Fr. Frank: Americans don’t share Obama’s “extreme and offensive views” on abortion
There will be a conference call tonight at 9p EST of national pro-life leaders reflecting on the presidential race. Sign up to join in the call here.
Following is a statement by Fr. Frank Pavone of Priests for Life with which I fully concur.
A grave mistake and an abiding hope
Americans have made a grave mistake in electing Barack Obama to the presidency. Yet America herself remains great and is not a mistake, which is why so many of her citizens will continue, with even greater energy and determination, to defend her founding principles….
The man elected to the Presidency said during the campaign that he does not know when a human being starts to have human rights. How can one govern from that starting point of ignorance? Governing is about protecting human rights; to do it successfully, you have to know where they come from, and when they begin.
The President-elect has already failed that test miserably.
The American people do not share Barack Obama’s extreme and offensive views on abortion. They never have and they never will. The coming 4 years will see a widening gap between the people and their President on this fundamental issue. As Americans come to know how extreme his position is, the intensity of the struggle to protect these children will only increase.
The pro-life movement has made significant gains in the courts and in the law in these last 8 years. For the next 4, the movement will work to prevent the erosion of that progress.
It would be a serious mistake for people to think that this election means the pro-life movement has no political power. All politics is local. Political power is about people. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. was once told that given the political realities, civil rights legislation would be impossible to pass. “We’ll just have to see about that,” he replied. And the civil rights movement was born, stirring the hearts of the people to lead the nation to the victory of justice.
So it is with our movement. The vast majority of Americans are pro-life. They will fight abortion on the local level, opening pregnancy centers and closing abortion mills, activating their Churches and educating their children, proclaiming the message in the media and demonstrating in the streets. The pro-life movement is winning this battle in the hearts and minds of the American people, as opinion polls show and as the shrinking number of abortion mills and abortion providers prove.
Political races are always a swinging of the pendulum. As soon as you win, you begin to lose, and as soon as you lose, you begin the ascent again to winning. In the next 2 election cycles (2010 and 2012) the pro-life movement will make up for political ground lost in this one.
It is all right to be disappointed at the end of an election season, but one must never walk away. Amidst disappointment is abiding hope in America, where everything remains possible, and where a new chapter of the pro-life movement has just begun. The efforts that were made, and the sacrifices endured in this election season made a difference, and we will build on that difference to see another day when the work and the ballots of pro-life people will dismantle the Culture of Death. We will keep marching toward that pro-life America we seek, and won’t stop until we get there.
[Photo courtesy of NECN.com]
Nov.05, 2008 6:22 am |
Born Alive |
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
“Lord Forgive us and our Nation.”
I hope none of the pro choice people on here are small business owners — cause you will be taxed out of business or devastatingly so. My sister told me that my brother in law’s former boss has this graphic designer at his company with Obama stuff all over his cubicle. The owner walked by and told him “When Obama’s tax policies tax me out of business, you’re the first one that I’ll fire,”
Think about all the family businesses that are generations of Americans that will be taxed to death. :(
Americans don’t share Frank Pavone’s extreme and offensive views on abortion.
The abortion ban in South Dakota was defeated again, despite the exceptions. Colorado voters voted 3 to 1 that personhood does not begin at conception. And obviously, Americans elected Barack Obama despite all the outrageous anti-choice lies you told.
Americans support Roe v. Wade, even in ruby red states. Americans want abortion to be legal.
reality – at one time some Americans wanted slavery to be legal too.
Reality,
The pro-lifers on this site are not cultural relativists.
Liz, my family owns one of those businesses. Three generations in my husband’s family …. started by his grandfather in a tiny garage in the 1940’s, expanded by his father, and now headed by my husband – they are a very successful business that employes around 25 people in our community.
Now they will be in the fight of their lives just to stay afloat and remain profitable.
My husband’s first words: well, I will either have to cut every employee’s pay, or I will have to fire at least one employee and have everyone that remains work harder to pick up the slack since we’ll have less workers.
And knowing that small businesses all over this country are the backbone of our economy …. this sounds like a fabulous solution. Thanks, President Obama!
I have to say, honestly, sitting there last night watching those results come in, all I could think about was the millions of babies that were going to die.
A very, very sad moment for our nation.
Hey reality, I’m curious, what exactly were these outragous anti-choice lies that Jill told?
This mornign, for the firs time in eight years. an American flag flies again at my home.
Those in this site who are thinking individuals and proud AMericans can join Barack and his supporters in the hard work that starts NOW. Or you can continue on the divisive path laid by George Bush and people like Pavone.
Welcome to those who want to join in the great effort before us. Dismissal to those who still seek to divide. Your future is there – the Flat Earth Society and John Birch Societies do still exist.
Seriously – I wish you all well in many of the good things you do. Helping pregnant women who have made the choie to give birth, but don’t lie to them before they make that choice.
Fostering children in need, working with the disabled-mentioned by many of you. All good and valuable tasks. My best to you in those endeavors. Who knows, we may be standing shoulder to shoulder at one of those events.
But stop wasting your time picketting and harassing at clinics and private citizens homes, stop the bitter blogging.
Bye and best wishes.
I’m not so sure about that vast majority that the good Father speaks about. What I do know is that as a Christians, as human beings who understand a fundamental truth, we must continue to carry the tourch regardless of its popularity. The truth is not subject to opinion polls. “If you were of the world, they would love you.” I don’t think he was kidding.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5OUdj_YIpo
Richardson revelation-Obama is an immigrant
CONTACT PHILIP BERG IMMEDIATELY!!!!
WHY IS OBAMA AN IMMIGRANT!!!!
http://WWW.OBAMACRIMES.COM IS STILL ALIVE!
JOIN THE GRASSROOTS MOVEMENT!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5OUdj_YIpo
Richardson revelation-Obama is an immigrant
CONTACT PHILIP BERG IMMEDIATELY!!!!
WHY IS OBAMA AN IMMIGRANT!!!!
http://WWW.OBAMACRIMES.COM IS STILL ALIVE!
JOIN THE GRASSROOTS MOVEMENT!
Keep your pro-life views to yourself, No one should have the right to tell me and my wife wether or not we can have an abortion, this should be our decision only. We are from New York City and now we are living in Palm Coast Florida for 5 years now, We bought our home with no mortgage at the time. Our property value went up in by $20k in just 4 months, this was before the builder even finished building our home. I opened a Limousine business, my wife worked at home scheduling jobs for me and I drove the cars. I bought both my stretch limo and a lincoln town car so I can do airport runs and do night out on the town jobs too. Life was quite good, A year went by and we had our first child, a boy. We were so happy and we figured we live in florida, we now need a pool so we thought we buy everything we own with cash which didn’t help bring up our credit so we figured lets get a mortgage on an in-ground pool, 4 years went by and now I am jobless because people here cant afford my services anymore, Things got so bad where I found myself sitting home for weeks at a time, I had to close the business for pennies, my wife had to find a job and we are having trouble paying our bills and living the lifestyle we are used to, we had 2 abortions in the past year and a half because we dont want to struggle to afford a new born, So we had to fly to New York City to get them done because it is considered a “no no” here in florida, our home lost value by $68k and I refuse to sell it and lose money so we are stuck here where I can’t find work, I refuse to work in a chain store and make $8 per hour when I made $300 to $1,500 a day. Im glad we New Yorkers and others from the tri-state area have come here and changed the majority from republican to democratic, we did good in Flagler County. God bless America, Pres. Obama, Israel, and my family. I blame Bush for this countries bad economy, if we didn’t have war with Iraq then things would be very different, Afghanistan was justified after 9/11 as we had the whole world backing us up, Iraq was not and we lost the support of the whole world. Now we have Iran (the biggest threat to us and Israel) who will soon have nukes. Sadam Husain kept the Iranians quiet, now with no Sadam, they are becoming powerful and Russia is thinking that America caused the USSR to collapse and now they want to return the favor, We have A lot to prove now to the world, we have to show the world we are not cowboys like bush and the red states who don’t know anything about designer name brands like Prada, Gucci, Armani Exchange and DKNY, We have to travel to NYC to go shopping because they don’t have good quality products in Palm Coast, They walk around in walmart clothes (lol) Well Sorry if I sound shallow to you but I am a true New Yorker and I am working hard to get every thing I can get out of my investments in florida and move back home to NYC, We learned a valuable lesson, There Is No Place Like Home or like NYC!
