Our worlds kiss rather than collide
Today the protest/prayer vigil of the Aurora Planned Parenthood was held. The crowd was huge, somewhere between 750-1,000! It is the largest protest of any kind I have ever attended next to the annual March for Life.
I have to sort through over 150 photos to whittle down to 10-15 to post, but in the meantime I’ll post one of Mary Kay (MK), Danny (Skinhead Dan), and me. Yes, Danny showed up. And he even surprised us by paying for our lunch, which was a kind gesture. (We happened to end up in the same restaurant affer the picket.)
For those who don’t know, MK is one of our site moderators, and Danny has been a pro-abort commenter here for several months.
So our blog world and real world met today, and the experience was nice! I had never met MK before either. It was wonderful spending time with her face to face.
More later….
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
“The crowd was huge, somewhere between 750-1,000!”
wow, thats great!.
…I like the unity picture. nice. I knew Dan had a good heart.
OK, so Dan’s shirt has prompted me to bust out some Paul Wilbur psalmy songs.
Ahem.
Here’s psalm 131
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1 Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity!
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2 It is like the precious ointment upon the head, that ran down upon the beard, even Aaron’s beard: that went down to the skirts of his garments;
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3 As the dew of Hermon, and as the dew that descended upon the mountains of Zion: for there the LORD commanded the blessing, even life for evermore.
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OK guys ready. Singalong
Henei ma tov umanaim
Shevet achim gam yachad
Sinei ma tov umanaim
Shevet achim gam yachad
Hinei ma tov (Henei ma tov)
Lai lai lai lai lai
Lai lai lai lai lai
Hinei ma tov (Henei ma tov)
Lai lai lai lai lai
Lai lai lai lai lai
Behold how good and
How pleasant it is
For brothers to dwell together
Behold how good and
How pleasant it is
For brothers to dwell together
Go here
http://www.audiblefaith.com/pages/sg201660
And click on the “listen to preview” button on the top right hand side of the page.
Then we can all do a traditional Jewish dance together!
Doh, not 131…133
Though this may get deleted, I do like that picture. I hate my smile, but it’s a nice picture.
Jasper, the UNITY on my shirt is what I’ve been preaching about for a while. We’re all brothers and sisters, we just need to get along. There’s a song by Operation Ivy that says exactly what I want everyone to know. I’ll post the lyrics at the end of this comment.
MK and Jill, it was a pleasure to meet you in person. Jill, I had my doubts on you, and I had some choice words lined up for you, but I figured that being a jerk would contradict my statement on my shirt and my sign, and you’re not so bad after all. Oh, and I’m glad I was able to pay for your lunch. I figured I’d show you guys that I’m not really all that bad :-)
Peace, ladies
“Unity” – Operation Ivy
There’s a war going down between my brothers tonight,
I don’t want no war going down, going down tonight.
Stop this war
Stop this war
Civilization? Ha! I call it as I see it.
I call it bullsh!+, you know, I still cannot believe it
Our evolution now has gone the way of hate
A world evolved resolved in this stupid fate
Stop this war
Stop this war
All so different yeah, I say we’re all the same
All caught, you know, in the division game.
Self destruction fast impending like a bullet.
No one can stop it, once it’s fired, no one can control it.
Stop this war
Stop this war
A final word, wait it’s not a call to action
We ain’t no sect, no, this ain’t no f***ing faction.
Unity, unity, unity you’ve heard it all before.
This time it’s not exclusive – we want to stop a war.
Stop this war
Stop this war
Ain’t nothing wrong with another unity song
Ain’t nothing wrong with another unity song
Ain’t nothing wrong
Ain’t nothing wrong
Ain’t nothing wrong
Ain’t nothing wrong with a unity song
Stop this war
Stop this war
Unity, as one stand together
Unity, evolution’s gonna come
Woohoo, I found my song on youtube. It’s quite a bit slower than the version I’ve heard before but horray!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvJuG7ciNho
Ok, I’m sorry one more.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUEY8OP-HPg&mode=related&search=
This is little kids singing, and there is just something about kids singing about unity!
MK, you look very familiar, you didn’t used to live in Kentucky, did you?
I almost forgot..How was the protest?!
Great picture!! Who says we older ladies don’t appreciate a good looking man! Danny, in the next few days I should be able to let you know more detail on that reptile of my daughter’s. I hope you’ll still be around.
I’ll be around, and I’ll check back. It’d most likely be easier if you sent the information to my email address, which MK and Bethany both have. If at all possible, send me a picture of said beastie.
Thanks for the compliment! I hate my smile, but I like that shirt! Got some looks, but had people asking me about it, and I got some people to walk away with a different point of view.
Which side did you stand on, Danny?
Alright, so I went to PP’s site and looked at their Aurora page.
Here’s a list what they offer.
Abnormal Pap Follow-up
Abortion Services – Medical
Abortion Services – Surgical
Adoption Counseling and Placement
Annual Exam
Birth Control without Pelvic Exam
Birth Control: Pills, Condoms, Depo-Provera, etc.
Cancer Screening (Pap Test)
Colposcopy
Counseling – Crisis
Cryotherapy
Emergency Contraception (EC)
HIV/AIDS Testing and Counseling
HPV Vaccine
IUD
Menopause/Midlife Services
Mirena
NuvaRing
Patch (Ortho-Evra)
Post-Abortion Exam
Pregnancy Testing and Counseling
Rapid HIV/AIDS Testing & Education
Sexually Transmitted Infection Testing & Treatment
Vaginal Infection Testing & Treatment
Do you see anything missing from that list? One that you would assume would be part of “comprehensive women’s services”?
Did you find waldo? There is NO prenatal care! The most you’ll get from PP is a test and some “counseling”.
I know this first hand. When I was pregnant with my son, I had just moved and didn’t have a pcp. I was pro-choice, so thought nothing of calling up the local PP.
They told me that unless I wanted an abortion,they could not help me. I asked if they offered prenatal care of any kind, and they replied that they offered urine pregnancy tests. Then they proceeded to ask me 3 times if I wanted an abortion and begrudgingly referred me to an OB (Who, by the way, was not accepting new patients).
This struck me as odd even when I was pro-choice!
It seems to me that “comprehensive women’s services and a “full range of reproductive health care” is simply code word for “we’ll give you a pregnancy test and an abortion”.
Me and my friends Ron and Amanda were the only pro-choicers there. We were a minority, but we held our ground!
We did get harassed quite a bit, though. That kinda sucked. My friend Amanda got attacked while she was in her car, and when I was telling Ron about it, a guy walking past started telling me that “my little pro-abort wh**e” deserved it for being a baby killer. However, I love when people talk big about someone who isn’t there, then when confronted by someone who is there will just walk away making empty threats.
I was passive, non-violent and non-provocative today. The only times where I ever had to defend myself was when a group of misguided youth who didn’t know what they were supporting tried to stare me down [they lost that one] and when some girl saw my jacket and started yelling that I was a Nazi, which is when I booked it towards both Ron and my car, because I did not need any fighting today. I made a promise that I’d be civil and passive, and I kept my word, just like I said I’d be there.
Dan, I sat there for like 2 minutes trying to figure out what wh**e could possibly be. Wow.
I’m sorry that your friends were harrassed. It seems when people get in large groups they tend to act like the jerks that they really are.
Hopefully most people were peacefully protesting.
