At long last I’ve got this video formatted correctly and posted on YouTube.
On September 29, 2000, I was interviewed on the O’Reilly Factor about my experience as an RN at Christ Hospital in Oak Lawn, IL, holding a live aborted baby.
Bill O’Reilly was uncharacteristically speechless a couple times throughout, which may be why he chose to replay this as one of his five highlights of the year on December 28, 2000.
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Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
Hmmm…your voice is different than what I had imagined it to be. I don’t know exactly what I had imagined it to be, perhaps I’m just weird…..
:-)
I think you may be the one person to leave O’Reilly speechless. Wow.
I’m so glad you exposed this. Bill looked so disgusted. I really like the guy.
I think I’m going to be sick..wow!
Hi Jill. Could you explain a little bit of your history working at the hospital? It seemed from the video that you initially didn’t know that the hospital performed abortions. How long did you continue to work there after you found out that they performed abortions? Thanks, God love you.
Jill, I am curious about something. What was that mother’s reaction after the birth? Did she want to see the baby? Did she cry? Any emotion at all? I just cannot imagine.
Sheesh, I think I need a break for a while.
JK, I have the same reaction when hearing my own voice… :)
Bobby, I did not initially know the hospital committed abortions. I worked in L&D for a year with it going on all around me. After I held the baby and went public, I continued to work another two years there until I was fired. I could never leave on my own accord. I thought to do so would be to abandon the babies and to shirk from a task God gave me.
Heather, I never met the mother. She was my friend’s patient. I don’t recall my friend relaying a reaction, only that the mom didn’t want the baby in the room.
Some women are cold blooded. I don’t believe that they don’t know what they are doing. While I do believe that some are victims, I also believe that a lot of them know the name of the game.
Hello, bunnies! Words cannot describe the madness that was my weekend. How is everyone?
Well, hello there Erin!
I can’t imagine someone not being the slightest bit curious. Well, look at Amy Grossberg. “Get rid of IT!!”……as she ordered her b/f to toss their newborn son into a freezing cold dumpster. Her son was not a “HE”…he was an “IT.”
Amy Grossberg to her attorney while he interviewed her in the hospital..”I thought I had a blob.”
Jill,
You did an incredible job. I can’t even imagine being in that position on national TV. This is also the first time I have seen Bill speechless.
Bill did look sickened. I felt the same. Who wouldn’t?
You know something? I remember watching this on TV with my mother! Never would have guessed I’d be debating with you on a regular basis almost 7 years later…
Mary, did you not say that in the hospital where you work, there is only a specific crew that will partake in abortions?
I’m just glad that you escaped Bill and his hot, hot loofa unscathed…
Had I seen distress, I would have sent Olbermann in to save you!
I wonder if Bill has ever done a piece on the oodles of molesting abortionists?
Abortionists More Prone to Crime, Pro-Lifers Charge
Dawn Rizzoni, CNSNews.com
Tuesday, Jan. 22, 2002
A Texas pro-life activist says he has collected 8,000 examples over the last decade of abortionists participating in crimes, including sexual assault, sexual harassment and murder.
Mark Crutcher, founder and president of Life Dynamics, says he hopes that by sharing his information, he can “better educate the public on the evils surrounding abortion.” Today marks the 29th anniversary of the U.S. Supreme Court’s Roe vs. Wade decision that legalized abortion in the United States.
Through television appearances, books, speaking engagements and articles, Crutcher uses his files as a public education tool. He also runs an Internet site, ClinicWorker.com, that encourages abortion workers to report possible crimes before being implicated themselves.
Crutcher focuses not only on the act of abortion, “but also the kind of people involved, and the things that happen to women who enter these clinics.”
One high-profile case involves Arizona abortionist Brian Finkle, who is scheduled to go on trial in August for allegedly sexually assaulting nine of his patients. After Finkle was arrested last October, roughly 80 women came forward to accuse the doctor of sexual misconduct.
The case involving Oklahoma abortionist John Hamilton has also attracted a lot of publicity. Hamilton was sentenced Jan. 9 to life in prison without parole for the Valentine’s Day 2001 murder of his wife, Susan, who was beaten and strangled.
“When you’re a medical person, you know what you’re doing when you take a human life” through abortion, Crutcher said. “And if you can do that, there’s not much else you won’t do.”
However, a representative from National Abortion Federation insisted, “The history of violence clearly lies on the side of those against choice.”
NAF keeps track of the violence targeting abortionists and abortion clinics. According to the group’s Web site, seven “abortion providers” have been murdered in America since 1993. The most recent of these is New York’s Dr. Barnett Slepian, who was shot and killed in his home in 1998. NAF also lists 17 cases of attempted murder since 1991 and 41 bombings since 1977, all targeting “abortion providers.”
The NAF representative refused to identify herself, and requests for more reaction to Crutcher’s findings were ignored. Telephone calls seeking comment from National Abortion and Reproductive Rights Action League also were not returned.
‘Easier to Hurt Other People’
British Columbia psychiatrist Philip Ney said he has worked with former abortionists who admitted that something inside of them changed for the worse after performing abortions. “There’s an instinctual restraint in humans that keeps them from harming a helpless child. If that restraint is damaged, it becomes easier to hurt other people,” Ney said.
A common crime committed by abortionists, Crutcher said, is the sexual assault of patients. He dedicated a chapter in his pro-life book “Lime 5” to the issue, documenting dozens of cases in which abortionists sexually violated women.
But tracking all instances of sexual assault by abortionists is impossible, Crutcher said, because there are many “clandestine” doctors who perform abortions as part of their regular ob-gyn practice without the public’s knowledge. Also, many rapes go unreported, especially if the woman has something to hide such as an abortion, he said.
According to Crutcher, teen-age patients are easy prey for abortionists who know their victims are unlikely to speak out about the crime.
“If your morals and human instincts are so corrupted that you can kill an unborn human baby, sex with a 15-year-old girl isn’t a big deal,” he said.
Another group, Operation Rescue of Boston, also maintains a record of abortionists involved in crime. One abortionist on their list, Daniel Holschauer, was found to have been involved in sexual misconduct, harassment, stalking, extortion and drug abuse in a study by the New York State Department of Health.
