Pro-choice prayer campaign “not a mockery of 40 Days for Life”
They claim they think it’s a mockery of the 40 days for Life campaign, but I don’t think there is any mockery in it. The prayers are quite sincere.
Apparently the religious right does not believe that anyone is allowed to pray except those who believe as they do. This is not a biblical idea; it is pure arrogance.
~ Rev. Rebecca Turner (pictured), a United Church of Christ minister and the head of Faith Aloud, a pro-choice religious organization, explaining why the pro-choice 40 Days of Prayer may irritate pro-lifers, as quoted by RH Reality Check, April 15
Apr.20, 2012 9:00 am |
Industry watch |
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
If it was a mockery that would be one thing. But if its sincere, its a whole lot worse. It shows them to be part of a creepy, death worshiping cult. Honestly, mockery is not such a big deal in comparison.
Psalm 66:18 “If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me.” Read your Bible Rebecca. Its not arrogance. Its scriptural.
Just because a woman slaps a collar on her own neck in the morning obviously doesn’t mean she’s read her bible. What part of “choose life that you might have it in abundance” doesn’t she get? What part of the Blessed Mother accepting the child Jesus doesn’t she understand?
Oh, you can pray all you want, abortion advocates, and you can even try nagging the same God, but guess what? We already had a battle of the pray-ers on Mount Carmel. Spoiler alert! Elijah won, Jezebel lost.
Arrogance? LOL! Projection much?
Did God, the author of life, not have some part in putting the baby in the woman’s womb in the first place?
I really agree with what she has to say though. None of you can speak the word of God and tell me that you OWN religion and anyone that is pro-choice is not religious enough or close to God enough. That is your opinion but it is not a fact. Plenty of good, kind Christian people also believe in choice and it is absolutely arrogance (and a little blasphemous) to claim that you know their heart and know they are not truly Christian.
That arrogance is not your path to conversion either. You’d be better off promoting positivity – i.e. every child is a blessing, you CAN go forward with this unplanned pregnancy, etc. You’d also be better off if members of your community could stop judging women for getting pregnant out of wedlock but considering all the past QOD posts in here I’m not holding my breath.
Elizabeth, it isn’t arrogance. Are you not familiar with discernment? If someone espouses something God clearly condemns in His Word then we are called to judge someone by their fruit. God called the fruit of the womb His reward. Someone who suctions out the heritage of the Lord and throws them in the trash is not living in accordance with God’s values. That isn’t opinion. Thats fact based on the Word of God.
Elizabeth, clearly you do not understand what the word ‘blasphemous’ means. To attribute the works of satan to God is blasphemy. To act as though one IS God is also. The purposeful, violent deaths of vulnerable human beings in their mothers’ womb is not “choice”, it is straight out of the bowels of hell. Apply the John 10:10 test: killing, stealing, destroying = the work of the enemy. Life and life abundantly = Jesus’.
Arrogance? I call it discernment and state clearly that anyone who promotes, allows or encourages the destruction of these so precious to our Lord would be better off with a millstone around their necks and cast into the sea. Not my words, but Jesus. Your issue is with Him.
Sydney, you are correct that God will not hear them, until/unless they repent (Elizabeth, that means TURN, 180 degrees from the broad path of destruction so many are on). They may pray but it is not the Most High, One true God who hears them. Baal, Molech, Satan himself maybe, but these have truly had their minds blinded.
Plenty of good, kind Christian people also believe in choice
Then you must mean plenty of good, kind Christian people believe that since a baby isn’t yet outside his mother’s body, it’s ok for her to pay to have him murdered.
“There is no God who condones taking the life of an innocent human being.” ~ Can you name the person who said this?
Luke 6:45 ;
A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good;and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.
Jeremiah 1:5 : Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
God knows us before we’re even formed. That’s HIS word, not “our interpretation”.
It’s BLASPHEMY and ARROGANCE to disregard His Word, and just do and say whatever WE want.
Apparently the religious right does not believe that anyone is allowed to pray except those who believe as they do.