Most of the protestors were very polite, and I was impressed, for the most part. There were some dirty tricksters mixed in there [Jill and MK know who I’m talking about], but they were very polite for the most part.
I agree. People in large groups gain confidence because they know that if they trash on someone who is the outsider, they have tons of backup. However, as our foul-mouthed friend learned, that doesn’t mean much when you’re within swinging distance.
Our conversation…
FMF: Your little pro-abort wh**e got what she deserves! Serves you right for being child murderers!
Me: Excuse me?
FMF: You heard me. She deserved it.
Me: Did you just call my friend a wh**e?
FMF: Yeah, so what? What’re you going to do about it?
Me: Well, most likely crack your jaw in three places unless you either apologize or walk away before I embarrass you in front of your children.
FMF: Yeah, like you’d really do it?! You’ll be arrested in a heartbeat, jack@$$!
Me: [Taking a step towards him] Wanna bet on it?
FMF: [Hurrying away with his kids and woman I assume as his wife in tow] Whatever, baby-killer!
I don’t care who you are, but you don’t insult my friends when they’ve done nothing to you, or aren’t there to defend themselves. You also don’t try and use your own CHILDREN as a shield. Cowardice runs rampant in large gatherings.
Also, saying a benediction when people called me names and doing the Vigilante Prayer from Boondock Saints every time this one lady would pray for St. Michael the Archangel to strike me down was pretty priceless XD.
Maybe I was in the wrong, but if they can’t take what they dish out, it’s not my problem. My friends and I were fairly polite to everyone we met, with the few exceptions.
Huh, Danny, I guess you just weren’t standing in the right spot, there were 23 that I counted across from where I was. (In front of Dominick’s)
MK,
That sucks, I was looking all over for you while picketing, didn’t find you until I was leaving, you were a block away:( Maybe next time.
The turn out was amazing!!! Lots of support from people driving by. Tons of compliments about my baby, which I love too!
Jill, that’s a great shirt you’re wearing. Perfect.
Lauren, that is great info about Planned Parenthood and the services they offer. It’s so great because it’s so true..
Huh. Ron and I walked around down there and didn’t see anyone who was PC. We did get stared at a lot, and some people were pretty colorful with their descriptions of us.
Danny, we won’t delete your comments in this post alone. It was nice meeting you and your friends, and since I posted your photo, you should have the opportunity to discuss our photo and the day.
Buying lunch helped… :)
Thanks Andrew. I was dumbfounded when I found out that they didn’t provide prenatal care I had been brainwashed (er..told) my whole life that PP was the go to person for all things related to women’s healthcare.
What a shock to find out that they offered every service BUT the one that enables parenthood.
Danny, did you guys have signs or anything like that?
Yeah. Ron had a sign that said “What about rape victims?” Mine said “Unity. As one, stand together.” On the back it said, “Her Body, Her Choice.
Haha, Jill, I told ya. I’m not a bad guy. I can be nice. You just gotta be nice to me too! Besides, it was my pleasure. I figure I should do something for you gals, considering I’ve been a bit of a hellion within the site.
I do, however, want those photos from today! If you wanna email them to me, I’d much appreciate it, especially since I don’t know what’s getting posted!
PS I guess I’ll just have to talk on this post alone, then… I SHALL FIND A LOOPHOLE! I SHALL PREVAIL! MWAHAHAHAHAHA!
Ok, I’m going to ask a question that I *hope* doesn’t offend you. We’re buddies remember?
I find it interesting that you had a sign that said “Her Body,Her choice”. When you were in the situation, was there no part of you that screamed out that the child in question was as much yours as hers?
I mean, I understand that a guy is supposed to be a “good guy” and say that he supports whatever choice the woman wants…but did you ever question this battle cry when it became personal?
I hope you aren’t put off by this, but your sign just really struck a cord with me.
They had signs, they read “keep abortion legal”. They left at around 10:00 though, guess their hearts just weren’t in it.
Lauren, my friend, don’t worry. I’m not going to fly off the handle. You asked a valid question that I am more than willing to answer for you.
I guess I didn’t really question it when it became personal. Like I said before, I’ve always supported a woman’s right to choose, and while I would’ve reacted differently to the situation I was in had the circumstances been different, I believe that what we decided on was the right choice. Yes, the child was as much mine as it was hers, but I wasn’t the one undergoing a surgical procedure. She was.
Good question. I might have to ponder this a little later.
I didn’t think you were going to fly of the handle…but I know it’s a sensitive subject so I wanted to tread lightly.
Rosie, they were the few who couldn’t handle being a minority in the crowd. As weird as this may sound to you cats, I am proud that my friends and I stayed strong in the face of overwhelming numbers, where we could’ve been strung up with ease, and I guaruntee the cops would’ve turned a blind eye to it.
Where there any clinic workers there?
I didn’t see any, but I wasn’t by the clinic for too long. MK walked me over by the clinic to introduce me to Jill, and that was probably the longest I was there. I spent more time causing mischief on the sidewalks and parking lots.
I’ve yet to be involved in a terribly colorful protest. Maybe I need to go out to San Francisco…
Wow.
So little of Planned Parenthoods services involve abortion. (About 3%)
I have to wonder how many abortions you pro-lifers are going to cause when you deny people a local, affordable source of birth control.
I have to wonder how many REAL LIVE people you’re going to kill by keeping their HIV, breast cancer and cervical cancer from being diagnosed.
The truth is that you’re not going to stop one single woman from having an abortion, unless,of course, you count all women you kill by denying them medical services.
Dead women seldom have abortions…
Depending on where you live, there’s probably easier protests to get to. My buddies Ron and Amanda both went to the war protests in Washington DC, and I’ve seen a lot of protests in Chicago on both the North and South sides.
Good point, Laura.
Danny,
It goes both ways i’m afraid. There was a pro-abort there who thought it was manly to swear at my 6 year old neice. Her dad just told her that he was a pro-abort and to remember what had just happened. As for the cops, well, i’m sure they are like everyone else, some are either pro-life or pro-aborts and act accordingly.
I don’t condone people doing that, either. I refused to start anything with anyone that wasn’t provoking me or cornering me, and with the exception of Mr. FMF, I don’t swear around or at children. That just strengthens a pro-lifer’s image of PC’s being mean, cruel people.
Laura, sidewalk counselors stop lots of abortions. We had over 300 in dallas last year.
Also, how many women are dying because planned parenthoods “comprehensive women’s services” do not include Prenatal care?
Eh, when it comes to cops, you have to put it into perspective. If a kid with a mohawk and a kid wearing a jacket that said American Skin on the back and Doc Marten boots was mobbed by a group of people, and you were a cop, and you saw what was going on, would you really want to jump in and help us out?
Because we look different, we get treated different. It’s stereotyping and prejudicial. It’s complete and utter BS, but it happens.
I live in Dallas. I’ve protested in Austin and Dallas.
Have you tried venturing into any of the other states around you? I’d figure there’d be tons of protests in Texas.
Also, how many women are dying because planned parenthoods “comprehensive women’s services” do not include Prenatal care?
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Google “Planned Parenthood prenatal care.” A lot of Planned Parenthood clinics offer prenatal care.
” So little of Planned Parenthoods services involve abortion. (About 3%)
I have to wonder how many abortions you pro-lifers are going to cause when you deny people a local, affordable source of birth control.
