Liberals, media try to shift debate from abortion to contraception
I wrote last week about a theory put forth by Washington Post’s Sarah Kliff that abortion proponents were shifting strategies to focus on contraceptives rather than abortion, the reason being their own polls show abortion is no longer a winning issue with young people and women, but contraception is.
This week Republican strategist Dick Morris pitched the same theory on Hannity, adding some corroboration:
Morris: Obama did not make a mistake in this mandate. It’s a deliberately calculated move on his part. The Democrats realize that abortion is no longer a winner for them. It used to be ten points more pro-choice than pro-Life, now it’s ten points more pro-Life than pro-choice possibly because of the publicity of the anti-abortion people, possibly because of the aging of the population. But the point is that it’s a loser issue.
So what they’re trying to do now is replace it with contraception. So the first piece of evidence was after Santorum won Iowa, the first controversy was, “Do you think states should have the right to ban contraception?” Where did that come from?
Morris: Then you remember that ABC debate with that paid Democratic hitman George Stephanopoulos went after Romney trying to… pin him down on, on contraception? And Romney kept saying, “George, nobody wants to make contraception.” “No, but do they have the theoretical power to do it?” Remember, it was five minutes, people were laughing at him, booing him. Well that…
Hannity: You think he was doing this under direct orders?
Morris: Under orders. And I think, and now he comes out with this thing on contraception. They want to create the idea, and it’s no coincidence, that he came out with it after Minnesota and Colorado which was Santorum’s victories. They want to create the impression that the Republicans will ban contraception, which is totally insane, but they’re floating it out and they’re bringing it out there. And this move on Obama’s part was part of injecting that issue.
On his February 14 show, Rush Limbaugh picked up on Morris’ theory:
Rush: I want to move on to this Dick Morris business and the attack on the Catholic Church last week by Obama. I want to ask you, if you remember back in January there was a presidential debate, a Republican debate in Manchester. Do you remember – ’cause this is a setup for what’s coming – do you remember, we were all perplexed here. George Stephanopoulos kept hounding Romney on contraception. It had not come up, nobody had said anything about it, and we were all confused, as was Romney, what the deal was. Well, it is Dick Morris’ theorem that that was a setup that led to what happened last week….
That’s what Morris’ theory is about what happened last week, trying to get abortion off the table because it’s a loser for the Democrats. And now instead of Republicans want to ban abortion, they want to ban contraception. Well, let’s go back and listen to what Dick Morris is talking about here….
Rush moved to a new radio ad NARAL is running in Colorado, Florida, Virginia, and Wisconsin, thanking President Obama for his contraceptive mandate. NARAL president Nancy Keenan appeared on MSNBC on February 14 promoting the ad and said this:
Keenan: [T]his is a win for women in this country and it’s a win for the president because it’s gonna draw the contrast between a president who stood with women and their access to contraception and birth control and those that oppose it and want to stand between a woman and her birth control. So absolutely for 2012, this is a president who stood with women.
Back to Rush…
Rush: So, it appears Dick Morris is up to something. It appears that he’s on to this. Out of the blue, this has now become something all about contraception…. And what’s happened, really, is that the terms, the definition and the terms have changed. We’re no longer talking about abortion. All of a sudden now it’s Republicans who want to stamp out contraception, that’s what the attempt last week was all about….
So that’s the paradigm shift here, at least so goes the theory, and it does explain why Stephanopoulos was talking about something that was not even an issue.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
I repeat: Subsidize your own sex life. Don’t you liberated women want control of your sexuality and your bodies anyway? Isn’t this what this it’s all about.
Oh. My bad. The true liberation comes from when the taxpayers pay for the contraception, the said contraception fails, and now you can get a taxpayer funded abortion. The freedom!!! Makes me want to go outside and wave a flag.
THE o’bama WAR ON HAIR DRYERS
“President Obama’s border enforcement officials prevented over 13,000 dangerous hair dryers from entering the country, the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) trumpeted today.”
http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/dhs-cbp-stops-thousands-unsafe-hair-dryers/376786
The ‘mules’ who were toting the contraband were escorted by coyotes armed with weapons provided by the ATF under the FAST AND FURIOUS boondoggle.
The ‘mules’ were granted ass-ylum and registered to vote as democRATs. One of the rescued smugglers said thru an intrerpreter, “Now I can fulfill my life long ambition to be elected President of the United States of North America. Muchas gracias el presidnente o’bama.”
