Life Chains this Sunday
This Sunday afternoon, October 7, hundreds of Life Chains will be held for the 20th year across the United States and Canada.
Life Chain is a peaceful, prayerful public witness of pro-lifers standing for 1 hour praying for an end to abortion. It is a visual of solidarity by the Christian community that abortion kills children.
For a list of places and times go here.
Life Chains offer an easy, quick way to become involved in pro-life activism. Please participate in a Life Chain near you this Sunday.
Oct.06, 2007 6:03 am |
Apologetics |
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
According to the Republican Majority for Choice, “our own polling found that 72 percent of self-identified Republicans believe that the government should not play a role in controlling family planning choices for women. ”
(Hat tip: NYTimes).
Jill,
Just to let you know, in my neck of the woods, Ontario, Canada, our LIfe Chain was last week, cuz it’s our Thanksgiving up here in the land of the moose!
Our parish priest told us that at last years Life Chain, a young couple who were contemplating an abortion, drove by the chain and decided against it. They now have a baby instead of three broken lives. WE don’t get much of a turnout here, but it shows that even 10 or 15 people in a small city (90,000 souls) can make a difference.
God Bless,
I found a place near me. I’m going.
ABORTION
Principled Choice: Contractors Boycott Abortion Clinic
By Lee Webb
CWNews
July 30, 2004
CWNews.org ? In January, we told you about a group of pro-life building contractors in Austin, Texas, who are trying to slow construction of an abortion clinic. Since then, they’ve had some success, and some setbacks. One man who took a bold stand, saw God back him up.
Austin, Texas has become a major battleground in the abortion debate. A self-proclaimed liberal college town, the capital of Texas is one of the only cities that funds abortions with public funds. It’s also a thriving New Age center and used to be the headquarters of famous atheist Madalyn Murray O’Hare.
It’s a tough town for anyone to take a stand against abortion. But remarkably a group of Austin-area construction company owners, led by Chris Danze, did take a stand.
Chris Danze said, “I think Texans, when they see evil, well, some Texans are willing to stand up and fight it and are not worried about what people in the media think, or people in the Northeast think or the power people think.”
Danze owns his own construction company in Austin and has been active in the pro-life movement for years. In the fall of 2003, he contacted his closest associates in the construction business and asked them to boycott the abortion project – a new Planned Parenthood facility being built in Austin.
He explained, “Anyone who worked on the project was participating in abortion – even if it was indirectly.”
Soon all the area construction companies pulled out of the multi-million dollar project. The lot sat vacant for months-until January when a company called Rainbow Concrete broke the boycott.
Mark Hamilton, former Vice President of Rainbow said, “Word came down from upper management that we were going to go supply it. And the die was cast, was the word they used.”
So, the concrete slab for the clinic was poured. Not during the day, but in the middle of the night. Hamilton said, “I just didn’t think it was the right thing to do. We had previously talked, six months earlier, about not doing that-and everybody agreed to it.”
Hamilton quit his job over the decision. He was disappointed that his company would “sell out” to what he says was “political pressure to break the boycott.”
Resigning was a tough decision with a family to support.
Hamilton said, “We were a little concerned, but we felt like we needed to keep the faith.”
Yet, Hamilton wasn’t out of work long. The day he resigned, another company called and offered him a job, not knowing the sacrifice Hamilton had just made.
Hamilton said, “I think it stems from my upbringing as a Catholic and as a Christian that the taking of innocent life is not right under any circumstance.”
Danze said of Hamilton, “He set an example and set a standard for people nationwide to resist the evil of the abortion industry.”
Even so, the boycott crumbled. Now construction companies go in and out of the building site every day.
Danze said, “We’ve had churches tell us that they will not use these companies that are working on the project. And they have indicated they want the list, when the project is finished. And many, many individuals have called me and asked me for the list. And they’ve told me they want to work with pro-life contractors and pro-life suppliers, pro-family suppliers.”
Many construction companies actually working on the building have concealed the name of their companies on their trucks-to avoid being associated with the abortion project. Now the building is only a few months from completion, but Danze’s says the boycott didn’t fail.
Danze said, “No. Not at all. Not at all. We, the boycott group, said ‘We’re going to stop it, slow it down, and make it more expensive.’ We’ve done all those things. So, no, never be discouraged.”
Carol Everett, the CEO of the Heidi Group, a pro-life organization based just outside of Austin admires what Danze did.
Everett said, “What Chris did was different. Because he used his own sphere of influence. And I believe, if we could export this and everyone started to look at their sphere of influence, it could have a profound effect on the opening of Planned Parenthood clinics.”
Danze believes the construction boycott will have a long-lasting effect on Austin. His pro-life construction team plans to continue to thwart new abortion clinics from going up.
He ended saying, “We are obligated as Christians to speak the truth. Even if we’re a lone voice crying in the wilderness, we still have that responsibility. And then God will take care of the victories and the successes.”
A pro-life company has recently taken over Rainbow Concrete and pulled it off the abortion project. But Planned Parenthood still says its abortion clinic will open this fall.
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Here is a great post for the day!
Oh boy, Heather’s back. Now we can look forward to more stupid commentary.
Heather, I thought you said you weren’t coming back!
SOMG, only for a day. Why don’t you get smart? You WISH I wasn’t. As long as Jill allows me to, I’ll be back
Somg, I must be doing something right if I’m getting under your skin. I love it! *I am smiling from ear to ear right now*
Heather, I’m glad to see you back.
Somg said, “We have volunteers in the recovery room at PP.” Q: Are these people trained? A: No, they don’t have to be. Q: Are they med. students? A: Well yes, well no, well, I’m not sure. DUH!!! In other words, you make things up as you go. Now that I know that you WANT me gone, I am staying, and I’m calling you out on everything you say. Try to back it up from now on! I’ll be asking you a lot of questions.
Thank you Library Betty. It’s so nice to meet you! I really did think about a break for a while, but rather than to call Jill’s blog an “addiction”, I think of it as a “calling.” We all have to stick together and allow the lord to use us as he wishes. I’m no wimp, and while abortion might be legal, we don’t have to stop fighting it! They may treat me badly, but it’s not even a fraction of what they are doing to our unborn children. I’m here for them!
Being called stupid is mild when you think about unborn children being cut to pieces, torn apart, burned, and tortured. We even leave them on shelves to die. I can’t wimp out on those babies!
Heather —
I had notice before that some people really liked to push your buttons. It shows that they are threatened by you and can’t meet you in discussion, only confrontation.
I don’t post much, I just try to monitor and jump in every once and a while.
It does seem that many of the Pro-Abortion people are extremely negative and really seek to shake up the Pro-Lifers. That’s okay, they are reading this blog and probably learning alot. Abortion is a negative act, which creates negative energy. As much as they strike out, it’s ineffective. Darkness can not defeat light.
Heather, hang in there and don’t let the Pro-Abortion folks spread their negativity to you or depress you in any way. They prey on weakness, and you are not weak — you know that.
Library Betty, why thank you for those kind and positive words! Glad to have you on our side!
Donald Trump commented “Elisabeth Hasselbeck is one of the dumbest women on TV.”…..This is coming from a man who can’t find a comb.
Heather,
I think it’s a blessing to see your posts on this site!!! Jesus said that “they will hate you because of me”. Don’t feel bad, though…just keep standing firm in the Lord! And you’re not alone! Things are getting pretty heated at the vigil at the Aurora mill….(especially on Friday & Saturday nights!) In fact, during the day, the employees there (including security) are really getting shaken up by our presence…you can see the hate & fire spewing from their eyes & mouths!!! Praise the Lord!!!!
PL Laura, Good morning. I said those very words to myself! What good is leaving going to do? I’m on the winning team. You are too.
Maybe we need to place importance on motherhood and family values. Young girls see plenty of examples of sexuality to emulate and chastity is a word seldom heard.
Sex is emphasized everywhere you look, and attracting the opposite sex is foremost in a lot of girls mind. And then of course, they have to figure out how to ?keep the guy.? Motherhood is something they figure will happen at the end. Since marriage is not as popular or necessary for a sexual relationship, girls are desperate to find a means to maintain a relationship. Men do not have to commit to a relationship because sex is so readily available. Everyone has suffered the consequences of the freedom of our modern day thinking. The family as we once knew it has disintegrated. The one thing that hasn?t changed, babies are created from these uncertain relationships which noone wants to take responsibility for.
Casual sex is at the root of the problem. If girls were taught to value themselves more, maybe they wouldn?t be giving their bodies to just anyone. Lack of self esteem in young girls is more rampant than ever. If ?freedom of choice? is so popular, why do women feel so badly about theselves? We have created a ?no boundaries mentality,?
and as a result the respect for women no longer exists.
Although women should have the same rights as men, the feminist movement has reduced our society to a degregation of women, motherhood and family in general.
Now, anything goes! Women have bought into the idea.
They don?t seem to know any better today; that their bodies are a temple of God, bought and paid for with the price of Jesus blood. Most would laugh at that. How can men respect women when they so easily succumb to easy sex and abortion on demand. Men have no reason to get married, and they especially don?t want the responsibility of a child from a casual sexual experience. The babies suffer the consequences of our immorality. If people feel they must engage in this lifestyle, they need to make sure they do not conceive a life. Babies should not be punished for the irresponsibility of our actions. Yes, I do believe we are becoming less patient and understanding of mothers who give their bodies over for illicit sex and then to the abortionist. The issue is that sex is so exalted in our world and the importance of motherhood and family is devalued. The emphasis should be on teaching young girls that they are special and worthy of being treated with respect. To provide birth control and assume that all girls are going to have sex, only promotes the idea that they are already devalued and it is permissable for the guys to go ahead and use them for the only thing they are worth. Sex without commitment only leaves women feeling alone and insecure, no matter what their age. Committment is the basis for conceiving a child. There is none, so that?s why we have abortion. Abortion is only the result of our years of conditioning that women should enjoy the same sexual freedom as men, and men have taken advantage of that. How is it that women have aquired the idea that a man is more important than a baby? Have you ever noticed how they actually ?run? into the abortion clinic? Often the man drives off and comes back after it is all over! I presume all she is thinking of, is ?getting back to her lifestyle, uninterrupted.? Promotion of better self esteem in girls should be part of the sex education received. Recognition of basic family values and the importance of motherhood needs to be emphasized. If one so chooses to indulge in premarital sex, use contraception. Why not? It?s better than abortion!
Heather, I second what Library Betty and PL Laura said. Good to “see” you are back.
I found this post on another PL site. It was written by a nurse. I think that most pro lifers will agree with it. Except for the part about contraception. However, I thought it was an excellent post!! Isn’t this what abortion is all about? These feminists have it backwards. Abortion doesn’t empower women at all. It enables her to get back to her dysfunctional lifestyle. That’s it! Abortion hurts women!
Carrie, thank you. Are you PL or PC? So many new people here. BTW, Nice to meet you.
Agreed Heahter. Abortion does hurt women. Not only born women, but unborn women also. In India and China to name a few, unborn women are targeted for sex-selective abortions. The male to female ratio has gotten so bad in some areas that China is considering outlawing sex-selective abortions. I really don’t see how a woman can call herself a feminist if she supports abortion, just my opinion.
Heather, I am prolife. I used to be prochoice up until 4 years ago. My change of heart was a gradual process. I just started becoming actively involved in the prolife movement this summer. I live in MA which is probably one of the most prochoice states in the nation so it is an uphill battle. I have a son with disabilities so that’s what really spured me into action.
Thank you, Carrie. I know several post abortive women, but I have never heard any of them say that the experience “empowered” them. I was looking at some of the PC signs from the DC death march. This older lady was holding up a sign that read “IF MEN COULD GET PREGNANT YOU COULD GET AN ABORTION AT WALMART.” Is this statement confusing to anyone? That’s just so stupid. Men will never get pregnant. Would abortion be any less tragic if men could have them?
Carrie, I used to be PC too.
Hi heather,
great to have you home again!!!!!!!!!!! {{{HUGS}}}
http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2007/oct/07100510.html
John, I love you!! [[hugs back]] I gave you 2 thumbs up in your post about wealth!!!
Carrie, God bless you and your son! It will be okay. You must be a really special mom!
John, thanks for the link.
Thanks, Heather. My son is doing pretty good right now. I found a great program for him. He is thriving like never before. It has been a struggle, but so worth it. Many people say to me that “I could never do what you do.” I always tell them that you never know what you can do until you are called to do it.
SOMG, 7:50am
If you think the government should stay out of family planning decisions, then would you agree that the government shouldn’t be subsidizing Planned Parenthood or paying for medicaid abortions? I’ve noticed abortion advocates howl about the government staying out of these decisions, that is until the time comes to foot the bill. Then listen to them squawk when the government tries to stay out of it.
Heather,
Welcome back! Concerning Donald Trump. A man who stepped into the sandbox with Rosie O’Donnell is questioning someone else’s intelligence?
Mary, Trump could have risen above that cat fight. There is a man who can dish it out, but he sure can’t take it. Great points to SOMG.
Carrie,
Sex selection abortions take place here in the United States as well. According to an article I read in 1982, already 4 out of 5 of the fetuses aborted for sex selection purposes in the United States were female. With ultrasound now so easily available, unlike then, one can only guess as to what extent this practice continues.
How ironic that abortion ends up relegating women to a second choice second class status.
I remember a contributing writer in a news magazine exposing this practice in India many years ago. The magazine had to point out the writer was Roman Catholic. So what? Did that change the facts? I wrote the magazine questioning this since I had never seen a writer’s religous or non-religious beliefs mentioned and this was an obvious attempt to prejudice readers. The media biased? nahhhhh.
About your son, my heart goes out to you and I wish you every success with him. People ask me also how I cope with a mentally ill daughter who has virtually disappeared. We just cope because we have to, right Carrie? I think we both realize too that there are people coping with much worse. My best to you and your son.
Mary and Carrie, My heart goes out to both of you. Everyone I know is coping with something or another, myself included. As they say, That’s life. My best wishes to both of you.
Heather,
Thank you for your kind words. As its often said, we all have our crosses to bear.
In a town near me a beautiful, vibrant young woman about to graduate from high school and with plans to join the military, then attend college and become a lawyer, was struck by a drunk driver as she was walking on the side of the road and was totally paralyzed. She is respirator dependent.
I look at her and her remarkable family, I can’t even fathom their devastation, not to mention hers, who can do little else but cope, and quickly dispense with any self pity!
In fact my heart goes out to the driver as well. He did something stupid, like we all have at sometime or another only we “got away with it”, and I can’t even imagine living with what that man does. He no doubt figured he could safely drive the short distance from the bar to his home. He is a local respectable businessman. I do NOT excuse his driving drunk.
Mary, I see it your way. I always try to look at things from every angle. That man will have to live with his guilt. What an unfortunate situation for all involved.
SoMG said, “According to the Republican Majority for Choice, “our own polling found that 72 percent of self-identified Republicans believe that the government should not play a role in controlling family planning choices for women.” ”
Hahaha, oh no you didn’t. Thanks for the laugh, chief. Yes, according to a pro-abortion Republican group, the vast majority of Republicans are pro-abortion. That’s why every other poll since 1973 indicates differently.
Tell me, do the Catholics for Abortion say that most Catholic support abortion? I wonder if there’s a group called Pro-Lifers for Abortion? If there is, I bet their own polling tells them that most pro-lifers are in favor of abortion.
John —
Excellent points — phony group alert. Most of these types of groups exist on paper only.
John and Library Betty, how true!
Mary, I did not know that sex selective abortions occured so frequently in the United States. How frightening. I am not surprised that the feminists who support abortion are not up in arms over this. In my opinion, they choose to put blinders on as to how much abortion devalues women. Unborn women are a silent constituency so it up to us to speak for them. Same goes for unborn men.
SoMG said, “According to the Republican Majority for Choice, “our own polling found that 72 percent of self-identified Republicans believe that the government should not play a role in controlling family planning choices for women.” ”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I don’t doubt it.
Abortion doesn’t even crack the top ten list of issues Americans care about, and the only pro-choice Republican presidential candidate is leading by a wide margin over his pro-life rivals.
Mary, you wrote: “If you think the government should stay out of family planning decisions, then would you agree that the government shouldn’t be subsidizing Planned Parenthood or paying for medicaid abortions? ”
But you see, the government pays LESS because of government-subsidized abortion. Government-subsidized abortion for indigent women saves many times more than it costs. Women who cannot pay for their abortions also cannot pay for their obstetric care (labor and delivery). Eventually the cost of that care gets passed on to the rest of us, mostly through the government (also through higher premiums and general health-care costs).
So the question isn’t, as you say, should we be paying for abortions. The question is, should we be paying for the increased costs associated with NOT paying for abortions? How much would you personally be willing to pay extra to the tax man, in order to cover the costs of a right-to-life policy? How much are you willing to see your health-insurance premiums go up to cover the expense of right-to-lifism?
Carrie, me neither. That’s awful.
Mary, my heart goes out to you also.
How much does the government pay out to treat botched abortion patients? How about abortion patients who have contracted HIV or other diseases?
Botched abortions are NOT rare events.
Heather knows better than the AMA and ACOG.
UPDATE: Botched Abortion Victim Sues Troubled NJ Abortion Mill
Suit claims Abortionists Keith Gresham and Nicholas Kotopoulos, provided ?negligent, careless and reckless care.?
Newark, NJ ? Twenty-year old Rasheedah Dinkins went to Metropolitan Medical Associates on January 27, for what she thought would be a routine abortion in her 15th week of pregnancy. Later that day, Rasheedah collapsed in her home. Family members summoned an ambulance to transport her to Newark Beth Israel Medical Center where she slipped into a coma lasting four weeks. When she awoke, Rasheedah learned that she had suffered massive blood loss, two strokes, a collapsed lung, neurological damage, and the removal of her uterus. She finally regained her ability to speak on Tuesday.
Rasheedah is still hospitalized in the critical care unit, recovering from the botched abortion that nearly cost her her life along with that of the last child she will ever bear. It is an act she now regrets.
Rasheedah is now suing Metropolitan Medical Associates, a clinic affiliated with the National Abortion Federation (NAF), and the two abortionists who treated her. In a complaint filed on Wednesday, she claims that abortionists Keith Gresham and Nicholas Kotopoulos, provided ?negligent, careless and reckless care.?
Metropolitan Medical Center was closed by the New Jersey Department of Health and Senior Services over the weekend after an investigation that was prompted when a hospital worker reported Rasheedah?s botched abortion. It had also been closed in 1993, after a 20-year old college student died during an abortion from a perforated uterus.
?Rasheedah showed remarkable courage in first being willing to admit that she should not have had the abortion, and second in her willingness to publicly discuss what happened to her,? said Operation Rescue President Troy Newman. ?We pray her lawsuit succeeds in helping to permanently closed this high-volume child-killing center.?
?We know that unfortunately, Rasheedah?s tragedy is not unique. We urge other women who have been injured at this and any other abortion mill to come forward and report their stories to their local authorities,? said Newman. ?The abortion industry is a predatory one, and the so-called standards that groups like the NAF impose on themselves are a joke. As long as women remain silent, they will continue to subject women to shoddy, dangerous conditions and substandard care. Now is the time to speak out to prevent other women from making the same tragic decision
Also MMWR.
Did this woman pay out of her own pocket for all of these medical expenses? Did she pay cash for her rehab?
A sample of one.