I have to wonder how many REAL LIVE people you’re going to kill by keeping their HIV, breast cancer and cervical cancer from being diagnosed.
The truth is that you’re not going to stop one single woman from having an abortion, unless,of course, you count all women you kill by denying them medical services.
Dead women seldom have abortions…”
Um, Laura, don’t you find it strange that you claim shutting down a PP will prevent women from getting birth control and STD testing, but won’t stop them from getting abortions — considering that birth control and STD testing are available from almost any OB/GYN but abortion is not?
Um, Laura, don’t you find it strange that you claim shutting down a PP will prevent women from getting birth control and STD testing, but won’t stop them from getting abortions — considering that birth control and STD testing are available from almost any OB/GYN but abortion is not?
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No. I’ve had times when Planned Parenthood covered my checkups for as little as $5.00.
Women who are willing to play roulette with their birth control and skip their pap smears, breast exams and STD testing altogether will still find a way to end an unwanted pregnancy. (The latest moronic fad that sends a chill up my spine? Girls ordering misopristol (sp) over the internet.)
My experience with the pro-aborts was certainly less than pleasant, although amusing. My role today was as photo journalist, so I kept popping over by them. I tried to engage them in real live conversation, as we do at this blog, and discovered it rattled them to venture beyond soundbites. Seriously. They couldn’t handle it. They told me to go back to my own side.
One time I was taking pictures and one of them thrust her sign in front of my camera (it’s in the slide show I’m attempting to make right now) and kept moving it when I tried to move. I said, “Real mature.”
About 10a, as they were closing up shop, I went over one last time to see if Danny had showed up, and a pro-abort man tried to stand in my way from walking down what he considered their part of the sidewalk. I asked was he going to push me so I could call the police? He backed off.
I listened in (i.e., eavesdropped) on the NOW spokeswoman speaking to journalists. She said they were surprised by our numbers, but she said we only got them by bussing people in from out of state. Puleeze. (They only had 17 people.) She complained that at other pickets they’ll have 100 protesters and we’ll have 3, and we get all the attention. What a lie. It’s always the other way around.
Joe, you think there was 1500?
“If a kid with a mohawk and a kid wearing a jacket that said American Skin on the back and Doc Marten boots was mobbed by a group of people, and you were a cop, and you saw what was going on, would you really want to jump in and help us out?”
Well, I would. The cops just should whether they want to or not and if they don’t they shouldn’t have that job. The whole ganging up on someone thing bothers the heck out of me, as does picking on someone smaller than yourself. Probably why i’m pro-life. As a kid I couldn’t watch wrestling on tv even tho I knew it was fake.
“I tried to engage them in real live conversation, as we do at this blog, and discovered it rattled them to venture beyond soundbites. Seriously. They couldn’t handle it.”
Of course not, it’s tough defending the killing of innocent human life. Thats why so many times here when they get boxed into a corner, they bail out.
Skin Dude-
On October 3rd, the documentary “Lake of Fire” is going to be released to home video. (Note to Netflix!) It’s considered to be the best documentary ever made on the subject of abortion in America.
Why would that be “Danny notable?”
“Lake of Fire” was made by Tony Kaye, Oscar-nominated producer of “American History X.”
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0841119/
Ok, Laura. First thing. If you’re going to address me, Dan, Danny, or Daniel will be perfectly fine. If you want to call me Skinhead Dan, by all means do so. However, my name is not “Skin Dude”. I don’t call you Pro-Choice Broad, do I? Be respectful. Show me respect, and I will do the same. Thank you.
Second thing. Do your research, and don’t be an ignoramus. Tony Kaye, who has done some amazing work, produced American History X, and it was a great movie about skinhead reformation from his ways as a hate-mongerer. You want a movie about true skins? Watch This Is England. Do me a favor. By referencing that movie to me, you’re implying that I’m a Neo-Nazi, and I really don’t like that, because you don’t know me, and I don’t know you. You are also implying that because I liked his movie about skinheads, I must obviously want to go watch his movie on abortion.
Maybe I’m misinterpreting what you posted, and if I did, then correct me so I can better understand what point you’re trying to make. However, I don’t really see a point here, so I’m just trying to make sense of all this.
>> Joe, you think there was 1500?
Well… That is my educated guess. I figure there were two HUGE picket lines separated by the driveway into Dominck’s. The first one was were we started. They counted over 300 there. When we went to the next picket line, it looked just as big to me… So I am guessing over 600 just in the picket lines… And there were a heck of a lot more people praying closer to the clinic… I mean gobs of them… So if figure its got to me more than 1200, so I say about 1500… Who knows it may have been more… As far as me actually counting… I counted the Pro-Choicers because it was much easier. There were 23 of them… Well… maybe 22, I got distracted as I was counting, so I may have added an extra (My camera is new so I was having trouble with all the knobs, cranks and whistles).
I didn’t see any of the “other side” acting up, but my brother said one guy was swearing and things like that. He said they were completely freaking out. His little girl got an earful.
I also saw Chris Lauzen there. Didn’t see any other political types though…
Maybe I’m misinterpreting what you posted, and if I did, then correct me so I can better understand what point you’re trying to make. However, I don’t really see a point here, so I’m just trying to make sense of all this.
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I used “Skin Dude” as an endearing expression, and have addressed total strangers with that term for YEARS without a pissy reaction.
I never suggested that you were a Neo-Nazi. I just thought that since the penultimate works on Skinheads and abortion in America were done by the same guy, you might be interested.
I’m not an ignoramus. You can’t live in Southern California and NOT have classmates, coworkers and neighbors who are deep into Skin culture.
Then Laura, you have my sincerest apologies. I get rather defensive, especially after the girl freaking out and calling me a Nazi today. I humble myself before you and ask for your forgiveness. Please excuse my jack@$$ reaction.
You do make a good point, and I’ve heard of Lake Of Fire. I really want to see that movie, and once I find it, I’m going to sit down and watch it. Tony Faye, while he did an amazing job on the portrayal of how Neos really are, didn’t really explain what skinheadism really is, and how it started. Great movie, but it only served to further the publics view of skinheads as Neo Nazis. Irritates me just a bit.
So, you’re from SoCal, huh? Ever hang out in the East Bay?
PS It’s good to hear from someone who actually knows what skinheadism really is, and doesn’t get all their information from PBS and American History X.
“They told me that unless I wanted an abortion,they could not help me. I asked if they offered prenatal care of any kind, and they replied that they offered urine pregnancy tests. Then they proceeded to ask me 3 times if I wanted an abortion and begrudgingly referred me to an OB”
Lauren, thats interesting…we now what their real money maker is, abortion.
I have to say, this is a really nice thing to see…PCers and PLers getting along…sorta…at a protest/rally. This, I think, is very touching and it’s a shame I had to miss out!
Ah vell, it’s nice to see some semblance of civility still can exist between both sides!
Dan! You are too cute!
And MK, I know you will probably hate me for saying this, but you kind of look like kathleen turner!
PiP, arigato!
I can’t really see the MK/Kathleen Turner connection. She just looks like Ma to me! I did get a funny look from some guy as we were walking to find Jill because I called MK Ma, and she was on the PL side while I was making PC mischief. Turned a head, made me laugh just a wee bit.
PS MK… SCOTLAND GO BRAUGH!
PIP,
And MK, I know you will probably hate me for saying this, but you kind of look like kathleen turner!
