Stanek weekend question: Should Chick-fil-A cater to abortion clinics?
On August 2 pro-life abolitionist Caleb Head, a member of Abolish Human Abortion, observed a Chick-fil-A catering truck making a delivery to Houston Women’s Clinic. According to Head, this abortion mill is the busiest in Houston and 4th busiest in the country….
AHA initiated phone calls and online activism to admonish this Chick-fil-A, located at 3101 West Holcombe Avenue, to repent and never do this again.
Head’s father, Pastor Scott Head, wrote a letter to CFA Holcombe’s owner, Juli Salvagio, who responded:
Our restaurant was simply fulfilling a catering request. Our goal is to serve great food with genuine hospitality to all guests. We have no political or social agenda.
We strive to serve everyone with honor, dignity and respect.
Pastor Head, in turn, responded:
[T]he ruthless killing of babies by abortion is not a political or social matter, it is a barbaric practice that all decent people ought to be concerned about.
You represent a company that has a particular learning and reputation toward Christian ethics, whether you are a Christian or not. Your company, though you are an independent owner, still represents the founder’s ethic. Knowing other independent franchise owners personally, I know they are free to do as they wish, but wise owners also support the general business and brand perception. Chick-fil-A will surely suffer, and your business in particular, if you stand by and give Nazi-esque answers when confronted about supporting abortionists like Rosenfeld’s HWC.If you remember, the Nazis who serviced the holocaust perpetrators also said “we are simply fulfilling a business order.” Yet these same businesses (like BASF, who supplied Zyklon B to gas Jews, for example) were held responsible by courts for war crimes.
Here’s AHA’s pictorial position:
In this video Caleb shows a clip of the original confrontation with the Chick-fil-A delivery person, who it turns out was manager Robert L.
In the video Caleb refutes complaints he has received from Christians, such as that we are instructed in Proverbs 25:21 to give our enemies food and water if they are hungry and thirsty, pointing out abortionist Bernard Rosenfeld and his staff are by no means starving or dying of thirst.
What do you think Chick-fil-A should have done when getting the catering call from an abortion clinic? How far should Christian and/or pro-life-owned companies go to avoid complicity with abortion?
For that matter, how far should we as individual pro-lifers go to avoid aiding and abetting abortion?
Coincidentally, here’s video via Life Dynamics of a different caterer who turned around and left when he realized he was delivering to the Houston Planned Parenthood.
Be sure to take the poll as well as lend your thoughts…
[HT: Andy Moore, lesforlife.blogspot.com, and saynsumthn.wordpress.com]
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
This brought to mind a great Russel Brand Quote:
“… we all know “just doing my job” is the excuse offered up for enacting genocide.”
Of course this was used in a not so noble endeavor, he’s a comedian, and AHA is in the abolition business, BUT art speaks truth to beauty, no?
In general, I would like to see all businesses conduct themselves in accord with some higher principles.
If you happen to be Starbucks or some other business that cultivates a trendy, liberal image — then cater to abortionists. Be proud and own it.
And if you are a Christian family business, then choose your customers and hire employees who share your values (whether or not they share your faith, because work is a human right. Everyone deserves to have a job and keep a home.)
The ones I have least respect for are the faceless secular corporations who insist on having no humanity or values.
Principled discernment is a good and necessary form of discrimination. (If the term “discrimination” bothers you, then try calling it “making choices.”) Our jaded society lacks this virtue.
No they most certainly should not. In fact no business should assist the abortion industry in any way.
From the article: “In the video Caleb refutes complaints he has received from Christians, such as that we are instructed in Proverbs 25:21 to give our enemies food and water if they are hungry and thirsty, pointing out abortionist Bernard Rosenfeld and his staff are by no means starving or dying of thirst.”
I don’t see the words “starving” or “dying of thirst” in that verse. I see the words “hungry” and “thirsty”. So I fail to see how Caleb ” refuted” anytying. I’d say those Christians who brought up the verse are 100% correct about what it says. Am I missing something?
