30 second t.v. commercial…
Movie trailer…
I don’t show up in the trailer but will in the movie, discussing Obama and Born Alive, of course. They interviewed us about 5-6 weeks ago. I’ll keep you posted on release details.
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Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
oooh, Jill’s a movie star now? I want an autograph!!!!
OK.
Where do I begin?
Well, is this a movie theatre kind of movie or some other venue?
Listening to talk radio over the last few weeks, all the points brought up in the trailer are nothing new. How, then, does the population at large hear this? Would they be willing to pay to watch a movie to find out otherwise?
Who’s funding this movie?
How long are you on in the movie, Jill?
Stay tuned for more questions…
Just read some of the Citizens United website, so that answers part of my question.
Something new was how Obama was not going to build up more military weapons. Did not know that. Scary.
When you first heard that Senator Obama was going to run for President, what went through your head?
The above question was for Jill.
Ooooh…cool!!
Can’t wait!! :)
Cheer up, LTL. Does that stand for Loving This Life?
LTL, you’re sure sounding a lot like another L I know. Comments deleted.
I miss Laura too.
I actually kind of miss SoMG, and that’s surprising to me.
You don’t have to be Laura to ridicule this movie, and I am certainly not Laura, but I understand that any comments which are not favorable to Jill are to be deleted, so I will leave it to Jill’s fan club to fawn over her.
Fascinating. A conservative hack (Alan Petersen) best known for no less a treasure than Fahrenhype 9/11, the light-on-facts conservative “rebuttal” to Michael Moore’s Fahrenheit 9/11, moves on to make a film about Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama, filled with interviews of other conservative hacks (sorry, Jill, but you are among very poor company in this “cast”), including one conservative “pundit” demonstrated to have been on the payroll of the Bush Administration (Armstrong Williams), and we are supposed to give this work of undoubtedly creative fiction any credence whatsoever? Take note of how many politicians listed there should truthfully have the word “Former” in front of their titles when weighing the gravitas they carry today, as opposed to four or five years ago.
I have a serious problem with a candidate who claims to be “the change” America is looking for. And it’s this —
It makes him a delusional panderer.
A President can’t change this country. Only Americans can. Lincoln can free the slaves with his signature, but Americans have to be willing to accept his proclamation.
Anyone who believes Obama is going to change this country, or McCain, or gosh, even Neal Horsley for all that matters, is a fool.
I have a serious problem with a candidate who claims to be “the change” America is looking for. And it’s this —
It makes him a delusional panderer.
A President can’t change this country. Only Americans can. Lincoln can free the slaves with his signature, but Americans have to be willing to accept his proclamation.
Anyone who believes Obama is going to change this country, or McCain, or gosh, even Neal Horsley for all that matters, is a fool.
Posted by: Cranky Catholic at July 22, 2008 7:39 PM
…………………………………………
Perhaps the question is whether either candidate is capable of inspiring sufficient numbers of Americans to bring about change.
A President can’t change this country. Only Americans can.
Wow, Cranky, that is exactly what Obama has been saying all along! Does this mean you’re jumping on the Obamawagon?
YES WE CAN!
YES WE CAN!
If those people really wanted to change they’d be yelling, “YES I AM.”
Let me translate YES WE CAN”: “Yes YOU can, but I don’t have to. Now leave me alone. I want a Big Mac.”
CC,
You aren’t noticing how many more people are politically active now?
The Democrats purpose for getting behind Obama was singular, to get rid of Hilary Clinton. They succeeded and now they are left with an unelectable empty suit. He is no more much about change as any other Chicago politician and you can tell he learned his pandering skills from the best in the business.
Reminder: No anonymous posts allowed!
Reality, 8:56PM
YES WE CAN do what?
Oh Mary, don’t be silly!
Yes we can “CHANGE”.
Please don’t ask me what we’re going to change, tho.
MK.
Fair enough!:) Just promise not to ask what “we’re the ones we’ve been waiting for” means. I’ve heard of finding oneself but waiting for oneself is a new one!
MK,
YES WE CAN “hope” too, as well as “change”. I suppose we can hope while we wait for ourselves.
See how badly though people just want something different than this chickenhawk coward president we have had for 8 years? Even if you don’t like Obama, you can see why people are thirsty for something new and different in this country. They don’t know what it is but they don’t have to. Like I have said before – the one who wins is the one who can get people out of their houses on voting day to go vote no matter what the circumstance.
We saw this in 04. All the bad things people had on Bush didn’t matter. Kerry motivated no one. Same problem with McCain for the GOP. You can have 1,000 problems with Obama being your president but the casual politico will not go vote for McCain because of that.
7 million new voters in the primary season. Was that because of McCain?
PP
Please specify what “new” and “different” would entail.
Mary and MK,
You keep saying you don’t know what change he stands for. I keep telling you, GO LOOK AT HIS WEBSITE. He has all of his political stances and policies laid out in an organized and easy to read format. He even elaborated on some of his policies at his rally. He talks about them at press conferences. In fact, it is really not hard to figure out, unless you are not looking.
PIP,
Just for fun, why don’t you tell us in your own words what these changes are…
By different I mean a non-GOP administration. The country wants a true anti-bush. New is a democrat in office.
I have this feeling that like 10% of the country watches the news everyday, reads blogs and takes an in-depth look into every policy etc. The rest of them give the president the cool factor. The beer factor. And then they go vote. John McCain will not get the mom that has to run 5 errands that day, pick up the kids etc. to get up early to vote. Obama does that.
I once read an article that said if 10-15% more college students voted, the GOP would never win. I have a feeling that the college voters are motivated this year by someone that understands what the American citizen is going through.
John McCain admits he cannot use a computer. Does this trouble anyone? Leader of the free world?