California Right to Life also issued an “Abortion Crime Report” that listed crimes such as murder, kidnapping, rape, stalking, death threats and more, committed by abortionists. One former abortionist on its list, Ivan Namihas, was charged with four counts of rape, 45 incidents of sexual abuse, gross negligence and mail fraud.
A spokesman for American Medical Association said the organization knew of no studies comparing the number of crimes committed by abortionists with the number of crimes committed by doctors in other fields.
Copyright CNSNews.com
Heather,
A hospital I trained at 26 years ago performed an occasional abortion. Yes, there were a number of OR staff, anesthesia providers, and students who refused to take part, and our decision was respected. You could also refuse to take part in tubal ligations but I had no problem with those and to my knowledge neither did anyone else. I remember one student who had deep ambivalence about being involved with an abortion, and the school director telling her it was her option not to participate. The people who would take part in abortions were very few in number and I remember one anesthesia provider who resented being “stuck” with them most of the time, even though she had no moral qualms about abortion.
Its interesting that no other surgical procedure seemed to generate any moral qualms. For instance, we weren’t asked how we felt about hernia repairs and we did not have the option of refusing to participate in them.
Heather,
An interesting and informative post. Thank you.
I wonder why we so naively think that legalizing any criminal act puts the criminal element out of business. Sometimes we only broaden their opportunities.
Mary, have we really come any farther than the back ally days? Looks like we took them and made them legal and acceptable.
Mary, 11:53a: at the time I had no idea who Bill O’Reilly was. I just got a call for an interview and said ok.
I prayed I would speak the right words, but afterward I thought I was not a good interviewee because there was so much dead air. I couldn’t see O’Reilly’s face; I was just looking at a camera.
Then I saw the interview on tv and said to myself not only does the good Lord give people right words to say, He also shuts people up and keeps them from babbling, which He did me.
Then we got cable a couple months later and I more fully understood why ignorance is bliss. Had I known how O’Reilly interviews, I would have had a heart attack beforehand.
Midnight, 12:02p: Yes, who knew? :)
Mary, I also know a lot of medical professionals, and they will not have any part of abortion.
Jill,
You did a very nice job in the interview… I agree with the comments above, I’ve never seen Bill speechless like this, he was because of the barbarity of not helping a baby and just leaving it to die. …Now, if we had a fair MSM that wasn’t so slanted radically left, you would’ve been booked on all of the morning shows, nightline, etc.
Jill,
I’m so sorry.
Heather,
Some women are cold blooded. I don’t believe that they don’t know what they are doing. While I do believe that some are victims, I also believe that a lot of them know the name of the game.
This is true.
sarah, I have known many women who are back for their second, third fourth abortion. How can you not know? How can you feel the child exit your body, and not acknowledge that it must be bigger than a blood clot? This is where I’m just not buying it.
First trimester abortions are bad enough. Second and third are just appalling!
I know Heather. Except to me (personally) its all the same, first, second, and third trimester abortions. I really don’t understand how someone could do this, or vehemently defend second and third trimester abortions, where it becomes more obvious what an appalling death this is.
How can you not know, is a good question. Especially at later stages, I don’t like to think about how the woman can do it.
sarah, yes. ALL are just as bad!
jasper,
The media isn’t liberal, that is just propaganda that the radical right likes to feed you.
If you need proof, look at all the articles done on Bush and Gore during the election, and count how many of Gore’s articles were positive and how many Bush articles were positive. Big difference.
Even if there was a bias in the news anchors, it would be unfair for them to be “radically left” while broadcasting so you’d have to look for it–and every person has a little slant anyway, so it would be unfair to judge them as representative of the whole media.
When events don’t go well in America, it seems logical that they would not show up well in the news. Is that the bias you are talking about? Reality?
Furthermore, most news organizations are all headed under a few large corporations. Guess which political party large corporations like?
If you said Democrats, you’d be wrong.
sarah, many women sought out George Tiller for abortions, so they could attend rock concerts and rodeos. Talk about twisted.
Makes you want to spit that women would actually come out and say that they had an abortion for such a trivial reason.
Who knows what goes through peoples minds eh. Heather, thankyou for talking, I have to go..
okay sarah, see ya next time.
PIP: “jasper,
The media isn’t liberal”
LOL! thats a good one PIP ….Yes, they are. 90 % of them are self-proclaimed Democrats. Not to mention my tax dollars going to NPR and PBS so I can hear Bill Moyers spout his left-wing, Bush is evil non-sense.
btw: Did CBS call Ohio for Bush yet ? Still waiting from the 04 election.
http://www.mediaresearch.org/
Guess what political party the multi-millionaire Hollywood crowd likes. If you said Republican, you’d be wrong.
Jasper,
Oh yeah! That’s an unbiased source!! Good job on that one, buddy.
As I said before, though, even if a reporter has a political stance, often it is hard to tell unless they have editorials. There may be a slight bias, but you describe it as “radical”–which is obviously wrong.
There is a difference between an individual journalist and a widespread overtaking of journalistic standards and professionalism. Usually the influencing factor in any large media corporation is from the top down.
The combination of these is usually a somewhat neutral media, with balancing opinions of either side when opinions or slants exist. A lot of conservatives seem to cling to a “left-wing” bias to assure themselves. Keep clinging to that raft, you’ll be fine.
Mary,
They are not an influencing political factor on day-to-day reporting. Rather, they mainly comprise an entertainment portion. Haven’t you noticed how all these political statements by celebrities are just made fun of all the time? Do you honestly think they are taken seriously by any media corporation?
They are usually talked about all the time because their exploits boost the entertainment factor on the news.
PIP,
You have alot to learn:
The results are astonishing: Not only are the network morning shows overwhelmingly focused on Democrats, they are actively promoting the Democrats
“Not to mention my tax dollars going to NPR and PBS so I can hear Bill Moyers spout his left-wing, Bush is evil non-sense.”
Funny, my tax dollars are going there, but when I see a conservative show or bias there I don’t go whining like a baby. ;)
jasper,
do you mind citing your facts, please. from a non-biased news source. So, FOX news doesn’t count, and apparently, AP, CBS, ABC, CNN, NBC, NPR, PBS, etc. don’t either.