Mississippi Abortion Practitioner Who Botched Abortions Suspended Email this article
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by Maria Vitale Gallagher
LifeNews.com Staff Writer
March 21, 2005
Jackson, MS (LifeNews.com) — A Mississippi abortion practitioner whose patients suffered damaging and even deadly complications has been suspended indefinitely by the state medical board. The suspension of Dr. Malachy Dehenre came after he testified that he did not like performing some 35,000 abortions but did so because he needed the work.
?I ask your forgiveness,? said the 54-year-old Dehenre. “I don’t want to be an outcast. I want to be among the medical community.”
Dehenre has been under temporary suspension since August. He had performed abortions at the New Woman Medical Center in Jackson and the facility closed following his suspension.
In December, an Alabama medical board found Dehenre guilty of gross malpractice in four abortions. In one case, a woman died 18 hours after having an abortion. The women involved in the other three cases had to have hysterectomies to stop massive hemorrhaging from uterine perforations.
During his testimony, Dehenre stated, “I found work in Jackson, and it happened to be an abortion clinic in which an obstetrician was needed. I needed money to pay expenses and education for my children. It was supposed to be temporary, but it turned out to be longer. I was in a position I didn’t want to be in, but I needed work.”
In the case involving a death, Dehenre admitted he should have met the patient at the hospital or relayed medical information to the doctor who treated her.
“We hope to hear from you at a later date when you get things straight in Alabama,” Mississippi board president Dr. Dewitt G. Crawford of Louisville told Dehenre.
Dehenre will have to regain his license in Alabama before he can seek reinstatement in Mississippi. The Alabama suspension will last at least one year.
Pat Cartrette, executive director of Pro-Life Mississippi, told the press, “I am pleased that the board made the right decision. … What they did will keep women safe in Mississippi.”
In a statement issued last year, Pro-Life Mississippi said Dehenre ?is now being held accountable for the injuries and death to women at abortion clinics and we thank God that both women and their unborn babies are now safe from this abortionist.?
Related web sites:
Pro-Life Mississippi – http://www.prolifemississippi.org
For each one like her, there’s more than ten who die in childbirth.
Woman Wins Botched Abortion Lawsuit vs. Planned Parenthood
Source: San Francisco Examiner; February 24, 2001
San Francisco, CA — A woman who remained pregnant following a botched
abortion three years ago has been awarded $672,610 from Planned
Parenthood. As the court clerk read the jury’s award Wednesday, the woman,
whose unborn child lost two limbs in the abortion attempt before being
aborted months later, lowered her head and wept, convinced her three-year
court battle was finally over.
And it is, but only for now. An attorney for Planned Parenthood Golden
Gate, which oversees nine abortion facilities in the Bay Area, vowed to
appeal the award. “It’s definitely going to be appealed,” Lynn Stocker
said Thursday.
But for the time being, the case is finished.
“I feel that there is justice after all,” the 28-year-old woman said
following the decision Wednesday. (The woman, is referred to only as
“J.B.” in court records.)
The three-week trial dealt only with how much J.B. was owed for her pain,
not whether Planned Parenthood was liable. San Francisco Superior Court
Judge Douglas Munson ordered the pro-abortion organization be held
responsible for its failure to turn over critical medical documents to
J.B. and her lawyer.
Stocker said she would not comment on why Planned Parenthood refused to
turn over the documents, saying only that the organization felt they were
“irrelevant” to the woman’s case. But J.B. said the documents — which
include internal Planned Parenthood procedures and her medical records —
must have contained something the pro-abortion organization didn’t want
her to see.
“If someone is covering up the evidence, it’s obvious they have something
to hide,” J.B. said. “Why would you wash your hands if they weren’t
bloody?”
The woman, a Yugoslav immigrant, described her experience in her testimony
and in the original lawsuit.
In October 1997, she discovered she was pregnant and went to Planned
Parenthood. But the “care” she received at the abortion facility was less
than ideal, said her lawyer, Chris Dolan. The first-trimester abortion
J.B. sought went awry.
Medical experts testified that J.B. was probably pregnant with twins. But
the abortion she underwent in December 1997 only fully aborted one child.
Though she was told the abortion was complete, J.B. said, she still felt
pregnant two weeks later in a follow-up exam, and called several times for
advice. Each time, she was told that her symptoms were normal.
But on Feb. 18, 1998, J.B. demanded a urine test. The same nurse who had
long assured her nothing was wrong came back horrified. J.B. was still
pregnant, her lawyer said.
She had been carrying the unborn child for nearly six months. The Planned
Parenthood facility does not do abortions late in the second trimester, so
she was given an apology, a list of places who would do abortions in the
second trimester, and shooed out the door, Dolan said.
Though Planned Parenthood did relent and pay for the second abortion, J.B.
was emotionally traumatized, something that would only get worse.
An ultrasound at a Buena Vista, California abortion facility revealed the
remaining unborn child had only one arm and one leg. “She sees the
ultrasound, and has an emotional collapse,” Dolan said. “She has to go
through a three-day procedure to terminate the fetus’ life, something that
absolutely wrecks her.”
Since that abortion, Dolan said, his client has been haunted by visions of
babies being killed, has contemplated suicide, and cries uncontrollably at
the sight of young children — particularly twins.
“She is like a shattered human being,” said the attorney, adding that J.B.
has been diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder. “She has been
unable to be in a relationship since this happened. She can’t get in close
proximity to a man without shaking and, sometimes, vomiting.”
The trial began Feb. 2, and the jury returned its verdict after two days
of deliberations. They awarded her $650,000 for mental anguish, $1,870 in
past medical costs, $14,500 for future psychiatric expenses and $6,240 in
lost earnings.
“I think deciding the economic damages were fairly easy,” said Paula
Brown, who served as the jury’s forewoman. “But the non-economic part was
more difficult. It’s not really easy to put a dollar amount on someone’s
life.” In the end, however, Brown said the jury went with Dolan’s
recommendation, finding it was fair.
Fair or not, the award will be reduced, due to a 1975 California law that
limits non-economic damages in medical malpractice cases to $250,000.
Though upheld by the courts on several occasions, the cap has never been
increased. Brown, surprised by this, said the law bordered on the
ridiculous. “If it’s our judgment it’s our judgment,” she said. “The 12
people in that room fought for that verdict.”
Another juror, Isobel Jones, who appeared on the edge of tears as she
discussed the case, said the trial was emotionally wrenching. Jones, a
corporate lawyer who is herself 28 weeks pregnant, wonders why she was
picked for the case at all.
“I don’t know how I did it, but I was told by the judge to be fair, and by
God I did it,” she said.
—
The Pro-Life Infonet is a daily compilation of pro-life news and
This latest story just shows that the system is working to remove poor practicioners. That’s part of the reason serious complications from abortion are as rare as they are.
Man Who Botched Abortions Can’t Change His Name, Judge Rules Email this article
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by Steven Ertelt
LifeNews.com Editor
May 26, 2005
White Plains, NY (LifeNews.com) — A former abortion practitioner jailed for botched abortions can’t change his name because a judge is concerned the public will think he is a reputable doctor again.
Abu Hayat was tagged as the “Butcher of Avenue A” in the early 1990s for several cases of botched abortion. The most infamous one involved a woman on whom he performed an incomplete abortion. Her daughter was born without a right arm.
Hayat last year presented a request to change his name to Alba D.R. Willobeyeee, but state Supreme Court Justice Nicholas Colabella sided with the state attorney’s office and said the middle initials could confuse the public and mislead them into thinking he was a legitimate doctor.
“This risk is of particular concern in this case, given that the petitioner was convicted of criminal conduct involving illegal abortions,” Colabella wrote.
In October 1991, Hayat attempted to perform a third-trimester abortion on Rosa Rodriguez, who was seven months pregnant at the time.
On the second day of the abortion procedure, after complications had begun, Rodriguez gave birth to a baby girl, Ana Rosa Rodriguez. The baby was taken to a local hospital and was released in good medical health, except for her missing arm.
Hayat also tried to frighten Rodriguez into paying $1,500 for the abortion. He reportedly charged Rodriguez $1,000 in cash, plus her passport, green card and jewelry as collateral for the other $500.
Seven months earlier, Hayat kicked out of his office a bleeding 38 year-old woman during the middle of the abortion procedure and with parts of her unborn child still inside of her. Hayat order the woman to leave after learning she and her husband could not afford an additional $500 on top of the $300 they had already paid for the abortion.
The woman was hospitalized, and, according to the Journal News, nearly died of an infection.
After his arrest, dozens of women came forward offering information and evidence that Hayat had damaged and mistreated them during abortions.
The New York Health Department found that one 17 year-old had died of an infection following an abortion he performed and her perforated the uterus of another woman.
Hayat’s medical license was revoked in 1992, though the state of New York was criticized for waiting so long to do so.
According to the Journal News, Hayat was sentenced to between 10 and 20 years in prison. He has been rejected for parole twice and is scheduled to be released in July 2006, though that could be extended.
His attorneys, who say he is suffering from depression and other psychiatric problems, say there is no illegal motive behind the name change. Hayat says he desires the new name because he has become a Christian.
Hayat was a member of the National Abortion Federation, a trade group of abortion businesses and practitioners. The organization came under fire for not doing a better job of monitoring its members.
Somg, do try and keep up. WHO IS PAYING FOR VICTIMS OF BOTCHED ABORTION? These women were too poor to raise a child, right? So, who paid for their hospitalizations?
Somg, do try and keep up. WHO IS PAYING FOR VICTIMS OF BOTCHED ABORTION? These women were too poor to raise a child, right? So, who paid for their hospitalizations?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:57 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Taxpayers do. The same way they pay for the thousands and thousands and thousands of poor women who have children.
Abortion is WAY cheaper.
Reasons to close Planned Parenthood
By DAVID BEREIT
Special to The Eagle
Last year, there were 6,876 compelling reasons to remove all funding from the Planned Parenthood operation that runs the Bryan clinic.
Why 6,876? Because Planned Parenthood?s annual report shows that its Bryan and Houston clinics performed 6,876 abortions in the past year. According to the organization?s annual summary, during the same period of time, its facilities provided only 42 women with prenatal care.
Planned Parenthood?s tax return demonstrates that abortions account for more than 24 percent of the group?s annual income throughout the region, and Houston 911 call records have documented at least two recent cases of women who were hospitalized after botched abortions at Planned Parenthood.
The facts clearly show why thousands of people are now demanding Planned Parenthood?s public records to know what businesses, foundations, and government entities are footing the bill for the organization?s harmful activities.
The Coalition for Life believes that these concerned individuals should have access to this public information.
The Coalition has attempted to contact every organization listed as a supporter by Planned Parenthood to verify the information and to explain why people are asking them to withhold funding from the abortion operation. Eleven of those groups have already committed to not support Planned Parenthood in the future, and we are hopeful that others will soon follow suit.
Community members who want to ensure that their hard-earned dollars do not go to any organization that underwrites Planned Parenthood can join with thousands of others who are visiting the Web site http://www.cutppfunding.com to learn more and to add their names to the petition that reads, ?We, the undersigned, ask businesses, government entities, and foundations to withhold all funding from Planned Parenthood.?
However, abortion is not the only reason that Texans are uniting against Planned Parenthood in record numbers. Here are just a few other reasons why concerned citizens are actively working to remove Planned Parenthood?s funding:
? Planned Parenthood puts women?s lives at risk to further its radical agenda. Even though an 18-year-old girl was recently killed by an RU-486 abortion at a Planned Parenthood facility, and even though the Food and Drug Administration is actively investigating the safety of the pill due to multiple deaths, Planned Parenthood continues to market and distribute the dangerous drug locally.
? Planned Parenthood encourages promiscuity among youth. According to an internal Planned Parenthood study conducted by Louis Harris pollsters, teens who participated in Planned-Parenthood-style sex education programs have a 50 percent higher rate of sexual activity than those who did not go through the programs, dramatically increasing their risk of contracting sexually transmitted diseases.
? Planned Parenthood distributes obscene materials to children. Houston?s ABC-13 news recently described a Planned Parenthood promoted manual used in public schools as a ?graphic sex education book that targets children. The book includes cartoon pictures of full frontal nudity and illustrations of children performing sex acts.? Concerned parents can see what Planned Parenthood is promoting to children by visiting the organization?s Web site at http://www.teenwire.com. After viewing the site?s shocking and offensive material, community members will understand why Planned Parenthood was kicked out of Bryan public schools.
? Planned Parenthood has demonstrated a willingness to cover up sexual abuse of minors. In a recent national study, the vast majority of Planned Parenthood offices were found willing to conceal the sexual abuse of minors.
? Planned Parenthood takes millions of dollars from taxpayers? pockets. Even though an April Zogby poll found that 74 percent of Americans do not want tax dollars going to abortion providers, Planned Parenthood filed a lawsuit against the state of Texas, forcing taxpayers to continue underwriting its agenda. Last year, the area organization showed a net profit of $17.4 million while taking in $4.66 million of taxpayer funding.
? Planned Parenthood executives profit from charity. The American Institute of Philanthropy?s Charity Watchdog Report documents that Planned Parenthood?s president is among the 25 highest-paid nonprofit executives in the country, and tax returns show that the group?s top five regional employees were collectively paid in excess of half a million dollars last year.
The Coalition for Life is committed to expand the efforts to cut Planned Parenthood?s cash flow. Scripture reminds us, ?With God all things are possible? … even removing funding from the largest abortion operation in Texas.
? David Bereit is executive director of the Coalition for Life in Bryan.
Abortion doctor gets 34 years for sex abuse of patients
Jan. 2, 2004 11:10 AM
Jurors in the Brian Finkel case deliberated for 14 days before returning a mixed verdict.
Brian Finkel, a once prominent Phoenix abortion doctor, was sentenced to more than 34 years in prison Friday for sexually abusing patients over a span of nearly two decades in his high-profile practice.
Finkel was also ordered to register as a sex offender and placed on lifetime probation should he serve out his 34? -year prison sentence.
A jury convicted the 54-year-old physician last month on 22 counts of sex abuse. It also acquitted him of 34 more counts, including six of the more serious charges of sexual assault.
The sentencing comes after three months of emotion-packed testimony from 32 victims who said the doctor pinched their breasts, or kissed or fondled them during examinations. He denied the charges.
Jurors deliberated 15 days before reaching their verdict. They refused to talk about how they reached the verdict.
Finkel, who performed more than 30,000 abortions over the past 20 years, had become a national figure in the 1990s. He often appeared on network talk shows denouncing the growing violence of abortion protesters, who he compared to terrorists. He wore a bullet-proof vest and patrolled his Phoenix abortion clinic with a gun, saying they were necessary to protect himself and his clients from attacks.
____________________________________________________________________________
By From Staff Reports
East Valley Tribune
Updated: 1:50 p.m. ET Jan. 02, 2004
Valley abortion doctor Brian Finkel was sentenced today to 34 3/4 years for the sexual abuse of
13 women.
Finkel, 53, was sentenced in Maricopa County Superior Court after jurors found him guilty on 22 counts of sexual abuse.
He was acquitted on 34 other sexual offenses and jurors were unable to reach verdicts on four other counts. The jury found Finkel either fondled the breasts or rubbed the genitals of 13 women who went to him as far back as 1986 for abortions or gynecological examinations.
Before grand jury indictments in October 2001 and January 2002 effectively ended his practice, Finkel was an outspoken abortion provider who railed against the anti-abortion movement and even other abortion providers such as Planned Parenthood, which he called “feminine separatists.”
He performed abortions with a handgun in a shoulder holster, which he carried after being assaulted by anti-abortion protesters, and his Phoenix clinic was a fortress of magnetically locked doors and bulletproof glass that was situated to be difficult for protesters to get near.
The beginning of the end of Finkel’s 30-year practice came in March 2000 when a 39-year-old Scottsdale woman who visited him for an abortion, reported to police that Finkel groped her breasts as she was waking from anesthesia, according to court testimony and records.
The case eventually fell into the hands of the Maricopa County Attorney’s Office, which found other police reports with similar claims by patients.
Media attention on the investigation brought out other women, and eventually two grand juries returned indictments totaling 67 counts and 35 accusers. Maricopa County Attorney Richard Romley said there were 70 other women who made allegations but weren’t part of the prosecution.
? 2005 EadsHome Ministries
All materials produced by EadsHome Ministries are free for your use as long as a profit is not made.
Materials copyrighted to others are specifically noted and linked.
Somg, is this how they weed out bad practitioners?
Now the taxpayers are paying for the pervo. to sit in the clink.
Joining “Chester the Molester” aka. Finkel are the following former abortionists: Ivan Namihas, Laurence Reich, Dr. Ghali. All of these abortionists molested and raped their patients.
Good.
Sex offenders should go to prison:
Anti-Abortion Extremist Loses Appeal on Child Molestation Charges
John Burt, an anti-abortion extremist, was taken into custody yesterday after losing an appeal of his conviction for molesting a 15-year-old girl who was in his care at his so-called home for “unwed” mothers, Our Father
Somg,
You wrote:
But you see, the government pays LESS because of government-subsidized abortion. Government-subsidized abortion for indigent women saves many times more than it costs. Women who cannot pay for their abortions also cannot pay for their obstetric care (labor and delivery). Eventually the cost of that care gets passed on to the rest of us, mostly through the government (also through higher premiums and general health-care costs).
So the question isn’t, as you say, should we be paying for abortions. The question is, should we be paying for the increased costs associated with NOT paying for abortions? How much would you personally be willing to pay extra to the tax man, in order to cover the costs of a right-to-life policy? How much are you willing to see your health-insurance premiums go up to cover the expense of right-to-lifism?
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 12:34 PM
I used to think the same thing when I was about 14.
Then I realized that the baby will live longer than the 9 months of pregnancy and birth.
He will grow up to become a great assest to society.
He will enrich our lives with his talents, labor and service.
He will be a far greater contribution than the cost of his mother’s prenatal checkups and obstetric care.
We should consider it a privilege and an investment to welcome him.
Please don’t reply with a list of stats promoting the idea that “these” kids will just grow up to be losers. The most improbable groups of disenfranchised folks founded and built this great nation, are doing so now, and will continue to into the future disproving all those who never believed in them.
Laura, guess what? Abortion is way cheaper? That’s a blanket statement. How many of those post abortive women have contracted diseases that the government now pays for? You guys asked the government to “STAY OUT OF YOUR UTERUS.” okay, I’d be glad to. The day I see a poor pregnant woman with a sign that reads the same, I’ll be the first to say “CUT HER BENEFITS.”
So what? Paul Hill was executed. We have to support Chester the Molester for the next 34 years.
How many of those post abortive women have contracted diseases that the government now pays for?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tell us.
My guess would be virtually none.
My gay friend has HIV. He is too sick to work, and the taxpayers are footing the bill for his medical expenses. If I EVER see him in Washington DC with a sign that reads “KEEP YOUR LAWS OFF OF MY PENIS” I will be the first one to tell him not to ask the government for a single hand out!
NONE? You really must be delusional.
I know one woman who had 7 abortions. Another who had 9. They were both sleeping around. Don’t they both sound like great candidates for STD’s?
Abortions give you STDs?
Laura said: “Good. Sex offenders should go to prison: Anti-Abortion Extremist Loses Appeal on Child Molestation Charges”
Wow, I agree with Laura twice in one day! But somehow I doubt you’ll find anybody on here who will say that child molesters should be spared from prison just because they’re pro-life.
SOMG,
So killing them off is cheaper in the long run. I’ve listened to these convuluted arguments longer than you’ve been born and frankly they don’t hold water.
