Don’t know the outcome of this incident, whether the girl aborted. Pray not.
But politically-correct language checkers at these 2 papers slipped. The Centredaily.com story appeared April 13, and the Tribune-Democrat story was posted April 12. Click to enlarge:
[HT: son Tim, reader Ryan J.]
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Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
This is a horrible story. It shouldn’t take a rocket scientist to see that legalizing the abortion drugs could lead to this. Look how the date-rape drug is used. It’s only a matter of time before missuse of the human abortion drugs will be reported, if it hasn’t been already.
When is the AMA going to step up and address this problem? Should PP and others be handing these drugs out for girls to stash at home “just in case”? Who is monitoring the inventories of these life-taking drugs?
It doesn’t matter Janet how many women will have this done to them. All that matters is that the sacrosanct right to abort is preserved under any and all conditions. After all, according to proaborts this girl wouldn’t “lose” anything anyway – it’s not a person.
Have we seen ANY pro-feminist, proabort coming out and speaking against this- NO!
What’s the point of underlining unborn baby or unborn child? It really is just easier for me to say fetus. I was saying for awhile, “a baby (still in the womb)” but people didn’t seem to get it. So I’m just going to say fetus. I’m still thinking of the same thing, just calling it a fetus/embreyo/zyogte because everyone here knows what that is.
A rose by any other name would still smell as sweet.
What in the world does RU486 being legal have to do with this?
Patricia, of course this is a horrible tragedy and I feel just terrible for this girl. I hope her child is alright, and I hope she will be fine to. I also hope however did this is brought to justice.
However you can’t blame the drug for this, you have to blame the person who abused it. Should we outlaw pain medication because some people abuse it?
BTW, end pregnancies in cows? That’s wrong, because the cow can’t tell you whether or not it want’s to be pregnant. Just let cows be cows.
Patricia, that’s a misrepresentation of feminism and being pro-choice.
Of course we should be outraged about this! This woman wanted her child, as far as I can tell from the article, and she has the RIGHT to have it!
Neither of the articles shed a lot of light on what really happened though, so slow down before you start judging. It doesn’t say whether the baby died, or if the girl didn’t want her child, or who was suspected… in fact, it doesn’t give a lot of detail at all. So let’s not be so quick to decide “what happened” when you don’t really know either.
Jess: What’s the point of underlining unborn baby or unborn child? It really is just easier for me to say fetus. I was saying for awhile, “a baby (still in the womb)” but people didn’t seem to get it. So I’m just going to say fetus. I’m still thinking of the same thing, just calling it a fetus/embreyo/zyogte because everyone here knows what that is.
You might have to do a little explaining to everyone, Right now you are caving in to political correctness, and not being true to yourself if you don’t call it as you see it – a baby.
Janet, when I picture a baby I picture like a three month old or something. I picture a baby that is already born. When I think of fetus I think of a little developing human inside of a woman.
I mean, if someone said, “I have a baby”, you would probably think of a baby that has already been born.
Janet, when I picture a baby I picture like a three month old or something. I picture a baby that is already born. When I think of fetus I think of a little developing human inside of a woman.
Jess, you said you used to call them “baby in the womb”. How did you picture them then?
And what do you think a developing human looks like anyway?
Bethany, when I said baby in the womb I got people saying, what? baby? unborn child? product of abortion? No, fetus, in the Mom attached to her. Baby, outside of the Mom. When I picture a developing human I think of someone who likes like your Blessing, if that is ok. Cute big head, little tiny hands, big black eyes and sort of transparent.
Damn, guys… seriously, when pro-lifers bicker over semantics, it makes you look foolish. That’s not the argument. Whether we call it a baby, fetus, zygote, caterpiller, piece of gum, blueprint, whatever… is not the point, nor is it the backbone of the pro-choice argument.
Edyt,
The bottom line is that this is not just a once in a while occurrence – it’s happening more and more.
My question remains: Where are all the feminista’s decrying the use of this drug against women?
Um, hello Patricia? Here I am!
Patricia, if you stepped out of your pro-life bubble every once in awhile, I’m sure you’d see some feminists saying women have the choice to have or not have a child, not anyone else.
For example, me, who just said it…twice now.
And Jess too! And… oh, I’d be willing to bet Hal and Doug and TexasRed agree with us too.
Oh man, doesn’t that just shatter your whole feminists-are-baby-killers argument and your pro-choicers-want-all-babies-dead argument?!