I recall this story where Chick fil a sandwiches were offered to Planned Parenthood workers and don’t recall anyone complaining about it. http://www.lifenews.com/2012/08/01/planned-parenthood-staffers-refuse-free-chick-fil-a-sandwiches/
Was it because the workers weren’t paying for the food? Is that what makes the difference? I’m confused.
I don’t think this represents Chick-Fil-A as a whole–but rather one foolish franchise. I would say boycott that particular Holcombe store, but I doubt what this particular store allowed was something Chick-Fil-A corporate HQ would smile upon. I have a feeling HQ is likely not very happy with that owner & manager right now, at least I should think so.
This owner and manager made a terrible judgement call in servicing an abortion clinic. Pulling your vehicle covered in advertising into an abortion clinic lot to render them services links the two businesses and for Juli Salvagio and her manager, they are rightly reaping the giant backfiring and negative publicity which they have earned.
If I were that Chick Fil A manager, I would have jumped at the opportunity. Prepare the food then put “And Then There Were None” flyers in each person’s bag of food. Great seed planting opportunity.
Come on, Chick-a-lay, open up on Sundays and join the new millenium.
Just curious. Is there some reason my comments await moderation? Did I say something inappropriate? Comments time-stamped after mine are published. Why not mine?
I am surprised that an abortion mill would even choose Chick_Fil A, given enough their reputation for being anti-gay.
I don’t like their food, too salty and greasy.
This kinda touches on a conversation I recently had with a childhood friend. He owns a very successful bakery that advertises it is Christian-owned in it’s name. Yet he makes cakes for gay weddings and posts the cakes and congratulates the couples on his company facebook page. His reasoning is that he is trying to “show the love of Jesus” to folks. I argued that we can show love without affirming sin.
This isn’t the same thing but yet in a way it is. How far do we as Christians go to show the love of Christ yet not participate in sin? Where is the line? When do we know we’ve crossed it?
I’m pretty sure their business model is that of a franchise, meaning that the owner is only going to have so much sway over the individual franchises and the decisions they make.
Economic isolation is an effective tool to dry up abortion facilities.
Instead of turning the delivery around, I would have given the food to the pro-lifers outside the fence.
The baker can show the love of Jesus through the spiritual works of mercy:
To instruct the ignorant;
To counsel the doubtful;
To admonish sinners;
To bear wrongs patiently;
To forgive offences willingly;
To comfort the afflicted;
To pray for the living and the dead.
They should deliver pulled chicken embryo sandwiches.
It will be interesting to see what the Chick-fil-A founders have to say about this scandal.
Like Hobby Lobby, the folks at Chick-fil-A just want to be left alone to run their business according to their personal Christian values. They want to treat their employees well, and give them Sundays off to be with their families.
One day, the CEO of Chick-fil-A made a public remark in support of natural families — and all hate broke loose. Hobby Lobby filed a lawsuit against an order to make them pay for abortifacient drugs, and intolerance rained upon them as well.
If I were Chick-fil-A brass, I would tell Juli Salvagio that she can sell to whomever she wants to — but when she takes the Company logo to unsavory places, she may face some disciplinary sanctions. We don’t want our image to be associated with stripper bars, massage parlors and abortion mills in any community.
Del – would be interesting to see the franchise agreement. Obviously is has something in there regarding business hours and being closed on Sunday. But would be interested to know how much farther the agreement does or doesn’t go.
I’d also put the NRA and some Catholic churches on your list at the end.
If you remember, the Nazis who serviced the holocaust perpetrators also said “we are simply fulfilling a business order.” Yet these same businesses (like BASF, who supplied Zyklon B to gas Jews, for example) were held responsible by courts for war crimes.
So, Mr. Head is saying that HWC is killing the precious babies with breaded chicken?
Exactly, Lisa! Hurd is hyperbolic, over the top and extra biblical. My Bible says to feed your enemy and that Jesus ate with sinners. This is a ministry opportunity that I wouldn’t have wasted if I had the opportunity to have contact with Planned Parenthood’s staff.
