Type-A post-feminists admit: We can’t control when we conceive
I’ve spent the last decade or so trying not to get pregnant. Thanks to the simple and effective methods offered by modern medicine (and the feminist movement), it hasn’t been hard. For women in my millennial-ish age group, too-early pregnancy has been the freedom-choking bogeyman that kept you from getting to do all the things women are ready and able to do now — college, jobs, geographic relocation, delaying marriage, the list goes on….
Unfortunately, all this non-pregnancy has a side effect. Women today are surpassing men in higher education, and may soon become America’s predominant breadwinners. There’s no doubt that when it comes to goal-oriented achievement, we’re kicking a**. Until, that is, the time comes (and it comes in our 30s, whether we like it or not) to perform the most elemental task that women can and have been doing for millennia….
So here we have it: many products of post-feminism are having no trouble attaining a graduate degree (or two) but plenty of trouble conceiving a child. And most especially, they’re having trouble doing it with the speed and control with which they do everything else….
[T]he control we’re now able to exert over our lives doesn’t extend to the biological, whether we like it or not.
~ Melissa Lafsky, The Daily Beast, April 17
[Photo via coastalhealthmatters.com]
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
Why is it so hard to set up our society so that young women don’t need to delay child-bearing to have an awesome career? It would be much better for everyone.
Why don’t women see child-bearing and child-rearing AS an awesome career?
There’s something weird about saying that conception is an “elemental task.” It takes me back to the old days when passing on the family name was the overriding goal of a marriage, love and affection be damned. True, most women do conceive at some point in their lives; and when they do, they (and the fathers!) have a duty to care for that child, whether it’s through parenting or adoption. But to treat conceiving a child as an obligation or “task,” like checking an item off of a to-do list, is not cool.
Maybe I’m reading too much into it, but the author’s word choice rubbed me the wrong way.
Oh heck, that’s one of the less offensive remarks in the blurb. How about this? “In a way, Jean Twenge’s new book, The Impatient Woman’s Guide to Getting Pregnant, can be seen as a victory—it’s a sign that women have achieved so much autonomy that we need books catering to our desire to fit pregnancy into our busy work schedules.”
It’s a victory when you desire to fit pregnancy into our busy work schedules. :/
“Twenge also pays homage to a specific symptom of the Pill Generation: most of us have no clue about the mechanics of our ovulatory systems, because we’ve simply turned them off. Details like the length of a luteal phase haven’t been in our consciousness for years, even decades. Twenge isn’t there to scold or explain ad nauseum. She’s careful to include case-specific information and offer ever-comforting assurances that being or not being on birth control for your entire adult life doesn’t necessarily mean anything once you stop taking it.”
Well there’s progress for ya! “I can do anything in the professional world whatsoever, but I don’t know jack about my body any more.” Kind of flies in the face of “what do you think women are — stupid?” objections to pre-abortion counseling, ultrasound and such. Apparently, yes, all this progress has made women in some respects more stupid than stay-at-home, young moms.
All of this still seems so very much about me. My curriculum vitae is incomplete without a child!
“There’s no doubt that when it comes to goal-oriented achievement, we’re kicking a**.”
1) There’s more to life than “goal-oriented achievement”
2) My SAHM mother and SAHM wife kick a$$.
I didn’t get married till I was 28 and didn’t get pregnant till I was 30. It never occured to me in a million years that I couldn’t get pregnant when and how and with what when I wanted to. I just believed that hey, when the the time comes, it will happen. And luckily for us, it did. But I do have friends who put off child-rearing well into their 30s, and their lives are not going the way they planned.
So glad I got to be a mommy 4 times, with 3 born children. The 10 years I spent at home weren;t a sacrifice, but a privilege.
I’m reminded of these scenes in films where some automatic door is closing in a dangerous space, and everyone’s scrambling to dive under it to escape. Often the last dude gets his leg caught (cut to next scene). The protagonist: “Whew! that was close!”
Should “family planning” really have that as its template? Are children really the last-minute rush item in life’s checklist? Should motherhood be the second end of a candle, double-lit? Surely professional women understand the concept of overhead, of headroom, of bandwidth. No?
