Country in trouble
UPDATE, 8:40a: From the Associated Press, yesterday:
The head of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, opening a national church meeting Monday, said that continued support for abortion rights will undermine any advances in social justice that come from a new president and Congress….
[I]n a later news conference, [Cardinal Francis] George… said bishops’ are preparing to lobby the Obama administration on any policies that diverge from Catholic teaching on marriage, abortion and other issues….
Catholic leaders – who run hospitals, adoption agencies and other charities nationwide – are deeply concerned that any changes in state and federal law not interfere with policies in Catholic agencies that reflect church theology.
They’d best be prepared to close doors if Obama attempts to follow through with some of his plans.
I’m feeling very militant these days. We’ll just see how pro-life we all are. If we all refuse to blink, we could beat Obama back. He can’t enact policies that close hospitals.
_______________
According to the New York Times the U.S. bishops were the real losers in last week’s election:
The election revealed how bitter divisions among some Catholics have become, but it also revealed how many others are just shrugging off the bishops’ teachings.
Along with the NYT, the Washington Times attributed Obama’s win in large part to the Catholic vote. Lots of useful information in this article….
“Latino Catholics appear to have been decisive in flipping 3 states from red to blue: NM, CO and NV,” wrote Michael Sean Winters, an author on Catholic issues and a regular contributor to a blog sponsored by the Jesuit-run America magazine.
Plus, “The states that are most Catholic – MA, CT, RI, NY, NJ and PA – are also the states that are the bluest of the blue,” he added….
But the WT says the problem isn’t just with Catholics:
According to the Pew data, white Christians who once were the senior partners in the religion vote, were outnumbered by black Protestants and Hispanic Christians, voters from other religions and the religiously unaffiliated.
Mr. Obama pulled in greater numbers of voters who attend church more than once a week, garnering 43% of this group compared with the 39% who supported Mr. Kerry in 2004. But Mr. Obama’s largest support base came from those who never attend church, 67% of whom voted for him….
8 out 10 Jews (about 78%) also supported Mr. Obama…. Similar numbers supported former Vice President Al Gore, a Democrat, in 2000 (79%) and Mr. Kerry in 2004 (74%).
Among Protestants overall, 45% supported Mr. Obama, up from the 40% who voted for Mr. Kerry. Among white Protestants only, the gain was much smaller. 34% of this group voted for Mr. Obama compared with 32% who voted for Mr. Kerry.
Among evangelical Christians, 26% voted for Mr. Obama compared with 21% who voted for Mr. Kerry.
Bottom line, as my column stated last week, the Christian Church en masse has to do a better job educating against the evil of abortion to its members on a consistent basis, not just once a year on the anniversary of Roe v. Wade or once ever 2 to 4 years on Election Day.
And the Church has to do a better job recruiting lost souls. We rightfully show concern for the worldwide lost but ignore the fact Rome is burning.
Because of Christians’ failure to glean our own fields white unto harvest, we’re now fighting secular, liberal, anti-Christian ideology, megaphoned by the likeminded mainstream press, and a government that has deviated from sound Scriptural principles.
One for instance: All the aforementioned (plus certain Protestant and Catholic leaders) have encouraged violating the rule of law by illegal immigration, and now Latinos vote for candidates they think are least likely to kick relatives or friends out of the country.
This election also exposed flaws in the black Christian Church, which at this point is more loyal to skin color than Biblical teachings.
I’m telling you, combining the demise of Christian influence in America with the liberal government created financial collapses – and solutions, now spearheaded by Obama – of the housing industry, insurance industry, auto industry and who knows what other industry down the pike, and you’ll understand this country is in real trouble.
[Photo of U.S. Council of Catholic Bishops president Cardinal Francis George convening the annual meeting yesterday courtesy of the Catholic News Agency]
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
You said it Jill. I have trouble getting churches to even speak of it once a year on the anniversary or Roe vs. Wade. I am very disappointed in the churches.