Tell me of one person who you consider part of the religious right who has stated that those who believe differently than them are not allowed to pray, Rebecca. Until, then I call BS and accuse you of being untruthful in addition to being an spoke person for the killing of humans.
Come now, people. How can we expect good thinking about abortion from someone who can’t even handle the fundamental act of inference.
“They claim they think it’s a mockery of the 40 days for Life campaign, but I don’t think there is any mockery in it. The prayers are quite sincere. Apparently the religious right does not believe that anyone is allowed to pray except those who believe as they do.”
Believing a thing is a mockery is tantamount to (implies) advocating disallowing of the thing by those deemed mockers? That’s neither “apparent” nor implied by her observation.
“This is not a biblical idea; it is pure arrogance.”
So fun. She draws an inference that literally cannot possibly be drawn, then distracts from the illegitimate leap by quickly denying that the inferred attitude is biblical, positing that it’s arrogant. And since pro-choicers believe pro-lifers are arrogant anyway, who would question the premise that seems to lie behind such a no-brainer conclusion?
I honestly don’t think most people contrive straw men purposively. I rather believe such straw men are erected when such folk supply their own conclusions as the missing premises. “Pro-lifers are arrogant. Thus, their ill regard for pro-choice prayers betokens their wish that such prayers would be disallowed. This is proof that they’re arrogant and unbiblical.”
She may be astonished that such prayers are deemed mockery, but this is only because pro-lifers are being charitable. That such prayers are sincere is the unthinkable thing to a pro-lifer. It may be delusional charity, ignoring how genuinely sold are pro-choicers’ souls — but it’s charity nonetheless.
Tell us you’re sincere, and you’ll have our utmost pity. The Moloch who receives your prayers will not be sated.
Elizabeth, there does have to be *some* standard for deciding what is right and what is wrong. And we (at least I) am not saying that pro-choice Christians aren’t actually Christians because you are right. I cannot see into people’s hearts. Far be it from me to say whether someone is or is not saved by Grace. However, I do know what the Bible says about certain issues and God does seem to cherish life. So what we are saying is that perhaps these pro-choice Christians are gravely deceived and need to head back to the Bible.
God loves life, of that we can be sure. And even if that were not the case, Christians are called to love others (all others – even their enemies). Abortion is not a loving choice for anyone involved. It is the easy choice, but it is the painful, destructive choice. We do not want women to choose abortion because it is so harmful and destructive.
@Elizabeth: Blasphemy is to make a claim about God that is false. I can not blaspheme by claiming to know the hearts of those who support abortion, even if they are Christians. That would be presumptuous, but not blasphemous (unless you want to claim that they are gods, which would be far more blasphemous than any assumption of anything on my part about them).
The truth is, it doesn’t matter whether they are sincere in their beliefs about Christianity or abortion. If they support abortion, they are wrong on that point, and acting contrary to Scripture by doing so. Nor is it relevant how genuinely felt the prayers of these folks are. God does not bless sinful work, though He may allow it to go on for a season. And the destruction of innocent lives is most definitely sinful, no matter how many false–if sincerely intended–prayers go up on its behalf.
As someone on Facebook pointed out, this may be a good thing. Prayer opens up lines of communication to God. And He may choose to respond. The organizers could see people defecting away from them as God reveals the truth of abortion to them and draws them away from supporting it. That should be our prayer, I think.
Rebecca and Elizabeth:
I suggest you (re-?)read John 14:15:
“If you love me, keep my commands.” ~Jesus
Simple, really. I’m pretty sure killing someone made in the image and likeness of God would not fit into “loving your neighbor.” But maybe I’m just being arrogant…
“Today we pray that a cloud of gentleness will fall on all underage sex-trafficking rings and that everyone involved will embrace their pasts with boldness.”
As sincere as that prayer could be offered, does anyone really think it’s honoring to or honored by God?