Oh my goodness, Rasqual, I think that very thought all the time! It’s like a submarine disaster, where the bilge-bay door is closing slowly and alarms are blaring and guys are pouring through the door with torrents of sea-water, and one lone dude is in there trying to fix something in order to save the whole ship! Awesome analogy! And at 42, my fertility feels very much like a slowly closing door. I thank God that I don’t have to live with that feeling alone–I have five children. I think part of the problem is our unwillingness to accept that when you open one door, you must close another.
Melissa – you’re only finding out that you’re not God – even though that’s what you thought you were.
The main problem I have with such naive observations is the complete ignorance of the life sacrifices many others have given for people like Melissa to achieve their dreams. This generation utterly lacks humility and perspective.
And Melissa – if you think it’s always about bread-winning, you need to be introduced to the reality of war, because the graves of soldiers are almost all men.
@Kelsey: No, I got that feeling too. This whole blurb is just another version of pitting women against their biology by saying that pregnancy/children supposedly keep you from building the life you want. This particular author just takes a different angle to get to the same, misogynist place. You can tell, as you pointed out, by the way she phrases things. “Unfortunately, all this non-pregnancy has a side effect. Women today are surpassing men in higher education, and may soon become America’s predominant breadwinners.” She goes on to make a different point, but the very first thing she sticks after “unfortunately” is that women are excelling beyond men in various place, and this is a bad, bad thing. From there she springboards into reducing women to our reproductive system and nothing else. “Your ovaries could have ruined your life before you wanted to be pregnant, and they can do exactly the same thing if you change your mind! Beware the betrayal of the ovaries!!!”
</rant>
I am thoroughly insulted by this woman. Of course, from The Daily Beast I should hardly expect any better, but geez.
Biology is not always friendly to our own wants. Kind of sad how long it takes some people to realize that.
[T]he control we’re now able to exert over our lives doesn’t extend to the biological, whether we like it or not.
Apparently Melissa has missed the obvious point that God is the one that is really in control.
Eric says 2) My SAHM mother and SAHM wife kick a$$.
+1 – mine too – let’s be sure we thank them for that!
WOW! Sounds like the “it’s all about me” feminist pro-choicers are finally getting a little clue. You really do not get to “choose when you conceive”. ”Ya think?”
For everyone who plays the chemical waiting game (Yes, I know not everyone using b/c is in this mindset) ”I can have it all, have sex as much as I want with whoever I want, whenever I want with no consequences, then have babies when I want in the “sweet bye and bye”, when I want and even dispose of the ones I don’t want because it’s my body I get to “choose”, after all I am so educated and enlighted, I am pro-choice” there are many consequences. (Did anyone count how many I’s in this diatribe-10 I’s). No one talks about the possible hormonal imbalance after years of not ovualting, not having true menstrual cycles. The STD epidemic triggered by having multiple sexual partners because of them thinking I’m on birth control and I can’t get pregnant. The infertility issues caused by scarred fallopian tubes because most STDs have NO symptoms until it is too late and they’ve got PID (Pelvic Inflammatory Disease) which may not show up until years later when they ”want” to have a “baby”. BTW, now they get to call “it” a “baby” because they “want” “it”). How sad. God help us. For those of you teaching the Theology of the Body thank you because we have sold our kids out, making them and their bodies hearts, minds and souls so cheap till they have no value and their unborn babies don’t either “until they “want” them. Continue to pray for our nation Christian prolifers.
Well, there are certainly young woman who are *wanting* to get pregnant and soon! I was married less than a year ago, and nearly everyone is advising us to put off having children for “at least three years.” Well, what if we don’t want to? What’s wrong with having children early? It just seems that even among many Christians, both delaying marriage and delaying childbearing has become the expected course of life.
And I agree with Jack – motherhood shouldn’t preclude women from a career! Believe me, it is possible for a woman to do “other than mothering” work and also be a mom. The problem often comes from society immediately categorizing the woman as a “mother.”