Why don’t you just get a vasectomy instead of making your wife go through violent surgeries? You are truly full of crap, and you don’t seem to know anything about the laws in Florida.
Chris,
reality – at one time some Americans wanted slavery to be legal too.
And at one time, Americans wanted abortion outlawed, but that time, like slavery, is long past, never to return again.
Your right The Other Erin, I don’t know the laws in Florida and I don’t care to know them, we searched for abortion clinics and only found chop shops, No stay time in a clinic till you feel better, I don’t want a vasectomy yet because we want more kids, just not right now when we can’t afford to have one. We are more careful now, we practice safe sex which is not as good but SAFE. Im just glad when we had accidents we were able to take care of them.
I’m sick and tired of the ludicrous comparison of abortion and slavery. I’m also offended by the notion that being pro-choice is as morally reprehensible as being pro-slavery, and that somehow, pro-choicers are bad, unprincipled, people because they are opposed to making something that can never be stopped illega.
Slavery can be stopped, and HAS been, although it still exists.
But abortion can never be stopped. It never has been and never will be. The only way to prevent abortions is to prevent unwanted abortions. All pro-choicers want to prevent as many unwanted pregnancies as possible, and Obama is no exception.
He doesn’t advocate “infanticide”. That’s a lie. He is determined to keep abortion legal; that’s all.
Father Pavone is dead wrong. We need a pro-choice president as a bulwark against anti-choice extremists. We must never let abortion become illegal again, or the results will be catastrophic for families and society in general.
Lord, make me an instrument of Thy peace;
where there is hatred, let me sow love;
where there is injury, pardon;
where there is doubt, faith;
where there is despair, hope;
where there is darkness, light;
and where there is sadness, joy.
O Divine Master,
grant that I may not so much seek to be consoled as to console;
to be understood, as to understand;
to be loved, as to love;
for it is in giving that we receive,
it is in pardoning that we are pardoned,
and it is in dying that we are born to Eternal Life.
Amen.
Theare73,
Keeping our prolife views to ourselves would defeat the purpose of a prolife blog.
Move along.
Palin is Pro-life, I never liked her face and “christian” ways. I Can’t say I like Obama, but I definitely would not like McCain & Palin in the white house. The evangelicals have lost!
I voted Bush and am glad I did. I will miss him when he is gone.
Democrats like to stick their feet out to trip Bush, then laugh when he falls.
Robert” “I’m sick and tired of the ludicrous comparison of abortion and slavery.”
Hey, Robert, there’s an easy solution to that problem: stay away from this blog!! Didn’t that occur to you?
But I do agree that the comparison fails, at least on one point: Abortion nearly ALWAYS KILLS, whereas slaves do sometimes escape and are rarely killed outright. So Abortion is quicker, but more more DEADLY permanent.
“I’m also offended by the notion that being pro-choice is as morally reprehensible as being pro-slavery”
This is true Robert. At least the slaves got to live. A human being is always killed in an abortion. Being pro-choice is much worse than being pro-slavery.
Doyle, Bobby, so true.
Now that they have control of the oval office and both houses, the Democrats will have to put up or shut up. Any problems that remain after the first day of February will be laid squarely on their doorstep. It ALL belongs to them now, and I for one intend to hold their feet to the fire for as long as they control our government.
Bobby what about slaves who killed themselves because they believed death was better then slavery? You should read Harriet Jacobs autobiography, she often talks about how death is preferable to a life of slavery and even prays to God that he will let her children die young so they don’t have to become slaves.
Give me liberty or give me death.
Yikes, a lot of nastiness this morning. The pro life movement needs to show LOVE, MERCY and COMPASSION in order to enlighten the hearts of many. Kill the pro-choice mentality with Kindness and Charity, Save the babies with LOVE. In the end, being pro-life is all about LOVE. Yeah, baby!
Oh Bethany, your glad Bush wanted to go after Sadam in Iraq for no good reason? Who are we to oust an other countries leaders if they pose no threat to us, he had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11. He kept a lid on Iran and in fact kept balance in the middle east. You were lied to by Bush and his people, you were made to believe that Sadam was a threat and that he had weapons of mass destruction. There were no weapons found, I know 2 people who died in the World Trade Center buildings and I had to Keep my windows closed for a month to keep that sweat metallic smelling smoke coming from ground zero out of my house. There was no one that wanted revenge more than us in NYC! but we knew Sadam had nothing to do with it but we went to war with them anyway losing every nations support that we had when we went into Afghanistan. Now we are virtually broke because of it. Thank you and people like you Bethany, for making Bush president and in effect making us (my family) broke and having to resort to abortion because we cant afford a new born baby right now. I wish we never had to resort to abortion and keep the child, but we are not trailer trash, we wont have children we can’t afford.
My nastiness comment is not referring to the discussions comparing slavery to abortion but early obvious mean-spirited posts. By abortion: We are slaves to: the sexist mentality of men who abandon their child and lover, the profits of abortionists and violence Tony Soprano style to solve an inconvenient problem.
TA73- I’m so sorry you must be mourning the death of your child and regret the decision that you made. My prayers are with you and your wife and your child. Adoption and crisis pregnancy centers are always an option, please remember that! But the pro-life movement needs to make sure we do a better job in helping out in crisis pregnancies!
But stop wasting your time picketting and harassing at clinics and private citizens homes, stop the bitter blogging.
Bye and best wishes.
Posted by: phylosopher at November 5, 2008 7:28 AM
Phylo, parting is such sweet joy. Please stay away for good. And the election of Obama is going to keep people picketing nd and keep abortion in the limelight as long as he is president.
Anon pick a name.
Oh Bethany, your glad Bush wanted to go after Sadam in Iraq for no good reason?
So are you saying that no democrats supported going to Iraq in the beginning? I can show you multitudes of videos which show democrats supporting going after Sadaam in Iraq.
Thank you and people like you Bethany, for making Bush president
You’re welcome!
and in effect making us (my family) broke
Of course. Everyone else caused your financial problems. You had nothing to do with becoming broke. @@
and having to resort to abortion because we cant afford a new born baby right now.
There are plenty of resources available for those who can’t afford babies. What you are doing is making excuses, and blaming others for your mistakes and poor choices.
I wish we never had to resort to abortion and keep the child, but we are not trailer trash, we wont have children we can’t afford.
Yep, it’s everyone else’s fault you had an abortion. Of course!
Check it out, Theare73:
“One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line.”
President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998.
“If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction program.”
President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998.
“Iraq is a long way from [here], but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face.”
Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998.
“He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983.”
Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998
“[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq’s refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs.”
Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others Oct. 9, 1998.
“Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process.”
Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998.
“Hussein has … chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies.”
Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999.
“There is no doubt that . Saddam Hussein has reinvigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies.”
Letter to President Bush, Signed by Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL,) and others, Dec, 5, 2001.
“We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of delivering them.”
Sen. Carl Levin (d, MI), Sept. 19, 2002.
“We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country.”
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.
“Iraq’s search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power.”
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.
“We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seing and developing weapons of mass destruction.”
Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002.
“The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons…”
Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002.
“I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force — if necessary — to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security.”
Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002.
“There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years . We also should remember we have alway s underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction.”
Sen. Jay Rockerfeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002,
“He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has refused to do.”
Rep. Henry Waxman (D, CA), Oct. 10, 2002.
“In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons.”
Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002
“We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction. “[W]ithout question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime … He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation. And now he has continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction … So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real …
Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003.
Jill, Bobby, Janet. Mary, Eileen, John, Liz, Jasper, Patricia, HisMan and others,
Thank you for your continued witness and for your never wavering commitment to fighting for a culture that embraces all of God’s children. It takes a special heart to remain steadfast in light of all the mean spirited attacks. You all have the patience and character of the Saints. May God continue to bless and uphold you in your work.
I went to Bible study on Monday night, where we are studying 1 and 2 Samuel. Here are some of the passages we came across. I could not help but think how prophetic they are.
Now Samuel called the people together to the Lord at Mizpah; and he said to the sons of Israel, “Thus says the Lord, the God of Israel, ‘I have brought you up Israel out of Egypt, and I delivered you from the hand of the Egyptians and from the hand of all the kingdoms that were oppressing you.’ But you have this day rejected your God who saves you from all your calamities and your distresses; and you have said, ‘No! but set a king over us.’ Now therefore present yourselves before the Lord by your tribes and by your thousands.”
1 Samuel 10:17-19
And Samuel said to all Israel, “Behold, I have listened to your voice in all that you have said to me, and have made a king over you.