Well there are so many I need a starting point. Want to name an issue?
PIP,
Kindly humor me and give me examples of change, hope, yes we can, and what waiting for ourselves means.
Peach Pit,
Ever listen to your guy without a teleprompter? I can sure understand why he’s not anxious take on McCain at a “town hall” meeting.
Please address my question. What exactly will be so different about Obama in office?
To me, change means an administration that is beholden to the electorate, not the corporations, one that will have our best interests in mind. Obama will do what he says, not the exact opposite, and will not treat the constitution like piece of toilet paper. The sad thing here is that it isn’t hard to govern much better than Bush, because Bush has been so terrible, as his 28% approval rating reflects.
And yes, Mary, I have heard Obama speak in person, off the cuff, with no telepromtr. He is eloquent and articulate, a pleasure to listen to…again, a complete change from Bush and his Bushisms, the idiot president.
Ray,
Keep listening, you haven’t heard the stuttering, stumbling, and bumbling I’ve heard from Obama.
The Democrat Congress, who’s approval rating is 9%, can only look on in envy at Bush’s.
What exactly does Obama say he’ll do? What does he mean by “change”, “hope” “yes we can” and “we’re the ones we’ve been waiting for”?
“New is a democrat in office. ”
————————————
Really? Haven’t you read that Obama has 300 “advisers” and most of these were former Clinton (Bill) people?
New? Yeah…in your dreams.
Here is what will be different. We will have a dem controlled house/senate/white house. That to me is the bright side. We are not better off than 8 years ago. We weren’t better off when W. had the house and senate. Remember that, when he didn’t veto one thing?
It is easy to get a 9% rating when you have everything you send up vetoed.
I will pay less taxes with Obama.
I will have better health care.
And here is the best part….all of the illegal things that this administration did will be brought to the forefront. John Edwards as attorney general…sounds sweet huh?
Here is the deal. It doesn’t matter what the change is to someone, change is optimism. Change is a break from the norm and people love that.
Change is not a lifetime politician that is so out of touch with America that he cannot use the computer. So I’m glad McCain hitched his wagon to the star of W.
I’m just glad there isn’t a pro life candidate so we don’t have to deal with that in our election.
It is so fun to watch the GOP freak out because they are going to lose….
PP,
Bush has triple the approval rating of congress because he vetoed everything.
It makes a lot more sense to say the Democrat congress got the lowest rating in history because it is useless and inefficient, much more so than what congress normally is.
How will your health care improve?
If health care is nationalized who do you suppose pays the increased taxes? Bingo.
John Edwards? He will accomplish exactly what as attorney general? In fact you can thank him for increased health care and insurance costs. Who do you suppose helped pay for all those medical lawsuits he won? Bingo.
You still haven’t told exactly what Obama will change and how he’ll change it, or for that matter what he even means by change.
Oh Mary…keep drinking your GOP kool aid and think who you want to get behind in 2016.
Do I have to tell you again that Obama winning is a change from white, 50+ bible thumping republicans? There is the change. What more do you want. Oh wait, some other changes…
….our soldiers are out of harms way sooner. The middle class is taxed less. Something gets done with health care, we all know it isn’t perfect. Let’ see…there is more…we look for Bin Laden, we don’t overuse our military, we secure our borders and railways, we quit thinking that oil is infinite, we earn instant credit around the world, we stop trying to throw our religion and democracy into other countries, we stop making the health of our citizens big business, we get rid of no child left behind, we start putting federal funding into stem cell research, we don’t drill into our most beautiful pieces of land, we curb the lobbyist’s influence in dc, we increase the value of the dollar, we stop dropping interest rates as stop gaps, we regulate the airline industry so millions aren’t stranded, we stop politicizing the justice department, we stop mixing church and state, and we finally get to uncover how truly bad cheney, bush and the crew are, the taliban stops growin maybe…those are just some of the changes…
“You still haven’t told exactly what Obama will change and how he’ll change it, or for that matter what he even means by change.
Posted by: Mary at July 23, 2008 1:17 PM”
———————————-
Yeah, Mary, Obama just mouths the word ‘change’ and the Dems and their supporters are all salivating like Pavlov’s dog.
It’s all rhetoric and they’re buying it.
Change for the sake of change?
“If health care is nationalized who do you suppose pays the increased taxes? Bingo.”
Actually if it is nationalized health care costs actually DECREASE because emergency care for undiagnosed problems actually costs more money than a quick trip to a primary care physician once in a while. Look at costs that went down in other countries.
“Kindly humor me and give me examples of change”
Why don’t you actually name an issue and I’ll tell you.
“, hope,”
Hope that things will change for the better under a new administration that is the same party as congress and will be less ridiculously bad as W’s.
“yes we can”
Yes, we can become politically involved, yes we can be optimistic for the future, yes we can be a part of the political process and not be put last after special interest and federal conglomerate lobbying groups.
“and what waiting for ourselves means.”
We’ve had the potential to step up all along, but we were 1. never asked to (don’t get involved, just keep shopping) and 2. were ridiculed for actually speaking our minds. What happened to I’m mad as hell, and I’m not going to take it anymore?
The people are mad as hell, and they don’t want to take it anymore. They are ready for a change of party, a change of outlook, a change of policy.
“those are just some of the changes…”
———————————-
Peach Pit…now tell me this…Did Obama say HOW he was going to do all that OR just telling people we need change on this or that is enough to get his vote from you?
RSD, for the love of god please read his website, unless you are lazy enough to request us to copy and paste it for you.
PIP…don’t tell me, you’re voting for him?
RSD, been through this already. Multiple times. Let’s continue this line of discussion. You are the one claiming it’s all hype, I’m ust responding to it.