Just my $.02
I guess these women don’t realize the side effects that taking hormonal contraception every single day for 15+ years can cause on a woman’s body. I’m not surprised so many women have trouble becoming pregnant after that; taking your reproductive system and artificially rendering it broken for so long… it doesn’t surprise me when it actually ends up being broken.
“I just found out that the world does not revolve around me, and Biology was not built to satisfy my desires! Call the waaaaaaaambulance!”
Dur-hur! -_-
Why don’t women see child-bearing and child-rearing AS an awesome career?
I agree, Jamie. This is something we need to work on in this country, men and women both.
Jackie Kennedy once said, ”If you bungle raising your children, I don’t think whatever else you do matters very much.”
Of course she also said, “I don’t think there are any men who are faithful to their wives.”
Jackie did a great job, I believe, but she did much of it alone.
I am thoroughly insulted by this woman. Of course, from The Daily Beast I should hardly expect any better, but geez.
Articles like this appeal to and describe a certain type of well-educated, yuppie mostly white women. Believe me, they don’t speak for the majority.
Why don’t women see child-bearing and child-rearing AS an awesome career?
I agree, but in this economy it’s often necessary for both partners to work. Being a stay at home other is a luxury few can afford. I firmly believe that a woman should always have some sort of skill that allows her to earn her own living, even if she wants to be a stay at home mom. What if hubby dies and doesn’t leave a will or life insurance? What happens if hubby decides he wants to turn his wife in for a younger model? It happens all the time!
My husband & I initially put off children for the first couple of years of marriage (I was on the pill), but once we got into a settle routine & felt secure in our jobs, I went off the birth control & whoops, no children (due to secondary infertility). Eventhough, in hindsight, it was better we did not have children because of the dysfunctional marriage, as I work in an assisted living facility, I look around & think to myself, here I am, divorced & no children, will I ever re-marry or have children & who’ll take care of me & advocate on my behalf in old age if I don’t?
@Eric – good for you and your SAHW. I don’t mean to get personal, but I hope she and your children are provided for if God forbid, something happens to you.
Wondering,
“Secondary infertility” refers to someone who already has a biological child(or children), and is having trouble conceiving ANOTHER one..like me.
If you’re having trouble conceiving a FIRST child, it’s ‘infertility’.
Don’t give up hope. I didn’t have our daughter until I was almost 42.
Phillymiss, no one denies that many moms have to work outside the home to make ends meet. My mom was one of those moms–she worked as a nurse to pay for school tuition. I’m so proud of her! But there are many women out there who postponed marriage and / or children to pursue a high-powered career. When they hit mid to late thirties they realize that they want a family and it’s often too late! Feminism hasn’t delivered on it’s promise to these women that they can have it all! I know plenty of these women: they’re now in their fifties, and if they had a stroke and found themselves permanently disabled—what? It’s is not good to be alone! And the way God has set it up, not being alone usually means being in a family setting. We are made for it, we naturally yearn for it, and there’s a world full of women who’ve built their lives around denying it. (And I’m not talking about women who through nature cannot conceive or who have not found a spouse.) This isn’t about guarding ourselves against unpleasant eventualities–those come to the married, the unmarried, the parents and the childless.
“Why is it so hard to set up our society so that young women don’t need to delay child-bearing to have an awesome career? It would be much better for everyone.”
JB,
Let me rephrase the question in a way which may assist you in understanding why it is ‘so hard’:
“Why is it so hard for government to reduce, or even eliminate, tornados, earthquakes, hurricanes, floods, and death?”
There are few things goverment can do and even fewer it can do efficiently and effectively.
If you still don’t get it, then go to your DMV and try to get a new drivers license.
o
“Unfortunately, all this non-pregnancy has a side effect. Women today are surpassing men in higher education, and may soon become America’s predominant breadwinners. There’s no doubt that when it comes to goal-oriented achievement, we’re kicking a**. Until, that is, the time comes (and it comes in our 30s, whether we like it or not) to perform the most elemental task that women can and have been doing for millennia….”
