Pro-abort: Juno means something but not sure what
I got quoted in a The New Republic column January 11 on the topic of Juno:
The politics of films like Juno, Waitress, and Knocked Up have become new turnbuckles in the wrestling ring of the culture wars.
Befitting the binary nature of the abortion debate, they also serve as something of a civic Rorschach test: For every conservative celebrating Juno as what Pro Life Pulse blogger Jill Stanek calls “the movie pro-aborts will hate,” there’s a pro-choicer declaring that the real power of the movie lies in their autonomous lead characters’ ability to make their own decisions. “The flick is pro-choice in the most literal sense of the term,” The American Prospect’s Ezra Klein wrote of Knocked Up. “She has a choice; nothing is forced on her.” But critics on both sides of the debate imply something new and dramatic is afoot, even if no one quite agrees on what it means.
Nice spin! The pro-abort columnist, Michael Schaffer, of course ignores the truly contempt-ridden reviews his side has given Juno, like this one from RH Realtity Check, which is the actual truth….
Indirect in its underlying condemnation of abortion on request, the film is a far more costly blow against abortion rights than anything the anti-abortion crowd could possibly hope for or ever produce – and they are big gainers (at no cost to them) from its sappy popularity.
With all the attention we’re all giving to the pro-life phenomenon in movies of late, I expect Hollywood to reassuredly respond with one promoting abortion.
Which will fall flat.
Meanwhile, Juno is on pace to become Fox’s biggest hit. Made for $7.5 million, it is looking to “vault past $100 million and beyond,” according to Marketwatch.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
You mean like this one? 4 months, 3 weeks, 2 days…
http://youtube.com/watch?v=K8jPBmGhXo8
I still dont see what the fuss is over this movie.
I watched it the other day, and it was kinda cute/funny, but not as amazing as everyone else has been saying. I thought the soundtrack was pretty good, though, lol.
As for the movie, I would’ve thought that it was ridiculous that there was only 1 protester who was high-school aged, and no picture of an aborted fetus in site. Sort of drastically understates the pro-lifer’s commitment doesn’t it?
Though it was also kinda funny when the ultrasound expert was a complete (insert 5 letter word here), so much for it being abortion doctors who are always the rude ones eh?
Really, the movie is about her CHOICE though. Look at it, she WAS going to get an abortion, and decided it wasnt for her. Shen then got the idea of allowing a closed adoption and giving up the child, believing she was not ready for a child. It WAS about her choice, whether a group appears to acknowledge that or not is their CHOICE.
Not to mention, there isnt a movie without her deciding not to get the abortion, its a MOVIE not a propaganda film. Jeez.
Dan,
Watch my link…it’s a movie, a whole movie, about making the other choice…
And the point of Juno, from our perspective, is that while yes, she HAD a choice to make, she ultimately made the RIGHT choice. Not just for her, but objectively.
MK:
But that choice might not be the right choice for another person…
————————
And I think I broke my freaking nose. It’s the only thing on my body, I liked, damni@!
Jill:
Your comments on the infant termination industrial complex are right on the money.
No pun intended.
PS: Your English is superb.
Oh, and Sweeny Todd beat Juno at the Golden Globes… Sorry y’all…
Phony HisMan,
This is your last warning…PLEASE choose a different name. I don’t see what the problem is since you appear to be pro-life…just use HisMan2 or something…
Midnite,
And I think I broke my freaking nose. It’s the only thing on my body, I liked, damni@!
oh that temper of yours! lol
Sounds like a Marsha Brady thing.
Okay, so how did you really do it?
Why has “choice” become such a sacred cow word in this debate about killing infants in the womb? That word in the rallying cry of pro-aborts. It’s their shield and sword.
What ever happened to just plain right and wrong?
Did we all just wake up one morning and all of a sudden it became OK to kill babies?
I guess so because that’s what’s happening.
Seems like the rights of infants in the womb have been suspended until we all wake up. The question is what will it take to wake us up?
We shouldn’t pin any hopes on movies produced by Hollywood because they are worse than the Democrats in the art of to and fro doctrine. For their goals are always profit and not principle motivated.