Bethany, when I said baby in the womb I got people saying, what? baby? unborn child? product of abortion? No, fetus, in the Mom attached to her. Baby, outside of the Mom. When I picture a developing human I think of someone who likes like your Blessing, if that is ok. Cute big head, little tiny hands, big black eyes and sort of transparent.
That was at only 6 weeks gestation, Jess. They continue developing after that point. Here is a picture of a 18 week unborn baby:
and here is a picture of a 20 week unborn baby:
It sounds like you were peer pressured out of saying the word baby. I’m sorry.
Oh man, doesn’t that just shatter your whole feminists-are-baby-killers argument and your pro-choicers-want-all-babies-dead argument?!
No, not really.
Edyt, definitely agreed – semantics is not the real deal here. Heck, call it anything, say anything, etc…
I have seen so much time spent in the (IMO) time-wasting effort of people going back and forth with “IS a baby,” and “IS NOT a baby.” Never gets anywhere.
It’s a subjective thing; it’s up to the user.
I know they keep developing Bethany. Just like a baby keeps developing to become a toddler, then a preschooler, etc…
Bethany, that 20 weeker looks like he is prematurely gray in the mustache and eyebrows.
In the recent discussions of the Canadian unborn victims of crime bill, feminists are terrified of the language of the bill– which uses the term “unborn child”.
They assure us that the term will be used to advance fetal rights.
This, in spite of the fact that our Supreme Court has said, practically verbatim, that an unborn child has no rights.
The feminists hate the term. Even when it does not threaten their rights.
haha Doug, it does look like that. :-) if they’re born early they’ll have that “cheesy” coating all over them. My daughter was coated in it. I can’t remember what it’s called though.
google image fetus, then google image baby.
Jess, I have before, Google “unborn baby”.
http://images.google.com/images?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=s&hl=en&q=unborn+baby&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
Wow, my own baby’s picture appears on the first page when you type those keywords.
Suzanne, the fear is a potential loophole that is created out of saying “unborn child.”
When you make a law protecting a “child’s right to life” then it also encompasses unborn children, as “unborn” is a modifier, while “child” is the noun.
In order to correctly prevent that loophole from occuring, you would have to make laws protecting “born children’s right to life” or otherwise change the terms of “unborn child” to “fetus”.
Terminology is important in that sense, but not in the overall abortion argument.
Why can’t I just call it a fetus? We all know what it looks like. We all know it’s human with human DNA. It’s just at different stages. Would it really change anything if I called it a baby? What if I started calling it an pre-adult?
I know Bethany I noticed her too she was very sweet looking, like a little angel : )
Why can’t I just call it a fetus? We all know what it looks like. We all know it’s human with human DNA. It’s just at different stages. Would it really change anything if I called it a baby? What if I started calling it an pre-adult?
Just because you understand it doesn’t mean everyone does. Many, many people (even some who have posted here) truly have believed that it is simply a blob of cells with no humanity. The word baby recognizes what they are.
The reason I argue with you on this terminology, is because you support allowing women to kill theirs, because they are not what you consider to be a “baby”. It’s not just about the word you use. It’s about what you allow the word to justify.
I know Bethany I noticed her too she was very sweet looking, like a little angel : )
Thank you, Jess.
That means a lot.
What’s the point of underlining unborn baby or unborn child? It really is just easier for me to say fetus. I was saying for awhile, “a baby (still in the womb)” but people didn’t seem to get it. So I’m just going to say fetus. I’m still thinking of the same thing, just calling it a fetus/embreyo/zyogte because everyone here knows what that is.
A rose by any other name would still smell as sweet.
Posted by: Jess at April 14, 2008 12:44 PM
If what is important is what is easiest for you, then go ahead and call it a fetus.
Call it a baby if you want to encourage a conversation with your friends. It your CHOICE!
Bethany I don’t support abortion because it’s a fetus. I believe in abortion because I believe a woman has a right not to be pregnant. I don’t know if you’ve heard this before, but I’m a staunch supporter of the Born Alive Infant Protection Act. Why? Because I’m not pro-killing babies or fetuses or whatever. I’m for a woman’s right not to be pregnant if she chooses to. If she’s not pregnant then no one has the right to end the child’s life, directly or indirectly.
Jess and Edyt:
Sorry but you guys are small potatoes! I am referring to the proaborts who are mainline, running the women’s organizations etc. Well known individuals who have stepped up front to support a woman’s right to abort.
The silence is deafening and similar to that on the risks of abortion too.
