New poll/old poll
My new poll question is up, and it’s a toughie:
Have you lost a child to abortion? Do you personally know someone who has?
You are allowed up to 3 answers.
Make comments about either the old poll question or new one on this post, not the Vizu website.
Who knew my poll question posted earlier this week would so quickly be answered? We were right on the Republican, which was Giuliani, but not the Democrat, which was Edwards….
And if you answered the poll – and if not, why not?! – find your brightly colored flag on the map (click to enlarge):
Jan.31, 2008 1:13 pm |
Polls |
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
We need one more choice for people impacted by abortion. Through adoption, I am parenting a child almost lost to abortion. Her birthmom visited abortion clinics twice in her first trimester with the serious intention of ending her pregnancy. Technicalities caused her to rethink it, and eventually she carried the baby to term and made the loving decision to place her for adoption. When your child was almost killed in that way, abortion becomes very personal.
I’ve lost several family members to abortion, including nieces and cousins. My SIL was due within two weeks of one of my children – I wonder what his life would be like with a cousin just his age?
I knew quite a few post-abortion women, sad to say.
I had an abortion that I regret.
My mother took my sister for an abortion.
I know at least 30 women who have and regret theirs as well.(through Operation Outcry and Silent No More)
I know one father who regrets the abortion of two of his children.
i have personally counseled many women who have suffered through an abortion-most of them were seriously pressured by family/boyfriends to abort-it’s always stunned me that feminists aren’t outraged by that-too bad abortion is their holy grail
Carla, does your sister regret her abortion?
Everyone who I know who has had an abortion is happy with the choice. And obviously, other people’s surgeries don’t affect my life at all.
I’ve heard that even some people who might regret their choice to have an abortion don’t think other women should be denied that same choice.
Hal,
My sister is an alcholic, has been divorced twice and is one of the most hateful, vulgar women I know. She must be completely and totally “happy” “fine” and “at peace” with it.
Carla, I’m truly sorry for your sister. Didn’t mean to bring up sore subject, but your choice of words earlier left me wondering.
Hal,
Thanks for asking.
It is not a sore subject. No worries. I haven’t seen her in 6 years. I do pray for her though.
Carla, my heart goes out to you. My sister also had an abortion. So I will never know my niece/nephew in this lifetime.
To this day, my sister does not know that I know. She was 17, I was 13 …. and like every good 13-yr-old, I was evesdropping in on a conversation between my sis and my mom when I heard them discussing her pregnancy and plans to abort. To my knowledge, it has never been discussed since.
Heartbreaking.
Thank you Kristi. Your story is a lot like mine. My sister was maybe 19, I was 18 and was told to NEVER tell anyone. If it’s so good for women maybe we should have told everyone!??! I often wonder what my mom tells herself about her grandchild.
Carla,
Sorry I missed you yesterday on another thread. Just wondering if you would be interested in some work I do for women who miscarry.
I did check out your blog and noticed we live in the same general area. If you are interested Bethany has my e-mail. Thanks!
I have met and gotten to know a large number of women who’ve had an abortion here. I have counseled (prouided a listening ear & reflective listening) to a number of women & have found a large number of women feel sadness and/or a loss to some degree, even those who are/were pro-choice or don’t regret choosing abortion.
I don`t know if my link came through or not (I’m a bit rusty on HTML coding) but the address was http://passboards.org
Sandy,
Yes I am interested. I will try get your email address. :)
Carla,
Could your sister have an underlying mental illness that accounts for her vulgarity, drinking, and failed relationships? I would advise that you google “personality disorders” and do some research. It may give you a great deal of insight as it did for me concerning my daughter and father. Good luck.
Carla, I am sorry about your sister. When I was in my 20’s I did sidewalk counselling and I remember talking to a 16 yr old girl going in with a friend. She didn’t want to have the abortion, especially after she saw the little fetal model I was carrying. Her baby was exactly the same age as the model. However, her “friend” pushed her along and in she went.
I eventually found her mom sitting in a car in the back alley behind the abortuary (see they’re still back alley abortions, even though they’re legal).
I talked with this woman for about a half hour but could not convince her to go in and get her daughter and that we (myself and another counsellor) would help her.
The mother spoke of the baby as a bunch of cells and refused to acknowledge that this was her grandchild she was killing.
I then learned that she herself had an abortion after her husband had abandoned her and she had also taken her eldest daughter for an abortion.
So, here in this household would now be 3 hurting women, all of whom had abortions. It was mind boggling. I felt that this woman was very hard and even coarse in some ways. There was nothing feminine about her.
I often think of this family and I pray for the girl who is now a woman. I can find no other reason that God allowed this to happen other than she is to have someone who is a spiritual friend.
This is only one of many women I remember but she stands out most.
BTW Carla, nice blog!
I too like Stevie Nicks, although her voice has sure gone downhill with age!
God bless you!
Thank you Patricia and Mary. I appreciate your comments. Abortion hurts us all.
Mary, I have never given mental illness a thought. She is hardened by her life and the choices she has made. I cannot bring myself nor my children near her. I would research but to be honest, I’m tired.:)
The Lord has blessed me with 4 children that I am trying hard to pour His love and instruction into. My husband and I have a legacy to change. My sisters grew up in the same dysfunction I did and we all dealt with it our own way.
Patricia,
What a heartbreaking story. I do wonder if my mother and sister think about it or discuss it. My best guess is no.
Patricia,
Thank you for the bloggy compliment.
Stevie!!! WOOT!
Carla,
I’m sorry about your sister. I hope you will look into the possiblity of mental illness, if for no other reason than to give yourself some insight and peace of mind. Your sister sounds so much like my father and daughter. While I cannot help my daughter, I at least know and understand what it is she is living with and what I can expect and never hope for.
My sister has a variation of the personality disorder my father had and its a real accomplishment if she and I can manage a civil conversation. These are NOT nice people but are instead extremely cruel and unempathetic.
Yes it was truly heartbreaking. I haven’t shared this story with anyone but close friends. It had a profound effect on me. In fact it was so strong that I experienced anniversary feelings around the date this happened for several years. So to me, abortion is not a private matter between a woman and her doctor. It is a very public act – it affects everyone.
Maybe in the next life, I’ll get to give her a BIG HUG!
I often wonder about the phrase “between a woman and her doctor”. What doctor? The abortion doctor? He did not even look at me or talk to me.
Obama said something to the effect that abortion is a decision to be made between a woman, her pastor, her spouse and her doctor. And if she doesn’t have those relationships?
Mary I am so sorry about your father and sister.
Yeah, the abortion doctor she has never met before in her life (if it’s her first abortion) and not only often doesn’t take the time for a consultation (as most surgeries require), but only has a limited knowledge of her medical history and health condition.