Under the ‘CATCH AND RELEASE’ policy of o’bama administration the coyotes were returned unharmed, but not unarmed, to their natural habitat.
The o’bama administration apologized to the Chinese government for the temporary disruption of their access to the U. S marketplace.
The tens of millions of undocumented aliens who have entered the country or remained here illegally lamented the lack of availability of inexpensive hair dryers.
Guttmacher admits the number one cause of unplanned pregnancy is improper use of birth control-why fund something they’re too stupid/lazy to use correctly in the first place? They’ve been shrieking for 40 years about how much they need PP for their ‘low cost’ bc-this is a glaring admission that they realize free ain’t free and that the rest of us are funding their libidos. It’s within every man and woman’s power to control their fertility without government subsidizing it and without the use of hormonal bc .
If abortion were taken out of PP’s business model today, they’d fold and be out of business in a month. Do they really think this propaganda campaign is fooling anyone? It’s just the typical liberal pocket picking dressed up as a human rights violation so they can continue violating the human rights of the youngest members of the human family. They want ‘choices’ while they ram Obamacare as the only choice down our throats. NO.
Well, weren’t we promised the most transparent administration ever? (Guffaw!)
Yep, we see right through you. May they fall flat on their faces with this ridiculous tactic.
Jill,
Great! Let’s talk about contraception. Last night I found the new pages that the World Health Organization has, linking to their Group 1 Carcinogens list, which includes oral contraceptives and estrogen replacement therapy. I also came upon the page that has ALL OF THE RESEARCH PAPERS IN THE SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE USED TO ESTABLISH THIS.
I’ve compiled the links at my blog:
http://gerardnadal.com/2012/02/15/world-health-organization-data-on-birth-control-pill-and-estrogen-replacement-carcinogenicity/
Planned Parenthood distributes these drugs like candy. Even with the smallest increase in risk, when multiplied by a billion women taking these drugs, we’re talking about a devastating number of new cases attributed to these drugs.
Perhaps if women realize the risk to themselves we’ll get more traction against Planned Parenthood.
So Dr. Nadal, how come we never hear about this? To know something is a carcinogen but not tell the consumer would be, like, misogyny, right?
Courtnay,
It’s profoundly disturbing that the truth is being hidden in the open. The scientific data are all there in the journals, and PP, et al. are banking on the fact that 99.8% of the population will never see it.
There is the fact that many forms of contraception are abortifacients. So if we do overturn Roe, will those at least be banned or not?
http://www.catholiceducation.org/articles/sexuality/se0002.html
Birth control pills are harmful – to women and the environment. Someone ought to compare the effects v.s. Cigarettes. Big Pharma is like Big Tobacco, only instead of cigarettes everywhere as they were in the TV shows and movies from WW2 through the early ‘1960s, it is all no-consequence (w)rec(k)reational sex.
Most “pro-lifers” do support “The war on drugs” with the SWAT teams and their no-knock warrants and flash grenades, asset forfeiture, and decade long prison terms for having small amounts of drugs. If you would not add abortifacients to the list alongside heroin and marijuana, what exactly would you do?
Unless your approach to Government is more Ron Paul than Rick Santorum, the left has a point. If you are calling for an end to the war on drugs, at least the thuggery, zero-tolerance, and long prison sentences, then you can claim they have nothing to fear.
All too often the discussion is not whether to use growing extremes of force, coercion, violence to enforce laws, but how to get control of the thugs to use them for our cause instead of theirs. The same thugs that will be enforcing the HHS mandate.
BC pills also pollute the environment and contaminate the water supply. Personally I’d rather not have someone’s extra estrogen in my morning coffee, thanks.
Do they really think this propaganda campaign is fooling anyone?
Yeah. The problem is, it IS fooling TONS of people, because they’ve built this latest charade upon the false narrative they’ve established that conservatives are just prudes who hate sex, so guess what? Everyone WILL believe this tripe.