Abortion is a sacrament to the left wing.
SUZANNE: you are so very right because of course this term tells who and what is really being aborted! And that they (the unborn child) might have rights! Not!
“Sorry but you guys are small potatoes!”
mmmm potatoes… : P
“..It’s a subjective thing; it’s up to the user.”
————————————-
Ah..yes…Moral Relativism at it’s finest…
and Semantics IS the key…the pro-abort, liberal folks like to de-humanize the human baby (by calling it whatever it wants) so it won’t be subject to human rights and they get to fool a lot more people to their side, too!
RSD, I don’t care if it’s a teenager, if it’s inside a woman and she doesn’t want it to be then she should be able to not have it in her.
Jess, who was responsible for putting “IT” inside the woman?
RSD, God?
No, the woman may or may not have choose to have sex. You walk outside every day but I’m sure you don’t consent to a tree limb falling on you and hitting you. You eat meat but I’m sure you didn’t consent to get cancer from it.
Jess, ..so..the girl chooses/ consents to have sex but does not consent to be pregnant…
Unfortunately, when a girl CHOOSES/CONSENTS to have sex…more often than not she gets pregnant, it’s the NATURAL Order of things.
Tell me of a girl who CHOSE not to have sex and got pregnant? (*aside from forcible rape and incest for those smart alecks out there)
Edyt,
The bottom line is that this is not just a once in a while occurrence – it’s happening more and more.
My question remains: Where are all the feminista’s decrying the use of this drug against women?
Posted by: Patricia at April 14, 2008 1:23 PM
***********************
What are you ranting about? Where do you get these ridiculous delusions and these deranged fantasies? This is taking choice AWAY from the pregnant woman. Except for some Chinese polititians, no one is “for” this.
And Jess too! And… oh, I’d be willing to bet Hal and Doug and TexasRed agree with us too.
Oh man, doesn’t that just shatter your whole feminists-are-baby-killers argument and your pro-choicers-want-all-babies-dead argument?!
Posted by: Edyt at April 14, 2008 1:30 PM
*******************
Exactly. Taking away the womans right to make her own decisions is wrong and its every bit as wrong to try to force her to abort as it is to try to force her to gestate.
That was at only 6 weeks gestation, Jess. They continue developing after that point. Here is a picture of a 18 week unborn baby:
******************
That’s a picture of a fetus at 18 weeks gestation. Its going to be about 5.5 inches long and about 5.5 ounces in weight. Its a fetus.
Oh man, doesn’t that just shatter your whole feminists-are-baby-killers argument and your pro-choicers-want-all-babies-dead argument?!
No, not really.
Posted by: Bethany at April 14, 2008 1:41 PM
********************
That’s because reality gets in the way of all your hatred and resentment for people who arent “just like you”. So you lie about them so you can try to excuse your hateful attitude.
Ah..yes…Moral Relativism at it’s finest…
and Semantics IS the key…the pro-abort, liberal folks like to de-humanize the human baby (by calling it whatever it wants) so it won’t be subject to human rights and they get to fool a lot more people to their side, too!
Posted by: RSD at April 14, 2008 2:57 PM
*************************
Why does the truth and factual information make you so uneasy? Because melodramatics and sensationalism support your agenda much better than the truth does. If the truth supported the antichoice agenda then you wouldnt have to try to hide behind melodramatics.
“more often than not she gets pregnant, it’s the NATURAL Order of things.”
I know people who have unprotected sex often and don’t get pregnant. I had unprotected sex like, twice and I didn’t get pregnant. So no, not more often then not.
“more often than not she gets pregnant, it’s the NATURAL Order of things.”
I know people who have unprotected sex often and don’t get pregnant. I had unprotected sex like, twice and I didn’t get pregnant. So no, not more often then not.
Posted by: Jess at April 14, 2008 4:13 PM
*********************************
Even without using any method of contraception a sexually active woman still has about a 15% chance of not getting pregnant in a years time. In the ‘natural order of things’ NOT getting pregnant is a lot more ‘natural’ than getting pregnant. A woman can only get pregnant for a relatively few days out of any given month but she can be sexually active *any time*. Its ‘the natural order of things’ to die from cancer and heart disease. I dont see anyone insisting THAT ‘natural order of things’makes it wrong to seek medical care.
So…85 percent possible pregnancy in case of sex is NOT more often than not?
That’s not including any contraception.
Okay, now see, this is what happens when you refuse to acknowledge that the unborn inside of women are a.human and b.babies.