Sorry, PIP, I know he supports infanticide, and that’s all I really need to know. Even if he had all these great ideas, the fact that he’s willing to let babies born alive die sort of clouds any of that other supposedly great stuff he wants to do.
That’s just me, though. Thinking of babies being left on soiled utility shelves because nobody gives a crap to save them just doesn’t sit too well in my stomach.
PIP…let’s just agree to disagree, shall we?
You’re voting for him//I’m not…and nothing can change that.
As you said, you’ve been thru this a million times and so do I…
But RSD, please enlighten to me where the hype is.
I don’t mind discussing that. The whole “I don’t think you are pro-life” discussion however is over. I vote for whoever I like best and don’t really care how my “pro-life”ness is judged by others.
So yeah, please continue.
Did anyone catch Katie Couric’s interview with Barack last night? I’m paraphrasing…she asked him if the improved situation in Iraq would have resulted if the surge would not have taken place.
His answer? “I have no idea.”
He has no idea? No idea at all? The honest thing to say to that should be a resounding “No”.
Not once did he say that the surge that he opposed was the right thing to do. He kept saying that our troops have done a great job (something to that effect).
And the “um..er…well…um..uh…” that was sandwiched between his words demonstrated someone who really wasn’t quite sure how to express what had to be said. Seriously. Katie asked him some direct questions and the preacher in him withered.
“I vote for whoever I like best and don’t really care how my “pro-life”ness is judged by others.”
————————————
There you go, PIP.
Elizabeth, have you been duped into thinking McCain is pro life?
mary? Mary? Mary? do you like those changes? No?
Uh, PP, you never said anything to begin with about a change from “white 50+ bible thumping republicans”. Exactly what will get done about health care? Obama has spoken of the need for increasing troops in Afghanistan, really he’s just parroting what NATO leaders have been saying,
Obama was glad gas prices rose and was only sorry they rose so quickly, we earn instant credit around the world, right our enemies will suddenly love us. Embryonic stem cell research has not accomplished as of yet what it was thought it would, adult stem cells have effectively treated disease. We look for bin Laden? When did we stop? We don’t drill in the most beautiful places, by that do you mean that tiny desolate patch in ANWAR? By the way, there was no oil spill from rigs during Hurricane Katrina, so what is the big issue about drilling in beautiful places? We have major fires and volcanic eruptions in beautiful places. Nature does more damage than we could ever hope to.
I must admit it is truly amazing what you fantasize Obama will do.
PP 2:45PM
What in the world are you talking about?
PIP,
If Social Security, Medicare, and the trillions wasted on anti poverty programs are any indication of how well the gov’t will manage health care and contain costs, we are doomed.
PIP, you can’t go on the assumption that people will get the care they need when they need it. You can’t even assume all people give a fat rat’s you-know-what about their health. I’ve seen too many for whom, booze, cigarettes, drugs, and bad eating habits, to name a few, are a life’s priority. Costs down in other countries? I understand France’s “free” care is bandrupting them. Cuba, sure, just stay out of the hospitals with their broken windows, overflowing toilets, and flies. Why did a millionaire Canadian friend of Hillary’s come to the US for breast cancer treatment and not take advantage of her country’s nationalized health care? Would a middle or low income Canadian woman have the same option? Did Ted Kennedy hop on a flight to England to get his brain tumor treated?
Free market forces have influenced change and advances in medicine. We have examination areas set up in stores for quick checks at minimal cost, sparing people a doctor or ER visit. Competing prices and services encourage competition, driving costs down. My husband left the hospital the day he had his gall bladder out. Unheard of 10 years ago.
PIP, if the man talks of change then certainly as his supporter you know exactly what he means by change, what he plans to change and how he’ll change it. So please, tell me.
He says “Hope” and “Yes We Can” and we fill in the blank spaces? Exactly what does HE say about hope and “Yes We Can”?
An administration the same party as congress. Do you mean the same congress with the 9% approval rating?
Why should anyone ask us to “step up” and do anything? Who cares if you’re ridiculed for speaking your mind? That’s never happened? Speak it anyway!
I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to take it anymore? I will say that makes a lot more sense than “we’re the ones we’ve been waiting for”.
Mary
You made this so easy for me. I am now voting for the guy that left his crippled wife and doesn’t know how to use the internet. I have also realized I cannot have hope anymore. I forgot McCain said things are better now than 7 years ago. Phew! You made that easy for me.
I’m also voting for McCain now because he is Pro Choice and not pro life.
Here is more of the same.
Mary
Instead of me typing out the 64 page document that McCain cannot access….go here:
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/
Mary, health care is fantastic in this country, IF you can pay for it. If NOT, you are screwed. The way the economy and health care costs are going, more and more Americans fall into the screwed category. Nobody should be bankrupted and lose their home because of a medical condition, but it happens all the time. That is messed up and needs to be fixed, but it will never happen under the current system of private insurance. The profit motive must be removed, because as long as it is there, the incentive is for insurance companies to provide as little actual health care as possible for the money they collect. The money they spend on auditing claims in order to find reasons to deny them is obscene, not to mention the money they spend on advertising.
Nobody is saying that rich folks can’t buy better coverage if they want it, but everyone else ought to be able to get decent health care without paying an arm and a leg, and a single payer system, such as an extension of medicare (one of the most efficient government bureaucracies, incidentally, with administration costs far lower than any insurance company) to all citizens seems a logical way to do it.
No, PeachPit, I have not been duped into believing McCain is completely pro-life. But from what I’ve seen, he’s never voted for infanticide. Obama has. End of story.
McCain = the more pro life candidate…but really into war and bombing innocents…
Great Britain and Canada have nationalized health care and I hear nothing but horror stories about it — waiting lists for surgeries and cancer treatment. Some people have had loved ones die while waiting on a list to receive chemotherapy. Let’s ask Patricia what she thinks of their health care system.
