“We reject abortion because we are left-wing”
Well, here is an interesting view, an op ed written by the SAIn Political Party (Internationalist Self-Management and Solidarity) in Spain, as quoted from Solidaridad.net, May 2 (bold highlights theirs):
In the last eight years under the Popular Party’s administration, abortion has risen by 37%, reaching almost 80.000 abortions per year…. [due to a] policy… result[ing] in free abortion practice during the first 3 months of pregnancy….
With such a “pseudo-progressive” measure as abortion advocacy a so-called socialist party… has explicitly put forward a neoliberal political and economic capitalist program.
We strongly disapprove of abortion because we are left-wing. Likewise, we are against any assault on life, such as death penalty, torture, hunger, armament, war, destruction of the environment… We therefore proclaim that these are values the Left must vindicate….
We are left, socialist and self-managed, because we defend the socialization of means of production, because we fight against any form of exploitation of human beings, because we are against the oppression of people by any imperialist power. Also, because we defend human life as a supreme value.
In world history, abortion has been legalised by totalitarian, comunist nazi and liberal capitalist regimes. People, such as Robert McNamara – from Vietnam – and the World Bank, have goaded abortion acceptance. They have imposed it as something convenient for multinational capitalist dominance. Hitler rejected it for his aria “race” but enforced it for those under his rule.
There’s life, a unique human life in the fertilised human ovum of the mother’s womb. This life is destroyed by using the cruelest methods. It is not just another part of the woman’s body, it is a unique individual; as well as elderly people, the handicapped, the mentally disabled, the terminally ill. All those people that would be included on a list of future targets by accepting abortion, because they might not be considered human beings with a right to live, but instead bothersome, unwanted members of a society that does not regard them as “productive.”
Despite whatever may be said, there is not any more reactionary claim than a person demanding a right over an unborn child. It is the most inconceivable claim of property, still worse than claiming a master’s right to enslave. It is a shame that the Left should defend this so-called right. Moreover, in doing so, they are letting the Right hypocritically monopolise the opposition to it.
We absolutely reject this shameful vindication, and considering the currently existent knowledge about embryology, the Left should not support this position. We are not only left-wing and we reject abortion, but also we are against it because we are left-wing.
Human life is a supreme value from its conception to natural death. In line with this, we must take measures against abortion by fighting its causes, by assisting single mothers socially and legally in an efficient way, those who want to keep their children as well as those who decide to give them up for adoption.
Abortion is an atrocious violent act against unborn children and their mothers. The Left should fight to make women’s wombs the safest place for children because this is naturally so. Likewise, society as a whole should protect mothers and children, before and after their birth.
Well, how can you argue against that logic?
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
“The Left should fight to make women’s wombs the safest place for children because this is naturally so.”
You don’t say?
Spanish Left, I’d like to introduce you to the American Left.
Shake Left hands and let’s begin…
“Shake Left hands and let’s begin…”
lol
It’s about time the left hand knew what the right hand was doing! Now let’s see if one hand can wash the other…because a bird in either hand, is worth more…period.
“It’s about time the left hand knew what the right hand was doing!”
Nice allusion to Matthew 6:3, MK…
Totally off topic, but this might just be the solution…Val sent this to me. Someone apparently didn’t know how to spell “peonies”…
thank you thank you thank you for posting this Jill!!!
I can’t say I’m a socialist but I like their position on this issue.
:)
“Totally off topic, but this might just be the solution…”
LOL!!! Man I needed a good laugh!!!
Gee, the republican party used to be all about small government and LESS INTRUSION INTO THE PRIVATE LIVES OF AMERICANS.
I don’t welcome the federal government into my uterus any more than I’d welcome them into my gun case.
(Phill Kline was told to go home and mind his own business Monday. Denied access to Planned Parenthoods private medical records. BRAVO!)
Mother’s Day is just around the corner.
I think roses are still a little more traditional than fresh cut penis.
(Just a thought…)
I haven’t been able to find any mention of this “party” on Wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_Spain
Odd.
Jill, you forgot to quote the best part of that screed — the beginning:
“All the parliamentary right and left-wing political parties defend the present capitalist system, and they are all pro-choice.”
Ready to join them in taking down the capitalist system, Jill? LOL
Jill:
This is the truly left-wing position and mantra. In this country they can’t explicitly state it since they know no liberal majority would ever get elected using this as a platform. That is why all liberals are phantoms. They get elected spewing conservative ideas (as Hillary is doing now saying crap like “a stonger military” and Obama now dissing his Pastor of 20 years. Then, once in power, they implement their destructive liberal agenda. We have a liberal, lesbian Governor (who denies her sexual preference), who acted like a conservative at campaign time and then enacts gay rights and pro-abortion legislation when ever she can. She is a lunatic left winger. Just like the party that lies to Black America and then supports Planned Parenthood who is engaged in Black Genocide. These are truly evil people. They can’t even be honest about who they are. They’ll do anything for power.
This clearly validates my post of April 17, 2007 in which I stated the following:
“It is no secret to me what abortion truly is and why I think it is used as a means to hold political power. I state it again as posted on previous threads as follows:
“You have to realize that pro-deathers are not driven by logic. They are driven by the lust for power, perhaps abortion followers without realizing it, but its leaders and initiators, guilty as hell.
They are no different than the poor man who fantasizes about taking the rich man’s watch without regard to how or why the rich man acquired the watch; while poor materially, they lack no prejudice. They feel totally justified in their position, not because of logic but in some sinister form of perverted self-righteousness not thoroughly arrived at, at having simply arrived. Perhaps this itself feeds the power demon inside them, at just being able to arrive, at joining up: “I’m in the club now and no one will every kick me out, not even me”.