I’m curious, I’d like to hear from the pro-choice/ pro-abort people answer the FIRST question….
yeah, I agree Rachael and now I read that PP is concerned about all the post-abortive men.
They want to offer them counselling, likely so they can feel better about their gals getting aborted.
They just don’t get it – death is usually very hard to peddle.
“I’m curious, I’d like to hear from the pro-choice/ pro-abort people answer the FIRST question….”
I don’t understand, we’re answering every question.
“Yeah, the abortion doctor she has never met before in her life (if it’s her first abortion) and not only often doesn’t take the time for a consultation (as most surgeries require), but only has a limited knowledge of her medical history and health condition.”
Rachael, as I’ve said before, the my wife’s ob/gyn peformed her abortion is his office. He had been her doctor for years, they had a very good relationship, and he delivered our children. Not every abortion takes place in a “mill.”
That’s so cool, Hal. He killed some of your kids and help others INTO this world. What a guy!
Your kids are definitely abortion survivors.
“Your kids are definitely abortion survivors.”
you say that like it’s a bad thing.
well, how would you feel knowing you made it through the gauntlet of your parents because….???
who knows, they felt like it, or you have blue eyes or you’re a boy or you don’t have some major disability.
You’re a swell guy.
If you don’t mind my asking…
Were these your first two children that you aborted, Hal? Why? I guess I have never read the story about that.
Hal…you’re just one…I seem to remember there were many of you that post here…
C’mon PRO-CHOICE people..let’s hear your answer on the FIRST question: “Have you lost a child to abortion?”
“Have you lost a child to abortion?”
not a child really. The question includes your prejudices.
Carla, the fist abortion was before my first daughter was born, the second after, but before my second daughter was born.
ALthough we had reasons, none are necessary under our right of privacy. (and none would rise to the level any pro-life people would approve of anyway)
Hal,
I appreciate your honesty. I wasn’t asking to approve or disprove. Just wanted to hear it from you.
Or is it disapprove? :O
Hal…I, too, appreciate your honesty…
disaprove I believe. Disprove would be trying to make it false.
Hal,
If your wife was pregnant, and she had an abortion, you lost a child.
A woman can only be pregnant with a child. Not an ameoba, not a parasite – a human child.
Yes, Patricia, I’ve heard that somewhere before.
Hal
Maybe some day you and your wife will face up to what has happened.
May God bless you.
C’mon PRO-CHOICE people..let’s hear your answer on the FIRST question: “Have you lost a child to abortion?”
You rang?
I have had an abortion.
Patricia, we have already faced up t what happened, just not in a way you would have liked.
In other words, no regrets.
Alexandra,
How has your abortion affected you?
Rachael, as I’ve said before, the my wife’s ob/gyn peformed her abortion is his office. He had been her doctor for years, they had a very good relationship, and he delivered our children. Not every abortion takes place in a “mill.”
That may be so Hal and it was probably safer for your wife that way versus the run of the night mills (but certainly not for your unborn child anyway you put it), however according to the Alan Guttmacher Institute the majority of abortions are provided on an outpatient basis in clinics:
The Number and percentage distribution of abortion providers and of
abortions, by type of facility, according to caseload, 2005: Out of 1,787 (100%), 816 (45%) were preformed at abortion clinics or other clinics (nonspecialized clinics), 604 (34%) by hospitals, 367 (21%) by physician offices.
Source:
Alan Guttmacher Institute
Abortion in the United States:
Incidence and Access to Services, 2005
Pg 7, TABLE 4.
http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/journals/4000608.pdf
Accessed on 2-1-2008
Hal…you’re just one…I seem to remember there were many of you that post here…
C’mon PRO-CHOICE people..let’s hear your answer on the FIRST question: “Have you lost a child to abortion?”
Posted by: RSD at February 1, 2008 12:51 PM
………………………………………
I know of no one dying from an abortion let alone one of my children. My children are alive and quite well and I fail to understand how my son could die from an abortion.
Neither the embryo that I aborted nor the fetus I miscarried ever had a chance of being a child. i don’t consider possibilities to be actualities.
Sally,
I don’t think I knew you had an abortion. Was it the best choice you have ever made? How do you think it has affected you?
“Neither the embryo that I aborted nor the fetus I miscarried ever had a chance of being a child. i don’t consider possibilities to be actualities.”
Posted by: Sally,7:54 PM
You are right, a fetus is not a potential human being; it is an innocent human being with great potential.
Carla,
My abortion didn’t really affect me very much. It prompted me to get an IUD, but that’s about it. I don’t regret it. I’m still in the same relationship — my first, and it’s looking like my only at this point — and I’m glad that I had the option available at the time. It’s entirely possible that someday I could be overwhelmed with grief and regret, but that seems unlikely given how unambiguous my feelings have been on the issue both before and after the abortion. Even a couple years of hanging around pro-life sites hasn’t really made me wish I did anything differently. I will never be so proud as to say that I can predict the future, though, so I’ll never say ‘never’ — just ‘probably not.’
I’m sorry you regret your abortion. I wish I could change things for you. Not your feelings, but the events behind them.
It’s impossible to lose a child to abortion. A child would have been born (at which point you could call it infanticide or homicide). Have I had an abortion? Nope. I lost an embryo to miscarriage. Life goes on.
A friend of mine lost her 25 year old son to premeditated murder. People who whine about abortion being murder need to walk a mile in her moccosins.
There was an informal survey a few years ago asking parents if they had it to do over again, would they have kids? Over 70% said no. Hmm; of all the women I know who have had abortions, not one regret. Interesting counterpoint.
Hal,
If your wife was pregnant, and she had an abortion, you lost a child.
A woman can only be pregnant with a child. Not an ameoba, not a parasite – a human child.
Posted by: Patricia at February 1, 2008 2:15 PM
No, she terminated a pregnancy. Depending upon when the abortion took place, it was either an embryo or a fetus.
No child until birth. Can’t put a fetus in a child seat, can’t put booties on an embryo. Can’t get a social security number until birth, can’t be listed as a deduction (other than as “medical expenses”) on your taxes until birth. An acorn is only a potential tree; a ZEF is only a potential person.
I don’t know why antichoicers are so scared of medical terminology…
Hi Alexandra,
I appreciate your answer. You are right about not being able to predict the future, I pray that you find comfort if you need it.
Hi Catherine,
I am sorry that your friend’s 25 year old son was killed. That is horrifying to me.(I have 3 sons)I am prolife and forgive me for all the whining I have been doing. Shame on me. You seem angry. Why?
I had an abortion. Am I proud of it? Not really, I’m also not proud of the gall bladder surgery I recently had. That one was actually much worse due to doctor error and mismanagement of that error. Would I abort again? Under the same set of circumstances, you bet. Heck, if I found out today I was pregnant, I’d be making an apt. first thing Monday morning.