MK, what you posted is a trailer for a European film that won a bunch of awards, I watched it, but it wasnt the whole thing, lol.
Dear Jill, MK, Bethany, Truthseeker, will the real Hisman please stand up? Sorry if I have missed any other prolifers on this blog…
Although I read this blog a lot I do not always comment. Here are some thoughts and a prayer. Does the abortion “argument” boil down to acknowledging the God who created us and also the babies in the wombs of mothers? Acknowledging that HE alone is the creator of the universe and all that is in it? He does what pleases Him. There is a lack of worship and giving God praise in this country. One Nation Under God, In God We Trust are being tackled all the time. As is prayer in school, bibles in school, CHRISTmas songs, even the words Christmas Break are now Holiday Break. We as a nation have turned from God and do not seek His face. We are floating in a sea of moral relativism.
Dear God,
Please forgive this nation. We have turned from you and gone our own ways. Like sheep gone astray we have turned to idols to seek pleasure and peace. You are the Giver of Life. You have written the length of our days, you have numbered the very hairs on our head. We repent for the evil we have done. Killing those from conception to grave that we do not feel are worthy of life. Forgive us Lord for taking innocent lives in the holocaust that is abortion. We beg your forgiveness and ask that you rain down on this nation with your Holy Spirit that we might feel Your blessing on this land again. Soften hearts and turn people to You. Help us all to look on each other with love and compassion and build a culture of life where every child is looked on as a gift and we reach out to the hurting and the lost. Nothing is impossible for you. We love you.
In Jesus name. Amen
This is the REAL Hisman…unfortunately I just junked his other post and am trying to get it back…my apologies…
MK, I was cleaning my apartment last night (to rid any reminder of the foreverEX-BF…
And I was moving my DVD stand to clean under it, and on top I have the very big, bulky and pick complete 6 seasons of Sex and The City. Well, when I moved it, this (at least 10 pound case) fell, and as it was falling, I looks up and it smacked me right in the freaking nose.
And yes, I’ve got a temper, it might be around for a while. My grandmother is sick, and I want to hide in my bed for a month. And possibly kill the ex at some point as well.
oops, pick=pink
We repent for the evil we have done. Killing those from conception to grave that we do not feel are worthy of life. Forgive us Lord for taking innocent lives in the holocaust that is abortion. We beg your forgiveness
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We?
Us?
Nope. I’ve never killed anybody.
Dan,
I didn’t mean the whole movie was on the link, just that a whole movie had been made on the choice of abortion…
Carla:
I agree with you.
God says that, “if my people” reprent and pray and turn that He will hear.
In a sense the church is responsible for ending abortion in this country and the world.
When the church stops being apathetic or worse participating in abortion, then, the abortion of infants in the womb will end.
And Fetus Fascist: Would you agree with the pleas that the Nazis put forth in their own defense that they were innocent because they were just following orders? How can one escape culpability before the Almighty if they at best don’t do or say anything against abortion or at worse support choice which is ultimately the support of infanticide?
Let’s say there were no laws against abducting and murdering born children. Let’s say you had a child or infant that was abducted, then murdered. How would you feel about the people who did nothing to get those laws repealed and those people who stood againat the repeal?
I think I know what you would say.
So then the question then becomes, is the abortion of infants in the womb right or wrong.
Thanks HisMan,
I have been thinking so much about WHAT’S IT GONNA TAKE? to end abortion. Thanks for the input.
Posted by: HisMan at January 14, 2008 10:25 AM
Um, that’s not the real HisMan. Look at the website his link brings up. Tis a FAKE
I have been thinking so much about WHAT’S IT GONNA TAKE? to end abortion. Thanks for the input.
Posted by: Carla at January 14, 2008 10:34 AM
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America thrives on free-market Capitalism. As long as people like you are willing to pay good money for the service, there will be providers.
Your financial endorsement means more than anyone else’s political endorsement.