Lower taxes? His plan will be disastrous. I don’t understand the complaints about taxes — my husband does not make very much but he has brought home more since President Bush has been in office.
Mary — great points!
Why is it that when democrats start to lose an argument they resort to nasty remarks?
bombing innocents…
Actually by far the majority of casualties are men. When counts are made there is no distinction made between men in the Iraqi forces and civilian men so they are lumped together. The numbers of women and children are very small. Our military does everything possible to avoid civilian casualties. Unfortunately we have to fight cowards who hide among civilians and don’t wear a uniform.
PP,
I’m sorry but you’re really not making a lot of sense, or I fail to get the point you’re trying to make.
Ray 3:38PM
Says who? Please show me people who die at accident scenes or of heart attacks on our streets because rescue squads won’t pick them up and no hospital will take them.
I remember when rescue squad services were “free”, and the city had to start charging because the service was so badly abused. I remember people bringing their 5 children into the ER for treatment for head colds, it was “free”. By the way, “free” only means someone else is footing the bill. Gullible juries are duped into outrageous awards for what amounts to little more than someone’s personal stupidity. Hey we’re screwing the insurance companies! No morons, you’re screwing yourselves. Where do you think the insurance companies get their money? Then people cry about increased costs and decreased coverage.
As I pointed out the free market motivates cost containment and innovations. I remember the days when hernia patients routinely spent 5 days in the hospital. I remember when outpatient surgery was non-existent and thought to be absurd.
I remember when health insurance covered everything, and the abuse I saw when people thought they were getting something for nothing was appalling.
When hospitals and surgery centers have to compete, people have choices, and people can go where it is most economical. If you want business, you better adjust your prices to what people can pay. Also, new innovations in surgery and treatment are cutting down on hospital stays.
Also Ray, hospitals offer payment plans, though you’d be surprised the people who feel no obligation to make their payments and guess who that gets passed on to. Bingo.
Many cities, ours included, have doctors who see patients on a sliding scale and free clinics. OUr state has coverage for children, however there are parents who don’t give enough of a hoot to get it.
True no one should be bankrupted or lose their home because of medical costs. People also go bankrupt and lose their homes because of legal costs. Why have we heard nothing about the “legal crisis” in this country? Have you checked out lawyer fees lately? Has anyone suggested nationalized legal services?
Another big factor is personal responsibility. As I have pointed out before Ray there are people who take absolutely no responsibility for their own health. I’m shocked at the intelligent people I encounter who make no connection between their morbid obesity and severe health problems.
Doctors have been chastised for telling patients to lose weight. How insensitive! Friends of ours abuse drugs, cigarettes, and alcohol, and get all the health care they need “free” thanks to you and me.
I see people spend literally thousands on cosmetic surgery but whine about paying for a physical exam. By the way there are several cosmetic surgeons in my mid size city and none of them are going broke, and believe me I ain’t talking Beverly Hills.
Speaking of personal responsibility, I have to wonder where “Sicko” producer Michael Moore, who praised socialized medicine, plans to go when his morbid obesity results in serious health problems. What do you wanna bet it won’t be Cuba!
Ladies and Gentlemen, Mary has spoken.
I know Carder…Mary has been on fire lately!
MK and Carder,
Thank you. I have been away a while so I must be making up for lost time.
True no one should be bankrupted or lose their home because of medical costs. People also go bankrupt and lose their homes because of legal costs. Why have we heard nothing about the “legal crisis” in this country? Have you checked out lawyer fees lately? Has anyone suggested nationalized legal services?
Much of our criminal legal services are paid for by the state. You don’t pay the DA; you don’t have to pay for your defense lawyer if you are unable to.
Civil law is of course a different matter.
Mary, it’s good to have you back!
Much of our criminal legal services are paid for by the state. You don’t pay the DA; you don’t have to pay for your defense lawyer if you are unable to.
I was waiting for someone to bring this up…
You may not have to pay for a defense attorney, but I think we can all agree that you’ll get a better one if you do.
Also, no one can be turned away from a hospital. So you can get health care if you need it too.
What is the percentage again of people with NO health care again??? And how many of them have chosen not to take it, if offered through their work? And how many are 20 somethings that are still in that place where they think they’ll live forever?
I’m not being sarcastic, I’m really wondering how “serious” this health care crisis is? Is it that we don’t have health care, or that we don’t want to have to pay for it?
Not everyone can drive a Lamborghini, so yes, it’s true, some people might have better coverage than others…but isn’t this what happens in a free market?
PiP: 11:38: Change is not a lifetime politician that is so out of touch with America that he cannot use the computer.
He doesn’t need to know, he’ll have “people” to do that.
You may not have to pay for a defense attorney, but I think we can all agree that you’ll get a better one if you do.
Also, no one can be turned away from a hospital. So you can get health care if you need it too.
I agree with both of these statements. But just because you can’t be turned away from a hospital doesn’t mean that you won’t lose your house and all other horrible hypotheticals you want to insert here. If you can’t pay for legal defense, you get it and you owe nothing, because we recognize it as an essential part of a functional society.
We have public and private schools, as well as public and private legal defense. If people think that it’s worth it to pay for the private institutions, I think they should be welcome to. But I’m also glad that for people who don’t have the financial options, there are still resources they can take advantage of. I think we’re better off for having these resources available to people.
I have no answers to the healthcare issue — it’s really something I’m not knowledgeable about. I just like talking.
Mary! You go girl!! :D
McCain is pro life when he wants to be…
CNN/Money did an analysis of their tax plans. If you make between 249,000 and 777,000 a year, your taxes go up $12.00 total. If you make less than that a year, you get more back on OBama’s plan than McCains…Rich get richer.