God used pregnancy and birth to bring salvation to the world. Not good enough for feminists and heretics. He also sacrificed His Son so we could have a relationship with Him in spite of our sins. Not good enough for these heretics-you’ve gotta sacrifice your own kids, too. Spitting in the face of Christ and the sacrifice He made.
Aslan to Emeth, on Tash: “For he and I are of such different kinds that no service which is vile can be done to me, and none which is not vile can be done to him.”
An additional thought: in the Bible, those who were blessed above all were obedient above all. God is under no obligation to bless what we were told not to do in the first place. Common sense.
Who are they praying TO?
You’d THINK, wouldn’t you. MPQ? ;)
LOL Pamela-common sense seems to be a dying art these days.
I am ok with the 40 Days of Prayer project. I am also ok with the United Church of Christ having a different perspective on the value of all human life as long as they don’t impose it on me. To me the positions of the project and the Church vividly show why the fight for the Constitutional rights of the preborn is not a religious fight – it is simply fight about whether the preborn are humans who deserve the same rights as the rest of humanity.
Although I don’t think the United Church’s position makes much theological, philosophical or rational sense I do think it is their right to hold such views even though these may be considered hate speech.
“I do think it is their right to hold such views…”
Yup, and it’s our right to criticize those views. After all, doing so is simply expressing our views.
(I’m not saying I think you were suggesting otherwise. I just think it’s an important point to add).
Rasqual, I was actually going to post the same quote. It was one of the first things I thought of when I heard about this “40 Days of Prayer.” If they are sincerely praying as they claim to be doing, it can only help the pro-life cause since we know that God is not for abortion. Perhaps He will soften their hearts to hear and embrace the Truth.
Andrew, I agree with you.
I think the position of the United Church does give pro-lifers (which I see as message that unifies people from all walks of faith and no-faith) a chance to use one of the classical pro-choice arguments – that one religious group should not get to impose its religious values on the entire American public. With the passage of Roe v. Wade that has happened. The United Church of Christ’s religious perspective has been forced onto the rest of us. There is no separation between the United Church of Christ and State on this issue!! Furthermore, and more importantly, the pre-born were denied their Constitutional right to exercise their reliigious freedom because they were denied their right to life. The preborn’s right to life precedes the United Church of Christ’s religious right to impose its view of life on the preborn.
”
“There is no God who condones taking the life of an innocent human being.” ~ Can you name the person who said this?
”
*raises and waves hand frantically
Oh, Kel, oh here, oh, oh, call on me, call on me!
And I didn’t even have to use the internet!
What is most hilarious, and sad, is that so many people THINK that Christianity is something you can make up on your own and as you go along. NO other religion in the world that is at least 200 years old has to face this kind of idiocy.
Elizabeth (not the pro-lifer) feels comfortable telling us that anyone can decide what Christianity is, as if it’s relative. It’s not. But, would you also say that a Hindu can decide for himself that reincarnation does NOT exist and that said Hindu is still just as good and valid a Hindu as one who believes that reincarnation DOES exist?
Or, can a Buddhist decide that human suffering does NOT have a cause, that its a random occurance having nothing at all to do with the human condition? If so, can he claim to be a good Buddhist, in the same standing as a Buddhist that believes in the 4 noble truths and follows the 8 fold path?
No. and no.
If you don’t want to belong to an organized religion, then don’t. But don’t tell Christians and Hindus and Buddhists who do follow the tenets of their faiths that these johnny-come-latelys can just up and change the dogma any old time they please.
The holy spirit is not to be trifled with, and I do hope as some commentors have said, that it works healing in the people who pray to murder the pre-born. I hope it brings them around to seeing that everyone deserves the right to their own life, uninterrupted by murder-for-hire.
Welcome to my world, people. As I’ve said before, I live and work in one of Episcopalia’s American meccas, and I have to deal with this crap all the time, as in People with collars who say that the killingof the innocent can sometimes be a GOOD, even HOLY thing.
Can you imagine 40 days for Overseers?
40 Days for Rwandan Genociders?
How about (cue CC): $0 Days for the Reich!