Oh Midnite,
*OUCH*
I’ve talked to HisMan and that is his website, it’s just not up and running yet. We’ve worked out a code so that I know it’s him posting and we have been emailing each other…so feel free to discourse.
Carla:
Another point. God cannot forgive what is not confessed and repented of.
Based on this we know that this nation as a whole can’t be forgiven as a whole because many in this nation don’t believe that killing babies in the womb is wrong as is evidenced by the comments being put forth on this site which probably represents a good ratio of views for and against.
If the church as a body does not confess it’s sin against unborn infants and repent of any view that support choice, how can He forgive the church and end this curse on our nation?
I believe that each and every individual Christian believer needs to go before God and confess either their lukewarmness on the issue, their active participation on the issue, or their downright misinformed support of the issue. If that happened, this country would change overnight and politicians like Clinton and Obama would be out in the wink of an eye. They would be seen as the evil people they are for their sins would find them out.
Very simply, we are now reaping what we have sown.
The good thing is that He is rich in mercy and will forgive anything if it is confessed and repented or turned away from.
As for me, I want no leaders in this country who do not lead based on character and conviction.
Hey Midnite,
You don’t suppose that the fact it was “Sex in the City” was more than a coincidence, do you?
There is a great Sex and the City episode about an abortion. Several topics come up:
The man’s right to know
What is the right decision?
What will it mean for my future?
Consequences of previous decisions.
At the same time Charlotte finds out she’s nearly infertile and how devastating it is.
A great line is when Miranda asks Carrie (who has had one) when she will start to feel normal. Carrie says it depends. Miranda then asks her when she started to feel normal. Carrie says, “any day now.”
Miranda decides to keep her baby. I wouldn’t call the entire episode “pro-life” because Carrie decides she made the right decision. There are just some good lines and topics I like.
Midnite678:
I’m sorry you broke your nose. Ice is the best thing until you can see a Dr.
Be careful you don’t get a sinus infection now.
Guys, it’s been nice talking. However, I’m a real infant when it comes to muscle cars and the Barrett Jackson auction opened this weekend in Scottsdale and I’m going out there today.
Peace…..
PIP:
I agree, I love that episode. But I wouldnt call it a PL attitude though. It was more along the line of “their individual choice”…
MK:
LOL, maybe it’s fate telling me to move and go on a dat??
I know, midnite, I think so too. I was happy she chose to have her baby, but carrie said that her abortion was the right decision so the episode is not really pro-life. Great topics though, and I like the ending ;)
I”m a sap, I want to cry every time I watch the scene where Charlotte and Miranda meet on the street.
“If the church as a body does not confess it’s sin against unborn infants and repent of any view that support choice, how can He forgive the church and end this curse on our nation?”
HisMan, Carla, et al. Some strides are being taken..
January 23, the tragic anniversary of Roe v. Wade, is the “day of penance for the violation of the dignity of the human person committed through acts of abortion, and prayer for the full restoration of the legal guarantee of the right to life.”
A mouthful, but as far as the Catholic church is concerned, that particular day gets 100% pro-life focus.
The holy sacrifice of the mass will be offered up for that specific attention at the National Basilica in D.C.. Count on EWTN to televise full coverage of the events for that day, including the March for Life.
End commercial.
Midnite,
MK:
LOL, maybe it’s fate telling me to move and go on a date??
Yeah, that’s what I meant. Not. :)
PIP:
I agree, that scene makes me cry, b/c I am Charlotte. The Series Finale was a tear jerker too.
MK:
Then what were you trying to tell me then?
Why has “choice” become such a sacred cow word in this debate
It’s not a “sacred cow.” It’s what the argument is over – should women have the legal choice to end or continue pregnancies?
……
What ever happened to just plain right and wrong?
Your opinions on them are not a good enough reason to deny women the freedom they now have in the matter.
Does the abortion “argument” boil down to acknowledging the God who created us and also the babies in the wombs of mothers?
No, Carla. For some people their religious beliefs play an important part, sure, but that is far from all of it.
First of all, those beliefs don’t apply to everybody, so the argument can’t “boil down” to them.