You got this nutcase trying to abort a calf. You’ve got this fool believing that the girl is pregnant with a cow!!!!
If you’d stop using “scientific language” like product of conception or fetal matter, he’d have realized that women carries human babies, not bovines!
I think TR meant a 15% chance OF getting pregnant within a year.
Considering only a few days of fertility every month (say about 4.5 days out of one month, 12 months a year, that’s 54 fertile days or about 15 percent of every year) it’s more likely to not get pregnant than it is to get pregnant.
And then consider that anywhere from 20 to 50 percent of all pregnancies result in miscarriage (official stats don’t exist because some people miscarry without even knowing they were pregnant).
Count the number of times sperm fails to fertilize an egg or the egg fails to implant in the uterus…
All this not counting the use of contraceptives… and considering contraceptives for normal (not perfect) use account for maybe 85-99 percent effectiveness… let’s take the 85 percent number, so there are 15 percent of people misusing their birth control…
Hmm, statistically, getting pregnant is a lot harder than it looks.
If 100 percent of people (who do not want children) used contraceptives normally, only 15 percent of those have the POTENTIAL failure rate, which when you count a 15 percent chance of getting pregnant every year and the high incidences of miscarriage… amount to way fewer unwanted pregnancies and way fewer abortions!
I SEE! THE ANSWER IS CONTRACEPTIVES TO LOWER THE ABORTION RATE! IT ALL ADDS UP PERFECTLY!
(Sorry, I got off on a tangent there)
That’s because reality gets in the way of all your hatred and resentment for people who arent “just like you”. So you lie about them so you can try to excuse your hateful attitude.
TexasRed, your posts are so ironic they are hilarious.
lol
Edyt, in theory, perhaps. In practice, the statistics say it doesn’t work that way.
“Planned Parenthood
Also, the pills that Planned Parenthood gives out so affordably are low-dose pills which aren’t nearly as effective in preventing pregnancy as the normal pills. Why do you suppose that an organization like Planned Parenthood might dish out such poor quality pills?
From abortionfacts.com :
But legalizing abortion was sold to us as a cure for many of our social ills.
Let
mk, stop using scientific language? Can we call it a blob again?
So what happened to the girl?
mk, stop using scientific language? Can we call it a blob again?
If you can type “blob” in the dictionary, and find that it’s definition is “baby”, or “unborn child”, or even “human fetus”, sure!
If not, then I fail to see your point.
blob (blb)
n.
1. A soft, amorphous mass.
2. A daub, as of color.
tr.v. blobbed, blob
Baby
n., pl. -bies.
1.
1. A very young child; an infant.
2. An unborn child; a fetus.
3. The youngest member of a family or group.
4. A very young animal.
2. An adult or young person who behaves in an infantile way.
3. Slang. A girl or young woman.
4. Informal. Sweetheart; dear. Used as a term of endearment.
5. Slang. An object of personal concern or interest: Keeping the boat in good repair is your baby.
I looked for information on how the girl is doing, and I found this:
“Police says at this time they think both the mother and the child are ok.”
http://wearecentralpa.com/content/fulltext/?cid=6400
Thanks Bethany. :)
I am praying that both mother and child will be fine.
That’s because reality gets in the way of all your hatred and resentment for people who arent “just like you”. So you lie about them so you can try to excuse your hateful attitude.
TexasRed, your posts are so ironic they are hilarious.
lol
Posted by: Bethany at April 14, 2008 6:24 PM
***********************
I couldnt care less if you think abortion is ‘wrong’. You have a right to your opinion about your pregnancy. But you want to make that decision for me too, and for every other woman in this nation and you bitterly resent the fact that you cannot do it. And you hate the women who do not agree with you. The fact that you have to lie about the opinions of other people, and lie about what they think, feel and believe proves my point.
So…85 percent possible pregnancy in case of sex is NOT more often than not?
Posted by: RSD at April 14, 2008 4:55 PM
*******************
In a given month a woman can get pregnant for about 3 days. That means for 27 or 28 days she can be sexually active and NOT get pregnant. Avoiding those 3 or 4 days is how NFP works. MOST of the month a woman cant get pregnant.
“Planned Parenthood
On Natural Family Planning – “The Creighton Method” – It works.
http://www.creightonmodel.com/index.html
The Creighton Method (cont.)
Long distance teaching can be done for those individuals in an area not currently served by a CrMS teacher. To inquire about these services, call the FertilityCare
(I have used this method with success.)
