Terri’s Day
Today marks the 3rd anniversary of the killing by dehydration and starvation of Terri Schindler Schiavo, and Terri’s Foundation along with Priests for Life have established an annual Terri’s Day observance.
Terri’s brother Bobby Schindler has an op ed at Townhall.com today. In it he takes all 3 presidential candidates to task for opposing governmental attempts to intervene to stop Terri from being so cruelly killed…
One of these candidates will be our next President, and the fact that they can make such statements with little to no fanfare from our secular media, or any noticeable outrage from the general public, is a chilling reminder of how far we have drifted as a nation….
I often wonder if our presidential candidates would make such insensitive and callous comments if this were their child or if they had ever known someone like Terri.
Perhaps they could take time to visit my parents and see the agony and torment that remains with them every single day as a result of having to needlessly watch their disabled child slowly killed by dehydration and starvation.
Maybe as president they could explain why my parents were told by the armed police guarding Terri that if either of them tried to give her ice for her bleeding lips they would be arrested immediately.
Maybe my parents could remind all three candidates, who are parents themselves, that a mother and father value nothing in life more than their children and want only to love them unconditionally and protect them in every way possible–a right you can no longer take for granted.
March 31st will mark the third anniversary of my sister’s brutal death. Sadly, it is a day that reminds me of what our nation has become, bringing back horrible images of a hideously inhumane death and how the judge who sentenced Terri to die also, in essence, sentenced my parents to death with her.
As a mother and grandmother, I literally do not think I could handle my child being slowly killed in front of me. I cannot imagine the Schindlers’ grief. I’m very sorry.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
You know when the nurse told her they were going to let her die by removing her feeding tube and she screamed, “I WAAAA”. I feel like that was her saying “I want”, meaning she wanted it to all end.
I feel like is she didn’t want it she would have screamed no.
I am still so saddened by this. I am so sorry to Terri’s family and the pain and grief that they still endure. Still praying for them.
Please Jess, have some compassion.
Maybe letting her go was compassionate.
jess,
you are one, cold, calculating hard-a**, Lucky guy who refuses to marry you!
it’s called growing-up and you’ve got a l-o-n-g journey! Remember growing older is beyond our control but growing-up is optional.
I am still so saddened by this. I am so sorry to Terri’s family and the pain and grief that they still endure. Still praying for them.
Please Jess, have some compassion.
Posted by: Carla at March 31, 2008 3:01 PM
*******************************
I have compassion. Nothing I’ve read suggests she knew anything that was going on around her. I cannot imagine anyone would want to exist like that. The parents wanted her to continue for their sakes, not hers. I cannot imagine letting someone I love exist like that. I have a living will for exactly that reason.
They did not “let her go” she was starved and dehydrated to death. You are the one that lacks compassion based on what you have just typed.
So not going to talk about the hows and whys of it all again.
It breaks my heart that someone who was NOT dying, nor on life support, was starved and dehydrated to death. I don’t think there would have been any harm in her parents caring for her.
God help us.
John you are a mean person. I try to be nothing but nice to all of you and there are some here who continue to attack me as a person, without even knowing me as a person. Shame on you.
I know Terri wanted to go I can just feel it. I can just sense that she was saying she wanted to let go. Nothing you can say can make me stop believing that was what she wanted. I feel like she is in Heaven now smiling down on me.
The picture of Terri that Jill posted is in my One Year Bible, stuck on this date. I knew the significance of this day. I am reminded and sickened once again how the culture of death has so permeated our culture.
Carla, she felt like a prisoner in her own body. She felt trapped, like she was just slowly drowning. To die felt like she was able to transcend her prison and be set free for her soul to fly away.
No Carla she didn’t die she transcended into eternal life. She is alive.
I am done commenting on Terri. I will remember her with much love and honor her family in how much they adored her and cared for her and I will NOT play a guessing game on what Terri felt or did not feel. She is in heaven. I believe that.
I also want to thank the Shindler family for honoring their sister and daughter by continuing the fight for life.
Carla, I agree it was inhumane to starve her and dehydrate her until she died. But euthenasia is illegal …
“To die felt like she was able to transcend her prison and be set free for her soul to fly away.”
Jess
And just how do you know that? Ever been there?
Are you handicapped? I am; not to the extent that Terri was, but enough to know that just because I lack some capacities, I damned well don’t want anyone taking away from me what I’ve got left…which is how most handicapped people actually feel. It’s called ADAPTING; it’s what natural survival instincts help normal people faced with such losses do naturally. It’s natural to want things to be better if one can make them better, and it’s easy enough to pontificate, in a state of full health, that one would not want to be worse off…but it’s a different story when you get there, just like any destination looks very different the closer you actually get to it than it does the further you are from it.
Regardless of how you feel, or what you think you “can just sense”, just because she could not scream does not mean that she did not know what they were doing to her. She was asked, by people who knew her well enough to know how she COULD communicate, to indicate in an appropriate manner whether she wanted to live, and responded that she did not want to be killed.
She had harmed no one; but she was tortured to death to suit the whims of a selfish, lying, MISOGYNISTIC male chauvinist bastard (illegitimate is as illegitimate does) who wanted her dead to suit his own fantasy (he imagined, and claimed, that she had died 15 years earlier, yet put her in a hospice instead of a cemetery – nobody does that to people who are really dead) and the anti-social agenda of pro-death vultures. It was needless and senseless; her parents wanted to care for her; and, in a sane, civilized, just, compassionate world, would have been allowed to.
Oh, and TR, how do you know Terri’s parents wanted her alive for their own sake? Not that it isn’t natural for parents to want the best for their children, and life, even if handicapped, is better than being tortured to death unless you are much sicker mentally than Terri ever was, which her parents weren’t. Did they tell you that?
And you might want to rethink your living will. The line between voluntary euthanasia and involuntary (genocide, a la Hitler), is a very, very thin one.
And it is equally false, cruel and senseless for Mike Schiavo and other pro-deathers to blather about her “quality of life” while deliberately denying her therapy that could have significantly improved that. It might not have improved his/theirs, which is what these folks were really concerned with.
@jess,
I do hope to never know you … and specially the claptrap you’ve been spouting. I am very close to Terry physically and there are many with your mindset who would call Terri and I like two-peas-in-a-pod! Perhaps you should get familiar with Not Dead Yet before mouthing off? http://www.notdeadyet.org
As a mother and grandmother, I literally do not think I could handle my child being slowly killed in front of me. I cannot imagine the Schindlers’ grief. I’m very sorry.