Even aside from that, I think there are arguments to be made within the religious frame of reference, i.e. it’s not like the biblical god wanted every single pregnancy to end with a live baby – at times he commanded things so that it would not be the case, in fact.
This is not for “all religion,” of course, but it applies to quite a few people on Jill’s blog and to many Americans, etc.
Also, witness all the miscarriages that occur without conscious input from the parents. If there is an all-powerful, all-knowing god, it does not make sense to think that such a god “wants” every pregnancy to go all the way.
I’m not trying to be offensive here – I just think they are valid points.
Doug
Midnite,
Um…i forgot? I only know it had nothing to with sex…or the city…or the fact that we’re always telling you not to have it…lol
Carder,
Haven’t left for the auction just yet but I do have some questions.
Do you think that the Catholic Church takes a more active role against infanticide in the womb then let’s say than the Protestant Church?
I know just as many nominal Catholics who are pro-choice as I do nominal Protestants.
I will say this however, I believe that the Catholic Church is on the front lines of this battle. I wish the Protestant Church as a whole would do likewise. I also wish we could all come togehter on this issue. It’s so basic.
Seems to me that main-line Protestant Churches, i.e., Episcopalian, Methodist, Lutheran and Presbyterian and more liberal on the issue where the more fundamentalist branches of Protestantism, i.e., Baptist, Assemblies of Gods, etc. are more in line with Catholic teaching.
Comments? How do we get the more main line churches over to our side? Do you see a correlation between the marriage/divorce and gay issues? If so, why? Do you find that interesting and what Biblical support is there for such liberal stances.
Hooray! Carla’s pic is up!
Doug,
Still goin’ on our two running threads…
His Man, first of all – it’s too bad somebody feels the need to try and impersonate you. Sheesh. (Talk about an “objective” wrong! ; )
So then the question then becomes, is the abortion of infants in the womb right or wrong.
Without arguing about “infant” or not, that is indeed part of the question. But wait, there’s more – there is the pregnant woman to consider, and the fact that the unborn are inside the body of women.
Doug
MK
Well, I wont be for a while, so breathe slowly. Tis OK…
HisMan:
HAHAHAHA.
Ok, first off: No, you’ll never get the Presbyterian church, trust me. I’ve been a member of the Presbyterian USA church since I was born.
Anyhoo, the Presbyterian church supports a Gay and Lesbian Day at Walt Disney World every year, and they ordain Gay Preachers.
Now, I have absolutely no problem with this: but I am sure you do. Thoughts?
Dear Doug,
I have a sneaking suspicion that I don’t want to go on a walk with you through “those beliefs don’t apply to everyone” so I won’t. :)
I have had two miscarriages. I have come to accept them as God’s will. Those babies lived inside me as long as God ordained them to live. I will live as long as He allows it. 2 more years or 20. I have tried to find the meaning in miscarriage and I trust that He has His reasons but for now I am happy to be there for others when they lose a baby through miscarriage.
all-knowing, all-powerful= The Wizard of Oz
The catholics who are pro-choice are phoney catholics who do NOT follow church teaching.
I believe the catholic church should pay the taxes and start speaking up against the culture of death (even more than they do now) and openly support pro-life candidates. Also, they should fire any bishops or priests who in anyway support a “pro-choice” position. Also, they should deny communion and ex-communicate any pro-abort politicians.
Jasper-
“I believe the catholic church should pay the taxes”
I disagree on that part, I feel that would welcome trouble, but yeah they should do a lot of things that they aren’t.
Presbyterian
PIP,
That episode was just on TBS the other night..the part I had a problem with was when they were all sitting around the table being like “Ok how many have YOU had?” It was as though they were asking how many teeth they have had pulled or something..that part made my stomach churn.
Doug 12:04 PM,
But don’t you believe that there’s no such thing as “objective” wrong??? Maybe this alleged “impersonator” holds the OPINION that his/her choice to do the “impersonating” is good for him/her. Isn’t that ALL that matters?
“Juno” – like “Knocked Up” and “Waitress,” is a pro-choice movie written by a pro-choice screenwriter.