I sound like her too…hey it could have been worse. You could have said I look a little like Helen Thomas…LOL
MK, You are lovely looking! I’ve seen your pics before, but I never told you. Danny, I think it’s great that you posed for the picture, and you paid for lunch? AWWWW! Where did you guys eat? Danny, sorry to hear of any negative outbursts. Jill, I still haven’t forgotten the video of the pro choice chick that ripped the sign away from the prolifer. Then she proceeded to rant and rave like a lunatic………Kind of entertaining! It’s 2 sided really.
Laura, sure “alot” of planned parenthoods offer pretnatal care, but it’s a bit telling that they don’t offer it in their largest clinic. Also telling is that they offer abortion in several cities where they do not offer prenatal care. Since they talk constantly about the hazards of childbirth, and prenatal care has shown to be the biggest factor in preventing maternal mortality, you would think that it would be high on Planned Parenthood’s list of services.
However, it seems they are content to offer literally every other women’s health service that does not actually include parenthood.
PIP reminds me of someone famous too. It will come to me. I can’t think of her name right now.
Danny and Jill, you guys are both so cute! Didn’t want to leave you 2 out. However, I think I’ve told you both before.
Haha, thanks, Heather! Yes, surprisingly enough, my friends and I [Picture is at the end of Jill’s slideshow] ended up at the Blueberry Hill pancake house, and even more ironically ended up sitting at the table opposite of Jill, MK, and Rosie. So, I had our waitress snag their check and bring it to me. Their waiter was hilarious. I’m not sure what he told the gals, but I think Jill said he told’em something about every 20 tables gets a free meal or something!
The looks on their faces was pretty priceless!
Blueberry Hill…psh what you Illinoians too good for IHOP?!
Hey! I worked at IHOP, thank you very much. I was a third shift server, and I love IHOP. However, my friends and I wanted food, and Blueberry Hill was right there, so we went there.
PS Us FIBs rule. Illinois is the greatest state in the union, hands down.
Haha.
Now, you don’t really want to go toe to toe on state patriotism with a Texan do you? I mean, we have people living in our state who still refer to it as a country!
It’s Illinois, the illest state in the Union. Besides, we’ve given the world the blues, the Bulls, the Bears, Abe Lincoln, John Belushi, Chris Farley, and Al Capone.
You gave us George W. Bush, oil companies, brutal rattlesnake round-ups, and the jackalope.
I rest my case.
Dear, sweet Danny.
You gave us Oprah Winfrey. And Gale. I rest mine.
Ouch! Touche, Lauren, though Oprah is not even close to Dubya bad. Let’s just settle this as our states rule. Agreed?
Danny, did you get along with Jill, MK, and Rosie? What did you think after talking to them?
Haha ok. We can settle. Also, since you’re not supposed to post in other threads, just answer my other posts over here.
Danny,
It’s great to see that even if the debate gets very heated like between Pro-Lifers and Pro-Choices, everyone can still put aside their differences and pose for a group hug!
My favorite picture is a picture in my living room of Our Mother Mary (who was unmarried, homeless and poor but still Pro-Life) hugging the Baby Jesus.
Mike
Lauren, glad we could agree on that. Also, I’ll find a way to answer. If anything, look for the different sides of me ;). Anything else you wanna ask?
Heather, yes, I did get along with MK, Jill, and Rosie just fine. I didn’t talk to Rosie much, but she was very nice and polite and I envy her car! MK is like my new momma. I don’t think there’s anything she could say that could make me mad at her. It was a pleasure to finally meet her, and she treated me and my friends very respectfully, though I’m still curious as to how she finally spotted me in the crowds. I had some trepidation about meeting Jill, and I still held a bit of a grudge over a few words that she’s said since I started posting here. However, I put that in the past and kept an open mind, and she treated me and my friends with both respect and dignity. I liked Jill, and thought she was a very nice person to meet, even if we don’t share view opinions or see eye to eye. I wouldn’t have bought the girls lunch if I didn’t like all of them!
Now, had Jill or MK or Rosie been jerks, or mean and disrespectful, or had tried to coerce me into a car to have me locked up, we would’ve have some problems, and seeing as how I have a mouth that could make a sailor blush and no moderator to censor what I say, things could’ve gotten very out of hand. I’m very glad they didn’t, though, and I would be happy to hang out with them again!
Mike, UNITY is the key, brother. We are all brothers and sisters. My favorite photo is a picture of Johnny Cash and Joe Strummer posing after recording Redemption Songs.
Haha, the idea of Jill, MK, and Rosie kidnapping you is hilarious.
I can see the headlines “Anti-choice Mommies Kindnap Skinhead Women’s Rights Activist”
Lauren and Danny,
You are both wrong. Minnesota totally OWNS both Illinois and Texas. :)
I mean come on, which state has the highest test-scores in the US? Minnesota.
“Minnesota Nice” anybody? :)
Yes, but you brought us Rose Niland. So you lose.
I have never even heard of Rose Niland.
Don’t we get any points for having a massive sculpture of a spoon with a cherry on it in the middle of Minneapolis? :D
I mean come on…we gave the world Bob Dylan and the lone Yank in Monty Python, Terry Gilliam. :)
Heather,
Really? Aww that makes me feel special.
We gave the world Garth Brooks, Hanson, Oil, and Country Music.
I apologize profusely.
Rose Niland…Golden Girls…Er, I feel *old*.
Ahem.
PIP…MMMBOP take the time I DO-OP
LOL!
Lauren, that headline is going on my wall of hilarious quotes!
Rae, you live in an emergency weather condition every winter. You are also living in the buttcrack of Canada. You’re like Canada’s Mexico!
OOOOOH! Sick burn.
Chi-Town! Woo!
@Danny: Hahaha, I like being Canada’s Mexico. I’d rather be a part of Canada. :) Better than being Mexico’s Mexico (Guatemala…it has to *suck* to live there).
And we haven’t had emergency weather conditions for YEARS, Danny. I personally thank Global Warming for that. :)
@PiP: I accept your apology (not sure if I’ll ever be able to forgive your state though, I mean, country music? Blah!) Just kidding of course! :)
@Lauren: Oooooh! I used to love watching Golden Girls! My mom used to watch it religiously and I occasionally catch it on the Lifetime channel when I’m feeling ultra girly. :) NOW I know what you mean by “Rose Niland”. I loved Rose, she was soooo stupid, but I felt soooo sorry for her because she seemed so sad and lonely! I personally liked Sophia, she was a “bad@$$”. :D
Rae and Lauren,
I LOVE ROSE NILAND! But I agree that Sophia was the best…unfortunately my personality and shoe size more mimicked Dorothy. Never cared for Blanche. As a supported of abstinence only, you can imagine how that woman grated on my nerves. Of course, at least she couldn’t get pregnant, so no abortion.
I do remember Bea Arthur getting her abortion on All in the Family tho, and I sometimes cringe when I see myself in Dorothy. Gotta keep tellin’ myself it’s all make believe.
Danny (son) thanks for the kind words…That wasn’t Rosie tho. I only saw Rosie once from the bus. That was Jill’s friend Fran. She almost cried from surprise when the waiter told us our bill had been “taken care of”…you majorly made her day!
Lauren,
I meant to tell you that my daughter in law is Jewish and I thoroughly enjoyed your musical contribution!
“They told me that unless I wanted an abortion,they could not help me.”
Now, did they really use that phrase?