At the very least the pain could have been lessened somewhat if they had received justice, and if it had not been done legally. The LEGAL Starvation and dehydration of Terri Schiavo only makes it that much more callous. The thought that your own child can be forced to starve to death, LEGALLY, in front of helpless parents who desperately want to take care of their child, while being told that caring for their child will put them in jail- the thought of that is so twisted sometimes I wonder if I’m really living in the United States of America. It seems like something barbaric that could not have happened here in this grand country, where EACH person is supposed to have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
Yet, this cruel torture and killing of the “unfit” happens every day to innocent people, who are indeed very loved, UNCONDITIONALLY, by their own families!
She was done fighting, she just wanted peace. She loved her husband and family for trying to help her, but she wanted them to move on, live their lives, enjoy life for her.
She was done fighting, she just wanted peace
How do you know this, Jess?
“You know when the nurse told her they were going to let her die by removing her feeding tube and she screamed, “I WAAAA”. I feel like that was her saying “I want”, meaning she wanted it to all end.
Posted by: Jess at March 31, 2008 2:40 PM”
Jess:
You “feel” it. No what you feel is satan’s embrace because everything about this case is satan inspired and satan directed. Besides, everything God does is based on faith not feeling.
Terri was saying, “I want to live”. No one rejoices at the prospect that they going to be killed. Have you ever heard of a sane death row inmate rejoice at the prospect of his execution? You’re feeling that she was expressing approval of her own death is absolutely ludicrous. Moreover, the fact that she would say “I waaaa” in response to a statement, totally negates any assumption that she was brain dead. Your assertion is idiotic, lacks consistency and representative of a total lack of logic, the typical outcome when utilizing “feelings” as a objective qualifier for decision making.
And something else that was expressed by the pro-abort idol, Babaric Obamination. At a campain rally today he said he would bring up his two daughters with morals and values stating also that they shouldn’t be punished with a baby if they made a mistake.
Now since when is a baby a punishment. My Bible says children are a gift from God. And this statement made by a so-called Christian.
Also, is it a moral value to teach your children that mistakes have no consequences? I say the oppposite is true. To teach this brand of morality and values, which promotes the avoidance of consequences for mistakes made, shows a TOTAL LACK of morals and integrity?
And you pro-aborts want to give this low-life control of our government? It is hard to understand the pro-abort mentality when it is filled with inconsistency, illogic, and the lack of real moral teaching. I shouldn’t be so amazed, however, when pro-aborts don’t call it abortion they call it “a choice”.
No one should be afraid or scared to go on, to eternal life. Unless of course you feel you would be punished for something.
John, WWJD? The fact that you only belittle me, treat me less then a person, speaks volumes about you. You don’t think I am a good person. Who are you to judge? Because I am speaking for Terri? I know she would have wanted everyone to move on, learn from her at least, to treat every day like it was our last, to enjoy this life to its fullest and embrace eternal life when your time comes.
Bethany I can just feel it. You know I have never said this before and probably will never say it again, but trust me please. I have a feeling I never felt before and it says she just wanted to let go. Please believe me. I’m not saying this is true for everyone, or even anyone else but her but I would bet my soul she wanted to let go.
Because I am speaking for Terri? I know she would have wanted everyone to move on, learn from her at least, to treat every day like it was our last, to enjoy this life to its fullest and embrace eternal life when your time comes.
Jess, don’t you think it is odd, how you feel you can speak for Terri but you feel that we cannot?
“You “feel” it. No what you feel is satan’s embrace because everything about this case is satan inspired and satan directed. Besides, everything God does is based on faith not feeling.”
Can’t you feel the holy spirit? Trust me, I gain nothing from telling any of you this but I have total faith in what I say is true.
“Jess, don’t you think it is odd, how you feel you can speak for Terri but you feel that we cannot?”
I don’t know maybe I am wrong I’m just saying I feel something I’ve never felt before and I think I should share it with you. I had to share it with you.
It is a sad day.:(
I mean Jesus came here to take away our sins so we could have eternal life in heaven. We shouldn’t love this world more then we love the next because the next world, life is the greatest thing. We shouldn’t mourn those who die we should rejoice that they are in place greater then any of us could imagine.
Can’t you feel the holy spirit? Trust me, I gain nothing from telling any of you this but I have total faith in what I say is true.
Jess, having total faith in it means nothing. I have total faith that Terri would have wanted to live.
The fact is, if you don’t know, erring on the side of life is much better than accidentally making the wrong choice and killing someone who may have desperately wanted to live!
And even if you’re going to have to kill her, did it have to be in such a painful way? My goodness, is there no better way to kill someone than to starve and dehydrate them to death, making their lips peel and crack and their eyes sink in, while they pant desperately needing water and being denied it cruelly as you lie right next to a vase filled with fresh water which you would reach out and drink, if only you could!
If they had to kill her, why couldn’t they give her the same respect that is given a dog in the shelter, or a prisoner on death row?
My goodness, it is just sick to think of how people have treated such an innocent victim as Terri.
I mean Jesus came here to take away our sins so we could have eternal life in heaven. We shouldn’t love this world more then we love the next because the next world, life is the greatest thing. We shouldn’t mourn those who die we should rejoice that they are in place greater then any of us could imagine.
How can one rejoice in the fact that people like Terri are being killed every day? Should the fact that we can go to Heaven after we die make me rejoice should someone kill a member of my family? Of course not. There is a reason that God said “thou shalt not kill”.
Bethany, they did remove her feeding tube and she did die. Isn’t it best to think she is happy and in a better place right now? Why believe she spent her last few days in agony. I didn’t say anyone else should be taken off their feeding tube, I’m saying she is happy where she is and doesn’t hate anyone or feel angry, bitter or resentful.
I thought this was a personal matter that should have been settled between family, and that it was a mistake to allow the government and the whole world to be involved.
And John, shame on you. You’re a grown man, yet you attack and degrade Jess with unnecessary insults.
It is always evil for the strong to prey upon and destroy the weak. ALWAYS. The MURDER of Terri is yet another infamous atrocity committed by human beings; an atrocity for which we must BEG for God’s forgiveness as a nation and as a human race.
I am not anywhere close to being like Terri was. I am a strong, vibrant young man with huge amounts of energy. And it’s exactly because I am strong that I have the obligation to defend the weak!