Jill, why should we expect anything out of the Catholic Church, and in particular Francis George? This man has backed off repeatedly whenever Mike Pfleger invites a pro-abort to speak from his pulpit. In the most recent fiasco, Pleger was out there endorsing Obama on his website and George did nothing until Pfleger made a national joke out of himself with his Hillary rant. Even then, the “punishment” was “non-punitive” – because Pfleger’s father was ill, he needed time off. He was told, for the umpteenth time, that he could not mention political candidates by name. So what does he do? Posts the names of candidates endorsed by the NRA and says “Do not vote for these people”. When I started e-mailing every church in the archdiocese and filed an IRS complaint, he changed the wording, suppressing the evidence. Nothing was ever done by George to make it clear that a vote for Obama was a claim of responsibility for the Freedom of Choice Act and means blood on your hands. But seriously, why should we expect anything from a bishop (George) who has the track record he does of covering up the crimes of his rapist priests and of trying to have them released from prison early? He has shown how little respect he has for children by his actions – why would he have any respect for them in the womb? SNAP has called for his resignation, and I have written every media outlet in Chicago to get people to wear teal ribbons (along with their life roses)in honor of those raped by priests until George resigns. George is a proponent of the Catholic Campaign for Human Development, which funds ACORN and ABORTION REFERRAL SERVICES!!!! If this man isn’t solid evidence that monarchy in the church is offensive to Christ, then I don’t know what is. He should be in jail – not looked to by millions as a spiritual leader.
The Catholic Church refusing to speak out against pro-abortion politicians is a worse scandal than the sexual abuse of children.
The Catholics spoke out, The politicians don’t listen. The media paints the politician as good and the church as bad.
The gove also is establishing that parents are bad and children are good and superior.
1. No laws to require parental consent for abortion is coming
2 Parents punished for discipline of child
3 Parents will be punished if they require church for minors
4 Parents can’t decide on childrens educaion. Sex ed or oher
5 Planned parenthood doesn’t report child molestation or rape. It could harm business.
Watch for new UN laws regarding childrens rights.
John,
I think they’re equal. They’re not equal ISSUES, but the church’s ROLE is equal. I prefer not to call it an “abuse scandal” – call it what it is – child rape, perpetrated by priests, and covered up by bishops who demand obedience from their dutiful flock. The sheep who refuse to call these priests rapists and their superiors criminals out of some blind cult-like obedience are no different than the sheep who wept in Grant Park last Tuesday night. In regard to abortion, the priests and bishops don’t kill the babies themselves – in the rape situation, they are directly involved. Obviously, murder in the womb (I also hate the term abortion because it’s too sanitized) is more serious than child rape, because it involves the death of the child. My point is that the church’s responsibility is about equal on the two – and too many Catholics are sheep who believe that a man, especially a man who has covered up the crime of child rape by his friends and subordinates, is somehow a holy person and represents the authority of Christ himself. Poppycock!
he Christian Church en masse has to do a better job educating against the evil of abortion
The problem with this plan is that lots of Christian churches are pro-choice. Even the good Dr. Tiller belongs to a Christian church.
You’ll never “educate” pro-choice people out of existence, Jill. We are already educated and our minds are made up, just like yours. We understand that outlawing abortion is the worst way to discourage abortion, and that legal abortion is safer for women and fetuses. The lowest abortion rates in the world occur in pro-choice countries. That’s how we know we are right.
“The Christian Church en masse has to do a better job educating against the evil of abortion
The problem with this plan is that lots of Christian churches are pro-choice. Even the good Dr. Tiller belongs to a Christian church.
You’ll never “educate” pro-choice people out of existence, Jill. We are already educated and our minds are made up, just like yours. We understand that outlawing abortion is the worst way to discourage abortion, and that legal abortion is “safer for women and fetuses”. The lowest abortion rates in the world occur in pro-choice countries. That’s how we know we are right.”
################ Tiller the killer?
So i suspect that he gives them money and they support him. I will point out a lie. It is deliberate on your part. What you call safe abortion leads to 100% dead unborn babies. Thart is dangerous if there ever was a thing called dangerous. BAIPA also adresses dange which you oppose.
You also do not know how many of the Killer Tillers mom’s die. How often the ambulance comes to take them for emergenices.
For someone to call an abortion safe for the fetus is an example of how dishonest they are.
Grave yard dead.
The lowest abortion rates in the world occur in pro-choice countries. That’s how we know we are right.