As for abortion-themed movies falling flat, you might want to check this out: http://www.starpulse.com/Movies/Vera_Drake/Awards/
Laura,
Do you like babies?
But don’t you believe that there’s no such thing as “objective” wrong???
Well, it was a joke.
……
Maybe this alleged “impersonator” holds the OPINION that his/her choice to do the “impersonating” is good for him/her. Isn’t that ALL that matters?
They’re doing what they want to, but of course that is not “all that matters.” Other people are gonna have their opinions, too. Would you want somebody to use your name all the time?
Elizabeth-
Samantha is the wild card–some of the stuff she says in each episode could be offensive. Notice how Charlotte completely called them out on it. And Carrie seemed offended by the idea she would have had more than one.
But yeah Samantha saying that didn’t surprise me, because I”m used to it, but she is treating the decision like it’s no big deal, which is sad. Charlotte’s infertility reminded me what a miracle each baby is, “wanted” or not. I’m not arguing about what the overall episode was aimed at “saying” but all of the talk that pops up is interesting.
PIP,
Yeah I know…I actually like the show..even though it does at times seem to me to be anti-family. I mean, not completely. I really didn’t like the episodes where they made it seem like having a family and being a mother was just soooo terrible. After Miranda decided to keep the baby and stuff, they portrayed her as just so miserable sometimes to me. Not that I’m saying pregnancy and childbirth/parenting are a walk in the park….but they could have showed the other side a little bit better IMO.
Yeah Elizabeth, I do agree with you on that. It showed her as being fed up, mostly. But it does also show how hard it is to work and not be able to spend a lot of time with your child. Maybe how some things need to change to help accommodate single working women, imo and this showed it.
Doug,
A joke? That’s a cop-out. Try again, please.
And it’s not important what I or anyone else, for that matter thinks, right? I mean, if that’s what they WANT to do…….It’s their fingers on the keyboard… Who am I to tell them what to do (with their body)????.
Alrighty poodles, my second video is uploading now and I will post it in a few minutes. It’s a remake of michael and janet jackson’s scream video. It’s MUCH more silly but a few of the parts were more serious than others. If you look hard there is an abortion picture in the montage(s).
You really have to see the video to understand a lot of jokes, so here is the real one, you can watch it while we wait ;)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=vNl2Pm9-7Vk
ugh, sorry this is taking forever guys. The video messed up so I have to upload it again.
video now messed up again. I don’t know why it is doing this. The video becomes very choppy and not together with music. Take 3.
Nevermind. Obviously not working. I guess the movie is too complex to be streamed over the internet, although it boggles me as to why. Sorry, all.
PIP,
I will agree with you on that one. I really did love the show regardless.
The one clear thing you get from this movie is that the girl DID THE RIGHT THING BY NOT MURDERING HER CHILD which EVERYONE knows in their heart is the violent murder of an innocent and defenseless baby.
BELLA has the main character already deciding to violently murder her baby all the way through the movie until a few minutes from the end.
That movie was specificly about NOT MURDERING the baby and it did very well, especially for an independent film.
When it comes out on DVD I will get at least 5 copies.
Zeke-
Do you know WHEN it comes out on DVD? I really can’t wait..because I never have a chance to go to the movies anymore so I haven’t seen it. :(
Thanks HisMan,
I have been thinking so much about WHAT’S IT GONNA TAKE? to end abortion. Thanks for the input.
Posted by: Carla at January 14, 2008 10:34 AM
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100% effective BC available to everyone. Every pregnancy a viable one. Complete and total absence of rape and incest.
I think that should do it.
There is always going to be rape and incest. How will you ensure every pregnancy is a viable one? Abstinence is the only 100% effective birth control.
There is always going to be rape and incest. How will you ensure every pregnancy is a viable one? Abstinence is the only 100% effective birth control.
Posted by: Carla at January 14, 2008 9:39 PM
…………………………………
Obviously you are resolved to the fact that abortion will never go away. As long as women can be raped and impregnated, abstinence is redundant in the equation. Sexual contact resulting in pregnancy isn’t always a woman’s choice. Rosemary’s Baby. If the devil impregnates you, are you ‘morally’ obliged to gestate and give life to the devil’s spawn?