They reject anyone or anything in authority that would tell them how to live including God Himself and it’s generally masked in the facade of women’s rights. Which when you analyze it, is a very parasitical way of thinking. I mean, they kill unborn baby woman too don’t they? How dare they use the issue of abortion to bolster their sense of self-hood. Again, the perverted, twisted and demented logic shows its ugly head from every angle of the looking glass. Ah, but they see in a mirror darkly? No, the light’s off.”
For all you pro-aborts out there, you need to realize what you have accepted as liberal doctrine and tripe. Liberals are willing to acrifice even you on the altar of political power.
Spain also legalized gay marriage with very little opposition, and have a lower infant mortality rate than the US. They also provide free or discounted birth control. My friend from Spain was paying 5 Euro (8 bucks or so) a month for the SAME exact pill I’m paying 20 for.
They’re also not hypocrites who started a gazillion dollar war which took money away from people who needed it (like pregnant women) and wasted it on killing people, all while yelling about how killing people is bad (I mean, unless they’re Muslim of course).
From their perspective, it makes perfect sense. If I lived in Spain, I’d probably be quite happy to be pro life.
Don’t pretend for a second like these people would support ANYTHING you say Jill. Their pro-life stance is coming from a humanitarian perspective, not religious fundamentalism, homophobia, and self-righteousness.
Amanda:
Oh now you’ve added geography to your list of conditions that define personhood? Rediculous!
Your true agenda shines through, total self-absorption.
I will state ths again to counter your lies. The war in Iraq is to combat Islamic fascism and terrorism. They attacked us on 9/11 killing 3,000 innocent people. They will not hesitate to nuke one of our cities, perhaps the one you live in. Why do you conveniently forget the fact that these people want to kill you? And these Muslim terrorists even kill Spaniards who caved to their demands and will lose eventually their country as is occurring all over Europe. Are you telling me you want to be a Muslim? You have no courage, moral or otherwise.
“I haven’t been able to find any mention of this “party” on Wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_Spain“
Uh mmm, Jill included a link, why don’t you check it out. BTW, wiki is available for editing by anyone, no one uses it as a sole source.
“Oh now you’ve added geography to your list of conditions that define personhood? Rediculous!”
Uhhh… nope. Geography has nothing to do with it. Tolerance and health care have everything to do with it.
“Your true agenda shines through, total self-absorption.”
Because I care very strongly about gays and poor people being treated fairly? Yeah…thats pretty self absorbed.
“I will state ths again to counter your lies. The war in Iraq is to combat Islamic fascism and terrorism. They attacked us on 9/11 killing 3,000 innocent people.”
Really? Iraq attacked us? When did that happen? All this time, even living IN New York City, I was under the impression it was Al Quaida that attacked us, organized by Osama Bin Ladin – neither of which had anything to do with Iraq.
“They will not hesitate to nuke one of our cities, perhaps the one you live in.”
Only that would require them actually HAVING a nuke. Which they don’t. Or did you forget the whole “ooops, my bad, there were never any WMD’s in Iraq” thing?
“Why do you conveniently forget the fact that these people want to kill you? And these Muslim terrorists even kill Spaniards who caved to their demands and will lose eventually their country as is occurring all over Europe.”
And that has WHAT to do with Iraq exactly? Other than the fact that our concentrating on Iraq has allowed the Taliban to regain strength?
“Are you telling me you want to be a Muslim? You have no courage, moral or otherwise.”
Ohhhhh I get it now. Because I’m against the war in Iraq, I want to be a Muslim. That makes PERFECT sense.
Amamnda:
You stated the following:
“Don’t pretend for a second like these people would support ANYTHING you say Jill. Their pro-life stance is coming from a humanitarian perspective, not religious fundamentalism, homophobia, and self-righteousness.”
Humanitarian perspective – belief that man can control his own destiny by asserting his own will and rejecting the notion of an absolute God. A lie more commonly known as humanism. Well, you’re right about that, liberals are humanists.
Religious fundamentalism – wrong there, please call it Biblical fundamentalism and I’m proud to know and use the Sword of the Spirit.
Homophobia – no, I have no irrational fear of homosexuals. Rather I have a very real fear that if they continue in their lifestyle they will spend an eternity in hell. Unlike you, I am not willing to sacrifice their temporal discomfort at realizing this and changing for an eternity with God. Who really loves homeosexuals Amanda, me who wants them to go to heaven or you who is willing to see them go to hell forever becasue you yourself are willing to be accountable to no one?
Self-righteous – a righteousness from one’s self. Let’s see, that would be YOU since you have rejected the offer of righteouness that is offered by God as a result of His Son’s death on the cross.
Totally off topic, but this might just be the solution…Val sent this to me. Someone apparently didn’t know how to spell “peonies”…
**********
Hey – we may have found where Loreena Bobbit is working now ….
I wonder how much abortion rates in Spain would go down if the RCC changed their attitude on contraceptives and started encouraging people to use them.
“Hey – we may have found where Loreena Bobbit is working now ….”
LOL
“Hey – we may have found where Loreena Bobbit is working now ….”
LOL, pretty clever, TR.
HisMan, shove it sideways you egocentric self absorbed sanctimonious *peony*
@Amanda: I say just ignore Mr. HisMan. That’s what I do…keeps my blood pressure much lower. :)
HisMan – thats a fabulous rant about how you know for a fact that your beliefs are right and everyone who feels differently is wrong. Until God shows up here and proves otherwise, my FAITH is no more right or wrong than your FAITH.
You also never answered my question. What U.S. city did Iraq attack on 9/11?
You also know Muslim countries have some of the lowest abortion and HIV rates in the world, right?
“HisMan, shove it sideways you egocentric self absorbed sanctimonious *peony*”
@TR: That’s an insult to peonies, what did those gorgeous little flowers ever do to you?
“HisMan, shove it sideways you egocentric self absorbed sanctimonious *peony*”
@TR: That’s an insult to peonies, what did those gorgeous little flowers ever do to you?