Rachael, you are sadly misinformed. You can’t walk into a clinic and get an abortion the same day. You are asked several times if you are sure. You have a pre-op apt and usually a post-op one as well.
Cheri,
I’m curious. Did you meet and were you interviewed preoperatively by the doctor doing the abortion? Did he/she take a complete medical history? Did he/she advise you of all risks and alternatives and then advise you to go home and consider these risks and alternatives before scheduling surgery?
Also, was the clinic staffed by credentialled personnel such as RNs, LPNs, Surgical Techs, or Patient Care Techs? Was the clinic set up for emergencies? By that I mean was there a crash cart, IVs, emergency medications, an ambu bag?
If you were administered any kind of anesthetic drugs, be it “twilight sleep” or general anesthesia, was it by a credentialled person and were you properly monitored the whole time?
Thank you.
Cheri,
I’m curious. Did you meet and were you interviewed preoperatively by the doctor doing the abortion? Did he/she take a complete medical history? Did he/she advise you of all risks and alternatives and then advise you to go home and consider these risks and alternatives before scheduling surgery?
Also, was the clinic staffed by credentialled personnel such as RNs, LPNs, Surgical Techs, or Patient Care Techs? Was the clinic set up for emergencies? By that I mean was there a crash cart, IVs, emergency medications, an ambu bag?
If you were administered any kind of anesthetic drugs, be it “twilight sleep” or general anesthesia, was it by a credentialled person and were you properly monitored the whole time?
Thank you.
Posted by: Mary
Mary, I’m not a child. I wouldn’t have had the abortion if the doctor hadn’t been ethical and met me before, explained all the risks, and had a good staff. I was properly monitored. I had a follow up appointment. Anyone who would have ANY medical procedure without doing that isn’t smart enough to raise a child, so abortion would be the best thing, don’t you think?
Cheri,
I in no way suggested that you were a child. I asked out of curiousity since other posters to this blog who have had abortions described other types of experiences, including not meeting the doctor ahead of time or even knowing who was taking care of them. Also, I have read such personal accounts by others not on this blog.
I have also seen programs of actual patients visiting clinics where there were no preoperative visits, no monitoring, and no emergency equipment.
One poster here describes how anesthetic drugs are given to abortion patients and there is no need for concern about their risks. I have told him/her time and again that he/she has no idea what he/she is talking about. This is in fact a very dangerous assumption.
That’s why I asked about your experience.
“I often wonder about the phrase “between a woman and her doctor”. What doctor? The abortion doctor? He did not even look at me or talk to me. “Posted by: Carla at February 1, 2008 9:09 AM
Carla, I wonder about that too. The phrase is kind of like the word “Choice”. It’s a good buzzword that doesn’t really mean anything. Abortion doctors are creepy, not the nice grandfatherly kind. If one ever even looked at me, I’d run.
“Abortion doctors are creepy, not the nice grandfatherly kind. If one ever even looked at me, I’d run.”
how many “abortion doctors” do you know? I only know one (and he would probably prefer the term “Ob/Gyn,”) and he’s a saint.
Cheri,
I in no way suggested that you were a child. I asked out of curiousity since other posters to this blog who have had abortions described other types of experiences, including not meeting the doctor ahead of time or even knowing who was taking care of them. Also, I have read such personal accounts by others not on this blog.
I have also seen programs of actual patients visiting clinics where there were no preoperative visits, no monitoring, and no emergency equipment.
One poster here describes how anesthetic drugs are given to abortion patients and there is no need for concern about their risks. I have told him/her time and again that he/she has no idea what he/she is talking about. This is in fact a very dangerous assumption.
That’s why I asked about your experience.
Posted by: Mary
Mary,
Most people on this blog have an antichoice agenda. You don’t think they’d admit it even if it wasn’t a horrid experience. The worse they can make it sound, the better for their position. Of course my abortion was shortly after Roe v. Wade came down from the Supreme Court. And, yes, the doctor was a kind faced older man.
Hal,
I often wonder about the “abortion doctor” lable. I know of none, they are all OB/GYNs who perform a service for a patient. And mine was a kind faced older man. My GP at the time referred me, and he wouldn’t have referred me if he didn’t have confidence in the doctor.
Jasper’s quote of the day:
“Twenty years ago, being pro-life was déclassé. Now it is a respectable point of view.
~ Excerpt from January 22 op ed in the Los Angeles Times by Kate Michelman, former head of NARAL, and Frances Kissling, former head of Catholics for a Free Choice”
The pro-life side is so far ahead of them…they haven’t a clue.
If they exemplify class, they can have it.
(Jasper’s Qoute of the day)…….that’s declasse. For some reason it didn’t pick up the accents on the “e”s,
Jasper’s quote of the day:
“Twenty years ago, being pro-life was déclassé. Now it is a respectable point of view.
~ Excerpt from January 22 op ed in the Los Angeles Times by Kate Michelman, former head of NARAL, and Frances Kissling, former head of Catholics for a Free Choice”
The pro-life side is so far ahead of them…they haven’t a clue.
If they exemplify class, they can have it.
Posted by: Janet
Janet, you can’t really believe a bunch of people who protest outside legal facilities with pictures and models of fetuses that are actually much older than those aborted have class. You can’t believe those that yell don’t kill your baby when the person going in is having a medically necessary abortion have class. If trying to guilt people into believing your way is class, I’d rather not have any. Fortunately for me, I know class when I see it and it usually comes in a prochoice form.
Cheri,
In fact we have many PC posters who have talked of their abortion experience and have not made it horrid at all. The one who thinks giving anesthetic medications to an abortion patient is a matter of no concern works in an abortion clinic, though in what capacity I don’t know.
Also, the other accounts I’ve mentioned have been personal testimonies in magazines, on this blog, newspaper accounts, and actual situations filmed for TV or video.
Its interesting you mention you went to a doctor’s office right after Roe v Wade. Back then most abortions were done in doctor’s offices. Contrary to popular misconception, most illegal abortions were as well. Doctors had to be more careful and were. In fact, the illegal abortion death rate had been steadily declining for years prior to Roe v Wade and this is probably why. Chances are your doctor had been performing them illegally in his office long before you saw him.
With the establishment of clinics and little regulation, as well as a massive influx of women, standards have slipped considerably and many have been forced to close because of substandard care. The accounts I’m referring to occured long after your experience.