I remember when I was working of eating in a sandwich shop and the discussion came up among the workers of delivering to an abortion clinic. The owner decided to fill their order and deliver it.
I didn’t say anything but never ate at that sandwich shop again. Within a couple of months they were out of business. Karma.
Ex-GOP says:
Del – would be interesting to see the franchise agreement. Obviously is has something in there regarding business hours and being closed on Sunday. But would be interested to know how much farther the agreement does or doesn’t go.
I’d also put the NRA and some Catholic churches on your list at the end.
YOU would, of course. But I was trying to put myself into the position of Chick-fil-A management. They don’t care about strictly political organizations, such as the NRA or the ACLU. They don’t care if you like those customers or don’t like those customers.
The NRA does not harm families. A family-oriented business like Chick-fil-A has no objection to them.
And your remark about Catholic parishes was just plain mean. Why should Chick-fil-A avoid Catholics, even if they were legally permitted to refuse food to people based on religion?
Del –
NRA promotes laws in which more people end up dead. They are pro-choicers to a lesser degree.
And on Catholics – Houston was the focus of this post – and that was one of the places with a pedophile scandal within the catholic church – a couple of different priests.
Anybody who does anything I disagree with should be executed!
Truth seeker in the Philippines there is a popular snack that believe is called balut. Its cooked chicken embryo. They eat it whole, feathers and all. Yuck!
“Anybody who does anything I disagree with should be executed!”
Well that totally answers the question.
Actually balut is made from duck embryos. Check out Wikipedia for some really um, interesting photos.
phillymiss, I did not know that, feathers and all…blechh. It sounds nasty.
Ex-GOP: It is pretty bigoted to make a statement like that about Catholics. Because there are a few bad apples, you will then tar all Catholics with the same brush? There are people of every race and religion who commit heinous crimes. Does this make everyone of that race or religion a criminal? How about you start studying the lives of the saints and the martyrs? Then you will see some real examples of the Catholic faith. People who have committed great evils are not practicing the Catholic faith; in fact, they have turned from God. Catholic doctrine teaches purity and chastity and celibacy for priests. The vast majority of priests are good and holy and would never harm a soul. There is a very tiny minority of priests who have done vile things, and may God have mercy on their soul. While these crimes are very wrong, and I do not condone them, the media has made it out to be a larger scandal than it actually is, and in fact many innocent long-dead priests have been wrongfully accused just for the sake of money. In reality, there are many more teachers who have committed crimes of pedophilia than priests, and yet, I rarely hear a vendetta against teachers for this scandal.
Some pro-life people are obnoxious and turn off more people than they attract and this is coming from a pro life person.
This guy needs to get a life.
Julie – I put Catholic priests at a much higher level of expectations than I would teachers – and I hope you would as well.
Julie, Ex-RINO, lashes out because he knows our faith teaches life before conception MUST be protected by any just society and because of our support of traditional marriage. He has a vendetta against Catholic priests because his church is uncomfortable with these things being taught as a part of God’s plan for the family.
Ex-RINO, ‘out of the blue’ you choose to make Catholic priests a target in your conversation about Chic-Fil-A and your reasoning for making them a target is that you hold them in a higher regard? You do realize how absurd that sounds don’t you?
truth –
Vandetta? Post one other post where I’ve ever mentioned catholic priests. You can’t.
I’m just staying that if we’re piling on with potentially offensive groups that some franchise owners might not want to serve, why not throw them in there? Or is it only fun to talk about when it’s “other” people.
I’ve enjoyed you living under your rock for a few months truth – you know that when you stick your head out and try to debate with Reality or me, it ends very badly for you – so please, let’s just go back to how it has been.
thanks –
Truthseeker good point about critics of the Catholic Faith. Apologetics is awesome!
“you know that when you stick your head out and try to debate with Reality or me, it ends very badly for you”
Oh come on, you and I both know very well that Reality has never won a debate with anybody. To pretend otherwise is pure foolishness.