Maybe this is her way of telling us she’s at peace.
Here’s a good video about Terri and the whole situation:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=8rFyfsIHaGM
Jess, I can’t think of a 3rd world person’s photo I’ve seen who looked peaceful when dying by starvation or dehydration. The Jews in concentration camps should have been ecstatic.
Stephanie said: “I thought this was a personal matter that should have been settled between family, and that it was a mistake to allow the government and the whole world to be involved.”
I agree Stephanie; instead of an agent of the government condemning Terri to die, her family – her father Bob Schindler, her mother Mary Schindler, her brother Bobby Schindler, and her sister Suzanne Vitadamo should have been allowed to take care of her. HER FAMILY.
Bethany, they did remove her feeding tube and she did die. Isn’t it best to think she is happy and in a better place right now?
She could be in a better place, Jess, and I definitely hope so, but we don’t really know that, do we? They could have sent her directly to hell for all we know. And I would HATE to think that, but it is true that this could have been the case.
Why believe she spent her last few days in agony.
Hmm, maybe by applying a little logic. Denying someone food. Denying someone water. Those two things equal pain and suffering, then death.
I didn’t say anyone else should be taken off their feeding tube, I’m saying she is happy where she is and doesn’t hate anyone or feel angry, bitter or resentful.
I sure hope she is, Jess.
Jill 4:13 thank you, exactly!
John L 4:14 very well said!
Of course she’s at peace NOW, Jess. But why couldn’t people leave her alone before? Her family was taking care of her and would have continued to do so because they loved her.
My doggy’s kidneys are probably shutting down but I’m not going to starve or dehydrate him in an effort to help speed the process along. If it comes down to it, we’ll have to put him to sleep, but I certainly wouldn’t starve or dehydrate him! So, if I wouldn’t do that to my dog, why IN THE HELL would I do that to a human being?!!!
Jess, suppose someone kidnaps you one day, and then locks you in a room and does not feed you for 14 days, while you kick and scream and fight to live, until you finally collapse, dead on the 14th day. Then this person takes you back to your house, and lays you on the doorstep of your family.
Should your family rejoice, since the kidnapper has only succeeded in sending you to heaven, or should they be angry?
Taking Terri Schiavo off of her feeding tube was murder, plain and simple. A huge mistake is made when we assume she went to Heaven, however, my utmost desire is that is where she is. However, all such desires can at best be termed wishful thinking as none of knows of anyone’s eternal destiny.
God’s commandments are never to be questioned otherwise we make ourselves God. Ending her life prematurely may have in fact violated God’s plan that she hear the Gospel and be saved. If such is true, those who killed her would be responsible for her being in hell. When we violate God’s commandements we are taking on the repsonsility for the results of violating those commandments.
Our duties as believers, as John so eloquently stated, is that we have a duty and obligation to defend and take care of the least of these, not ever to murder them, under any circumstance. For our Lord says, “whatever you do to the least of these my brehtren you do unto Me”.
That is why we are pro-life and anti-abortion.
Every moral decison we make MUST be tested in light of God’s Word and NOT on feelings. I am sure Hitler, as well as millions of his Nazi compatriots, felt great at the murder of millions of Jews.
If after we have tested our actions against God’s Word and found them to be in agreement can we take the luxury of feeling good about any decision or action.
Bethany, ask Jess no questions and she’ll tell you no lies.
I believe it was inhumane to starve her and dehydrate her to death, but I do not believe it was inhumane to let her die. Numerous doctors had been saying for at least 10 years that she had no chance of recovery. She wasn’t just handicapped, she was brain damaged to the point of being unable to think for herself or decide what she wanted for her own life.
And shame on the family for turning a personal situation into a media circus.
And shame on the family for turning a personal situation into a media circus.
How could the family turn the situation into a media circus? I’m pretty sure the only people who can do that are…..the media.
I believe it was inhumane to starve her and dehydrate her to death, but I do not believe it was inhumane to let her die. Numerous doctors had been saying for at least 10 years that she had no chance of recovery. She wasn’t just handicapped, she was brain damaged to the point of being unable to think for herself or decide what she wanted for her own life.And shame on the family for turning a personal situation into a media circus.
Since you also believe it was inhumane to starve and dehydrate her to death, can you possibly tell me what you would have done if you were in her parents place, and this is what everyone was choosing to do with your daughter’s life?
Would you not have done whatever you could to try to stop this type of inhumane treatment of your daughter, Edyt?
w. a. how can I lie I’m only saying how I feel?
Jill, they’re at peace now.
Bethany, they would hopefully be angry at what I had to go through, and the person who put me through it but I’m sure we all would, or at least I would, be happy I’m not in that little dark room anymore.
I didn’t say it was right to do I’m just saying she is free now and we should be happy.
Could they have spoon feed Terri? Or did it have to be a feeding tube? I know some people tried to sneak food in to her room for her. Could she have eaten any of it? Jut curious.
The mind was gone, if anything it was a blessing to let her go, as she had said she wanted.
Jess, the judge ruled that Terri must not be fed any food or drink by mouth. By order of the government, a disabled woman was NOT ALLOWED to be given water, not even to put moisture into her dry and parched mouth.
Why? What was the reasoning behind this? The judge ruled that Terri couldn’t have food or water because she might choke on it and die. I am being serious. Is that a sick joke or what?
Fr. Frank Pavone was in the room when Terri was being denied water and he said that there were flowers in that room. They were cut flowers in a vase with water. The flowers had water while they could give no water to Terri. If Fr. Pavone had attempted to dip his finger into the vase and put a few drops of water on Terri’s tongue, he would have been arrested by the police, who were stationed there to make sure that Terri was not given any water. Is that not perverse beyond belief?
Bethany – Edyt would have aborted her daughter, perhaps even violently like though a D&E, so she wouldn’t go through the abuse of dehydration. She’s loving in that way.
How much do you really know about the legal facts of the situation, Edyt?
Edyt – Do you deserve an impartial, unbiased defense of your life, or would you like to die based upon something you said that was taken out of context by someone who was no longer faithful to you?
I thought this was a personal matter that should have been settled between family, and that it was a mistake to allow the government and the whole world to be involved.
And John, shame on you. You’re a grown man, yet you attack and degrade Jess with unnecessary insults.