Posted by: Janet
Janet, you can’t really believe a bunch of people who protest outside legal facilities with pictures and models of fetuses that are actually much older than those aborted have class. You can’t believe those that yell don’t kill your baby when the person going in is having a medically necessary abortion have class. If trying to guilt people into believing your way is class, I’d rather not have any. Fortunately for me, I know class when I see it and it usually comes in a prochoice form.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 12:49 PM
Cheri,
Class is not the issue here and this is perfect example of how the pro-choicer leaders operate. They bring up all kinds of other talking points to distract people from thinking about “what are we doing to an innocent human life”? Why not show the pictures of fetuses? We see every type of surgery on television today. We just want to show the truth. Just this week, a beautiful (unbloodied) picture of a miscarried, very young fetus(baby) was posted here. You’d be amazed at how amazingly human it really looks. Even at that age it’s a baby with the potential for a good life.
“Abortion doctors are creepy, not the nice grandfatherly kind. If one ever even looked at me, I’d run.”
how many “abortion doctors” do you know? I only know one (and he would probably prefer the term “Ob/Gyn,”) and he’s a saint.
Posted by: Hal at February 2, 2008 12:16 PM
Hal:Your OB/GYN may be a nice enough man, but a saint? Perhaps, if he quit killing babies and stood up in defense of innocent human life. In my opinion, calling an abortionist an OB/GYN is an insult to all of the OB/GYN’s who’ve ever come before him/her and all the OB/GYN’s who will follow him. As you say, some might prefer not being called abortion doctors. Then they’d have to admit to their friends at cocktail parties and such, that they are killing (innocent human beings that have potential for a life). Please don’t say that they are afraid of us crazy pro- lifers, because it’s a very small minority; their immoral behavior is not condoned nor supported by us.
Thank the Lord, I have never met an abortionist (he does abortion care like a dentist does dental care) but what I have seen is the crazy look in the eyes of women who will fight to the death for a woman’s right to abortion. Abortion is an evil thing, evil brings out the worst in people. There are testimonies of ex-abortionists on the Pro-Life Action League website, see http://www.prolifeaction.org/providers/. Some might look nice but that is worse, because they can deceive people with their gentle manner. You can’t always tell a book by its cover.
Mary, I wasn’t sure if you meant to ask both Cheri and myself, and I didn’t want to risk seeming rude or like I was ignoring you so I answered your questions anyway:
I’m curious. Did you meet and were you interviewed preoperatively by the doctor doing the abortion?
I met the doctor before the abortion, and she spoke with me about whether or not I was sure I wanted to have an abortion.
Did he/she take a complete medical history?
The nurses did. This was my experience when I had surgery on my foot as well — the doctor met with me, the nurses did the information-gathering, and the doctor performed the surgery. Those are my only two experiences with surgical procedures, so I have no other basis for comparison.
Did he/she advise you of all risks and alternatives and then advise you to go home and consider these risks and alternatives before scheduling surgery?
Yes. A nurse went over a list of risks and possible complications with me point by point, and asked if I had any questions.
Also, was the clinic staffed by credentialled personnel such as RNs, LPNs, Surgical Techs, or Patient Care Techs?
I didn’t ask for credentials, so I don’t know what type of nurses and techs were there. They all were very knowledgeable and knew what they were doing as far as I could tell, though if I’m ever there again perhaps I’ll ask for degrees so I can better answer your question. I don’t mean that to sound curt; I’m not well-acquainted with the varying levels within the medical community so I don’t really pay attention to differences between types of nurses etc.
Was the clinic set up for emergencies? By that I mean was there a crash cart, IVs, emergency medications, an ambu bag?
When we were going over risks, we discussed whether there was any complication that might arise that they would not be equipped to deal with. They said that due to the nature of some of the risks, they would have to call an ambulance, but that they were set up to keep me stabilized until the ambulance arrived. I had a manual vacuum aspiration, so the chance of complications during the procedure was pretty low.
If you were administered any kind of anesthetic drugs, be it “twilight sleep” or general anesthesia, was it by a credentialled person and were you properly monitored the whole time?
I had the doctor and a nurse in the room with me. The doctor gave me a painkiller — I think ibuprofen — a short while before the abortion, and then she numbed my cervix with a shot of a local anesthetic, kind of like the anesthetic shot you get when you’re at the dentist. I had no other anesthetic.
Alexandra,
Thank you. I appreciate your response.
For any other type of surgical procedure, and I’ve had a few minor as well as more major ones as well, the doctor will meet with you, take a history, especially if its a first meeting, discuss all risks and alternatives, then send you home to think it over and then schedule your surgery. I was in fact annoyed when I was having a repeat office procedure with the same doctor and he was adamant that I must first see him for a review of my history, discussion of the procedure, and then I could schedule for another time.
This is the routine for surgery, except for emergency situations. Also, surgeons must have history and physicals on the chart that they performed. Podiatrists must have an MD or DO perform and write one up.
About credentials. All I mean is did you know by a name tag who was caring for you. Usually they’ll tell you the name and training, such as RN, LPN, or PCT. Also, when staff introduce themselves they should tell you who they are and what they do. I always introduce myself and my job description when I speak to a patient.
At Tiller’s clinic in Wichita none of his staff is medically trained or licensed and this has been the situation in many abortion clinics, that’s why I asked.
It sounds like they were set up for an emergency. Again, in some clinics this has not been the case.
Concerning the anesthetic. In some clinics, unqualified people were administering more potent drugs, or were administering these drugs and operating simultaneously. Not safe. I’m curious if you were monitored. This should be standard. I was for my office procedures which were also done under local anesthetic.
Rachael, you are sadly misinformed. You can’t walk into a clinic and get an abortion the same day. You are asked several times if you are sure. You have a pre-op apt and usually a post-op one as well.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 9:29 AM
If this is true then why are so many states fighting the 24 hour waiting period?
Hal,
We have talked about this before. You seem to have had the top of the line limosine abortion experience and this is what you base most of your arguments on.
If this is true then why are so many states fighting the 24 hour waiting period?
Posted by: Sandy
Because it is one more hassle. Some people can’t get an abortion within hours of their home. So you want them to troop down, miss work, etc. just to make you happy? If the woman is sure, going in the morning of the procedure and talking about the risks, the procedure, etc. can be the only way to get it done. Is this optimal? No, but the anti-choice nuts have closed down so many clinics with their threats of violence that it is often the only choice.
Cheri,
Class is not the issue here and this is perfect example of how the pro-choicer leaders operate. They bring up all kinds of other talking points to distract people from thinking about “what are we doing to an innocent human life”? Why not show the pictures of fetuses? We see every type of surgery on television today. We just want to show the truth. Just this week, a beautiful (unbloodied) picture of a miscarried, very young fetus(baby) was posted here. You’d be amazed at how amazingly human it really looks. Even at that age it’s a baby with the potential for a good life.
