Jivin J’s Life 5-3-10
by JivinJ, host of the blog, JivinJehoshaphat
The alleged strong-arm tactic happened one day after DHS learned of the pregnancy, when the girl was about 22 wks pregnant, according to her foster mother and the girl’s social worker, Marisol Rivera….
The Daily News also learned that:
DHS got a Family Court judge’s order allowing it to take the girl for an abortion, after the girl’s birth mother refused to approve the procedure. By the time DHS arranged for the abortion – in March – the girl was 24 weeks pregnant. She had to undergo the procedure in NJ because abortions in PA are illegal at 24 weeks.
The Philadelphia Daily News also notes the attempts of the DHS to squelch this story from coming out.
Abortion, then, involves the killing of a human being. But that abortion involves the deliberate killing of a human being is no reason for abortion to be illegal. Nor should one be morally troubled by it.
He goes on to list his arbitrary criteria for personhood (“richly aware of its environment and full of beliefs and desires,” “self-conscious,” “self-aware locus of experience” and has an interest in living) which would eliminate numerous born human beings and provides no reason for why anyone should accept his arbitrary criteria for personhood over anyone else’s arbitrary criteria.
At Reproductive Services, ultrasound imaging for an abortion patient is completed before the physician who will perform the abortion arrives at the facility,” the suit states. “Requiring a physician to perform the ultrasound imaging himself or herself, or requiring that the ultrasound imaging be performed while the physician is on-site, would drastically reduce the number of abortions that Reproductive Services could perform.
“Reproductive Services would not be able to meet the demand for abortions from its patients and might not be able to remain in business,” the suit states .
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
I’m always amazed at abortion advocate’s rationalizations. The arguments used to support abortion are functionalist, arbitrary, and, frankly, don’t make any sense. To say that one is a person only when one meets certain criteria is frightening. You don’t become a person–you are a person. You are not a “potential” person, you are a person with potential. We could use the same reasoning to kill those who have already been born….those with birth defects, those who are in a coma, those who are old, those who are unconscious. It is either okay to kill a human being at ANY stage, or it is NOT okay to ever kill a human being.
Ok – I’m awake so I’m a person.
I’m sleeping – I’m not a person…
So my state of person-hood changes with my sleeping/waking and all other stages of consciousness.
And heaven forbid if one has any disability. Or an operation? Seizures? Medications? a glass of wine?
I can’t believe this professor is getting paid.
Are professors persons when they are illogical?
He may be awake – but he’s asleep at the wheel.
Gee, I wonder how her abortion HELPED that pregnant teenager. I wonder how the abortion helped her see that sleeping around is not the way to fill the hole in her heart, to get the love, attention, and affection she needs.
DHS is worthless. I’m disgusted that they think “helping minors” means killing their babies. I hear more negative stories about DHS than positive ones (leaving minors in the care of abusive parents who later end up maiming or killing the child, removing children from loving homes erroneously, now pushing abortions on pregnant teens…). And how wonderful that they’re using public funds (doesn’t matter whether it is state, local, or federal level) to pay for the abortions. (sarcasm)
I bet their taxpaying residents would love to know that.
Posted by: army_wife at May 3, 2010 2:09 PM
For all the “horror stories” that you hear about DHS, they are still on the front lines protecting children from hideous sexual and physical abuse. As a former child protective worker, I can attest to the absolutely vital work done by social workers who risk their lives to remove children from abusive homes. For you to say that DHS is useless would be analogous to me saying that all army soldiers commit atrocities. While there are some atrocities and some mistakes made by protective workers, without them, our children would be at serious risk.
If the facts of this case support the allegations, then the worker should be fired as their conduct was unethical. A protective worker should never coerce any client to either terminate or continue the pregnancy. That’s a decision made by the client. If a pregnant child does not get parental permission, as determined by state law, and still wishes an abortion, the social worker is within their rights to take the case to court. If no parental consent is given, in a non parental consent state, end of story. In reading the details of this case, it appears that there were some miscommunications, due, in part, to a language barrier. But again, if the worker coerced the child to have an abortion, that is a serious problem which could open up the state to a lawsuit. If the worker is licensed, they could lose their license. Not good….