Posted by: Stephanie at March 31, 2008 4:09 PM
————-
@Stephany,
shame – no shame here! I jumped on jess BECAUSE she is much younger tan I am; and BECAUSE I have been seriously disabled longer than she been around. And I wished her to seek another answer than the tac of comforting-appeasement she was supporting. That kind of thinking began WW II …. google Nevil Chamberlain and Hitler and see.
It takes courage – a lot of it – to live; a coward is one who points to another’s agony and says… “well it’s all for the best!”
Why would anyone give her food and water if she would choke and die?
Edyt – Did I say die – no actually I meant brutally tortured. Sorry for putting things so simple, but surely you must know at least that much.
Jess, I believe there was a nurse who testified that Terri was able to consume pudding by sucking it through a bottle. The testimony was thrown out by George Greer, from what I recollect. What possible reason did the nurse have to lie about her patient in this way? Michael schiavo is the one who refused to let her have therapy, with which she was actually improving years earlier.
Bethany, I would have asked for her to be given a dosage of lethal and painless medication to end her life.
Jess and John, no they could not have spoon fed Terri or given her water through her mouth. She did not have the brain activity necessary to eat or drink on her own. She could not swallow.
I believe that by dehydrating her, they caused her unnecessary pain and prolonged her life longer than necessary after the decision to let her die had already been made.
Jess,
w. a. how can I lie I’m only saying how I feel?
Sometimes we should think twice before we express our feelings if there’s a chance someone’s feelings might be hurt. Even on blogs.
Do you realize there is a very good chance that Terri’s family is reading this blog today, the anniversary of her premature death (that’s saying it nicely), and that they might prefer a sympathetic word from you and perhaps even a bit of outrage at the way she was forced to die, instead of “Oh well, she’s happy now”……..?
To Terri’s family and friends, my deepest sympathies to you all.
They should be happy she is in heaven, loving and looking down on them, making sure they will be alright.
Maybe they should have taken her home to care for her on their own?
John McD:
“It takes courage – a lot of it – to live; a coward is one who points to another’s agony and says… “well it’s all for the best!”
Amen, John.
Anonymous, I completely agree. Bobby Schiedler has in fact participated in the threads here before, and
I wouldn’t find it surprising at all if he and the rest of the family were reading here today. It hurts me to think of how terribly these callous comments must hurt Terri’s family.
They should be happy she is in heaven, loving and looking down on them, making sure they will be alright.
How do you feel that you have the right to tell them how they should feel about someone else murdering their sister and daughter?
Nothing anyone can do is going to bring her back Bethany would it make everyone feel better if I said she was slowly and brutally murdered and they’ll never see her again?
Nothing anyone can do is going to bring her back Bethany would it make everyone feel better if I said she was slowly and brutally murdered and they’ll never see her again?
At least you would be starting to be more honest about the situation then.
However, the point of bringing Terri’s story up over and over again is not to make people feel sorry for them.
It is to bring awareness to the situation and that this is happening to people all the time, and that we need to find ways to protect those who are in the same situation as Terri, but have not been yet murdered like she was. The hope is that we can protect others, though we were not able to save Terri.
Take Lauren for example:
https://www.jillstanek.com/archives/2008/02/let_lauren_live.html
A link to Terri’s story:
http://www.terrisfight.org/
Would it also be honest to say she is probably in hell for the way she abused her body to the point of collapse through starving and dehydrating herself? It’s rather fitting she was starved to death then, she probably would have wanted it.
Her medical chart contained a note that “she apparently has been trying to keep her weight down with dieting by herself, drinking liquids most of the time during the day and drinking about 10
Would it also be honest to say she is probably in hell for the way she abused her body to the point of collapse through starving and dehydrating herself?
That doesn’t even make sense, Jess. She didn’t abuse her body. Someone else did.
It’s rather fitting she was starved to death then, she probably would have wanted it.
What? Jess, sometimes you truly do not make sense. I cannot for the life of me understand what you are trying to convey here.
Edyt – Why show any sign of being humane? Why? Why not violently rip her body apart? Why not shoot her? What difference does it make except maybe to sooth the conscience of the executioner and the judge?
Did you know what she bled out of her eye sockets? Ever see an eye socket pooled with blood? Every orifice cracked and she bled out. What’s humane about that?
By the way, “let her die” is not what they did. They killed her. It not a passive death, Edyt.
Did you know Greer never even visited her to assess her condition personally? He didn’t make his decision on clear and compelling evidence, he made his decision on ignorance – like some folks here.
Did you know that there are about 20 similarities between Terri Schiavo and Christ, including the semblance of being humane (offering a drop of wine on lips and mother observing unable to assist)?
The ignorance about this case is astounding.
It’s amazing me how incomprehensibly ignorant and judgmental our society has become.
Read O. Carter Snead’s paper called “The (Surprising) Truth about Schiavo: A Defeat for the Cause of Autonomy.
And for those of you who believe in abortion bodily rights…it doesn’t bode well for you either.
God bless the Schindlers. God help us all.
“the medical records indicate a discharge diagnosis of hypoxic encephalopathy
Jess is just trying to defend the indefensible. That’s why her arguments make no sense.
Terri was never proven to be bulemic, Jess. The autopsy report proved that she never was. Michael Schiavo received money under false pretenses when he brought that malpractice lawsuit.
Jess,
Maybe they should have taken her home to care for her on their own?
HELLLLOOOOOOO…Earth to Jess! testing 1,2
You’re kidding right?!?!?!?!?
Bethany I don’t get it, I try to be nice saying she is in a better place and I’m a horrible person for it then I tell the truth, she was starving herself so she could be skinny (vanity is a mortal sin) and she finally gets the chance to starve herself to death and you guys freak out on me. I mean, she starved herself to death, Lauren ODed WHILE pregnant and because it fits your agenda you make them out to be saints.
John L, I’d have to agree with you there.
“You’re kidding right?!?!?!?!?”
Why not?
Bethany I don’t get it, I try to be nice saying she is in a better place
Why do you think that avoiding the truth and telling Terri’s family they should just suck it up and be happy is “being nice”, Jess?
and I’m a horrible person for it then I tell the truth, she was starving herself so she could be skinny (vanity is a mortal sin) and she finally gets the chance to starve herself to death and you guys freak out on me.
First of all, the whole mortal sin thing, it doesn’t work with me, I’m not Catholic.
Secondly, there is absolutely no proof that she was starving herself, none whatsoever. It was dis-proven with the autopsy report.
Even if she had been trying to keep her weight down, that’s not a good reason to kill her.