Posted by: Janet at February 2, 2008 2:24 PM
And if you’ll buy that…
Hal,
We have talked about this before. You seem to have had the top of the line limosine abortion experience and this is what you base most of your arguments on.
Posted by: Sandy at February 2, 2008 4:29 PM
Gee, I had the same type of experience. No one wants to aknowledge that MOST abortions and OB/GYNs work this way. It’s much better to point to one or two bad ones.
For any other type of surgical procedure, and I’ve had a few minor as well as more major ones as well, the doctor will meet with you, take a history, especially if its a first meeting, discuss all risks and alternatives, then send you home to think it over and then schedule your surgery. I was in fact annoyed when I was having a repeat office procedure with the same doctor and he was adamant that I must first see him for a review of my history, discussion of the procedure, and then I could schedule for another time.
*************
Hmmmm sounds like your doctor got burnt with a malpractice lawsuit somewhere down the line and is now doing unecessary visits and tests. Or he could be doing them to make money off your insurance company. I have had three minor procedures performed in the last six months, all by the same doctor. He never made me see him before the last two procedures. I’d been scheduled with him to have a toenail off, but we discussed it and have decided to take a wait and see approach. I’ve had another “minor” surgery with a different doctor. I saw her a week before the procedure. She went over everything with me and it was the worst medical experience I have ever had. It was supposed to be in on Friday back in class on Monday. Never did get back to class that term. So no matter how careful people are, mistakes happen. In my case it got worse because the surgeon wouldn’t accept she made a mistake. I have another procedure scheduled with the doc that did the other three. I saw him while we were talking about my toenail and I mentioned he’d be seeing me again.
Cheri,
One more hassle? We have people come from out of town to see our surgeons, sometimes travelling 2+ hours and I’m sure having to arrange child care and missing work. They must still see the surgeon first, have a workup, be given all risks and alternatives, then go home, think it over, and schedule their surgeries for another day. This is standard of care, the only exception being an emergency. If this is inconvenient, and I’m sure it is, that’s unfortunate. This is how it will be done. I told Alexandra in her post how annoyed I was a doctor wouldn’t do a repeat office procedure on me without seeing me first and scheduling me later for the procedure, and he had already treated me.
The clinics have closed down because of substandard and dangerous conditions. One clinic in Kansas had cockroaches and rodent droppings. One New Jersey clinic was found to have rusted instruments as well as numerous other violations. The clinic was closed down after nearly killing a woman and leaving her with possible neurological damage.
Rachael, you are sadly misinformed. You can’t walk into a clinic and get an abortion the same day. You are asked several times if you are sure.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 9:29 AM
Then,
I ask:
If this is true then why are so many states fighting the 24 hour waiting period?
Posted by: Sandy
Because it is one more hassle. Some people can’t get an abortion within hours of their home. So you want them to troop down, miss work, etc. just to make you happy? If the woman is sure, going in the morning of the procedure and talking about the risks, the procedure, etc. can be the only way to get it done.
Cheri,
So you contradict yourself. Now you say women can go in the same day. Try to follow your own story. Also, the 24 hour waiting period is not set to make me happy. As you clearly stated:
“You have a pre-op apt and usually a post-op one as well.”
This is to ensure the health of the woman. That would make me happy. What other elective procedure would you have the same day.
Gee, I had the same type of experience. No one wants to aknowledge that MOST abortions and OB/GYNs work this way. It’s much better to point to one or two bad ones.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 4:34 PM
Please source your statement.
Cheri, 4:42PM
That’s standard of care and its routine for any surgeon. Also, I was self pay and the visit didn’t cost me a dime. What I was having done was more extensive than a toenail removal and it had been a year since I had seen him.
You had been more consistently seeing your doctor and he was aware of your health status so he may go ahead with certain minor procedures he may know you need when you decide you want them done.
That’s very unfortunate about your experience with the woman doctor. You did have to meet with her ahead of time though as I said is the standard of care. Unfortunately, there are no guarantees.
Cheri,
I am not here to judge anyone. You can read what the doctors have to say about their own profession. The link is at my 2:29 PM post. God bless you.
Cheri,
Don’t bother. Found it myself.
Most abortions in the U.S. are performed in independent clinics that specialize in abortion services. In 1996, 90 percent of reported abortions were performed in clinics, seven percent took place in hospitals, and three percent were performed in the
private offices of physicians.8
Site:
The Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation is an independent national health care philanthropy and is not associated with Kaiser Permanente or Kaiser Industries
So, a mere 3% of abortons take place in a private office facility. 90% are shuffled off to abortion clinics where women don’t have an established on-going relationship with the abortionist. Not what I would call a limosine abotion experience.
Cheri, 4:42PM
That’s standard of care and its routine for any surgeon. Also, I was self pay and the visit didn’t cost me a dime. What I was having done was more extensive than a toenail removal and it had been a year since I had seen him.
You had been more consistently seeing your doctor and he was aware of your health status so he may go ahead with certain minor procedures he may know you need when you decide you want them done.
That’s very unfortunate about your experience with the woman doctor. You did have to meet with her ahead of time though as I said is the standard of care. Unfortunately, there are no guarantees.
Posted by: Mary
Mary, only the toenail procedure was THAT minor. However, I have all my healtcare with the same group, so he could easily talk to my PCP at lunch or some other time. I’m very lucky in my healthcare benefits. I did go to a specialist when I had a granuloma on my toe. The entire toe was horribly red and hurting. Instead of giving me a pain med so I could deal with the surgery, he did it right then with local anesthetic. Idiot! When the toe acted up the next time I asked for a second opinion. That was a case of a bad male doctor and a good female doctor.
So, a mere 3% of abortons take place in a private office facility. 90% are shuffled off to abortion clinics where women don’t have an established on-going relationship with the abortionist. Not what I would call a limosine abotion experience.
Posted by: Sandy at February 2, 2008
Certainly better than what you want people to believe. A friend works at PP 9where they only offer referrals, not actual abortions. She’s visited the clinics the clinic refers to and is satisfied they practice pruudent medicine.
That was a case of a bad male doctor and a good female doctor.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 5:07 PM
Why do you point out that the bad doctor was male?? And the good doctor was female.
Cheri,
You are indeed lucky. Under these circumstances its understandable that your doctor would be comfortable doing the procedures in his office without seeing you first every time.
She’s visited the clinics the clinic refers to and is satisfied they practice pruudent medicine.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 5:11 PM
So what. Sounds like the wolf in charge of the hen house.
That was a case of a bad male doctor and a good female doctor.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 5:07 PM
Why do you point out that the bad doctor was male?? And the good doctor was female.
Because I’d made a comment about a female dr. not being great and the male doctor being good.