Keep bombing them McCain.
McCain loves war.
PP — you don’t see the difference between having to confront terrorists who want to kill you and ending the lives of innocent, defenseless babies?
Sorry, Obama is going to win. Don’t know what to tell you. Just pulled even in Florida.
“PIP, you can’t go on the assumption that people will get the care they need when they need it. You can’t even assume all people give a fat rat’s you-know-what about their health. I’ve seen too many for whom, booze, cigarettes, drugs, and bad eating habits, to name a few, are a life’s priority.”
So you’ll punish the people who want health care because some of them smoke, drink, are drug addicts and fat? They don’t deserve health care?
“Why did a millionaire Canadian friend of Hillary’s come to the US for breast cancer treatment and not take advantage of her country’s nationalized health care?”
Actually Canada would have a different system because they use a single-payer system and we would use a double-payer system (similar to private v. public schools.) So don’t worry, millionaires can still pay whatever they want for their health care.
“Did Ted Kennedy hop on a flight to England to get his brain tumor treated?”
That doesn’t make sense. Why fly to a different country if you can pay for it here.
“Competing prices and services encourage competition, driving costs down.”
Are you serious?! Health care costs are enormous!
“PIP, if the man talks of change then certainly as his supporter you know exactly what he means by change, what he plans to change and how he’ll change it. So please, tell me.”
I certainly do. As I said, we can go issue by issue. Or you can actually take the time to read his website. I think I’ve said this several times.
“He says “Hope” and “Yes We Can” and we fill in the blank spaces? Exactly what does HE say about hope and “Yes We Can”?”
Why don’t you listen to him and find out?! He spends a lot of time when he speaks talking about this stuff, you only seem to not know about it because you don’t want to listen.
“An administration the same party as congress. Do you mean the same congress with the 9% approval rating?”
Hasn’t PP already been through this, it’s easy to have a low approval rating when everything put through is filibustered or vetoed.
“Why should anyone ask us to “step up” and do anything?”
HAHA not a JFK fan are you? I think when Americans have a challenge they can overcome it, and when asked to support their country they will do it. Saying “it’s okay, just go shop” is not what a leader does. A leader prompts others to band together to accomplish goals.
“Who cares if you’re ridiculed for speaking your mind? That’s never happened? Speak it anyway!”
You mean publicly labeling dissenters terrorists was okay? I think the country is better than that.
I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to take it anymore? I will say that makes a lot more sense than “we’re the ones we’ve been waiting for”.
That scene in the movie Network…demonstrates the line brilliantly. Maybe if you re-read it, it would make more sense to you.
Also, yes RSD, I don’t define my pro-life standards by how you think. I think there are more pro-life issues than abortion, but alas many of you disagree.
PIP,
I am serious. The more competition, the more prices are brought down. I see it all the time. Also vast improvements in medical care are and will continue to stabilize costs.
For example, at one time glaucoma meant certain blindness, in fact I was just diagnosed with it in my left eye. The only treatment was surgery and that was only 50% successful. The doctor told me that because of the effectiveness of eye drops in treating the condition, most opthamology residents never get any surgical experience where glaucoma is concerned. Great!
Laprascopic surgery has reduced hospital stays to one day, sometimes only a few hours.
In our city a woman had a brain tumor removed with “cyberknife”. She returned to her gardening right after. Imagine the trauma and cost that was spared with this procedure!
These are just a few examples.
No PIP I would not punish anyone for their bad habits. That’s like asking if I would object to the fire dept. responding to a call because someone was careless with matches. My point is there are people who will take absolutely no responsibility for their own health and this is what drives up costs. You can’t blame the medical people establishment for this. Just as people have to take some responsibility to protect their homes from fire, people have to take some responsiblity to maintain their own health.
I’m not concerned about millionaires paying for their health care. My point was if the Canadian system is so wonderful, why did the woman come to the US? Also, would a middle or low income Canadian woman have the same option or must she wait her turn?
About Kennedy. The care he needed is available here, that’s the point. I gave an example of how that care is improving and the woman who benefitted was an average everyday non millionaire resident of my city.
I’ve check the website and I know his stand on issues. When I listen to him without a teleprompter I only hear a lot of stammering and stumbling. Even poor Katie Couric had a devil of a time getting a straight answer from him during an interview and I don’t believe she ever got one despite her best effort.
PIP, if Bush is filibustering everything, why are his approval ratings triple that of congress? Sorry, but this is an exceptionally useless congress, and that’s saying something considering they are normally useless.
A JFK fan? Not really. I have always considered him one of our more mediocre and vastly overrated presidents. I understand even Nikita Kruschev expressed his sympathy to the American people that he was our president. What has JFK got to do with this?
Publicly labeling dissenters as terrorists? Believe me, I have heard dissenters on any number of issues called far worse! Again, so what?
I liked that movie Network and I loved that scene.
I already said it makes sense to me! :)
” I think there are more pro-life issues than abortion, but alas many of you disagree.
Posted by: prettyinpink at July 23, 2008 10:06 PM”
——————————————–
PIP…we agree there ARE more pro-life issues than abortion. What you fail to realize is that abortion TRUMPS all those other issues.
Why do we care about the poor, the hungry, the oppressed, the war..etc? It’s because we care about people LIVES. If you drill down to the lowest common denominator as to whose lives are being snuffed out and are the most vulnerable..it is the unborn.
Until we remove abortion and the necessity of abortion in people’s minds and hearst…it will be difficult to move ahead to the “other” problems facing people’s lives.
At the very least, these people already have a life and can defend themselves….the defenseless, unborn don’t even stand a chance when their own Mother decides to have them killed.
That is the so-called “CHOICE”.
I wonder, who would the terrorists (al Qaida/Iran/bin Laden) want in the White House?