Posted by: Rae at April 30, 2008 12:20 PM
***********
Heh! ;)
Amanda 10:40: From their perspective, it makes perfect sense. If I lived in Spain, I’d probably be quite happy to be pro life.
Don’t pretend for a second like these people would support ANYTHING you say Jill. Their pro-life stance is coming from a humanitarian perspective, not religious fundamentalism, homophobia, and self-righteousness.
Truth is truth and doesn’t change depending on the perspective of the one speaking this truth. Come over to pro-life side on abortion, even if you aren’t living in Spain! Maybe you can change things for the better!
TR – thats an interesting question, although, like I mentioned earlier, Spain legalized gay marriage with little opposition – which obviously goes against the RCC. Also, there are several areas of southern Spain that have high Muslim populations, and a few Jewish areas as well. It would be interesting to see a breakdown by region.
Interestingly, when I was working with a mostly RC Latina population, the girls seemed to pick and choose which doctrines of their religion they would follow and which could go by the wayside. Most importantly – contraception = bad, oral sex = bad, but premarital sex = just fine. Most of them did not want abortions (in fact a handful of them got pregnant on purpose), but several of them panicked AFTER they had unprotected sex and got the MAP.
“Hey – we may have found where Loreena Bobbit is working now ….”
LOL
Posted by: Bobby Bambino at April 30, 2008 12:07 PM
***********
or maybe a moil has a second job –
Mohel – sorry
Amanda,
If you don’t mind my asking, what work do you do? What’s the MAP?
“Interestingly, when I was working with a mostly RC Latina population, the girls seemed to pick and choose which doctrines of their religion they would follow and which could go by the wayside. Most importantly – contraception = bad, oral sex = bad, but premarital sex = just fine.”
That’s too bad, Amanda. That also seems surprising. I would expect most people to disregard the Church’s teaching on contraception first, oral sex second, premarital sex third, and abortion last. It’s an unfortunate characteristic of the culture when Catholics feel they can pick and choose which doctrines they will believe and which they will not. I guess the catechesis is just as bad there as it is here! God love you, Amanda.
@Bobby: She’s talking about RC Latina girls in NYC, not Spain. :)
TR – thats an interesting question, although, like I mentioned earlier, Spain legalized gay marriage with little opposition – which obviously goes against the RCC. Also, there are several areas of southern Spain that have high Muslim populations, and a few Jewish areas as well. It would be interesting to see a breakdown by region.
Interestingly, when I was working with a mostly RC Latina population, the girls seemed to pick and choose which doctrines of their religion they would follow and which could go by the wayside. Most importantly – contraception = bad, oral sex = bad, but premarital sex = just fine. Most of them did not want abortions (in fact a handful of them got pregnant on purpose), but several of them panicked AFTER they had unprotected sex and got the MAP.
Posted by: Amanda at April 30, 2008 12:25 PM
*******************
I would think there would be a whole lot more stigma attached to a Moslem girl having a child out of wedlock than a Catholic one, just based on what Ive read of the Moslem attitudes. A really strict Moslem family wouldnt even let their daughters close to males who werent family members. But Id like to see a break down on who is having abortions based on religion – that would be interesting. I think with a lot of RCC young people church doctrine and rational intelligent thought are coming into conflict more and more.
“@Bobby: She’s talking about RC Latina girls in NYC, not Spain. :)”
Oh okay. But they were originally from Spain? They grew up there?
MAP – morning after pill – women take it the ‘morning after’ sex if a condom broke, they werent using a contraceptive, they want to be extra careful, etc It prevents pregnancy
“I think with a lot of RCC young people church doctrine and rational intelligent thought are coming into conflict more and more.”
I’d have to disagree with you here, Red. In fact, from what I’ve seen, just the opposite seems to be true; that is, I think a lot of the youth are seeing how faith and reason compliment each other in the Catholic Church’s teachings. Many young people who are serious about their faith have become quite good at apologetics and giving rational reasons for what they believe. This is due in no small part to JPII’s monumental work on the theology of the body. This has given Catholics strong theological and philosophical reasons to oppose things like contraception, abortion, and euthanasia. I see the young people being more fired up for their faith and more well-equipped to defend it then it probably has been in recent decades.
“I think with a lot of RCC young people church doctrine and rational intelligent thought are coming into conflict more and more.”
I’d have to disagree with you here, Red. In fact, from what I’ve seen, just the opposite seems to be true; that is, I think a lot of the youth are seeing how faith and reason compliment each other in the Catholic Church’s teachings. Many young people who are serious about their faith have become quite good at apologetics and giving rational reasons for what they believe. This is due in no small part to JPII’s monumental work on the theology of the body. This has given Catholics strong theological and philosophical reasons to oppose things like contraception, abortion, and euthanasia. I see the young people being more fired up for their faith and more well-equipped to defend it then it probably has been in recent decades.
Posted by: Bobby Bambino at April 30, 2008 12:42 PM
*********************
I think more and more young people and older people in America are coming to terms with the fact that they can disagree with ‘the church’. There is no rational argument against contraceptives. There is no rational support for the insistance that sex is only for reproduction. And a lot of American catholics have seen things this way for a long time and their kids are growing up with the same attitude.
http://cara.georgetown.edu/bulletin/index.htm
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/22678.php
“There is no rational argument against contraceptives.”
Well, who are some of the authors that you’ve read giving arguments against contraceptives? Because if you haven’t read his work, Christopher West is an excellent writer of this topic. It was primarily his work that got me to intellectually accept the church’s teaching, not just will it. Also there’s guys like Jason and Crystalina Everett, Kimberly Hahn, and of course, John Paul II has tremendous work on it. Also, I know there are several good Protestants who have a lot of good arguments like Hank Hanegraaff and Steve Gregg.