Ask yourself the following questions and if the answer to any of these questions is “Yes!” then you should seriously consider looking up one of the affiliated centers of FertilityCare
Re NFP – fine, if you want to use it. Lots of people really do not want to spend that much time trying to keep track of their cycle etc. or have their sex life dictated by their cycle. It usually works a lot better TO get pregnant than to avoid pregnancy.
Would you like a family planning system that actually helps bond your marriage? Where both the the man and the woman work together?
Are you looking for a system of family planning that is morally acceptable to you and your spouse?
***************************
Trying to say NFP ‘will’ to do these things is dishonest. I have a serious problem when someone shys away from science and factual information and comes up with emototbabble and melodramatics. If they want to talk about the potential negative health impact of, say, Depo, thats one thing. But insisting NFP WILL ‘help bond a marriage’ and IS ‘morally acceptable’ to everyone just is not telling the truth. And neither is tring to pretend NFP is a ‘solution’ to infertility, miscarriages, stillbirth and premature birth. Thats just flat out lying.
You can buy a basal thermometer at most drug stores and inside there will be instructions with a chart to keep track of your daily temperatures, to 1/100th of a degree. You can teach yourself, although classes are recommended. More information can be found here:
Basal Thermometers – Tips for Use
A basal thermometer is an ultra sensitive thermometer that tracks your body’s minutest temperature shift. A basal body temperature (BBT) thermometer is often used by women to chart their basal body temperature chart and hence predict their fertile period or ovulation. There are various kinds of BBT thermometers available but a digital basal thermometer is your best bet. Most basal thermometers come with a blank basal body temperature chart that you can use. You can also download a our free basal body temperature chart to use.
A basal thermometer is more reliable and accurate than a simple glass thermometer since glass thermometers are only accurate to .2 degrees Fahrenheit. You really need it to be accurate to .1 degrees Fahrenheit. The main advantage of the digital basal body thermometer over a fever measuring body thermometer is speed. The basal body digital thermometer is more accurate than a fever based thermometer, and it only takes 30-60 seconds. In addition, a digital basal thermometer is harder to break and remembers the temperature for you if you don’t want to chart it immediately.
Charting your basal body temperature is also easy. Simply put, what you are doing is taking your temperature first thing each day and plotting the temperature on a chart. What you are looking for is to see a temperature shift of at least .4 degrees Fahrenheit after ovulation making your chart biphasic. This means that your chart should show low temperatures before ovulation in the follicular phase, and higher ones after ovulation in the luteal phase.
Here are some tips to help use your basal body thermometer with optimum accuracy:
1. Use your basal thermometer first thing in the morning before you get out of bed.
To avoiding forgetting you can leave your thermometer at your bedside within easy reach so you don’t have to move much to get it. If you use a glass thermometer, make sure you shake it down before going to bed.
2. Try to take the temperature at as close to the same time each day as possible.
You may need to set an alarm to be accurate. Staying within a half hour either side of your average time is a good idea because your temp can vary with the time. For example, if you usually take your temperature at 6 a.m., it is fine to take your basal body temperature between 5:30-6:30, but the closer to 6 the better. The normal variation is by up to .2 degrees per hour. It may be lower if you take your temperature earlier than average and higher if you take it later than average time.
3. It is best to use your basal thermometer after 5 hours of uninterrupted sleep.
The minimum limit is 3 hours.
4. You can use your basal body thermometer orally, vaginally, or rectally.
But always stick with the same method for the entire cycle.
5. You should try to place the basal body thermometer the same way each day
Meaning, try and place the basal thermometer in the same location of your mouth, same depth vaginally or rectally.
6. Some women, not all, have a temperature drop when they ovulate and then see the temperature jump following the dip. If you see this drop, it is a good idea to have sex in case you are ovulating. Otherwise continue using your basal body thermometer throughout the cycle for accurate results.
http://www.babyhopes.com/articles/basal-thermometer.html
*Footnote to earlier posts – My posts regarding the Creighton Method of Natural Family Planning are direct quotes from the web sites indicated at the end of the post. (I should have put them in quotes, my mistake.)
My post regarding basal thermometer usage was a direct quote from the referenced site (excluding the first paragraph which were in my own words). Although the direct quote suggests using a basal thermometer accurate to 1/10 th of a degree, I did find a different web source that mentioned one that measured to the 1/100th degree of accuracy, which is why there is a discrepancy.