I wonder why?
Alexandra, 6:51PM
Thank you for your kind words. Its always nice to see you here as well.
Concerning lawyers. Yes, one is entitled to a public defender or legal aid but certain criteria must be met. I’m not sure what the income level is for a legal aid lawyer. A public defender is provided at no cost, be it for a crime, drunk driving, etc. if one is unable for any reason to obtain an attorney.
However, if you hire your own attorney to defend you on a criminal charge or a civil suit of some kind, that’s where it can get expensive. If someone decides to sue or accuse you, even frivolously, it can cost dearly, meaning home, business,etc., no matter how innocent you may be. Divorces don’t come cheap either. I’m sure we’ve all heard tragic accounts of innocent people going broke defending themselves in court, of thousands spent on lawyers’ fees.
You are correct about the DA, who will represent the victim(s) of a crime or “the people” and prosecute the accused criminal. I would assume the DA is hired by the jurisdiction he/she serves.
“PIP…we agree there ARE more pro-life issues than abortion. What you fail to realize is that abortion TRUMPS all those other issues.”
NO. Every person’s life matters. you are placing more worth on the unborn than the born. They are worth the same. And making abortion a political voting game is ridiculous. Abortion isn’t something you stop from the top down, but from the bottom up.
Mary, will reply to your post tonight when I get home from work :)
” Every person’s life matters. you are placing more worth on the unborn than the born. They are worth the same.”
——————————–
Sure, PIP, I agree….but the unborn have a higher
DAILY casualty rate (was it 2,000 a day) than the others. And this is NOT due to poverty, war, hunger, war…heck! the Total American casualties in IRAQ since the campaign began does not come close to the number of aborted Americans in the same period.
It’s a matter of priority. I have limited resources, I choose to focus on protecting/ defending the unborn…what about you?
Any Pro-Obama supporter want to take a crack at this:
“Who would the terrorists (al Qaida/Iran/bin Laden) want in the White House? ”
“It’s a matter of priority. I have limited resources, I choose to focus on protecting/ defending the unborn…what about you?”
I focus my life on humanitarian efforts, so I choose to have many focuses and work on different levels at different issues. I guess that means I have a broader focus than you.
“I guess that means I have a broader focus than you.
Posted by: prettyinpink at July 24, 2008 9:59 PM”
—————————————
Sure you do…reminds me of a saying Jack of All trades….
RSD,
I don’t know what to tell you. I make time in my life for several issues, and it’s true I can’t focus on all of them, but I lend my support for as many causes as possible. If you want a narrower focus on abortion, fine, but going “oh your vote means you are not pro-life” is stupid because I think we can all agree abortion problem is not going to be solved by voting alone.
“I am serious. The more competition, the more prices are brought down. I see it all the time.”
Then competition needs to go up. Can’t you ring the stock bells harder, make it go some more?
(Seriously, I don’t think health care should be a big business. I don’t believe in gambling people’s health for number games)
“My point is there are people who will take absolutely no responsibility for their own health and this is what drives up costs.”
There will always be people who don’t try in school. Is that a reason to stop having public education?
“You can’t blame the medical people establishment for this. Just as people have to take some responsibility to protect their homes from fire, people have to take some responsiblity to maintain their own health.”
I don’t see where public policy can’t help this.
“I’m not concerned about millionaires paying for their health care. My point was if the Canadian system is so wonderful, why did the woman come to the US? Also, would a middle or low income Canadian woman have the same option or must she wait her turn?”
My point is that the Canadian system won’t be the same as the US system. So why compare them?
Since my vision of health care will be a similar concept to private v. public schools, that would be you asking, why have public schools if rich people could travel to a private school out of state to receive education? Poor people don’t!
“About Kennedy. The care he needed is available here, that’s the point.”
And it won’t be if we let other people have it?
Care is improving. But what about the people left behind?
“I’ve check the website and I know his stand on issues.”
Oh good! So you know all about the things he wants to change.
“When I listen to him without a teleprompter I only hear a lot of stammering and stumbling.”
REally? Whenever I see him at debates and press conferences I always find him well-spoken.
“PIP, if Bush is filibustering everything, why are his approval ratings triple that of congress?”
Well I’m sure people had higher expectations of new congress in 2006 than they did of having Bush in office.
“Sorry, but this is an exceptionally useless congress, and that’s saying something considering they are normally useless.”
Actually they have put through some really useful bills, I think. There are many bills they have put through that looked very good, but Bush vetoed them, so oh well.
“What has JFK got to do with this?”
Ask not what the country can do for you, but what you can do for your country.
Pretty inspiring words. It’s true that these words have been manifested before him through inspiring people like FDR. Asking people to stand up to the challenges America faces. Being a part of something. True leaders do that. No good leader I know tells everyone to just sit back and not think about what’s going on.
“Again, so what?”
I just don’t think it’s the proper way for the White House to act. I think it’s childish. And not something to be admired or accepted from our country’s leaders.
“I already said it makes sense to me! :)”
;)
“I think we can all agree abortion problem is not going to be solved by voting alone.”
—————————————
Sure, I agree…but for a “pro-lifer”, voting for Obama is like putting salt in a wound…it doesn’t help and it makes matters worse…
And, PIP…I didn’t call you “stupid”…I don’t do that…
RSD, I did not call you stupid, I am calling that attitude (that votes measure how “pro-life” someone is) stupid. Please don’t confuse what I say. I think the whole idea of judging how “pro-life” someone is (what is there a scale?) is stupid. I don’t think calling ideas stupid is a personal attack on you, so don’t take it personally.
“that votes measure how “pro-life” someone is”
———————————-
PIP,
If YOUR vote helps the abortion process instead of limiting/ abolishing it…How is that attitude not “stupid”, for a pro-lifer??