It’s a mystery to me:
God will always hate abortion. (yes, Elizabeth–time to get in the Word, sister)
God will always love abortionists.
Thank goodness He’s God.
*sees hand and calls on Bobby*
Yes, Bobby, you may give the answer! :D
Apparently the religious right does not believe that anyone is allowed to pray except those who believe as they do.
You can pray for whatever you want, but you can’t pray for something evil and expect God to grant your prayer. Even a quick read of the Bible would make that much clear to even the most hardened of sinners.
That would be our fearless leader, Barack Obama.
oh my! I did not know he said that. so why are his policies the way they are??
Right, Bobby!
And as for Obama, well… a broken clock is right twice a day. ;)
If you want my opinion on this, Joy, it is because I believe he is demon possessed. That is, I think that part or all of his faculties are controlled by some demonic power. When he says things like that, he is mocking God.
Dear Heavenly Father,
We believe you are the creator of the universe, but dont believe/have enough faith that you can provide for a mother and child…
What do they pray for? “PLease God, protect abortion? Keep safe the abortionists and the clinics? Help pregnant women to make the right choice – to abort?” …shudder…
That would be our fearless leader, Barack Obama.
He said that? I think my head just exploded.
”But don’t tell Christians and Hindus and Buddhists who do follow the tenets of their faiths that these johnny-come-latelys can just up and change the dogma any old time they please.”
Oh, let’s do the time warp again. One suspects that this was what the Catholic Popes were saying when John Huss, Martin Luther, and all the other Reformation figures were plying their doctrine.
“If you want my opinion on this, Joy, it is because I believe he is demon possessed”.
Remind me, what century are you living in? And do you flagellate too?
”I live and work in one of Episcopalia’s American meccas, and I have to deal with this crap all the time, as in People with collars who say that the killingof the innocent can sometimes be a GOOD, even HOLY thing.”
Hate to break to ya, Courtnay but Episcopalian theologians (very, very well educated) base their views on what they think is the real deal. Just as you do. And that’s why religion has no place in formulating law.
“The preborn’s right to life precedes the United Church of Christ’s religious right to impose its view of life on the preborn.”
Roe was decided by the Supreme Court. The UCC had nothing to do with it. They had not and do not have the lobbying presence of the Catholic Church which still seeks to impose it’s medieval dogma on the rest of us. And while you say that the UCC (which had its beginnings in revolutionary America) is trying to impose its view, their view is the view of the Episcopal, Evangelical Lutheran, Methodist, Unitarian, and Reform Jewish denominations which are pro-choice.
Looks like we have another religious war happening. Guess it boils down to whose side is “god” on. But I was taught that the Catholic Church is the “true” church so that proves it. And BTW, how do we know that “god” has a penis?
Too bad we don’t have a modern day Inquisition which would take care of all these demon possessed Protestants and Jews? Am I right?
You guys need to step it up. You need to attend religious services held by these apostates and, in the middle of the services, stand up for your principals. Tell them and their demon seed congregants of their evil baby killing way. Courtnay, why haven’t you confronted your Episcopalian priest neighbor about his godless theology. Why haven’t all of you protested at the residence of Episcopalian Presiding Bishop Katherine Schori who the papists would deny is even a bishop. If it’s an apostate church, you guys, Ninek especially, need to stand outside their dens of Satan and provide counseling to their gullible parishioners. Get thee to the synagogues, those bastions of those who rejected the true messiah and who are now part of Satan’s baby killing regime.
CC, I never said my Episcopal priest had a godless theology. Don’t put words in my mouth. But only one of us can be right about abortion.
“But only one of us can be right about abortion”
So who is right about the Eucharist? Is it the Catholic “transubstantiation” or the Episcopalian “consubstantiation.” Who is right about the sacrament of penance. Is it the Roman doctrine that mandates that a priest hear confession or the Protestant doctrine that says that everyone is responsible for their own confession and forgiveness. How bout Mary worship. How bout faith vs. good works. We could go on and on about who is right and who is wrong.