1 Samuel 12:1
“And now behold the king whom you have chosen, for whom you have asked; behold, the Lord has set a king over you. If you will fear the Lord and serve him and listen to his voice and not rebel against the commandments of the Lord, and if both you and the king who reigns over you will follow the Lord your God, it will be well; but if you will not listen to the voice of the Lord, but rebel against the commandment of the Lord, then the hand of the Lord will be against you and your king.”
1 Samuel 12:13-15
Lord, save your people from their arrogance and their ignorance.
Let us fervently pray that our new president and his followers set aside their selfish and Godless ways.
Think about all the family businesses that are generations of Americans that will be taxed to death. :(
Posted by: LizFromNebraska at November 5, 2008 6:36 AM
Tax to Death? where’s you read that. A 3% increase on profits over $250,000 is an increase, but I doubt it would be the difference between making it and going under. Any business making that much profit (i.e., after expenses like payroll) isn’t in danger of closing it’s doors. I’ve run businesses that succeeded and businesses that have failed. Also, as one who will be paying more if Obama’s plan is implemented, I’ll handle it.
Those who persecute Christians for fighting for life know this: our argument is grounded in Natural Law and rudimentary medical science. Yours is supported by nothing but ignorance, spin and semantics. Don’t hate on us because you’d prefer to dispense death at your convenience than force your consciences to accept the truth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5OUdj_YIpo
Richardson revelation-Obama is an immigrant
CONTACT PHILIP BERG IMMEDIATELY!!!!
WHY IS OBAMA AN IMMIGRANT!!!!
http://WWW.OBAMACRIMES.COM IS STILL ALIVE!
JOIN THE GRASSROOTS MOVEMENT!
“Those who persecute Christians for fighting for life…”
Who has done that?
The comment above about how we can never stop the killing of unborn children is absurd. If it is completely prohibited it will be greatly reduced and millions of human beings will be saved.
Obviously, all laws are violated. By that standard, you should argue that we cannot stop ANYTHING (actually we cannot) and so therefore ALL laws should be repealed. After all, we still have murder, rape and armed robbery and they have always been illegeal.
It is estimated that in the old days there were between 100,000 and 200,000 illegal criminal abortions. Now, I have seen an FBI estimate that there are about 200,000 illegal criminal rapes every year and I have seen other estimates that go as high as 300,000.
Would you militant abortion crime advocates argue that we should repeal statutes against criminal rape based on the fact that it cannot be stopped?
The only argument is whether killing human beings is a crime or not. It is, always has been and always will be a crime to kill us human beings throughout our lives.
I used to be a limousine driver, just like that man in Florida, but unlike him I never committed unspeakable crimes against my own children.
Looks like Obama shifted his tax schedule downward in the last 60 days. Now it increasing taxes for $150,000 in profit and going to $100,000. I told you so. One of the things left out by the deceiver is that we will face a lot of inflation. That will shove every one up several brackets.
Democrats are for inflation which hurts those on fixed incomes.
Hal,
The comments you make to HisMan come to mind.
Carla, perhaps some of my comments to HisMan were critical and unkind. That does not equate to “persecution.” HisMan can dish it out as good as he takes its. The free exchange of ideas on this site are not what I would consider “Those who persecute Christians for fighting for life…”
Ridicule, perhaps. But not “persecute.”
Looks like FBI is in Obama’s case Nov 4, 2008.
“Agents and I talked about payoff, bribe, kickback for a long time, though it took them only a short number of minutes of talking with me while looking at the appraisal to acknowledge what they already seemed to know: The Rezko lot was grossly overvalued,” Mr. Conner told The Washington Times Monday.
“Rezko paid the asking price on the same day Obama paid $300,000 less than the asking price to the same seller for his adjacent mansion,” he said. “This begs the question of payoff, bribe, kickback.
Looks like Obama structured a deal to hide a kickback/bribe . Rezco is awaiting sentencing and they say he is “singing”.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/nov/04/fbi-asked-questions-on-rezko-land-deal/
Will there be interrogations on this soon? A Prosecutor?
The comment above about how we can never stop the killing of unborn children is absurd. If it is completely prohibited it will be greatly reduced and millions of human beings will be saved.
Dear Joe,
Abortion will never be completely prohibited in America. Even if Roe v. Wade were overturned, that would only send the abortion issue back to the states, and most states would keep abortion legal. Women from anti-choice states would just travel to pro-choice states.
xppc, 10;24am
Don’t hold your breath. Like the German people of 70 years ago, the American people have been taken in by a sociopathic, smooth talking, charasmatic political thug.
The great minds and military men of Germany turned themselves over to HItler. A nation was mesmerized.
We the American people have been mesmerized by this political thug as well.
Ask Obama supporters on this site what Obama’s credentials are. You’ll never get an answer. What were Hitler’s credentials? Who cared.
We wonder how the German people were so taken in by a paper hanging, art school reject and street thug.
We have only to look at ourselves for the answer.
Here is a timeline from the last time a messianic leader took over a western democracy.
TIMELINE: THE GROWTH OF
ANTI-SEMITISM IN NAZI GERMANY
Background image to this page: Long before Jews in Europe were required to wear the Star of David on their persons in Europe or Germany, the Nazis were using the symbol. In April 1933, when the Nazi Party orchestrated a boycott of Jewish shops and businesses, Hitler’s government ordered that Jewish shops be marked with placards featuring “a yellow badge on a black background” Robert Weltsch, a writer for the Zionist publication Judische Rundschau commented “this regulation is intended as a brand, a sign of contempt. We will take it up and make it a badge of honor.”
In September 1941, Jews in the German Reich were ordered to wear badges with the yellow star and the word “Jude.” Jews in the German-occupied lands of eastern Europe had been ordered to do the same two years earlier.
1933:
Jan. 30 — Adolf Hitler is named chancellor of Germany by President Hindenburg. Hitler’s partners in this coalition government agree that Nazi minister Hermann Goering, as Minister of the Interior for Prussia, would have jurisdiction over most of the German police. Goering quickly appoints members of the SA and SS as auxiliary police. Police increasingly do nothing while SA stormtroopers assault Jews in the streets.
(Obama’s “Civil Defense Force”?)
Feb. 27 — German Reichstag burns in act of arson, subsequently blamed on a Dutch communist. Hindenburg agrees to let Hitler use emergency powers and civil rights are suspended in Germany. The number of Nazi Party seats in the Reichstag increases with new elections. The new Reichstag soon passes a law that permits Hitler to rule by decree for the next four years. (2010/2012 elections suspended for “emergency purposes)
March — Joseph Goebbels is named Minister for Propaganda and Public Enlightenment, and immediately begins encouraging the German press to criticize Jews as a “cancer” within Germany. Heinrich Himmler, as provisional head of the police in Munich, orders the establishment of a large camp for keeping in “protective custody” Germans who”cannot be allowed to remain free as they continue to agitate and to cause unrest.” This camp is built around an old gunpowder factory at Dachau.
April — Nazi stormtroopers begin intimidating shoppers to boycott Jewish-owned businesses. Reichstag passes several laws to remove Jews from civil service jobs, restrict Jewish lawyers, judges and physicians, and establish a quota system limiting the number of Jewish students in German schools and universities.
May-July — Books by Jewish writers, socialist writers and others who are condemned as “subversive” or “decadent” are burned in public bonfires. Reichstag passes law making the Nazi Party the only legal political party in Germany. Another law permits government to revoke citizenship of anyone who settled in Germany after November 9, 1918; this is applied to large numbers of Jews from Poland and other eastern European countries. (Fairness Doctorine?)
August 25 — Germany concludes Haavara Transfer Agreement with Zionist officials, which will allow Jews to emigrate to Palestine with a larger part of their savings than they could otherwise take out of Germany. German press encourages Jews to take advantage of this and leave.
September 22 — New law creating a Reich Chamber of Commerce is used to eliminate Jewish-produced paintings, books, music, and other cultural artifacts. Jewish writers, musicians, conductors, etc. are stripped of their positions.
1934:
June- July — After purging the SA of leaders that he no longer trusts, Hitler grants the Heinrich Himmler’s SS independence from the SA. The SS will play the dominant role in the persecution of the Jews from this time forward.
August — After the death of President Hindenburg, Hitler becomes both chancellor and president of the nation. The German military and all public officials in Germany must now swear an oath of personal loyalty to Adolf Hitler, pledging to obey whatever orders he may choose to give.