Here is the thing though, women aren’t doing the same things as men in their goal oriented achievement. Women have always been about half of the people, and therefor have always done their share of the work but not the same work. The same still holds true today. Women do not really want guy jobs. They don’t want to be sanitation workers, truck drivers, carpenters, coal miners, oil field workers, electricians etc. and they aren’t. So while they do more work outside the home they still don’t much do men’s work, and still do different work on average.
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
“There are few things goverment can do and even fewer it can do efficiently and effectively.
If you still don’t get it, then go to your DMV and try to get a new drivers license.”
Your comment would make sense if I mentioned the government even once in my comment.
”Women do not really want guy jobs. They don’t want to be sanitation workers, truck drivers, carpenters, coal miners, oil field workers, electricians etc. and they aren’t. So while they do more work outside the home they still don’t much do men’s work, and still do different work on average.”
One of my good friends is rig worker, lol, she might disagree that women don’t want to do “guy jobs”. And the gender split in a lot of male-dominated specialties is decreasing, as well as in female-dominated specialties like nursing. My best friend is a chemist, when she got her degree like only five years ago she was one of four or five women in the advanced chem program, now the classes she teach are about 30% female at the least. I wonder how much women “don’t want to do guy jobs”, and how much it’s just socially discouraged.
“Why don’t women see child-bearing and child-rearing AS an awesome career?”
Because it’s not a career, any more than impregnating women is a career for men.
Because it’s not a career, any more than impregnating women is a career for men.
Getting pregnant or impregnating someone is not a career. Being a stay at home mother or father is certainly a job and is important for stable societies.
Does that mean that households where both parents work are neglecting an important task and inadvertently undermining social stability?
That depends, Joan. Some large families do well when the older kids are fully participating caregivers. When kids become responsible (often because they have good role models in their parents), all kinds of expansive possibilities open up.
Both parents working and imagining that child-rearing will take care of itself is a bit like extending your credit too far. Some people can handle it. Many can’t.
Sorry, no answer to feed your next question. ;-)
Does that mean that households where both parents work are neglecting an important task and inadvertently undermining social stability?
No, of course not. They are generally doing the best that they can with their particular circumstances. If it’s possible, however, one parent staying at home with children when they are small generally makes for a more stable environment, as long as their personality works well with that type of lifestyle.
Because it’s not a career
joan decides what is or is not a career, remember that.
Do Abortionists have a career?
hippie, I work in carpentry and I can weld. I work with lots of electricians who are women. Men and women BOTH who are typically viewed as “goal oriented achievers” generally do not have the types of jobs you listed – oil riggers, electricians, etc. People whose labor is primarily physical, basically. I absolutely 100% disagree with this social assessment of “achieving goals” versus “not” but it applies to both genders regardless. It’s not a gender divide. It’s a stigma divide.
My wife stays home with our children….and trust me, it isn’t a career. Praxedes, yes abortionist is a career.
When people don’t consider raising children and all the duties around the home work, I like to ask them why we pay people to do those tasks if such tasks aren’t work??? Wha are childcare workers getting paid for then?
Meh…It’s Joan and Jake. Their comments are pretty predictable.
What are childcare workers getting paid for then?
Are you seriously asking this question??? Here is the answer:
1) Raising your own kids is enjoyable and rewarding
2) Raising kids that are not your own is a job
If you seriously look at raising your kids as a job, then you should have had an abortion.
@Eric – good for you and your SAHW. I don’t mean to get personal, but I hope she and your children are provided for if God forbid, something happens to you.
I’m worth more dead than alive, and she has bachelor’s degree.
and trust me
That’s what he said. Then he told me to “take care of it.”
Your wife’s staying home to raise children may not be viewed as a career by you but her staying married to you makes her a victim soul to me.
Are you seriously asking this question??? Here is the answer:1) Raising your own kids is enjoyable and rewarding2) Raising kids that are not your own is a job
Tell point number one to the proaborts and the abortionists, Jake. Maybe the abortion rate will go down.
How are your pom poms holding up?
JB,
mea culpa/my bad: I did not leave not enough bread crumbs for you to follow the train of thought/connect the dots.