I mean, she starved herself to death, Lauren ODed WHILE pregnant and because it fits your agenda you make them out to be saints.
no one ever said they were “saints”. Why should anyone be a “saint” in order to be protected from harm?
I think that if you are a continual shoplifter, and one day I realize someone is about to kill you, I would try to do all I could to protect you. This would not be “making you a saint”, this would be basic human dignity and compassion.
MK 5:53.. LOL
Jess,
She wasn’t anorexic.
Her family tried to be allowed to take her home to care for her. They were forbidden.
She wasn’t dying. She was perfectly healthy.
She wasn’t “let go”…she was starved.
Her husband wasn’t even with her anymore. He had moved on…to another woman, and another family.
Are you even familiar with this story?
John McDonnell is slowly dying. He has a degenerative disease that is sapping his life as we speak. Saying things like “Oh she’s in heaven now and so much better off…I just feeeeeeel it…is an insult to him, and every other person who doesn’t fit your standard of perfection. Think girl!
Jess, you DO realize that Terri’s father, mother, brother and sister wanted nothing more than to take her home and take care of her, right? But a judge ruled that Terri must die, and so Terri’s family was not allowed to take her home. That’s what happened!
Jess, they didn’t allow them to!
Hello My sweet PIP!!!!!
Heya MK ;)
I still can’t believe they starved and dehydrated this women to death. Death-row prisoners get treated so much better.
“Jess, you DO realize that Terri’s father, mother, brother and sister wanted nothing more than to take her home and take care of her, right? But a judge ruled that Terri must die, and so Terri’s family was not allowed to take her home. That’s what happened!”
Maybe we should rule that the Judge must die, let’s see how he likes it.
Guess who got an 85 on their Exercise Phys test!?
Maybe we should rule that the Judge must die, let’s see how he likes it.
He will. Death is an inevitable part of life. The only questions remaining are “when?” and “how?”
Good Job PIP!
“He will. Death is an inevitable part of life. The only questions remaining are “when?” and “how?””
He will? would he mind if I decided when and how?
mk what do you want me to say? I hope no one ever dies and none of us ever go to heaven? If John McDonnell is dying and he is a good person then he will go to heaven and going to heaven shouldn’t be something to mourn. If he’s a bad enough person to go to hell then I don’t care if I hurt his feelings because he’s said some really mean things to me that hurt mine.
Maybe he has a good reason to fear death?
Congrats on the test PIP!
Yes I think her family should have been able to take her home with them and care for her themselves.
Grow-up Jess. Your “hurt feelings” don’t even come close to the pain that John M. has to deal with on a daily basis. Stop feeling sorry for yourself Jess and just be glad that you are in good health.
Thanks guys :)
I’m VERY excited!
I think what they did to Terri was absolutely horrific!
But what we seem to lose sight of here, is that God was in charge before this happened, while it happened, and continues, even now, to be in charge.
Jess, if you really feel that you are sure beyond a doubt that Terri wanted that, I surely cannot argue with you. Maybe she did, maybe she didn’t…no one really knows but Terri and God.
People ALL OVER THE WORLD prayed for Terri, including myself. I didn’t want her to die that way, and surely wanted so badly for her parents to take her home and care for her as they so longed to do.
However, when we pray, we need to remember that we are praying for GOD’S WILL to be done, not ours. We don’t know why things happen, even when they are as horrific as the case of Terri is to us. But we don’t know God’s ENTIRE plan, and what needed to happen for His plan to be fulfilled. We will know one day.
God uses many situations that seem bad to us for the good, and we really don’t know how many people that Terri has helped through this, or how many more people she may in the future…through God’s great plan for her. Who knows…maybe thousands of souls that didn’t know God before this happened, found Him through her story. Isn’t God more concerned about our eternal souls than our earthly bodies???
We are only here temporarily, but our eternal life exists forever and ever…there is no end!
To the Schiavo family….my deepest sympathies to you as you remember this day three years ago. I pray that God will heal your emotional wounds so that you may see the beauty in His plan.
Carrie that is no reason to just be mean to people.
And isn’t God in control of all life? So, according to most of you this is just God, God’s will and we have to accept that and embrace God’s will.
John:
I didn’t know of your situation. My heart goes out to you man. The Word says you are actually in a priviledged situation as your faith is being tested to the limit. You must be an awesome man of God and you will succeed, I know it.
You are demonstrating enormous faith and courage by your dependence on Him.
I’ll pray that Christ is made stronger and stronger in you every day and that you come to a fuller and greater knowledge of He who died for YOU.
Paul said it was better to be with Christ. I’ve got to admit, I agree with him.
John, God will never leave or forsake you and I know what’s happening to you will result in many crowns in heaven.
Hang in there, you are destined for a glory beyond your wildest imaginations and dreams as is my hope and prayer for all believers.
“In Christ we,
hope against failure,
believe against doubt,
love against hatred…
For in Christ we find,
only success,
only sight,
only life…..for
His banner over us is love”
Jesus is Lord!
Jess: I urge you to really read Bethany’s posts on this thread. When I first started posting here, I am ashamed to admit that I actually supported Michael Schiavo. I read some of Bethany’s posts and she completely changed my mind.
Jess: This post should be about lifting up the Schindlers in prayers and good wishes. The anniversary of Terri’s death is not the time to have this discussion,imo.
I never said I supported what he did I only said she is in a better place, she is happy and healthy and watching over her family until they come and join her one day.
Apparently that’s the worst thing I could have said.
It is never God’s will that any evil be done to anyone. That is why He commands us not to murder. That’s why abortion is so wrong.
Despite our sin, because of Christ’s death on the cross, we have a hope of heaven, if we accept it. It is God’s will that no man perish.
However, evil does exist in the world, and herein lies the justification for hell. Hell is the eternal destruction of all that is evil including those who rejected Christ as a ransom for our sins. Hell is what God turns his back on in eternity.
That is why our Lord asked on the cross, “my God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me”? Hell is being forsaken by God.
If you are alive and can still make a choice for Christ, God has not yet forsaken you.
“No Carla she didn’t die she transcended into eternal life. She is alive.”
Jess 3:16 pm.
Jess: You know exactly what you said to offend people here.
Carrie 7:33…wow, I didn’t know that. You have no idea how much that means to me.
I know HisMan I believe things like diseases and illness are not sent from God, but through God we can overcome them, maybe not by getting better and living here more years but having a whole and healthy soul that will go on into eternal life.
