On the toilet, in a meadow, and with thinly veiled help from MSM: Stars schlep for Planned Parenthood
It sure looks to me like Gwyneth Paltrow was sitting in her bathroom on the toilet when filming this short (don’t blink) PSA for Planned Parenthood…
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZYX95ufXQc[/youtube]
Recall Gwyneth and her mother Blythe Danner are longtime PP supporters. Mother/daughter pro-aborts always seem creepily weird to me. Think about it.
And I guess Scarlett Johansson thought she’d look more like a feminist if she didn’t wear make-up when filming her PP PSA. I’m not sure why the crew picked a meadow for filming. Maybe it’s Scarlett’s back yard. Maybe her bathroom was dirty.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UfJtOv8DjM&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
Finally, I had to check 2 sources on Kathleen Turner’s pitch for PP. I seriously thought the video was dubbed. Turner sounds drunk, for starters, and like a man. Breitbart noted her accent was of “unidentifiable origin,” which is also true.
But whatev, Turner had clearly told Good Morning America staff beforehand she wanted to discuss PP, and GMA came up with the “we-have-an-extra-30-seconds-of-time-is-there-anything-you’d-like-to-add” route to let Turner state her PP piece while appearing to keep its hands clean. And I don’t think it’s Republicans that are making you sick, Kathleen. I think it’s those 3 packs a day…
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLFf2Dx1bRA&feature=player_embedded#at=34[/youtube]
Notice the one word missing from all these starlit pro-PP PSAs? That’s right, the A-word.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
It’s funny how celebs can make such an impact. Here they are spouting the same liberal nonsense you hear from most Planned Parenthood fans (notice they skip over the provided Abortion services), but it’ll probably help the cause because their famous. . .and being famous qualifies you to talk about this sort of stuff and have it matter all the more.
When abortion is made illegal, and the world sees it for what it truly is. . .I hope we make sure to drag these sorts of videos back out into the light — like videos of Hitler’s speeches — to show how dangerous hero worship can be. To show that Hollywood doesn’t always get it right, and in fact, frequently gets it wrong. And finally, to show that ignorance can sometimes lead to savagery, no matter how good your intentions are.
Gwyneth, Blythe, Scarlett and Kathleen,
Give to PP to your hearts and wallets content. Give and give and give some more to provide the A word.
Cough it up, Kathleen. :)
That paints such a pretty picture, unfortunately they also support trafficing of young girls for sex slaves, they hide molestation and incest cases. Oh yeah, they kill more baby girls in a year, then they perform basic healthcare for less fortunate woman. But they sure paint a pretty picture! American’s wear blinders, they have no idea what they are doing. I support life!
Scarlett – unable to get the birth control she needs? No one is stopping a woman or her man from walking into a store and purchasing condoms. But then again, that’s not what the issue is, because according to Guttmacher – contraceptives don’t work 100%, and in many cases – simply don’t work.
So what do you mean by birth control? Do you really mean “controlled birth?” Because in that case – that’s precisely what Planned Parenthood does – by killing the child through numerous procedures, it controls the birth, rather than letting it happen naturally.
Perhaps you need to see what controlled birth really looks like – Abby Johnson saw it and she ran away from Planned Parenthood.
Or maybe you need serious prayer, because you trusted Planned Parenthood’s talking points without ever looking into what they really mean?
Maybe before you stand for Planned Parenthood, you should look into what they really stand for. And if you really can’t go there – as friends of Abby Johnson discovered when she witnessed the child’s spine being sucked into a cannula – then perhaps you shouldn’t be promoting them at all.
Moderators – and as eye-catching is the ‘toilet’ argument – let’s not go there. Live action films also just put up a video of one of their own Ana Benderas in a video articulating the pro-life argument regarding ‘safe,legal and rare.’
If we want to take the high road – let’s do that. We do not want anyone else making crass remarks about any other videos, including pro-life ones. No need to do this. High road, please. Thanks.
Amen, Chris! The way I see it, the collective social mentality of Hollywood is so unbelievably dysfunctional that it seems almost impossible that there could be anyone working in that industry with a working conscience (or, if I may add rather flippantly, a working brain cell). Luckily, there are a few notable exceptions, however: Patricia Heaton, Neal McDonough, Euardo Verastegui, Ben Stein, and a few others.
Actually – reminding people that PP promotes and performs the abortions, which is what would force the Title X money to disappear if PP keeps doing that part of their business. That would have been a better thing. Or the comment on their video, like Live Action did on an abortion-nurses comments about ‘product of conception’ and ‘heart tones,’ by pointing out that local public health clinics and services do that medical screening also, in addition to: blood pressure, immunizations, dental health, etc… That would have been much better.
Jill, I think you meant starlet, not starlit.
I’m totally turned-off by these actors. All of you should use common sense instead of the scripts PP gives you. Yikes. Abortion, which you conveniently ignore, is real. PP does abortions! Pregnancy is hardly ever life-threatening to a woman, rape rarely results in pregnancy and abortion shouldn’t be used after failed BC so actresses can keep their pretty little figures so they can have long careers. There are no excuses for abortion. Standing up for PP means zilch. Who is going to stand up for the babies and mothers who have no where to turn?
Re:Turner - she has always had a very deep voice and a unique accent as well. According to Wiki — she grew up in Canada, Venezuela and England and spent time in Cuba. She also suffers from severe rheumatoid arthritis. None of us are perfect – how boring would that be? :)
And I wish Kathleen Turner would stop smoking. She sounds terrible. I hope she gets some good care…
Do gas stations/convenience stores/Wal-Mart no longer sell condoms?