“I asked if they offered prenatal care of any kind, and they replied that they offered urine pregnancy tests. Then they proceeded to ask me 3 times if I wanted an abortion and “begrudgingly referred me to an OB” (Who, by the way, was not accepting new patients).
I’m not finding your statements to be 100% truthful. If by some slim chance, they are, the woman who gave you this information shouldn’t be working for PP or anyone else where information is solicited.
Many Ob GYN’s can’t accept new patients at every given time! If they have too many patients, they can’t give the woman the best care they possibly can.
The fact that many Drs. volunteer there time at PP to donate their time to women who need health care tells you that they can do half a dozen breast exams and pap smears an hour and seeing pregnant women at every PP would be a waste of time and money. Given the fact that OB GYN’s make more money in pre natal care and delivery vs. performing abortions, is it any wonder that PP can’t afford to do pre natal care thru out a pregnancy and they refer them to local ob gyns?
“Danny (son) thanks for the kind words…That wasn’t Rosie tho. I only saw Rosie once from the bus. That was Jill’s friend Fran. She almost cried from surprise when the waiter told us our bill had been “taken care of”…you majorly made her day!”
Sorry for the case of mistaken identity. Glad I made her day, though! Guess even a non-believer can be a Good Samaritan…
Rae, you live in Minnesota. You’re winters are so cold, penguins and polar bears won’t inhabit your state. You live in a cold that no human should live in, and you think it’s NORMAL! That’s not weather, that is, again, an emergency weather condition.
Merry, what year did you find your friend dead from a self induced abortion? Just curious.
Merry, I had asked you this question on another thread, but I never saw an answer. I figured you didn’t see it. I was just curious, because I have never met anyone who knew someone who had died from an illegal abortion.
Merry, why do you keep avoiding this question? I have asked you twice.
Rae..
I have yet to forgive the state myself.
PIP, give me the background on your video. And I’m guessing you’re from Bartlesville?
For Danny:
When I read the Unity song you posted, The abortion war immediately came to my mind. You seem like someone who genuinely cares about unity and peace; why can’t you see that abortion destroys unity and peace as well?
I felt compelled to change a few words of your Unity song to make the point, but really, it shouldn’t be necessary:
“Unity” – By Unborn Baby
There’s a war going down between me and mother tonight,
I don’t want no war going down, going down tonight.
Stop this war
Stop this war
Civilization? Ha! I call it as I see it.
I call it, depravation, you know, I still cannot believe it
Her solution now has gone the way of hate
Her world evolved resolved is now my fate
Stop this war
Stop this war
All so different yeah, I say we’re all the same
Born and Unborn, you know, in the division game.
Self destruction fast impending like suction,
No one can stop it, once inserted, no one can control it.
Stop this war
Stop this war
A final word, wait it is a call to action
We ain’t no blobs of cells, no,
Danny,
Was MK as chatty offline as she is online? You’re a cutie patootie, Danny. Dig the smile and you know it ;-)
Clever, Ellie, clever.
@Danny: You are sorely mistaken. We have insanely hot summers and last year we barely had a foot of snow for the winter. Our winters are becoming more mild and our summers more hot and apparently humid (I had no idea MN was considered humid until a girl from California and a woman from Germany worked in the lab I work in this summer and they both complained about the humidity here!).
@MK: I liked Dorothy too! She was soooo sarcastic, I imagine that I’ll probably end up like her when I’m old. Lol. I hate Blanche as well, not because she was kind of a…”skank”…but because she was so self-centered and what not.
Blah, working in a parking lot booth is so boring…::headdesk::
I saw the “Lake of Fire” documentary at the Philly Film Festival. While an enjoyable experience (we brought a group of young adults – pretty much the only young adults there – and all wore pro-life shirts), I was really disappointed with the flick. I really did not view it as the “ultimate” documentary on abortion. While the philosophical discussion was good, I did not feel represented. Young pro-lifers were not given a voice, and people who are relatively unknown among the movement are given so much time, you are led to believe that they are the vox populi.
Aside from that, there were many errors in the spelling of interviewees’ names. That’s enough to get you fired on “The Apprentice,” and doesn’t lend to the film’s credibility.
Jill,
Why yes, this is my home town. One I was born in, grew up in, and graduated from high school in. Bartlesville, Oklahoma.
Our video was aimed at being an irreverent tip of the hat to our little town while pointing out its obvious flaws.
For example, the (simulated) drug use. Drugs are a big problem there. Apparently it arises out of boredom.
We also wanted to make sure people could make sense of what we were doing but also giving our b’ville friends some jokes that only b’ville residents could truly understand..
And you can probably tell we are sorta sick of the place and find education the best way to get our butts out of there. ;)
Also I”m sorry the quality stinks on youtube. I heard the signs are hard to read because of the pixelization. If you need help deciphering them ask me and I’ll tell you what they say. Also sound quality is a lot worse. I apologize about that, I don’t think there is any way to get this high quality video to be as accessible though. :/
Also feel free to ask more questions!
Merry, why haven’t you answered me? Your story stinks, and I don’t believe you!!! And you complain about truth.
Merry, don’t pee on my leg, and tell me it’s raining!!!! I can spot a liar a mile away!
Merry, if you were being truthful, you would have answered me without hesitation!! I can only conclude that you are lying!
Ellie,
Good rewrite, depending on your stance. Seeing as how Operation Ivy was one of the first bands I ever heard, I’m not happy that you rewrote it nor do I really appreciate it considering that the intent of the song was to raise awareness on racial unity, but I do give you props for having the guts to do it. Just don’t do it again ;-)
Carder,
Ha ha, glad you dig the pic and my smile. I’m not a huge fan of my smile, but then again, everyone’s their own worst critic. As for MK, yes, she was very chatty, and seeing as how I’m a big talker too, we had good conversations. Like I said, she’s my momma.
@Heather: Grow up. Honestly. She probably hasn’t replied to you because a) she’s been busy and hasn’t had time to or b) doesn’t want to reply to you because you are being *very* immature right now. Good grief.
@Danny: You’re just a wimp. :) Minnesota winters are NOTHING. I’ve had colder ones in South Dakota. Now those are brutal winters.
Carder,
Was MK as chatty offline as she is online?
What are you trying to say? I’ve always thought of myself as the strong silent type! ;)
Danny,
If you’re still out there: mystery solved! Its a Ball or Bull python that grows 5-6 feet. Its escaped its cage a few times so now they weigh the lid down with bricks. She said he still tries though.
@ Sorry Rae. That’s the second time. I don’t have to buy it, and I don’t.
MaryKay and Jill, I am soooo jealous. I wish I could have been there to meet you both!
Me too.
Merry, sorry. I see you did answer me. Jill, please feel free to delete my posts.
Pro Choicers are always so mature. Laura is an excellent example. I didn’t see anyone comin down on her. Just taking up for her and her piggish ways!
Danny, I think it’s sweet that you are calling MK “ma.” I love it! I also think it’s great that you could put your differences aside, and you could all come together for a picture.
@Heather: I ignore Laura. I ignore HisMan. I try to ignore Jasper but sometimes I can tolerate reading his posts without wanting to rip out my hair. I also ignore TexasRed and Sally.
Ignoring people is the best way to go about things because a lot of people are what I call feedback junkies, they say a bunch of stuff that may or may not be offensive in order to get responses/reactions out of you.