No Carrie I actually have no idea what I said to upset people.
It is never God’s will that any evil be done to anyone. That is why He commands us not to murder. That’s why abortion is so wrong.
Of course God doesn’t “will” any evil on us, but He does allow it for His purpose. He can stop it if He wants to, right? Did God not know Terri before she was in the womb? Did God not know the judge before he/she was in the womb? Isn’t God more concerned with our eternal souls than our earthly flesh?
Is murder right? Of course not. Is abortion right? Of course not. MILLIONS have prayed for the end to each of these. Do our prayers go unanswered? Of course not. In His due time!
Read the Book of Job.
JLM, so we are all just part of a stupid bet between God and Satan? That sucks.
Jess: 1. saying that you knew that when she said “waaaa” that meant that she wanted to die 2. saying that maybe she wanted to be starved to death because she was doing that anyways with her eating disorder(which she didn’t have) **That’s what upset people**
Jess,
None of us gets to make the decision on when someone should be intentionally murdered apart from sinning. However, if we do sin, we do not get the last word on the murdered person’s eternal destiny. So God, who sits on the throne, makes all such decisions despite man’s sinful decsions.
That is what happened in the Schiavo case. A decison was made by others to murder her and sin was committed. I’ll guarantee you that this was not God’s will for her. However, her being murdered did not keep God from drawing her unto Himself.
Murder can never be justified because of the assumed eternal destiny of another.
While you may feel that she’s in Heaven this can never be used as a justification for what was done to her.
Otherwise us pro-lifers should give up on abortion because all murdered unborn babies go to heaven….that’s ridiculous. God does not condone evil of any kind.
The only reason I even brought up the eating disorder was because people were getting mad at me that I said she was in heaven.
“While you may feel that she’s in Heaven this can never be used as a justification for what was done to her.”
I’m not trying to justify what happened to her but isn’t it better to think she is in heaven?
JLM, so we are all just part of a stupid bet between God and Satan?
uhhhhhhh…no
God presents to us a choice: Life or death, God or satan.
God’s wager is that we will choose life. He bet His Son on you, on me, on all of us. Doesn’t that move any of you in any way?
God was willing to bet Himself on me? I for one am going to prove Him right with all of my strenth, all of my my mind, all of my heart, and all of my soul. Perfectly? No. But to the best of my ability.
Isn’t that Job though? Satan said to God, Job only loves you because he has a good life. If he didn’t he wouldn’t love you. And God was like, oh yeah wanna bet?
Except the Bible says it better.
See HisMan you get it.
Isn’t that Job though? Satan said to God, Job only loves you because he has a good life. If he didn’t he wouldn’t love you. And God was like, oh yeah wanna bet?
Jess,
Brief and to the point, kindof, but there’s much, much more there!
The book of Job shows us that God is sovereign. We don’t understand what He does by rational thinking alone. Faith must rest in His love and us knowing Him. Sovereignty means that god is all-powerful…He knows ALL…He is EVERYWHERE…and His decision is final.
The book of Job also shows us how we understand oursleves and our lives in a direct relationship to our understanding of the character and workings of God. When we understand that God’s will for us is GOOD, that God loves us and communicates His love to us, (as He did to Job), it changes eveything! Faith has to have a resting place. When we greatly suffer, it threatens our foundations of faith, as it did with Jog. It can destroy us unless we are firmly rooted in the truth that God is in charge of us, God’s will for us is GOOD, and that He loves us.
When we face times of tragedy and sadness, it’s a turning point in our faith to either choose the temptation of making God our adversary, or making Him our advocate.
The book of Job shows us that we either question God, or bow in humility and wait for God to reveal Himself and His purposes to us.
Uncontrollable forces (evil, Satan) can test our individual, personal faith, and make us feel like we’re alone in a battle. It is right at this point that we must hear God’s voice rather thatn the voice of tothers and trust Him to fill our voids and return us to victory!!!!
(John McD…that’ one’s also for you!!! AMEN?)
“Jog”…darned “fat fingers!” Should be “Job”!!!
Thank you for that JLM.
No problem, Jess… THANK GOD for ALL!!!
I can’t help but think of verse today:
Psalm 118:24
This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.
Murder can never be justified because of the assumed eternal destiny of another.
While you may feel that she’s in Heaven this can never be used as a justification for what was done to her.
Otherwise us pro-lifers should give up on abortion because all murdered unborn babies go to heaven….that’s ridiculous. God does not condone evil of any kind.
HisMan,
I totally agree. We should never, ever, ever, ever give up the fight against murder. When we “fight” it, we are shining the light upon the darkness. God is the Light, and darkness is evil. When we are out there shining God’s truth upon this evil, we are showing people God THROUGH us! It is so important that we continue the fight to shed God’s light on the evil of abortion, which continues to lead people to Christ through His humble witnesses!
“Psalm 118:24
This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.”
Believe it or not that has always been my favorite Psalm : )
Jess,
That verse has always been such a huge comfort to me when I’m thinking I’m having a “bad day”. It really puts things into perspective, doesn’t it?
Jess, your argumentation is analogous to Jews praising Hitler for sending their brethren to Heaven.
No, I never said it was good that she died or how she died, just that now she is in peace in heaven. If I totally was in control of her life I wouldn’t have put her in a vegetated state but I had no control over that. If it was up to me she would have gone home with her parents.
And for the record, yes I think Jews can go to heaven.
John McDonnell,
I am praying for you! I’m sure all of us here are!
If everyone could please pray for my doggie, Hemingway…he’s old, about to turn 10 years, and we had to get tests done on him today because we believe his kidneys are shutting down. We don’t want to take him to the animal hospital that he hates going to and have him put to sleep if it turns out that his kidneys are shutting down. My mom and I wish that he could just go in his sleep, or that someone could come here maybe and put him to sleep, where he is in the comfort of his home and family, but we are struggling with how to deal with possibly losing our guardian angel doggie!
I’ve been crying all day just thinking about losing my dog, I can’t imagine how Terri’s family must feel today!
I am so very sorry Elizabeth. I consider my hammies member of my family, I’m sure you consider your dog the same, and I’m sure he knows this. If it is any consolation I’m sure he had the best life possible, having you as his Mom! Give him a kiss for me he’ll be in my prayers.
If everyone could please pray for my doggie, Hemingway
You’ve got it…I’ll be praying for your family, too, Elizabeth.