Society can only be ‘set up’ by an organized effort and that is almost always thru some form of ‘government’
or were you anticipating some sort of spontaneous ‘big bang’ harmonic convergence of unified human effort where we all simultaneously jump to the next rung on the evolutionary ladder.
mr. bo-jangles delusional claim to the contary, neither he nor government can halt the purported ‘rise of the oceans’.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0tuAJkbUWU
Halting the rise of un-employment or rate of inflation would be appreciated.
[I wonder if TOTUS got goosebumps during that little moment of oratorical splendor. One TOTUS chose suicide rather than deliver another whatasized load of oompah to the POTUS.]
Families are best suited to meet the unique needs of pregnant women on an individual case by case basis.
Kudos to Jake on finding a woman who could swallow down her vomit long enough to procreate with him.
Another kudos to him for finding a woman behind whose skirt he may hide so that he can join us on this thread, since that seems to be the prerequisite for his participation in any discussion. Joan seems to be the host of this little parasite for the evening. Aren’t they adorable? Joan tells us how little she appreciates mothers and then Jake punctuates the statement by demeaning his wife. Bravo!
Because it’s not a career, any more than impregnating women is a career for men.
Apparently joan was spawned by sea turtles. That explains some things. The cold blood, for a start. In the mammalian world, joan, offspring require care and nurturing, typically more the more complex a creature is. Hence, human offspring require quite a bit for an absurd length of time, by animal standards. This is often viewed as quite taxing. There is quite a bit that’s been getting lost in translation between us, I’m afraid!
Society can only be ‘set up’ by an organized effort and that is almost always thru some form of ‘government’
Actually, ken, as more women enter the workforce in leadership positions, corporations are implementing their own large-scale change.
http://www.bowdoin.edu/news/archives/1academicnews/001791.shtml
Your attack of Jack was short-sighted, I’m afraid.
Not sure how i demeaned my wife. She is happy to raise our children, and doesn’t consider it her career. As for my point number one Praxedes, I never advocate abortion for those who, you know, want children. It is those who would view being a mother/father as a job that should have the option of aborting. Man, this isn’t that hard, i can’t believe you all need so much explanation.
I guess it’s hard to comprehend that child-rearing is an important JOB when you see kids as something purely for YOUR enjoyment/entertainment, like a fun game or optional hobby or something. Not something really important, like guiding the next generation to adulthood as they prepare to inherit the world. Doesn’t really matter how they turn out, as long as you get your kicks, right?
Wow. I feel bad for your kids xalisae. Kids as a job?? Man that is an unfortunate thought. I would like to think that if children were raised to believe that they brought joy and fun and amusement to a family then they, you know, might be well adjusted and happy. I guess I’ll continue to let my kds think they are enjoyable while you treat yours as a chore.
To further illustrate my point, I actually enjoy my job, you know the one I go to every day to make money, but I would never equate that with raising my kids. Given the choice, I would love to forgoe my job and spend time with my kids. So to equate child rearing with work doesn’t much make sense to me. But you all continue to treat your kids as work…..good luck with that.
Jake seizes on an equivocal sense of “work” or “job,” purposefully missing the point of the comparison in order to impugn the blog’s denizens. Oh such a cunning little brain!
Chris: “The main problem I have with such naive observations is the complete ignorance of the life sacrifices many others have given for people like Melissa to achieve their dreams. This generation utterly lacks humility and perspective.”