Celebs like Kathleen Turner who go around and falsely claim “millions of women” will be without healthcare if the US Government defunds Planned Parenthood need a swift lesson in basic math. Planned Parenthood MAKES money. They, unlike the US government, is running the BLACK. So, they have more than enough moola to make sure “millions of women” have their “healthcare”. And as a side note, does this mean that when/if Obamacare comes to be we can then stop funding PP? Or will there be another lame excuse on why we need to funnel taxpayer’s dollars to this horrible profit-making “non-profit”. Just wondering….
PP Heartland (Iowa and Nebraska) took in $24,458,673 in revenue according to their annual report. Their expenditures were $23,535,531 leaving a SURPLUS of $923,142. They accepted $1.432M in tax dollars. Hmmm. A surplus, Kathleen Turner?! Think of all the poor women who had to let their children starve so they could get the medical care they needed and this organization took in a profit?! How dare they do that to poor people? I mean, how many women had to make their birth control stretch by not taking it every day because they couldn’t afford it? How many women had to have the babies they wanted to abort because they couldn’t afford the abortion fee? And PP took in a profit? That’s cruel and unAmerican. I can’t believe PP did that…
Who decided those in Hollywood were geniuses anyway? I sure didn’t. I could care less what any of them think. Most can’t even keep their own life in order…why should anyone care what they think about anything else?
Celebs like Kathleen Turner who go around and falsely claim “millions of women” will be without healthcare if the US Government defunds Planned Parenthood need a swift lesson in basic math. Planned Parenthood MAKES money. They, unlike the US government, is running the BLACK.
Brandolyn, That’s a really good point that I haven’t heard anyone mention in this budget debate! Thanks for illustrating your point with facts.
I want to see an add with an actual person from the lower income bracket who has received all those services these “stars” are whining about. Why isn’t PP using actual testimonials on their advertising? I mean, really? Gweneth Paltrow? Scarlett Johansen? I wonder where they get their contraception from? Surely, not PP!
DEFUND PP and stop giving to Susan G. Komen too. Look for options that don’t kill babies or increase the risk of breast cancer at an early age.
Turner sounds drunk, for starters, and like a man.
Does this mean that all men are drunk? : D
Hey Janet, no, I meant starlit. Just a little play on words.
No, Doug, but nor was I saying all drunks are men. I happen to know that for a fact.
More free hog-wash publicity for Planned Parenthood. The liberal media just can’t seem to help themselves, can they?! Lie, lie, lie. Very convenient leaving out the “a” word, wasn’t it. Blatantly lying, and blatantly committing the sin of omission. The liberal media continues to be more and more of a joke everyday. They all ought to head on down to Venezuela and stay. They’d get better ratings, heck, they’d get the ONLY ratings.
Jill,
Sorry! I’m slower (than usual, ha ha) today.
well, I’m convinced! NOT!! :p
No, that’s great, Janet. Point out potential typos whenever you see them. 9x out of 10 you’ll be right!
I don’t have an issue with the basic concept of celebrities using their fame to promote a cause. Loads and loads of people in the 50s got vaccinated for polio after Elvis got his polio vaccine shot on TV. If I disagree with a cause, I’m going to disagree with it no matter who advocates for it. I just wish celebrities who endorse various causes would all endorse worthy and right ones.
On Scarlett’s video: “TO PLAN HER FAMILY”?! Excuse me while I vomit.
Brandolyn – right! PPA is well aware of this.
As Abby Johnson mentions in her book unPlanned – “Cheryl” – her supervisor, adamantly explained during a director’s meeting – “non-profit is a tax status, not a business status.”
These women and the entire movement which pushes those lies, are a disgrace, and betray their lack of knowledge of the facts, and poor judgement, let alone the malevolence of Planned Murderhood and slaughter of babies, AKA elective abortion supporters and propagandists.
One of the biggest lies vomitted by these folks is that women will not be able to get health care, mammagrams, cancer screening, breast exams, etc.
Those claims by Planned Murderhood cultists are all false.
My wife, who is not so political, rattled off numerous outlets to which women can go for health care, mammagrams, breast exams, cancer screening, and more, all free, or at least all paid by someone else.
Am I the only person who is sick of this nonsense that Planned Murderhood, abortion-slaughter of babies pushers spread?
Gwyneth, Blythe, Scarlett and Kathleen,
take a long walk off a short pier.
Jasper: Let’s add a few more times to those going for that long walk: Joy Behar, Whoopi, Dana Delaney, Baba Wawa, Cher, etc. etc. etc. ad nauseum. Best they go in groups of five at ten minute intervals…we don’t want the pier to collapse and ruin it for the rest of them.
Good Mourning America ‘necromancing the stoned’ Kathleen Turner, a faded and jaded star lit [as in one too many eye openers before breakfast].
euphemisms and mis-nomers exposed:
When the ‘dead babies r us’ folks say birth control, they really mean live birth prevention and/or ‘quality control’. In their brave new world onlyl the genetically desireable should survive.
When they say STD/sexually transmitted disease they include pregnancy.
Boy, yor bro ken, ain’t THAT the truth. They treat the unborn human child like a parasitic infection. How more dehumanizing than that can they get?? Such insanity.