Hippie makes an excellent point. We can never know how any child will turn out. Children from the best of homes turn into terrible people, children from the worst of homes turn out great. I’ve seen it happen time and again, even in my own family. I’ve never figured out how my crazy, drunken, womanizing cousin and his equally drunken slob of a wife produced a lovely daughter deeply devoted to her parents. I wonder how many people would have thought her mother should have an abortion.
You go on the assumption that women would abort if they could, and are having babies they don’t want. Has it occured to you that these women WANT these babies, that’s why they have them. Believe me, plenty have told me just that. If you assume all low income women are giving birth to “accidents” SOMG, you need a reality check. When I see the 18y/o girl having her third baby, by the way we have a PP in our community, you have to wonder just how “accidental” it is. Sometimes these girls just flat out don’t give a damn. Also SOMG, women are using abortion for birth control. If abortion wasn’t available they likely would have taken precautions against pregnancy and either way wouldn’t be having babies. So the argument about saving money on welfare costs is tenuous at best.
For over 40 years SOMG, we’ve been told how abortion would cut welfare costs, poverty program costs, foster care costs, child abuse costs, and the costs of caring for drug and alcohol addicted children. Certainly we should be seeing some major cuts in expenses by now. Can you give us some examples of how abortion has truly made a difference in these social problems?
Oh, and please answer Heather’s question, who pays the hospitalization of Ms Dinkins who suffered a botched abortion, who’s care is running into the hundreds of thousands of dollars, since you have such an issue with costs? It sounds like she may need extensive rehabilitation and possibly home care. Wouldn’t you agree it would have been a lot cheaper to kill her off with the baby?
John,
As far as I’m concerned our society is far too lenient in the treatment of sex offenders, all of whom I would love to see strung up.
John, Mary, and Laura, I don’t care WHO is doing the child molesting. They ought to rot in the clink. I’ve not heard Laura or Somg say one negative word about the molesting abortionists I’ve posted. Laura, abortions don’t give you STD’s. Sleeping around will. Ask my gay friend. However, I think you knew what I meant. If the abortion clinics/equipment is as filthy as they’ve been reported to be, I suppose she could get an STD from her abortion.
If I EVER see him in Washington DC with a sign that reads “KEEP YOUR LAWS OFF OF MY PENIS”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I think I have that T-shirt.
Mary, too lenient…I agree. We can also thank PP for a hand that. They cover the tracks for sex offenders.
I’ve not heard Laura or Somg say one negative word about the molesting abortionists I’ve posted.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gee, Bi-polar Bear-
I said they should go to prison.
If I EVER see him in Washington DC with a sign that reads “KEEP YOUR LAWS OFF OF MY PENIS”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I think I have that T-shirt.
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007 2:16 PM************************* LOL! you do? I’ll let you know if he ever wants to borrow it.
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October 6, 2007
Life Chains this Sunday
This Sunday afternoon, October 7, hundreds of Life Chains will be held for the 20th year across the United States and Canada.
Life Chain is a peaceful, prayerful public witness of pro-lifers standing for 1 hour praying for an end to abortion. It is a visual of solidarity by the Christian community that abortion kills children.
For a list of places and times go here.
Life Chains offer an easy, quick way to become involved in pro-life activism. Please participate in a Life Chain near you this Sunday.
posted on October 6, 2007 6:03 AM
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Comments:
According to the Republican Majority for Choice, “our own polling found that 72 percent of self-identified Republicans believe that the government should not play a role in controlling family planning choices for women. ”
(Hat tip: NYTimes).
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 7:50 AM
Jill,
Just to let you know, in my neck of the woods, Ontario, Canada, our LIfe Chain was last week, cuz it’s our Thanksgiving up here in the land of the moose!
Our parish priest told us that at last years Life Chain, a young couple who were contemplating an abortion, drove by the chain and decided against it. They now have a baby instead of three broken lives. WE don’t get much of a turnout here, but it shows that even 10 or 15 people in a small city (90,000 souls) can make a difference.
God Bless,
Posted by: Patricia at October 6, 2007 7:50 AM
I found a place near me. I’m going.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 8:36 AM
ABORTION
Principled Choice: Contractors Boycott Abortion Clinic
By Lee Webb
CWNews
July 30, 2004
CWNews.org ? In January, we told you about a group of pro-life building contractors in Austin, Texas, who are trying to slow construction of an abortion clinic. Since then, they’ve had some success, and some setbacks. One man who took a bold stand, saw God back him up.
Austin, Texas has become a major battleground in the abortion debate. A self-proclaimed liberal college town, the capital of Texas is one of the only cities that funds abortions with public funds. It’s also a thriving New Age center and used to be the headquarters of famous atheist Madalyn Murray O’Hare.
It’s a tough town for anyone to take a stand against abortion. But remarkably a group of Austin-area construction company owners, led by Chris Danze, did take a stand.
Chris Danze said, “I think Texans, when they see evil, well, some Texans are willing to stand up and fight it and are not worried about what people in the media think, or people in the Northeast think or the power people think.”
Danze owns his own construction company in Austin and has been active in the pro-life movement for years. In the fall of 2003, he contacted his closest associates in the construction business and asked them to boycott the abortion project – a new Planned Parenthood facility being built in Austin.
He explained, “Anyone who worked on the project was participating in abortion – even if it was indirectly.”
Soon all the area construction companies pulled out of the multi-million dollar project. The lot sat vacant for months-until January when a company called Rainbow Concrete broke the boycott.
Mark Hamilton, former Vice President of Rainbow said, “Word came down from upper management that we were going to go supply it. And the die was cast, was the word they used.”
So, the concrete slab for the clinic was poured. Not during the day, but in the middle of the night. Hamilton said, “I just didn’t think it was the right thing to do. We had previously talked, six months earlier, about not doing that-and everybody agreed to it.”
Hamilton quit his job over the decision. He was disappointed that his company would “sell out” to what he says was “political pressure to break the boycott.”
Resigning was a tough decision with a family to support.
Hamilton said, “We were a little concerned, but we felt like we needed to keep the faith.”
Yet, Hamilton wasn’t out of work long. The day he resigned, another company called and offered him a job, not knowing the sacrifice Hamilton had just made.
Hamilton said, “I think it stems from my upbringing as a Catholic and as a Christian that the taking of innocent life is not right under any circumstance.”
Danze said of Hamilton, “He set an example and set a standard for people nationwide to resist the evil of the abortion industry.”
Even so, the boycott crumbled. Now construction companies go in and out of the building site every day.
Danze said, “We’ve had churches tell us that they will not use these companies that are working on the project. And they have indicated they want the list, when the project is finished. And many, many individuals have called me and asked me for the list. And they’ve told me they want to work with pro-life contractors and pro-life suppliers, pro-family suppliers.”
Many construction companies actually working on the building have concealed the name of their companies on their trucks-to avoid being associated with the abortion project. Now the building is only a few months from completion, but Danze’s says the boycott didn’t fail.
Danze said, “No. Not at all. Not at all. We, the boycott group, said ‘We’re going to stop it, slow it down, and make it more expensive.’ We’ve done all those things. So, no, never be discouraged.”
Carol Everett, the CEO of the Heidi Group, a pro-life organization based just outside of Austin admires what Danze did.
Everett said, “What Chris did was different. Because he used his own sphere of influence. And I believe, if we could export this and everyone started to look at their sphere of influence, it could have a profound effect on the opening of Planned Parenthood clinics.”
Danze believes the construction boycott will have a long-lasting effect on Austin. His pro-life construction team plans to continue to thwart new abortion clinics from going up.
He ended saying, “We are obligated as Christians to speak the truth. Even if we’re a lone voice crying in the wilderness, we still have that responsibility. And then God will take care of the victories and the successes.”
A pro-life company has recently taken over Rainbow Concrete and pulled it off the abortion project. But Planned Parenthood still says its abortion clinic will open this fall.
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Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 9:18 AM
Here is a great post for the day!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 9:19 AM
Oh boy, Heather’s back. Now we can look forward to more stupid commentary.
Heather, I thought you said you weren’t coming back!
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 9:23 AM
SOMG, only for a day. Why don’t you get smart? You WISH I wasn’t. As long as Jill allows me to, I’ll be back
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 9:26 AM
Somg, I must be doing something right if I’m getting under your skin. I love it! *I am smiling from ear to ear right now*
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 9:27 AM
Heather, I’m glad to see you back.
Posted by: Library Betty at October 6, 2007 9:30 AM
Somg said, “We have volunteers in the recovery room at PP.” Q: Are these people trained? A: No, they don’t have to be. Q: Are they med. students? A: Well yes, well no, well, I’m not sure. DUH!!! In other words, you make things up as you go. Now that I know that you WANT me gone, I am staying, and I’m calling you out on everything you say. Try to back it up from now on! I’ll be asking you a lot of questions.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 9:34 AM
Thank you Library Betty. It’s so nice to meet you! I really did think about a break for a while, but rather than to call Jill’s blog an “addiction”, I think of it as a “calling.” We all have to stick together and allow the lord to use us as he wishes. I’m no wimp, and while abortion might be legal, we don’t have to stop fighting it! They may treat me badly, but it’s not even a fraction of what they are doing to our unborn children. I’m here for them!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 9:42 AM
Being called stupid is mild when you think about unborn children being cut to pieces, torn apart, burned, and tortured. We even leave them on shelves to die. I can’t wimp out on those babies!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 9:47 AM
Heather —
I had notice before that some people really liked to push your buttons. It shows that they are threatened by you and can’t meet you in discussion, only confrontation.
I don’t post much, I just try to monitor and jump in every once and a while.
It does seem that many of the Pro-Abortion people are extremely negative and really seek to shake up the Pro-Lifers. That’s okay, they are reading this blog and probably learning alot. Abortion is a negative act, which creates negative energy. As much as they strike out, it’s ineffective. Darkness can not defeat light.
Heather, hang in there and don’t let the Pro-Abortion folks spread their negativity to you or depress you in any way. They prey on weakness, and you are not weak — you know that.
Posted by: Library Betty at October 6, 2007 9:58 AM
Library Betty, why thank you for those kind and positive words! Glad to have you on our side!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:03 AM
Donald Trump commented “Elisabeth Hasselbeck is one of the dumbest women on TV.”…..This is coming from a man who can’t find a comb.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:14 AM
Heather,
I think it’s a blessing to see your posts on this site!!! Jesus said that “they will hate you because of me”. Don’t feel bad, though…just keep standing firm in the Lord! And you’re not alone! Things are getting pretty heated at the vigil at the Aurora mill….(especially on Friday & Saturday nights!) In fact, during the day, the employees there (including security) are really getting shaken up by our presence…you can see the hate & fire spewing from their eyes & mouths!!! Praise the Lord!!!!
Posted by: PL Laura at October 6, 2007 10:20 AM
PL Laura, Good morning. I said those very words to myself! What good is leaving going to do? I’m on the winning team. You are too.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:27 AM
Maybe we need to place importance on motherhood and family values. Young girls see plenty of examples of sexuality to emulate and chastity is a word seldom heard.
Sex is emphasized everywhere you look, and attracting the opposite sex is foremost in a lot of girls mind. And then of course, they have to figure out how to ?keep the guy.? Motherhood is something they figure will happen at the end. Since marriage is not as popular or necessary for a sexual relationship, girls are desperate to find a means to maintain a relationship. Men do not have to commit to a relationship because sex is so readily available. Everyone has suffered the consequences of the freedom of our modern day thinking. The family as we once knew it has disintegrated. The one thing that hasn?t changed, babies are created from these uncertain relationships which noone wants to take responsibility for.
Casual sex is at the root of the problem. If girls were taught to value themselves more, maybe they wouldn?t be giving their bodies to just anyone. Lack of self esteem in young girls is more rampant than ever. If ?freedom of choice? is so popular, why do women feel so badly about theselves? We have created a ?no boundaries mentality,?
and as a result the respect for women no longer exists.
Although women should have the same rights as men, the feminist movement has reduced our society to a degregation of women, motherhood and family in general.
Now, anything goes! Women have bought into the idea.
They don?t seem to know any better today; that their bodies are a temple of God, bought and paid for with the price of Jesus blood. Most would laugh at that. How can men respect women when they so easily succumb to easy sex and abortion on demand. Men have no reason to get married, and they especially don?t want the responsibility of a child from a casual sexual experience. The babies suffer the consequences of our immorality. If people feel they must engage in this lifestyle, they need to make sure they do not conceive a life. Babies should not be punished for the irresponsibility of our actions. Yes, I do believe we are becoming less patient and understanding of mothers who give their bodies over for illicit sex and then to the abortionist. The issue is that sex is so exalted in our world and the importance of motherhood and family is devalued. The emphasis should be on teaching young girls that they are special and worthy of being treated with respect. To provide birth control and assume that all girls are going to have sex, only promotes the idea that they are already devalued and it is permissable for the guys to go ahead and use them for the only thing they are worth. Sex without commitment only leaves women feeling alone and insecure, no matter what their age. Committment is the basis for conceiving a child. There is none, so that?s why we have abortion. Abortion is only the result of our years of conditioning that women should enjoy the same sexual freedom as men, and men have taken advantage of that. How is it that women have aquired the idea that a man is more important than a baby? Have you ever noticed how they actually ?run? into the abortion clinic? Often the man drives off and comes back after it is all over! I presume all she is thinking of, is ?getting back to her lifestyle, uninterrupted.? Promotion of better self esteem in girls should be part of the sex education received. Recognition of basic family values and the importance of motherhood needs to be emphasized. If one so chooses to indulge in premarital sex, use contraception. Why not? It?s better than abortion!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:27 AM
Heather, I second what Library Betty and PL Laura said. Good to “see” you are back.
Posted by: Carrie at October 6, 2007 10:29 AM
I found this post on another PL site. It was written by a nurse. I think that most pro lifers will agree with it. Except for the part about contraception. However, I thought it was an excellent post!! Isn’t this what abortion is all about? These feminists have it backwards. Abortion doesn’t empower women at all. It enables her to get back to her dysfunctional lifestyle. That’s it! Abortion hurts women!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:33 AM
Carrie, thank you. Are you PL or PC? So many new people here. BTW, Nice to meet you.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:35 AM
Agreed Heahter. Abortion does hurt women. Not only born women, but unborn women also. In India and China to name a few, unborn women are targeted for sex-selective abortions. The male to female ratio has gotten so bad in some areas that China is considering outlawing sex-selective abortions. I really don’t see how a woman can call herself a feminist if she supports abortion, just my opinion.
Posted by: Carrie at October 6, 2007 10:42 AM
Heather, I am prolife. I used to be prochoice up until 4 years ago. My change of heart was a gradual process. I just started becoming actively involved in the prolife movement this summer. I live in MA which is probably one of the most prochoice states in the nation so it is an uphill battle. I have a son with disabilities so that’s what really spured me into action.
Posted by: Carrie at October 6, 2007 10:47 AM
Thank you, Carrie. I know several post abortive women, but I have never heard any of them say that the experience “empowered” them. I was looking at some of the PC signs from the DC death march. This older lady was holding up a sign that read “IF MEN COULD GET PREGNANT YOU COULD GET AN ABORTION AT WALMART.” Is this statement confusing to anyone? That’s just so stupid. Men will never get pregnant. Would abortion be any less tragic if men could have them?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:50 AM
Carrie, I used to be PC too.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 10:53 AM
Hi heather,
great to have you home again!!!!!!!!!!! {{{HUGS}}}
http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2007/oct/07100510.html
Posted by: John McDonell at October 6, 2007 10:58 AM
John, I love you!! [[hugs back]] I gave you 2 thumbs up in your post about wealth!!!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 11:00 AM
Carrie, God bless you and your son! It will be okay. You must be a really special mom!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 11:03 AM
John, thanks for the link.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 11:07 AM
Thanks, Heather. My son is doing pretty good right now. I found a great program for him. He is thriving like never before. It has been a struggle, but so worth it. Many people say to me that “I could never do what you do.” I always tell them that you never know what you can do until you are called to do it.
Posted by: Carrie at October 6, 2007 11:28 AM
SOMG, 7:50am
If you think the government should stay out of family planning decisions, then would you agree that the government shouldn’t be subsidizing Planned Parenthood or paying for medicaid abortions? I’ve noticed abortion advocates howl about the government staying out of these decisions, that is until the time comes to foot the bill. Then listen to them squawk when the government tries to stay out of it.
Heather,
Welcome back! Concerning Donald Trump. A man who stepped into the sandbox with Rosie O’Donnell is questioning someone else’s intelligence?
Posted by: Mary at October 6, 2007 11:31 AM
Mary, Trump could have risen above that cat fight. There is a man who can dish it out, but he sure can’t take it. Great points to SOMG.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 11:38 AM
Carrie,
Sex selection abortions take place here in the United States as well. According to an article I read in 1982, already 4 out of 5 of the fetuses aborted for sex selection purposes in the United States were female. With ultrasound now so easily available, unlike then, one can only guess as to what extent this practice continues.
How ironic that abortion ends up relegating women to a second choice second class status.
I remember a contributing writer in a news magazine exposing this practice in India many years ago. The magazine had to point out the writer was Roman Catholic. So what? Did that change the facts? I wrote the magazine questioning this since I had never seen a writer’s religous or non-religious beliefs mentioned and this was an obvious attempt to prejudice readers. The media biased? nahhhhh.
About your son, my heart goes out to you and I wish you every success with him. People ask me also how I cope with a mentally ill daughter who has virtually disappeared. We just cope because we have to, right Carrie? I think we both realize too that there are people coping with much worse. My best to you and your son.
Posted by: Mary at October 6, 2007 11:43 AM
Mary and Carrie, My heart goes out to both of you. Everyone I know is coping with something or another, myself included. As they say, That’s life. My best wishes to both of you.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 11:47 AM
Heather,
Thank you for your kind words. As its often said, we all have our crosses to bear.
In a town near me a beautiful, vibrant young woman about to graduate from high school and with plans to join the military, then attend college and become a lawyer, was struck by a drunk driver as she was walking on the side of the road and was totally paralyzed. She is respirator dependent.
I look at her and her remarkable family, I can’t even fathom their devastation, not to mention hers, who can do little else but cope, and quickly dispense with any self pity!
In fact my heart goes out to the driver as well. He did something stupid, like we all have at sometime or another only we “got away with it”, and I can’t even imagine living with what that man does. He no doubt figured he could safely drive the short distance from the bar to his home. He is a local respectable businessman. I do NOT excuse his driving drunk.
Posted by: Mary at October 6, 2007 12:09 PM
Mary, I see it your way. I always try to look at things from every angle. That man will have to live with his guilt. What an unfortunate situation for all involved.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:17 PM
SoMG said, “According to the Republican Majority for Choice, “our own polling found that 72 percent of self-identified Republicans believe that the government should not play a role in controlling family planning choices for women.” ”
Hahaha, oh no you didn’t. Thanks for the laugh, chief. Yes, according to a pro-abortion Republican group, the vast majority of Republicans are pro-abortion. That’s why every other poll since 1973 indicates differently.
Tell me, do the Catholics for Abortion say that most Catholic support abortion? I wonder if there’s a group called Pro-Lifers for Abortion? If there is, I bet their own polling tells them that most pro-lifers are in favor of abortion.
Posted by: John Lewandowski at October 6, 2007 12:20 PM
John —
Excellent points — phony group alert. Most of these types of groups exist on paper only.
Posted by: Library Betty at October 6, 2007 12:27 PM
John and Library Betty, how true!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:30 PM
Mary, I did not know that sex selective abortions occured so frequently in the United States. How frightening. I am not surprised that the feminists who support abortion are not up in arms over this. In my opinion, they choose to put blinders on as to how much abortion devalues women. Unborn women are a silent constituency so it up to us to speak for them. Same goes for unborn men.