RSD,
I believe my vote will do little to nothing about the abortion process, which is sad, but that is how politics has been for a long time. Instead, my vote will help eliminate casualties in Iraq, casualties of bad health care policies, victims of torture, and victims of bad economy, foreclosures, and an unfair legal system. Again, abortion is not something you attack from the top down but from the bottom up. This is just how I think. You can think what you want to. I just think that the judgement of “pro-lifeness” is stupid, and alientates people. You agree that judging people like that is stupid?
I agree, PIP…it just shows the level of (im)maturity of the person.
Again, I cannot see your logic in what you just stated.
“I believe my vote will do little to nothing about the abortion process”
and then you turn around and state:
“Instead, my vote will help eliminate casualties in Iraq, casualties of bad health care policies, victims of torture, and victims of bad economy, foreclosures, and an unfair legal system”
If you’re sure your vote won’t make a difference in the former, how can you be sure it will in the latter?
Either your vote means something or it doesn’t…make up your mind.
Obama got the life issue (the most fundamental/ basic issue) wrong, what makes you think he will get the others right??
PIP,
Absolutely competition needs to go up. The more the better. What better way to keep quality up and prices stable? You want my business you better work darned hard to get it. Medicine shouldn’t be big business? Let me see, what about the people who work in companies and factories that supply hospitals, clinics, and offices? Hospitals employ all levels from skilled professional, to housekeeping staff, kitchen workers, security personnel, and groundskeepers.
Gambling with people’s health? No way if I want to keep my customer base. I had better be innovative, economical, very competent, and treat my customer base like royalty.
I hope those stock bells chime like Big Ben.
Take my word for it PIP, as idealist and hopeful as one may want to be, there are people who will take absolutely NO responsiblity to manage or improve their lives and health. No gov’t program will change this. This has to come from within all of us. Why is it people with every opportunity squander their lives and people facing every obstacle excel? Like I said, it comes from within us.
I in no way suggested that people who don’t take responibility for their own health don’t deserve medical care. I use that to illustrate a factor that drives up medical costs. One can’t cry about medical costs when they abuse their health and bodies. Just as we have to take some responsiblity to protect ourselves from crime and fire, not just depend on the police and fire depts, we must also take some responsibility to maintain our health, not depend on the medical profession or the gov’t.
I didn’t compare the systems of Canada and the US.
Canada is often used as a model of how medical care should be publicly funded so I wonder why anyone would want to come to the US if this is a preferable system.
I don’t quite understand your vision of health care as compared to private or public schools.
I also don’t quite understand the point you make about Kennedy and others having health care.
Also, please specify who is being left behind.
Yes I know what Obama wants to change, especially concerning taxes and health care.
Sorry PIP, but when I listen to the man I’m not impressed, I’m in fact concerned, especially when he’s caught off guard. I would love to see him take McCain on in a town hall meeting.
People in fact had higher expectations of Congress in 2006. I don’t recall Bush being immensely popular at the time. If Bush has vetoed all these great bills, why isn’t he the one with 9% approval ratings and the congress triple that, instead of the other way around?
JFKs words were inspiring, that’s for sure but my opinion of him remains unchanged. FDR? The president who put American citizens in concentration camps after confiscating their homes and businesses, and who sent a boatload of Jewish refugees back to Nazi Germany after refusing them admission into the US. By the way 600 of those 937 passengers eventually lost their lives in Nazi death camps. I am obviously not a great admirer of him either.
This remains a country of people free to speak. People won’t always agree with or like what you have to say. So what? Say it anyway.
“Medicine shouldn’t be big business? ”
Mary, I was specifically talking about businesses like insurance companies, not stock and supply. The companies that make electrode pads aren’t the main reason health costs are so high. Why don’t you look at all of the countries’ health care spending before and after a form of socialized medicine. You’ll find that they are much lower.
“Take my word for it PIP, as idealist and hopeful as one may want to be, there are people who will take absolutely NO responsiblity to manage or improve their lives and health. No gov’t program will change this. This has to come from within all of us. Why is it people with every opportunity squander their lives and people facing every obstacle excel? Like I said, it comes from within us.”
I’m not saying that there aren’t going to be people who won’t take care of themselves. That doesn’t mean we should be denying care for people who want it. It doesn’t mean we should refuse to treat their lung cancer. Although there are some things we could do to help with problems like child obesity (as a community). With big problems it sometimes takes a village.
“I don’t quite understand your vision of health care as compared to private or public schools.”
Having a choice between private insurance companies and public insurance.
“I also don’t quite understand the point you make about Kennedy and others having health care.”
I’m not sure I get the point either. The problem with our health care isn’t that the rich care are getting good health care, it’s that the middle class and poor aren’t.
“Also, please specify who is being left behind.”
The people who either don’t have health insurance or are being screwed over by insurance companies. People paying over the top prices for basic medications, etc.
“Yes I know what Obama wants to change, especially concerning taxes and health care.”
Then why are you asking us to explain it to you?
” I would love to see him take McCain on in a town hall meeting.”
Me too, I can’t wait until the debates.
“People in fact had higher expectations of Congress in 2006. I don’t recall Bush being immensely popular at the time.”
That was my point. If I had high expectations in 2006, and didn’t see results (often they don’t understand that this stuff is happening either) I will probably be more disappointed and be met with more disapproval than someone who is consistently bad. Isn’t that why many people voted for Bush in 04. “At least we know how consistently terrible he is. Beats trying something new.”
“People won’t always agree with or like what you have to say. So what? Say it anyway.”
mary, I was talking specifically about the actions of the white house/bush administration. What they did was immature and irresponsible. I never said people weren’t free to speak. But I think the white house creating division instead of unity isn’t something to approve of.