PP supporters need to learn how to take responsibility and so does Planned parenthood as an org. They keep highlighting all the ways they help women but just sidestep over all of the terrible things they have done, i.e. abortion, and all of the illegal activities that keep coming out in the news. PP supporters need to stand behind everything they have done, they can’t just cherry-pick certain aspects about the organization.
If there services are so important to these women then it’s time to make a choice, will you support funding PP independently or will you reconcile with pro-life citizens who are funding for you? I mean if it wasn’t for abortion and all the unethical behaviour, pro-lifers wouldn’t have such a problem with PP as an org. They can’t just ignore the pro-life community’s sentiments and expect them to keep paying the bill for them, I mean if their tax dollars are so important to PP they need to show some respect to those who are paying.
You can’t have everything you want in life, they need to decide what’s more important, keeping abortions or keeping federal funding.
Some like to throw in the same old argument, defunding PP will lead to more abortions because women will not attain the birth control they need. Well who’s fault would that be? There are plenty of other places to go for birth control and women’s health services taking away PP would not leave them with no options, the question is how is PP more beneficial than any free health clinc or pregnancy resource center?
wonder when PP will start funding the national debt?
What will take PP’s place? One of the keys to preventing abortion is preventing crisis pregnancies. Will a pro-contraceptive as well as pro-abstinence group take PP’s place?
How about MORE CPC’s? More maternity homes? More abstinence education? How about more support from ALL OF US to reach out to troubled teens?
PP kills children first and foremost. They promote promiscuity. Shut them down and the abortion rate will drop.
Thanks for letting me know whose films I should boycott!
And I guess Scarlett Johansson thought she’d look more like a feminist if she didn’t wear make-up when filming her PP PSA.
What does makeup have to do with anything? I don’t wear makeup, and it’s not to make me “look more like” anything – that’s the point. The idea that not wearing makeup is a statement somehow is so annoying. If the problem is that she wears tons of makeup in movies and at awards shows but chose not to for this, well, I know lots of women who spend their working hours in the makeup chair who prefer to wear none on their time off. When your face is a canvas for someone else’s design, it can be comforting and refreshing to look like YOURSELF when you’re, say, SPEAKING FOR YOURSELF. Which I suppose she is doing here.
Are things like this really relevant comments on the videos in question?
Denise Noe says:
April 13, 2011 at 8:27 am
What will take PP’s place? One of the keys to preventing abortion is preventing crisis pregnancies. Will a pro-contraceptive as well as pro-abstinence group take PP’s place?
Carla says:
April 13, 2011 at 8:45 am
How about MORE CPC’s? More maternity homes? >>
(Denise) This is after the fact. They don’t work to prevent crisis pregnancies that can end
up being aborted.
<<More abstinence education? How about more support from ALL OF US to reach out to troubled teens? >>
(Denise) I’m for abstinence. But it’s not realistic to expect that the only females who engage in sexual intercourse will be those who want to or even those who are willing to carry to term. Contraception is part of any truly effective campaign against abortion.
PP kills children first and foremost. They promote promiscuity. Shut them down and the abortion rate will drop.
(Denise) It might. But then again it might not.
Jasper and Mike,
I get your sentiment, I do, really, but maybe we would be better served to not embrace the same murderous nature as those women you mentioned. I get the frustration you must feel toward them, but we need to pray for these women. Clearly, they don’t know Jesus. If they did, they would not support such a horrible thing. :) Not trying to lecture, but this is my pro-life movement, too. Just trying to keep it about life – always.
Carla is right, Denise, PP promotes promiscuity, abstinance is not in their vocabulary. They do nothing for those who are already pregnant other than give them a dead baby.
Many contraceptives are also abortifatients as well. PP was founded by a eugenist and a racist, an elitist by the name of Margaret Sanger. PP pushes her ideals which are all of the culture of death-nothing that woman founded was any good nor did it bring any good it only brought the breakdown of the family to our nation. Hitler was fond of her and her works. What should that tell you?!
@Delaineb: Modern-day white supremacists consider her a heroine of the white race.
Really folks — how many people are really influenced by what celebrities say or think? Not me, I prefer to think for myself!
delaineb says:
April 13, 2011 at 12:04 pm
Carla is right, Denise, PP promotes promiscuity, abstinance is not in their vocabulary. They do nothing for those who are already pregnant other than give them a dead baby.Many contraceptives are also abortifatients as well. PP was founded by a eugenist and a racist, an elitist by the name of Margaret Sanger. PP pushes her ideals which are all of the culture of death-nothing that woman founded was any good nor did it bring any good it only brought the breakdown of the family to our nation. Hitler was fond of her and her works. What should that tell you?!
(Denise) Promoting abstinence and promoting the responsible and regular use of contraceptives shouldn’t be seen as opposites. They should fit together as ways to prevent problem pregnancies and the abortions that so often follow them. I don’t want to debate Hitler, Sanger, or anyone else. However, I have read that Sanger in fact despised abortion and promoted contraception partly to decrease the amount of it.
Again, it is probably not realistic to believe that the only females engaging in penile-vaginal intercourse are those seeking to become pregnant. Thus, contraceptives are vital to preventing the pregnancies that are so frequently aborted. Is there a pro-contraception organization that rejects abortion? If not, someone should get one going as a Planned Parenthood alternative.
PP could be one of those health-providing clinics that don’t provide abortion – but it’s most sacred to them and they won’t. too bad. But they know where there bread and butter are coming from – and it’s not family or contraceptive services. it’s abortion.