Janet –
The job I was talking about in NYC was my senior internship. It was called PCAP (Prenatal Care Acess Program), provided by Planned Parenthood (I’m sure there was some funding for it, but I wasn’t being paid). I had two locations, 1 at the School For Pregnant Teens in East Harlem, and the other at a Community Health Center in Hollis Queens.
I basically worked with those two groups of teen girls, helping them locate an OBGYN, fill out insurance or medicaid paperwork, writing up their delivery plan, keeping on top of them to make sure they were getting to their prenatal checkups, and giving prenatal and parenting education.
At the end of my internship, they offered me a paid position… for a whopping 16k a year. Which doesn’t even cover rent in a studio in Brooklyn. Because god-forbid more funding go to silly things like educating teen moms.
I ended up deciding to move back to Boston anyway. I’m now working as a Patient Liaison in a pediatric speech and occupational therapy department at one of the big Boston hospitals.
Bobby – Latina meaning that for the most part they were born here in the states but are of Puerto Rican/Dominican/Latin American descent.
“Bobby – Latina meaning that for the most part they were born here in the states but are of Puerto Rican/Dominican/Latin American descent.”
OK, thanks. Sorry, I’m just ignorant of culture and such…
Amanda:
Excuse me, God did show up in bodily form about 2,000 years ago. I did not make this stuff up.
You however, believe a lot of myths and half-truths and as such condemn yourself.
You also know Muslim countries have some of the lowest abortion and HIV rates in the world, right?
Posted by: Amanda at April 30, 2008 12:13 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
…And that Christian countries have a HUGELY disproportionate HIV/AIDS rate – ofter 10x to 100x greater than neighboring Muslum countries.
Check the stats. They’re shocking:
http://www.martinrothonline.com/MRCC11.htm
TR:
I can picture you now.
A cigarette in your mouth, curlers in your hair, in your dirty bathroom, sitting in a filthy house, swearing at your kids, chugging a warm Bud regretting and punishing yourself for the life you could have had.
Uno mas servesa por favore?
I will state ths again to counter your lies. The war in Iraq is to combat Islamic fascism and terrorism. They attacked us on 9/11 killing 3,000 innocent people. They will not hesitate to nuke one of our cities, perhaps the one you live in. Why do you conveniently forget the fact that these people want to kill you?
Posted by: HisMan at April 30, 2008 10:50 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Actually, Saudi Arabia produced 15 of the 19 hijackers – and provided all of the funding.
THIS is how George Bush dealt with the House of Saud after they killed 3000 Americans:
http://dohiyimir.typepad.com/bush-abdulah.jpg
HisMan
I will ask you now for a third time…
WHAT U.S. CITY DID IRAQ ATTACK ON SEPTEMBER 11th?
and
WHAT DOES WORLDWIDE ISLAMIC EXTREMISM HAVE TO DO WITH THE SPECIFIC NATION OF IRAQ?
“I can picture you now.
A cigarette in your mouth, curlers in your hair, in your dirty bathroom, sitting in a filthy house, swearing at your kids, chugging a warm Bud regretting and punishing yourself for the life you could have had.
Uno mas servesa por favore?”
Wow HisMan. Thats…really…special.
So is that your definition of the “typical white woman”?
Because you never answered me (that seems to be a theme) when you called Edyt a “typical white woman” and a “cracker baby killer”, and I asked you what exactly a “typical white woman” is.
P.S. its “Cerveza”
Amanda,
Now that you mention it, I recall you mentioning your work previously. Thanks for repeating it for me! It’s awesome that you were trying to make a difference in NYC. What percent of Latinas do you think were opting to keep their babies vs. aborting? Were any of those keeping their babies giving them up for adoption?
Amanda, HisMan is just trying to deny his deeply rooted racism by saying he has black friends. If his black friends would get all upset by the things some people have written here, he would have called out Jasper when he called Michelle Obama an “angry black woman” because HisMan would have recognized the hideously pervasive stereotype and called out Jasper on it.
So instead of addressing real racism, he belittles other white people who happen to be pro-choice.
Hey Amanda:
I don’t drink. I learned the phrase when I moved to the SW. I can spell Jack Daniels and Southern Comfort though. (Hey forgive me, I was a Janice Joplin fan in my crazy teen years.) OK, back to the business at hand.
Why don’t you ask your Prince Diss-My-Pastor-Of-20-Years-When-Its-Politically-Expedient-To-Do-So-King-of-Doubletalk Obama what a “typical white woman” is? Or perhaps you missed that comment?
What, you got a problem with that phrase? My point is that on the whole and “typically”, black woman have different reasons for killing their children than do white woman. Not that any reason is justifiable, however, to kill out of convenience is especially heinous.
Perhaps you agree with TR’s shove it sideways comment as well. Hell, I’d bet you wouldn’t have a problem aborting me in a heartbeat. Isn’t that how you feel about all such inconveniences, you angry TWW.
Amanda, HisMan is just trying to deny his deeply rooted racism by saying he has black friends.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/9846/stevenandalangc3.jpg
We have a liberal, lesbian Governor (who denies her sexual preference)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
What do you mean, “denies her sexual preferance?”
Janet –
It’s hard to tell, because I didn’t work AT the PP clinic with any patients who would have been having abortions. The population I was working with at the school for pregnant teens were mostly in their 2nd and 3rd trimesters. The population at the Community Health Center was more scattered, and 2 of the girls I saw there did end up having abortions…one was black and one was Latina, but still, that represents a small fraction of the overall population since I only saw the girls who were lucky enough to be referred to the PCAP program by their pediatrician or the NP who administered their pregnancy tests. There are undoubtedly thousands of girls who fall through the cracks.
None of the girls I dealt with were giving their children to another family for adoption, but 5 or 6 of them planned on signing over parental rights to their parents, or in 2 cases, the parents of their baby’s father.