We need to make the grounds of our opposition to this contraceptive mandate EXCEEDINGLY CLEAR:
Yes. Some people are willing to accept an increased risk of cancer in order to have what they want. You can actually witness this happening at any major beach on any given hot summer day. Some people are willing to accept an increased risk of cancer in exchange for a lesser risk of pregnancy to engage in intimacy. That’s simply how it is, and by refusing to accept this, we’re shooting ourselves in the foot. I don’t and can’t take birth control, but I’m perfectly willing to let others who feel as though they need it take it. But, I do agree that they should pay for it themselves. I’m not paying for anyone else’s sunscreen for a day of fun at the beach, I’m not going to pay for their birth control for a night of fun in the sack. I don’t care what they ingest, I don’t care who they’re with, what they’re doing, or why. But we shouldn’t have to pay for it.
Secondly, this is about religious rights. I’m not religious, but I understand the provisions in the Bill of Rights protecting religion from government, and this is MOST DEFINITELY flying in the face of it, boldly. If we give up this right, we deserve to have every other right which will inevitably be taken from us thereafter removed. If one goes, the others will be soon to follow.
Seriously, everyone. We have MORE than plenty of reasons to oppose this without attacking birth control itself. Let the babies have their bottles, so-to-speak, because when contraception itself comes under attack, we are sure to fail, and THEY KNOW THIS. THAT IS WHY THEY ARE DOING IT. WHY ARE WE PLAYING INTO THEIR GAME?!
im no prude and i like sex as much as the next guy but i feel that if women want to go out and have reckless sex then they need to pay for their own birth control and their own dead baby. stop asking the taxpayers to fund it pro aborts!
Yep, confuse an elective product (birth control) and make it seem like a necessity. I’m so glad that at least all the folks here don’t have the wool pulled over their eyes.
Natural family planning doesn’t pollute the environment. How can people be so bonkers about plastic bottles and so dense about all those hormones and chemicals!! Hullo McFly!!!
I’m not saying it is a necessity, ninek. As I stated before, I’ve been able to live without it. However, SOME PEOPLE, a LOT of people in fact, DO consider it a necessity for them, EVEN THOUGH IT IS NOT. Liberals are trying to conflate the fact that we don’t want to have to pay for birth control and some religions do not allow them to provide/pay for it with a desire on our part to OUTLAW it, which is not true. However, if that lie is allowed to take hold and spread, and we do not clarify that this is a religious and fiscal issue ONLY, we WILL lose this fight, Mississippi Personhood Initiative-style. They lied there about contraceptives, and we lost, and that is why they are trying to do it again.
How am I the only person who can see this? How am I the only person who can see that we have to look at their successes and figure out how to cut that ground out from under them by tailoring our message?
After literally YEARS of debating this crap with the other side, and coming back against every point they’ve had to make SUCCESSFULLY, until it just degrades into their head exploding and them cussing me out, basically, how can we not see this?
1.) “You just want to control my body because you are religious.”
me: I’m not religious.
them: *HEAD EXPLODIES!*
2.) “You’re just a man who hates women.”
me: I’m a woman, and have fought for numerous other rights for us. As a matter of fact, I’m divorced and am grateful that I’ve had the right to become so.
them: *HEAD EXPLODIES!*
3.) “You just hate sex unless it’s to make babies!”
me: Actually, I have an active sex life and a tubal ligation.
them: *HEAD EXPLODIES!*
4.) “You’re just ignorant and don’t know what a human being is. Learn to read!”
me: Actually, I’ve successfully completed college courses in Biology, so I’m quite familiar with the science involved.
them: *HEAD EXPLODIES!*
I’m telling you guys, we have to LISTEN to what they’re saying before we can beat them, and we’re not going to beat them unless we get as effective at countering their B.S. as they are at spouting it.
When one is given an opportunity, one should use the most of it. Let’s start asking them to define their terms, let’s quote the medical research, and the information leaflets handed out with the Pill, and let’s read the warnings out aloud to them. This is an opportunity to take back America, to say the Truth about the chemicals that women have been ingesting. Let us stand up for women, let us determine the narrative. They want us to affirm their sexual immorality (just as the homosexual lobby wants us to affirm gay relationships as marriages), they want us to affirm their view that the sterilization of women is good, and that casual sex is good (not just permissible). This fight should be graciously accepted.
Ugh. False dichotomy. If you want to “determine the narrative” like that, everyone’s going to laugh in your face, because just because you use contraception doesn’t mean you’re having casual sex or that you are immoral. Just because a woman wants to be sterilized doesn’t mean she’s wrong or bad. Sorry we live in a world where not everyone who is happily married ALSO wants children but also happen to enjoy intimacy, but that’s just the world we live in, and if you think everyone is going to adopt your attitude, you’re delusional.