I really hope he had a happy life with us.
We got him back in 7th grade when my dad was losing his business, and our house was going into foreclosure. It was a really tough time for my family, but my parents took us to the humane society and got us a dog. He was our protector through a lot of that bad time in my family’s lives, and he traveled across the country with us after we lost our house and had to move to different parts of the country a couple of times. He’s awesome and I really hope that he just closes his eyes and goes to sleep. I really don’t want to take him and put him to sleep. But thank you for the prayers Jess..it is needed!
Thank you as well, JLM!
Aww, that’s horrible Elizabeth. I don’t pray, but I hope for the best for your Hemingway. I’ve lost several dogs in my lifetime and it’s truly such a horrible feeling, even though you know putting them to sleep is the best option for them.
What kind of dog is he?
And wanted to add … I’m really glad your family adopted from the humane society. So many people don’t even think to stop there and go straight to the pet store. Adopting animals from shelters and societies is one of the most noble things a human can do.
He is a rottweiler/german shepherd mix…he had a brother we wanted to get as well, but he had already been adopted. So everytime we see a dog that looks like him, we tell him it’s his brother lol.
And yes, I like getting animals from the humane society as well. The ones from the pet stores are such biters!
The Clear and Convincing Evidence of Terri’s Wishes – NOT!!!!!
If people really want to read up on the veracity of Terri’s wishes, I suggest the following source:
http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=886373
It’s a hell of document to read. It looks like this Law Professor actually did the legal homework that Judge Greer and the Appeals court failed to do.
Jess,
If you really meant that even tho her death was horrible, we can be assured that Terri is now in heaven, then I agree with you.
If we misunderstood you then we’re sorry.
Surely, if you can see how we misunderstood you, then you can see how John M misunderstood you and you can understand why he reacted the way he did.
Perhaps you could say you are sorry for calling him mean? He’s not mean. He’s just very sensitive to the idea that people can be “put down” when they aren’t considered up to snuff…
You got him from the humane society? That’s wonderful! He would definitely be appreciative of finding a good home then.
PETA would totally approve : )
Perhaps you could say you are sorry for calling him mean? He’s not mean. He’s just very sensitive to the idea that people can be “put down” when they aren’t considered up to snuff…
mk, here’s what John wrote:
jess,
you are one, cold, calculating hard-a**, Lucky guy who refuses to marry you!
it’s called growing-up and you’ve got a l-o-n-g journey!
I’d say that’s pretty mean, and pretty uncalled for. I think that John owes Jess an apology.
“If you really meant that even tho her death was horrible, we can be assured that Terri is now in heaven, then I agree with you.”
I totally meant that even tho her death was horrible she is in heaven now, I didn’t agree with how she died.
I’m sorry if I hurt John’s feelings, and I’m sure if he knew what I was trying to say he wouldn’t have said those things to me either.
Thanks for sticking up for me JLM, but I don’t need an apology. Everyone is entitled to their opinions even if I don’t agree : )
I know I try to be the best person I can be.
@Jess,
you haven’t offended me, but I certainly did wish to offend you – to wake you up … I sure wish you to really live life and not find a route of trying to avoid pain.
Decades ago I started a group of people with my disease and their families. Most of these friends have died, but they ALL were a precious gift of unrelenting courage. I could only try to share a teeny bit of what I’ve received ….
I remember Deb and her Dad driving this van. Deb was my friend so I put my arm around her so we wouldn’t sway so much. Only years later (after Deb had died at 26yrs) did I realize that I had likely been the only person, ever (besides her parents) to hug her and care for her.
My cousin had her sister die recently. At times, words are more of an intrusion on sorrow, than they help. All I wrote was … this letter ia very late! The shock of Theresa’s death left me with no words; I wish I could just hug you, instead.
Be at peace, Jess … learn to love the ‘yourself’ that God created … magnificent!
Jess,
What you said in your 10:13 post shows how “grown up” you are. That was very big of you!
I’m glad his comment didn’t bother you. I guess it bothered me more than it bothered you.
And, for the record, I don’t think that John is a mean person. He said a mean thing, and like you said, Jess, everyone is entitled to their opinions. I’m just glad his didn’t hurt you, and I wish that yours didn’t hurt him.
He’s just very sensitive to the idea that people can be “put down” when they aren’t considered up to snuff…
MK, understandable as far as born people, but the abortion debate exists as it does due to the fact that “people” isn’t attributed to the unborn as it is to the born, so it’s a different deal in the first place. Also, the unborn being in the body of a person makes a further very large difference.
There’s no blanket pronouncement of “not up to snuff” from the Pro-Choice side. It’s the decision of the pregnant woman.
John I went to your site and I want to say I had no idea of the illness before we began discussing it here. I’m sure your site will help others. I hope everyone, the sick, the healthy, everyone can enjoy life to the fullest.
I love that picture of Terri. She was so beautiful in all of her pictures, and until the day she passed. What a very, lovely lady!
Elizabeth,
Awww, I love German Shepherds. I had one who lived to be about 13 before we put him down. We called him Wolfy. :)
After that my family got a Rottweiler/Great Dane mix. He looks like a giant black lab who still thinks he’s a puppy! Super adorable. We call him Java. (But I don’t live with my parents anymore so I don’t get to see him too often…)
I think humane societies are just really good with training animals to be much nicer with humans, which definitely helps out the adoption process.
To TexasRed’s “I have compassion. Nothing I’ve read suggests she knew anything that was going on around her. I cannot imagine anyone would want to exist like that. The parents wanted her to continue for their sakes, not hers. I cannot imagine letting someone I love exist like that. I have a living will for exactly that reason.” 1. Well you only read what you wanted to hear. 2. You cannot imagine, because you no longer know right from wrong. 3. And you can speak for her parents now? 4. And what’s the diff between Terri and an unborn baby? 5. You have a living will and Terri had a will to live!
To JLM’s “I love that picture of Terri. She was so beautiful in all of her pictures, and until the day she passed. What a very, lovely lady!” Thank-you, your touching memorial of Terri can only be shattered by the reality that her husband beat her to within an inch of her life, and was never prosecuted while he went on with his pathetic existance…only to finish the job later while in the spotlight of his hatred for her and her family.
Terri Schiavo for Congress!
Voting rights for the unborn!
TexasRed: “I cannot imagine anyone would want to exist like that.”
That means YOU wouldn’t want to exist like that. That’s fine, but just because you wouldn’t want to go on living doesn’t mean that no one would.