Posted by: Carrie at October 6, 2007 12:32 PM
SoMG said, “According to the Republican Majority for Choice, “our own polling found that 72 percent of self-identified Republicans believe that the government should not play a role in controlling family planning choices for women.” ”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I don’t doubt it.
Abortion doesn’t even crack the top ten list of issues Americans care about, and the only pro-choice Republican presidential candidate is leading by a wide margin over his pro-life rivals.
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007 12:33 PM
Mary, you wrote: “If you think the government should stay out of family planning decisions, then would you agree that the government shouldn’t be subsidizing Planned Parenthood or paying for medicaid abortions? ”
But you see, the government pays LESS because of government-subsidized abortion. Government-subsidized abortion for indigent women saves many times more than it costs. Women who cannot pay for their abortions also cannot pay for their obstetric care (labor and delivery). Eventually the cost of that care gets passed on to the rest of us, mostly through the government (also through higher premiums and general health-care costs).
So the question isn’t, as you say, should we be paying for abortions. The question is, should we be paying for the increased costs associated with NOT paying for abortions? How much would you personally be willing to pay extra to the tax man, in order to cover the costs of a right-to-life policy? How much are you willing to see your health-insurance premiums go up to cover the expense of right-to-lifism?
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 12:34 PM
Carrie, me neither. That’s awful.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:35 PM
Mary, my heart goes out to you also.
Posted by: Carrie at October 6, 2007 12:35 PM
How much does the government pay out to treat botched abortion patients? How about abortion patients who have contracted HIV or other diseases?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:38 PM
Botched abortions are NOT rare events.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:40 PM
Heather knows better than the AMA and ACOG.
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 12:43 PM
UPDATE: Botched Abortion Victim Sues Troubled NJ Abortion Mill
Suit claims Abortionists Keith Gresham and Nicholas Kotopoulos, provided ?negligent, careless and reckless care.?
Newark, NJ ? Twenty-year old Rasheedah Dinkins went to Metropolitan Medical Associates on January 27, for what she thought would be a routine abortion in her 15th week of pregnancy. Later that day, Rasheedah collapsed in her home. Family members summoned an ambulance to transport her to Newark Beth Israel Medical Center where she slipped into a coma lasting four weeks. When she awoke, Rasheedah learned that she had suffered massive blood loss, two strokes, a collapsed lung, neurological damage, and the removal of her uterus. She finally regained her ability to speak on Tuesday.
Rasheedah is still hospitalized in the critical care unit, recovering from the botched abortion that nearly cost her her life along with that of the last child she will ever bear. It is an act she now regrets.
Rasheedah is now suing Metropolitan Medical Associates, a clinic affiliated with the National Abortion Federation (NAF), and the two abortionists who treated her. In a complaint filed on Wednesday, she claims that abortionists Keith Gresham and Nicholas Kotopoulos, provided ?negligent, careless and reckless care.?
Metropolitan Medical Center was closed by the New Jersey Department of Health and Senior Services over the weekend after an investigation that was prompted when a hospital worker reported Rasheedah?s botched abortion. It had also been closed in 1993, after a 20-year old college student died during an abortion from a perforated uterus.
?Rasheedah showed remarkable courage in first being willing to admit that she should not have had the abortion, and second in her willingness to publicly discuss what happened to her,? said Operation Rescue President Troy Newman. ?We pray her lawsuit succeeds in helping to permanently closed this high-volume child-killing center.?
?We know that unfortunately, Rasheedah?s tragedy is not unique. We urge other women who have been injured at this and any other abortion mill to come forward and report their stories to their local authorities,? said Newman. ?The abortion industry is a predatory one, and the so-called standards that groups like the NAF impose on themselves are a joke. As long as women remain silent, they will continue to subject women to shoddy, dangerous conditions and substandard care. Now is the time to speak out to prevent other women from making the same tragic decision
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:43 PM
Also MMWR.
Posted by: SoGM at October 6, 2007 12:44 PM
Did this woman pay out of her own pocket for all of these medical expenses? Did she pay cash for her rehab?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:45 PM
A sample of one.
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 12:48 PM
Mississippi Abortion Practitioner Who Botched Abortions Suspended Email this article
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by Maria Vitale Gallagher
LifeNews.com Staff Writer
March 21, 2005
Jackson, MS (LifeNews.com) — A Mississippi abortion practitioner whose patients suffered damaging and even deadly complications has been suspended indefinitely by the state medical board. The suspension of Dr. Malachy Dehenre came after he testified that he did not like performing some 35,000 abortions but did so because he needed the work.
?I ask your forgiveness,? said the 54-year-old Dehenre. “I don’t want to be an outcast. I want to be among the medical community.”
Dehenre has been under temporary suspension since August. He had performed abortions at the New Woman Medical Center in Jackson and the facility closed following his suspension.
In December, an Alabama medical board found Dehenre guilty of gross malpractice in four abortions. In one case, a woman died 18 hours after having an abortion. The women involved in the other three cases had to have hysterectomies to stop massive hemorrhaging from uterine perforations.
During his testimony, Dehenre stated, “I found work in Jackson, and it happened to be an abortion clinic in which an obstetrician was needed. I needed money to pay expenses and education for my children. It was supposed to be temporary, but it turned out to be longer. I was in a position I didn’t want to be in, but I needed work.”
In the case involving a death, Dehenre admitted he should have met the patient at the hospital or relayed medical information to the doctor who treated her.
“We hope to hear from you at a later date when you get things straight in Alabama,” Mississippi board president Dr. Dewitt G. Crawford of Louisville told Dehenre.
Dehenre will have to regain his license in Alabama before he can seek reinstatement in Mississippi. The Alabama suspension will last at least one year.
Pat Cartrette, executive director of Pro-Life Mississippi, told the press, “I am pleased that the board made the right decision. … What they did will keep women safe in Mississippi.”
In a statement issued last year, Pro-Life Mississippi said Dehenre ?is now being held accountable for the injuries and death to women at abortion clinics and we thank God that both women and their unborn babies are now safe from this abortionist.?
Related web sites:
Pro-Life Mississippi – http://www.prolifemississippi.org
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:49 PM
For each one like her, there’s more than ten who die in childbirth.
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 12:49 PM
Woman Wins Botched Abortion Lawsuit vs. Planned Parenthood
Source: San Francisco Examiner; February 24, 2001
San Francisco, CA — A woman who remained pregnant following a botched
abortion three years ago has been awarded $672,610 from Planned
Parenthood. As the court clerk read the jury’s award Wednesday, the woman,
whose unborn child lost two limbs in the abortion attempt before being
aborted months later, lowered her head and wept, convinced her three-year
court battle was finally over.
And it is, but only for now. An attorney for Planned Parenthood Golden
Gate, which oversees nine abortion facilities in the Bay Area, vowed to
appeal the award. “It’s definitely going to be appealed,” Lynn Stocker
said Thursday.
But for the time being, the case is finished.
“I feel that there is justice after all,” the 28-year-old woman said
following the decision Wednesday. (The woman, is referred to only as
“J.B.” in court records.)
The three-week trial dealt only with how much J.B. was owed for her pain,
not whether Planned Parenthood was liable. San Francisco Superior Court
Judge Douglas Munson ordered the pro-abortion organization be held
responsible for its failure to turn over critical medical documents to
J.B. and her lawyer.
Stocker said she would not comment on why Planned Parenthood refused to
turn over the documents, saying only that the organization felt they were
“irrelevant” to the woman’s case. But J.B. said the documents — which
include internal Planned Parenthood procedures and her medical records —
must have contained something the pro-abortion organization didn’t want
her to see.
“If someone is covering up the evidence, it’s obvious they have something
to hide,” J.B. said. “Why would you wash your hands if they weren’t
bloody?”
The woman, a Yugoslav immigrant, described her experience in her testimony
and in the original lawsuit.
In October 1997, she discovered she was pregnant and went to Planned
Parenthood. But the “care” she received at the abortion facility was less
than ideal, said her lawyer, Chris Dolan. The first-trimester abortion
J.B. sought went awry.
Medical experts testified that J.B. was probably pregnant with twins. But
the abortion she underwent in December 1997 only fully aborted one child.
Though she was told the abortion was complete, J.B. said, she still felt
pregnant two weeks later in a follow-up exam, and called several times for
advice. Each time, she was told that her symptoms were normal.
But on Feb. 18, 1998, J.B. demanded a urine test. The same nurse who had
long assured her nothing was wrong came back horrified. J.B. was still
pregnant, her lawyer said.
She had been carrying the unborn child for nearly six months. The Planned
Parenthood facility does not do abortions late in the second trimester, so
she was given an apology, a list of places who would do abortions in the
second trimester, and shooed out the door, Dolan said.
Though Planned Parenthood did relent and pay for the second abortion, J.B.
was emotionally traumatized, something that would only get worse.
An ultrasound at a Buena Vista, California abortion facility revealed the
remaining unborn child had only one arm and one leg. “She sees the
ultrasound, and has an emotional collapse,” Dolan said. “She has to go
through a three-day procedure to terminate the fetus’ life, something that
absolutely wrecks her.”
Since that abortion, Dolan said, his client has been haunted by visions of
babies being killed, has contemplated suicide, and cries uncontrollably at
the sight of young children — particularly twins.
“She is like a shattered human being,” said the attorney, adding that J.B.
has been diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder. “She has been
unable to be in a relationship since this happened. She can’t get in close
proximity to a man without shaking and, sometimes, vomiting.”
The trial began Feb. 2, and the jury returned its verdict after two days
of deliberations. They awarded her $650,000 for mental anguish, $1,870 in
past medical costs, $14,500 for future psychiatric expenses and $6,240 in
lost earnings.
“I think deciding the economic damages were fairly easy,” said Paula
Brown, who served as the jury’s forewoman. “But the non-economic part was
more difficult. It’s not really easy to put a dollar amount on someone’s
life.” In the end, however, Brown said the jury went with Dolan’s
recommendation, finding it was fair.
Fair or not, the award will be reduced, due to a 1975 California law that
limits non-economic damages in medical malpractice cases to $250,000.
Though upheld by the courts on several occasions, the cap has never been
increased. Brown, surprised by this, said the law bordered on the
ridiculous. “If it’s our judgment it’s our judgment,” she said. “The 12
people in that room fought for that verdict.”
Another juror, Isobel Jones, who appeared on the edge of tears as she
discussed the case, said the trial was emotionally wrenching. Jones, a
corporate lawyer who is herself 28 weeks pregnant, wonders why she was
picked for the case at all.
“I don’t know how I did it, but I was told by the judge to be fair, and by
God I did it,” she said.
—
The Pro-Life Infonet is a daily compilation of pro-life news and
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:51 PM
This latest story just shows that the system is working to remove poor practicioners. That’s part of the reason serious complications from abortion are as rare as they are.
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 12:52 PM
Man Who Botched Abortions Can’t Change His Name, Judge Rules Email this article
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by Steven Ertelt
LifeNews.com Editor
May 26, 2005
White Plains, NY (LifeNews.com) — A former abortion practitioner jailed for botched abortions can’t change his name because a judge is concerned the public will think he is a reputable doctor again.
Abu Hayat was tagged as the “Butcher of Avenue A” in the early 1990s for several cases of botched abortion. The most infamous one involved a woman on whom he performed an incomplete abortion. Her daughter was born without a right arm.
Hayat last year presented a request to change his name to Alba D.R. Willobeyeee, but state Supreme Court Justice Nicholas Colabella sided with the state attorney’s office and said the middle initials could confuse the public and mislead them into thinking he was a legitimate doctor.
“This risk is of particular concern in this case, given that the petitioner was convicted of criminal conduct involving illegal abortions,” Colabella wrote.
In October 1991, Hayat attempted to perform a third-trimester abortion on Rosa Rodriguez, who was seven months pregnant at the time.
On the second day of the abortion procedure, after complications had begun, Rodriguez gave birth to a baby girl, Ana Rosa Rodriguez. The baby was taken to a local hospital and was released in good medical health, except for her missing arm.
Hayat also tried to frighten Rodriguez into paying $1,500 for the abortion. He reportedly charged Rodriguez $1,000 in cash, plus her passport, green card and jewelry as collateral for the other $500.
Seven months earlier, Hayat kicked out of his office a bleeding 38 year-old woman during the middle of the abortion procedure and with parts of her unborn child still inside of her. Hayat order the woman to leave after learning she and her husband could not afford an additional $500 on top of the $300 they had already paid for the abortion.
The woman was hospitalized, and, according to the Journal News, nearly died of an infection.
After his arrest, dozens of women came forward offering information and evidence that Hayat had damaged and mistreated them during abortions.
The New York Health Department found that one 17 year-old had died of an infection following an abortion he performed and her perforated the uterus of another woman.
Hayat’s medical license was revoked in 1992, though the state of New York was criticized for waiting so long to do so.
According to the Journal News, Hayat was sentenced to between 10 and 20 years in prison. He has been rejected for parole twice and is scheduled to be released in July 2006, though that could be extended.
His attorneys, who say he is suffering from depression and other psychiatric problems, say there is no illegal motive behind the name change. Hayat says he desires the new name because he has become a Christian.
Hayat was a member of the National Abortion Federation, a trade group of abortion businesses and practitioners. The organization came under fire for not doing a better job of monitoring its members.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:54 PM
Somg, do try and keep up. WHO IS PAYING FOR VICTIMS OF BOTCHED ABORTION? These women were too poor to raise a child, right? So, who paid for their hospitalizations?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:57 PM
Somg, do try and keep up. WHO IS PAYING FOR VICTIMS OF BOTCHED ABORTION? These women were too poor to raise a child, right? So, who paid for their hospitalizations?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 12:57 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Taxpayers do. The same way they pay for the thousands and thousands and thousands of poor women who have children.
Abortion is WAY cheaper.
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007 1:03 PM
Reasons to close Planned Parenthood
By DAVID BEREIT
Special to The Eagle
Last year, there were 6,876 compelling reasons to remove all funding from the Planned Parenthood operation that runs the Bryan clinic.
Why 6,876? Because Planned Parenthood?s annual report shows that its Bryan and Houston clinics performed 6,876 abortions in the past year. According to the organization?s annual summary, during the same period of time, its facilities provided only 42 women with prenatal care.
Planned Parenthood?s tax return demonstrates that abortions account for more than 24 percent of the group?s annual income throughout the region, and Houston 911 call records have documented at least two recent cases of women who were hospitalized after botched abortions at Planned Parenthood.
The facts clearly show why thousands of people are now demanding Planned Parenthood?s public records to know what businesses, foundations, and government entities are footing the bill for the organization?s harmful activities.
The Coalition for Life believes that these concerned individuals should have access to this public information.
The Coalition has attempted to contact every organization listed as a supporter by Planned Parenthood to verify the information and to explain why people are asking them to withhold funding from the abortion operation. Eleven of those groups have already committed to not support Planned Parenthood in the future, and we are hopeful that others will soon follow suit.
Community members who want to ensure that their hard-earned dollars do not go to any organization that underwrites Planned Parenthood can join with thousands of others who are visiting the Web site http://www.cutppfunding.com to learn more and to add their names to the petition that reads, ?We, the undersigned, ask businesses, government entities, and foundations to withhold all funding from Planned Parenthood.?
However, abortion is not the only reason that Texans are uniting against Planned Parenthood in record numbers. Here are just a few other reasons why concerned citizens are actively working to remove Planned Parenthood?s funding:
? Planned Parenthood puts women?s lives at risk to further its radical agenda. Even though an 18-year-old girl was recently killed by an RU-486 abortion at a Planned Parenthood facility, and even though the Food and Drug Administration is actively investigating the safety of the pill due to multiple deaths, Planned Parenthood continues to market and distribute the dangerous drug locally.
? Planned Parenthood encourages promiscuity among youth. According to an internal Planned Parenthood study conducted by Louis Harris pollsters, teens who participated in Planned-Parenthood-style sex education programs have a 50 percent higher rate of sexual activity than those who did not go through the programs, dramatically increasing their risk of contracting sexually transmitted diseases.
? Planned Parenthood distributes obscene materials to children. Houston?s ABC-13 news recently described a Planned Parenthood promoted manual used in public schools as a ?graphic sex education book that targets children. The book includes cartoon pictures of full frontal nudity and illustrations of children performing sex acts.? Concerned parents can see what Planned Parenthood is promoting to children by visiting the organization?s Web site at http://www.teenwire.com. After viewing the site?s shocking and offensive material, community members will understand why Planned Parenthood was kicked out of Bryan public schools.
? Planned Parenthood has demonstrated a willingness to cover up sexual abuse of minors. In a recent national study, the vast majority of Planned Parenthood offices were found willing to conceal the sexual abuse of minors.
? Planned Parenthood takes millions of dollars from taxpayers? pockets. Even though an April Zogby poll found that 74 percent of Americans do not want tax dollars going to abortion providers, Planned Parenthood filed a lawsuit against the state of Texas, forcing taxpayers to continue underwriting its agenda. Last year, the area organization showed a net profit of $17.4 million while taking in $4.66 million of taxpayer funding.
? Planned Parenthood executives profit from charity. The American Institute of Philanthropy?s Charity Watchdog Report documents that Planned Parenthood?s president is among the 25 highest-paid nonprofit executives in the country, and tax returns show that the group?s top five regional employees were collectively paid in excess of half a million dollars last year.
The Coalition for Life is committed to expand the efforts to cut Planned Parenthood?s cash flow. Scripture reminds us, ?With God all things are possible? … even removing funding from the largest abortion operation in Texas.
? David Bereit is executive director of the Coalition for Life in Bryan.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:09 PM
Abortion doctor gets 34 years for sex abuse of patients
Jan. 2, 2004 11:10 AM
Jurors in the Brian Finkel case deliberated for 14 days before returning a mixed verdict.
Brian Finkel, a once prominent Phoenix abortion doctor, was sentenced to more than 34 years in prison Friday for sexually abusing patients over a span of nearly two decades in his high-profile practice.
Finkel was also ordered to register as a sex offender and placed on lifetime probation should he serve out his 34? -year prison sentence.
A jury convicted the 54-year-old physician last month on 22 counts of sex abuse. It also acquitted him of 34 more counts, including six of the more serious charges of sexual assault.
The sentencing comes after three months of emotion-packed testimony from 32 victims who said the doctor pinched their breasts, or kissed or fondled them during examinations. He denied the charges.
Jurors deliberated 15 days before reaching their verdict. They refused to talk about how they reached the verdict.
Finkel, who performed more than 30,000 abortions over the past 20 years, had become a national figure in the 1990s. He often appeared on network talk shows denouncing the growing violence of abortion protesters, who he compared to terrorists. He wore a bullet-proof vest and patrolled his Phoenix abortion clinic with a gun, saying they were necessary to protect himself and his clients from attacks.
____________________________________________________________________________
By From Staff Reports
East Valley Tribune
Updated: 1:50 p.m. ET Jan. 02, 2004
Valley abortion doctor Brian Finkel was sentenced today to 34 3/4 years for the sexual abuse of
13 women.
Finkel, 53, was sentenced in Maricopa County Superior Court after jurors found him guilty on 22 counts of sexual abuse.
He was acquitted on 34 other sexual offenses and jurors were unable to reach verdicts on four other counts. The jury found Finkel either fondled the breasts or rubbed the genitals of 13 women who went to him as far back as 1986 for abortions or gynecological examinations.
Before grand jury indictments in October 2001 and January 2002 effectively ended his practice, Finkel was an outspoken abortion provider who railed against the anti-abortion movement and even other abortion providers such as Planned Parenthood, which he called “feminine separatists.”