Rae and Heather,
To be fair, I think Laura and Sally had simply never experienced a pro life site quite like ours.
Laura has been mucho civil as of late and I am enjoying her posts.
Sally and I made peace (of course, then she disappeared)…
I think it takes time to realize that we’re not here just to trade insults which apparently is the case with most of these sites…
I even miss my Cam..
Oh where oh where has my Cameron gone?
Oh where oh where can he be?
With his words so big,
and his posts so long,
Oh where oh where can he be?
MK, LOL!
Mary,
Ah ha! A ball python, huh? They’re great beginner snakes, and amazing escape artists. She must have a different genetic morph if it’s brown and green; they’re naturally brown and tan. Glad to hear it though, Balls used to be one of my favorite things to breed because of their nice temper, and they always sold real well.
Heather,
Arigato! MK is like my momma; she’s even a pain in my @$$ about certain things! Hey, if anyone wants to take a picture with me, I’m always down.
Rae,
I’ve endured a week of SD winter, actually. Those are the suck. Same with Maine winters. I’d rather be stranded in the desert naked with a cactus crammed in my butt than endure another one of those winters.
MK,
You still haven’t answered my question, Mommy McSmokesalot. HOW DID YOU FIND ME IN THE CROWD?!?!
Oh, since it didn’t get posted, here’s the link for the Operation Ivy song that I posted and Ellie butchered.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJUE74i-htQ
Listen to it and enjoi it.
Peace, kats! This crazy man has college packing to do, and a boa constrictor to feed!
Ellie, please…
Don’t butcher Operation Ivy again. I keep reading those lyrics, and you’re making me hate one of my favorite songs…
A sad day indeed…
Danny,
You sent me pictures remember? Plus I had said a prayer that I’d find you and there you were…you look very different than your pictures. You were in you school uniform in them.
Danny,
Thank you. My daughter may have been bluffing me about the color just to shut me up. The darned thing is still trying to escape, nudging the lid of the cage. I told her she better warn me if its escaped before my next visit because mama ain’t showing up until that reptile is found!
Oh jeez, yeah, you’re right. I kinda forgot that I sent you my SJNMA pix. I thought I’d sent you some from the summer that were way more recent.
I guess I did make it pretty obvious, though, considering that Ron, Amanda, and I all stuck out like sore thumbs…
Though I’m disliking my limitation to just this thread, I’m disliking Ellie’s Op Ivy rewrite much more. It ticked off everyone at the Oasis today, and considering we’re all Tim Armstrong/Op Ivy fans, it wasn’t too appreciated.
Do you have any free days this week when I can come annoy you? Oh, and if you can get any pix of us from Jill, let me know. I want to put them in my scrapbook!
This week is pretty solid. I have the baby for most of it…and a pro life meeting on Wednesday, and a meeting with the teachers (to be determined per the pro life meeting…we’re trying to set up a pro-life mass for Respect Life Month), but when did you have in mind?
And while I understand your distress over Ellie’s new lyrics, it is a free country and the lyrics were fitting. Now if she had messed with a James Taylor song and turned it pro-choice, we might have something to talk about…
Seriously tho, free domain and all that…who are these ivy people anyway?
MK, that’s just mean. You’re giving her the ok to mess with my bands, but if she messed with yours, it’d be a travesty? Hypocrisy, my friend, is an ugly thing. Don’t be a hypocrite, because it’s not appealing for you, and seeing as how you’re my momma, I don’t want you being a hypocrite. Besides, the edited lyrics don’t fit the song, free country or not. Yeah, she had the right to edit them, that I cannot dispute. However, disrespecting a song about racial unity by making it a pro-life anthem? Very disrespectful in my eyes. Not kool at all. Besides, now I have to find a James Taylor song and make it pro-choice for a rebuttal…
Now, for a history lesson…
Operation Ivy was a ska punk band that started in 1987 and broke up in 1989. Tim Armstrong and Matt Freeman of Rancid fame played in the band, and they were considered revolutionary for bringing different social issues into the open with their music. “The lyrics and tone of Operation Ivy’s music portray a youthful desire for social justice and a strong distrust of mainstream or conformist culture.” They’re a legend in the punk scene, and considerably famous for becoming so successful in just a two-year reign. I respect Operation Ivy way more than anyone else that I’ve heard, barring the Man in Black, of course.
It’s a two-way road, MK. Ellie has the freedom to rewrite a song for her own views. I have the same rights, do I not? God bless the First Amendment.
MK, that’s just mean. You’re giving her the ok to mess with my bands, but if she messed with yours, it’d be a travesty? Hypocrisy, my friend, is an ugly thing. Don’t be a hypocrite, because it’s not appealing for you, and seeing as how you’re my momma, I don’t want you being a hypocrite
Danny, she was making a joke, silly! :)
…and Ellie’s song really made a good point, IMO.
I don’t think it was disrespectful at all.
Haha, Bethany, you’re always a voice of reason, aren’t you?
In your eyes, maybe, Ellie’s rewrite wasn’t disrespectful. However, it was disrespectful to me and anyone else who supports racial unity. Taking a song that has been used to protest the Darfur and Rwanda genocides, and other forms of race wars, and turning into a song that can be used as a pro-life anthem doesn’t seem very respectful to me.
The rewrite was very well-written. I won’t dispute that, and I give Ellie some credit. However, it didn’t go over well with a lot of the people I showed it to, many of them being huge Op Ivy fans, and even some of the pro-life people I showed it to weren’t happy with it [yes, I do have pro-life friends].
Ellie is entitled to her right to free speech, as well as her right to rewrite the song because I doubt she’s going to pay royalty fees and whatnot to record it. It just irked me to see a song that I love being turned into a pro-life anthem.
This is a pointless debate. I can’t change what she did, and she already wrote the song, so it doesn’t really matter. However, I do have some lyrics here to combat Ellie’s. Let’s see how they go over.
“Open Your Eyes” – Baby born to a drug addict single mom
Open your eyes
To the millions of lies
That they tell you everyday
Open your mind
To the clever disguise
That the Christians have to say
How do they know
What’s good for you?
Wake up, wake up, whoa
Wake up, wake up, whoa
Dope has messed up my head
I wish I was dead
Will you wake up, wake up, whoa
Ignore all the men
And save who you can
Just to make awareness rise
Sell you from birth
For all that you’re worth
Cause Mom’s addiction that she hides
And how do they know
What’s good for you?
Wake up, wake up, whoa
Wake up, wake up, whoa
Mom’s screwed in the head
I’m better off dead
Will you wake up, wake up, whoa
Don’t wanna hate you
Don’t wanna blame it all on you
I’m out of options
If you don’t look I’ll force you to
If you don’t look I’ll force you to
If you don’t look.. I’ll force you to
Wake up, wake up, whoa
Wake up, wake up, whoa
I’ve been born I’m not dead
But Mom can’t keep me fed
Will you wake up, wake up, whoa
Open your eyes…
Open your eye
That’s very beautiful, Danny. Why would you assume the baby is better off dead, and not better off placed in the arms of another family who will be willing to love and care for her?
In your eyes, maybe, Ellie’s rewrite wasn’t disrespectful. However, it was disrespectful to me and anyone else who supports racial unity.
Can you tell me what exactly you found offensive about it? Not a vague idea, but specifically what it is that you find incorrect or disrespectful about the actual message.