But yeah, another religious war will be so cool. And let’s bring back the fires of the Inquisition. Those liberal Jews are Christ killers as well as baby killers. Am I right?
And funny, “god” was on a number of sides in so many conflicts. But only one side was right, right?
“But only one of us can be right about abortion”
Have you ever actually spoken to him about it? And BTW, you do seem to have a problem with snark.
“Too bad we don’t have a modern day Inquisition which would take care of all these demon possessed Protestants and Jews? Am I right? ”
No, I disagree.
I absolutely have spoken to him about it, as well as his wife who is a good friend of mine. Our boys play together, my husband coaches their daughter in volleyball, and I count their golden retriever as one of the true great loves of my life. That means everything to the community in which I live and love.
But if they (and you and Mother Theresa and the good reverend pictured in this article) ever tell me abortion is ok with God, I will tell them they are wrong. Either abortion kills an innocent human being created by God, or it doesn’t. As anyone who has ever lost a child, there is no gray area between life and death.
Choose Life.
Hi CC.
“Remind me, what century are you living in? ”
I live in the 21st century, just like you. I’m not sure what other options there are, really. How does the century one lives in determine metaphysical and religious beliefs?
” And do you flagellate too?”
I don’t but I probably should.
Isaiah 1:15
And when you spread forth your hands [in prayer, imploring help], I will hide My eyes from you;
even though you make many prayers, I will not hear. Your hands are full of blood!
Isa 29:13 Isa 1:10-23 Prov 24:11-12 Prov 1:10-18 Jer7:31
Jer 19:5 Jer 32:35 Matt 15:6-9
even though you make many prayers, I will not hear. Your hands are full of blood!
Like your pal Scott Roeder’s et al?
Yep, same excrement, different day.
Oh, and CC? You BET I have a talent for snark, epecailly when it comes to anti-religious zealots who, if they had a church, would make abortion one of the 7 sacraments. You get on here, start attacking my God, my Church, and my cause, I have a special resevoir of snark ready just for you.
BRING IT.
CC:
Who do you believe the 40 Days of Prayer participants are praying to?
CC says: April 20, 2012 at 7:19 pm
“even though you make many prayers, I will not hear. Your hands are full of blood!”
Like your pal Scott Roeder’s et al?
====================================================
occultic
You should stick to subjects in which you have some familiarity, if not mastery.
It is implied in the passage that the hands full of ‘innocent’ blood.
I am not sure how the Creator GOD views Scott Roeder’s killing of George Tiller,
but I have no doubt how GOD views George Tiller’s murdering of innocent pre-natal human beings and those misguided mystics who are his accomplices in the continuing slaughter, genocide, gendercide, pogrom, massacre, holocaust.
The ‘chicken came home to roost’, reaping what was sowed, karma, in that confused congregation on a Sunday morning and all the encouragers and enablers got to see first hand what Geogre Tiller saw every time he murdered a pre-natal child:
The victims blood.
The difference is George Tiller is NOT innocent.
CC says: April 20, 2012 at 6:35 pm
“And BTW, how do we know that “god” has a penis?”
==============================================================
inaccurate,
There you go again, rushing in unarmed and empty headed to a battle of wits.
Luke 2:21 And at the end of eight days, when [the Baby] was to be circumcised, He was called Jesus, the name given by the angel before He was conceived in the womb. AMP
I have never heard anyone claim that Jesus was NOT circumcise in accordance with the commandment of GOD to Abraham and the Law of Moses.
If Jesus was circumcised then it was NOT a Zen ceremomy where they just went thru the mental gymnastics, but the priest actually removed the foreskin from our LORD and Savior’s phallus.
Christians believe that Jesus was the SON of GOD and as such was both GOD and human….therefore GOD has a penis.
Now, I would be willing to bet most of these ‘priestesses’ do not believe Jesus was GOD or the SON of GOD, nor do their feminista followers.
So it follows their ‘god/goddess’ has either a vagina, is a hermaphrodite or is androgynous.