One more hassle? We have people come from out of town to see our surgeons, sometimes travelling 2+ hours and I’m sure having to arrange child care and missing work. They must still see the surgeon first, have a workup, be given all risks and alternatives, then go home, think it over, and schedule their surgeries for another day. This is standard of care, the only exception being an emergency. If this is inconvenient, and I’m sure it is, that’s unfortunate. This is how it will be done. I told Alexandra in her post how annoyed I was a doctor wouldn’t do a repeat office procedure on me without seeing me first and scheduling me later for the procedure, and he had already treated me.
The clinics have closed down because of substandard and dangerous conditions. One clinic in Kansas had cockroaches and rodent droppings. One New Jersey clinic was found to have rusted instruments as well as numerous other violations. The clinic was closed down after nearly killing a woman and leaving her with possible neurological damage.
Posted by: Mary
I’m sorry you live in such a poor place where surgeons are 2+ hours away. By choice I see doctors that are 45 – 60 minutes away. I could see doctors up here, but I started at that place when I lived closer. Even that far is a hassle, one I find worthwhile, but most people think I’m weird because we do have good doctors here and two very good hospitals across the river. I just prefer the familiar. I think most people do. However, the people seeking abortions are frequently the women who just can’t miss work. I think it’s fine if they meet with the dr. in the am and have the procedure in the pm.
She’s visited the clinics the clinic refers to and is satisfied they practice pruudent medicine.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 5:11 PM
So what. Sounds like the wolf in charge of the hen house.
Posted by: Sandy
LOL, you’d have to know my friend. She was a staunch anti-choicer until I introduced her to another friend of mine. That person’s case made her rethink things. She does still believe abortion should be rare, but if they are going to be done, she wants to make sure no harm comes to the woman.
Rachael, you are sadly misinformed. You can’t walk into a clinic and get an abortion the same day. You are asked several times if you are sure. You have a pre-op apt and usually a post-op one as well.
Posted by: Cheri at February 2, 2008 9:29 AM
Really, Cheri, because this is not the experience the majority of women have, my conclusion comes after the reading and listening to a number of the very real personal accounts of other women not only not on this blog, but of a variety of backgrounds and beliefs:
The Voices of Men and Women Who’ve Experienced Abortion
A diverse collection of women’s stories at their online journals and blogs, often written from the day they found out about the pregnancy to recovery after the abortion
http://rsnider.livejournal.com/4874.html
Baby Center Bulletin Boards: Termination for Non-Medical Reasons
http://boards.babycenter.com/bcus1143243
Abortion Info Community
http://community.livejournal.com/abortioninfo
PASS Support Site: Sharing Stories
afterabortion.com/sharing.html
PASS Support Boards – Coerced Abortion
http://passboards.org/
Mods, got another post in que, thanks!
Catherine,
I don’t know why antichoicers are so scared of medical terminology…
I don’t think “scared” is the right word…
The generation of children born after Roe v Wade use those terms now. But they are relatively new in the general public. Older prochoicers use them to dehumanize the infants, and younger ones use them because that’s all they know.
But pre Roe v Wade NO ONE except medical personnel used terms like fetus. It’s a ploy by the pro choice side, well thought out and manipulative.
We aren’t “scared” of the terms, just “wise” to them and the reason for their use…
Alexandra,
Even a couple years of hanging around pro-life sites hasn’t really made me wish I did anything differently.
The fact that you’ve been hanging out at pro-life sites for a couple of years should tell you all you need to know.
I had knee surgery last spring. It hasn’t affected me. However, if someone catches me hanging out at knee surgery sites for the next couple of years, they can feel free to assume I’m a little obsessed with my knee surgery.
Other than the fact that you are searching for “something”, I can’t think of a single reason to hang out at pro-life sites for years. One of us isn’t getting a clear picture…
Cheri,
Most people on this blog have an anti choice agenda.
Hmmmmm. It’s a prolife blog, Cheri. What did you expect? Most likely not what you have received. Honest, straightforward answers, respect and mature dialog with people who really care. Mary, Janet, Sandy to mention a few. You are respectfully disagreed with. Agenda, indeed.
Cheri,
You misunderstand. People travel to our city from more rural areas to see our specialists. This is often the situation in other cities which have specialists. People travel from my city for specialized care not available here.
And these are people who would prefer not to miss work if at all possible and must also make arrangements for child care, as you say women having abortions must do.
Meeting the surgeon for the first time in the AM and having surgery in the PM, unless its urgent, is highly unlikely. The surgeon has other patients and may not be available. The surgeon would also prefer you schedule the procedure after thinking over the risks and alternatives, that you make a well informed choice that you have had time to think over.
The fact that you’ve been hanging out at pro-life sites for a couple of years should tell you all you need to know […] Other than the fact that you are searching for “something”, I can’t think of a single reason to hang out at pro-life sites for years. One of us isn’t getting a clear picture…
Right, it could have nothing to do with the fact that I’m interested in political discussion about abortion, or that I’m interested in knowing what pro-lifers think because I’m interested in finding common ground to help women in crisis pregnancy situations, or that I enjoy being made to think rather than to just read things that I agree with over and over. I vastly prefer to seek out opinions that differ from my own; I’m of the belief that if I don’t understand the best arguments that an opposing point of view has to offer, then I don’t fully understand my own opinions. I have several politically-charged sites I visit on a regular basis, all dealing with various topics. If I see something that makes me think, or something that makes me wonder what other people think about it, I click on it; if not — as is often the case — I move on to the next one. I mostly only skim topics on pro-choice sites or other topics where I’m in agreement with the author, because I know what the comments will be and I won’t be reading anything new. I could not, however, fathom anyone supporting something as alienating and obnoxious as picketing outside a businessman’s house on Christmas day — so I clicked on that thread here to read the comments. I came to understand why people may have believed it was a good thing to do, but my initial opinion was not swayed — only strengthened — by doing so.
You don’t know me very well, mk, which is not an accusation or anything — I don’t post here very often, so you don’t have much to go on. But I’m pretty sure that my seeking out of opinions that differ from my own on a variety of topics isn’t some indication that I’m searching for anything more than knowledge and further understanding. I have found that I feel most confident in my own opinions when I’m aware of the arguments against them, that’s all.
Carla (6:42 AM),
I’m very touched by your kind words. I do care about each and every person who comes to this blog. If I didn’t, I wouldn’t be here. There are days when the dishes don’t get washed, errands don’t get done, and I think “should I be doing this”? But then I think about the women, the babies – and I can’t stay away. I want everyone to know that God loves us and will give us everything we need to get through any situation, if we open our heart to Him. God bless you.
Alexandra (10:47),
“I’m of the belief that if I don’t understand the best arguments that an opposing point of view has to offer, then I don’t fully understand my own opinions.”