Promoting abstinence and promoting the responsible and regular use of contraceptives shouldn’t be seen as opposites. They should fit together as ways to prevent problem pregnancies and the abortions that so often follow them
Denise,
Actually what fit together is abstinance and chastity. You can be chaste without being abstainant and you can be abstainant without being chaste. Chastity is about respecting oneself and others and purity of mind, body, and spirit. Abstainance is simply abstaining from sexual intercourse (unless you abstain from all sexual activity; but generally it only covers sexual intercourse).
Contraception doesn’t fit anywhere in that equation because all contraception does is the attempt to bar/prevent conception and/or implantation…it doesn’t promote abstainent behavior or chaste behavior it just attempts to bar conception–and often it works and sometimes it doesn’t and some of them cause abortions. So please tell me HOW EXACTLY abstianance and contraception go hand-in-hand? If a person’s abstaining from sexual activity they have no reason to bar conception because they aren’t doing anything that could cause pregnancy/STDs/STIs (Sexually Transmitted Infections).
P.S. Please pardon any mispellings, I am not a perfect speller, nor have I ever claimed to be; but I do my best.
Exactly, Mother in Texas.
Denise, you need to get the whole picture of what Mararet Sanger and PP, her brainchild (no pun intended) are all about.
Here is a quote from her:”The most merciful thing that a large family does to one of its infant members is to kill it.”
Margaret Sanger, Women and the New Race
(Eugenics Publ. Co., 1920, 1923)
She certainly promoted infanticide, if not abortion, didn’t she?! And, what really is the difference between infanticide and abortion? Just the distance the child travels between the mouth of the womb and the exit of the birth canal.
When travelling from pro-choice to pro-life, the purists’ stand against contraception might be hard to understand. Briefly put: when a couple uses contraception, they EXPECT not to have a baby. When the contraception fails, and it often does, their actions to prevent conception make them feel justified that the baby must be gotten rid of. “We did what we could to prevent a baby, so why should we have to have this baby?” is kind of how the mentality goes.
However, if you expect the possibility of pregnancy with each and every sexual encounter, then you know that babies are made by having sex. This is why abstinence and Natural Family Planning are superior to contraception. And besides, Planned Parenthood’s minion, Guttmacher, does itself say that 54% of women who seek abortions were indeed using contaception when they conceived.
The basic attitude of our whole society needs to change. A baby isn’t a punishment. A baby is simply a baby. Babies don’t need to be defined by ‘wanted’ or ‘unwanted.’ Babies just need help being placed with families if their birth parents aren’t going to raise them. Adoption isn’t perfect, but it’s a chance at life and many adopted people have gone on to do great things.
ninek says:
April 13, 2011 at 5:19 pm
When travelling from pro-choice to pro-life, the purists’ stand against contraception might be hard to understand. Briefly put: when a couple uses contraception, they EXPECT not to have a baby. When the contraception fails, and it often does, their actions to prevent conception make them feel justified that the baby must be gotten rid of. “We did what we could to prevent a baby, so why should we have to have this baby?” is kind of how the mentality goes.
However, if you expect the possibility of pregnancy with each and every sexual encounter, then you know that babies are made by having sex. This is why abstinence and Natural Family Planning are superior to contraception. And besides, Planned Parenthood’s minion, Guttmacher, does itself say that 54% of women who seek abortions were indeed using contaception when they conceived.
(Denise) Many of them may not have been using the most effective contraceptives or they may not have been using them conscientiously.
I believe abstinence and contraception go hand in hand because some people are receptive to an abstinence message and some are not. Those who are not — and don’t want to have a baby — need to use the best contraceptives and use them conscientiously. We can increase the numbers of people abstaining and we should but there are some who are just going to engage in sexual intercourse without wanting to get pregnant. In addition, young fertile women who are abstaining should be using hormonal contraceptives, in my opinion, to protect against pregnancy if they are raped.
I’m very aware that abstinence is possible. I’ve abstained for years now. When I was a good girl in high school, I turned “sweet 16 and never been kissed.” However, I was multi-orgasmic every day and had been since 13. I had a minimum of 4 and maximum of 18 orgasms a day. This helped me be good because I wanted to stay home in my room instead of going out to get into mischief.
<<The basic attitude of our whole society needs to change. A baby isn’t a punishment. A baby is simply a baby. Babies don’t need to be defined by ‘wanted’ or ‘unwanted.’ Babies just need help being placed with families if their birth parents aren’t going to raise them. Adoption isn’t perfect, but it’s a chance at life and many adopted people have gone on to do great things. >>
(Denise) Adoptees are 2-3% of the population and 16% of serial murderers. They are 15 times more likely to kill one or both their parents than other people. David “Son of Sam” Berkowitz, Kenneth Bianchi of the Hillside Strangler duo, Joel Rifkin, Lawrence Bittaker, Robert Lee Bennett Jr. “The Handcuff Man,” and Jeremy Strohmeyer were all adoptees.
Mother In Texas says:
April 13, 2011 at 3:48 pm
Promoting abstinence and promoting the responsible and regular use of contraceptives shouldn’t be seen as opposites. They should fit together as ways to prevent problem pregnancies and the abortions that so often follow them
Denise,
Actually what fit together is abstinance and chastity. You can be chaste without being abstainant and you can be abstainant without being chaste. Chastity is about respecting oneself and others and purity of mind, body, and spirit. Abstainance is simply abstaining from sexual intercourse (unless you abstain from all sexual activity; but generally it only covers sexual intercourse).