Cry out full-throated and unsparingly, lift up your voice like a trumpet blast; Tell my people their wickedness, and the house of Jacob their sins.
They seek me day after day, and desire to know my ways, Like a nation that has done what is just and not abandoned the law of their God; They ask me to declare what is due them, pleased to gain access to God.
“Why do we fast, and you do not see it? afflict ourselves, and you take no note of it?” Lo, on your fast day you carry out your own pursuits, and drive all your laborers.
Yes, your fast ends in quarreling and fighting, striking with wicked claw. Would that today you might fast so as to make your voice heard on high!
Is this the manner of fasting I wish, of keeping a day of penance: That a man bow his head like a reed, and lie in sackcloth and ashes? Do you call this a fast, a day acceptable to the LORD?
This, rather, is the fasting that I wish: releasing those bound unjustly, untying the thongs of the yoke; Setting free the oppressed, breaking every yoke;
Sharing your bread with the hungry, sheltering the oppressed and the homeless; Clothing the naked when you see them, and not turning your back on your own.
Then your light shall break forth like the dawn, and your wound shall quickly be healed; Your vindication shall go before you, and the glory of the LORD shall be your rear guard.
Then you shall call, and the LORD will answer, you shall cry for help, and he will say: Here I am!
Isaiah 58:1-9
Oh Truthseeker,
That is my favorite one yet…I’m LOVING these Psalms!
A joke? That’s a cop-out. Try again, please.
Nope, it was a joke.
……
And it’s not important what I or anyone else, for that matter thinks, right? I mean, if that’s what they WANT to do…….It’s their fingers on the keyboard… Who am I to tell them what to do (with their body)????.
You may not say you care, but I don’t believe you.
mk,
Isaiah what I mean and I mean what I say
The catholics who are pro-choice are phoney catholics who do NOT follow church teaching.
I believe the catholic church should pay the taxes and start speaking up against the culture of death (even more than they do now) and openly support pro-life candidates. Also, they should fire any bishops or priests who in anyway support a “pro-choice” position. Also, they should deny communion and ex-communicate any pro-abort politicians.
Posted by: jasper at January 14, 2008 12:31 PM
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Inquisition anyone?
NOBODY expects the Spanish Inquisition! Our chief weapon is surprise…surprise and fear…fear and surprise…. Our two weapons are fear and surprise…and ruthless efficiency…. Our *three* weapons are fear, surprise, and ruthless efficiency…and an almost fanatical devotion to the Pope…. Our *four*…no… *Amongst* our weapons…. Amongst our weaponry…are such elements as fear, surprise….
Elizabeth
The estimated release date for Bella on DVD is sometime in February.
http://videoeta.com/movie.html?via=form&id=96518
I liked the movie. I thought it was quirky and cute and the soundtrack was pretty awesome. Made me happy :)
HisMan,
I think the Catholic church has a stronger pro-life position because they have a consistent pro-life position. Catholic doctrine sides with life, not just in issues of reproductive freedom, but they also tend to be anti-war and anti-death penalty. I think it’s easier to fight abortion with a consistent pro-life stance. At least, it makes a lot more sense to their opponents.
While there are certainly pro-choice Catholic individuals, the Church as a whole still functions as a monolithic group with an established, recognized hierarchy. Protestant churches don’t have that.
I don’t think Protestants will ever be able to come together on the issue of abortion. There’s way too much dissension. When some denominations ordain women and homosexuals and some refuse, there will be division no matter how strongly they may all agree on the pro-life position. When some denominations accept gay members and others promote ex-gay therapy, there is too much division to work together on pro-life issues. When every denomination has some unique characteristics and doctrinal differences, there can’t be any unity.
And then, of course, not all Protestants are pro-life. And there are many pro-life Christians who still don’t agree that abortion should be illegal.
So basically, Protestant denominations will never be able to work together as a movement to end abortion…at least not on a large scale. It’s just not realistic.