I’m afraid their b.s. has worked because it’s based on the realities of the attitudes of people, not because they somehow mind-controlled everyone into wanting sex or not wanting to become pregnant. And yes, I reiterate that a good many people are perfectly comfortable with an increased risk of cancer. How many smokers are there in the world? How many tanning salons are there? Be more realistic.
“And yes, I reiterate that a good many people are perfectly comfortable with an increased risk of cancer. How many smokers are there in the world? How many tanning salons are there? Be more realistic.”
Yes, what you say is true. However, we do not give children a choice about whether or not they will smoke or drink alcohol. We require warning labels on these carcinogenic and teratogenic products, and make their sale to and consumption by minors illegal. The same needs to be done with oral contraceptives.
That would break Planned Parenthood’s knees.
xalisae, I agree with some of your points, especially the point that exact language needs to be used. But it is due to the confusion on this topic that this conversation is so necessary.
Kinds of contraceptions
For example, when I use the word contraception I use it with the strict literal meaning of the word which is to prevent conception. This means condoms are contraception but most versions of the Pill are not. If you read my comments with this definition in mind I don’t think you will have a problem with my comments on contraception. I also never said or even implied that those who use contraceptions are having sex. However, with that said I can still make the point that if one uses the strict definition of contraception then one must see that contraception is used to prevent conception during sex, casual or otherwise.
Contraception and Relationship status
Married couples, or seriously committed couples that use contraception are not involved in casual sex, whcih is a valid point. However, the State does have a responsibility to encourage and foster support for marriage and the raising of a family, A shrinking population is not good for any country, just ask the Russian people. Very few rational people do not think that marriage is the healthiest parental arrangement for children to grow-up in. Furthermore, PP and the Left promote casual sex and contraception simultaneously, as the video from the other day pointed out.
Contraception and age
The use of contraception or sterilization does not make a person bad. IMO, the use of sterilization is wrong. However, I would not prevent adults (over 18 years old) from using sterilization or true contraceptives.
The marketing of sex
Their bs has worked because it has been marketed better than the marketing virtues. They have controlled the minds of many young and old adults including myself. Most people do not want cancer, and once the public is educated about the harms of various activities such as smoking, they stop doing them en masse, Although some will continue smoking or doing harm to themselves I do not think most will. This is an argument about numbers.
xalisae – you are too funny! I was laughing out loud at your comments! Wonderful. She makes some good points – although not completely in step with the Catholic teaching – but very useful and good to have people of other persuasions come aboard. We have to keep asking – WHY would the government want to keep peddling something that is a know carcinogen? I thought this was about woman’s health? If we keep making soundbites like the opposition – it’ll get through. Let’s play like the others do – but with real facts and figures. Let’s expose the harm. let’s remind them about the people we know with blood clots, ruined fertility, those women who pay dearly due to those low-cost (and now trying to be free) cancer-inducing artificial man-made hormones. We are still experimenting on women…
them: *HEAD EXPLODES!*
The one thing the Left has done really well is to make people believe all contraceptive methods are equal, and that some abortifacients are contraceptive rather than abortive. They allow this to happen so that people will once again hate the Catholic Church. They hope the Public will not be able to distinguish between contraceptives so that when they hear Church teaching on the subject (which is extremely exact and precise) they will be confused and threatened.
I resent the way I am portrayed as wanting to control women’s bodies becuase of this issue (see Megan, et al). I have no interest in controlling your body–in fact, please, keep it to yourself!
But once your baby’s here, he’s here. It’s ironic–I’ll bet Megan never guessed in a million years that there would be folks all over this country one day mourning the child she so casually threw away for the degree and now so stridently defends killing.
Because it was a fetus.
Shouldn’t the medical community be more vocal about this as Dr. Nadal is? If more M.D.’s, etc. came forward and talked about the health risks of chemical b/c would the public listen? Or is it just a big money-maker for the medical community and pharmaceutical companies and they don’t want to give this up? Tyler, no matter what, there will always be those that hate the Catholic Church and what she stands for. They’ve been trying to take it down for 2,000 years! The gates of Hell will not prevail against My Church!
Um liberals aren’t entirely misrepresenting this issue.
For sure conservatives don’t want to make condoms illegal
But on this board and others many people have argued for making IUD’s and ‘abortifacient’s illegal, which would make the pill illegal which is a wildly unpopular move
We need to take this very seriously.