Or maybe she/he/it has had gender re-assignment surgery.
It only follows that they would fashion a ‘god/goddess’ in their own image.
Their ‘go
CC, doctrine about the Eucharist is revealed–can’t be known without revelation directly from God. However, that the child in the womb is just that….can be known by anyone with eyeballs.
Somehow, when I first saw this thread I just knew that CC would love it. :)
The good news is that if there are any actual prayers from confused belivers being offered, then I’d fully expect God to engage their requests with some conviction of truth.
CC, I really like the following comment by you. I think you gave us some good advice. Thank-you.
“You guys need to step it up. You need to attend religious services held by these apostates and, in the middle of the services, stand up for your principals. Tell them and their demon seed congregants of their evil baby killing way. Courtnay, why haven’t you confronted your Episcopalian priest neighbor about his godless theology. Why haven’t all of you protested at the residence of Episcopalian Presiding Bishop Katherine Schori who the papists would deny is even a bishop. If it’s an apostate church, you guys, Ninek especially, need to stand outside their dens of Satan and provide counseling to their gullible parishioners. Get thee to the synagogues, those bastions of those who rejected the true messiah and who are now part of Satan’s baby killing regime.” – CC on April 20, 2012 at 6:45 pm
“Plenty of good, kind Christian people also believe in choice ”
Elizabeth, let me finish the sentence for you and you will see how ridiculous you are being.
“Plenty of good, kind Christian people also believe in choice to kill kill unborn children”See how ridiculous that sounds?
I would advise pro-aborts against mocking God with prayers for choice to kill unborn children. But these people are already posessed by evil and I look forward to a just God’s response to their petitions.
CC,
No one worships Mother Mary. Catholics do not worship Mary. We honor her just as we would our own mothers. She is very special and very important, but we only worship God and His son, Jesus.
I wish people would stop repeating this outright lie.
Let them pray. If their prayers are sincere, God may answer them in the most interesting ways…. I just think they are praying for their own conversions. Which is why I think it is amusing that they feel they need to have 40 days of prayers for abortion… Wouldn’t it be funny if they all became pro-life? Pro-choicers would then become afraid to actually pray since their prayers are strengthening us… We just have to wait for the news that someone in their group switched sides. Let them pray and see what happens.
How does it happen that speaking the unthinkable is somehow now an option available to Christians?
How does it happen that speaking against those that speak the unthinkable is somehow now a thought crime?
”God-talk,” when heard by the deceived, irritates them.
They wish to make it illegal to do “God-talking” in the public square, even though such is a Constitutionally protected right.
The Old Testament talks about “sooth-sayers.” These were people who took on “God-talk” but were really speaking for Satan.
Another way of saying “sooth-sayer” is “soothe-sayer.” Satan’s words soothe, and seduce and charm a person into thinking good is evil, and evil is good.
There is truly nothing new under the sun.
That is silly, Doc Kimble. No one but the most extreme of the extremists wants to make prayer and proselytizing illegal. Some of us non-Christians find being preached at and told that we are going to Hell incredibly annoying, but nearly every American supports the First Amendment.
I really tried to ignore this thread, I knew that it would irritate me, but that’s just silly.
They are praying for the killing to continue Chantal.
They are praying for women to come and pay someone to kill their babies.
They are praying for child sacrifice.
And yes they are sincere. Sincerely evil prayers.
CC you seem to think that prolifers should accept the pro-choice position of various denominations that don’t support the pro-life position and I don’t understand why you would think that. You also seem to imply that all Jewish people are pro-choice, which is simply untrue. Furthermore, most religious people desire the conversion of other people to their religion so I am not sure why you seem to think that people who belong to a Church that supports a pro-life position wouldn’t want others to convert to that religion. For example, the Mormon Church is not going to turn a Christian away if the Christian wants to convert to Mormonism. For that matter, many atheists want people to lose their theistic religions – just think of Richard Dawkins, et al. Human beings have a tendency to think that whatever position they hold is the right position to hold – CC even does this. Does CC hate those who attend synagogues that support the pro-life position, or those individuals that go to pro-life evangelical Churches, or are Roman Catholic?