Posted by: reality at November 11, 2008 8:04 AM
You really need to change your moniker from reality to “mindless”. How many abortions were there in Ireland last year? That’s right, almost none.
I think the important thing to remember is that the culture of death was not made overnight. The Catholic Church foresaw this and began to act before the turn of the last century.
In 1907, Pope Pius X warned against modernist tendencies in areas of faith and morals. Pope Pius XI in 1930 warned against contraception calling it an abominable crime.
Pope Pius XII condemned the use of the pill in 1958 and in the encyclical Gaudium et Spes, Pope Paul VI wrote to married couples advising: “But in their manner of acting, spouses should be aware that they cannot proceed arbitrarily, but must always be governed according to a conscience dutifully conformed to the divine law itself, and should be submissive toward the Church’s teaching office, which authentically interprets that law in the light of the Gospel.” (no 50)
His teaching against contraception was further condemned by his encyclical Humanae Vitae.
However in my country, Canada, by 1966 the Canadian bishops were in open and full rebellion stating “We consider Article 150, which forbids giving information about contraception, as well as the sale or distribution of contraception an inadequate law today… ”
This betrayal of Catholic teaching certainly helped in the passage of legalization of contraception by the Trudeau government in 1969. The ultimately led to the infamous Winnipeg statement issued by Canadian bishops, which advised Canadian Catholics that they could practice contraception if done in “good conscience”.
Little wonder that 30 years later we have the vile “Fully Alive” sex ed progamme in our Catholic schools and no national restrictions on abortion. A mere 25% of Catholics attend church and Quebec, which was our Catholic province is now considered mission territory by the Holy See.
Rome, has ALWAYS been faithful to the teachings of Christ. Our Canadian, American and German bishops in particular have not. This infidelity has had dire consequences for society.
There are many reasons why Obama was elected in AMerica but one of the major reasons has to be the fact that millions of Catholics simply do not live the teachings of their faith. They don’t live the faith because they aren’t taught it and they don’t understand it. They see it as irrelevant to modern life. This is the fault of the bishops, the Catholic educators and parents. The question remains: What will the US bishops do to bring these Catholic’s back into the church, into the fullness of their faith and onto the side of life.
Oh, and the Irish citizens who did commit abortion by going to the UK etc was well below 1% of the population. Reality, what are you smoking?
You are absolutely right Patricia. The teachings from Rome are very clear and a great blessing to the faithful and tru to scripture and Christs teaching that the Holy Spirit is the creator of life and “ALL” human life, including embryos, deserve full protection under the law. Problem is that that so many so-called Catholics
are either ignorant of their faith or really only wear it as a lapel pin on Christmas and on their gravesite.
I love the moronic positions that if the majority support it it must be right, or if people are going to do it anyway then it should be safe and legal. Does that apply to everything or only to murdering babies in the womb? I challenge every “pro-choicer” (God I hate that word) to disconnect an alarm system you may have in your house, because a potential burglar might get shot if the police are alerted to his activity. There used to be a time in this country when people stood for what was RIGHT and JUST and not “tyranny by majority” as was practiced when Hitler killed the Jews like Obama plans to kill our unborn children.
Oh…and I actually got an e-mail yesterday from someone who said, and I quote, “Wake up Kevin. Oh yeah, millions of people are supporting this man and he wants to kill unborn babies. Yeah, right.” God are we in trouble…..
Dear Reality,
Yes, tell that to all of the women that regret their abortions. Tell them that abortion is safer. Better yet, tell me. My abortion story is irrefutable. Like all of the others I know.
Tell the other women and babies that abortion is safer. Oh wait, they are all dead.
I am praying that God raise up the men. The men that have participated in abortion and regret it. The prolife men who have been silent for too long. I am praying that God raise up more and more women that regret their abortions. Women that have been raped and regret their abortions. Women that have been raped and kept their beautiful children and believe them to be blessings. Praying that ALL of us that value life from conception to natural death FIND THEIR VOICE and begin to speak out!!!
You are not alone if you regret your abortion. Please know that there are people waiting to hear from you. Waiting to help you get into abortion recovery. 1-866-482-LIFE The National Helpline for Abortion Recovery.
Or you could email me!! :)
God be with you Carla! You are a wonderful witness to truth!