I’ve cited this before. Timely to do so again:
“The villainy of the Skimpole Syndrome does not consist in its choice of goods: papers, conversation, music, mutton, coffee, landscape, fruit, a little claret—few of us would argue that such things are inherently unwholesome. Nor is genial tolerance—“Go your several ways in peace! . . . go after any object you prefer!”—a bad thing in itself. The problem with Skimpolism is that it ignores, and refuses to acknowledge, the sources and causes of its own good fortune: the enormous human enterprise of toil, commerce, and distribution, the attendant fatigue, risk, worry, and vexation, the requisite virtues of foresight, prudence, honesty, and diligence—all of which are necessary for something as ordinary as a peach or a glove to end up in Skimpole’s dining room. For the Skimpoles of this world, the ultimate source of bread is the baker’s van, and there is no need to concern oneself with plowing, sowing, weeding, dunging, cutting, threshing, milling, and baking—not to mention the thousands of mercantile transactions, from mortgages to tire rotations—that must be in place, and continually attended to, so that Skimpole might have his honey on toast.” http://goo.gl/FoTlQ
Jake seizes on an equivocal sense of “work” or “job,”
Ah okay I see now…putting quotations around “work” and “job” makes your point. It isn’t really “work” work. It isn’t a “career.” Ohh, this is fun. Let me suggest one for you…..abortion isn’t really “murder,” it’s just something you say to shame women who wish to control their bodies.
Then Jake doubles down on stupid by imagining that unimaginably sophomoric semantic twaddle is really impressive.
How dense can abortion advocates insist on being??
When my mother was pregnant, that was MY body developing in her womb, and she had no right to harm ME. I’m glad some women are finally wising up. The writer isn’t the smartest but she’s beginning to get it.
Ninek, you uppity parasite!
Jake: “Man, this isn’t that hard, i can’t believe you all need so much explanation.”
Mmm just a hint in debating/communication: When people aren’t understanding what you are saying, don’t blame the listeners. Ask yourself how you can better communicate your point. ;)
Oh, Jake. Is some nonsense about controlling their bodies really the best argument for abortion? If so do yourself a favor and kindly step out of the debate.
LB: He’s a confused twit. He’s so concerned to impugn pro-lifers that he maneuvers his way onto the back side of his own logic.
In this case, the issue is that folks see careers/jobs as so vunderful that children are slated as an afterthought. Pro-lifers assert that the effort, reward and value that people enjoy in their careers exists for stay-at-home moms as well. Then along comes twit jake and supposes that by semantic legerdemain he can demonstrate his great wit, changing the significance of career/job from something people prioritize over having children to a sense of drudgery one is obliged to perform — then casting pro-lifers as characterizing parenthood as a case of that. Aren’t pro-lifers pathetic for comparing child-rearing to work-a-day drudgery?
Geez some people are consummate tools.
I guess Jake is under the impression that his children never poop. Perhaps he should speak more often with his wife and spend less time making a fool of himself here.
Acknowledging that children properly raised require a great investment of WORK (there’s that word again!) doesn’t mean that they aren’t also viewed as and told to be great sources of joy and amusement. Your attempt at setting up a false dichotomy are pretty hilarious, and, unless you employ an au pair, only an expression of how little you understand and value your wife’s daily duties. I feel sorry for her, and your children. She knowing how little you think of what she does for your family, and your children knowing you see them as little more than an episode of Full House. :(
Your attempt at setting up a false dichotomy *is pretty hilarious.
And, I take it back about ‘Full House’. There are episodes where Michelle is seen getting into trouble and making messes that then have to be cleaned by “Mr. Mom” Danny Tanner, or his child-rearing partners. Jake is not even taking things like that into consideration, so his idealized notion of what it surely must be like to be at home with the kids all day is not even on par with sitcom-levels of reality. I can’t imagine any reason someone would devalue their wife and objectify their children like this. Do you resent having to go to work for your family, Jake?
Jake, you’re an idiot. I was a SAHM for 10 years with 3 kids, 2 of whom were in diapers at the same time (and they were CLOTH diapers, buddy). Don’t make some stupid-a$$ statement like it’s not work. Sheesh. While I always saw, in the big picture that me actually mothering my own children was a holy vocation and privilege, there were days that were filled with NOTHING but cleaning up bodily fluids and doing laundry, and it was a small act of God that I could even have a shower. Between diapers, meals, snacks, laundry, playdates, picking up, preschool, library day, shopping (NEVER TAKE 3 KIDS UNDER 5 TO WALMART AT THE SAME TIME), ETC., ETC., it was all I could do to get into slleeping clothes before I fell into bed.