Contraception doesn’t fit anywhere in that equation because all contraception does is the attempt to bar/prevent conception and/or implantation…it doesn’t promote abstainent behavior or chaste behavior it just attempts to bar conception–and often it works and sometimes it doesn’t and some of them cause abortions. So please tell me HOW EXACTLY abstianance and contraception go hand-in-hand? If a person’s abstaining from sexual activity they have no reason to bar conception because they aren’t doing anything that could cause pregnancy/STDs/STIs (Sexually Transmitted Infections).>>
(Denise) For one thing, it might be good for fertile abstinent women to still use hormonal contraception to guard against pregnancy in case of rape.
Additionally, a married woman might not want to get pregnant but may still have sexual intercourse. She should be using an effective contraceptive regularly and responsibly.
Prostitution is considered the world’s oldest profession for a reason. Don’t you want female prostitutes to consistently use reliable contraceptives?
Some people are receptive to an abstinence message. We can increase the number of people abstaining. But we must recognize that some females will have sexual intercourse who don’t want to get pregnant. They must use contraceptives.
Ok, I have to chime in here, is someone seriously suggesting virginal women take a dangerous, damaging, and frequently life-altering drug (hormonal contraceptives) because it’s possible they way get raped and that rape may cause an unintended pregnancy??? EXCUSE ME?
Hormonal contraceptives can cause excessive weight gain, lack of/extreme sexual desire, massive emotional/characteristic shifts, and bone loss leading to early osteoperosis, and those are just the COMMON and irrefutable side effects! Women would be better off kept under lock-and-key in chastity belts to avoid rape, or, better yet, how about we blame men who rape and actually punish them as opposing to blaming the victim and slapping the men’s wrist and say ‘well, boys will be boys!’
Jespren says:
April 14, 2011 at 9:16 am
Ok, I have to chime in here, is someone seriously suggesting virginal women take a dangerous, damaging, and frequently life-altering drug (hormonal contraceptives) because it’s possible they way get raped and that rape may cause an unintended pregnancy??? EXCUSE ME?
(Denise) I am suggesting exactly that. Virgins can get raped and the rape may cause a pregnancy that will exacerbate the trauma of the rape many times. Those pregnancies through rape may end in abortions. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. Virgins should use contraceptives to prevent being impregnated through rape.
Hormonal contraceptives can cause excessive weight gain, lack of/extreme sexual desire, massive emotional/characteristic shifts, and bone loss leading to early osteoperosis, and those are just the COMMON and irrefutable side effects! >>
(Denise) And what are the common and irrefutable side effects of pregnancy? Of abortion? Of childbirth? Better to protect virgins from pregnancy through rape.
Women would be better off kept under lock-and-key in chastity belts to avoid rape, or, better yet, how about we blame men who rape and actually punish them as opposing to blaming the victim and slapping the men’s wrist and say ‘well, boys will be boys!’>>
(Denise) Heavy sentences are given to convicted rapists — as they should be. That won’t prevent men from raping since psychopaths — the group most prone to rape — are willing to take risks.
When my wife and I got married someone ‘advised’ her to use industrial strength make up for the wedding.
She has never worn that much makeup, before or after.
Now we have these wedding photos that do not reflect the woman I married.
[She looked like a ‘geisha girl’.]
My wife wears makeup, but I have made it clear to her, and she has agreed, that she is not doing it for me, but for herself. We are good with that.
No problema, but for me less is better.
If Scarlett looks that good without makup then why would she bother?
I kind of liked the ‘tacky’ comment about her ‘bathroom being dirty’.
Not really relevant but it was a nice touch.
I always do all my PSA’s from the outhouse but I make sure there is a full roll of toilet paper, a can of air freshener, and poster of b o prominently on display.
Okay, now I have to chime in. Jespren, did you honestly suggest that women be put into chastity belts? Am I reading that right? If so, then, where exactly is your time machine and from what century did you come? The 12th or 13th? What an archaic, ridiculous suggestion. My Lord, I’m all for free speech, but that is just a laughable idea, and your argument would have been better served if you kept that one to yourself.
@ brandolyn, no I was suggesting that taking hormonal contraceptives on the vanishing rare chance that a virginal woman may concieve a pregnancy via rape is AS BAD AN IDEA AS the whole lock-and-key chastity belt. They both substantially and at times irrevicably alter a woman’s mental and physical well being to ‘protect’ them for their ‘own good’ against something that shouldn’t be happening to begin with. I was pointing out that telling a women she should propolactically be protecting herself against an incredibly rare circumstance (pregnancy via rape) with something that damages her is ludacrisly a BAD IDEA and it sets the stage to place the accountability of the crime on the victim, not the perpetrator, which only INCREASES the likelihood of the underlying crime happening. While reasonable precausions always make sense (a women shouldn’t accept drinks from strangers at a bar or walk down a gang street naked) altering common life is NEVER the correct answer to a crime. We call that paranoia and it’s a mental disorder! People who are so afraid of traffic accidents they never get in a car, or who are so afraid of intruders that they have 6 locks, 2 guard dogs, an alarm system, a security door, bars on their windows, etc, or who are so afraid of germs they wash the skin off their hands have a problem. There are many normal, common sense things a woman can do to avoid rape, and if she is unlucky enough to be a victim of this horrible crime, she is highly unlikely to get pregnant, if she gets pregnant, even in today’s abortion loving society, she is LESS likely than the average woman to abort. MANY women say their child allowed them to heal from their rape (either by keeping or giving it for adoption), likewise MANY women say aborting the pregnancy made the rape worse, harder to deal with, and allowed society to shrug aside their trauma. It is a horrendously wrong idea on so many levels to think that a healthy young women should by matter or course take a powerful drug just to exist ‘safely’ day by day. Turn it around, would it make sense to chemically castrate (which is easily reversible but while done removes most or all sexual desire or ability from men) all men at puberty until they had a signed waived from a significant other stating they wanted to have sex to keep them from raping on the off chance one of them might? That’s actually better than what is being suggested because at least that avoid the actual crime (rape) and not just avoid evidence of the crime (pregnancy). (And I’m not advocating for that at all, just pointing out how incredibly damaging and dangerous such a notion is)
Rape is the crime, pregnancy is the (possible) evidence! Telling women they should take a drug to avoid evidence of a crime should it ever be commited against them has got to be the worst blame-the-victim mentality I have EVER heard.