1935:
May 21 — A new law on military service now excludes Jews from serving in the military.
June 25 — German government amends its 1933 sterilization laws to allow the state to mandate abortions for women who are deemed “eugenically unfit.” (FOCA?)
September 15 — The New Racial Laws are announced at the Nazi Party rally in Nuremberg. These laws proclaim that German citizenship is restricted to those “who [are] of German or kindred blood.” The state will decide who is and is not worthy of citizenship by issuing “Reich Citizenship Papers.” Marriage and sexual relations between Jews and non-Jews is prohibited by the new law.
November 14 — A special decree issued in conjunction with the citizenship law defines what a “Jew” is under German law and states “A Jew cannot be a citizen of the Reich.” Earlier Nazi laws had exempted Jewish military veterans from the harshest anti-Semitic measures in education and the professions. This decree removes the exemptions.
December 31 — Any remaining Jews in the German civil service, including military veterans, are now dismissed from their jobs.
(For the full text of the above laws, click here)
1936:
June 17 — Hitler gives control of all police agencies in German to the SS and makes Himmler the head of all German police. Persecutions of the Jews fade as Germany prepares to host the Olympic Games at Berlin. Persecutions of gypsies in Germany increase as many gypsies are arrested placed in detention camps.
September 9 — At the annual Party rally in Nuremberg, Hitler announces plans to have the German military ready for war within 4 years. Subsequent decrees make all Jews in Germany responsible for actions by “individual Jews” that may hinder this plan.
1937:
July — The Buchenwald concentration camp is completed and opened.
December 14 — Himmler issues a decree that permits the arrest and detention of any “asocial” person. While the decree is aimed at gypsies, it is applied to Jews and other “undesirables” as well.
1938:
March — The Anschluss: Germany annexes Austria. All Austrian Jews are subjected to the retrictions of the 1935 racial laws.
April 26 — A new decree orders Jews to register with the state all their assets greater in value than 5000 RM. (Tax Codes?)
August 17 — All Jewish men in Germany required to add the middle name “Israel” to their names, and all women to add “Sara” to their names.
September — New decrees prohibit Jews from practicing law or medicine in Germany. (Elimination of Conscience Protections for Medical personnel?)
October — German Jews must have their passports stamped with a “J” for “Jude,” and over 15,000 “stateless” Jews in Germany (Jews who had been born elsewhere, but who had lived in Germany since 1919) are expelled and driven across the Polish border.
November — A Jewish student in Paris, whose parents had been among those expelled into Poland, kills a German diplomat in the German embassy. In retaliation, Nazi Party members, led by SA leaders, go on a rampage in Germany on November 9-10, killing Jews and burning synagogues, homes, and businesses. Some thirty thousand Jews are arrested and detained in concentration camps in the aftermath of the “Kristallnacht” pogrom — the night of broken glass.
1939:
January — The SS takes charge of all emigration of Jews from the Greater German Reich. Hitler in a speech to the Reichstag says that a new war in Europe will lead to the “annihilation of the Jewish race in Europe.” The German army is already planning the invasion of Poland.
March — German troops occupy the remainder of the Czech state. Jews in Bohemia and Moravia are arrested and placed in concentration camps.
May 15 — Ravensbruck concentration camp is completed and opened for women prisoners.
June-August — The SS creates special units – Einsatzgruppen — for the purpose of carrying out “special tasks” during the coming attack on Poland. These tasks will include the murder of Polish leaders and intellectuals, and the rounding up of Jews in Poland for the purpose of placing them in ghettos.
September — Germany invades Poland. Britain and France declare war on Germany.
Sources: Gotz Aly, ‘Final Solution’: Nazi Population Policy and the Murder of the European Jews (1999); Yitzhak Arad, et. al., editors, Documents on the Holocaust (1999); Saul Friedlander, Nazi Germany and the Jews (1997); Donald Niewyk and Francis Nicosia, The Columbia Guide to the Holocaust (2000).
Father Pavone is dead wrong. We need a pro-choice president as a bulwark against anti-choice extremists. We must never let abortion become illegal again, or the results will be catastrophic for families and society in general.
Posted by: Robert Berger at November 5, 2008 8:07 AM
*******************************************
Yes, yes!! We must keep the babies from surviving! The survival of our GREAT society DEPENDS upon their DEATHS!! Die, babies, DIE!
(Just checking to see if you all really realize what you’re saying here. But the sad thing is, you probably do.)
And heh, the people talking about the FREEDOM of this nation seem to love to tell us we have no right to speak on behalf of the unborn. This is one effed up world, excuse me for saying so.
I also find it hilarious that people like phylosopher believe that we who differ with their opinions are “unthinking” and then they say “Join our cause, you unthinking idiots!” LOL Yeah, THAT’S not divisive or anything. ;)
DeeL,
An excellent post. The thing that is most frightening is that such a people as the Germans could so devote themselves, a religious fanaticism, to a thug.
Here in the US along comes a smooth talking and charasmatic politician of limited experience and questionable character. Americans are entranced.
Hisotory repeats itself.
We wonder how the German people were so taken in by a paper hanging, art school reject and street thug.
We have only to look at ourselves for the answer.
Posted by: Mary at November 5, 2008 10:52 AM
**********************************************
True.
Like the German people of 70 years ago, the American people have been taken in by a sociopathic, smooth talking, charasmatic political thug.
The great minds and military men of Germany turned themselves over to HItler. A nation was mesmerized.
We the American people have been mesmerized by this political thug as well.”
Is this kind of talk really necessary? I understand your candidate didn’t win, but holy cow, it happens.
Mary,
It is scary how fast things moved out of the people’s control into a totalitarian situation. Everyday, more and more people were losing their rights.
For those of you who say it’s impossible here… history says otherwise.When a nation decides that rights come from the government, and not from God, it is a doomed nation indeed.
Wasn’t it Ronald Reagan who said that “A government that gives you everything you want can take everything away”?
Lord, have mercy. Save your people.
Hal 11:33am
Hitting a nerve? Tell me Obama’s credentials Hal.
Oh, and it was Bill Clinton who referred to him as a (paraphrase)Chicago political thug.
Did your guy consult Tony Rezko, who was under federal investigation, about a house because there’s a shortage of real estate agents?
You never told me what you thought of Obama’s talk of a “civilian security force”.
What about his desire to destroy the coal industry?
Oh, Mary, don’t be silly! You KNOW none of that “other stuff” matters, as long as we preserve the sacred right to kill our children at will. ;)
And Hal,
votes for a man that has bailed out wall street and did nothing for main street Americans. Not a word about restoring the lost retirement funds, pension funds, mutual funds, income funds, 401k’s, or any financial instruments that the middle class invested in.
$700bl for the his buddies on wall street, and his personal thieves, such as Rezko.
A depression is coming, and Oboma will accuse debtbeat geners, as being the cause of the Depression. Hal will too.
DeeL,
Indeed it is scary. Now the Fairness Doctrine is being brought up, where the gov’t monitors what’s on the radio. It must be “balanced”. Shades of Josef Stalin and Adolph Hitler.
Kel,
So long as we have the gov’t taking care of us, we’ll be fine. That’s why we have our great (white, black) father in Washington.
Mary, I did tell you what I thought of Civilian Security Force; I don’t think he meant it literally. I think he was saying that those who work at home to make our country great should be as well funded, organized, and respected as our military. If he meant it literally, we would have heard it more than once, and it would be on his website under his proposals.
On his credentials, you can’t see what you don’t want to see. I think I’ve posted my views several times and you just disagree. I say he’s a constitutional law professor, you say he’s ignorant of the constititution. I say he has a great education, you say fancy-pants schools don’t indicate wisdom. I say he’s thoughtful and compassionate, you say, that’s what Hitler said. I don’t think we have to keep doing this. Let’s just agree as Americans to support him when he’s right and voice our disagreements when we think he’s wrong.
Hal,
I truly hope and pray you are right about your guy. The problem is after 2+ years running for the presidency, we still know very little about him. And what we do is scary. despite your state of denial. The MSM (Obama propaganda ministry) totally failed in their duty to present the real agenda of this man and you guys bought the image hook, line and sinker. I pray with all my heart that we are as wrong about him as you say we are.
Hal,
He didn’t mean it literally? He sounded pretty serious to me. It brought him lots of applause.
Why would he even suggest this if he didn’t mean it? Everything starts out as “just talk” Hal. Be very wary.