Now, with parenting, you can get by with very little and they’ll still grow up. But if you are truly interesting in releasing well-formed, moral, God-loving and obedient kids into the world with soft hearts and clear values, you have to WORK at it. It’s a JOB. You betcha. There’s very little glamour, and I get paid in hugs, though somedays, because now I have a 13 and 12 year olds, I get eyerolls.
Your poor wife. Do you have ANY idea how SAHMs hold this world together?
SSShh. Just don’t talk.
Seriously, Courtnay. I think Jake resents his role as breadwinner in caring for his family, and that’s why he idolizes the willfully barren and mothers of dead children here, whittles the value of his kids down to “entertainment”, and makes it out to be as if his wife doesn’t do anything but lay around playing patty-cake all day. If only his mooch of a wife hadn’t squatted out those dreadful crotch droppings, he’d still be wild and carefree!
Makes me wonder what kind of laissez faire parents raised him.
Those cloth diapers were definitely NOT entertainment.
my advice to these feminists….ditch the pills and contraceptive devices and learn about the way your body actually WORKS…how there are signs of fertility during the month and also signs of infertiliity during the month…..it takes a little practice…but you can learn it if you are willing to actually take the time to do so.
And this isn’t grandma’s rhythm method.
Jake presents a ridiculous false dichotomy- as X and others have pointed out.
Raising one’s own children is enjoyable and work and a true job all in one.
Some men don’t get this because they’ve never had to do it and they don’t respect what their wives and mothers, etc. have done for so long.
People start looking at childrearing as cutesy fun and flowers. They don’t take it seriously. Weak and/or gullible women want to be taken seriously so they opt for throwing their ancestors and fellow women under the bus and put down childrearing as outdated nonwork. Then IF they have children (a tacky, but tolerable thing to do if you keep it under three children) these women pay someone else to do the bulk of the childrearing and pursue other careers that are taken seriously.
I work outside the home because my husband and I are both freelance musicians and we can’t make it on his income alone. He values the Real Work/ Job of staying home with our four boys because he knows how demanding it is. Our favorite funny truism is that we need to work outside the home to get a break.
People who denigrate the job of childrearing just haven’t done it for any length of time. Meanwhile, too many kids are being raised by nonparents. Sometimes this is necessary. But lotsa times our cultures attitudes about childrearing as nonwork contributes to parents and kids not being around eachother enough.
This is great. So which is it?? Is it a job? A career? Or is it a “job” and a “career?”. Haha watching you all fumble over the definition and pity my wife has been most enjoyable. She and I have had so much fun reading your “outrage” over my position. (wait did I use quotations correctly there?). You all should pick a position and agree on it. Call it a career (which is ridiculous), call it a job (which is also ridiculous), we will just continue to let our boys know that we are happy to have them and that we don’t consider them a commodity that requires a justification that they are “worth” a certain amount of money. Pathetic
And xalisae, bravo for completely generalizing my life into a few sound bites that prolifers can rally around. Oh the nasty male breadwinner wishes his wife didn’t have kids so he could make money and live the life!!! What a joke. Here are the facts, my wife and I chose to have children (two boys in fact). She wanted to stay home and raise them. She is happy to do this, doesnt consider it a job. I am stay at home as much as I can be ( weekends and nights), and I don’t consider it a job. You would think the pro lifers here would maybe, I don’t know, respect that. But no, you show yourselves for what you are. And that makes me smile, cause you will always show your true colors in the end!! :)
Lmfao, as opposed to your shining example of human goodness, Jake? Why do you expect to get any respect when you act like a bored sixteen year old trolling private blogs and issue pages? I actually had you pegged as a teenager, I am still not buying your claim of adulthood, lol.
Oh jack, are you still smarting about our little confrontation on your blog?? Don’t you get it my man?? Can you not see that I, not knowing about your past or experiencing what you have experienced, probably am not qualified to pass judgement on your experiences? And that you, not knowing about every pregnant women’s situation, is not qualified to pass judgement on them, an therefore should NEVER dictate how she manages her life or body??? Come on man, get in the game.