Jespren says:
April 14, 2011 at 11:04 am
@ brandolyn, no I was suggesting that taking hormonal contraceptives on the vanishing rare chance that a virginal woman may concieve a pregnancy via rape is AS BAD AN IDEA AS the whole lock-and-key chastity belt. They both substantially and at times irrevicably alter a woman’s mental and physical well being to ‘protect’ them for their ‘own good’ against something that shouldn’t be happening to begin with.>>
(Denise) We live in an imperfect world. Forcible rape is only one of many things that shouldn’t be happening but are happening and will continue to happen.
<<I was pointing out that telling a women she should propolactically be protecting herself against an incredibly rare circumstance (pregnancy via rape) >>
(Denise) It’s not rare at all! Rebecca Kiessling, who was conceived in rape and advocates abortion criminalization, states on her website that over 32,000 adult women in America get pregnant through forcible rape each year. And that’s not even counting minor girls who are impregnated this way.
<<with something that damages her is ludacrisly a BAD IDEA and it sets the stage to place the accountability of the crime on the victim, not the perpetrator, >>
(Denise) Protecting girls and young women from pregnancy through rape in no way excuses the rapist. It just prevents the trauma from being extended by a pregnancy and birth.
<<which only INCREASES the likelihood of the underlying crime happening. >>
(Denise) Taking hormonal contraception doesn’t increase the likelihood of any crime.
<<While reasonable precausions always make sense (a women shouldn’t accept drinks from strangers at a bar or walk down a gang street naked) altering common life is NEVER the correct answer to a crime. We call that paranoia and it’s a mental disorder! People who are so afraid of traffic accidents they never get in a car, or who are so afraid of intruders that they have 6 locks, 2 guard dogs, an alarm system, a security door, bars on their windows, etc, or who are so afraid of germs they wash the skin off their hands have a problem. There are many normal, common sense things a woman can do to avoid rape, and if she is unlucky enough to be a victim of this horrible crime, she is highly unlikely to get pregnant, if she gets pregnant, even in today’s abortion loving society, she is LESS likely than the average woman to abort. MANY women say their child allowed them to heal from their rape (either by keeping or giving it for adoption), likewise MANY women say aborting the pregnancy made the rape worse, harder to deal with, and allowed society to shrug aside their trauma.>>
(Denise) The reason they should be on hormonal contraception is so they don’t have to face the dilemma of either aborting a pregnancy through rape or having the rapist’s baby.
I’ve also read about girls and women who were damaged in illegal abortions because they couldn’t stand carrying the pregnancy through rape to term.
The point is that we’ve got to prevent crisis pregnancies to prevent abortions. If you’re delighted to be pregnant, what are the chances you’ll abort?
@ Denise:
32,000, while a large # by itself, is, as I stated, vanishingly small statistically given how many adult women there are in the U.S., apx 156m adult females in the U.S as of 09, the most recent statistic I can find. That’s what? A 1 in 4875 chance of a women getting pregnant through rape? to put that in perspective there are just under 309m adults based on the 2010 census, there were 2.9m people injured in car accidents (in 2005, couldn’t fine more recent) that’s about a 1 in 105 chance to be injured in a car accident. Should we all not drive to avoid those injuries? Pregnancy is a temporary condition which naturally resolves itself, and, if one avoids the cut and slash happy OBs, rarely causes injury in and of itself. If abortion was illegal and we didn’t live in a blame-the-victim society, women who conceived via rape would be faced with loving support and
(Con) silly cell… loving support and the hard but doable choice to keep and raise the child themselves or to give the baby for adoption.
It’s unconsciousable to suggest that all women become ‘victims’ of hormonal borth control to avoid a possible side effect only a very tiny # of women would experiance and even a smaller # would find negative. So many people have strongly negative reactions to birth control, some can’t even take the standard ‘pill’ and are stuck with other chemical options with even greater chances of negative side effects. I’m sorry there is no kinder way to state this but the mentality of someone who thinks this is a good idea is so messed up I fear for any children you may have/had. “An ounce of provention is worth a pound of cure” was never meant to cause people to cower in fear in a plastic bubble terrified if they step outside ‘something’ might happen to them.
But what if the problem for the rape victim is the PREGNANCY ITSELF? What if she simply cannot stand to have her body swell and swell with a rapist’s baby and go through the agonies of childbirth for it? It seems to me that at least some rape victims will find the state of pregnancy through rape simply psychologically intolerable.