Jess: “I know Terri wanted to go I can just feel it.”
Jess, before we end someone’s like, we need something a little more substantive than “I can just feel it.” Michael Schiavo didn’t provide much more proof than that.
Jess,
Good for you. Thanks for the apology to John. I’m so glad we misunderstood you and that you weren’t saying you were glad that Terri died the way she did. I agree, she is now in heaven and smiling down on you.
John,
I wish I could have been there to hug your friend as well. Here’s a cyber hug for you too. You
know if bigamy was legal, I’d marry you too!
Jess, I’ve been reading your comments for a long time now. I’m starting to think you really do mean well and are sincere when you say these things. It’s so hard for me to comprehend that idea, because sometimes the things you say are just so shocking to me – so offensive that it seems almost impossible for you to not be trying to hurt others, but then again, I read other things you say and it seems that it’s not out of hate after all. I don’t think you really realize how your posts sometimes sound, and your questions are truly innocent questions. I am going to try my best to be more patient with your questions and thoughts from now on.
SOMG, why must you be such a jerk?
Terri was Catholic and was being denied the sacraments (The Eucharist, especially). Since she was a victim, I am sure God showed mercy upon her and she’s now safe in Heaven.
Her husband at the time was committing adultery, breaking his marriage vows. Did you ever hear the testimonies from the nurses who cared for Terri before she was put in the hospice in Florida? They said he took away a washcloth because “its therapy”.
When she was dying, her lips were chapped. Her family wasn’t even allowed to wet them with water.
That’s a HORRIBLE way to die! Why would someone chose that? I am sure that Terri, had she been able to communicate in another way, would have said, Please DON’T KILL Me.
No one knows what really caused her collapse.
SoMG:
Your true murderous colors show through Mr. Professional.
To TexasRed’s “I have compassion. Nothing I’ve read suggests she knew anything that was going on around her. I cannot imagine anyone would want to exist like that. The parents wanted her to continue for their sakes, not hers. I cannot imagine letting someone I love exist like that. I have a living will for exactly that reason.” 1. Well you only read what you wanted to hear. 2. You cannot imagine, because you no longer know right from wrong. 3. And you can speak for her parents now? 4. And what’s the diff between Terri and an unborn baby? 5. You have a living will and Terri had a will to live!
Posted by: theonlything2fear at March 31, 2008 11:13 PM
**************
I ‘no longer know right from wrong’? Thank you for looking like an idiot. Terri didnt have any ‘will’. Her only ‘interaction’ was in the imagination of the people around her and in the tall tales they spread about her. I dont have to ‘speak for’ the parents. They spoke for themselves. She was oblivious. The parents couldnt let her go for their own sakes, not for hers.
Thank you Bethany. It is never my intention to hurt or offend anyone, and if I have ever done so to anyone here I am sorry. I just feel being a woman and a human being I have to stand up for what I feel is not only best for me, but right.
“I agree Stephanie; instead of an agent of the government condemning Terri to die, her family – her father Bob Schindler, her mother Mary Schindler, her brother Bobby Schindler, and her sister Suzanne Vitadamo should have been allowed to take care of her. HER FAMILY.”
No arguments from me, John. I don’t think what was done to her was the right thing to do, and I think it’s horrible she had to waste away like that. This is why I support euthanasia as an option for such patients as Terri; that is, patients with no hope for recovery (and this would be with their consent beforehand).
I never understood why a husband has the most say in decisions like this, when obviously there are more people involved.
TR:
The parents couldnt let her go for their own sakes, not for hers.
I don’t understand how you could possibly know this. It is part of human nature for a parent to protect the life of their child. You don’t know these people. Why would you presume selfish motives on the part of Terri’s family?
TR:
The parents couldnt let her go for their own sakes, not for hers.
I don’t understand how you could possibly know this. It is part of human nature for a parent to protect the life of their child. You don’t know these people. Why would you presume selfish motives on the part of Terri’s family?
Posted by: Janet at April 1, 2008 2:25 PM
***********************
Ok – you dont understand. So noted.
The fact of the matter is ‘Terri’ was already gone. Im not sure I could call it ‘selfish’ on the parents part – but they couldnt accept the fact that their daughters body was all that was left and they couldnt let her go. She ‘died’ years before.
If the matter had been “left up to god” then she would have been allowed to die how many years ago? It was ‘gods will’ that she die then. Man intervened. Everything that happened between then and now was mans interference, not ‘the will of god’.
SoMG said: “Terri Schiavo for Congress! Voting rights for the unborn!”
Why not? We let liberals vote and get elected to Congress.
TexasRed: “If the matter had been “left up to god” then she would have been allowed to die how many years ago?”
Was it God’s will when your Mom dropped you on your head? You can’t commit euthanasia against someone and then claim it was “God’s will” since they used a feeding tube to eat, as if God doesn’t want us to use technology to help people. You might as well say that it’s God’s will that people on an airplane die in a fiery crash, because if God wanted people to fly, He’d have given us wings! Obviously, that’s completely absurd.
Was it God’s will when your Mom dropped you on your head?
**********
Thank you John – I needed to be again reminded that anything you say is worth jack diddly squat and that youre an idiot.
“Ok – you dont understand. So noted.
The fact of the matter is ‘Terri’ was already gone.”
Except that she wasn’t. She was still a living human being. No, she wasn’t brain-dead, either — at least, not until they began the starvation process. And, no, you don’t need to be particularly religious to understand any of this. The media loved to harp on the fact that pro-lifers and people of a religious bent were fighting for Terri’s (why your single quotation marks, by the way?) life, as the media often take a less-than-favorable view of those two groups of people. What they conveniently left out is that several disabled-persons’-rights groups were there protesting, too, as mentioning that would make it harder for the media to construct their “fundies vs. compassionate realists” narrative.
JL: “Was it God’s will when your Mom dropped you on your head?”
TR: “Thank you John – I needed to be again reminded that anything you say is worth jack diddly squat and that youre an idiot.”
Other than JL’s insult directed towards you, can you address the rest of his post? If you argue that Terri being disabled was merely “God’s will,” then are all those other things merely “God’s will,” also? Should we close down emergency rooms, because people who are in life-threatening vehicular crashes only do so because it is “God’s will”? I find it strange that religious arguments are forbidden if you’re on the conservative side of an issue, but seemingly perfectly okay if you’re on the liberal side…