That’s such a great point. I can really appreciate your quest for knowledge and truth. ( I was one of those geeky kids who loved to just pick up an encyclopedia and start reading.) That said, being on the pro-life side, myself, I don’t see the abortion issue as a political one at the core. To me, it’s about respect for the dignity of each and every person, from the time the egg joins with the sperm, to natural death. It’s a woman’s issue and more – it’s a human issue.
In my opinion, politicians have embraced this issue to further their own causes. “Choice” has become the buzz word – it conveniently neutralizes the fact of what’s really going on – a child is being killed in the womb. If you read about the group “Jane”, a group of abortionists who operated underground in Chicago before it was legalized, you get a good idea of how the pro-choice ideology began. As you learn more about the pro-life arguments, you may want to study the pro-choice side. You may see it in a different light. Your interest in helping women in crisis pregnancies is wonderful. Women need to stick together! God bless you.
Alexandra: I enjoy being made to think rather than to just read things that I agree with over and over. I vastly prefer to seek out opinions that differ from my own; I’m of the belief that if I don’t understand the best arguments that an opposing point of view has to offer, then I don’t fully understand my own opinions.
Right on, Alexandra. The abortion debate is a good one in that it takes us down to our most basic, unprovable assumptions. It helps us to know ourselves.
Doug
Sally,
I don’t think I knew you had an abortion. Was it the best choice you have ever made? How do you think it has affected you?
Posted by: Carla at February 1, 2008 9:17 PM
……………………………………..
The best choice I have ever made under the circumstances. But since I have only been in those particular circumstances once, it is hard to really say. How did it effect me? Being rather Pollyanna over pregnancy and gestation, I had the opportunity to seriously study the realities of pregnancy in the context of biology as well as female human experience. I gained insight. Hardly a negative I believe. All in all, I would have liked more kids so it was a bit of a bummer.
“Neither the embryo that I aborted nor the fetus I miscarried ever had a chance of being a child. i don’t consider possibilities to be actualities.”
Posted by: Sally,7:54 PM
You are right, a fetus is not a potential human being; it is an innocent human being with great potential.
Posted by: Janet at February 1, 2008 10:01 PM
………………………………………..
That is simply your opinion Janet.
Sally,
Can you explain your “abortion” again. Somehow I remember you posted it was really a D&C procedure to remove a diagnosed fetal demise that would have ended in a natural miscarriage had you not opted for the D&C.
If I am correct, your use of the term abortion is not consistent with the term abortion as we refer to it on this site.
Catherine,
I don’t know why antichoicers are so scared of medical terminology…
I don’t think “scared” is the right word…
The generation of children born after Roe v Wade use those terms now. But they are relatively new in the general public. Older prochoicers use them to dehumanize the infants, and younger ones use them because that’s all they know.
But pre Roe v Wade NO ONE except medical personnel used terms like fetus. It’s a ploy by the pro choice side, well thought out and manipulative.
We aren’t “scared” of the terms, just “wise” to them and the reason for their use…
Posted by: mk at February 3, 2008 6:30 AM
………………………………………
My mother’s generation was wise to nothing concerning pregnancy and gestation. They used euphemistic terms to describe the condition and process because it was considered sinful to them. The PL of today do the same thing for the same reason.
Sally,
Can you explain your “abortion” again. Somehow I remember you posted it was really a D&C procedure to remove a diagnosed fetal demise that would have ended in a natural miscarriage had you not opted for the D&C.
If I am correct, your use of the term abortion is not consistent with the term abortion as we refer to it on this site.
Posted by: Sandy at February 3, 2008 5:40 PM
…………………….
Sandy,
My miscarriage necessitated the forceful removal of the fetus. I would have bled to death if not for the abortion procedure. It was my option not to die. Let’s not pretend that the procedure somehow becomes different due to the circumstances of the pregnancy termination.
My ‘other’ abortion was my choice of when and how the pregnancy was terminated. My cervix had been rendered incompetent through cancer surgery. After much research, I chose not to risk my health or unaffordable time away from work to miscarry. My specialist referred me to a specialist at PP.
Sally has a point. The term abortion is a medical term used for miscarriage as well.
It sounds like Sally experienced a “missed abortion” which means she retained either a dead fetus and /or a sac and placenta, and bled around them. This would necessitate a D&C or a D&E, depending on the fetal size.
Since the term “abortion” has a connotation to it, the term miscarriage is preferred to avoid any confusion.
Yes it is the same procedure though it may not be referred to as an “abortion”, technically it is.
Therapeutic abortion meant an abortion to save the mother’s life.
Elective abortion is what most of us know as an abortion.
Septic abortion can mean either a miscarriage or elective abortion that has become infected.
I well remember the days when “pregnant” could not be said on TV, i.e. “I Love Lucy” and saying the word abortion would get your mouth washed out with soap.
Its interesting that I once heard a staunch PC journalist refer to RU486 as a “miscarriage inducing drug”. As you can see Sally, PC people also use the more glossy terms.
I wrote the above post (Anonymous 6:57PM) and forgot to put in my name!
Mary
Mary,
Hi!
Thanks for weighing in. Sally has had me and others somewhat confused with context of the terminology she uses.
In the past, Sally has referred to her D&C procedure to remove fetal remains due to her missed miscarriage as an abortion in the same regard that it was elective and and was used to end a healthy pregnancy. She often neglects to mention it was performed due to an already diagnosed fetal demise.
**************************
Let’s not pretend that the procedure somehow becomes different due to the circumstances of the pregnancy termination.
Posted by: Sally at February 3, 2008 6:14 PM
The procedure may technically be the same but it is for two COMPLETELY DIFFERENT REASONS!!
You choose to believe that the two are one in the same Sally. By doing so you offend those of us who lost a baby that we were so hoping to have. It’s insulting. I really is. Many women who have a diagnosed fetal demise choose or must have a D&C due to many medical reasons. Not one being to end a healthy pregnancy. See the difference???
I had a D&C to remove my second missed miscarriage. My baby had already died due to natural causes and there was nothing I could have done to prevent it. I wanted my baby very much ( I requested my babies remains so I could honor and respectfully bury it) I would never go around telling people I had an abortion.
The topic of this site is elective abortion. Not the procedure that is performed to remove an already diagnosed fetal demise.
Sally has a point. The term abortion is a medical term used for miscarriage as well.
It sounds like Sally experienced a “missed abortion” which means she retained either a dead fetus and /or a sac and placenta, and bled around them. This would necessitate a D&C or a D&E, depending on the fetal size.
Since the term “abortion” has a connotation to it, the term miscarriage is preferred to avoid any confusion.
Yes it is the same procedure though it may not be referred to as an “abortion”, technically it is.
Therapeutic abortion meant an abortion to save the mother’s life.