Wow, pro-aborts spend ridiculous amounts of energy trying to justify something that cannot ever be justified. I have never heard a single pro “choice” argument that wasn’t either a slogan or an excuse.
The whole situation in PA with DHS is sad. Where’s the teenage girl’s voice in all of this? What about what she wanted? What about the negative emotional effects of an unwanted abortion, especially late term when she’s felt the baby kicking and likely started bonding.
Wow, I actually agree with Artemis on this one. I’m currently reading the story of David Pelzer who was the object of one of the worst cases of child abuse in CA history (“A Child Called It”). If it weren’t for the social workers and the foster care system, he would likely have been killed by his 18th birthday.
While he acknowledges the problems in the system, he blames the individuals involved, NOT the system. The system does the best it can for the many children who desperately need help.
The social worker involved in this should be fired.
Thank you, Artemis. I actually work for the agency in question,. and unfortunately, our local newspapers NEVER tell about how we place children in loving, adoptive homes, reunite families, pay for clothing and food for needy families, etc. A newborn baby on my caseload died (natural causes, no abuse involved) and we even paid $2,000 towards the funeral. I can’t tell how many social workers actually take money from their own pockets to help our clients. But good news doesn’t sell.
This is truly a sad case. This social worker clearly overstepped her bounds and should, at the very least, be reprimanded.
I see two sides to this. On the plus side, I won’t have to subsidize another minority welfare baby with my tax dollars. On the minus side, they didn’t sterilize the stupid teen mother while they were at it. Oh well. Another day, right?
If this young lady was indeed coerced to abort by a social worker, this social worker should be fired, not reprimanded.
Tom, it’s not really “libertarian” to believe that people should be forced into unwanted abortions and sterilizations.
Don’t bother , Lauren. ‘Tom’ is a troll. Ignore him.
Phillymiss @ 3:45 PM, does the law or agency policy require a foreign language interpreter for non-native English speakers or clients who speak no English? I’m just curious.
phillymiss, I’m glad to finally hear of some actual GOOD being done by DHS. It was a sight for sore eyes to read what you posted.
I’d be almost inclined to believe the whole “don’t blame everyone for a few bad apples’ actions” in this case except for the fact that in this case one caseworker was fired for refusing on moral grounds to take this girl for an abortion, that the girl was happy and wanted the baby but was coerced by a DHS employee with threats etc. to get the abortion, and that DHS tried to keep the story from the public. Sounds like it’s somewhat systemic, but since you work there you’d know the truth of that matter a bit more than an outsider.
I truly hope what has been said here is really true (that there is more good than harm being done by DHS). It makes one wonder when every single time I hear of anything happening involving DHS, it’s totally messed up in one way or another. Normally it is something along the lines of “child taken from loving home on trumped-up charges” or “child killed by abusive parent/parent’s significant other after falling through the cracks of DHS/being returned to abusive home”, but this whole coerced-abortion crap is just as bad as any of the other things I’ve heard.
And I agree that any caseworker that is found to be threatening or bullying the girls/women that they’re supposed to be helping into getting abortions – should be FIRED, not reprimanded. That’s heinous.
I’d also like to add that if a social worker, given information at the time which seems appropriate, places a child in a situation which later proves to be fatal, that worker might spend the rest of their life in therapy. Given the high caseloads and the nature of the work (including family court judges who aren’t always top notch), there’s a reason for the high “burn out” rate in child protective services even in places like little Rhode Island. But that still doesn’t excuse unethical case management.
Not surpised to hear this. When I was a social worker in St. Louis, I heard about the family court judge ordering Children’s Division to pay for an abortion … madness!@
The family court judge I’ve been in front of too many times regarding custody issues has fallen asleep on the bench. He has added up bills in front of me and was off and then argued with his clerk when she tried to point out he was mistaken. He also cut me off when I attempted to disagree with the GAL telling me, “it doesn’t matter what you say, I trust her.”