HisMan – you are the MASTER of really lame dodges and changes of subject.
YOU are the one who used the term “typical white woman”. I have not heard Barack Obama use that phrase. If I did, you bet your butt I’d be asking him what a “typical white woman” looked like too. But YOU used the term, so please, enlighten us all HisMan…
What does a “typical white woman” look like?
And, for the 4th time, you stated, in an attempt to refute my comments about the Iraq war, that “THEY attacked us on September 11th”. Please, enlighten us all as to where this attack occured.
I’ll remind you again that you also said that Islamic facism and terrorism presented a danger to the world. I agree.
But how is fighting a war in Iraq, and subsequently having fewer rescources to fight terrorism all over the globe, especially in Afghanistan, where the Taliban is regaining strength daily, addressing any of those concerns?
Posted by: Amanda at April 30, 2008 1:14 PM
Amanda, I mean this in all sincerity. If it was provided by PP (who has HUGE profits) why couldn’t they pay you more, or fund it better?
I’m not saying the government shouldn’t but you can’t tell me PP didn’t have the means.
Amanda:
I’ve given you my answer now deal with it.
When I interned as a midwife in the heart of the Dallas/FW metroplex we had a lot of hispanic clients and we interacted a lot with the general population as we did sonograms, had cheap pregnancy tests and would fill out medicaid forms.
The hispanics I interacted with (I speak spanish so I did a lot of interacting!) do not consider adoption out of the family to be an option. They also were on the whole very anti-abortion. Many times they would intentially get pregnant at all ages, often to try and salvage a relationship.
There were many many tears shed in the sonogram room over girls. The mothers were afraid and sadly often correctly so that the fathers would leave them if the baby wasn’t a boy. However, the births that I attended where they didn’t know the sex before hand never had anyone crying over the wrong sex, whether or not the parent’s relationship had or would last.
I am not saying this is the case for all people of hispanic descent, simply reporting my experiences with this culture in my area.
Amanda,
“They also provide free or discounted birth control. My friend from Spain was paying 5 Euro (8 bucks or so) a month for the SAME exact pill I’m paying 20 for. ”
From what I remember, I saw a newscast discussing the discrepancies of drug costs between the U.S. and other countries, and they mentioned the reason being that other countries impose limits on the costs of drugs, so us Americans end up paying the difference. Don’t know if that would apply to the BC pills.
Amanda:
Here it is:
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/03/21/barack-obama-calls-his-grand-mother-a-typical-white-person-what-hypocrisy/
Posted by: carder at April 30, 2008 3:09 PM
Carder, I also heard this plus the fact that the most research/development is done in the U.S. and we wind up paying for that as well because of the restrictions.
Kristen – I agree with you 100%. I think my jaw dislocated from my skull when they offered me that salary. I was like “you do realize the girls I’m working with make more than that at McDonalds?” It was a great experience for my internship though – so I’m grateful for that – but if no student takes that internship, that means there’s no one working with those girls for that semester. Which is really a tragedy.
HisMan – your “answer” to my questions is to dodge and ignore them and tell me to go ask someone else to define what YOU said?
Okay, I can deal with pathetic cop outs, as long as I’m not the one making them. Good day to you then.
Humility, Hisman, humility.
Perhaps you agree with TR’s shove it sideways comment as well. Hell, I’d bet you wouldn’t have a problem aborting me in a heartbeat. Isn’t that how you feel about all such inconveniences, you angry TWW.
Posted by: HisMan at April 30, 2008 2:14 PM
**************
HisMan if you were in my body without my permission you can bet your *** you would die. And youre not oblivious nonviable tissue either.
TR:
I can picture you now.
A cigarette in your mouth, curlers in your hair, in your dirty bathroom, sitting in a filthy house, swearing at your kids, chugging a warm Bud regretting and punishing yourself for the life you could have had.
Uno mas servesa por favore?
Posted by: HisMan at April 30, 2008 1:38 PM
*********************
And you prove my point about how important lies are to you and how uncomfortable you are with the truth.
Elizabeth G –
What I observed was pretty much the same exact thing.
The school for pregnant teens admitted girls from all over NYC, so even though East Harlem is a mostly Hispanic area, it was still disproportionately Hispanic girls. What that says about the other races? Who knows… but indeed, though some of them had considered abortion, most of them did not, and a couple did get pregnant on purpose to “salvage” relationships. (I put that in quotes not to be mocking of your use of the word, but because it’s scary to me that 14/15 year old girls feel like they need to do that)
I had mentioned this earlier before you were around, but one thing that struck me was that it seemed the younger the pregnant teen and father were, the more likely the father was to still be involved with the whole ordeal. I’m assuming its because they’re young enough that THEIR parents still had enough control over them to make sure they did the right thing, but who knows?
Posted by: Amanda at April 30, 2008 3:16 PM
That stinks! I think it would be a very fun and fulfilling job. I have a friend that’s a nurse and she visits new moms at home with their newborns.
I had a nurse, paid for by insurance, that came to my house two times after my first. She was such a help just giving me pointers. I’ll never forget she said “I know you’ve never been a mom before, but she’s never been a baby before either so she doesn’t know what you’re doing wrong.” That made me relax – a bit.
Hey Admins – any chance this is the fake HisMan posting again?
This is me trying desperately to give him the benefit of the doubt…because he’s being downright vile.
There was a fake HisMan???
Amanda, I have no problem at all with your quotes around the word salvage. I agree, its very, very poor critical thinking and decision making.
I have seen at least one marraige salvaged by an “oppsie” baby, but typically when the relationship is already strained and lacking the commitment level that comes with two people determined to remain married, any new stresser can put it to the breaking point.
I didn’t have the chance to follow any of the really young couples through pregnacy, normally they use the hospital and not the birth center. We had one that was going to use us, and both sides of the family were very involved, but they miscarried. It would not surprise me if they marry and/or have another baby right away, the miscarraige was very devastating to them and they seemed to try to give and draw strength from each other.