Suggested prayer for Reverend Rebecca Turner of Faith Aloud and her followers:
Matt 27:25 And all the people answered, Let this blood be on us and on our children! [Deut 21:6-9; Ps 26:6.] AMP
And this will be the prayer of the righteous:
Deut 21:7-9 7 And they shall testify, Our hands have not shed this blood, neither have our eyes seen it.
8 Forgive, O Lord, Your people Israel, whom You have redeemed, and do not allow the shedding of innocent blood to be charged to Your people Israel. And the guilt of blood shall be forgiven them.
9 So shall you purge the guilt of innocent blood from among you, when you do what is right in the sight of the Lord. AMP
Rev 6:10 They cried in a loud voice, O [Sovereign] Lord, holy and true, how long now before You will sit in judgment and avenge our blood upon those who dwell on the earth? [Gen 4:10; Ps 79:5; Zech 1:12.] AMP
Num 35:33-34 33 So you shall not pollute the land in which you live; for blood pollutes the land, and no atonement can be made for the land for the blood shed in it, but by the blood of him who shed it.
34 And you shall not defile the land in which you live, in the midst of which I dwell, for I, the Lord, dwell in the midst of the people of Israel. AMP
Luke 23:34 And Jesus prayed, “Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.”
Humans are stupid, but GOD can fix stupid.
I don’t think there’s any coincidence at all that abortion advocates especially hate: the Catholic Church, the Orthodox churches and synogogues, and anything with a hierarchy, rules, and traditions.
When you join an organization that has kept its identity intact over multiple human lifetimes, you join something bigger than yourself. But, if you’re “spiritual not religious” then: you want everything to bend to your opinion, your worldview, your wants and whims.
And isn’t that at the heart of the abortion issue: a child is a new generation, bigger than you, making you part of something greater: the human family. You do sacrifice your small view for something larger. You can’t force fertility, conception, etc. Part of it is beyond your control. Abortion advocates hate that and everything about it. Destroying a pregnancy rather than bring a child to term is a symptom of their desire to control. We post-abortive women were sold that: “it’s alright, you’ll have your old life back and you can control it all.”
We can’t control everything, and that’s ok.
Majorly well said.
So much of what’s good in life comes when we step into something greater than ourselves. For those who accept that we have a particular nature — even if we don’t all agree on just what that is (“know thyself” isn’t met in a single epiphany, but takes a life and, from the Christian point of view, some inside information from those who’ve heard from God in the past) — it’s a matter of ordering our minds and our worlds to what we believe is really true about it. And there’s comfort in knowing that there’s a place for us in this world, and that we have a cosmically ordered role to play in that place. We are not wanderers. We have work to do.
For those who believe, however, that existence precedes essence, and that the world and ourselves are what we make of it (and that the unborn possess whatever worth whomever ascribes, since they don’t have a “nature” that entitles them to any default level of respect), it’s a different thing entirely. Power becomes really important, because creating your own nature against nature requires force. Pegs that imagine themselves some particular shape must exert great effort to shape the entire universe to validate that self-image.
Yada yada. Must have coffee. Can’t think…
So, I guess we’re not getting a new quote today.
JDC, if you had seen the top post, Jill’s daughter just gave birth this afternoon. I’m sure she’s busy. :)
Too bad they’re praying to the Father of Lies and Prince of Darkness.
Kate, I guess that excuses it. :)
This woman is a little confused. Nobody said she’s not allowed to pray. However, most Christians would agree that it’s wrong to pray for people to be killed, especially innocent children.
My faith doesn’t tell me that unborn children are alive. That’s the realm of science. My faith tells me that the killing of innocent people can never be condoned.