I totally agree we are in serious trouble. Now I hear some people are lobbying for a national holiday for NObama….. are you kidding me????
And his radical abortion policies are going to be enacted, we discover this less than one week after he is “elected.” I will always believe this was stolen in some of the battleground states…. anyone remember ACORN?
He got 52% of the popular vote, yet we hear how this was a “rout” and how he has this huge “mandate” for “change.” I absolutely cannot stand CNN. It’s total garbage…. Pravda.
And remember Biden promised us that there would be some grave world crisis soon after NObama is inaugurated. That is one thing I can agree with him on.
I’m not sure why we expect our country to have a conscience. Morality is rooted in God, and I, for one, do not see a country that cares at all about God. That is not to say that you cannot be “moral” without knowing God, but the further you get from the source, the more murky the water becomes.
That being said, we who know God, are called to be his advocates. However, it is good to keep in mind that the battle is the Lord’s. And although I think things will get much worse before they get better, God eventually wins. He will not be mocked.
Very well said, Tim.
You’re also not alone if you don’t regret your abortion.
“We are already educated and our minds are made up, just like yours.”
I can’t speak for everyone here, but in my opinion, reality, you are dead wrong here. Our side listens and responds to arguments and, if we are proven wrong, will concede points. Your side makes no such attempt. Google “pro choice answers to pro life questions” if you don’t believe me. See what comes up.
I’ve seen 9 year olds argue for life and win against adults in my own family on this issue. There’s simply no valid pro-choice arguments that can’t be knocked out completely by common sense and reason.
Best get organized Wichita Linewoman. Speak out about how abortion helps women.
What I have been up to
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnLUadlbAuI
The problem is that the Catholic Church is the only denomination that denounces abortion as a whole, while with other churches you only get a handful of people who are pro-life per denomination.
“The lowest abortion rates in the world occur in”
POLAND, because it is illegal there!!!
Rosie,
In my church I have heard the term abortion maybe twice in 5 years. Praying that changes. Soon.
I haven’t heard about abortion in my church since last Sunday.
Carla,
A relative was at mass in SE Wisconsin recently and the priest was preaching about the many different pro-life issues one could base their vote on, etc…. UGH. I think we need to start writing letters to our Bishops when we hear our priests making statements that conflict with Church teaching.
. . . . . . . . . .
Rosie @ 10:09 AM
“The lowest abortion rates in the world occur in”
POLAND, because it is illegal there!!!
Exactly. The Polish people follow the pro-life teachings of their beloved Pope John Paul II who was born in Poland. They suffered persecution under the Communists, therefore they understand the intrinsic value of each human life.
Hear hear, Miz Wichita.
Um. Janet, I am not Catholic. But I know you still love me!
THANK YOU for sharing that video, Carla. It’s very powerful.
Carla,
Oops! I knew that, I hope I didn’t offend you. Of course, I’ll always love you!
I just watched your video and I must say it’s a wonderful thing you are doing. God bless you for telling your story. Can you imagine if every woman who regretted their abortion spoke up? What a difference that would make. We could start shutting clinics tomorrow.
The lowest abortion rates in the world occur in pro-choice countries. That’s how we know we are right.
Posted by: reality at November 11, 2008 8:04 AM
Low abortion rates accompanied by low birth rates indicate low fertility rates. How does this make YOU right?
None taken, Janet!! :)
Thanks for watching.
Hi Erin, Somehow I knew you would show up! ha
Fed up,
Thank you for watching it.
Jasper’s QuOTD,
”We have been communicating with his transition staff almost daily. We expect to see a real change”.
~ Cecile Richards, President of Planned Parenthood Federation of America.
It would be nice to see someone in the media do an in depth interview with Richards. Let’s see how she defines “change”.
Abortion Changes You
http://www.lifenews.com/state3634.html
Carla, Thank you for sharing your story. Stories like yours help me to know that we must keep up the fight.
Please sign the petition to stop FOCA (The Freedom Of Choice Act). This is especially important because, if passed, there will no longer be any parental notification, NONE. As well as the return of the barbaric Partial Birth Abortion.
http://www.fightfoca.com/
Thanks lovethemboth,
I put FOCA button on my blog and signed the petition as well! :)
I am the Yin to your Yang, Carla! You know I love you, though!