Tell you what jack, let my buy you a beer and let’s get past all this nonsense. I assure you I am not a teenager and can legally buy you a beer
LOL, I really don’t care what you said to me, I just think your whining about Xalisae questioning your parenting and marriage is highly ironic. Us evil pro-lifers! We like, think sexual abuse is prime mocking material! Oh wait, nm, that’s your side.
You know, there a several pro-choice commenters who manage to debate and dialogue on this blog without acting like 4channers who have no computer skills
What you don’t understand, Jake, is that by claiming that no one has a right to pass judgement on pregnant women seeking to abort, YOU are passing judgement-a LIFE or DEATH judgement-on children who grow up just. like. Jack. Hopefully one day, you and your “chosen” children will understand that. I hope so, anyway, lest your sons find themselves in a sticky situation with an “unwanted” child one of these days…urging their partner to dispose of the child, as Jack’s mother would’ve disposed of him had she been able, and as my ex-husband would’ve disposed of our daughter had he been the only authority in the decision.
I’m fighting for you, Jack. I’m fighting for my daughter too. Your mother, my daughter’s father-FOOLS. They’re fools. Presuming to pass a death sentence on to their own children. DISGUSTING. You, and my daughter, are worth more than those morons and the “wanted children” combined. Why? Because you know your worth, and it’s not assigned and given to you by your parents. It comes from inside yourselves.
we will just continue to let our boys know that we are happy to have them and that we don’t consider them a commodity that requires a justification that they are “worth” a certain amount of money. Pathetic
It isn’t that we consider them a commodity and that they are worth something. It’s that every human being IS worth something, intrinsically, by virtue of their humanity. People like Jack and my daughter are going to know that they had a right to live. The “worth” we talk about isn’t a monetary value. That’s how pathetic you are. You think the only “worth” in the world is coin? Really? How sad you are to have to have things simplified to a dollar sign to understand the premise. There’s worth BEYOND money, little man. You see it every time you come here, and you STILL don’t understand it. Ignorance abounds in you, my friend.
I work in and outside the home and love both my jobs. I raise my four sons with great joy, humor, and sincerity. It’s my most important and rewarding job. For a mother, what other career could be more fulfilling?
Ah, Jake. I don’t feel the need to laugh at you or think exactly like every other prolife commenter on this thread.
I know what I do, I know the difficulties and the joy, and how much it matters. I’m not upset if you don’t get it.
Haha xalisae, you don’t even understand what I am saying. How amusing. It is your side that is trying to make the argument that parenting is a job and a career. Haha, you don’t understand, but that’s okay. I pity your daughter, and you.
ooh, this is a good one. Jack, exactly why do yopu pity X’s children? Because their lives were non-negotiable?
Motherhood is a job AND a career. Obviously you didn’t read my post. How amusing.
“as more women enter the workforce in leadership positions, corporations are implementing their own large-scale change.”
Employers have little choice because they will be sued if they don’t hire x% women who apply. They have to compete for the few qualified women.
Good grief, “haha”.
Jake, I think Jack is now distressed with your assurance that you’re NOT a teenager. It’s much more difficult to figure out how to relate to adults who think and speak like teenagers. One wishes there were more there to work with, so to speak.
I think I’ll retract my theory that you deem it wit to leverage equivocation; at this point I’m convinced that, incapable of as much, neither have you any idea how to carry on a reasoned conversation.
In the flame warrior taxonomy, I dub thee L’Enfant Provocateur, Lamer, Tiny Yapper, and Jerk.
hippie, how does your assertion that there are only a “few qualified women” square with the reality that colleges have more women than men, and women are increasingly the breadwinners for their families? Certainly if only a few women were qualified for employment, we would not have a society where nearly 40% of working wives out-earn their husbands.
Jack, exactly why do yopu pity X’s children?
*Jake, but yeah, I’m a bit curious myself. LOL
From now on, let’s all just call Jack “JB”.
My bad. I meant Jake.
Sorry, JB.
Jake, has your wife aborted any of her children that you know of?
Or have any of your children been aborted?
Are you employed with an abortion industry?
Jake doesn’t know Jack.