“our faith teaches life before conception”
Wait, life BEFORE conception must be protected? How does that work? Are each sperm and egg supposed to be protected somehow?
“.. such as that we are instructed in Proverbs 25:21 to give our enemies food and water if they are hungry and thirsty … ”
This passage does not apply not because they are not starving, but because it says GIVE! It does not say “allow your enemies to purchase at a reasonable margin profitable to you.”
JDC: you and I both know very well that Reality has never won a debate with anybody. To pretend otherwise is pure foolishness.
No way, Holmes. If there is “foolishness” here, it is the mischaracterizations of arguments (strawmen, etc.), and opinion/subjective belief/myth/fantasy presented as external fact.
Reality correctly notes that, arrives at the logical end via argument, and doesn’t engage in logical fallacies in the first place.
What we have here are differences of opinion, and it seems to me that the only way you would say “good argument” to someone is if they share your unprovable assumptions from the beginning.
JDC, I meant to say life begins at conception. Nice catch.
LOL Ex-RINO, this coming from the guy who says abortion is murder but thinks people should have the ‘choice’ to abort. I am flattered that you an 12 other pro-choicers have missed me so much :)
You and Reality are the most feeble-minded posters on this entire board. You never answer questions directed at you and you never stay on topic.
I really don’t think it is polite to discuss a recognized commenter who has not [yet] commented on a specific thread.
truth – you are mixing up views here – you must be attributing some other poster’s views to me.
Maybe your views have ‘evolved’ then. In the past you had said that you think abortion is murder; has your position changed on this point?
Nope – I believe that.
Truthseeker, to Ex-GOP: You and Reality are the most feeble-minded posters on this entire board.
Come on, mang. You know that’s not true.
—–
You never answer questions directed at you and you never stay on topic.
Poppycock, my good man. There is endless pretense about what “Reality says,” and the arguments of other posters, all manner of straw men arguments, false assumptions that subjective opinion is external fact, etc., and a noted lack of directly quoting what some people say and then replying to that, rather than going off kilter outright, or on nutty tangents.
“JDC, I meant to say life begins at conception. Nice catch”
Okay, I see. It occurred to me after I made my comment that some people are now saying that conception and fertilization are different things, with conception now being equivalent to implantation or something. So I was then thinking you may have been referring to protecting life between fertilization and implantation.
“I really don’t think it is polite to discuss a recognized commenter who has not [yet] commented on a specific thread.”
I really can’t see a problem with it. Look, we’re all part of a community here so I figure we can refer to ech other when we need to.
Pardon me, but part of the address needs correcting. It’s not Ave., it’s Blvd. (for boulevard).
I grew up in Houston and I knew it was Holcombe Blvd.
That’s pretty weird of Chick Fil A catering a place like a murder mill.
Maybe Chick will donate the money made from it to a pro-Life charity…..
OK then Ex-RINO, we agree that abortion is murder. If abortion is murder, then tens of thousands of people are being murdered by abortionists every day in the US correct?
Doug, welcome back to the board after your long hiatus. Ex-RINO avoids answering questions and he changes the subject with strawmen.
Reality is just living in fantasy. For instance when the US was bombing Libya (our planes, our bombs, our pilots etc,); I could not even get Reality to admit that the US was bombing Libya; he insisted on saying it was not the US it was the UN. For gawd sakes man; We funded 90% of that military campaign.
Truthseeker, quotes and references or it didn’t happen. Anybody can say anything, but there is endless amounts of pretending what others say and have said, and people talking past each other.
100 years ago today, France declared war on Austria-Hungary.