“There are 6 things that the LORD hates, 7 that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, AND HANDS THAT SHED INNOCENT BLOOD; A heart that plots wicked schemes, feet that run swiftly to evil, the false witness who utters lies and he who sows discord among brothers(Prvs 6:16-19)
We are called to Rescue those who are UNJUSTLY SENTENCED TO DIE; don’t stand back and let them die……For God, who knows all hearts, knows yours, and He knows you knew! And He will reward everyone according to his deeds. Prv 24:11-12
Jesus said in Matthew 25:40: “Whatever you did for the least of my brethren, YOU DID IT TO ME.”
The unborn, are a boy or girl from conception it’s in their DNA and is Jesus brethren just as much as born persons.
Wow, everything was so well-articulated here. I just want to point out that for some reason, it is not considered “hate speech” when that hate is directed toward Catholics and pro-lifers. Catholics and pro-lifers can be called every foul name in the book and can be treated as criminals, and liberals justify it.
I am glad to know that the United Church of Christ is behind this, as it is good to know who our enemies are. I also know that many mainline Methodists and Presbyterian churches, as well as many other mainline Protestant churches have caved in to give their approval to abortion. I admire and applaud those pro-life Protestants out there who have found the truth about the unborn and don’t wrongly and blindly follow those Protestant church leaders who support abortion. Do not get me wrong; there are those Catholics who are Catholic-in-name-only (and this includes some clergy as well as laity) who whole-heartedly support abortion, and I pray for them.
However, the beauty of the Catholic Church is that its doctrine, as well as its authority (the Pope) has never faltered in its complete and total rejection of contraception and abortion. Even when I questioned my faith, I kept coming back to the truth and the beauty of that truth – the Catholic Church is the only one that has always rejected contraception and abortion, and therefore, it must be the one true church. Why would the Catholic Church persist in such an unpopular and unworldly view, if it isn’t the one true church?
The Catholic Church, incidentally, is the only one that has apostolic succession all the way back to St. Peter, and therefore, the only one with valid Holy Orders and valid and consecrated Eucharist. Anyone who was not rightfully ordained as a priest by a bishop who is in obedience to Rome (the Pope) has no ability to validly ordain, and thus, there is not a valid consecration. Catholics believe in transubstantiation because Jesus said, “This is my body. Take and eat this in remembrance of Me”. He did not say, “This is LIKE my body” or “This is a a remembrance of my body” or “This is a symbol of my body”. Rather, He said, “This IS MY BODY”. This is why it is transubstantiation. The unconsecrated host, through the action of the consecration BECOMES Jesus’ actual body. No other faith believes this, and even if they believed it, it would not be possible because they are not in communion with Rome and following ALL of the church teachings as set forth by Vatican (the Pope). The break in apostolic succession happened as far back as when there was a split and the Eastern Orthodox churches broke away from the Catholic Church and refused to be obedient to the Pope. Another break occurred when King Henry the 8th wanted to divorce his wife, but the Pope wouldn’t let him. This created the Church of England (now called the Anglican Church and Episcopalian Church in the U.S.). All Protestant religions broke off of the Catholic Church at some point, and can trace their roots back to it.
Martin Luther was a Catholic monk who believed in marriage of priests. He also very firmly believed in honoring Mary and recognizing her role in our lives. Calvin and Wesley also broke off of the Catholic Church, and if you read your history, you will find that there were a great deal of treasures and riches to be found in disagreeing with the Catholic Church and stealing her treasures. A great many beautiful and expensive works of art and statues were stolen from the European cathedrals and went into the hands of Protestants. Thus, those who wanted to get richer at any cost became Protestant.
This is not to say that Protestants are like this now-a-days, but these are the honest-to-goodness historical roots. Also, the Catholic Irish were heavily persecuted, starved, and driven out of Ireland by English Protestants and Irish Protestants.
In America, Catholics have a long history of being persecuted. Just look at Rick Santorum and all of the persecution he has faced.
Mexican Catholics and Chinese Catholics are still being persecuted and put to death for their beliefs. For the person who was putting down the Catholic Church, I would just ask, what are your motives? Do you see the Catholic faith as your greatest enemy because she is the strongest defender of innocent human life?