. I was just answering a question that was posted in the article. And if the article had said “Why are pro-lifers so bent on enslaving women to their will?” Then I would have posted a response to that.
Instead of blathering, how about you look at what I actually posted in response to that question? I said that people who are pro-choice to kill babies in the womb know that it is evil but they delude themselves in order to try and avoid feeling guilt about it.
“If Carl Trueman was stating that abortion is a positive good, in his opinion, that is one thing, or, per what you said, if it’s “God’s grace,” same deal. And once again – neither of those are the real deal.”
What are you trying to say here?
They say that demonic possession always has three visible signs:
1) nudity & sexual perversion.
2) violence & death.
3) blasphemy & lies.
I just sayin’…
Yeah, Tommy, you’re right on track. [eyeroll]
Truthseeker: Instead of blathering, how about you look at what I actually posted in response to that question? I said that people who are pro-choice to kill babies in the womb know that it is evil but they delude themselves in order to try and avoid feeling guilt about it.
I really was not “blathering,” but okay – reasonable of you, there. It seems like sometimes discussions easily go off the track.
TS, I don’t see it as necessarily “evil.” After all, life is ending, all the time, all around us. There are a given number of abortions in the US, and there are more births, and a lot more deaths of the fertilized organism due to failure to implant in the uterus. We go on, the US goes on, society goes on, etc., more or less just fine, with all the above.
Really – what harm is done if one woman chooses to end an unwanted pregnancy by abortion? I know that some of your basic assumptions differ from mine, and I am not saying I am any better than you on that score nor that my feelings count for more than yours.
But whether that life ends by failure to implant, or by the conscious will of the woman, the end result is the same. I know the idea is truly horrible to you and many others. The other day, I read an account of the Nazis, who during World War II at one of the “death camps” had a long line of naked women, some holding their kids – I think they were gypsies, perhaps, or Jews of some nationality – just waiting to move forward, to be shot to death.
Well, that is horrible to me. What they must have thought, at that time… After a bit, I thought to myself, “This is the same way that some people feel about abortion.”
In the end, it really is all about feelings.
What I meant about Carl Trueman is that everything is coming from him; he’s not actually addressing true positions of the people he pretends to interpret.
Without knowing much about him, admittedly, I see him as an Al Sharpton type – probably never did an honest day’s work in his life, gets paid for talking. Gets paid for transparent, lame stuff.
people who are pro-choice to kill babies in the womb know that it is evil but they delude themselves in order to try and avoid feeling guilt about it.
Well, some pro-choicers may feel that way, but I don’t think it really works, i.e. if they did think it was “evil” then they wouldn’t be pro-choice in the first place.
Of people who do think it’s “evil,” then we are talking about pro-lifers, and while it’s a lesser percentage than for women as a whole, a good many of them end up having abortions per their own will. Whatever feelings of “evil” they may have, they are still finding that in their situation, there is reason enough to do it. Perhaps they are not really facing all their feelings – they want “a way out” and they’re trying to damp down their emotions to the contrary. If you believe we have free will, then that’s the way it’s gonna be – ain’t no guarantee that one will be forever satisfied with one’s picks (and I do realize that for some women, abortion is the wrong choice).
“TS, I don’t see it as necessarily “evil.” After all, life is ending, all the time, all around us”
Nobody is claiming the it is always evil when people die. People intentionally killing other people (except in self defense) is evil.
Doug said “Do you really think that pro-choicers are going to say that having an abortion is better than preventing the pregnancy in the first place? Well, they are not…”
Can’t lump all pro-choicers in a single “they”. There are some who regret they got pregnant in the first place, but there are also many who get swept up in the battle cry of “I had an abortion and I’m PROUD of it!”, but I rarely hear “I prevented a pregnancy and I’m PROUD of it!”
weird, Gloria….
Truthseeker: Nobody is claiming that it is always evil when people die. People intentionally killing other people (except in self defense) is evil.
TS, I do see the difference there. I’d add that once again – there is more to it than that, when it comes to abortion; there is the pregnant woman to consider – but of course you and I already disagree about several things in the overall discussion.
Eric TL: Can’t lump all pro-choicers in a single “they”.
For sure, in general, but I do stand by what I said about the sentiment that preventing unwanted pregnancies is better than having abortions. I think pro-choicers will be consistent there (same as will be pro-lifers, for that matter).
There are some who regret they got pregnant in the first place, but there are also many who get swept up in the battle cry of “I had an abortion and I’m PROUD of it!”, but I rarely hear “I prevented a pregnancy and I’m PROUD of it!”
Saying, “I’m PROUD of it!” is a response to the far-off fringe on the other side of the debate. Most women are more in, toward the center. Many woman are conflicted about it, i.e it may be a near thing whether to have an abortion or not, to continue the pregnancy or not.
You are right, of course – you don’t see slogans saying they prevented a pregnancy and are proud of it, but then it’s not an issue in the first place.
Mother’s intentionally killing their offspring is probably more evil than you typical robbery/murder where a stranger kills some mother’s child.
It is powered by the grotesque thrill which holding power over life and death brings with it…. – well no, it’s not. It’s powered by the yearning to have power and control over their own reproductive rights and freedoms.
“Do you really think that pro-choicers are going to say that having an abortion is better than preventing the pregnancy in the first place?”
They aren’t going to say that, no. But the truth is anyone who supports abortion is willing to sacrifice a child’s life in pursuit of the myth of consequence free sex. It doesn’t matter if they wouldn’t have an abortion themselves. They support someone else’s right to kill a child if their pregnancy prevention efforts (assuming their were any) fail. So “pro-choicers” can go ahead and pay lip service to wanting to prevent the pregnancy in the first place, but who cares if that’s true when they accept death as a backup plan. If you were to suggest to them that if death for any resulting child is the only alternative, then perhaps sex should be avoided, it becomes immediately clear what their real non-negotiable is.
CT, you are going with your own take on things, and stamping it onto other people – who in reality will often not share it – and then carrying that pretense into your conclusion.
Even without arguing your points, the fact remains that it’s not “delighting in death,” or feeling that “abortion is a good thing in itself, without regard to a greater situation,” etc., to be pro-choice for oneself and/or others
OK Doug. Are you saying that that you delight in your choice to kill the unborn but not in the death? Cause I’m not buying it.
No, TS, not saying that.
But you would be a blast to have a few drinks with…
And as I recall you don’t drink anymore, but still – it would be an experience.
True that I don’t drink the way I used to (when I considered myself to be a ‘master’ of mixing strong drink) but I would enjoy a few drinks with you too.
Ha! Well then let’s do it!
I’m 56 and have eased off a good bit myself. ‘Hard drinking’ is a young person’s game (if ever).
I work all over the US and would enjoy a dinner, perhaps with a few drinks beforehand.
porkloin@aol.com