Danny, since it seems to be racial issues that are your main concern…
Considering what you wrote about the baby, and the suffering the baby was going through- your response was that the baby was “better off dead”, correct?
Do you believe that a slave who was being mistreated or abused by his master would have been “better off dead”?
Or….do you think he was better off *free*?
Sorry for the multitude of posts. lol I meant to onl post one and then more thoughts came to mind.
Bethany,
You make a good point. However, there are some women out there who have children and are horrible mothers. In turn, the child grows up not knowing true motherly love and what a family should be like. Hell, ask Erin about it, she’ll know more than I would, but with the adoption system in America, more children float around the system, or end up in Foster care and have a multitude of problems that could’ve been avoided. This makes me sound callous, I know, but I think not living at all would be better than the alternative.
Listen to In The Ghetto by Elvis Presley. That says a lot too.
OOH! Another thought. I met a kid back when I was a counselor for a wilderness adventure camp that took inner city kids to places like southern Illinois, Kentucky, South Dakota, etc, to go rafting, rock climbing, hiking, camping, etc. A few of those kids were orphans who had been placed in foster care because their mothers gave them up for adoption at birth. They didn’t have loving families, and were some of the hardest kids I’ve ever met, and most of them were barely teenagers. One of them ended up in juvenile detention, and later prison, a few years later, and when I asked him about his feelings on it, all he said was that he wished he was dead! Why should he have to live a life like that? He didn’t ask for it. Someone else decided his fate for him, and now he won’t be out until he’s at least 30.
I’m not saying all abortion is good. You know my stance, and how I feel about abortion. I’d rather abortion be used as a last resort, and not a form of birth control.
I feel like I’m either talking in circles, or just making confusing statements. Do you follow what I’m getting at?
Bethany, you know, you, MK, everyone interested could plan to come to DC for the March in January. I got us a free room, one block from the White House.
I would love to meet up for that! Very important day!!
Danny, it seems that you’re talking to the wrong person, because if anyone knows what it’s like to live in a very terrible situation (not physically, necessarily, but extremely emotionally and psychologically destructive) at home as a child, it is me.
My life was not easy, at all, and yet I wanted to live. I wanted to find my way out of my home, so that I would find the love I so craved. Yet, I had to go through years of suffering before that could happen. Yet, I stuck through it all and am thankful I did! Why do you assume that everyone who suffers desires to die? I know that I certainly didn’t.
While I understand where you are coming from, you need to really look at the world in a different light.
Look at people who have overcome their obstacles, instead of caving in and saying well, life isn’t worth living anymore because I am suffering now. It is actually the people who have suffered the most, who have made the biggest marks on the world and who have accomplished the most for society.
Just because you personally would not necessarily want to continue living if you had suffered abuse or neglect in life, doesn’t mean that every other individual on earth has the same feelings. And the answer, in my opinoin , would not to be to prove to them that they really were as worthless as they imagined they were, by killing them. The answer would be to love these people, cherish these people, show them the love that they are not receiving at home. Give them what they need, don’t treat them badly because they already feel worthless. We cannot help the fact that there will be bad people on this earth who will not treat their children right…but if we are not part of the solution, we are part of the problem. Killing them is not the solution. Loving them is.
Every person has inherent value.
Without love we have nothing.
Jill I am going to pester my hubby BIG time cause I want to go!
One of them ended up in juvenile detention, and later prison, a few years later, and when I asked him about his feelings on it, all he said was that he wished he was dead!
I bet all he needed was someone to really care about him and give him the love that he so craved during his lifetime. If one really wanted to help him, they would spend time with them, showing this young man that they felt he was worth something, by their actions. Not by feeling pseudo compassion, and believing that it really would be better for him to be dead. If he could feel like someone actually loved him, he would most likely change, and his life would turn around dramatically.
Many times when one says “I want to die” they don’t really mean it. What they really mean is, “I wish someone cared!”
Jill, what days in January?
Bethany,
“Why do you assume that everyone who suffers desires to die? I know that I certainly didn’t.”
Same here, I think I appreciate life more because of the suffering and I can also empathize with others because of it.
Rosie, excellent..that is exactly how I feel!
I think it’s January 23rd. The anniversary of Roe v. Wade.
Rosie, you know (just thinking out loud) if everyone who went through suffering was done away with, then we wouldn’t really have very many left on the planet after it was over, would we? We’d probably be extinct.
I don’t really think I know anyone who hasn’t gone through some type of suffering in their life. Unfortunately, suffering is a part of life.
The most inspirational people I know of are the ones who find a way to turn their negative experiences into positive ones.
Thanks, Heather!
Ok Bethany, onto the other questions,
“Do you believe that a slave who was being mistreated or abused by his master would have been “better off dead”?
Or….do you think he was better off *free*?”
Here, you’re comparing two different subjects. The fetus isn’t being mistreated over a long period of time, or forced to do something against its will. Slaves were forced into slavery, sold and auctioned off like livestock, and beaten for literally anything. No one does that to a fetus that doesn’t have conscious thought. Comparing apples to oranges = no argument.
As for the song… What offended me was the sheer fact of taking a song that’s promoting racial unity and using to further the pro-life/pro-choice debate. Were this public, or were it being performed, I guaruntee there would be a full-scale riot, considering that Operation Ivy is not only legendary, but one of the most influential ska-punk bands in history of punk. They brought social issues to the light that most people had never thought about, and helped stop a lot of major racism in America. Now, if you want me to dissect this song bit by bit, I can do that, too, but keep an open mind on this one, and try to see this from my perspective.
“Unity” – By Unborn Baby
There’s a war going down between me and mother tonight
[There’s no war going on. None. That fetus can’t wage war. It doesn’t have conscious thought. Furthermore, if said fetus was waging war, I doubt we’d have a pro-life/pro-choice debate!]
Civilization? Ha! I call it as I see it.
I call it, depravation, you know, I still cannot believe it
[Calling it as they see it, huh? They can’t see anything other than placenta and amniotic fluid. Also, depravation of what? So far, they’re getting provided with everything they need.]
Her solution now has gone the way of hate
Her world evolved resolved is now my fate
[Hate? I don’t think there’s hate involved with abortion. I’ve met a lot of women who’ve had abortions that didn’t hate their unborn. They had a choice to make, and for their own sanity and personal health, they took it. One of my friends was pregnant and was advised to get an abortion because if she didn’t, she could’ve died. She was 17. You’re telling me you’d rather have my friend die while she’s that young?]
All so different yeah, I say we’re all the same
Born and Unborn, you know, in the division game.
[All so different? Where are we different? Fetii haven’t really anything that seperates them from anything else. They’re fetii, just like all other fetii on the planet.]
Self destruction fast impending like suction,
No one can stop it, once inserted, no one can control it.
[Mother has a choice whether or not she gets an abortion. She can stop at anytime, even right before the procedure.]
A final word, wait it is a call to action
We ain’t no blobs of cells, no,
Here, you’re comparing two different subjects. The fetus isn’t being mistreated over a long period of time, or forced to do something against its will. Slaves were forced into slavery, sold and auctioned off like livestock, and beaten for literally anything. No one does that to a fetus that doesn’t have conscious thought. Comparing apples to oranges = no argument.
No, not apples to oranges, Danny. If you’ll look back, you’ll see I was comparing a baby born to a drug addict mother, to a slave.