Hal, you can’t see what isn’t there! Those aren’t credentials. A great education is fine, it doesn’t in itself qualify you for a job.
A Constitutional lawyer, fine. MOst politicians are lawyers. I don’t think I need to say more.
Those sound like credentials to be a lawyer or law school professor, not president of the United States.
Compassion is great. It doesn’t make you a world leader.
Please, just give me his resume.
Or that Congress manages to keep him in check until the country regains its senses.
Reality 6:52am
In the sapphire blue state of California the Gay Marriage referendum didn’t pass. That must be proof positive all Americans oppose gay marriage.
Hal : I say he’s a constitutional law professor, you say he’s ignorant of the constititution.
I don’t think he’s ignorant of the constitution at all. I think he knows the constitution very well. I do believe he has studied it with the intent to destroy it. Again, I hope and pray that I am wrong.
Correction to my 12:03 post,
The voters approved a Gay Marriage ban. Again, must mean all Americans oppose gay marriage.
Is Hal literate and educated?
Tell us Hal, is “the Fed”, a government agency or a private corporation of bankers?
How is capital produced Hal?
Does education make one dumb? Well yes, ask Greenspan pleading his “dumbness case” before his fascist cronies before Congress.
Maximize the corporate profits, by privatizing your corporate losses, to the middle class taxpayer.
When a person uses “security” in any sense, they are actually demanding order from someone and something.
The coal industry can break the socialist command economy of Oboma, by doing one simple thing.
Take the week off, a month, a year, and pay the employee’s until they have no more capital credit or debt they may borrow. Ship no more dirty coal, and watch the “security service” demand order from the coal industry.
Upon which every security thug, created by the fascist Oboma will be educated in dirty jobs quite quickly. Expect a high defection from his brownshirt creation. Upon which he will arrest the defectors and try them for treason or whatever his educated mind can think up.
Indeed it is scary. Now the Fairness Doctrine is being brought up, where the gov’t monitors what’s on the radio. It must be “balanced”. Shades of Josef Stalin and Adolph Hitler.
Posted by: Mary at November 5, 2008 11:46 AM
Yea Mary,
Like the MSM is “balanced”. Ha ha.
Hal,
Please, your thoughts on Obama’s plan to destroy the coal industry.
Gotta go help my homeschooled daughter with her work. I wonder how long it will be until that’s outlawed and she will be required to attend the state indoctrination centers.
Have a great day everyone. Play nice with each other and continue your prayers for our country!
Mary, again, you have his resume, you’re just not impressed with it. Fine. How about Wilson: “served as President of Princeton University and then became the Governor of New Jersey in 1910. With Theodore Roosevelt and William Howard Taft dividing the Republican Party vote, Wilson was elected President as a Democrat in 1912.”
yllas, you’re not as funny anymore.
Mary, the coal industry was last Friday’s talking point if I remember correctly. We’re past that now.
Do you really think a president of the United States wants to destroy ANY American industry? You guys have begun to believe your own demonization of the man. The election is over, you can dial it back a few degrees.
Obama:
Let me sort of describe my overall policy.
What I’ve said is that we would put a cap and trade system in place that is as aggressive, if not more aggressive, than anybody else’s out there.
I was the first to call for a 100% auction on the cap and trade system, which means that every unit of carbon or greenhouse gases emitted would be charged to the polluter. That will create a market in which whatever technologies are out there that are being presented, whatever power plants that are being built, that they would have to meet the rigors of that market and the ratcheted down caps that are being placed, imposed every year.
So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can; it’s just that it will bankrupt them because they’re going to be charged a huge sum for all that greenhouse gas that’s being emitted.
That will also generate billions of dollars that we can invest in solar, wind, biodiesel and other alternative energy approaches.
The only thing I’ve said with respect to coal, I haven’t been some coal booster. What I have said is that for us to take coal off the table as a (sic) ideological matter as opposed to saying if technology allows us to use coal in a clean way, we should pursue it.
So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can.
It’s just that it will bankrupt them.
God Bless you, DeeL for homeschooling your daughter.
If I am ever blessed with a family, I want to home school.
Listen to him say it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hdi4onAQBWQ
Hal,
Are you serious? We’re not past anything. He’s president now, its more that a “talking point”.
No, I wouldn’t think any rational president would want to destroy a US industry.
Go to http://www.rushlimbaugh.com and click the 11/3 tab. You can read for yourself what Obama said about this.
Hal,
My friend, please open your eyes to what and who Obama really is.
Hal, 12:20OM
Please, what resume? I agree his background is fine for a lawyer or law professor, what are his credentials to be president? Wilson was a governor! That’s a credential.
What are the requirements to get a job in the security service of the O man?
A degree?
A criminal record brought about by “social injustice”, which means you understand the oppressed of the nation?
Too keep it honest and upstanding, only a person who has, or is getting some edumacation, will have the requirements to be a obergruppenfuher.
No edumacation? Highest rank will be a oberscharfuher.
What color uniform will this security service personel wear, that the O man has spoken about?
Desert sand, from the downsizing of the murderous soldiers of the Bush regime?
Which leaves the O man not wanting to have unemployment amongst his party hacks in the corporate world of making uniforms, for the armed forces of the USA.
New security uniforms will be made by the previously, hopelessly, unemployed who lack a eduation, and given a job making unforms for his politically correct corporations as the ranks swell from a Depression.
Quality is irrelvent, since quality is not the reason for the job anyway.
Hal will applaud such new and inventive social justice being applied as the final solution to unemployment and poverty brought to the USA.Although those evil capitalist he bailed out, will owe him the revival of their fascist money grubbing, that actually comes from the people they made poor by the Depression they caused.
Of course they will need lawyers of the quailty of Hal, who knows that being employed by the O man, is a priviledge beyond any pay raise given to him by the poor taxpayers of the nation, in his new job for the O man.
Such are the paths to power of the obsequious, pusillaminous men that will flock to the O man.
America has spoken.
Barak Obama is our President, elected For the People By the People.
Every abortion iniative failed. Roe vs Wade is settled law and it will be for many years to come, even in Ruby Redstate America. Republican women across this Nation are Pro-choice, including Laura and Barbara Bush.
You have a choice – you can live your life in Moderate mainstream America with the general population or you can choose to set on The Far Right Fringe of reality believeing your way is the only way.
The bulk of American women (and men) disagree with you. That is the bottom-line and this is the best country in the world (that ever was and ever will be) in 2008.
God Bless America!
Obama/Biden 2008
Mary, look at it this way. Obama may probably totally suck as President. He possibly could disgrace liberals and Democrats in general. This could probably prevent the Dems from winning an election for at least 20-30 years, during that time a Republican president that you oh-so-desire will be able to fix all the damage Obama may do.
Compassion is great. It doesn’t make you a world leader.
Posted by: Mary at November 5, 2008 12:00 PM
Isn’t that why John McCain got support? He was compassionate towards unborn babies?
Tell us Hal, is “the Fed”, a government agency or a private corporation of bankers?
How is capital produced Hal?
Still searching the net, Hal?
Who really makes money in this nation Hal? Private bankers loaning money to the government to print the money, or government making fiat money outta nothing?
What is a fractional banking reserve system, Hal?
And how does it work to produce more debt money from the original debt money produced by a loan?
How does that relate to being unable to estimate the actual loss of capital in this so called, financial crisis?
“Please, what resume? I agree his background is fine for a lawyer or law professor, what are his credentials to be president? Wilson was a governor! That’s a credential.”
Obama was an Illinois state senator and a US senator.
“Go to http://www.rushlimbaugh.com and click the 11/3 tab. You can read for yourself what Obama said about this.”
If you want to know about Obama’s policies why not go to Obama’s site instead of the site of someone that hates him?
Mary, you seem to be looking for an argument. You don’t think Obama is qualified. We get it. You seem to be trying to get us to agree with you. Not going to happen. We voted for him for a reason. (actually, lots of reasons)
America has spoken.
Barak Obama is our President, elected For the People By the People
Posted by: Thee at November 5, 2008 12:54 PM
Democracy is the greatest lie fostered upon the shepple such as Thee.
When one loses a issue in a election, or a vote for a person, no one represents you in the government of a democracy. You loose. And that fact is avoided by such shepple as Thee.
At the highest level of power, the president, when one loses a election for their choice for a president, they have no representation, or voice in that nation at the highest level.
This is why liberals cheat, steal, invent voters in mass amounts because they know there is no voice when they lose a election.