“Funny, my tax dollars are going there, but when I see a conservative show or bias there I don’t go whining like a baby”
what conservative show on Public Radio or PBS? I like the non-polical stuff that PBS does.. but the polical stuff is all liberal, all of the time.
How bout this PIP:
“I
Hear we are discussing Jill’s interview with the lone news outlet (FoxNews) that covered this story and “pro-life” PIP who is supporting Obama (who voted against protections for the aborted alive babies) is attacking Fox..
something stinks….
Jill, I will always be so grateful for your exposing the practice of induced labor abortion. It is beyond my comprehension that Americans aren’t outraged at the practice of deliberately inducing labor to have babies too small to live on there own to die. This is horrible for any baby, but because it is commonly done for handicapped babies is even more unconscionable.
jasper
http://www.mediaresearch.org/about/aboutwelcome.asp
Their slant is conservative, and they admit it. You are here complaining that you want neutrality, give me a neutral source.
Scarborough is AGAIN a conservative source of information ( and on NBC!). So, go scramble and get me stuff from COMPLETELY neutral sources if you want me to believe your claim.
NBC workers, even the liberal ones, found the story misleading. They usually don’t just sit down and watch, they are working. And even the next day, he said “bias is not allowed at MSNBC” (shock and surprise).
Try again.
Hear we are discussing Jill’s interview with the lone news outlet (FoxNews) that covered this story and “pro-life” PIP who is supporting Obama (who voted against protections for the aborted alive babies) is attacking Fox..
There you go again, jasper, twisting facts around.
A. I believe I was just reacting to your outlandish statement that there is a media that is vastly “radically liberal”
B. I don’t believe that supporting fox was ever a requirement for being “prolife.” But you can say that, if you want to keep being derisive! Again, keep clinging to that raft.
C. Did I ever say that I was a staunch supporter of Obama? Or did the last time you freaked out after I reminded you of this and my second correction conveniently slip your mind?
Stop learning from Ann Coulter and Bill O’Reilly. It’s not good for your arguments.
Frankly, I like Bill O’Reilly. I don’t know much about Ann though.
Heather,
Can I ask you why?
*when I said media above I meant mainstream media
Sure. I like him because he speaks his mind.
Heather,
Ann Coulter is a brilliant fearless writer and wonderful person. Check out some of her columns when you get a chance. She’s the one that said liberals holiest sacrament is abortion, and she right.
ok. Will do.
Heather-
“Sure. I like him because he speaks his mind.”
What do you think of his practice of cutting off people’s mics when they start contradicting him?
“Ann Coulter is a brilliant fearless writer and wonderful person.”
I would not call someone so horrific and bad-mouthed a wonderful person–
Someone who claims 9/11 widows enjoyed their husband’s death
Someone who said “My only regret with Timothy McVeigh is he did not go to the New York Times Building”
Someone who claimed “We should invade thier countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Chrisitanity”
Someone who said “If only we could get Muslims to boycott all airlines, we could despense with airport security altogehter”
Need I go on? If a liberal said this you would be protesting and whining, but now that this conservative cat said it, it’s acceptable commentary (many like to guise this as “satire”–satire of what?)
She makes her living off of outlandish blanketed statements, and no sane person would ever take her seriously.
I’ve not seen O’Reilly do that. I have seen Howard Stern talk over people who disagree with him though..that’s another story, I suppose. Where did Ann Coulter write this stuff? What is the name of that book? I wouldn’t mind reading it.
“Someone who claims 9/11 widows enjoyed their husband’s death”
I agree with her there PIP, she had a good point about the political and phony Jersey Girls…
Someone who said “If only we could get Muslims to boycott all airlines, we could despense with airport security altogehter”
Well, she raises a good point. Yes, we could almost.
jasper, did she write a book?
Jill, I LIKE your voice.
Jasper: She’s (Ann Coulter’s) the one that said liberals holiest sacrament is abortion, and she right.
Jasper, I’ve heard it explained as that if men could get pregnant then abortion would be a sacrament.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/06/07/entertainment/main1690954.shtml
Coulter writes in a new book, ?Godless: The Church of Liberalism,? that a group of New Jersey widows whose husbands perished in the World Trade Center act ?as if the terrorist attacks happened only to them.?
She also wrote, ?I’ve never seen people enjoying their husbands’ deaths so much.?
I like O’Reilly, often, but at times he does talk over other people and not let them speak or not let them finish – a pet peeve of mine that occurs on so many darn talk shows….grrrrr…..
There have been times when I yell at him for being an idiot, but I’ve also see him put some good shots on people where I thought they were the idiots.
Doug
Yes Heather. She wrote a few, her latest is called:
Godless: Church of Liberalism
( she’s very funny too, sometimes people take her comments out of context )
“I like O’Reilly, often, but at times he does talk over other people and not let them speak or not let them finish”
Doug, I agree with you there, Bill should do a better job of letting people finish their comments.
speaking of radio idiots, Howard Stern cut a lady off who told him he was ugly…LOL! I guess I can’t blame him. However, he sure can dish it out, but he can’t take it.
“Well, she raises a good point. Yes, we could almost.”
No. You need to break out of the conservative simplistic mindset.
Once we start racially profiling, terrorists will come in the form of other people and other races. To refuse to see the distinction between terrorism and the appearance of middle eastern people is ignorant. It’s okay, the water’s fine.
“I agree with her there PIP, she had a good point about the political and phony Jersey Girls”
I think anybody who is willing to launch an independent investigation of a very important tragedy in American history has their heads in the right place.
What are conservatives afraid of? There is something fishy going on when you REFUSE to testify under oath. Even if everything the government did was flawless (which no government is or ever will be), it would still be necessary to find out what we did wrong and how we can prevent it in the future.
Publicly slandering someone so committed to finding out the truth like that is irresponsible and wrong.
“I’ve not seen O’Reilly do that.”
1. http://youtube.com/watch?v=vTkFU4MtubU
2.http://youtube.com/watch?v=MsuooIpnArQ
3. http://youtube.com/watch?v=h2X1RRoLICQ
Truthfully, I don’t watch Bill THAT much. Perhaps that’s why I’ve never caught that. However, I’ll go with you all on that, and I will say that interrupting others is rather rude.