Hey Admins – any chance this is the fake HisMan posting again?
This is me trying desperately to give him the benefit of the doubt…because he’s being downright vile.
Posted by: Amanda at April 30, 2008 3:42 PM
**********
How do you tell the difference between the fake vile and the typical every day vile?
Hey Admins – any chance this is the fake HisMan posting again?
This is me trying desperately to give him the benefit of the doubt…because he’s being downright vile.
Starting at 1:31 I think it was the fake Hisman. The style sounds familiar. I’ll check into it and see what I find.
I’m sorry that this keeps happening. I know it’s awfully confusing!!
There was a fake HisMan???
Yes, actually a few times now. The real Hisman isn’t too happy about it either.
Actually, the fake Hisman comments may have started earlier than that (1:31). I haven’t seen all of them yet.
TR – mostly just the lack of Bible verses.
But also, though HisMan is often abrasive and condescending, there’s a bit of a difference in tone between that and the things he’s posted in this thread…which are just… well… I don’t even need to say, you can see them. haha.
Amanda and TR:
Wah, wah, wah, wah, wah.
This is the real HisMan.
First, the doctoring of Bethany’s photos and SoMG’s comments of same. It’s outrageous that you people can accuse me of anything considered abrasive. You really don’t have any idea of what an aborion truly is do you?
When Jill posts things like a robber killing a woman’s babies and one can trace the fact that they can get away with this to the pro-abort mindset, well, guess where my anger goes?
So, I know I have been rather abrasive, however, I have a real hard time dealing with these monumental injustices. There’s no excuse though, forgive me for sinking to the pro-abort level. You know, when you crawl in a mud hole you get dirty.
Perhaps you guys were just as outraged as I was at these acts, however, I think you could have expressed just a little more outrage and been honest about how the abortion mindset contributea to these types of laws.
Amanda:
My wife is a typical white woman, 5′-5″, 120 lbs, knock-out gorgeous blond, high maintenance, uses a lot of makeup, wants her own way, etc., and I happen to love her, OK.
I gotta say my daughter is not a TWW, she’s a tiger. More like her dad. She’s a Typical Sicilian Woman, a TSW. She makes typical white males cry. You know the wimp kind.
Now, stop being a feminazi and relax.
Totally off topic, but this might just be the solution…Val sent this to me. Someone apparently didn’t know how to spell “peonies”…
Posted by: mk at April 30, 2008 8:05 AM
……………………………………….
Are you sure that Lorrena Bobbit hasn’t started a new business? I think that I may have had to pull over and check it out.
*looks at HisMan’s post about his wife and daughter*
I think I’m a combination of both….. scary. :P
Blonde Italian. Should be impossible. But isn’t. :D
Oh okay, so the real you can’t answer questions, and makes disgusting generalizations about people. Glad to know I was wrong to give you more credit than you deserve. Not even Bethany, who agrees with you on many things, thought you’d stoop to say such ridiculous things.
So being a low maintenance average looking brunette who hardly wears any makeup…what does that make me exactly? A fake white woman? I’m not Sicilian either… hmmm…And what about overweight women? Red heads?
Your generalizations are literally astounding to me.
And you still haven’t told me when Iraq attacked us.
Anyways – you win for the most pathetic cop out of the week. Congrats for that. High Five!!!!
Amanda,
I don’t know if it is a real or fake Hisman, but if there is a fake Hisman, don’t you think it would be possible for him to say, Oh no, I’m the real Hisman?
Bethany, could you clarify for us?
“I don’t know if it is a real or fake Hisman, but if there is a fake Hisman, don’t you think it would be possible for him to say, Oh no, I’m the real Hisman?”
That really sucks that there is a fake HisMan. Amanda, I would hold off judgment until we know for sure that this is the real HisMan.
Lyssie:
Oh my goodness, you must be beautiful.
I’ve got two sons left, both georgeous.
Amanda:
Like I said, relax. I have no idea how you look and I could care less. Can’t you just laugh once in a while or do you never take your feminazi uniform off? Look, go open a Bud and cuss at Sean Hannity or O’Reilley for a while. Get rid of some of that Gloria Steinem angst you’re feeling.
You’ve gotta see the irony in my posts regarding using the term “typcial white womnan”. I mean with Barack Obama inventing the term and Edyt’s comments regarding the abortion of black babies and all. Actaully, I prefer using the term “white cracker woman” over “typical white woman”. Now can you laugh at that or not?
I probably didn’t do a very good job twaining those issues together.
And Bethany: TR calling me vile is a joke. She throws insults around like they’re peanuts. It’s all that comes out of that woman’s mouth not to mention her hatred of “cells, sentient, non-conscience BS”.
“Oh my goodness, you [Lyssie] must be beautiful.”
She’s gorgeous, HisMan!
And Amanda:
I’m not ignoring your Iraq question. I do recall one Saddam Hussein who was insane enough to kill Kurdish woman and children, invade Kuwait unprovoked, start oil well fires, establish torture chambers throughout his country, etc., etc., etc. I say someone liek him comes up agasin we do the same thing. If politicians had the courage to do this with Hitler we wouldn’t have lost 50 million people. However, I can see how losing 50 million of anything doesn’t bother a pro-abort at all. It didn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that this guy was a maniacal leader bent on Israel’s destruction. Aminejhad is worse and I hope he gives us just one tiny excuse to take him out as well. You’ve got a problem with confronting evil men, I don’t.
However, since you seem to be so anally bent on me giving you a technical answer, which I am sure you will diss, I think I need to do some careful research, you know, so I can make it Amanda proof.
Besides, I run two businesses, have 5 kids, and do a lot of other stuff so my time is very limited.