Such silly remarks brought to you by a sheeple named Thee, is a demand of loyality to those that are not represented in their new demand for loyality of “the people”, that are not represented in their party hack world vision.
Take a hike Thee, and take off your demand for me being loyal to nothingmore then the lack of being represented in a democracy.
What a thug.
Still waiting Hal.
Are you not educated enough to know the answer to my simple questions?
Are you a ignorant lawyer in matters of basic banking?
Tell us Hal, is “the Fed”, a government agency or a private corporation of bankers?
How is capital produced Hal?
What is fractional banking, Hal?
yllas, who cares?
Mary,
You of all people would know a sociopath when you see one.
So tell me…what were the red flags for you? I saw plenty, but am interested in your perspective.
I’m looking forward to the Big Handout I’m supposed to get from President ManChild. Could pay for my skyrocketing electricity bills he’s promised to set in place.
And my own personally signed-by-him copy of the fundamentally flawed Constitution so I can use it for paper towel. But by golly the world is gonna love us now!
Welcome to the Socialist States of Amerika!
They were the first bankers because they started keeping other people’s gold for safekeeping in their safe rooms, or vaults.
The first paper money in Western Europe was merely receipts for gold left at the goldsmiths, made from rag paper as the ditty goes:
“Rags make paper; paper makes money; money makes banks; banks make loans; loans make beggars; beggars make rags.”
Paper money caught on because it was more convenient and safer to carry than a lot of heavy gold and silver coins. As a convenience, to avoid an unnecessary trip to the goldsmiths, depositors began endorsing these gold deposit receipts to others, by their signature.
Over time, to simplify the process the receipts were made out “to the bearer”, rather than to the individual depositor, making them readily transferable without the need for a signature. This, however, broke the tie to any identifiable deposit of gold.
Eventually goldsmiths noticed that only a small fraction of the depositors or bearers ever came in and demanded their gold at any one time. Goldsmiths started cheating on the system.
They began by secretly lending out some of the gold that had been entrusted to them for safekeeping, and keeping the interest earned on this lending.
Then the goldsmiths discovered that they could print more money (i.e. paper gold deposit certificates) than they had gold and usually no one would be the wiser. Then, they could loan out this extra paper money and collect interest on it. This was the birth of fractional reserve lending – that is, loaning out more money than you have reserves on deposit. Obviously, it was fraud, often specifically outlawed, once understood.
The same system of banking in the USA today.
When the bank reserve is caught with no money, as in bank runs, such as Schumer caused, the government steps in and “borrows the money” to cover the loss of that private bank, by a loan from a private banker , and issues a debt obligation known as T bonds,etc.
And who pays for that debt the government has created to private bankers? Taxpayers do.
The O man has made it clear that his banker thugs, who stole your retirement funds, 401k’s or any financial instrument held by the middle class, will be paided in full by taxing their losses unto the back of the new poor they created.
Now that’s change you can believe in.
yallas, you lost my interest a few days ago. Sorry.
Mary, you seem to be looking for an argument. You don’t think Obama is qualified. We get it. You seem to be trying to get us to agree with you. Not going to happen. We voted for him for a reason. (actually, lots of reasons)
I think she’s just asking questions and hoping for some answers, Hal. The election is over…what’s the harm in answering them honestly now?
Not implying that you’re not being honest now, just saying I don’t think Mary is trying to fight with you as much as she is trying to get you to see it from our point of view, and to actually take a closer look at what Obama really supports.
Who cares?
You will, when your loans are called on you sucker.
And after his banker friends took your extra income known as financial investments by a stock market crash, you’ll be homeless as they will and can demand in full any loan or debt you have out?
A bank can demand full payment on any debt owed them, sucker. That they can use a late payment on that silly cell phone as a reason to demand full payment on your home loan, education loan, or any financial instrument that is a debt obligation.
And since they have no capital to stay in business, and the other private bankers actually want to eliminate competition in banking/loans, your going to see a depression that makes you as homeless as any sucker that has nothing in assets left after the O man finishes with your lawyerly, financially ignorant butt.
And here it comes. The almighty denial of debt obligations by Hal. The Doug defense, of always thinking that no one has a argument against him, they just think they do.
But, even if you have paided off a house, and are a typical liberal, that owns a second seasonal house in some resort area, the lack of a tax base by all those foreclosed homes in any and all cities, will take your last private wealth by those government entities needing to raise the property taxes on your house until you become a resident of the new O man public housing, based upon the hugh stock of foreclosed homes.
Of course they will be totally ruined by the debtbeat generation knowing that that house was just below their taste in housing, as was that car they took a debt out on, and you’ll either pay to fix it up, or be like all “socialist housing owners”, waiting for the government security service personnel of your O man, to mow the weeds, or take the trash out for ya Hal.
Now, what gets ya Hal, is that lawyers will have lost a great source of wealth they take in payment by debtbeat geners of criminal or civil types, their homes.
The O man will not allow such actions of vulturism to continue under his reign. Or will that pig allow the fleecing of the most desperate amongst us, those that lose a house or wealth to a lawyer confiscating some poor mother or father’s house in return for some civil or criminal action.
Not if he really wants change we can believe in, Hal. He must deny you the right to live off the misery of the most desperate amongst us.
Hi Bethany. Mary and I have had this exchange before. I understand we view Obama differently. I tell her what I like about him, she doesn’t agree. So, I get a post like this:
Please, what resume? I agree his background is fine for a lawyer or law professor, what are his credentials to be president? Wilson was a governor! That’s a credential.
Posted by: Mary at November 5, 2008 12:48 PM
I understand she doesn’t think he’s qualified. And ANYTHING I state to support my opinion will be dismissed. I “see your point of view.” I really do. Some of it is legitimate in my eyes (Obama has less experience than others) some of it isn’t (Obma will ruin the economy, shred the Constitution, and kill our children). The reason I posted so many conservatives who endoresed Obama was to “give some answers” in a way I thought might resonate with you guys. There is really nothing more to say about Obama that hasn’t been said. Let’s see how he does, and support or oppose as it plays out.
I guess name calling is all you can resort to when you are wrong. LOL
You my friend is exactly why the GOP lost.
Posted by: Anonymous at November 5, 2008 2:08 PM
Written like a typical party hack, demanding loyalty to a person that doesn’t represent me in any democratic form or fashion, and the hypocrisy of being a person that now demands me to be loyal to your party hack president.
Go back to the Daily Kos, and think about all the disloyality to a president demanded there for years.
Or does hypocrite, ring a bell sheeple?
I have not stated I voted for McCain, and as usual, your party thug demands of me for loyalty to your version of a president, is a hugh fact of your announcing your a party hack-ta -vision sheeple.
It ain’t name calling when the names fits your selfmade admitting of demanding loyality to your O man.
Well Hal,
What have I proved about you?
That if you are a lawyer, your either one dumb dude in matters of banking and finance.
That your failure to understand basic principles of banking and capitialism is what will hang yourself financially for your vote for the O man.
But, will you return that house you took from poor old mom and dad, being desperate enough to use your services as a so called edumacted dude?
Or are you a corporate lawyer, who destroyed the wealth of millions of middle class Americans, by playing upon their financial ignorance, as your now pleading financial ignorance, by your non-answers to simple financial questions posed to you, Hal?
Either way, there are too many lawyers feeding off the public and private wealth of this nation.
And now, with a lack of wealth to take, your going to be applying for that job as a edumacted security service personnel, capable by education, of being raised to the rank of oberfuher.
Change Hal can believe in.
Thee 12:54PM
90% of the German people supported Hitler. Were the 10% who opposed him wrong?
Also, in California the Gay Marriage ban won in a referendum. I guess that means the people have spoken once and for all on this issue.
Rae 12:57PM
That’s the best case scenario.
yllas: The almighty denial of debt obligations by Hal. The Doug defense, of always thinking that no one has a argument against him, they just think they do.
yllas, that’s silly. Hal has seen through you, like just about everybody else.
There are plenty of arguments on both sides – no doubt about it.
Josephine 1:04PM
Why don’t you go read what your hero writes?
Read Bethany’s 12:31PM post then maybe you can tell me what you think of a US president planning the destruction of an industry.
Barack was a US senator for 143 days or 4 and a half months. His adminstrative knowledge and experience is what?
Yes he served one term as a state senator. I believe he voted mostly “present”. How nice he had the assistance of Bill Ayers in launching his political career.
by the way Josephine, Rush only prints what Obama says.