“I am obviously not a great admirer of him either.”
Who are you a great admirer of?
“If you’re sure your vote won’t make a difference in the former, how can you be sure it will in the latter?”
There is not enough pressure right now on politicians to do something about abortion. I help figure out peoples’ number one issue at my job, I only once found someone who said values, and even then it was because the person said he would vote for the “lighter candidate.”
Plus, really, what is there to do? Abortion is already legal. And Obama’s already said that he supports regulation on 3rd trimesters, like it already is. It’s likely nothing will change substantially while he’s in office.
What make you so sure that abortion will be McCain’s biggest policy, either? Looks to me he is going to ride out his “war hero” status as long as possible. I highly doubt he will do anything substantial in terms of abortion.
We’ve been doing it your way for 30 years. Nothing substantial has happened.
PiP: There is not enough pressure right now on politicians to do something about abortion. I help figure out peoples’ number one issue at my job, I only once found someone who said values, and even then it was because the person said he would vote for the “lighter candidate.”
PiP, Maybe the pressure on politicians hasn’t changed, but I think they are finally waking up to what PL’rs have been saying for 35 years. Abortion is killing whole segments of each generation. Obama is in PP’s pockets and vice versa. You don’t think he’s going to do everything he can to make sure they continue to grow their monopoly on the abortion market?
Jante
They already have a monoply on the abortion market. Again, nothing there will change. Unless we get a big majority of people to really care aboutr the issue.
PIP,
Please look more closely at these countries. The citizens are taxed heavily for this “free” care. I understand its nearly bankrupting France. Sure costs are contained in Cuba, if you don’t mind hospitals with flies, broken windows, and overflowing toilets. You’ll never get something for nothing, “free” or “low cost” only means someone else foots the bill. About the insurance companies, tell the juries who think they’re sticking it to the insurance companies that they’re only sticking it to themselves, and the rest of us. The companies just pass on the cost of these lawsuits to you, me, and them. Also, people were under the mistaken impression they could abuse their medical insurance coverage, and did. Guess who pays more and gets less because of this?
The example I gave of the “free” rescue squad service our city once offered is a classic example. It was so badly abused that the city had to start charging. Typical. Some people abuse and the rest of us have to pay.
PIP, please, I have never suggested anyone, no matter how badly they abuse themselves, shouldn’t get medical care. I’m saying it drives up the cost for individuals and our society when people do not take any responsiblity for their own health. People drive drunk, causing not only death but extensive injury and disability, and soaring medical costs. People abuse their bodies. I’m only stressing there is something called personal responsibility and too many people simply do not take it.
For example, if I had a house fire that resulted from my leaving several candles burning in my home while I stepped out for a few hours, I’m sure you would be sympathetic, supportive, and grateful the fire dept. was there to do what they could. I’m sure you’d also think, “uh Mary, shouldn’t you have been a little more responsible? Small wonder you had a fire and all this extensive financial and personal loss.” That’s the point I’m trying to convey.
Yes it does take a village, but you cannot help people who don’t want to help themselves, take any personal responsibility, or better care for their health. All the good intentions and idealism in the world won’t change this. Believe me, PIP, in my lifetime I’ve seen it tried time and again. Look at all the public education and stricter laws against drunk driving. People continue to be killed, injured, and permanently disabled.
We have public insurance. Our state has a program for low income children, you’d be surprised the parents who don’t give enough of a damn to enroll their children. We have medicaid and medicare. Some people, my daughter included(much to my chagrin), do not take the responsiblity of getting health insurance, they’ll “take their chances”. Also, I have seen advertisements for lower cost health insurance. Again competition. I can offer a good product at more reasonable costs than the other guy.
I must vigorously disagree that the middle class and poor don’t get good care. Single mothers on welfare get the same maternity care as the ceo’s wife at our hospital, and every other one I know of as well. When emergency patients were brought in we didn’t check their financial status. The lady I mentioned that had the “cyberknife” brain tumor removed was an older middle class woman in our community. The people I see paying thousands of dollars for cosmetic surgery are every day working people. The patients I care for are mostly middle and low income people.
Belief me PIP, many of the people not getting care are people who don’t take the responsibility to get it.
Yes we hear sob stories on TV about people who went broke paying medical expenses. There are also innocent people who lose everything paying legal expenses to exonerate themselves, people severely disabled because a drunk drive hit them and who’s family must struggle financially, and on and on. There is certainly no shortage of tragedy in life and sadly there is no easy solution.
About medication costs, I understand Wal-mart is offering low cost prescriptions. Competition. How long before other pharmacies will follow suit? Isn’t Montel Williams in a TV ad about pharmacerutical companies offering free or low cost drugs to those in need? Competition.
About Congress. Let’s just face the sorry fact that they have done an exceptional job of being useless.
About Obama, I thought as his supporter you could tell me exactly what he means by change, hope, and “yes we can”, not advise me to look it up.
Who do I admire? John McCain for his service to our country and his refusal to accept deferential treatment that would have enabled him to leave the other POWs behind. Rush Limbaugh(who by the way is an admirer of JFK), the late Benazir Bhutto, Margaret Thatcher, Muhammed Ali, who I have come to respect more over the years though I have always liked him, disabled skier Jill Kinmont, the late Dana and Christopher Reeve. While I disagreed with Reeve’s politics I certainly admired his courage and the inspiration he gave to so many, as well as his efforts on behalf of the disabled. Also, people in my community who have dedicated so much of themselves to help those in need. Just a few off the top of my head.
Mary, I won’t respond to these comments because the thread is out of the page but if you want to bring it up on a current thread let me know.
(seriously though? Rush Limbaugh? Surely you can do better than admire him.)
PIP,
All in the point of view.