America is addicted to contraception. Obama and PP have positioned themselves as teh pushers. The addicts will sacrifice every shred of dignity and freedom to get their fix.
Go ahead — try and warn the public about the risks of stroke and breast cancer. Women and the men who love them will ignore the risks, because the lust for infertile sex is too strong.
Let’s face it — women are willing to kill their children in order to have sex without consequences. Venereal diseases, strokes and breast cancer pale in comparison.
Merely suggesting that Republicans want to cut off their contraception-fix has already triggered widespread, irrational paranoia.
This is going to be a tough lie to overcome. Perhaps the toughest yet.
It wouldn’t make the pill illegal. There was a commenter here named “Dave” that participated as a researcher in I think he said clinical trials or something for a hormonal contraceptive. He said what a few others (OB/GYNs, even) have stated: that the pill is not an abortificent and there is no way to determine whether it is for certain or not, anyway.
No, nobody wants to make the pill illegal. Take your lies you’re trying to bring us down with elsewhere.
We need to take this very seriously.
America is addicted to contraception. Obama and PP have positioned themselves as teh pushers. The addicts will sacrifice every shred of dignity and freedom to get their fix.
Go ahead — try and warn the public about the risks of stroke and breast cancer. Women and the men who love them will ignore the risks, because the lust for infertile sex is too strong.
Let’s face it — women are willing to kill their children in order to have sex without consequences. Venereal diseases, strokes and breast cancer pale in comparison.
Merely suggesting that Republicans want to cut off their contraception-fix has already triggered widespread, irrational paranoia.
This is going to be a tough lie to overcome. Perhaps the toughest yet.
Ok. Sex is bad, blah blah blah, I hope those sluts get the cancer they want, blah blah blah, we’re so much better than contracepting people, blah blah blah.
Now that we’ve gotten all of that out of our system, can we PLEASE do something to address the lie that Pro-Lifers want to make hormonal contraception illegal? PLEASE?!
We don’t want it illegal – we don’t want to be complicit it it’s use or encouragement. Nuf said. repeating lies won’t make them truths – they are still dishonest.
As a woman who has been harmed by artificial hormones – I can say I wish that the medical researchers and doctors will stop experimenting on women. We are not guinea pigs.
I want the Pill that Kills to be illegal.
I agree that pro-lifers need to come to a consensus on this issue.
There are other contraceptive methods available for women to use that are less harmful to both the innocent life and the Mother. The Pill increases the risk of breast cancer in the Mother, and causes the embryo, new life, to fail to implant.
The manufacturers designed the pill to work this way, and that is why they are legally required to disclose this to the users of their product.
Aside from all of the other available technological methods to contracept there is also a natural method available to women. The natural method is not only healthier for women, but it is also free. God was no fool, he designed women with all of their differing concerns in mind.
No one needs to come to any consensus. We should be free in a damned free country.
The problem isn’t insurance. The problem is the insurance mandate.
The problem isn’t contraception. It is the contraception mandates.
All these mandates, aka commands from these petit dictators are the problem.
Why the hell are free people being mandated all this crap by these stinking overlords?
We are not their subjects. And they are anything but liberals.
They are every bit as tyrannical as any king.
They are reactionaries who want to go back to the time of kings and tyrants.
By the way, Catholics think sex is good, why do you think so many of them have large families!!!
(I apologize to my fellow Catholics, I do know that the enjoyment of sex is not the reason why you have children.)
Hippie, I do agree that the trampling of religious freedom is the immediate issue that needs to be addressed. However, the Pill has killed and will continue to kill millions(????) of innocent lives. Is this not important? It has harmed and killed countless women due to breast cancer. Why should we turn our heads and not confront these issues? Do we care about women or not? Do we care about all preborn life or not? Preborn embryoes deserve freedom and the protection of the life just as much as the rest of us.
I guess I failed to make my point clear, xalisae. I agree with you.
We need to take this lie very seriously — because the American public is deeply addicted to contraception. Normally rational people are turning frothing rabid at the thought of Republicans wanting to take away their contraception.
And the more that we tell the truth — NO ONE WANTS TO BAN YOUR CONTRACEPTION! — the more it confirms their irrational paranoia.
IT’S A LIE! IT’S A LIE!
MOTHER JONES IS LYING!
PLANNED PARENTHOOD IS LYING!