He performed abortions with a handgun in a shoulder holster, which he carried after being assaulted by anti-abortion protesters, and his Phoenix clinic was a fortress of magnetically locked doors and bulletproof glass that was situated to be difficult for protesters to get near.
The beginning of the end of Finkel’s 30-year practice came in March 2000 when a 39-year-old Scottsdale woman who visited him for an abortion, reported to police that Finkel groped her breasts as she was waking from anesthesia, according to court testimony and records.
The case eventually fell into the hands of the Maricopa County Attorney’s Office, which found other police reports with similar claims by patients.
Media attention on the investigation brought out other women, and eventually two grand juries returned indictments totaling 67 counts and 35 accusers. Maricopa County Attorney Richard Romley said there were 70 other women who made allegations but weren’t part of the prosecution.
? 2005 EadsHome Ministries
All materials produced by EadsHome Ministries are free for your use as long as a profit is not made.
Materials copyrighted to others are specifically noted and linked.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:12 PM
Somg, is this how they weed out bad practitioners?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:14 PM
Now the taxpayers are paying for the pervo. to sit in the clink.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:16 PM
Joining “Chester the Molester” aka. Finkel are the following former abortionists: Ivan Namihas, Laurence Reich, Dr. Ghali. All of these abortionists molested and raped their patients.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:20 PM
Good.
Sex offenders should go to prison:
Anti-Abortion Extremist Loses Appeal on Child Molestation Charges
John Burt, an anti-abortion extremist, was taken into custody yesterday after losing an appeal of his conviction for molesting a 15-year-old girl who was in his care at his so-called home for “unwed” mothers, Our Father?s House. A three-judge panel of the First District Court of Appeal ruled unanimously to uphold Burt?s conviction, the Associated Press reports. Burt will continue to appeal his conviction and sentence of 18 years in prison, according to the Pensacola News Journal.
In the early 1980s, John Burt, who was the Regional Director of Rescue America at the time, was at the center of disruptions at the Pensacola, Florida clinics. In 1986, Burt led an invasion into the Ladies Center Clinic in Pensacola, which led to his arrest and conviction along with Joan Andrews Bell, an associate of James Kopp, who was convicted of assassinating Dr. Barnett Slepian. Joseph Scheidler was touring at the time on his book, ?99 Ways to Close an Abortion Clinic.? Scheidler was on the lawn in front of the clinic at the time of the invasion. This incident was the impetus for the NOW v. Scheidler case, which will be heard by the US Supreme Court for the third time this fall.
In 1993, Burt was leading a Rescue America protest outside the second Pensacola clinic when an Our Father’s House volunteer, Michael Griffin, shot and killed Dr. David Gunn in the rear of the clinic. Burt was also an associate of Paul Hill, who murdered Dr. Bayard Britton and volunteer escort James Barrett outside the Ladies Center Clinic in Pensacola in 1994. Burt was videotaped helping Paul Hill identify Dr. Britton outside the clinic in the weeks before Hill shot and killed Dr. Britton and his clinic escort.
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007 1:22 PM
Somg,
You wrote:
But you see, the government pays LESS because of government-subsidized abortion. Government-subsidized abortion for indigent women saves many times more than it costs. Women who cannot pay for their abortions also cannot pay for their obstetric care (labor and delivery). Eventually the cost of that care gets passed on to the rest of us, mostly through the government (also through higher premiums and general health-care costs).
So the question isn’t, as you say, should we be paying for abortions. The question is, should we be paying for the increased costs associated with NOT paying for abortions? How much would you personally be willing to pay extra to the tax man, in order to cover the costs of a right-to-life policy? How much are you willing to see your health-insurance premiums go up to cover the expense of right-to-lifism?
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 12:34 PM
I used to think the same thing when I was about 14.
Then I realized that the baby will live longer than the 9 months of pregnancy and birth.
He will grow up to become a great assest to society.
He will enrich our lives with his talents, labor and service.
He will be a far greater contribution than the cost of his mother’s prenatal checkups and obstetric care.
We should consider it a privilege and an investment to welcome him.
Please don’t reply with a list of stats promoting the idea that “these” kids will just grow up to be losers. The most improbable groups of disenfranchised folks founded and built this great nation, are doing so now, and will continue to into the future disproving all those who never believed in them.
Posted by: hippie at October 6, 2007 1:23 PM
Laura, guess what? Abortion is way cheaper? That’s a blanket statement. How many of those post abortive women have contracted diseases that the government now pays for? You guys asked the government to “STAY OUT OF YOUR UTERUS.” okay, I’d be glad to. The day I see a poor pregnant woman with a sign that reads the same, I’ll be the first to say “CUT HER BENEFITS.”
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:26 PM
So what? Paul Hill was executed. We have to support Chester the Molester for the next 34 years.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:29 PM
How many of those post abortive women have contracted diseases that the government now pays for?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tell us.
My guess would be virtually none.
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007 1:30 PM
My gay friend has HIV. He is too sick to work, and the taxpayers are footing the bill for his medical expenses. If I EVER see him in Washington DC with a sign that reads “KEEP YOUR LAWS OFF OF MY PENIS” I will be the first one to tell him not to ask the government for a single hand out!
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:34 PM
NONE? You really must be delusional.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:36 PM
I know one woman who had 7 abortions. Another who had 9. They were both sleeping around. Don’t they both sound like great candidates for STD’s?
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 1:45 PM
Abortions give you STDs?
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007 1:57 PM
Laura said: “Good. Sex offenders should go to prison: Anti-Abortion Extremist Loses Appeal on Child Molestation Charges”
Wow, I agree with Laura twice in one day! But somehow I doubt you’ll find anybody on here who will say that child molesters should be spared from prison just because they’re pro-life.
Posted by: John Lewandowski at October 6, 2007 2:00 PM
SOMG,
So killing them off is cheaper in the long run. I’ve listened to these convuluted arguments longer than you’ve been born and frankly they don’t hold water.
Hippie makes an excellent point. We can never know how any child will turn out. Children from the best of homes turn into terrible people, children from the worst of homes turn out great. I’ve seen it happen time and again, even in my own family. I’ve never figured out how my crazy, drunken, womanizing cousin and his equally drunken slob of a wife produced a lovely daughter deeply devoted to her parents. I wonder how many people would have thought her mother should have an abortion.
You go on the assumption that women would abort if they could, and are having babies they don’t want. Has it occured to you that these women WANT these babies, that’s why they have them. Believe me, plenty have told me just that. If you assume all low income women are giving birth to “accidents” SOMG, you need a reality check. When I see the 18y/o girl having her third baby, by the way we have a PP in our community, you have to wonder just how “accidental” it is. Sometimes these girls just flat out don’t give a damn. Also SOMG, women are using abortion for birth control. If abortion wasn’t available they likely would have taken precautions against pregnancy and either way wouldn’t be having babies. So the argument about saving money on welfare costs is tenuous at best.
For over 40 years SOMG, we’ve been told how abortion would cut welfare costs, poverty program costs, foster care costs, child abuse costs, and the costs of caring for drug and alcohol addicted children. Certainly we should be seeing some major cuts in expenses by now. Can you give us some examples of how abortion has truly made a difference in these social problems?
Oh, and please answer Heather’s question, who pays the hospitalization of Ms Dinkins who suffered a botched abortion, who’s care is running into the hundreds of thousands of dollars, since you have such an issue with costs? It sounds like she may need extensive rehabilitation and possibly home care. Wouldn’t you agree it would have been a lot cheaper to kill her off with the baby?
Posted by: Mary at October 6, 2007 2:05 PM
John,
As far as I’m concerned our society is far too lenient in the treatment of sex offenders, all of whom I would love to see strung up.
Posted by: Mary at October 6, 2007 2:08 PM
John, Mary, and Laura, I don’t care WHO is doing the child molesting. They ought to rot in the clink. I’ve not heard Laura or Somg say one negative word about the molesting abortionists I’ve posted. Laura, abortions don’t give you STD’s. Sleeping around will. Ask my gay friend. However, I think you knew what I meant. If the abortion clinics/equipment is as filthy as they’ve been reported to be, I suppose she could get an STD from her abortion.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 2:16 PM
If I EVER see him in Washington DC with a sign that reads “KEEP YOUR LAWS OFF OF MY PENIS”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I think I have that T-shirt.
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007 2:16 PM
Mary, too lenient…I agree. We can also thank PP for a hand that. They cover the tracks for sex offenders.
Posted by: heather at October 6, 2007 2:18 PM
I’ve not heard Laura or Somg say one negative word about the molesting abortionists I’ve posted.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gee, Bi-polar Bear-
I said they should go to prison.
Posted by: Laura at October 6, 2007
*** OMG, we finally agree on something! Well, off to work all.
Laura said: They should go to prison. OMG, we agree on something!
SoMG —
The government helping with the costs of bringing a child into the world is making an investment in society. That child will go on to be a taxpayer and a contributing member of society.
In the end. the government will lose money by supporting abortion. Much like how NOW and other anti-human groups are seeing their membership decline over the years. Encouraging the extermination of the next generation is really a silly approach for any organization which seeks to influence society in the long-term.
It seems obvious that you look at life and at children as only a cost, not having intrinsic value on their own. What, if anything, is the value of your own life? Are you a contribution to this world or simply a cost to it? How much are any of the children in life worth — have you have figured a Profit/Loss out on them?
It always seems that Pro-choicers are all for ‘helping’ the poor by killing their children. Is it because a poor child is worth less than a middle class child? Is it because you believe poverty is a life sentence and there is no hope for a child born into it to have a good life. This seems to what underlies the Pro-Choice movement.
Proverty is not a death sentence, unless it is poverty of spirit.
Laura
It seems you like to taunt people or what did that bi-polar bear thing mean?
If you are mean, I guess it’s fitting that you support killing children. Guess it’s better you are posting your meanness online then spreading your anti-charm out in the real world.
*clapping for that post L.B.*!!! BRAVO!! I’ve gotta run, but look at Nick Cannon. He’s a famous singer. His mom almost aborted him d/t poverty. He sings a song about it.
SOMG left the blog. He always gets out of the kitchen when it gets too hot. He doesn’t have the intelligence to beat us! Score 1 for the PL team.
I have wondered about his/her real commitment about deeply thinking about the positions he takes. It’s easy to throw barbs and statistics around, but think about the real impact is difficult.
I have hope that things will change when many pro-choicers or fence-sitters really look at the illogical nature of Abortion. It is a real negative to everyone involved as well as society. What looks like an ‘easy’ solution in the short-run has very dire consequences in the long haul.
Library Betty,
Some excellent posts. We are likely all the descendents of desperately poor women.
Library Betty, I agree with you that money ultimately should not determine who has a baby and when, but if right-to-lifers are going to claim that abortion is a net cost, or that it forces them to pay more taxes, they need to be corrected. Remember, it was YOUR side that introduced the $ motif into this discussion by suggesting that the government should not spend $ on abortion. I pointed out that government-subsidized abortion for indigent women saves more $ than it costs, but it was your side that introduced the whole money question.
No one is trying to “exterminate the next generation”. It’s lines like that that make it obvious to the world that you right-to-lifers should not be taken seriously or allowed to run things.
Heather, I have other things to do besides correct your errors and foolishness. I agree that this would be a full-time job, but there just isn’t enough time in the day.
LIbrary Betty,
By the way, welcome to the gang.
I appreciate the historical facts you bring into o the picture. In the end, Truth always wins out.
And SoMG? If you’ve lurked long enough you’ll get the sense that SoMG is a little on the unbalanced side.
Just ask MK!
Heather,
I remember the case of Ana Rodriguez. She was such a beautiful toddler. I’m sure she’s a grown woman now. I understand a prosthesis company run by a pro-lifer or at the request of a pro-life group offered to make an arm for her, but the story was so long ago I may not remember it right. Anyway, I wonder if NOW or NARAL ever offered her any similar assistance.
As far as the $$ issue, I’m not quite sure how this came up in the conversation but it is a factor because all US citizens pay for anything that tax dollars support.
The aims of government, for which we pay taxes are outlined in the Preamble to the Constitution.
Quote “We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America”
All government programs and spending need to comply with at least one of these aims. I don’t see how funding abortion meets any. In fact, funding abortion seems to go against ‘secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity.
I disagree with funding of abortion ‘services’ on constitutional grounds. That isn’t a valid use of my hard earned money.
L B,
you wrote
It always seems that Pro-choicers are all for ‘helping’ the poor by killing their children. Is it because a poor child is worth less than a middle class child? Is it because you believe poverty is a life sentence and there is no hope for a child born into it to have a good life. This seems to what underlies the Pro-Choice movement.
Proverty is not a death sentence, unless it is poverty of spirit.
Posted by: Library Betty at October 6, 2007 2:48 PM
Great point LB.
There is a quick fix, cheap’n’easy element to the arguments of those who promote access to abortion. They are quick to point to situations they feel abortion would be the best remedy. They don’t always remember to fill in the phrase “the woman should have a choice in this case” because they believe abortion is better.
They often are called pro abortion because they argue for abortion more than for choice. I have seen comments here like,
if you have the right to keep your daughter from having an abortion, then I should have the right to force my daughter to have an abortion. This is clearly not arguing for education and thoughtful decision. It is an argument for abortion. There are also arguments against eduating women about abortion. Like, don’t show disgusting pictures. Well, abortion is violent and disgusting. A picture is just evidence. Photos are used to educate people on every topic imaginable.
Somg uses arguments that appeal to a person’s self interest, such as arguing for abortion as being cheaper birth. Probably because such arguments appeal to Somg, not, of course, to those who see each human life as priceless.
I tend to argue in terms of the interconnectedness of all humanity, which of course, does not appeal to some people.
There, you see? Again, the right-to-lifer (Anonymous) complains that government-subsidized abortion “isn’t a valid use of [his] hard earned money”.
In fact, government-subsidized abortion for indigent women ALLOWS people like Anonymous to KEEP MORE OF HIS HARD EARNED MONEY.
SOMG,
As I asked earlier, let’s see evidence of how the taxpayer keeps more of their hard earned money by the reduction of poverty, welfare dependency, child abuse, foster child care, illegitimacy, and the treatment of drug and alcohol addicted babies, all the social problems legal abortion was going to eliminate and save the taxpayers millions on.
Mary: Do you think you would lessen any of those problems by forcing pregnant women to grow their pregnancies and give birth to babies they didn’t want?
And no one ever said abortion would “eliminate” those problems or even that abortion would make them better than they used to be–just that they would be better with abortion generally available than they would without abortion.
SOMG,
Like I said, these babies are not as unwanted as you think they are. Also, show me where aborting the children of the poor has done so much to improve our society and save us tax dollars.
By the way SOMG, someone did in fact say abortion would solve these problems. In the early days of the abortion movement, this is exactly what the American public was promised by your predecessors, a solution to every imaginable social problem and saving untold millions in the process. Why do you think they were so anxious to get poor women on the abortion tables? It would solve all these problems and save us millions! There was also a little elitism and racism thrown in the mix as well. It was amazing how rich white men and women could speak so eloquently for the poor and/or minority woman, women they seldom concerned themselves with otherwise. You know, that WE know what’s best for THEM mentality.
I guess they were a bunch of liars trying to promote their agenda, eh SOMG? Also looks like they left you holding the bag!
SoMG —
I was the anonymous you referred to above — forgot to look before I posted.
My argument was not about the money per se, it was about the legitimacy of government spending money to provide abortions. Why is the government financially supporting this practice and with my tax dollars?
No, being pro-life isn’t about the money to me. In fact, that makes me laugh seeing as I am a single mother of an unplanned child. I don’t get support from anyone else and that’s okay with me. Money is not that important.
I support her myself and am just getting into the whole college search process. It will cost some money, but it is an investment for her. Chosing to have her in the first place was an investment in a better society. It has already been paying dividends to everyone who comes in contact with her.
Yes, we have been poor at times and struggled, but that can be dealt with and overcome. I just hate that pro-abortion folks cater to a women’s fears and tell them that having their baby will doom them to poverty and struggles.
As one who had many people try to sell me that story 16 years ago, I know they are offering a permanent solution to a temporary ‘problem’.
Yes, we have been poor at times and struggled, but that can be dealt with and overcome. I just hate that pro-abortion folks cater to a women’s fears and tell them that having their baby will doom them to poverty and struggles.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wait a minute…
YOU just copped to being poor and struggling, and then turn around and accuse pro-lifers of using that as a fear tactic?
No Honey, YOU are living proof that bringing a child into a bad situation will leave you poor and struggling.
I didn’t have to say a THING. You did all the talkin’.
Laura —
1st, don’t call me honey — then re-read all that I wrote.
Yes, having a child made life a little more difficult but money is not the reason to kill children. Having my daughter also made my life permanently RICHER. Temporary financial difficulties happen for a multitude reasons. Some people who are single have financial problems as do married couples with children.
I can tell from your posts that you are always eager to find problems and relish them — you don’t seem to grasp the notion of hope or positive change.
Have you aborted or convinced someone to do it?
Library Betty, you wrote “My argument was not about the money per se, it was about the legitimacy of government spending money to provide abortions. Why is the government financially supporting this practice and with my tax dollars? ”
You seem to have missed the point again. You pay LESS in tax dollars because of government-subsidized abortion for indigent women. If the government STOPPED providing abortions for indigent women, THAT would be the government spending your extra tax dollars. On forced labor and delivery against the patient’s will.
Mary, no, no one seriously said that abortion would SOLVE the problems you mentioned. To solve a problem means to make it stop being a problem. Whoever claimed legalizing abortion would create a world without any poverty? Maybe some author of a utopian novel. Or a subscriber to a utopian ideology, the way Marxists used to say that global communism would eliminate poverty. The serious futurists only said it would ALLEVIATE the problems. And it does.
By the way, Mary, I am pleased to see that you oppose “that WE know what’s best for THEM mentality.”
Let’s all agree to stop pretending we know best and let THEM (the patients) decide for themselves.
SOMG,
I am older than you and yes your predecessors did say abortion would cure poverty, illegitimacy, and welfare dependency, though child abuse was the big one. I remember bumper stickers that said “Stop child abuse, support abortion reform”. You name the social problem and abortion would solve it. No these were not Utopian writers, they were commentators, feminists, writers, to name just a few.
Alleviate the problems? OK, tell me what problems have been “alleviated”.
The two main problems which have been completely eliminated by legalizing abortion are: 1. The Problem of the Black Market in Abortion Services. This was a serious problem which maimed and killed women. Also 2. The Problem of Women Undergoing Pregnancy, Labor, and Delivery Against their Wills, which violated their personal freedom.
Regarding the other problems you mentioned: Are you seriously suggesting that these problems would be alleviated if we forced pregnant women to grow their pregnancies and give birth to babies they didn’t want?
SoMG —
No, I didn’t contradict myself. I am against the government paying for abortion because it is morally wrong. I don’t want my money spent on abortion it is not a valid use of public money.
You and Laura need to learn how to read for meaning and understanding. Well, perhaps that may give you a heartache.
LB, )once and for all, and then I’m going to stop repeating myself because it’s not penetrating,) your money is not SPENT on abortion. It is SAVED by abortion.
You may regard saving money in this way as immoral, but it’s a saving, not a spending.
You and Laura need to learn how to read for meaning and understanding. Well, perhaps that may give you a heartache.
Posted by: Library Betty at October 6, 2007 11:03 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Please. We’ve all heard your story.
Having a baby you couldn’t afford and living a barely tolerable existence has made you a noble, virtuous martyr for your cause.