I love you too, Erin. You know that.
If the catholic church wants to drag its feet on social justice then that is its perogative. It only serves to sully their reputation even more. The rest of us will go on doing good regardless of the pro-life temper-tantrums. I’ve got no problem with working with the catholic church but if they cannot reciprocate they only risk making themselves look like immature children stomping their feet screaming “you wont play my worldview game!”
Yo La,
Social justice must be grounded on the right to life — all other rights follow from the right to life.
Carla,
Again, God bless you and thank you for your witness. I can’t listen to those testimonies without crying.
Now when I read your posts, I will be able to hear your voice in my mind :)
Awwww. Thank you Eileen#2. Please don’t cry. :) I am doing exactly what God wants me to do and it has been years in the making. Here am I. Send me.
Abortion stories of regret are not easy to listen to, so I appreciate that you watched it. ((hugs))
I’m not sure why we expect our country to have a conscience. Morality is rooted in God, and I, for one, do not see a country that cares at all about God. That is not to say that you cannot be “moral” without knowing God, but the further you get from the source, the more murky the water becomes.
That being said, we who know God, are called to be his advocates. However, it is good to keep in mind that the battle is the Lord’s. And although I think things will get much worse before they get better, God eventually wins. He will not be mocked.
Posted by: Tim at November 11, 2008 9:18 AM
my favourite post here today! Very nicely done Tim!
Carla: thank you for posting the video. May I ask how far along you were when you had your abortion. I don’t know if you mention this or not. Was it 10 weeks?
I was told I was 8 weeks along at the abortion clinic. I was closer to 10. I figured out my dates years later. Which is why my miscarriage at almost 11 weeks hit me so hard. God is so awesome!! I doubt that I would have figured it out if not for holding that baby in my hand and seeing how perfect he was.
Carla,
Speaking of FOCA buttons…. do you know of any group selling “anti-FOCA” buttons/magnets or window decals?
I am sorry. I do not, Janet.
Ok Carla. I rather thought that was what happened when I listened to your talk. I think this might be a good thing to bring out in your account (if you already don’t). When you saw what was living inside you at that stage – it wasn’t a few random cells – that is what hit you so hard.
I know a friend who miscarried at 11 weeks and she was stunned to see what her baby looked like at that stage. All of her children saw their sibling and they KNOW.
Your witness must be difficult. Peace.
Yo La,
Social justice must be grounded on the right to life — all other rights follow from the right to life.
that kind of logic would make sense if the catholic church paid attention to social problems as an institution. Some churches do a really good job, but insitutionally it seems to be a lot of talk and smoke and mirrors. When is the last time Frank Pavone fed the poor? When is the last time Chaput got up at 4:30 to work the breakfast detail at a homeless shelter? What a bunch of phonies! They speak of controlling what is not theirs to control, but yeild when it comes to actual generosity of time or talent.
Carla,
I love you for your courage. Thank you so much for sharing that video.
I’m sending you a big cyber hug.
Yo La Tengo,
Are you stalkiing Fr. Pavone and Bishop Chaput?
First, how can you presume to know what they do when they are not in the public eye?
Second. the clergy’s responsibility is to form (educate) and minister (provide sacraments) to the faithful. It is the mission of the faithful to go out and minister to the rest of the world. Given that the Catholic Church is on the forefront of many social services, I would say they do a pretty good job. Is there room for improvement, absolutely. But who exactly is doing a better job?
When is the last time Frank Pavone fed the poor? When is the last time Chaput got up at 4:30 to work the breakfast detail at a homeless shelter? What a bunch of phonies! They speak of controlling what is not theirs to control, but yeild when it comes to actual generosity of time or talent.
Posted by: Yo La Tengo at November 11, 2008 6:03 PM
How do YOU know what they have or haven’t done Mr Tengo?
If you KNEW anything about priests and bishops you would KNOW that the poor regularly turn to the rectories for money and food. I’ve mentioned before about my pastor but I also know of a situation where the Bishops house received a late night call at the door. The young priest in residence answered the door only to be set upon by the homeless man. Nevertheless, the bishop and priest said no matter what happened it was their first duty to answer the door to help any person they thought might be in need. Maybe you could use with a 48 hour stint in a parish rectory to update your view on the clergy.