Doug,
https://www.jillstanek.com/2011/03/stanek-sunday-funnies-3-27-11/#comments
you can start at April 2, 2011 at 1:58 am
I pointed out that US forces launched 168 of the first 180 tomohawk missles that were launched against Libya in March 2011 and I quote reality’s response:
““In your ‘reality’ was it Obama’s decision to launch the 200 humanitarian tomohawk missiles as a first strike upon Libya?” – my answer to your heavily loaded question must be NO! –
I attribute it to a progressive ‘mind-bending’ that allows them to place themselves into such severe denial to the point of speaking lies (intentional or unintentional?) in order to shirk any responsibility for their actions. Obama is a perfect example.
truth – yes – murders every day.
and truth – you make fun of progressives, but you realize your daily support is for the bankrupt party – no ideas, no future – their only strength is being negative about anything and everything going on. They are like the old complaining aunt or uncle everyone has and nobody likes. That’s your party. They are a road to nowhere. So make fun of others all you want – but realize you’re on a sinking ship of dinosaurs. I mean, your party leaders – Jeb Bush, Rick Perry, Rush Limbaugh. Wow. Very appealing to the masses truth.
Tens of thousands of murders every day, you had to leave the numbers out just to say it; and the DemocRATic party is the party of that ‘choice’. Any party that is twisted enough to support killing children as a part of their platform is ineligible to get my vote. Period. I’ll take that to judgement day.
If you are interested; my favorite Republican candidate right now is Dr. Ben Carson. I guess that doesn’t fit your theme that the tea-party is racist though does it?
I’m really not that interested to know who you’ve seen in a Fox interview or two. I’ve read some of Dr. Ben Carson’s health care stuff. It’s cute. It would never work, and smart economists have torn it up, but it’s cute if you’re into stuff that won’t work.
The Republicans are bending over backward to validate 98% percent of abortions. We have two parties of death – face it.
Truthseeker – okay, if it was indeed Obama’s decision, then Reality was wrong about that.
Doug, It was US soldiers using missiles and US planes and US battleships; how could it not have been Obama’s decision? He did have the backing of former vice-president Dick Cheney but Obama was Commander in Chief at the time the US forces carried out those strikes.
I agree that priests are good and holy men, and should be held to a higher standard, and I am glad that you (Ex-GOP) recognize that. When someone is *supposed* to uphold a higher standard of goodness than the rest of us, we feel a certain level of betrayal; that is true. However, you failed to respond to the logical part of the argument about teachers versus priests, and in fact, simply responded in an emotional way. Thus, I still have the upper hand in this debate – score for me! Why isn’t there a huge media scandal about teachers, and why isn’t the NEA (National Education Association)being sued over teachers who molest students? Based on your argument, all teachers ought to also be denied Chick Fil A sandwiches. Please continue the logic and tell me that you don’t just have a personal hatred for all people who are Catholic regardless of their personal actions/behavior. If you did, then you might just be bigoted, eh? By the way, the real issue here is about abortion, but I find that since you can’t truly *defend* the killing of innocent children, you invent all kinds of sideshow arguments to distract from what abortion really is. No one who is in favor of abortion can really say with honesty: ” I think it is right to kill innocent children”. No one can say that! Win! Score – pro-life side! Have you seen the awesome debate of Lila Rose & her arch nemesis – the president of NARAL? Even that woman cannot, and will not actually defend or even speak about what goes on in the womb during an abortion, and I bet you can’t and won’t either. It’s too vile, too wrong, and too awful to even contemplate – and so you call murder “choice”. Another win for the pro-life side!
Julie – if you want my thoughts – ask me. If you want to have a debate with yourself – carry on. Very odd post.
Julie – nice WIN for you and for the pro-life side :)
“I’m really not that interested to know who you’ve seen in a Fox interview or two.”
Ex-RINO
Dr. Carson out-classes Obama by a country mile. Here he is on CSPAN – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpiryahOspY
Truthseeker, I think down deep you love Obama like the dickens – and you end up trying to damp your psyche down all the time by saying “bad” stuff about him. ;)
Ben Carson routinely fires up hyperbolic silliness; is he a disciple of Michelle Bachman?
truth –
Can you bullet point out the details of Dr. Carson’s health care plan – and state what you do or don’t like about it?