4. http://youtube.com/watch?v=IHC3MOFb_lg
PIP, you posted after I did. I watched the videos. Okay. Fair enough. I’d never noticed.
Heather,
Yeah, sorry, I am just slow and didn’t refresh the screen before I posted. :)
I wish I could watch him tell Hillary Clinton to “Shut up.”
just kiddin….well, gotta go. goodnight all!
“Once we start racially profiling, terrorists will come in the form of other people and other races.”
I’m waiting….Not all muslims are terrorist, but virtuly all terrorists (99.9%) are muslim. ….There should be some racial profiling, to do otherwise is stupid and dangerous. I don’t put catholic nuns and young muslim men from egypt in the same catagorie.
“I think anybody who is willing to launch an independent investigation of a very important tragedy in American history has their heads in the right place.”
It wasn’t an independent investigation, Jamie Gorelic (Clintons asst Attorney General) broke the communication between the FBI and CIA. It was dog and pony show designed to attack reuplicans..
PIP,
Concerning celebrities. You mentioned Republicans are supported by corporations, I mentioned that Democrats are supported by multimillionaire celebrities. Like the corporations, the wealth of the celebrities does the talking. Support by the rich and famous in politics goes both ways.
Jasper, brace yourself…
I agree with you.
Heck, “profiling” is the job of the police. Better to stop crimes before they occur (hmm… wonder what might arise here) rather than wait until a perpetrator strikes, just because there was no overt evidence against him at the time.
Are we to scrutinize little old ladies from North Dakota, whose families have lived in the US for 200 years, as much as foreign men of middle-eastern descent, aged 18 to 35?
Doug
“Not all muslims are terrorist, but virtuly all terrorists (99.9%) are muslim. ”
Most Arabs are not Muslims, and most Muslims are not Arabs. So which is it, and Arab line at airports or a Muslim line? Should we just ask everyone what their creeds are and THEN separate them from the lines?
While we are at it, let’s make and Irish line for IRA checks, too.
btw, where did you get this statistic? The only sources I could find are blogs and anti-muslim websites.
“It wasn’t an independent investigation, ”
Funnily enough, the Jersey Girls agreed with you there. They called for a new one.
“Jamie Gorelic (Clintons asst Attorney General) broke the communication between the FBI and CIA”
Where did you get this from, and really, what does this have to with the need to launch an independent investigation
“It was dog and pony show designed to attack reuplicans..”
If republicans had nothing to hide they would have no need to refuse to testify under oath. Why are you covering for that?
Doug, I agree with you there, Bill should do a better job of letting people finish their comments.
:: laughing ::
Dang, Jasper, now I know that the leetle debbils have their ice skates on.
Yeah, and it’s not just Bill. I’ve seen some decent discussions/arguments on several of the Sunday-morning political shows, but at times there and many times just about anywhere else you have two people yelling at the same time, talking fast, or in a lower voice trying to slink “under” the other’s comments.
I want the ghosts from “Ghostbusters” to come and slime them, something fierce, at those moments.
Doug
PIP –
Ya know I love you and that I usually agree with you. However –
Ann Coulter – She does say some things just to be offensive. Kinda like Howard Stern without all the sex stuff and Bill Moyers without the idiocy.
As for her statement: “We should invade thier countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Chrisitanity”
If I’m not mistaken she said that as a joke. She also said it on the “1/2 hour news hour” which is a satirical look at the left wing media (yes, left wing) She said this in a skit where she played the Vice President and Rush Limbaugh played the President. It was hysterical! And this very skit made fun of Rush and Ann with their conservative biase.
As for the media being left wing. Most of the large corporations that run the big media outlet are democratic. Especially newspapers. If you watch CNN you will see what looks to be an unbiased report – but look again. When telling a story, you get all sides of the story. The liberal side first, then the conservative side in the middle, then a liberal slant at the end.
One thing I like about FoxNews is that they announce when they are being biased one way or the other. (Certain shows you just know are going to have a conservative biased. John Gibson comes to mind.) When you watch their news reports they will alternate which view comes first. It is the commentary that you have to watch out for. That is when they are conservative. The reports are usually pretty fair.
As for Bill O’reilly. He does bother me when he gets upset and won’t let people talk. Did your U-tube copies show the whole interview? (I don’t have time to watch them) Most of the time what I have seen is that he won’t let people talk because they are trying to spin the story and not answer the question. His motto is “the spin stops here.” He stopped Dan Burton once from talking and I’m not sure if you can get more conservative than Dan Burton! I’ve seen many liberals on his show rant and rave and he lets them because they are answering his questions and staying on topic. He has been pretty vicious lately towards people that protect pedophiles or people who don’t want to pass “Jessica’s Law”. But I’m usually cheering him on at that point. ;-)
I know you don’t have much time, being in shcool. But here is what I did. One day I watched CNN. The next day I would watch MSNBC. Then FoxNews next. I did this for about 2 months (I admit – after about 2 weeks I dropped MSNBC and just went with CNN and Fox). What I saw (and this was a few years ago) was liberal reporting from CNN. Foxnews is conservative in its commentary, but its reporting is usually fair. Even Brit Hume got me yelling at the TV once when he was a panalist and not the host! BTW – Brit Hume’s show is awsome. Usually very fair in its political reporting. They have 3 panalist that discuss the latest political news and they always try to have a liberal (Juan Williams used to be a regular – I think still is but lately is has been Maura ??? I can’t remember her name, but she’s good), conservative (usually Fred Thompson) and a moderate (Usually Morte Kondracke). When Brit is a host, he is good at not taking sides.
done babbling….have a good night PIP!
Heather, I think you, Howard Stern, Bill O’Reilly, and Doctor Tiller should have a round-table discussion.
I’ll bring the popcorn.
Doug
PIP: “btw, where did you get this statistic?”
PIP, if you need statistics of who the overwhelming majority of terrorists are I don’t what to say, I’m not sure what planet you’re living on.
“Concerning celebrities. You mentioned Republicans are supported by corporations, I mentioned that Democrats are supported by multimillionaire celebrities. Like the corporations, the wealth of the celebrities does the talking. Support by the rich and famous in politics goes both ways.”
I do agree it goes both ways. I was more referring to the claim about liberal media. The fact that the conglomerates that own the media are supporters of the Republican party is not very incriminating of a liberal media conspiracy.