Don’t tell me, you think Aminejhad is cute? I can understand, those beady eyes that are what anout an inch apart? Or perhaps you just hate Israel, the apple of God’s eye?
@HisMan: Oh? We go and take out evil, cruel dictators? Then why the hell is Hu Jintao still in charge of China? Why is Omar-al Basar still in charge of Sudan? Why is King Abdullah still ruling Saudi Arabia? Why is Robert Mugabe still running Zimbabwe?
Please. We don’ take out dictators because they’re evil…we take them out only when it suits us politically and potentially economically.
@HisMan: You’ll also note, we didn’t give a flying crap about Hitler until HE declared war on US. Before that point, we didn’t care. We turned away a whole ship of Jewish refugees (the St. Lawrence?).
Don’t give me that crap about us doing the right, moral thing because “that’s what America” does, because that’s bull.
Rae:
I know, I know. Good questions, and you’re probably right, unfortunately. However, has anyone of those arseholes you mentioned ever threatened us or our allies? I’m asking, I really don’t know.
Hussein was a big mouth and was easy to pick on though. He invaded Kuwait and then did all kinds of stupid stuff that made him an easy target, not only for us, but the world. I mean you do remember all those UN resolutions don’t you?
However, I like your suggestion, if I understood it correctly, so let’s go take those dudes out. My son put it all on the line, could you?
Was that the fake Bobby Bambino or the real Bobby Bambino? U from Brooklyn or sumting big man, huh? Ya like cheese? I discuverd dis new cheese called Robertberger cheese. It’s imported from the moon. Mr. Dawkin’s bought all the impoort licenses form the aliens he’s in contact with. You can say he’s the liberal, cheesy Berkshire Hathahway insider type. I understand he’s giving all the proceeds from his cheesy empire to Planned Parenthood who now accept donations that target aliens for abortion. Is an alien human?
@HisMan: I would serve in the military, but I’ve been barred from military service.
I’m a bit on the young side, so I don’t remember the UN resolutions, but I find the UN useless and basically just an organization only there to bash the US because of our imperfections (which we really need to start acknowledging, we do fark up, and we have farked up a LOT in the past…Chile, Nicaragua etc).
Does it matter that they’re not threatening us? They are cruelly abusing their own citizens, killing them wantonly (especially China, disgraceful), and stealing money from the their own citizens that are given by overseas organizations that donate money for helping the poor. They are just as bad as the countries that overtly “threaten” us.
Was that the fake Bobby Bambino or the real Bobby Bambino? U from Brooklyn or sumting big man, huh? Ya like cheese? I discuverd dis new cheese called Robertberger cheese. It’s imported from the moon. Mr. Dawkin’s bought all the impoort licenses form the aliens he’s in contact with. You can say he’s the liberal, cheesy Berkshire Hathahway insider type. I understand he’s giving all the proceeds from his cheesy empire to Planned Parenthood who now accept donations that target aliens for abortion. Is an alien human?
Posted by: HisMan at April 30, 2008 8:29 PM
That was hilarious! (Nothing personal RB)
“Don’t give me that crap about us doing the right, moral thing because “that’s what America” does, because that’s bull.”
Tell that to the Men from Omaha beach.
Rae:
I understand your heart for the poor and needy.
I try to focus on those that don’t have a voice at all, the unborn.
I don’t think were gonna rid the world of all this bad stuff until Jesus comes back.
@Jasper: Think about that for just one second. We didn’t give a *shit* about the war in Europe or in Asia UNTIL Japan ATTACKED US and then Hitler declared war ON US. Before that, we didn’t do jack. We only fought back when OUR interests were at risk (security).
The only reason we even WENT to Omaha Beach was because Hitler declared war on us…not because we felt we had some moral imperative to do so.
@HisMan: The poor and needy don’t have a voice either, especially in countries like Zimbabwe or Saudi Arabia or China or Burma.
The unborn are just as important as the poor and needy, both need help, as well as the mothers of the unborn, they need help and support as well with pregnancy.
People are TALKING ABOUT ME AGAIN. *HUFF*
Urgh. *grin*
Amanda:
Here ya go:
Al Qaeda, Cohorts Remain Worst Terror Threat: U.S.
Wednesday, April 30, 2008 1:15 PM
WASHINGTON — Nearly seven years after the September 11 attacks, al Qaeda remains the biggest terrorist threat to the United States and its allies, the U.S. State Department said in an annual report on Wednesday.
The country-by-country survey of terrorism trends and incidents in 2007 said al Qaeda had used tribal areas of Pakistan to reconstitute some operational capabilities, replace killed or captured fighters and rebuild its leadership.
Al Qaeda “utilizes terrorism, as well as subversion, propaganda, and open warfare; it seeks weapons of mass destruction in order to inflict the maximum possible damage on anyone who stands in its way, including other Muslims and/or elders, women and children,” said the report.
The number of terrorism attacks worldwide fell slightly in 2007 to 14,499, from 14,570 in 2006. A total of 72,066 people were killed, injured or kidnapped in 2007, down from 75,211 in the previous year, data from the U.S. National Counter-terrorism Center showed.
In the two theaters of U.S.-led wars, terrorism incidents in Iraq fell to 6,212 last year from 6,628 in 2006, but in Afghanistan they rose to 1,127 from 969 in the previous year, data showed.
The report said Afghanistan had made progress fighting extremists, but “the Taliban-led insurgency remained strong and resilient in the South and East” with an undiminished ability to recruit foot soldiers from rural ethnic Pashtuns.
The list of designated state sponsors of terrorism — Cuba, Iran, North Korea, Sudan and Syria — remained unchanged, despite efforts to remove North Korea from the blacklist through slow-moving nuclear disarmament negotiations with Pyongyang.
The report said Sudan continued to take significant steps to cooperate in anti-terrorism, but Cuba, Iran and Syria had not renounced terrorism or worked to combat terror groups.