Bethany 1:55PM
Thank you. I simply want to know the guy’s qualification, not his personality traits. His educational background is fine but what qualifies him to be the leader of the US?
I think this is a very straightforward question and I can’t seem to get an answer to it.
Mary, I’m not sure what you’re asking. What qualifies anyone to be the Leader of the US?
Things like temperment, education, intelligence, etc. Personality traits ARE the qualifications we’re looking for. If I asked you what qualified Bush to be President and you told me what you thought did it, how would you answer if I kept asking?
(by the way, THREE terms as a state senator). (also by the way, voting “present” is the way they vote often “no” in the Illinois Senate)
Hal : (also by the way, voting “present” is the way they vote often “no” in the Illinois Senate)
Yes, when they don’t want to be held politically accountable for their position. Thanks for reiterating what a coward he has been when it comes to being clear on his positions.
DeeL, that’s not why they do it. But, doesn’t matter anymore.
Carder 1:41PM
The biggest red flag for me was the adulation of the masses. Sociopaths are among the most cunning, manipulative, and charasmatic people on earth, and people respond as such, Whether its on a personal basis or en masse. This is what can make them so dangerous.
They are people of high intelliegence.
Ted Bundy was a classis example. Incredibly manipulative and charasmatic.
His not so subtle “finger” to Hillary and McCain, along with showing the guy has no class, also displays a meanness, another side the public doesn’t see behind that huge smile.
His treatment of people who might hinder him politically. Throwing his minister “under the bus” is one example. Sociopaths view people as objects, to be used or discarded as they see fit. He would have no more twinge of conscience about this than he would tossing out his garbage.
His lying. He didn’t know what his minister preached, he barely knew Bill Ayers.
Those are just my observations Carder. For me the biggest red flag is the first, his incredible charisma and ability to mesmerize people.
I have had a friend for years who I have come to realize is a sociopath. While I maintain a friendship with him I am always aware I am dealing with a sociopath and act accordingly.
Most Americans don’t agree with GWBush’s extreme right-to-life position either.
We should have a POTUS who is every bit as pro-choice as GWB is RTL.
This is what the GOP gets for scheming to overturn Roe/Wade. Blame Ronald Reagan, he started it.
Voting present is just another way of acknowledging that it’s just all WAY above his pay grade.
And won’t it just be dandy as he tries to break vodka on the rocks with the Russians who have announced that they are now placing missiles near Poland?
The Court Jester was right: It hasn’t even been 24 hours and they’re already testing the non-existent mettle of this guy.
Oh well. Now that we’re socialist, we should be able to find some common ground with the Muscovites.
Hal,
Senate terms are two years in Illinois? That’s interesting. They’re six in my state.
DeeL, 3:30PM
Thank you for pointing that out.
TSF,
That debate is older than Reagan’s presidency. He didn’t start anything.
Hal,
Don’t be ridiculous, that’s exactly why they do it. And he did it so Emil Jones could make him a senator and put him on the road toward a presidential run. Every vote he cast (or failed to cast) was calculated to advance his political career. But as you say, the point is moot. As I said before, I truly pray that you are right and we are wrong. I don’t believe that’s the case, but this is one time where I would gladly eat my words.
Thank you, Mary. That’s what I thought.
At this point, I support whatever actions Israel decides to take to protect their nation, given that half of the American electorate just sold them out.
If they want to nuke out Iran’s potential, then so be it. Come what may.
Admittedly, I am BAFFLED that Jews in our country voted for B. Hussein 2 to 1.
Wasn’t Auschwitz enough?
Mr. Obama cast 4,000 votes in the Illinois Senate and used the present vote to protest bills that he believed had been drafted unconstitutionally or as part of a broader legislative strategy.
130 “present” votes.
Hal 3:25PM
If you asked for George Bush’s credentials I would say
Harvard business school
First Lieutenant in the Alabama and Texas air national guard.
Businessman
Governor of Texas for 5 and a half years.
I think that’s pretty straight forward.
Mary and Carder,
I agree with your insights. It’s creepy. Where Chris Matthews gets tingles up his leg, I get chills down my spine.
Admittedly, I am BAFFLED that Jews in our country voted for B. Hussein 2 to 1.
Wasn’t Auschwitz enough?
Posted by: carder at November 5, 2008 3:46 PM
Another drama queen? Obama = Auschwitz????
Hal,
Why didn’t he just vote “no”?
Mary, there are articles all over the internet about why they do it the way they do in Illinois. Sometimes to help out friendly Republicans, sometimes because you don’t really oppose the idea, but you can’t vote for the specific language. This way you are not saying you oppose it necessarily, just can’t vote for it the way it has been presented. They understand that in Illinois.
Carder 3:39PM
Imagine those nasty Russians! I can’t imagine the tyrants and dictators of the world knowing an inexperienced novice when they see one.
Reminds me of the trouble Kruschev made when Kennedy was in power. He had expressed his condolences to the American people that he was our president.
But if one sits down the the world’s tyrants and talks nice, it shouldn’t be a problem. Shades of Neville Chamberlain.
Sure Hal, that’s why he did it. We’ll go with that one. :)
All the nut jobs in the middle east are doing a happy dance at the prospect of diminished (eliminated?) US support of Israel under President Obama, but Carder’s just a drama queen.
Carder 3:46PM
I’m sorry to say I’m not. This is just an example of his sociopathy in my opinion. His ability to so captivate people they only too readily overlook the truth about him. People fall all over themselves “explaining” him.
Hal:Mary, there are articles all over the internet about why they do it the way they do in Illinois. Sometimes to help out friendly Republicans, sometimes because you don’t really oppose the idea, but you can’t vote for the specific language. This way you are not saying you oppose it necessarily, just can’t vote for it the way it has been presented. They understand that in Illinois.
No, what we understand in Illinois is that we have a sleazy political machine in Chicago and another sleazy political machine in Cook County and they have a political stranglehold on our General Assembly. It’s all pay for play in Illlinois. Obama played nice with the king makers, kept his record nice and sanitized in the GA and Daly put his boy in the White House just like his daddy did in 1960.
We always joke about welcoming people to Mayor Daly’s Illinois. Now maybe it will be Mayor Daly’s United Socialist States of America.
Now that they have control of the oval office and both houses, the Democrats will have to put up or shut up. Any problems that remain after the first day of February will be laid squarely on their doorstep. It ALL belongs to them now, and I for one intend to hold their feet to the fire for as long as they control our government.
Posted by: Doyle Chadwick at November 5, 2008 8:46 AM
OH but didn’t you hear Doyle: Obama’s already saying that it’s gonna take 2 years to make a difference and change things!
————————————————-
Another drama queen? Obama = Auschwitz????
Posted by: hal at November 5, 2008 3:52 PM
under Obama’s dictatorship the victims will far outnumber those of the holocaust. Abortion victims alone will be at least 6 million assuming the number of abortions stays constant.
But if one sits down the the world’s tyrants and talks nice, it shouldn’t be a problem. Shades of Neville Chamberlain.
Posted by: Mary at November 5, 2008 4:02 PM
You’re missing the point. you sit down and talk tough, not nice.
The “he inspires people, therefore he is Hitler” is kind of a disturbing, cynical way to look at our leaders. What you would rather have a total uninspiring person try to unite people just so you know they aren’t hitler?
I don’t happen to think that the majority of people in the US share a prolife view as we know it. I think most people are living their lives today with the idea that their bodies are there own and they can do whatever they want with them – even if causes death to themselves (hence suicide laws) or death to their children (hence support for abortion).
This idea of bodily autonomy is inculcated daily in our books, movies, schools and laws. The notion of a sacrifical love has been gone from most areas of our society for decades. It’s even reflected in the way we treat the poor. Instead of each of us taking responsibility and sharing our wealth, we expect the government to do it. And it a person falls on hard times, it all their own damn fault.
Maybe this modus operandi has to play itself out to the bitter end.
Hal 4:25PM
Right Hal. Dream on. They better know you’re as dirty as they are too, and ready to back up your tough talk with firepower.
Liz,
Thanks for your blessing. Homeschooling is a great blessing in my life. It has decreased the levels of stress and anxiety in both mine and daughter’s and my life. I avoided it for years, out of fear I couldn’t do it. But we’re having a blast and her competency has improved. I pray you have the opportunity to experience it.
Well, Mary, maybe I’m a bit off topic here but it didn’t come as any surprise this morning I read that as soon as the election was over and Obama’s in – Russia states it will be placing missiles in the Balkans.