It is especially likely that in the immediate aftermath of a rape a victim might yearn for protection from pregnancy.
How does abortion heal rape??
How about we offer support and encouragement and COUNSELING to help heal the trauma of rape??
Oh, and that baby is HERS.
It would serve you well to start reading the stories of women that have been raped and kept their babies and women that were raped and had abortions. The last prolife banquet I attended the speaker was a woman who became pregnant as a result of rape and allowed her daughter to live! Very powerful!
And again…….pregnancy resulting from rape is rare.
Well 1st i’d get her the support she needs. What you’re talking about there is the reason most women who do abort their rape-conceived child feel further victimized by the abortion, this notion that everything will be better if the pregnancy went away. But that doesn’t make it better, it just makes her a victim of rape AND the mother of a dead child, one who is told by society at large that she should be all better because her problem has been fixed. If I was counseling a woman immediately after a rape I would (hopefully after a rape kit has been gathered but before if she wasn’t up to that) suggest a medical application of spermacide, even introduced past the cervix if appropriate (which I’m told was done in the pre-plan b days). Sperm sits in the vaginal vault and it can take hours or even days to fertilize an egg, spermacide, while not ideal after-the-fact can still be effective, if the women is in her pre-ovulation time (which she may or may not know but many women do know when they ovulate) she could also take an emergency contraceptive to prevent ovulation as well as the spermacide to kill sperm mobility. Most importantly I would find her some peer support, someone who can say ‘i’ve been there, it’s tough, it’s going to be really hard, but you can get through it and I’ll be there for you’. That’s what a women needs. I would never say ‘oh be happy you might get pregnant and that can help’ but I would make sure she had someone who could say ‘i had to wait on that pregnancy test and std test too, and mine came back positive, it was really hard, but I’ll sit right next to you when you hear the news and I’ll help you through it if did get pregnant or if he did give you something’….and right there is another flaw in your thinking, pregnancy is short lived (although as someone who went through it twice that 9th month can feel very long), several STDs are forever. Should all women wear propolactic (sp?) Female condoms to cut down on their chance of contracting an STD from rape? How about propolactic antiretrovirals in case their rapist has AIDS. Why is the non-disease, non-lifelong evidence/effect of rape what you’re worried about? I’m be a lot more scared of catching something (and have a much higher chance of doing so) from a rape than I would of getting pregnant! Only this mentality that pregnancy is IN AND OF ITSELF a bad thing would cause society to focus on that aspect of rape, when the far more likely outcome is some barely managable or even deathly desease!
@jaspren, okay…i missed that analogy then. sorry for the snarky (but still kinda clever and funny..lol!) time-machine comment. ;) have a great day.
What if she simply cannot stand to have her body swell and swell with a rapist’s baby and go through the agonies of childbirth for it?
Take out the term “rapist’s” and you have the whole “bodily autonomy” and “parasite” argument in a nutshell.
No one here is pretending rape is anything but horrific and traumatizing and violent.
But let’s also not pretend that a “rapist’s” baby is anything less than human. And as Carla said – HERS.
Did you ever wonder if perhaps requiring all young women of childbearing age to be put on the Pill might lead to an increase in predatory male behavior in society? Less risk of pregnancy – less DNA evidence. We already know sexual predators love abortion because it destroys the “evidence” of their crimes. Pumping young women full of hormones to stop their body’s natural (and not harmful in the least) reproductive processes will only serve to harm women further.
Kel says:
April 14, 2011 at 1:12 pm
What if she simply cannot stand to have her body swell and swell with a rapist’s baby and go through the agonies of childbirth for it?
Take out the term “rapist’s” and you have the whole “bodily autonomy” and “parasite” argument in a nutshell.No one here is pretending rape is anything but horrific and traumatizing and violent.But let’s also not pretend that a “rapist’s” baby is anything less than human. And as Carla said – HERS.>>
(Denise) What I’m talking about is PREVENTING pregnancies from rape. It seems to me that, in the aftermath of rape, it would be especially terrifying to contemplate being pregnant as a result of it.
<<Did you ever wonder if perhaps requiring all young women of childbearing age to be put on the Pill might lead to an increase in predatory male behavior in society? Less risk of pregnancy – less DNA evidence. We already know sexual predators love abortion because it destroys the “evidence” of their crimes. Pumping young women full of hormones to stop their body’s natural (and not harmful in the least) reproductive processes will only serve to harm women further.>>
(Denise) I didn’t say it should be legally required. I think it’s a good idea to automatically put every girl on hormonal contraceptive when she hits puberty. Perhaps some sexual predators prefer anti-abortion laws because that means their genetic material has a better chance of getting back into the system.
At any rate, it doesn’t make any sense to promote pregnancy through rape in the hopes of using it to gather evidence against the rapist.
Perhaps having more young women on contraceptives will lead to more respect for those who say NO. They could say they’re not abstaining out of fear of pregnancy but because they are saving themselves for that special someone. Chastity that is positive rather than fear motivated might be more respected.
We’re kind of getting off on a tangent — yes, to some degree my fault — about rape victims and pregnancy. My original point is that we need a group that will replace PP: rejecting abortion but promoting BOTH abstinence and contraception.
What I’m talking about is PREVENTING pregnancies from rape. It seems to me that, in the aftermath of rape, it would be especially terrifying to contemplate being pregnant as a result of it.