(For drama’s sake, I will now wipe away a single tear from my cheek…)
I have a girlfriend in her 50’s. She aborted twice in her 20’s. She’s in menopause now, so children are no longer an option. This woman has remained in a cycle of poverty her entire life. Always living from the pillar to the post. She’s gone from one toxic relationship to another. She also regrets her abortions! How did having 2 abortions HELP her? She lives in a tiny apartment, and she works at a drug store making minimum wage. Yes, abortion solved it all!
Poverty is a state of mind!
Heather, I have other things to do besides correct your errors and foolishness. I agree that this would be a full-time job, but there just isn’t enough time in the day.
Posted by: SoMG at October 6, 2007 3:17 PM********************* LOL! There isn’t enough time in the day for you to disprove my factual posts! Score 2 for the PL team!
Also, there isn’t enough time in the day for me to cut and paste post after post about botched abortions and perverted abortion quacktitioners!
SOMG,
I do oppose the “WE know whats best for THEM” mentality and I’m a strong advocate of patients’ rights. I oppose abortion.
In the same vein I oppose domestic violence, that does not mean I take a “WE know what’s best for THEM” attitude toward married couples.
It amuses me that you all think spending time on this blog insulting each other is helping save teh babiezzz. Why don’t you go do something? Isn’t life chain day? For pete’s sake, quit whining and go display your idiocy in the fresh air.
pedgehog, Ah, you’re here, aren’t you?
pedgehog, I remember you now. You work in an abortion mill. That’s so horrible. How on earth do you do it?
SOMG,
Please show us how our money has been saved by abortion.
Black market in abortion services has been eliminated? Sure, and we’ve replaced it with unregulated, unlicensed dirty “clinics” staffed by untrained, unqualified people where women are aborted by sex offenders and drug addicts, and all the other dregs of the medical profession. SOMG, get over your naive notion that legalizing anything puts the criminal element out of business. All too often it only makes it easier for the criminal element to function and profit.
I knew a nurse who worked in New York City who saw women come into the ER after aborting themselves. When I asked her if these women couldn’t have obtained legal abortions she laughed in my face. In New York City they’re given away, she told me, there’s an abortion clinic on every street corner. Any woman, whatever her circumstances can get an abortion.
When I asked her why these women would self abort she only shrugged and said, “damned if I know”.
Women undergoing pregnancy against their wills?
Some statistics or sources please. Since your side argues that women who wanted abortions always got them anyway, why would there ever have been a problem of women undergoing pregnancy against their wills?
Mary, you wrote: “we’ve replaced [the black marked in abortion] with unregulated, unlicensed dirty “clinics” staffed by untrained, unqualified people where women are aborted by sex offenders and drug addicts, and all the other dregs of the medical profession. ”
Then why is the complication rate from legal abortion so low? The mortality of legal abortion is less than one death per hundred thousand abortions, more than ten times safer than childbirth, and safer than injecting penicillin into a patient. How could this be if abortion clinics were staffed by the dregs of the medical profession?
Then why is the complication rate from legal abortion so low? The mortality of legal abortion is less than one death per hundred thousand abortions, more than ten times safer than childbirth, and safer than injecting penicillin into a patient. How could this be if abortion clinics were staffed by the dregs of the medical profession?
Posted by: SoMG at October 7, 2007 11:36 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Liposuction kills about TWENTY per 100,000 procedures. Where are the “right-to-lifers” with their signs?
SOMG,
Is the mortality rate so low, or does it just go unreported? I’ve seen and know women treated for complications of abortion SOMG, and as far as I know, their complications were treated and they were released, there was no reporting to any particular agency. At least I was never involved in any reporting after caring for such patients.
Also, if illegal abortion was so deadly how do you explain the fact that the year before Roe v Wade, the death rate from illegal abortion was at an all time low after steadily decreasing for years?
SOMG, if you don’t consider sex offenders, drug addicts, and doctors who have lost their licenses for gross malpractice the dregs of the medical profession, then you are of a far more charitable nature than I am.
Mary, where did you get the idea that “sex offenders, drug addicts, and doctors who have lost their licenses for gross malpractice ” were the ones staffing abortion clinics?
Let me guess–you got it from a right-to-life propaganda site, whose mission is to scare women out of having abortions. Not a reliable source.
Abortion clinics are regulated and monitored like any other medical clinic. How else would they close down bad clinics like the one in NJ? That’s the system working to keep abortion safe.
12/19/2005
Sen. Barbara Boxer Demands Immediate Suspension of Abortionist’s License
Operation Rescue Applauds Boxer’s Effort to Stop Laurence Reich
PANORAMA CITY, Calif., Dec. 19 /Christian Wire Service/ — Senator Barbara Boxer, known for her rabidly pro-abortion views, has demanded that the Osteopathic Medical Board of California immediately suspend the license of Abortionist Laurence Reich.
In a strongly worded letter, Boxer referred to a recent CNN report about Reich that detailed Reich’s criminal past as a sexual predator, but failed to mention that he is an abortionist.
“I never thought I would agree with Barbara Boxer on anything, but I whole-heartedly support her demand for the immediate suspension of abortionist Laurence Reich’s license in the interest of public safety,” said Operation Rescue President Troy Newman. “If someone like Sen. Boxer can see that this abortionist is a danger to the community, you know he must be a very dangerous man.”
Operation Rescue reported on October 31, 2005, that Reich, a frequent focus of Operation Rescue demonstrations, had been convicted of sexually molesting his patients in 2002, but three years later the Osteopathic Medical Board still had not decided upon appropriate discipline. Reich had previously been convicted of sexually abusing his patients in incidents stemming back to the 1970s and was placed on 10 years probation, which was completed in 1994.
Reich is listed as the “medical director” for a small chain of Southern California abortion mills called Clinica Medica Para La Mujer De Hoy. According to the owner of the abortion mills, Bertha Bugarin, the chain targets women in the Hispanic community.
“We believe that Reich has found that the Hispanic Community is the perfect stalking grounds for his sexual attacks,” said OR spokesperson Cheryl Sullenger, who has followed Reich’s nefarious career and lodged complaints against him. “Women who may be in the U.S. illegally are especially vulnerable to exploitation because they are less likely to report a man like him to the authorities. We applaud Senator Boxer’s efforts to stop Reich from further exploiting women.”
EXPOS?LINKS ABORTION INDUSTRY WITH SEX ABUSE CRIMES
Planned Parenthood and National Abortion Federation Caught Aiding Sex
Predators
PHILADELPHIA, May 21, 2002 (LSN.ca) – A startling new investigation exposing
the partnership between Planned Parenthood, the National Abortion Federation and men who sexually abuse underage girls has been unveiled by Life Dynamics Inc. (LDI). LDI President Mark Crutcher will officially present the findings of the investigation at Human Life International’s Weekend Conference in Philadelphia on Saturday. He states that: ?The American abortion industry has chosen to become paid accomplices of the pedophiles and sexual deviants who target underage girls.”
Crutcher will reveal details of an undercover investigation recently conducted by Life Dynamics. The investagion shows pro-abortion organizations consistently fail to adhere to state and federal laws concerning reporting child sexual abuse and statutory rape. For the investigation, LDI obtained information from government sources, medical journals and independent researchers. But the most incriminating evidence came from the abortion industry itself: “.[LDI] conducted a covert survey in which we called over 800 Planned Parenthood and National Abortion Federation facilities across the country,” Crutcher reports. “.The results of this survey were appalling.”
According to Crutcher’s newly released booklet Child Predators, “among girls 15 and younger who get pregnant, between 60 to 80 percent are impregnated by adult men.. [Life Dynamics’] investigation has uncovered irrefutable evidence that both Planned Parenthood and the National Abortion Federation-often operating on taxpayer dollars-knowingly conceal these crimes while aiding and abetting the sexual predators who commit them.”
A report on the findings by WorldNetDaily reveals that one pro-life researcher portrayed a 13-year-old girl made pregnant by a 22-year-old boyfriend. The teen-girl imposter telephoned over 800 Planned Parenthood and NAF facilities across the country. “Her story was that she wanted an abortion because she and her boyfriend did not want her parents to find out about the sexual relationship,” the summary stated.
“In the final analysis,” said the summary report, “virtually every Planned Parenthood and NAF facility we contacted was willing to illegally conceal the sexual abuse of this 13-year-old girl.” The investigation found the abortion clinic workers “willing – and in many cases, eager – to help this child hide from her parents and the authorities the fact that she was being sexually exploited.”
Order a copy of the summary report by Life Dynamics:
http://www.lifedynamics.com/Products/index.cfm?fuseaction=Pr…
See the WorldNetDaily coverage:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=276…
——————————————————————————–
(c) Copyright: LifeSiteNews.com. Permission to republish is granted (with limitation*) but acknowledgement
Mary, where did you get the idea that “sex offenders, drug addicts, and doctors who have lost their licenses for gross malpractice ” were the ones staffing abortion clinics?
***********************************************
Why don’t you tell us why Brian Finkel got away with sexually abusing his abortion patients for 2 decades.
Abortion clinics are regulated and monitored like any other medical clinic. How else would they close down bad clinics like the one in NJ? That’s the system working to keep abortion safe.
Posted by: SoMG at October 7, 2007 12:52 PM*********************************************** Well the reason they closed it was because they almost killed a woman. That sounds like a great reason.
What about John Burt? He ran a “safe house” for pregnant teenagers called “Our Father’s House”. Now he’s serving time for molesting his clients.
Conclusion (Using Heather-type reasoning): All right-to-life agencies, including all CPCs, are staffed by child molestors.
Abortionist Nabil Ghali was sentenced to six months in prison for 47 counts of felonious sexual penetration and 29 counts of gross sexual imposition involving 25 of his female patients. He performed abortions despite having his license revoked for lying on his application for a medical license and for concealing an earlier conviction for molesting his 14-year old goddaughter. Ghali lost his license to practice medicine in Kentucky after numerous lawsuits were filed against him for medical malpractice (including killing a woman) and sexual abuse of patients, including children, and moved on to do abortions in Florida, and then Ohio, where he racked up similar records. Among the numerous lawsuits against Ghali for botched abortions was one by a woman who had her bladder removed without her permission.
As usual, the abortionist offered excuses for his horrible negligence and abuse for women, and whined that he was a victim.
Ghali filed suit against the medical board and alleged anti-Arab bias in the revocation of his Florida medical license. The Miami Herald quoted his attorney as saying, “We believe the proceedings were unfair and violated his rights to due process. We will pursue those issues as long and as far as we can.” Ghali’s complaint for an injunction against revocation of license states “DPR and the Board are causing Dr. Ghali irreparable harm. They are preventing him from practicing medicine and from earning a livelihood. They are preventing him from caring for his patients and from honoring other commitments and obligations related to his practice. They are causing irreparable damage to his reputation among his patients, in the community and in his profession.”
Ghali’s license was revoked in Kentucky (1987), Florida (1987), New York (1987), and California (1988) following convictions in Kentucky on four counts of unlawful sexual transaction with a minor in 1982. The 14-year-old daughter of friends testified Ghali offered her a massage, then took off her bathing suit, rubbed his penis between her legs, and penetrated her vagina with his penis and his fingers. The girl testified that on another occasion Ghali tripped her and rubbed his penis between her legs, penetrating her vagina with his penis and fingers, asking her if she had had enough. Medical board documents indicate that he also engaged in cunnilingus with the girl. She is quoted as saying, “I knew it wasn’t right … I guess I trusted him and cared for him. We were really good friends.” She told her stepsister about the encounters when she thought she had become pregnant. At the trial an 8-year-old girl testified indicated she’d seen Ghali touch other children’s chests and genital areas and that he had touched her chest; her 12-year-old sister testified that she saw Ghali put his hand up a 5-year-old girl’s shirt while she was sitting on his lap. Both girls also described an “airplane game” Ghali allegedly played with children he invited to his home for parties, which involved picking the children up and spinning them, touching their chests or groins.
Ghali’s Ohio license was also suspended in 1984 and his Utah license was revoked in 1985 for making false statements in renewal applications; he denied the disciplinary actions that had been taken against him by Kentucky. The Florida medical board also stated that he filed for license under false application, stating he had only one malpractice suit against him when the board was aware of four. In his 1986 application for renewal of his Ohio license he failed to disclose suspension of his Utah license. In his 1988 application for renewal of his Ohio license he indicated that he had not been disciplined since his last application when in fact his license had been revoked in New York, California, and Florida. He also gave similar false information in application for privileges at three hospitals in 1989 and 1990. The Ohio Medical Board said, “the evidence shows a long-term pattern of repeated fraud. Such behavior on Dr. Ghali’s part provides no foundation for a continued relationship between him and the Board, which is charged with regulating licensees and protecting the public.”
Ghali also owned the Blue Coral Medical Center abortion mill, which was temporarily shut down under an emergency order describing “deplorable conditions,” including a suction device with “green mold” growing in it; improperly discarded bloodstained sponges; generally poor infection control; about 70 different kinds of medication with expired dates; unsafely administered general anesthesia; stirrups covered with blood; and untrained workers monitoring women in recovery. An inspector was quoted as saying, “When we got there, there wasn’t any soap in the place, so our inspectors had to go next door to wash their hands.” Eager to continue making money, the abortionist opened Blue Coral under stipulations as soon as he possibly could.
Ghali also worked at Miami’s notorious Dadeland abortion mill, where his quackery contributed to the death of abortion patient Ellen Williams.
What about John Burt? He’s behind bars, right? GOOD! LOCK HIM UP! I am not the one defending sex offenders. You are!
I didn’t realize that Ghali was a pedophile. GROSS!
Heather you defend right-to-lifers. As my previous post established, right-to-lifers are all sex offenders. Therefore, you are defending sex offenders!
This is why people get ticked off at abortionists. What if it was your loved one? Your mom, sister, wife, or friend? What are people to think?
All RTLfers are sex offenders? Proof please.
Somg, stop side stepping my posts. Why are all abortionists sex offenders?
I already cited the example of John Burt. Using Heather-style reasoning, this one example allow us to infer that all right-to-lifers are sex offenders.
Also, I am a RTLfer. I assure you that I am not a sex offender.
Somg, you are cornered again. You sited one person. More please.
Yes, you are. The example of John Burt, using Heather-type logic, leads us to the conclusion that all rtls are sex offenders, including you.
Somg, very funny. Can you prove that? Can I call you Donald Trump?
I wonder if John Britton was a sex offender. I pray for that man’s soul. I wonder what happens to people who leave this world,especially those who performed evil deeds.
It’s already proven, using Heather-type logic, by the example of John Burt. No further proof necessary, using Heather-type logic.
SOMG,
You guess wrong. I got the information from this blog. Heather has listed several documented cases and is now again listing documented cases. Thankfully, since your memory appears short.
Oh, and in a clinic not far from us, the abortionist, a cocaine addict and wife beater, was finally forced to close his clinic.
The New Jersey clinic did not get in that deplorable condition overnight. Regular inspections, which the clinic obviously was not too concerned about, would have shut them down long before these deplorable conditions ever arose.
The difference between a rusty coathanger and a rusty crochet hook is what? The rusty crochet hook was used in the New Jersey Clinic.
Also, check the Operation Rescue website for more documented clinic shutdowns and why, as well as for abortionists I referred to as dregs.
Mary, thank you for the back up! I appreciate that so much! Anyone can run a check through their search engine, and these stories are easily found. Some people want to stay in denial, I guess.
Mary, Jill’s blog, and the OR web site, are exactly what I said: right-to-life propaganda sites, whose mission is to scare women out of having abortions. Not reliable sources.
Lists of bad practicioners prove nothing about the profession as a whole (except to Heather–hee hee!). I could make equally long lists of bad practicioners and sex offenders in ANY profession. It’s just a matter of taking the time and trouble to find out their names.
The examples of Larry Craig and David Vitter, using Heather-type logic, prove that all Republican senators are sex offenders.
Somg, try again. You have to start backing up your facts, because I don’t believe you. Who cares where the info came from? Are you trying to say that these things never happened? I’d welcome you to prove me wrong. I wish you could. Go for it.
The examples of Larry Craig and David Vitter, using Heather-type logic, prove that all Republican senators are sex offenders.
Posted by: SoMG at October 7, 2007 1:45 PM*******************************They are? Well, LOCK THEM UP!
No, Heather, you’ve already proven it. According to your logic, a few examples of bad abortionists means all abortionists are bad.
Similarly, one example of a right-to-life child molester means all right-to-lifers, including you, are child molesters. I bet you molest your own children. I bet Jill Stanek does too! I don’t even need to bet–the example of John Burt proves it, according to your logic. Someone should turn you over to the feds.
And two examples of Republican senators who are sex offenders mean that all Republican senators are sex offenders.
An abortion clinic in my state closed a year and a half ago. The abortionist was a nut job, and I heard about the clinic closing on the local news. I also found the story on pro life sites. What is your point? Just because it’s on a pro life site, does not make it a bogus tale.
Somg, what kind of drugs do you do? I’m serious.
Obstetricians are FAR AND AWAY the most heavily litigated practicioners in all of medicine.
They must all be terrible doctors or they wouldn’t get sued so much.
Obstetrics should be outlawed in the US. It is a field that clearly attracts the worst of the worst.
Heather, you are the druggie here. You have admitted that you often use the most lethal recreational drug of all–Alcohol, which kills more people every year than all other recreational drugs combined.
somg, you should be turned over to the feds for making death threats.
SOMG,
Obviously what you consider propaganda sites is different from what I do. If you can show me documentation to prove your point, fine. I don’t care what site I get it from.
Can you prove any of the documented incidents on these sites are false? If so, I’m all eyes. If not, then you can hardly call them propaganda.
Heather,
You might want to lock up Bill Clinton as well, you know our possible future “first flasher”.
somg, i drink socially. it’s my body and it’s my choice.
Heather, in other words, you are an alcohol addict.
Mary, LOL!!!!!! ROFLMAO!!!
Laura drinks. What does that make her. Now you can make a DX over the net?
An alcoholic and a social drinker are different.
Laura,
I’m afraid what OBs attract are patients who demand the gift of prophecy from their doctors, not to mention total perfection and blissful outcomes. That’s the reason for the litigation.
I can well remember the days when a less than perfect child was simply accepted as “an Act of God”. Please no religious debates. That was simply how it was viewed. Now its something the OB should have had the power to predict and prevent.
Mary, do you still not understand this? Lists of examples of bad practicioners prove NOTHING about the profession as a whole. And they say NOTHING about how safe abortion is. Similar lists could be made about any profession.
I’m starting to suspect that you are pretending to be stupider than you are. It’s really not necessary.
Somg, I’m laughing at your posts today. You really can’t keep it together. You’re gonna lose it in the turn.
Yes, Heather, and you are both.
How often do you go to sleep drunk? My bet: very often.
Have you ever shared alcohol with your children?
Mary and stupid don’t belong in the same sentence. Nice feeble try though.
Somg, you really are in the sandbox…LOL!
Pro lifers win again!
Heather,
Thank you for the kind words.
SOMG,
Please, take a break. I’m really tired of recycling these old arguments and waiting for you to properly address the issues being raised here. You asked about bad practitioners, you were given a list and the sources plus other sites you can check out yourself. Take them or leave them. You know its time to unwind with a good glass of red(better antioxidants)wine and collect your thoughts when you have to start resorting to sandbox tactics.