“Better to stop crimes before they occur (hmm… wonder what might arise here) rather than wait until a perpetrator strikes, just because there was no overt evidence against him at the time.”
There are other signs to watch for rather than race. Many attacks have been prevented, and none of them have included putting a separate “Arab” line in an airport or something similar.
“Are we to scrutinize little old ladies from North Dakota, whose families have lived in the US for 200 years, as much as foreign men of middle-eastern descent, aged 18 to 35?”
What about Muslim families who have lived in the US a long time? By the way, how are we supposed to target Muslims again?
“Heck, “profiling” is the job of the police.”
I don’t think it’s right to search every black they come across just hoping some of them might commit a crime.
Similarly I don’t think its reight to search every Muslim or Arab they come across just hoping some of them might commit a crime.
Judge on any sort of suspicious behavior, etc. When there are reason to suspect, and the people are Arab, then I support a search. When we start actively racially profiling for any one reason it can become dangerous. Almost 4 in 10 Americans believe Muslims should carry a special ID card. 22% said they would not want to have a Muslim as aneighbor. 34% felt that American Muslims were sympathetic to Al Qaeda and only 49% thought they were loyal to the U.S.
(http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/8/10/165733.shtml)
These sentiments are becoming dangerous.
Doug –
I’m praying. Those poor minions don’t even have winter jackets!
I agree with you on the profiling thing.
AAAAHHHH!!!!!!
you said “Heck, “profiling” is the job of the police. ”
I have a funny story. When I had very little money I had a truck that I called (lovingly) my “hic-mo-bil”. It was an ’83 Nissan King Cab. It was litterally held together with sheet metal. Every time (and I mean every time) I drove through one of the richest suburbs I would get pulled over by a cop! I worked at an animal hospital and the sister clinic was in this rich area, so I had no choice. I’m sure it didn’t help that one time I was driving through blaring Marilyn Manson’s “The Beautiful People” on the radio. hehehe… Just couldn’t help it!
“BTW – Brit Hume’s show is awsome. Usually very fair in its political reporting.”
I agree Valerie….for some reason the Democrats are afraid to have a debate on Fox news……
PIP –
My sister’s in-laws are arabic. Their last name is Nasser. If you remember, that was the last name of the couple of the terrorists through all this. They don’t mind the profiling. Wanna know why? My brother-n-law’s grandparents remember what it is like to live in fear of terrorists. They remember going out into the streets with their heads down and moving as quickly as possible so they could get back home. They remember all the reports of the dead and injured and knowing many names that were on those reports.
My brother-in-laws father says that the Isreal airport is one of the safest you can go to. It takes more than 6 hours just to get through security. Is that what we want?
“Ann Coulter – She does say some things just to be offensive”
Then, she’s not a satirist or a gift from God. Let’s call her the “Howard Stern of the right” instead.
“If I’m not mistaken she said that as a joke”
She said it in her column.
http://www.anncoulter.org/columns/2001/091301.htm
“Most of the large corporations that run the big media outlet are democratic.”
The CEOs of both News Corporation and Time-Warner are conservative. Many of these companies recieve orders from the top down.
“One thing I like about FoxNews is that they announce when they are being biased one way or the other.”
Unfortunately I have never seen a liberal opinion expressed by FOX news anchors, and for my senior report, I watched 15 hours of it. I’ve watched Hannity and Colmes a few times, and usually Colmes doesn’t have much to say, and he certainly doesn’t represent a liberal accurately. I’m not sure, given Hannity’s personality, they wouldn’t have paired him with an equal pundit, just wimpy old Colmes.
“Most of the time what I have seen is that he won’t let people talk because they are trying to spin the story and not answer the question”
Yes they were usually 5 minutes long. Usually they would answer the question or say “it’s not a fair question, this is what is important” and then he would freak out and cut off their mics.
“What I saw (and this was a few years ago) was liberal reporting from CNN. ”
I did this too, for my senior report. There was a difference b/t CNN and FOXnews. That during a tour of europe, CNN essentially said, “good, but he has said some of these before [aired clips]. Let’s hope he means what he says.” FOX said, “Bold and courageous!” Now, you can call CNN biased, or you can call both biased. I think they are both a little biased, but not enough to scream out “liberal media!” every time a story isn’t slanted to the right.
“PIP, if you need statistics of who the overwhelming majority of terrorists are I don’t what to say, I’m not sure what planet you’re living on.”
Then you can’t find one? I have been trying to find a reputable source for this statistic. Who has calculated it? Which organization?
Instead, all I find are blogs and anti-muslim groups saying it. Can you find one that comes from a reputable source?
“My brother-in-laws father says that the Isreal airport is one of the safest you can go to. It takes more than 6 hours just to get through security. Is that what we want?”
You can have the safest airport in the world, and go through that heavy security with everyone if ya want to.
Or you could look for behaviors, etc. I’m not the one screamign racism everytime one is searched. I think it’s okay-as long as there is a good reason.
Racial profiling is going down a slippery slope-a dangerous one. There is no why I can justify it to anyone.
If I said that, since a lot of robberies are committed by African Americans, that we should treat every black person with the idea that they are probably a robber?
If I said that most gun violence is committed by Hispanics, should we search every Hispanic to make sure that they won’t?
I’m standing by my principles on this one. If A is an entitiy and B is a category in which a lot of A is included, A does not cause B.
Can you find one that comes from a reputable source?
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
“Heck, “profiling” is the job of the police.”
PIP: I don’t think it’s right to search every black they come across just hoping some of them might commit a crime. Similarly I don’t think its reight to search every Muslim or Arab they come across just hoping some of them might commit a crime.
True, PrettyInPink, and I’m not saying “shoot on sight.” Agreed that there are abuses like “driving while black.”
I don’t think it’d be fair to make all muslims in the US carry an identity card. However, if things get bad enough – if there were continued attacks over a long enough period of time – I think public opinion could change, bigtime. The few bad apples messing it up for everybody else.
I guess I would agree with you where you say “judge on any sort of suspicious behavior.” Airports, train stations, entries and exits to the country, etc., where people are under increased scrutiny anyway.