Thanks DeeL! :)
Patricia,
Depending on the audience there are things I may leave in or out. For a church youth group I tend to not go so much into “the procedure” for my Women’s Ministry I go more into God’s healing and forgiveness.
I thought that was in there somewhere. Seeing my baby in my hand is what crumbled the lies. I won’t be watching it again. Can’t stand to watch myself but feel free. HA
of course Carla. And I would think just speaking about it is enough. Remember not to be too hard on yourself. God loves you!!
YLT when was the last time you volunteered at a soup kitchen or donated hats, gloves or coats to a homeless shelter?
People’s City Mission in my city is run by a Christian minister.
Feed the Hungry. Clothe the Naked. Visit the Sick. Comfort the Dying. Just a few of the Corporal Works of Mercy.
Yo La,
Some churches do a really good job, but insitutionally it seems to be a lot of talk and smoke and mirrors.
What Patricia and DeeL said. You were raised catholic, you should know better! Why don’t you call your parish and ask the Pastor himself what he does for the poor. You may be pleasantly surprised.
Smoke and mirrors? Are you talking about incense? :)
YLT: “that kind of logic would make sense if the catholic church paid attention to social problems as an institution. Some churches do a really good job, but insitutionally it seems to be a lot of talk and smoke and mirrors. When is the last time Frank Pavone fed the poor? When is the last time Chaput got up at 4:30 to work the breakfast detail at a homeless shelter? What a bunch of phonies! They speak of controlling what is not theirs to control, but yeild when it comes to actual generosity of time or talent. ”
Look up the definition of ad hominem dude. It’ll help you in your quest to discuss the flaws of “others” logic.
“pro-choicer” (God I hate that word)
Posted by: Kevin Keane
Kevin, I like to use “anti-lifer”
Carla,
Your testimony should be enough to give any abortion minded woman pause. God bless you.
Looks like the Catholic Bishops are joining the fight more vocally now that so many Catholic’s have gone against the Church’s teaching by supporting Obama’s extremely anti-life agenda.
http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/11/11/catholic-bishops-vow-confront-obama-administration-abortion/
God bless you, truthseeker!!
Bishops: No more Mr. Nice Guys
In a follow-up to my post yesterday comes this from the Associated Press, November 11: The nation’s Roman Catholic bishops vowed Tuesday to forcefully confront the Obama administration over its support for abortion rights, saying the church and religio…
Truthseeker: Kevin, I like to use “anti-lifer”
Heh – spoken like a true “woman-slaver.”
Posted by: Oliver at November 11, 2008 9:21 PM
Ad hominem attacks have nothing to do with pointing out the obvious lack of moral cred of Pavone and Chaput and the rest of the cronies. For all their lack of actual priestly work they seem more like liturgial welfare queens than actual men of the cloth. Hot air is good if you’re a heater, but if youre a priest (or playing one on TV) it just makes you seem like a pair of inflated vestiments billowing in the wind. Of course they’re just following in line with the anti-choice movement – the original steam-works (except without the works).
“For all their lack of actual priestly work they seem more like liturgial welfare queens than actual men of the cloth. Hot air is good if you’re a heater, but if youre a priest (or playing one on TV) it just makes you seem like a pair of inflated vestiments billowing in the wind.”
That’s how I see Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson and some others. Have these guys ever actually done a day’s work in their lives?
Easy to strut around and be a “preacher” and live off “donations.”
That’s how I see Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson and some others. Have these guys ever actually done a day’s work in their lives?
What does Al Sharpton or J. Jackson have to do with anything? You need to update your rolodex of progressive Christian leaders.
————————————————
Easy to strut around and be a “preacher” and live off “donations.”
Posted by: Therence at November 13, 2008 11:05 PM
exactly what Chaput, Pavone and other EWTN\ TBN cronies do. Why do you think EWTN\TBN is always asking for money?
“the liberal government created financial collapses”
Jill, most of the financial industry regulations enacted after the stock market crash of 1929 were scrapped in the last 10-15 years. Please explain how ‘liberals’ are to blame for this. Conservatives are generally the most ardent champions of deregulation, a philosophy that echoes that of the pro-abortion faction.