THEY ARE LYING!
STAY CALM! — NO ONE WANTS TO TAKE AWAY YOUR CONTRACEPTION!
I’m sorry I misunderstood you then, Del. I’m sorry. I’m getting exasperated about this because I’m sick of the lies, and I’m sick of people like Tyler being taken out of context to help feed the lies. Sometimes I get frustrated with my own side, and I just don’t know what to do.
I’m sorry.
Del, I agree as long as you don’t call the Pill a contraceptive. If you think the Pill is a contraceptive and should be legal I don’t agree with you. I don’t want to use Leftist tactics to win the fight. I don’t want to lose my soul to win the world.
xailise,
who is lying???
Several pro-life sources are refering to the Obama mandate as requring people to buy abortion-inducing drugs.
The drugs they are referring to are the pill and morning after pill. You might not be concerned with abortifacients but many are. If you call the pill an abortion inducing drug and then say you want to ban abortions you ARE saying you want to ban hormonal bc
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/pro-life-nuns-were-not-exempt-obama-mandate-would-force-us-to-pay-for-abort
xalisae, have confidence in the truth. It is hard, and the truth often makes one feel vulnerable but if we courageously stand by it, we will win, we will even win the debate about the value of the Pill for women and their children.
This Papa Bear will always back you up.
xalisae, I too often get frustrated by the limited tactics we as Pro-lifers have at our disposal. However, I am coming to terms with it. Part of this is reflecting on the successes of 2011. The common theme to the success seems to me to be the matter-of-fact way pro-lifers have brought the truth, the tiny truth, to the courts.
uhh…yeah. Except for the fact that BC wasn’t created with the intent to flush embryos, nor has it been definitively proven that it does, plus, I myself and MANY people I know have gotten pregnant while on BC, so I think that’s a load of crap, and BC is not an abortificent.
Enjoy coming to terms with losing, because I refuse to do so.
what r you talking about
YOUR OWN PEOPLE ARE calling it an abortifacient not me.
I’m not losing anything. Your people are saying the pill causes an abortion. I’m not saying that I think its redic! but if you look at fox and lifesitenews they have multiple headlines about how obama mandates the covering of abortion care.
MANY pro-lifers have called the pill an abortifacient, that isn’t liberal libel
X,
I don’t claim to have the scientific proof but it sure makes sense that high doses of hormones ingested to negatively impact a woman’s fertility by stopping ovulation and disrupting a womans menstrual cycle would have a HIGH PROBABLITY of making the utering lining less receptive to embryo implantation. It is rational and it is the truth. Women desreve honest information about this. It is not the best agrument against Obama’s decree but I won’t be stopped from getting the truth to people about it just cause the other side wants to spin the truth into lies for political advantage.
Well, shoot! Mr. President-you don’e let that snake out the box, didn’t you.
Go ahead! See if you can get it back ‘en! :-))
MITT ROMENY IS A ROBOT
Hi Bobbi,
Obama brilliantly planned this strategy. Fight it we must, but either way he has won. He has made contraception an issue. This man is a mile down the road and we are still running in one spot, chasing our tails.
Dick Morris nailed it. I’m just embarassed that I didn’t figure it out. Heck, I predicted everything else he was going to do. I knew Obama had an angle, I just didn’t know what it was. Well, typical sociopath, they are always one step ahead.
He has no intention to “get it back ‘en”. Too many people have made the huge mistake of underestimating this man. As I said, when it comes to the sociopath, you cannot project on to hm or her what are to you normal human emotions or reasoning.
This man wants to stay in power. He desperately needed a “wedge” issue. If he has to kick in the teeth of the people who gave him their support, the majority of Catholics, he’ll do it. I mean heck, he relegated his minister and mentor of 20 years, Jeremiah Wright, to the status of a senile old uncle when it was poltically expedient, why should Catholics expect any different? He has the help of a White House stenography pool that passes as journalism in this country. Anyone want to place bets on how soon Chris Matthews was b—-slapped back into line?
Sorry folks, Obama has already won this round. Whatever strategy we take, he wins.
There will not be consensus on the bc issue for a loooooong time, if ever. And we don’t need consensus. The Republican party is not trying to make bc illegal. Even possibly abortifacient bc. This mandate is a religious freedom issue.