And even then I question how much we can really protect ourselves. If a person is willing to die, it’s tough to stop ’em.
From last May: “A Pew Research Center poll found that, while U.S. Muslims are largely the picture of assimilation, about a quarter of Muslims ages 18 to 29 said the use of suicide bombing against civilian targets to defend Islam could be justified, at least on rare occasions.”
This came and went fairly fast, but was surprising to me. I think it was actually 26% of those young US muslims felt suicide bombings were okay, to defend Islam, at least on rare occasions.
That’s quite a few people, even if the poll is wrong and the actual percentage is only a half or a quarter of that….
Sheesh.
Doug
I have a funny story. When I had very little money I had a truck that I called (lovingly) my “hic-mo-bil”. It was an ’83 Nissan King Cab. It was litterally held together with sheet metal. Every time (and I mean every time) I drove through one of the richest suburbs I would get pulled over by a cop! I worked at an animal hospital and the sister clinic was in this rich area, so I had no choice. I’m sure it didn’t help that one time I was driving through blaring Marilyn Manson’s “The Beautiful People” on the radio. hehehe… Just couldn’t help it!
Ha! I can see it, Valerie.
(I hope this was before Ice T’s “Cop Killer” came out.)
Doug
PIP,
If there were 10 people ( 5 arab men from saudi arabia men, and 5 swedish ladies ) boarding a plane leaving for NY city from Paris, and you were the police officer who had to search half of them, who would you search?
“Can you find one that comes from a reputable source?”
That site is an anti-muslim site. That’s not reputable. Try again.
“Agreed that there are abuses like “driving while black.””
How is being pulled over because they are black and being pulled over because they are Arab any different?
” However, if things get bad enough – if there were continued attacks over a long enough period of time – I think public opinion could change, bigtime.”
Wait, I’m not quite sure what you are saying here. That you think the majority WILL want an ID card? Or that it might get worse for American muslims? Maybe it would probably be best for them to just leave the country. Or put in internment camp. Whichever.
“I guess I would agree with you where you say “judge on any sort of suspicious behavior.” Airports, train stations, entries and exits to the country, etc., where people are under increased scrutiny anyway.”
Yup, agreed.
“And even then I question how much we can really protect ourselves. If a person is willing to die, it’s tough to stop ’em.”
Agreed.
“I think it was actually 26% of those young US muslims felt suicide bombings were okay, to defend Islam, at least on rare occasions.”
A little scary, but “rare occasions” is a little vague. I’d have to look at the question. Rare occasions can mean practically anything, and different things to different people. So this question might be better if they were asked if they support what terrorists are doing right now. And hopefully that number will decrease dramatically.
And hopefully if they do plan to do anything we can stop them. Theoretically, pulling over every muslim isn’t going to help.
And again, here’s the problem. Muslims are many times not Arab. If we are targeting Muslims, how WILL we figure out which ones they are? In that case, an ID card would be necessary.
Hopefully we can agree that it would be going to far.
PIP: Or you could look for behaviors, etc.
I went to Switzerland in 1990, going from Detroit to Amsterdam, then to Geneva (had a girlfriend in nearby Lausanne, Switz., who picked me up in a car there).
Had a couple hours in the Amsterdam airport. There I was, 31 years old, clearly alone, wandering about, dressed like a foreigner. At one point, some policemen came toward me and there was an inner “Oh-oh..” feeling. I knew the deal.
I’m 6′ 2″ and four airport policemen, all taller than me, surrounded me, every one of them with a machine gun strapped across their chest. They were polite and friendly after I acted fairly relaxed and “cool.” But they wanted to know what was going on, where I was coming from and going to, to see my boarding pass, passport, etc.
I’m always amazed at how good the English of many foreigners is.
Doug
“That site is an anti-muslim site. That’s not reputable. Try again.”
Can you dispute the statistics on that site PIP? Since you’ve already read it, please tell me what statistic is false?
Jasper: If there were 10 people ( 5 arab men from saudi arabia men, and 5 swedish ladies ) boarding a plane leaving for NY city from Paris, and you were the police officer who had to search half of them, who would you search?
:: laughing ::
This is an easy one.
1.) The Swedish ladies.
2.) The stewardesses.
3.) The rest of the women on board.
4.) What are those women doing in the boarding area for that other flight?
5.) What was the question again?
“If there were 10 people ( 5 arab men from saudi arabia men, and 5 swedish ladies ) boarding a plane leaving for NY city from Paris, and you were the police officer who had to search half of them, who would you search?”
The people who displayed the same characteristics that you are looking for.
PIP –
“”If I’m not mistaken she said that as a joke”
She said it in her column. ”
Re-read the column PIP….she was making a joke! She is sarcastic! I’ve seen a couple sarcastic remarks around here that would fit in this boat….
“The CEOs of both News Corporation and Time-Warner are conservative. Many of these companies recieve orders from the top down.”
Wasn’t Time Warner owned by Ted Turner? Wasn’t it Ted Turner who was ticked off one Ash Wednesday because his office was filled with “Jesus Freaks”? I believe he just stepped down (2006) from being director on the board of directors at Time Warner. I think you may need to look up the definition of liberal and conservative.
“Unfortunately I have never seen a liberal opinion expressed by FOX news anchors, and for my senior report, I watched 15 hours of it. ”
You’re basing this on only 15 hours? I based my opinion on 2 months of watching. I dont’ watch regualar TV. I watch the news, weather and history,discovery,animal planet channels. That’s it.
You are also calling Allan Colmes Wimpy based on “I’ve watched Hannity and Colmes a few times”???? Nice way not to profile!
“Yes they were usually 5 minutes long. Usually they would answer the question or say “it’s not a fair question, this is what is important” and then he would freak out and cut off their mics.”
That is called spinning. Just because they felt the question wasn’t fair they wouldn’t answer it and they were telling O’Reilly how the interview would go. Like I said; “The no spin zone” and “The spin stops here” is his motto…..
“Agreed that there are abuses like “driving while black.””
PIP: How is being pulled over because they are black and being pulled over because they are Arab any different?
None at all.
……
” However, if things get bad enough – if there were continued attacks over a long enough period of time – I think public opinion could change, bigtime.”