Laura,
I’m afraid what OBs attract are patients who demand the gift of prophecy from their doctors, not to mention total perfection and blissful outcomes. That’s the reason for the litigation.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yeah, and when some moron decides to leave laminaria and gauze in her cervix for three weeks, ignores aftercare advice and refuses examination and treatment for her infection, people on this board blame the abortion practitioner for her death. (According to the local news she was also positive for three different controlled substances…)
Holly Patterson defied her aftercare instructions, and never told the emergency room she went to that she had taken RU-486 or that she was pregnant and having an abortion – just that she was having fever and a tummyache.
To obstetricians get sued for situations beyond their control – YES!
Do abortion practitioners get sued for situations beyond their control – YES!
Read the story of Christen Gilbert’s abortion-related death and see if the details don’t stink to high heaven…
And what about all those Catholic priests being sued for molesting choirboys? All right-to-lifers, and all child-molesters. Hmmmmmmmmmmm!
If you believe in Heather-type logic (which I suppose should also be called Mary-type logic) you can’t avoid the conclusion: All right-to-lifers are sex offenders.
Did I mention that BATHROOM-FAGGOT Senator Larry Craig and WHORE-MONGER Senator David Vitter are both right-to-lifers?
I personally know a woman who had a many-year-long affair with a Catholic priest. Yes, they had sex regularly.
Buggering choir boys is just the tip of the iceberg, with these guys.
Laura,
The woman who had the laminaria inserted had it done by a nurse practitioner, not an OB. I’m not certain who administered the drug to Holly Patterson.
Concerning Christen Gilbert. The details do stink to the high heavens, especially the part where 911 was called and put on hold, then told they only needed a transport, when in fact Christen was a pulseless non-breather who Tiller’s staff was performing CPR on. Honestly Laura, I’ve heard of schoolchildren, even family pets, exercising better judgment.
Not properly informing 911 as to how serious a situation is can result in inadequate help being sent.
Christen’s “care” while waiting for her abortion to occur was in a hotel where she was supervised by a non-credentialled employee who apparently didn’t recognize how critically ill Christen was becoming. You’d think the local health department would have some issue with the use of the hotel for aborting patients. Personally I wouldn’t stay in that place. This was common practice for Tiller’s clinic, where such employees could supervise care and even administer drugs. You’d think a licensing and regulation board would have some issue with this. Check Tiller’s website yourself and tell me if you find the credentials of the people who work there.
Pro lifers win again!
Posted by: heather at October 7, 2007 2:35 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Really?
I’m willing to bet that as many as 4000 American women walk into a clinic tomorrow and exercise their right to terminate a pregnancy. In fact, I bet that will happen every day this year.
What exactly have pro-lifers won?
SOMG,
Please, take my advise. I promise, you’ll feel a lot better.
And what about Randall Terry, founder of Operation Rescue? He was kicked out of his church for serial adulteries with multiple partners. Now he wants to be welcomed into the Catholic Church.
And Randall Tobias, Bush’s abstinance czar, who resigned because he was outed as a WHOREMONGER.
No doubt about it: All right-to-lifers are sexual devients of one kind or another.
“Devients”. Spelling error. Sorry about that. Should be deviants.
Heather and Mary, good job today! SoMG appears to be unraveling before our very eyes.
And don’t forget Dr. David Hager, the Bush administration’s appointee to the Advisory Committee for Reproductive Health Drugs, a very active right-to-lifer–who subjected his wife to years of anal rape.
Carrie,
Thank you. I really wish SOMG would follow my advice though.
The list just goes on and on, doesn’t it?
Mary, I really think SoMG is congratulating himself right now for his self-perceived cleverness. He must have taken your advice and then some. Newsflash-SoMg has been detained for blogging under the influence.
What do you mean? I thought you guys found lists of examples convincing.
SoMG, is confusion starting to set in?
In their own words…
“In our “clinic”, we were killing or maiming one out of every 500 women who came to us for an abortion.” – Carol Everett, former owner/administrator of several death mills in the Dallas, TX area.
SoMG, how many fingers am I holding up?
Mary and Carrie, just took a nap. I was reading over the posts and I realized that we have still won. Thank you, Save Our Sisters! Laura, if 4000 women aborted today, then they still lose. They don’t know what joy those children would have brought them. We still in his debate. Mary, you are correct about the recycling part. Talk about old and tired. Sheesh. I must give Warren Hern credit for telling the truth.
Should read win this debate
What do you mean? I thought you guys found lists of examples convincing.
Posted by: SoMG at October 7, 2007 4:27 PM******************************** Not really. Lock up all sex offenders! That’s the bottom line. I don’t care what they do and who they are. You should be saying the same thing about abortionists.
Not really. Lock up all sex offenders! That’s the bottom line. I don’t care what they do and who they are. You should be saying the same thing about abortionists.
Posted by: heather at October 7, 2007 5:55 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Who has ever argued with the jailing of sex offenders?
Every person on this board wants sex offenders jailed. I’ve never heard anyone suggest otherwise.
Somg, you kept mentioning “whoremongers”..you forgot Bill Clinton. Laura, Somg has never said anything about supporting any jail time for sex offending abortionists. I asked him if he’d ever thought about molesting his patients. He never gave me a straight answer.
Heather, is SoMG an abortionist?
Laura, Somg has never said anything about supporting any jail time for sex offending abortionists.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I’ve always maintained that sex offenders should go to prison (or be destroyed outright.)
I’ve expressed that very sentiment on this board over and over and over…
Somg, you kept mentioning “whoremongers”..you forgot Bill Clinton.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Really?
David Vitter has copped to soliciting prostitutes. When did President Clinton do that?
Carrie, he has claimed to have some affiliation with the abortion industry. He talks about the procedure here a lot. We think so. Some have speculated that he could be George Tiller. Some think he’s a troll. He has contradicted himself a few times. It’s still a mystery.
Laura, I don’t even care to discuss Bill Clinton anymore. Carry on, Bill and Hill. Good for the 2 of you. As I’ve stated before, at least we agree about ANY sex offender needing incarceration. I don’t care if it’s a priest or an abortionist.
SoMG, you seem to take as much pleasure in detailing sexual deviancy as the deviants themselves do in committing it. I, for one, would be delighted to learn that the perps you name were innocent, after all, although I know that Randall Terry, at least, is guilty as charged. I would want them proven innocent; you probably would want the acts they committed dissociated from any moral censure and therefore called “innocent”. Planned Parenthood seems to call any sexual act guiltless unless it is committed, fruitful, heterosexual marriage…then they belittle it like crazy. You’re on the right track, though, in calling adultery, fornication and sodomy deviant; now if you would take a shot at consistency, you might get it all right eventually.
Maybe you pcs are so deviant yourselves that even deviancy by proxy is better for you than no deviancy at all (?!), which many of us in the prolife movement would love to see. But, it would considerably cut down on business at the baby butchering hellholes you so perversely insist upon calling “reproductive health clinics”, which I’m sure no Proabort would like to see.
Laura, I don’t even care to discuss Bill Clinton anymore.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
YOU brought up Bill Clinton.
YOU hauled his name into this thread less than an hour ago.
I don’t think he’s Tiller. That guy would never have this kind of time on his hands. Too busy killing babies. He may have worked for Tiller. He just thinks the world of the guy. Very odd, if you ask me. Either way, this guy is a definate sociopath.
Thank you jtm!
jtm, BTW, well put!!
Heather, I don’t think he’s Tiller either. I think he’s a Tiller wannabe. I think he aspires to be Tiller.
Bill Clinton didn’t solicit prostitutes? Why should he? It doesn’t sound like there’s been any shortage of ladies to accomodate his urges.
Carrie, I agree. He knows all about the abortion procedure. He has claimed to work in a hospital.[I hope his patients are watching their pillows] He has told us what an aborted “fetus” looks like. Maybe he just reads a lot of med books. Maybe he’s a flunky. Maybe it’s a she.
Mary, LOL!
Carrie, I left out the most important part. He has made several death threats here directed at the families of Shelly Shannon {shot, and wounded George Tiller] and Paul Hill {shot and killed abortionist, John Britton] Shelly is serving time, and Paul Hill has since been executed. What kind of logic is that? Poor Jill has to keep deleting these posts.
Would you incarcerate the parents of Scott Peterson, because Scott is a killer?
What kind of logic is that? Poor Jill has to keep deleting these posts.
Posted by: heather at October 7, 2007 7:21 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We all remember the last posts deleted from this board – you know – your totally insane rant? The one where YOU wanted people dead?
It’s good to know that people can use that kind of language and stay on this board.
Who did I want dead?
Laura, you aren’t very tightly wrapped anyway. What about you and your rants about “fetus boy,” as you so called him, being hauled off in an ambulance? You added “I got my wish.” Ah, proof that you have some psyco tendancies.
Just because someone disagrees with your views, you would wish them dead? I met Belladonna and Jenna Jameson while I was in Las Vegas. Both women gave me a big hug and a kiss. I don’t agree with what they do, but I don’t wish them any ill will. They were both very sweet.
Laura, I just remembered that your posts were also were deleted a few times. I am allowed to stay, so you will see me on here.
Somg, paging…..why didn’t you answer a single question today? I told you that I was going to start putting up those posts. Would you care to reply?
Somg, the “Eric Rudolph” of the PC side.
Did I mention that BATHROOM-FAGGOT Senator Larry Craig and WHORE-MONGER Senator David Vitter are both right-to-lifers?
Posted by: SoMG at October 7, 2007 2:59 PM
************************************************* Attention Pro choicers! The last time the word FAGGOT was used here, it was used by a pro lifer. You guys jumped all over him! Are you going to slam the pro choicer in the same fashion for using the same word?
Another right-to-lifer and sexual deviant: Justice Clarence Thomas(?)
I bet there are more sexually deviant right-to-lifers than there are sexually deviant abortion doctors.
SoMg, isn’t it kind of early for a liquid lunch?
You’d have to ask Heather about that.
I bet there are more sexually deviant right-to-lifers than there are sexually deviant abortion doctors.
Posted by: SoMG at October 8, 2007 6:02 AM
*************** I doubt it.
Yes, Heather, I’ll bet everything I own that if you counted the number of sexually deviant right-to-lifers in the USA, and counted the number of sexually deviant abortion docs in the USA, the right-to-lifers would be many times more numerous.
Start making your list. I’ll be waiting for it.
Carrie, LOL!
Heather, I think SoMG is just some teenager living in his parents’ basement who picked up some medical books for some light reading. The more he posts the more obvious it becomes.
Carrie, it very well could be. I’ve noticed that he has really been acting childish.
I think SoMG has just been exposed.
Proving that either some abortionists or some rtl activists are guilty of this or that crime is not central to discussion of the morality of legal access to abortion.
Mental illness is evenly distributed among all socio-economic groups, in general.
This is why you see dropouts, doctors, college students, parents, singles etc. as terrorists.
Exposing the worst doctors simply reinforces this with evidence, although we do need to be reminded from time to time of it.
What concerns me is a generalized movement toward thinking abortion helps people without looking at the information objectively. Has anyone seen an objective longintudinal study of post abortive women? It seems that would aid in understanding.
I am very concerned when people don’t want certain questions asked because the evidence may not support their view.
What also concerns me is the general complicity of those who oppose abortion. I mean all those who say they would never have an abortion because it is wrong but if someone else does, oh well.
We have seen this complicity allow the suffering of slavery and the mass execution of different groups throughout history.
I am concerned when people argue for abortion instead of life or even choice. This is especially disturbing in light of the social ills such as homes without fathers (and their income), rising STD rates, rising child abuse rates, continued high rates of unwanted pregnancies. How can you argue for something that lacks evidence of a positive social impact?
Even utilitarian arguments are terribly weak, like saving a few bucks now on obstetric care, and losing the contribution of 40plus years of a person’s working life to the economy. This is more important every day as our population is aging.
Women who abort are throwing away the happiness that comes with one of the most personal and meaningful connections of what it means to be human and reaching out for material gain that will never make them happy.
Hippie, you wrote: “Proving that either some abortionists or some rtl activists are guilty of this or that crime is not central to discussion of the morality of legal access to abortion.”
Heather and Mary seem to think it is.
Anyway, Carrie, all you need to know about me is this: I am smarter than you, and I know more about abortion than you do.
hippie, I always love your posts! Well put. As I have stated before, I have a friend in her 50’s who aborted twice while in her 20’s. [see above post]…Weren’t the abortions suppossed to help her to improve her life? If so, why did she turn to booze? Why didn’t she ever get an education, and why did she go from one dysfunctional relationship after another? Another lady is a former co worker of mine. She’s also in her 50’s, and she aborted 3 times. She did manage to get some schooling, but she’s not able to maintain employment d/t a drinking problem. She cried to me a few months back about her abortions. I asked her if she regretted them. Her reply, “Oh my God, yes.” She says “I’m older now, and all I have is my dog.” “I’m going to die alone.”..Isn’t that sad?
Somg, you are not smarter than Carrie.
Heather, how would you know?
Hippie, I seriously doubt that the pc crowd would even want a long-term study on the effects of abortion on women. They don’t want to know. If it was proposed, I am sure NOW,NARAL, and PP among others would fight it tooth and nail. Just like they fight every other measure that would shine a light on the evil that abortion truly is. Let’s shine a flashlight on the cockroaches and watch them scurry!
Somg, proof please LOL! How’s the basement?
Carrie, excellent post! NOW and NARAL oly have a political agenda to satisfy. They don’t care about women at all.
SoMG, you must really be filled with self-doubt. Only someone who didn’t feel they were smart would need to proclaim they were. If someone is truly smart, they don’t need to shout it out. It would be obvious in how they conduct themselves and how they ponder life’s questions.
Carrie, correct again.
Most PCers don’t want to admit that PAS exists. They are quick to call poor Dr. Reardon a “quack.” Dr. Reardon cared enough about women to study PAS. If NOW or NARAL ever cared to admit that, that would just be one more strike against them. Dr. Reardon is a quack? Did he ever molest women like your wonderful abortionists did?
Fearless on Abortion
Posted October 5, 2006 | 04:40 PM (EST)
——————————————————————————–
Read More: Breaking Living Now News, Gloria Steinem, Kathy Najimy, Anne Archer
Amidst a growing media buzz, the “We Had Abortions” issue of Ms. Magazine will hit the newsstands next week. Listed by name will be over 1,000 of the 5000 women who reportedly have signed Ms.’s petition acknowledging that they’ve had abortions. The rest of the names will appear on Ms.’s website.
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Kudos to Ms. I spent several years being about a similar business. I wrote a book, The Choices We Made: 25 Women and Men Speak Out About Abortion. It not only named names (mostly famous ones), but also recounted the intimate details of each person’s abortion experience. The book came out in 1991, on the heels of two U.S. Supreme Court decisions restricting a woman’s access to abortion, and two pro-choice D.C. demonstrations that attracted a total of nearly one million people.
Gloria Steinem pitched the idea for the book, to be focused on well-known personalities, to Random House, which took me on as the author. I had no idea what celebrities would agree to be in such a book, but it was my job to find them. So I wrote a letter, the oddest letter I’ve ever written, saying, You don’t know me, and I don’t know whether you’ve ever had an abortion, but if you have, would you like to talk to me about it?
To my great surprise, out of a deep commitment to keeping abortion legal and despite the risks of what others would think, people agreed. I talked with Fatal Attraction star Anne Archer, who wept as she recounted her steps into a ramshackle building in Mexico for an illegal abortion. I heard actress and singer Polly Bergen’s harrowing story of the kitchen-table abortion that cost her her fertility, and retired marine Jim Friedl’s devastating recollection of his 27-year-old mother’s death at home from an overdose of a drug she had taken to abort.
I spoke with Reverend Christine Grimbol at her Long Island, New York, church about the legal abortion she had as a lonely young woman, while her eight-year-old son slipped love notes under the door. And I met with actress Kathy Najimy, who grew up Catholic and had a legal abortion. “When you do something like that,” she said in her show Parallel Lives, “you do it because for you it is your only choice. The sad thing is you really want to be able to feel bad about it without feeling wrong.”
For months, I fielded calls from all manner of celebrities as they considered my request. One day I picked up the phone and a woman said: “Hold the line for Katherine Hepburn.” I promptly dropped the receiver, retrieved it, and was immediately chastised by Hepburn. She said in her croaky voice that “This is a ri-dic-ulous idea for a book.” She said it flew in the face of the very principle of choice, that the decision to have or not have a child must be a private one. I told her the book was Gloria Steinem’s idea.
Of course, I didn’t agree with Hepburn. I agreed with Gloria, who wrote in the foreword to The Choices We Made: “From the prisoners whose stories started the storming of the Bastille and the French Revolution to the ‘speaking bitterness’ groups of China, from the church ‘testifying’ that started the Civil Rights movement to the consciousness-raising that began this most recent wave of feminism, populist truth-telling has been the heart and soul of movements and revolutions all over the world.”
In the 15 years since my book was originally published, the battle over abortion has turned deadly, with doctors murdered and workers lying wounded at their desks. Along with the violence has come vilification. In a premonition of what was to come, a young actress who had had a legal abortion told me why she decided she couldn’t be in my book. “There’s real sympathy for women who had illegal abortions,” she said. “They’re the martyrs. I feel like a criminal.”
Judie Brown, American Life League president, sees women who have had abortions in just that way. On her website, she wrote: “When I saw the Ms. Magazine invitation to join the new ‘We had Abortions’ petition campaign, the evil practically jumped right off the page.”
Naming names forces a confrontation. It flies in the face of the cross-cultural inability to integrate the virgin and the whore, the spiritual, nurturing woman with the passionate, sexual one. Whatever our moral and ethical issues are about abortion–and there are many–it makes clear that the women who have abortions are not alien and apart. They are, as they have always been, our mothers, our grandmothers, and our great-grandmothers. The women in my book had collectively mothered fifty-two biological, adopted, and step-sons and daughters; they had twenty-eight grandchildren and six great-grandchildren.
Of her reason for participating in my book, actress Anne Archer said, “It is only through the personal stories of women who have had abortions that we will come to understand what the human experience is.” With 26 million women having abortions each year in countries where it is legal, and 20 million in countries where it is restricted or illegal (and where over 70,000 women will die), we still don’t have any idea what that human experience really is.
The more women who bravely step forward to tell us, the closer we are likely to get.
If you haven’t already visited our new Becoming Fearless section, click here for more blog posts, news stories, and special features on relationships, work, parenting, health, sex . . . life.
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Check out these whiners. Always going for shock value.
Heather thinks women who lost their fertility to illegal abortion are “whiners”.
What about you, Jill, what do you think?
SoMG:
I’m disappointed in you. “I’m smart and You’re not” is a bit beneath you, don’t you think?
I also think we can agree that there are sexual deviants in every profession out there. The only reason why abortionist sexual deviants come up is because this is a blog about abortion.
__________
Heather – what has always amazed me is that Ms. Magazine only got 5,000 signatures! According to Guttmatcher institute there are over 1 million abortion every year and they could only get 5,000! If I remember correctly it was an “open” internet petition as well.
Also, it amazes me when the PC crowd states that a research isn’t valid because it was a pro lifer who did the research. Do they really think that someone who has scientifically proven that the “fetus” is a living human who has the sensory capability to feel pain is going to be Pro-Choice! I always refer to the Guttmatcher institute because I actually do find most of there information valid. They give to and receive money from Planned Parenthood.
_______________
Anywho… Thanks to everyone who kept this as civil as possible. It is difficult at times, I know!
*smooches* to everyone.
Somg, abortions today are costing women their fertility.
valerie, hello, and thank you! I wonder if Ms. Magazine will visit women’s prisons and get convicted murderers to sign a page that says “We killed someone.”