This will be an ugly battle but the silver lining, from a Catholic perspective, is that the American Church is finally talking about bc after a 40+ year silence. At least 2 generations of American Catholics have not been taught God’s plan for human sexuality. The Church is not trying to legislate it’s teaching and force everyone to comply. The Church wants to be free to teach and live the faith. If we are not free to live our faith, then we are not free at all.
Obama brilliantly planned this strategy. Fight it we must, but either way he has won.
Mary,
Obama’s approval rating had been inexplicably rising over the past month. Now the latest daily gallup poll from yesterday has Obama approval down 5% points from one week ago. How is that a winning strategey?
Hi ts,
He’s created a wedge issue, which is what he wanted. Approval ratings go up and down.
Whatever happens he has his issue. That is how this is a winning strategy.
But the issue is only a winning strategy for him if it wins him votes. It seems to be dramatically dropping his approval rating among the general public and has motivated the consevative and Christian bases to further mobilize against him. Doesn’t sound like a winning strategy much less a strategy that has already won. His startegy was to make this be seen as a contraception issue but it is not working out the way he intended. The approval he is losing was not what he expected because people are rising up against government over-reach more-so than aginst contraception.
The approval he is losing was not what he expected because people are seeing this as an issue of government over-reach more-so than an issue of access to contraception.
“uhh…yeah. Except for the fact that BC wasn’t created with the intent to flush embryos, nor has it been definitively proven that it does, plus, I myself and MANY people I know have gotten pregnant while on BC, so I think that’s a load of crap, and BC is not an abortificent.”
xalisae, I think you missed the following report by Ms. Stanek:
https://www.jillstanek.com/2012/02/immaculate-contraception/
Please check out the foolowing links in the article:
Class I carcinogen
yes, that’s right
Judie Brown
And read this insert on the Pill (see page 2 describing the effect of the Pill on implanation):
http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2005/021690lbl.pdf
Oral “contraceptives” definitely kill babies. They have been incorrectly labelled as contraceptives.
The incremental approach is okay in the legal arean, IMO. But keeping the pill legal for bc purposes is not morally consistent with a pro-life position.
Here is another showing that the Pill causes the embryo to fail to implant:
http://womenshealth.about.com/cs/birthcontrol/a/preventpregnanc.htm
xalisae, the fact that women can and have gotten pregnant on the pill does not mean that the Pill does cause the embryo to fail to implant at other times, and for other women. The hardest part for me in accepting this point about the Pill was that my wife used oral contraceptives, and I didn’t object!!! I can’t even say that I was entirely ignorant at the time.
Do you think any company would market the Pill in a way that would tell people they were aborting their children, purposefully causing miscarriages? The way the Manufacturers market the Pill is the height of dishonesty.
Ok, Tyler. Let me know when you’re ready to next launch your crusade against stress, caffeine, exercise, being underweight, etc. Because those provably cause embryos to fail to implant as much as hormonal B.C. does.
OH MY GOODNESS! ALL THOSE TIMES I WAS SEXUALLY ACTIVE AND WORRYING ABOUT MY FINANCES, I PROBABLY LOST 2394829857349875239487 BABIES!!!! WE SHOULD MAKE IT ILLEGAL FOR WOMEN TO BE STRESSED OUT AT ALL!!!! BAAAAWWWWWWWW!!!!
You’re a lunatic.
I think I’m done here for a while. You guys enjoy your FAIL.
Also, this:
http://www.aaplog.org/position-and-papers/oral-contraceptive-controversy/hormone-contraceptives-controversies-and-clarifications/
YOU LOSE! GOOD DAY, SIR!
“Ok, Tyler. Let me know when you’re ready to next launch your crusade against stress, caffeine, exercise, being underweight, etc. Because those provably cause embryos to fail to implant as much as hormonal B.C. does.”
Can provide any support for this, or did you just make this up? I would like to see the evidence that exercise or caffeine create as much risk as the Pill in causing the embryo to fail implant.
OH MY GOODNESS! ALL THOSE TIMES I WAS SEXUALLY ACTIVE AND WORRYING ABOUT MY FINANCES, I PROBABLY LOST 2394829857349875239487 BABIES!!!! WE SHOULD MAKE IT ILLEGAL FOR WOMEN TO BE STRESSED OUT AT ALL!!!! BAAAAWWWWWWWW!!!!
Your conclusion makes no sense at all. Just because women and men who have used the Pill have been complicit in the deaths of many babies and may feel guilty about it does not mean the fact isn’t true. Pain often accompanies responsibility.