“Iran and Syria routinely provided safe haven, substantial resources, and guidance to terrorist organizations,” said the 312-page report.
Thank you Jasper…for showing that the UN is a completely ineffectual organization with no teeth what-so-ever with its revolutions.
Dang it Jasper! Why’d you deletorate your post?
Rae,
I deleted it because it pushes the comments section of the web page over to one side….I think because I cut-n-pasted a from another with many tabs..
Here it is…..
http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/iraq/decade/sect2.html
Ho’kay.
Now may I ask what the purpose of that post was?
The purpose of the post was a response to Amanda’s question(up above) about the reason for invading Iraq. Actually, if the US doesn’t enforce these treaties, who will?.
and Rae, you’re party right about the US not getting involved in WW2 earlier. Roosevelt should have listened to Churchill.
@Jasper: Gotcha.
But there have been many countries besides Iraq that break resolutions and we don’t invade them. What about all the countries that were condemned for their human rights abuses like China? Why aren’t we invading China? Hell, we’re letting them host the Olympics!
I am entirely right about WWII. We didn’t care. We were very pro-isolationist at that point. It was only about America, nobody else, and we only attacked once we were attacked by the Japanese. We didn’t do diddly as Japan marched into China and began taking over it.
We didn’t do diddly as Hitler annexed the Sudetenland, began militarizing, etc…all of which were violations of the League of Nations (the equivalent of today’s UN). We sanctioned Hitler when he invaded Poland, yet we did nothing beyond condemning his actions. We didn’t do ANYTHING as Hilter invaded Belgium, the Netherlands, France, etc…just pointlessly condemned his actions.
Why is Saddam so much more different than Hitler? Why did Saddam merit a pre-emptive strike but Hitler didn’t?
Rae, look at it this way: Iraq is both a combination of our behavior during WWII and the Vietnam War.
With WWII, we got involved because we were attacked (see 9/11) and with the Vietnam war we continued fighting an idea (communism/terrorism) until we devastated our troops, our resources, and our morale.
History repeats itself…
@Edyt: Good point. And that’s interesting, I haven’t looked at it that way.
It really is a crap situation though…trying to decide what to do that is both moral and helpful.
Definitely.
When I hear HisMan talk about Iraq, he reminds me of the red scare, McCarthyism and witch hunts and all that. For centuries we’ve been hunting down invisible monsters. Before the war in Iraq, we had the war against drugs. Thing is, these aren’t things you can fight! What a lot of Americans forgot after 9/11 is that terrorism doesn’t come from one country. Terrorism can come from anywhere at any time. Remember anthrax? The Oklahoma City bombing? Those were terrorist attacks, and they came from our own citizens.
But instead of being fearful and monitoring everyone’s phone conversations, we need to be above that. Terrorism is going to happen, and it’s going to be shocking and scary and sudden. Is the Middle East a threat? I don’t really think so. Their ideas may be … but we won’t change their minds by bombing them. We have to show that we’re not a fearful country, that our democracy is best because our citizens are happiest and healthiest.
Unfortunately, we’re not doing a good job at that, so they have no reason to think we’re successful. Even if we are the wealthiest country in the world, they can see that the wealth is disproportionate, and not much different than their own countries, where wealth is held in the hands of the few and powerful.
Sorry, kinda went off on a tangent there.
Of course, there are other wars….
Sorry, meant to have this attached.
Why is Saddam so much more different than Hitler? Why did Saddam merit a pre-emptive strike but Hitler didn’t?
Rae, because Bush Jr. felt he needed another issue as the post 9/11 and Afghanistan “high” in popularity was wearing off.
He also had guys like Paul Wolfowitz in the administration, guys who had wanted to get Saddam all along, since the time of Bush Sr., and who were pounding the table to git after ‘im.
People are TALKING ABOUT ME AGAIN. *HUFF* Urgh. *grin*
Lyssie, your fame is spreading (with very good reason, in my opinion).
Did you get all your tasks accomplished on that very busy day?
Doug,
Yeah…I got THOSE tasks done….although I can’t say much for the ones I’m working on right now. Bleh. Still pluggin’ away.
But on a lighter note, I’m officially a member of the co-ed fraternity I was pledging. So that’s why you haven’t seen me MUCH over the past week.
:D
Right on, Lyssie. I was an Alpha Tau Omega.
My wife is Sicilian and has two sisters, and it’s funny – when they are together one looks “brown,” one “pink,” and my wife appears a bit “green.” Lightly olive-skinned I guess, but they all have dark hair.
I’ve been to Italy twice, and once my wife and I went to Sicily – her ancestors came from the area of a little town, Agrigento.
Also went through Corleone, for the ‘Godfather’ movies’ association. I’ve seen a good number of blond Italians and Sicilians. Although, some of those blond women dye the roots of their hair dark for some reason.
Also saw, in Corleone, the blackest hair ever. This woman had it straight and shiny and oh so black it was breathtaking.
And like four feet long. Whew….
Maybe I should ask Bethany to change the picture of me on the snap page…maybe to a picture of myself next to my very Italian-looking dad. Then you can see what an odd anomaly I am. :)
Uhhhh… HisMan, that was a lovely post.
Too bad it didn’t answer my question…at all.
You said this to justify the invasion of Iraq:
“THEY attacked us on September 11th”.
No, HisMan, they didn’t.
An international terrorist organization run by a man who actually hated Saddam Hussein attacked us. And most of the terrorists were citizen of our allies in the Middle East.
But I don’t think you really give a damn about needing a legitimate reason to kill Muslim people, since you’ve not hesitated to be EXTRA bitter and hateful towards them. Despite the fact that they have fewer abortions than any other cultural group.
Lyssie, send me the picture. I’ll post it for you! :)
ignoring TR today…..