As the baby has to suffer through the agony and neglect of a drug addict mother, a slave had to endure the sufferings of being a slave.
Were slaves better off dead, as the baby you mentioned was ‘better off dead’?
Ah, I missed that.
Gotta point. Slave was better off free than dead.
Ah, I missed that.
Gotta point. Slave was better off free than dead.
Aww Danny, yay! :) Can I hug you now?
Danny,
“The fetus isn’t being mistreated over a long period of time, or forced to do something against its will.”
He or she is being forced to die against his or her will. There’s a video called “The silent scream”, in it is a 14 week baby being aborted, it literally is trying to move away from the instrument that is used to rip it apart, and the kid is screaming.
Bethany, I’d rather no hugs. I’m in a bit of a bad state right now, and a comment that was made earlier kinda set me off. I don’t want to make an @$$ of myself and blow up on the board, so yeah.
Rosie,
Lots of things are forced to die against their will. My buddy Rob, who I have a memorial service for tomorrow, died against his will. That’s life. Get over it.
PS Someone tell Heather that her little comment about pro-choice men pi$$ed me off, and that she needs to get on this thread and make some amends. She was outta line!
Typical pro abort male. Doug, men like you benefit from abortion! No wedding vows, no child support, no commitment. No responsibility at all.
Posted by: Heather at August 27, 2007 8:03 PM
Heather, seriously, you better say something good before I do lose control and get myself banned permanently. As a post-abort father, I take serious offense to that, and you are way out of line on this one.
Bethany, I’d rather no hugs. I’m in a bit of a bad state right now, and a comment that was made earlier kinda set me off. I don’t want to make an @$$ of myself and blow up on the board, so yeah.
I just realized that you take things very literally, when they’re not intended to be. You have done this many times, and I think it might be due to the fact that you can’t detect the tone in our voice when we say things. When I said that, I I meant a metaphorical hug. As in, I’m thankful that we reached a point of agreement. Not a literal hug, or that we’re best buds now. lol
Lots of things are forced to die against their will. My buddy Rob, who I have a memorial service for tomorrow, died against his will. That’s life. Get over it.
First and foremost, I am deeply sorry that your friend has passed away. I know you must be struggling through a lot right now.
Secondly, I have to ask… why do you suppose your suffering any more validated than our suffering? Why are we not allowed to suffer and then express our feelings about it, but you are? We have to watch innocent babies die every day..don’t you think that hurts us? We are helpless to save them…but you are angry with us because your friend died? Don’t you think your anger is a bit misplaced?
How is it the fault of anyone here?
I understand that you are in deep sorrow and grief from your loss, and I am sorry for that, and I empathize with your loss. However, please put your feelings in perspective. It is not the fault of anyone here. I don’t even think anyone was even aware you had a friend who died. Can we read minds? Of course not, Danny. Try to see it from another viewpoint.
That said, once again, my deepest sympathies for you, and the family of your friend.
Heather, seriously, you better say something good before I do lose control and get myself banned permanently. As a post-abort father, I take serious offense to that, and you are way out of line on this one.
Danny, specifically what did she say that was incorrect?
Yes, Danny, do tell?
That’s serious bullcrap that pro-choice men get off easy. Considering that I’m a post-abortion father, I take serious offense to that.
I’ve expressed before that had circumstances been different, I would’ve much rather gone for adoption or kept the child and raised it as my own. I might not have money, and I might not be the best person, but I would’ve shown that child the love it deserved and done my very best to support it. I would’ve been honorable and married the woman who was bearing my child, and had it come down to it, I would’ve paid child support.
I’m not a fan of abortion. I’ve been through it, but I am in no way a fan of it. I’d rather explore alternative options, and would rather leave abortion as a last resort. Like I said, I wish that what happened hadn’t happened, but I can’t change that. However, that doesn’t give Heather any right to make a blanket statement about pro-choice men. You guys want to make me out to be someone I’m not, good for you, and good riddance.
Keep in mind that I could’ve booked it and left Erin to deal with it on her own. I did what any honorable man would do. I stuck around, I supported her in every way possible, and did my best to deal with the situation. If that makes me a bad person, then I guess I’ll take my leave of you people and go lead my life of sin.
You happy now?
OK, I can’t take it. Just…can’t take it.
Are you going to tell them how you told me repeatedly that you were sterile, Dan?
You would have married me? That’s a two-way thing. You would have married me just because I was pregnant? That’s a happy start to a family.
Post-abortive father? You were never a father. I was never a mother. It was a fetus. Oh, and how about you tell them that when we found out you were such a wreck that I had to spend my time talking you down instead of being able to personally deal with the fact that I was harboring a fetus. Tell them how you were a big tough skinhead when we found out.
You’re on here still because you like to grub for sympathy and you can find it here. I’m sick of it. If people want to keep in touch with me,
eobrock1@student.gsu.edu
Have fun, Dan. Eventually, they won’t want to take your nonsense either, and you’ll find somewhere else to spread it. I love the people here, and I love the debate, but I can find other places for that. Obviously, your needs can’t be satisfied anywhere else.
Sorry to be nasty guys, really, but this has kind of been building and building. As a personal favor, please don’t use this as an ‘example’ of what happens when couples abort. This is raw enough as it is, and I don’t want to be used as fuel for a political agenda. I mean it.
Much love, PL and PC alike.
I was TOLD BY DOCTORS that I WAS STERILE. It was my fault for believing them and not being more careful. Yeah, I did freak out. I was scared. I pretty sure I’m entitled to be scared in that situation, and you freaked out too, as I recall, and took off to talk to a friend to have them talk you down, as well.
Technically, we were parents, and yes, I would’ve married you, or like I stated, paid child support. I would’ve helped out in any way that I could, so DON’T EVER tell me what I would and wouldn’t do.
I’m not taking the bait on this one, Erin. I already told Jill I was off the site once this thread died down, in person. Chill.
Post Scriptum:
I don’t know how you feel about the whole ordeal, but I have regrets and wish things would’ve gone a different direction. I supported the decision, but I also am entitled to my regrets.
To each their own.
All right, Danny. Time to go. No more posts. Don’t make me sit here all night. Buck up, be strong, and walk away. MK has your address and will keep in touch with you.
Danny, I just found the following website tonight. It is the place for you:
http://www.lifeissues.org/men/MAN/index.html
Danny, this site is Erin’s territory. We’re part of the property division, and Erin gets us.
Erin, I’m sorry. This one was my fault. I posted the photo of us, and it reopened the door. It won’t happen again. None of us want you to leave. I don’t want you to leave. Please don’t.
*sigh* I’m sorry, Jill. I don’t know what got into me, I just kind of snapped. I’m almost never confrontational. That won’t happen from me again either. I apologize.
Oy, this is a great way to spend the first few minutes of my birthday, in tears in front of my computer. I think I need a day off.
Your birthday?! Oh, happy birthday, Erin. And if you’ll notice, you snapped before the day began, even on EST. You were just snapping off the old. It’s a new day, a new year, Erin.
Danny. now you are trying to control my input? It was directed @ Doug anyway. Sorry if you were offended ….yeesh.
@ Erin, don’t cry, and happy birthday! It appears that Danny has gone. *deep breath*
I feel like I’m either talking in circles, or just making confusing statements.
Posted by: Danny at August 27, 2007 6:50 PM
____________________
We finally agree on something.
Erin, my brother and you share the same b/day.