Wait, I’m not quite sure what you are saying here. That you think the majority WILL want an ID card? Or that it might get worse for American muslims? Maybe it would probably be best for them to just leave the country. Or put in internment camp. Whichever.
I thought of the internment of the Japanese in the US after Pearl Harbor when I was writing that, but I really only meant that they’d be required to carry identity cards. So, yes, I guess that would be it getting worse.
Although I wonder – there’d still be a hue and cry that it wasn’t fair, and that kind of thing can lead to us all needing “papers.”
Doug
PIP,
what in God’s name are they teaching you in college?
OMG, the political correctness in your comments are frightening. Do you know there was not 1 retaliation death of a muslim in this country after 9/11, in which 3,000 of our citizens were brought to there deaths by 19 muslims?
“I’m always amazed at how good the English of many foreigners is.”
Yup, but apparently when it is encouraged for us to use another language, it’s a problem.
I’m sorry you got searched. At least they were nice to you and everything.
I’d rather someone search me every once and a while than be under a racist policy.
“Can you dispute the statistics on that site PIP? Since you’ve already read it, please tell me what statistic is false?”
I’ve been to that website a million times.
I asked YOU to come up with a reputable source for a statistic. That is not a reputable source. I challenged you, it’s just good manners to actually rise up to the challenge before trying to make others do the same.
Doug……. LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I agree!
I watch the news, weather and history,discovery,animal planet channels. That’s it.
Whoa…. Valerie, my long, lost…. BROTHER!
Doug
Jasper: Do you know there was not 1 retaliation death of a muslim in this country after 9/11, in which 3,000 of our citizens were brought to there deaths by 19 muslims?
You know what’s weird? You’re right, Jasper – I don’t think any muslims were killed. However:
“MESA, AZ — A man armed with hate, bigotry and a gun killed Balbir Singh Sodhi on Saturday, September 15.
Authorities say Mr. Sodhi apparently was singled out in retaliation for last week’s terrorist attacks against the United States because he was believed to be Arab or Muslim.
Mr. Sodhi was not a terrorist. He was not a Muslim. He was not even of Arab origin. He was from India. And he was a Sikh.”
Doug
“Whoa…. Valerie, my long, lost…. BROTHER!”
Brother???
Does this mean my husband is gay?
I think I may be confused again……
“Re-read the column PIP….she was making a joke! She is sarcastic! I’ve seen a couple sarcastic remarks around here that would fit in this boat….”
I’m not saying she was dead serious. I don’t honestly think she wants to kill the leaders and convert them to Christianity. But it’s not the right thing to say THE DAY AFTER 9/11. Any other person saying that would be labeled insensitive. Coulter says it and “she’s joking.” Liberal bias?
“Wasn’t Time Warner owned by Ted Turner?”
No, I believe it is Richard Parsons. Who by the way, is a Republican.
“You’re basing this on only 15 hours? I based my opinion on 2 months of watching. I dont’ watch regualar TV”
Yes, because I was watchign a specific event.
It’s not like I’ve ONLY watched 15 hours EVER. I’m just saying I’ve watched 15 hours each on the same subject and if there ever is a bias, it’s not a conspiracy, it’s just there because humans are imperfect.
“You are also calling Allan Colmes Wimpy based on “I’ve watched Hannity and Colmes a few times”????”
I can’t count how many times I’ve seen it. Every time I watch it though I never see him say something of substance. By the way, he is moderate. Radical conservative vs. a centrist. What a debate.
“”The no spin zone” and “The spin stops here” is his motto…..”
Honestly, if there was no spin, there would be no show. He is GREAT at spinning things. When people call him on it he freaks out.
“what in God’s name are they teaching you in college? ”
To have a soul and stick by your principles?
“OMG, the political correctness in your comments are frightening.”
If you call political correctness the right thing to do, then yeah, they are very frightening. Boo!
“3,000 of our citizens were brought to there deaths by 19 muslims?”
None of the 3,000 citizens killed were muslim?
Doug,
thanks for that …..ok , yes. there was one idiot who killed an Indian man….
” I don’t think any muslims were killed. ”
Considering that not everyone was even identified, a statement like that would have to come from some sort of source.
PIP,
nobody is saying that we should round up all of the muslims ( I have some muslims friends from work )….let’s just use a little common sense.
“nobody is saying that we should round up all of the muslims ( I have some muslims friends from work )….let’s just use a little common sense.”
Which is?
Most of your pundit friends want Muslim lines at airports. You actually disagree with O’Reilly here?
Does this mean my husband is gay?
Not enough information to be sure, Valerie, but I think it’s obvious that he’s a lucky guy.
I was just astounded by your channel picks, to the point that it struck me jokingly as a “same-sex” thing, since often guys will watch a certain group of channels as will women. (I don’t watch all that much “Spike TV” and I noticed it didn’t rate a mention from you, either heh heh heh.)
Even the order you mentioned – I’ll turn it on, flip through some news channels, check the weather, and then the History Channel would be next for me.. incredible odds.
Most of your pundit friends want Muslim lines at airports.
Should we make them take the bus, or all pile on the outside of a battered old truck, or ride a camel?
How does it feel to be one of Bill’s dimwits of the year? How does it feel to latch on to another flamer? Do you enjoy being used? Of course you do. You would like to demand it of others.
PIP-
“I’m not saying she was dead serious. I don’t honestly think she wants to kill the leaders and convert them to Christianity. But it’s not the right thing to say THE DAY AFTER 9/11. Any other person saying that would be labeled insensitive. Coulter says it and “she’s joking.” Liberal bias?”
You are obviously way too young to remember the comments from everyone Sept 12 – Oct 1, 2001.
“No, I believe it is Richard Parsons. Who by the way, is a Republican.”
From Wikipedia: “On September 22, 1995, Turner Broadcasting System, Inc. announced plans to merge with Time Warner, Inc. The merger was completed on October 10, 1996, with Turner as vice chairman and head of Time Warner’s cable networks division.”
He is also the founder of CNN among others.
AND Richard Parsons is considered a “liberal Republican”. Basically, for New York he is a liberal Republican, for the “fly by country” (everything between the New Enland States and California) he is liberal through and through.