Elective abortion is what most of us know as an abortion.
Septic abortion can mean either a miscarriage or elective abortion that has become infected.
I well remember the days when “pregnant” could not be said on TV, i.e. “I Love Lucy” and saying the word abortion would get your mouth washed out with soap.
Its interesting that I once heard a staunch PC journalist refer to RU486 as a “miscarriage inducing drug”. As you can see Sally, PC people also use the more glossy terms.
Posted by: Anonymous at February 3, 2008 6:57 PM
…………………………………
I find nothing ‘glossy’ about dumbed down terminology.
Sandy,
These terms are used interchangably and do generate some confusion. When talking to patients I always refer to their miscarriage, though the proper medical term is missed, incomplete, or complete abortion and this is what will be on their surgical permits.
D&C or D&E is used for fetal demise. Some women prefer to wait for nature to take its course and so long as the women does not bleed excessively or develop a fever, it will be allowed. Very sadly we have had women hold out until these complications do begin, usually because they are in denial.
We do not say we are aborting these women though technically in some situations when there is still a fetus, we are. Some of these fetal demise D&Es can be gruesome even if the fetus is already dead. We had to send one woman to the ICU overnight for blood loss, she thankfully had an uneventful recovery. We just describe the procedure and why. In fact the miscarriage/abortion may have already taken place and the woman is bleeding from a retained placenta or sac. Other times there has been no fetal development and all you are “aborting” is a sac and/or placenta, so to say we are performing an abortion isn’t completely accurate.
Sally,
You talked of PL people today using euphemistic terms to describe the condition and process. I only pointed out PC people do as well.
Thanks for clearing that up, Mary. I had asked Sally to clarify her experiences before but for some reason I didn’t get a response.
So in a nutshell: One procedure was for a miscarriage, the other for her avoiding a possible medical complication.
One “elective”, the other not. Am I right?
Mary,
Hi!
Thanks for weighing in. Sally has had me and others somewhat confused with context of the terminology she uses.
In the past, Sally has referred to her D&C procedure to remove fetal remains due to her missed miscarriage as an abortion in the same regard that it was elective and and was used to end a healthy pregnancy. She often neglects to mention it was performed due to an already diagnosed fetal demise.
**************************
Let’s not pretend that the procedure somehow becomes different due to the circumstances of the pregnancy termination.
Posted by: Sally at February 3, 2008 6:14 PM
The procedure may technically be the same but it is for two COMPLETELY DIFFERENT REASONS!!
You choose to believe that the two are one in the same Sally. By doing so you offend those of us who lost a baby that we were so hoping to have. It’s insulting. I really is. Many women who have a diagnosed fetal demise choose or must have a D&C due to many medical reasons. Not one being to end a healthy pregnancy. See the difference???
I had a D&C to remove my second missed miscarriage. My baby had already died due to natural causes and there was nothing I could have done to prevent it. I wanted my baby very much ( I requested my babies remains so I could honor and respectfully bury it) I would never go around telling people I had an abortion.
The topic of this site is elective abortion. Not the procedure that is performed to remove an already diagnosed fetal demise.
Posted by: Sandy at February 3, 2008 7:51 PM
……………………………..
Sandy, would you ‘go around’ telling people that you miscarried and expect some kind of special treatment? Like a day off work or something really lazy?
Carder,
If Sally had a medical issue her one abortion would be considered either therapeutic or elective. Her other D&C or D&E was for fetal demise. It sounds like Sally suffered a “missed abortion” where she was bleeding around a retained dead fetus and surgery was necessary to remove/abort the fetus along with the sac and placenta.
Carder,
If Sally had a medical issue her one abortion would be considered either therapeutic or elective. Her other D&C or D&E was for fetal demise. It sounds like Sally suffered a “missed abortion” where she was bleeding around a retained dead fetus and surgery was necessary to remove/abort the fetus along with the sac and placenta.
Posted by: Mary at February 3, 2008 8:36 PM
…………………….
Not being a qualified physician or the woman involved, all you can do is pretend you have a clue.
Sally,
Don’t take offense. I’m only going on the info you wrote. I have seen these situations with missed abortions and they can be horrendous. I in no way trivialize what you went through. Whether or not there was a medical issue with your other abortion, again I only go by what you say. I do not deny there was one.
Sally, (5:24 PM),
Forgive me if I spoke too soon. I misunderstood your situation.
God bless you.
Sandy, would you ‘go around’ telling people that you miscarried and expect some kind of special treatment? Like a day off work or something really lazy?
Posted by: Sally at February 3, 2008 8:31 PM
Sally,
No surprise that a PCer wouldn’t know how to compassion for any woman who would miscarry.
It was necessary I tell people I miscarried. You see, it was a little hard to get up for work in the morning when I was bleeding excessivley on the hour every hour until 5 am. I didn’t think it would be wise to go to work as I was soaked in blood and suffering horrendous contractions which lasted until 11 pm the following evening. I then delivered my baby in my home. Probably not something I should do at work.
So yes you smartass, I didn’t really think going to work would be a wise decision. Neither did my doctor or anyone else involved in the situation. Unlike you who is so ignorant you can’t decipher the difference between a spontaneous abortion and an elective one and who would walk into an abortion clinic like it was a lunch date and return to work with a giant smile on your face. Unlike you or any of your supporters who abort because they were too lazy to use a condom or lazy to remember to take a simple pill each day, or too lazy to even consider going through a pregnancy to give a child life.
Yes, Anon was me.
Sandy
Sandy,
How terrible. My heart goes out to you. I had complications with my last pregnancy, I bled continuously from my 3rd to 6th month. I was told I had a low lying placenta but that I was also at great risk for miscarriage. I had to inform people at work as well, considering I bled right after doing a surgical case. It was hardly any sympathy ploy on my part. It was embarassing to say the least when I hemorrhaged a month later in the hospital cafeteria. I was told to go home and put my feet up. Thankfully it stopped and that baby is now a 20 year old paralegal.
I’m so sorry for your loss and I understand to some degree what you endured.
I am so sorry, Sandy.
Mary, I love hearing stories like yours, despite how hard it was at the time. I’m glad for you and your daughter (?) – I’m guessing but I think you mentioned her (?) before.
Doug
Doug,
Thank you for your inquiry and your concern. Indeed I have mentioned her. She’s gorgeous, she obviously takes after her father, and she and I share a very strong bond after spending her teen years fighting like a couple of pirahnas. I am truly blessed to have her and I will be forever thankful she survived those difficult prenatal months.
I’ve lost my oldest daughter to mental illness, that’s no sympathy ploy only a fact, but I have a son I idolize and my youngest daughter. I also have my wonderful friends on this blog and that includes you Doug. I have it all.