Your weblink does not disprove the link between the Pill and the failure to implant. It does show a concerted effort by the manufactures and those on the left to provide a moral shelter for women who have concerns about the ethics of the Pill. If you rely on such hair-spltting research your conscience will not have a place to rest.
xalisae, I recall that you are a secular pro-lifer. I would like to say to you that God will forgive you for any of the deaths that you may have caused. He will forgive. But since you are secular I don’t know what to say to you or to any secularist who must deal with guilt, or with overcoming past actions that they now consider wrong.
How does a secularist deal with personal wrong doing?
X,
Have a nice chill. Love ya
Your weblink does not disprove the link between the Pill and the failure to implant. It does show a concerted effort by the manufactures and those on the left to provide a moral shelter for women who have concerns about the ethics of the Pill. If you rely on such hair-spltting research your conscience will not have a place to rest.
Umm…that web link was from the American Association of PRO-LIFE Obstetricians and Gynecologists, so I don’t know where you’re getting “manufacturers and those on the left” from, at all. Sounds to me like you’re grasping at straws.
My conscience rests just fine, thanks. I know what I’ve done and what I can be held accountable for, and it’s nothing I’m losing any sleep over, trust me. I don’t really give a rat’s *** if someone like you wants to judge me or not. But enjoy working with the forces currently in motion trying to bring down the Pro-Life Movement. You’re really helping them out right now, and that’s something YOUR conscience can go rest with.
Xalisae,
I raised this topic not to judge you. I raised the topic to agree with your point that pro-lifers need to come to a consensus on this topic. If you feel judged by remarks that must be your own conscience biting you.
Your website has its Pro-Life opponents (the article itself acknowledges them). Your website also acknowledges the different oral contraceptives and that some, indeed, cause the embryo to fail to implant (3 out of 4 in fact).
But finally, your arcticle, and this is the most troubling aspect about it, fails to discuss the harm/cancer that these pills cause to the Mother. Given this glaring oversight but I can’t help but question the ethics and intention of those who wrote and published this article. Why do you ignore the cancer causing aspect as well? Are not women and Mothers worthy of your pro-life concerns?
xalisae what is name worth?
Would you consider Planned Parenthood an accurate name for that organization? Are they really about Parenthood? What are they planning? Usually they are helping folks to plan not to be parents.
These Obstrecians and Gynecologists could also be pro-abortion, as long as they are truly Pro-Choice, according to the rhetoric of some!!!
If some people want to bury their heads in the sand that is their choice, and there is not much I or you can do about it. Again given all the alternative bc methods, why are you hooked on harmonal bc?
If some people want to bury their heads in the sand that is their choice,
Obviously.
xalisae,
it is highly unlikely that you lost 2394829857349875239487 BABIES. Assuming a women has 12 cycles per year and is fertile for 30 years she will have released, at most, 360 eggs (not babies). Depending on that woman’s sex life the number of babies lost could vary widely. Women should really count their eggs!!!
By the way, xalisae can you tell I don’t have a sister?
Depending on that woman’s sex life the number of babies lost could vary widely. Women should really count their eggs!!!
And this is why we’re going to lose. Because sometimes, for some people in this movement, it really IS about controlling women.
But yeah, we’ll get right on that egg-counting thing…just…let us do everything and anything else ever, first.
Laugh a little xalisae. It is Friday!!
We will not lose. We lost a long time ago on this issue. We are trying to climb back out of the hole on this issue.
However, that egg counting thing, it is important!!! I have aked women if I could give them drugs so that I could control the number of eggs they released so that I could control when they get pregnant. Their response: “No thanks, I’ve got that under control. I have got my pills. PP helped me out.”
Hi ts, 1:35PM
He has his issue, let the chips fall where they may. We aren’t certain yet that it has cost him votes and opposition to his “courageous” stance is going to make him look like a hero to his base and the mindless dolts who have been taken in by all this.
He’s generating controversy and conflict, and he has a slavish media on his side. He is not going to back down. Sorry ts, but he has the upper hand here.
He’s accomplished exactly what he set out to do.
Mary, he took a ‘courageous’ stance on partial birh abortion and that wasn’t enough to keep himou of the presidency so I see your point that he wanted to make this into an anti-contraception issue. Hopefully Obama’s HHS decree continues to play out as an uconstitutional government over-reach.