As for Foxnews and CNN – I admited that they are biased in commentary. There reporting isn’t as biased as CNN. Pick up any moderate report on the subject. It isn’t just republican’s that find CNN biased.
Sally, you sound really confused. Come again.
“Should we make them take the bus, or all pile on the outside of a battered old truck, or ride a camel?”
I”m not sure, you should probably ask Bill O’Reilly about that.
“You are obviously way too young to remember the comments from everyone Sept 12 – Oct 1, 2001.”
I do, and most people were devastated and/or angry, something humans do when they are reacting to a tragedy like that. btw, I was 16. My memory is not that bad.
“From Wikipedia: “On September 22, 1995, Turner Broadcasting System, Inc. announced plans to merge with Time Warner, Inc. The merger was completed on October 10, 1996, with Turner as vice chairman and head of Time Warner’s cable networks division.””
From Wikipedia:
“Richard D. Parsons, Chairman/CEO of Time Warner Inc.
Jeffrey L. Bewkes, President/COO of Time Warner Inc.”
“Randy Falco, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of AOL LLC
Glenn A. Britt, President and CEO of Time Warner Cable
Barry M. Meyer, Chairman and CEO of Warner Bros. Entertainment Inc.
Bill Nelson, Chairman and CEO of Home Box Office
Philip I. Kent, Chairman and CEO of Turner Broadcasting System
Ann S. Moore, Chairman and CEO of Time Inc.
Robert Shaye, Co-Chairman and Co-CEO of New Line Cinema
Michael Lynne, Co-Chairman and Co-CEO of New Line Cinema”
“Richard Parsons is considered a “liberal Republican”
That means he is not liberal enough to partake in any sort of widespread liberal conspiracy. He probably just supports the more liberal Republicans. I’ve seen a pretty big difference between liberal Republicans and liberal Democrats. Mainly, that the Republicans tend to vote for Republicans, and Democrats tend to vote for Democrats.
“he is liberal through and through.”
Well, then why has he worked for Nelson Reckefeller and Gerald Ford, and supports Rudy Giuliani?
“There reporting isn’t as biased as CNN.”
I don’t think that’s true. I’ve never seen CNN any more biased than FOX news. They even have conservative pundit shows on CNN. Yes, they too are part of the liberal conspiracy.
“It isn’t just republican’s that find CNN biased.”
Honestly, it’s a matter of opinion. But I do find that Republicans tend to only watch FOX news– and really aren’t that better than CNN when quizzed on politics.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/TV/09/28/comedy.politics/
To lighten up the conversation, I’m going to harken back to Colbert’s show..good times.
Stephen Colbert: [Debating Russ Lieber on minimum wage] Look, people don’t have to work for what I’m paying them, they don’t have to show up. It’s not slave labor. By the way, slave labor- I’m against it. Rebuttal?
Russ Lieber: Um, well… I’m against it too.
Stephen Colbert: I accept your apology. Look, they tried your idea in Russia. Minimum wage is just line item Communism! All right? The government is controlling the economy. We won the Cold War, Mr Lieber, fair and square.
Russ Lieber: Well, I don’t see what the Cold War has to do with this.
Stephen Colbert: Then why don’t you support our troops?
Russ Lieber: I, I do! I don’t see what that has to do with…
Stephen Colbert: So it’d be better for you if Saddam were back in power?
Russ Lieber: No, we were talking about minimum wage.
Stephen Colbert: On September 11’th, 2001…
Russ Lieber: Oh come on, September 11’th has nothing to do with this!
Stephen Colbert: I am not gonna let anyone sit here and bad mouth our firemen! No way! Sorry, not on my show, mister! Cut off his mike!
Russ Lieber: Oh, now wait a second!
Stephen Colbert: Cut off his mike!
[Lieber’s mike is cut off, but he’s still talking]
Stephen Colbert: I can still hear him, what is that? Is he coming through my mike? Cut off my mike!
Stephen Colbert: Look, I just think that Rosa Parks was overrated.
Conan O’Brien: Rosa Parks was overrated? That’s-that’s madness!
Stephen Colbert: Conan, last time I checked, she got famous by breaking the law.
Conan O’Brien: Breaking the law? She was standing up for a whole race of people. She was a freedom fighter!
Stephen Colbert: Conan, how do I know that there wasn’t an old, sick, white man who needed that seat in the front of the bus?
Conan O’Brien: How can you say that?
Stephen Colbert: Conan, I’m gonna keep saying this until Rosa Parks’s children apologize for what their mother did to that bus company!
Conan O’Brien: You want Rosa Parks’s children to apologize?
Stephen Colbert: Absolutly.
Conan O’Brien: Gah! Okay, I’m sorry. I have no choice.
[shoots Stephen in the chest, who then rises up a second later]
Stephen Colbert: [unaffected] Typical East-coast, Ivy League educated response.
Conan O’Brien: [pause] We’ll take a break. We’ll be right back.
Stephen Colbert: Look, I respect your right to disagree with me. Don’t get me wrong.
Conan O’Brien: I shot you very near the heart!
I’m so glad that you finally got this posted on youtube, Jill! :)
Doug –
“I was just astounded by your channel picks, to the point that it struck me jokingly as a “same-sex” thing, since often guys will watch a certain group of channels as will women.”
I will agree to that. I’ve just never been a typical woman when it comes to this kind of stuff. I’ve always detested Soap Opera’s, I can’t stand talk shows (I can tolerate Operah to a certain degree, but that depends on the subject), I couldn’t stand “The View” even before Rosie was there, Melrose Place needed to burn and 90210 was just FUBAR! I think the only “network” TV shows I have watched is Star Trek (only TNG – not DS9 etc.) and The X-files. Oh – I’ve never seen an episode (or even 10 minutes) of American Idol or any other reality TV show.
I’m out of touch with entertainment and I’m glad!
I love Mythbusters, Dirty Jobs, Modern Marvels, Lost Words and the like.
hmmm…..Maybe my hubby is gay? I tried to tell him that, but he said he wanted to be a lesbian instead.
Bethany, 11:18a: Yeah, whew! Thanks to you. Wouldn’t have known about the wmv.
I know your story but to hear to talk about it was incredible.
God Bless u!
St. Gianna please pray for those who have gone through abortions. Truly, they know not what they do.
Amen, Patricia!