I’ve also dealt with county social services and believe it to be severely disfunctional as well from the top down. Unfortunately, the common name for it in my area is “social circuses.” I know there are great social workers but they probably burn out quickly from not only the families they deal with but the nasty politics as well. This leaves the county with a bunch of unethical louts.
Thanks Artemis for not excusing caseworkers who behave unethically. I wish there were some in my county who would be willing to speak the truth about others who break the law.
Ah yes, Artemis..champion of children. Ironic.
I know a social worker who is definitely pro-life… she says most of her co-workers are very anti-Christian. She has, however, started a mentoring program where individuals from our church are matched with at-risk kids.
I also have some non-Christian friends who were in the process of adopting two siblings, of whom the boy was very troubled and suffered past abuse. Then he made an accusation that my friend had hit him (when everyone knew he had a history of abuse and was known to be a liar) and they lost both kids, which was particularly tragic for the little girl who had bonded with them. Now they will never be able to adopt (I don’t know why they haven’t had biological kids–choice or biology–but I imagine it’s too late at any rate). Their experience has made me scared to ever adopt an older child; I would be risking my biological children to do so. Yet these are the kids who most need help… but how can adoptive parents take that risk if they aren’t protected?
Personally, I think the social worker should get the death penalty. I hope the day comes when those who perform abortions stand trial for their crimes against humanity.
Personally, I think the social worker should get the death penalty.
Posted by: ycw at May 4, 2010 6:28 AM
Wow. Is all human life sacred or not?
I think if the allegations are true, at the very least the social worker’s license should be revoked and criminal charges should be explored. But I can’t say I would concur with the death penalty unless execution is the only means of protecting society from this woman. And I find it difficult to believe that would be the only way in this case.
Fed-up, I’m not sure if it is actually the law to have a translator present if the client does not speak English, but it is considered good social work practice to do so. I don’t work in the field anymore, but it’s not too much trouble to get a Spanish-speaking translator, so I don’t know why this case worker didn’t use one. If it’s Tagalog or some other unusual language, that’s a different story.
Also, the social worker who was fired for refusing to take the young woman to have an abortion wasn’t from DHS, but from Concilio, one of the agencies we work with. They work mainly with Puerto Ricans and other Spanish-speaking clients.
I remember I interviewed for an agency where they point-blank asked me what I would do if I was required to take a client to have an abortion. I told them I could not in good conscience do so, unless the live of the mother was in grave and imminent danger, and would explain to my supervisor my moral objections. I didn’t get the job, but I didn’t regret telling the truth.
I got the impression it was the foster mother, who only overheard the conversation, who did not speak English.
I’m still unsure on the death penalty in general, but I do feel that whether dangerous convicted criminals should be executed for their crimes is a separate argument from whether children should be executed for their mom’s whim. The latter is parents playing God, and the former is government playing… government.
Maybe I shouldn’t have said what I did, and I was even thinking that at the time, but some crimes are so revoltingly evil it’s hard to know how to process and deal with them. Just sending her to prison–or worse, just slapping her on the wrist–hardly seems a just punishment for coercing a woman to kill her beloved son. That woman had bonded with her baby, tried out names, told his sister about him, knew his gender–what do you think this will do to her? How could justice ever be served? I suppose there is One who paid that price–I suppose this is why the wrath of God had to be poured out–that there is grace even for this–that my own sins are no better–
sigh.
The law invites vigilante justice when it refuses to punish the guilty.
Phillymiss, thanks for answering my question. And for the integrity you showed in your job interview :)
some crimes are so revoltingly evil it’s hard to know how to process and deal with them.
Posted by: ycw at May 4, 2010 1:36 PM
I agree. I used to work in a forensic psych facility and it can be very difficult to see past the crime to the person behind it.
“For all the “horror stories” that you hear about DHS, they are still on the front lines protecting children from hideous sexual and physical abuse.”
yeah. Right. Like this would have happened if the teen was taken to PP.
Don’t they enable child molesters and pedophiles….???
And Tom the Libertarian, you disgust me. Where is this girls father? Where is this teen’s baby’s father? Likely both of these men are busy making another baby with another woman they will also abandon. Funny I don’t hear you calling for the men to go under the knife. You are a pig. :(