Ms. magazine names women who had abortions” – AP
It starts so proud:
New York (AP) – At a pivotal time in the abortion debate, Ms. magazine is releasing its fall issue next week with a cover story titled ?We Had Abortions,? accompanied by the names of thousands of women nationwide who signed a petition making that declaration.
But quickly gets so sad:
Another signatory, Debbie Findling of San Francisco, described her difficult decision last year to have an abortion after tests showed that she would bear a son with Down syndrome.
?I felt it was my right to make the decision, but having that right doesn?t make the decision any easier,? she said. ?It was the hardest decision I?ve ever made.?
Findling, 42, is married, with a 5-year-old daughter, and has been trying to get pregnant again while pursuing her career as a philanthropic foundation executive.
She says too many of her allies in the abortion-rights movement tend to minimize, at least publicly, the psychological impact of abortion.
?It?s emotionally devastating,? she said in a phone interview. ?I don?t regret my decision ? but I regret having been put in the position to have to make that choice. It?s something I?ll live with for the rest of my life.?
And yet she says she supports the Ms. petition:
Findling strongly supports the Ms. petition, and believes women who have had abortions need to be more open about their decisions. She has written an essay about her own experience, and plans to include it in an anthology she hopes to publish next year.
The closing remark:
?The women thanked us for doing this,? Smeal said. ?They wanted to tell their stories.?
[The full story.]
Look at what Debbie Findling had to say about other pro choicers. Sorry for all of those ??? in my post. I’m not sure why they are showing up.
“I don?t regret my decision ? but I regret having been put in the position to have to make that choice. It?s something I?ll live with for the rest of my life.?”
What choice was that? Have a child who isn’t “perfect” or have an abortion. The selfishness amazes me.
uggg……
I NEVER would have thought myself capable of handling an autistic child. Although his autism is very mild, I still would have thought myself incapable. Guess what? Not only am I capable but i wouldn’t trade him for the world.
She was “forced” to make a decision because her child wasn’t going to be perfect. I think we all need to think on that for a bit. And before anyone says something like “its not your life, you don’t know what she is capable of….” she never even tried! if she found herself incapable of raising a Down’s syndrome child there are hundered of thousands of couples and single people wanted to adopt. There is no such thing as an unwanted child as long as there are people willing and able to adopt! Just because the child is unwanted to one, doesn’t mean that child is unwanted to all. Remember: One person’s trash is another person’s treasure.
valerie, you are correct. Also, why was it so difficult for her? It’s just tissue, right?
Heather, loss of fertility due to abortion is a rare event.
If you knew anything about the subject, you would know that.
Legal abortion, that is. From illegal abortion no one knows how common it is because you can’t monitor illegal abortion.
Somg, I’m not paying attention to you anymore. I need to see some facts.
SOMG, 10:24a, said: “Heather thinks women who lost their fertility to illegal abortion are ‘whiners’. What about you, Jill, what do you think?”
Infertility is a consequence of abortion. Some women know the risk beforehand, but some don’t, thanks to information suppression by the abortion industry.
Ultimately, every wrong decision has bad consequences, so none of us – which is all of us – who have suffered consequences following a poor decision deserve to complain. I myself have made some doozies with terrible regrets afterward.
There is one Friend I have, though, who never condemns me when I complain or lament to Him.
Interestingly, this Friend has to power to alleviate consequences but many times does not. But He still loves and accepts me as I am and encourages me to learn and grow from my failures.
I try to emulate that Friend.
Of further interest is my Friend has the power to completely forgive my failures when asked, and He always does.
Hi Jill! I just e-mailed you!
Heather, no problem. Here you go. Note especially: “Induced abortion does not harm a woman’s reproductive capacity. Premature birth, infertility, ectopic pregnancy, spontaneous abortion, and adverse pregnancy outcomes are not increased in frequency after abortion. The question of placenta previa is unsettled; some reports have found an increased risk for this abnormal placental attachment in later pregnancies, whereas others have not.”
Jill, you need to read my reference too. Infertility is NOT a consequence of abortion.
Jill, you should also say, when describing your “Friend”, that He is imaginary.
it was for rasheedah dinkins
SOMG, your denial of the truth on both counts doesn’t make either of them any less true.
Jill: You think you know better than the editorial board of the Annals of Internal Medicine about whether abortion causes infertility?
And some people have accused ME of having delusions of grandeur…
Weren’t the abortions suppossed to help her to improve her life? If so, why did she turn to booze? Why didn’t she ever get an education, and why did she go from one dysfunctional relationship after another?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I saw this lady on TV who had two kids. She never got an education, turned to booze, had dysfunctional relationships, shaved her head, and danced poorly at the MTV Music Awards.
It’s pretty obvious that everyone who has kids will become a clumsy, bald-headed drunk.
(I love her anecdotes…)
Well, Britney won’t ever have to worry about residing in a tiny dump. I don’t see her ever having to work at a drug store. At least she’ll have her boys, and they do have a loving grandmother.
Also, Brit could get an education. It’s not too late.
Heather wrote:
Findling strongly supports the Ms. petition, and believes women who have had abortions need to be more open about their decisions. She has written an essay about her own experience, and plans to include it in an anthology she hopes to publish next year.
The closing remark:
?The women thanked us for doing this,? Smeal said. ?They wanted to tell their stories.?
[The full story.]
Posted by: heather at October 8, 2007 10:56 AM
Maybe Ms. Findling can start at home by telling her 5 year old why it is so important for mommy to be allowed to kill her little brother because he was not good enough to live.
hippie, right! Nobody forced her to anything. She chose it.
Jill, you should also say, when describing your “Friend”, that He is imaginary.
Posted by: SoMG at October 8, 2007 11:41 AM
Proof please.
Heather – what has always amazed me is that Ms. Magazine only got 5,000 signatures! According to Guttmatcher institute there are over 1 million abortion every year and they could only get 5,000! If I remember correctly it was an “open” internet petition as well.
Also, it amazes me when the PC crowd states that a research isn’t valid because it was a pro lifer who did the research. Do they really think that someone who has scientifically proven that the “fetus” is a living human who has the sensory capability to feel pain is going to be Pro-Choice! I always refer to the Guttmatcher institute because I actually do find most of there information valid. They give to and receive money from Planned Parenthood.
_______________
Anywho… Thanks to everyone who kept this as civil as possible. It is difficult at times, I know!
*smooches* to everyone.
Posted by: valerie at October 8, 2007 10:29 AM
valerie, that petition is still available on line. 5000 signers isn’t very many.
Loss of fertility due to abortions is rare…
Hardly. Loss of life naturally includes loss of fertility / virility, and well over half the patients subjected to induced abortion die. (The unborn are patients, too). If you kill an unborn child, you also kill the toddler, the child, the teen, and the adult that that baby would eventually become, given the chance. The figure among the mothers subjected to this traumatic invasion of their bodies is way too high for a “procedure” that purports to be safe, but when you figure in the potential of their children to reproduce, it goes off the charts and through the roof.
So if SoMG’s mom had chosen to have him aborted, it isn’t an unborn child who wouldn’t be posting here, it’s who he is today. In a way, it’s a pity; I’m sure he’d have had a healthier perspective on abortion as an unborn child than he does now, according to silentscream.org.
And if you allow a human egg to die, you’re also killing the person it might have become.
Menstruation is murder!
SOMG –
I’m sure you know the difference between the DNA of a fertilized egg and the DNA of an unfertilized egg.
I’m also sure you know the difference between a natural bodily response and a forced one.
Please tell me I don’t have to quote all those biology books to show the difference between menstruation and induced abortion.
Oh, puleeeeeeeze.
Ms. magazine asked for the signitures of women who were grateful that they has access to abortion, and inside of two weeks over 5000 signed up.
Silent No More tried to gather 1700 signatures of women who regretted their abortions. It’s been almost a year, and I’m pretty sure the ad STILL hasn’t run. http://abortionblogger.com/silent-no-more-signature-ad-1700-women-who-regret-our-abortions.html
The vast majority of women are more then happy with their decision to abort. Virtually all say that under similar circumstances, they’d do it again.
Valerie, who cares about the DNA? That egg MIGHT have become a beautiful baby! By failing to fertilize it you’re MURDERING the beautiful baby it might have become.
Laura, you mean they could only find 1700 women to sign an online petition saying “I regret my abortion”?? Only 1700 in the whole internetosphere? LOL! That’s pitiful, even by their standards.
Laura, you mean they could only find 1700 women to sign an online petition saying “I regret my abortion”??
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Actually, they couldn’t find that many.
Silent No More once held a demonstration on the steps of the Florida State House that drew 8 women. Another held in Washington drew 22.
I’ve posted “testimonials” here from the Silent No More website that were so riddled with factual errors that they had to be fakes.
Only a miniscule percentage of women ever regret their decision to have an abortion.
I always wonder, if PAS is real, where are all the patients? Why aren’t there millions of them showing up in the shrinks’ offices? There’ve been what, 48 million abortions since Roe/Wade? Where are all the PAS sufferers?
Could it be that PAS is ** gasp ** extremely rare?
Could it be that it’s a fake, concocted by right-to-lifers to scare women out of having abortions, and to make political arguments against abortion?
Or is that paranoia?
I always wonder, if PAS is real, where are all the patients? Why aren’t there millions of them showing up in the shrinks’ offices? There’ve been what, 48 million abortions since Roe/Wade? Where are all the PAS sufferers?
Could it be that PAS is ** gasp ** extremely rare?
How would you know how mant women are going to shrinks?************Ever heard of HIPAA?
Somg, some of these women have killed themselves. There are other post abortion healing sites. Safe Haven Ministries, and Rachel’s Vineyard. You are wrong again. Perhaps 1700 women signed the petition about regretting their abortions. 5000 were proud. The rest are embarassed.
Heather, what are you talking about? HIPAA doesn’t prevent shrinks from writing about trends in their practices, as long as they don’t publish the patients’ names. If there were any significant numbers of women going to shrinks with PAS complaints, we would know.
You wrote: “some of these women have killed themselves. ” Is that why there’s so few of them?
Has anyone ever committed suicide and mentioned abortion in the suicide note? Do we know of even one such case?
Talk to Dr. Reardon. I have been to web sites where women have killed themselves shortly after their abortions.
Go to this site. “The Real Choice.” Women expressed extreme grief over their abortions to their loved ones, and then they killed themselves.
Suicide
This case is of a woman who couldn’t deal with her abortion and committed suicide in 1989 – my mom.
[She came to have the abortion through a] family friend.
Once married (not to one involved in abortion), busied herself with raising seven children – but when husband died in 1987, she went into deep depression – abortion exposed.
She went to God, but had spent sixty years believing she would go to hell. God’s forgiveness was hard for her to grasp along with the guilt and shame she felt. She committed suicide in 1989 telling me to go on with Pro-Life efforts.
This abortion news affected the whole family – especially those who could not understand her pain. I could. I’d been there. Suicide was not meant to hurt her children (who she loved and protected), but to get rid of her hurt and pain
Posted on 09/24/2006 4:53:15 PM PDT by Neidermeyer
PLANTATION ?An enraged police officer who fatally shot her boyfriend, then turned the gun on herself, might have been upset about their decision to abort their baby a few weeks earlier, a witness told detectives.
Plantation Police Officer Laura Grunas argued with her boyfriend Robert Peat on Aug. 4, and police had to tell her to leave his Plantation home. When she returned a short time later that night, Grunas killed Peat and committed suicide, police said.
(Excerpt) Read more at sun-sentinel.com …
Florida Police Officer Kills Boyfriend, Commits Suicide After Abortion
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by Steven Ertelt
LifeNews.com Editor
September 25, 2006
Plantation, FL (LifeNews.com) — A Florida police officer killed her boyfriend and then shot herself apparently after she became haunted by an abortion she had just weeks earlier. Witnesses told authorities they think the abortion prompted the stress that caused her to engage in the shootings.
Laura Grunas has an argument with her boyfriend Robert Peat on August 4 and police told her after they were called about the incident that she had to leave his home.
Grunas returned a short time later to the house, AP reported, killed Peat and then committed suicide.
Michael Roth, a police officer and friend of Peat’s told AP that he witnessed the argument and was at Peat’s house when Grunas returned later.
During the argument, Roth said Grunas told him, “Did he tell you about killing my baby?” — referring to the abortion. Roth told authorities that Peat told him Grunas had an abortion after she found out she was pregnant.
Peat disagreed with the decision to have an abortion but eventually supported it. Still, Roth told police that Peat said the couple’s relationship grew worse following the abortion.
Numerous studies have shown that abortion causes severe depression and thoughts of suicide for women who have them.
Published in the medical journal Acta Paediatrica, an October 2005 study conducted by Priscilla Coleman, a professor at Bowling Green University, found that “emotional difficulties and unresolved grief responses” from pregnancy loss such as abortion.
A 2002 study published in the Journal of Child Psychiatry and Psychology found abortion has been linked to an increase in substance abuse and thoughts of suicide.
“The common perception seems to be that abortion solves the immediate problem of a crisis pregnancy and that therefore it must be a positive thing for women,” Elliot Institute director Dr. David Reardon said.
Reardon added, “However, more and more studies such as this one show that abortion can have a severe and lasting impact on women’s lives, shaping their futures and the futures of their families for years to come.”
Same story, but more info.
Just run “Do women kill themselves after abortion” through your search engine. Also run abortion/suicide. You will find many articles there.
Well searching the site for “suicide” yields the following: She lists three suicide cases; two of them are linked to non-existant pages and the third is a case where a woman committed suicide one year after she had an abortion, but there is no evidence (no note) connecting the suicide to the abortion.
This is a common error in logic known as “Post-hoc ergo propter-hoc”: The one event occurred after the other, so it must have occurred BECAUSE of the other.
No, Heather, a woman who kills herself shortly after her husband dies (!) doesn’t count, unless she left a suicide note that specifically mentions the abortion as a reason for suicide.
Somg, you are being ridiculous again. How could I possibly investigate all of the details of every suicide in the USA? I’m sure there are many cases. I suppose you are going to tell me that nobody has ever killed themselves over an abortion. I maintain that it can and did happen.
Talk to Dr. Reardon.
:: laughing ::
Laura –
“Silent No More tried to gather 1700 signatures of women who regretted their abortions.”
All the information isn’t on the blog website that you posted. It was 1,700 people who had completed post abortive healing programs in 2006. It wasn’t a petition, but people who went through the programs in one year and was in an ad in USA Today –
From Silent No More’s USA Today Ad:
“1,700 women and men in 2006 completed post- abortive healing programs. Citing Science Magazine, Planned Parenthood website reveals up to 10 % of women who have an abortion experience
valerie, thank you for the clarification.
David Reardon?
BWAHAHAHAHAHA!
SoMG:
“Valerie, who cares about the DNA? That egg MIGHT have become a beautiful baby! By failing to fertilize it you’re MURDERING the beautiful baby it might have become.”
Then you better not masturbate. All those sperm not getting to an egg is murder. So, I murder one egg a month by not getting pregnant and there are how many sperm with each ejaculation? hmmm….
You are being rediculous and you know it. When the egg and sperm combine it is a developing human being. When a spontaneous abortion occurs it is usually because of problems with the fetus or the mother. It is nature saying that there is something wrong and that the pregnancy should not continue. Sometimes we know what the reason is; sometimes we don’t. But it is natural. It isn’t a woman who decides that her child isn’t worthy of being wanted and then destroys that developing human being for that reason only. Statistically this developing human being has nothing medically wrong and would have continued developing until birth. it doesn’t matter how many people may consider that child wanted, it is up to one person to decided the value of a human being.
“Could it be that it’s a fake, concocted by right-to-lifers to scare women out of having abortions, and to make political arguments against abortion?
Or is that paranoia?”
Please don’t make me go throught the medical list of “medical problems that were once considered non-exicistant but have been proven to be real”.
I’ll give a few:
post partum depression
AD/HD
PTSD
Even different forms of treatments have been through the ringer a few times with the “it doesn’t work – yes it does”
Acupuncture
antibiotics (overuse can cause immunity to drug)
antidepressants
True Proven medical treatments are only about 15% according to British Medical Journal
Heather you wrote: ” I suppose you are going to tell me that nobody has ever killed themselves over an abortion. ”
Not NOBODY, no. Any issue you name, there’s probably SOMEONE who’s committed suicide because of it. People commit suicide for all kinds of reasons.
But not enough to budget for.
I know you can’t investigate every suicide yourself, but I can’t help thinking that if PAS were such a big problem, then we’d have heard about at least ONE case where a successful female suicide specifically mentions an abortion as the reason in the note. Remember, 48 million women have had abortions since Roe/Wade. Surely ONE….
How many women would commit suicide in consequence of being forced to grow and give birth to babies they didn’t want? No way to measure this, or even approximate it.
Meanwhile, sites like Reardon’s are essentially advertising to women: If you’ve had an abortion and you feel at all dissatisfied with your life, you can transfer responsibility for all your problems to the doctor, and get in addition all the benefits of membership in our christ-cult if you claim to have suffered the alleged symptoms of PAS. Or if you convince youself that you really are suffering from them.
You get the love and respect of other cult members. You can sue your doctor (who knows–you might win something!). You can write a book (or hire it written) that will be sold in Christian bookstores.
Naturally some women with abortion histories will allow themselves to be recruited and/or programmed in this way.
I’m not saying that ALL the patients who alledge PAS are fakes and brainwash-ees but it’s equally hard to imagine that NONE of them are, and any serious consideration of the problem has to take this into account.
SoMG: I’m not saying that ALL the patients who alledge PAS are fakes and brainwash-ees but it’s equally hard to imagine that NONE of them are, and any serious consideration of the problem has to take this into account.
I think a lot of the problem is the “PAS” stuff. If a given person says they really regret having had an abortion, that it’s been hard on them, etc., that may well be true. That some women have some post-traumatic stress after having abortions isn’t really in doubt, IMO anyway. Yet acting like it’s more than it is won’t garner one many logic points, especially if one pretends it’s this “syndrome” that will happen to another given woman.
Doug
Doug, thank you for 1/2 agreeing:} Somg, you aren’t the type of person that cares about anyone, so let’s just leave it at that. It figures you would say “Who cares.” “She was all screwed up before the abortion.” Okay, laugh at Dr. Reardon if you want to. I’m sure he’s a good guy. He never molested his patients like abortionists do.
Somg, you still can’t respond to anything I’ve posted. You haven’t addressed any of these issues. I’ve posted proof. You respond with your own opinions. That’s just not good enough. Plus, you and Laura keep mixing up the facts that you do post.
Somg, I also found the post about the police officer who blew her lover away and then herself. Sounds like things were okay before the abortion. Why did the woman bring up “her baby”?? Why would she commit such a violent and permanent act? It sounds to me like abortion played a huge part in that murder/suicide. Most couples who abort don’t stay together.
He never molested his patients like abortionists do.
Posted by: heather at October 9, 2007 8:38 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Patients? Why would a guy with a mail-order degree in Bioethics from a diploma mill have patients?
(If you want to know about practioners who sexually abuse their patients, try looking at shrinks and dentists. They lead the pack.)
However, this is a blog about abortion, so I find it very fitting to list the quacks! It’s not hard to do.
Obstetricians are the most-sued practitioners in medicine. Wouldn’t abortion be a good way of avoiding those quacks?
no.
Heather, you wrote: “Most couples who abort don’t stay together.”
Where did you get this idea? Source, please.
Also, we have already established that there are more right-to-life molesters than there are abortion docs who molest.
somg, no, we have not. I need your source please.