I’m sure it would be, yes. Which is why those women need support – LOTS of it – and counseling. Because there is another human being’s life at stake in that situation as well. This is not something that should be ignored because a woman has been traumatized. We do not excuse battered women from killing their abusive husbands, and neither should we excuse rape victims from killing their children. I have a great deal of compassion for a woman who finds herself in this situation. I can’t imagine the mental anguish. But abortion should not be treated differently, as if it is somehow “therapy” for a rape victim. It is no more “therapy” than killing an abusive spouse.
Your solution to “protect” women from rape pregnancies is to put them all on birth control on the off-chance that a small percentage might be raped. I’m really surprised the feminists aren’t screaming “misogyny” right now, because that’s what it sounds like to me. It just strikes me as almost as dumb as handing out condoms to known rapists and telling them to “practice safe sex.”
Perhaps some sexual predators prefer anti-abortion laws because that means their genetic material has a better chance of getting back into the system.
Uh huh. Okay.
I think it’s a good idea to automatically put every girl on hormonal contraceptive when she hits puberty.
You do realize that a young woman’s reproductive system is still developing during puberty, right? Why is this a good idea? Oh, right. Wouldn’t want those rapists to keep on raping. Oops, no, wait, that wouldn’t stop rape. Well, I guess it’d stop those rapists who use rape as a way to “put their genetic material back into the system.” :-/
Kel said:
You do realize that a young woman’s reproductive system is still developing during puberty, right? Why is this a good idea? Oh, right.
(Denise) It’s a good idea because it means young girls and women who are raped don’t have to choose between aborting a resulting pregnancy or carrying it to term. The choice is an ugly choice so it’s best to protect them from getting pregnant in the first place.
<<Wouldn’t want those rapists to keep on raping. Oops, no, wait, that wouldn’t stop rape. Well, I guess it’d stop those rapists who use rape as a way to “put their genetic material back into the system.” :-/ >>
(Denise) It is unlikely anything will ever stop rape completely. Anything that can be done will be done by someone. The horror of rape doesn’t have to be exacerbated by the raped female finding out she’s pregnant if she’s on contraceptives at the time of the rape.
Denise, it seems pretty extreme to me to recommend that all pubescent girls (yes, girls) be put on artificial hormones during their developmental years.
Kel says:
April 14, 2011 at 5:40 pm
Denise, it seems pretty extreme to me to recommend that all pubescent girls (yes, girls) be put on artificial hormones during their developmental years.
(Denise) Again, I believe “an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.” I would rather prevent crisis pregnancies than deal with females seeking abortions. Pregnancy should be a time of joy.
Kel – I will not argue bits and pieces of scripture. If one wants to look at the whole chapter or the whole book of scripture and discuss it, then that is a different matter.
I used to counsel in a CPC office, too. I quit when I realized how the counselors, at the direction of the director, were using the counseling as a proselytizing tool, and not meeting the women where they were at. Similarly, you seem to be doing the same – condemnation scriptures to make a point that if a woman does not repent of their abortion or know Christ, they are condemned.
I may be reading your post incorrectly, and if so, forgive me.
We cannot judge, we certainly condemn ourselves if we set ourselves up to decide who is condemned and who is not.
Kel already quoted to you (on another thread) the clearest Scripture that are Jesus’ own words explaining to Nicodemus the truth of a necessity to be born again. If John 3:18 is too “narrow” for you, read the entire third chapter of John, then the Gospel of John, then the entire New Testament. It is very clear that knowing Jesus is eternal life (Jn 17:3). He is the way, the truth & the life and NO ONE COMES TO THE FATHER EXCEPT BY HIM (Jn 14:6).
Are you a universalist, Lee? Otherwise I can’t make heads or tails of what you’ve written today.
I am not a universalist, klynn73. I refuse to argue snippets of scripture. It is pointless.
What you are saying is that no one who is not a born again believer in the Lord Jesus Christ is condemned because of your interpretation of the bible – and then again, only a little snippet of the scriptures. What version of the bible do you use?
I like the King James Version, though I have NIV, ESV, & NASB on my reference shelf, along with my Greek New Testament. Linguistics is my field and what words mean matters very much to me, particularly The Word. If you’ve got a translation that says something other than anyone without Jesus is lost, I would highly recommend looking up the passages in a real Bible. blueletterbible.org also is an incredible resource.
I could post the entire 3rd chapter of John, here, Lee, but the Gospel message is this: God reconciled the world unto Himself through the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ. The wages of sin is death but the free gift of God is eternal life, which I’ve already clarified means knowing Him. We can accept or reject that gift. Anyone who has not accepted the gift is by default (we are born at enmity with God) condemned, lost, without eternal life, destined for hell. Gospel means Good News. The Good News is that no one need be lost. Jesus gave Nicodemus the answer. Very clear cut.
Also, as a born-again believer, God has sent the Spirit of His Son into my heart. Having the very author of The Book living in me, whose job it is to lead me into all truth & bring to remembrance all that Jesus has spoken to us is a definite advantage. He freely gives the Holy Spirit to any believer who asks. Have a good night, Lee.
klynn73 – I am surprised you use a truncated version of the bible. I am glad it is working for you, though. Thank you for the wishes for a good night.
What organization will take PP’s place — advocating contraception as well as abstinence while shunning abortion?
Contraception is part and parcel of any realistic and effective campaign to reduce abortions. I should add that I find abortion horrifying.
klynn, I love what you said at 7:38.