They KNOW Obama has no backbone – he’s a liberal who rationalizes every move he makes.
PIP,
There’s a difference between inspiration and mesmerization. Obama supporters appear to be more the latter.
PIP,
Inspiring people is one thing, overlooking someone’s history and character because you see them as some kind of savior is quite another.
His questionable associations. Who cares?
His desire to destroy the coal industry. Who cares?
His raising taxes in time of economic downturn. Economic disaster. Who cares?
His talk of a “civilian security force” gets him applause. What briliance! It makes my skin crawl.
His elitist contempt for “bitter clingers”. who cares?
His association with anti-semites. Who cares?
Crowds becoming orgasmic when he blows his nose for heaven’s sake. Yes I actually saw that happen.
PIP, that’s where I see Americans falling for a smooth talking demagogue as did the German people. And like the German people I’m convinced it will lead us to our own destruction.
Patricia 4:42PM
The world tyrants know when they have an inexperienced novice. If we can’t see Obama for what he is, and isn’t, they certainly can.
Patricia, 4:24PM
You mean a man who can lower the ocean levels and heal the planet needs 2 years to make a difference and change things! What will you tell me next, that he doesn’t walk on water?
yeah, sorry Mary!
If McCain had just been elected and he made that statement, the MSM would be ALL over it!
What gets me is that 48% of Americans under Obama’s economic policies will not be paying taxes. Do you really have that many impoverished people in your country? Almost half the tax base?
Hey, pro-lifers! Why are you bothering to engage the pro-abortion scum on here? They’re doing what they always do – wasting our time with their dishonest nonsense. I don’t try to have serious discussions with pathetic liars. It’s completely ridiculous.
This election was all about mindless anti-Bush hate. Mindless hate from the left combined with disenchantment with the Republican Party on the right to produce failures of pro-life proposals at the polls. Don’t read too much into it, because that’s all it really was. ANY Democrat could have won this election. They could have run an actual donkey for office and he would have beaten McCain. Why? Because of mindless hate.
So the haters are in control… for now. They’ll have four or eight years. They’ll eff up the country and we’ll work to protect it from them. That’s all.
Anyway, I hope you’re all going to the March for Life so we can show Barry Carter what we think of his pro-abortion policies.
“This election was all about mindless anti-Bush hate.”
Not so mindless.
And, are you supposed to be calling us “scum?”
whatever, like HisMan,I need a break from the haters here. I’ll post my final (for now) thoughts in a few minutes.
There is far more risk of tyranny from the right in America than tyranny from the left. I’m against both. At least Obama won’t try to have the government pry into the bedrooms of American citizens.
Ironically, the abortion rate could decrease markedly under Obama, not increase as some one claimed absurdly on this website.
I came to this website today to find some other pro-lifers that are also sad today. It is amazing how many far leftists need to hear themselves speak in a place that they shouldn’t even be. Gloating is overrated. I will not stoop to the levels the left went to in an effort to disgrace President Bush, but it won’t be an easy road for sure. Obama is so wrong on so many levels. I think people have too much time on their hands when they come to harrass. I will be on the call to Fr. Pavone tonight.
John Lewandowski 5:21 PM
“Because of mindless hate.”
I see you bringing that, more than anybody else.
PIP, Hal,
We’ve been on this blog long enough to know that I don’t flippantly compare individuals to Hitler.
That’s not what I posted.
Clear?
The “disturbing” point I was making is that here we have a prez-elect who is on the record wining and dining with PLO-loving characters, the same PLO that is set on getting theirs with Israel, and the majority of Jews in this country have pretty much confirmed with their vote what Hal claims: “I don’t think he meant it literally.”
There is such blatant writing on the wall here. I’m not Jewish and I get it, for crying out loud.
Tiny, not-a-serious-threat Iran will have their missiles built, aimed and ready to go sooner than we know it and Israel has already stated they will lauch preemptive strikes when necessary. Do you expect them to wait for B. Hussein to vote present?
Read an article a few days ago, the Jerusalem Post or something similar, that the majority of American citizens living in Israel supported McCain.
What a bunch of drama queens THEY are.
Hello Eileen F.,
I am sad. I was thinking today that if McCain had won I certainly wouldn’t be “in your face” about it to the Obama fans.
I will not lose heart. I will not give up on the innocents. I will continue to tell my story of abortion regret. I will pray.
The Obamatrons are dancing on Rowan’s grave, on Shanice’s grave, on Tennessee’s grave. On Marla Cardamone’s grave and Laura Smith’s grave and Edrica Goode’s grave.
The really sad thing is how many of them KNOW it and just don’t care.
I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just.
And reality — up until 1976 it was legal to kill Mormons in Missouri. When was the government in the wrong?
“Read an article a few days ago, the Jerusalem Post or something similar, that the majority of American citizens living in Israel supported McCain.”
Nothing wrong with supporting McCain. Does not equal yelling about the sky falling if Obama wins. Everyone has a preference. Some, however, need to freak out if they don’t get their preference.
So, I wanted to stick around long enough to see the election play out. But, as some have noticed, I have work to do. I’ll check in now and then. Wish you all the best. Please, wait until Obama actually gets in office and does something before you despair. You might be pleasantly surprised.
Eileen F: I came to this website today to find some other pro-lifers that are also sad today. It is amazing how many far leftists need to hear themselves speak in a place that they shouldn’t even be.
A website need not only be for glad-handing, preaching to the choir, and “fellowship” with those of similar ilk. Do you really want Pro-Lifers to be in a “vacuum” apart from everybody else?
…..
Gloating is overrated.
Agreed, but we haven’t really seen much of that here yesterday nor today, not nearly as much, I daresay, as it would be had McCain won.
…..
I will not stoop to the levels the left went to in an effort to disgrace President Bush, but it won’t be an easy road for sure.
Bush Jr. did it to himself.
If you want to talk about “an effort to disgrace,” look at all the crazy stuff that was bandied about re Obama.
Patricia, 4:42PM
A co-worker of mine who’s son lives in Europe has told her the Europeans are ecstatic over Obama. Finally the US will have the prestige it deserves. Hey Europeans, how do you feel about being eyeball to eyeball with Russian missiles since Obama doesn’t seem to make the Russians shake in their boots? Want to be right in the middle of a Russian challenge to the United States?
Mary,
Just saw a clip of a CNN chat where one of the commentators said that B. Hussein’s position as commander-in-chief should include “hugging” the nation. You know, that affirmation hug that everything is going to be unitedly ok.
Not kidding.
Putin must be ecstatic.
Mary: Well anyone who has been over to Europe lately tells me the culture is depraved and is the “culture of death” exemplified.
When my daughter was corresponding with a gr 8 from the north part of England I had to ban her from viewing this girl’s profile on MSN. Many of the profiles were soft porn with icons that would be more suitable for a playboy website. (Where the heck are the parents?)
A coworker told me that her husband went over to Germany earlier this year and was appalled at the way men treat women. Sexual innuendo and other types of behaviour that this woman’s husband was sure would pass for sexual harassment in Candian society were the norm.
My take: the extremely liberal sexual attitudes rampant abortion and legal prostition have destroyed the beauty of European culture. The US is considered very prudish. They probably see Obama as liberalizing America.
Fr Pavone’s webcast in 6 minutes. ; )
Carder 7:32PM
So he’s supposed to give us a hug as the Russians move their missiles into Poland?
I think it likely he is laughing himself stupid. This is on a par with Richard Gere asking everyone at the Academy Awards to concentrate along with him and send “vibes” to the Chinese gov’t on behalf of the Tibetans. The Chinese must have had the biggest laughs of their lives.
Carder,
I meant it is likely Putin is laughing himself stupid.
I want to say that I have been listening to Fr. Pavone’s conference call and it is wonderful. In their last 40 days for life, they actually saved 500 babies. It is heartening to know of the work that is going on. I will disregard those that came here to taunt and disregard life. I also will not make light of Obama’s Presidency and how the country was ready for him to serve. The pendulum will swing back for it always does. In the meantime I will not stoop to the nastiness I have seen with the left in the past 8 years. I will call him President Obama and I will be respectful of the office. I don’t think I will reply to individual taunters here because I have more important things to do. I do meet and see people in the mainstream all the time. I think that those that do not value life imagine we sit around and only pray the rosary in church. However, pro-lifers are out and about like all the rest of you. I would say that our main difference is that we don’t consider life an inconvenience, surely sometimes a challenge- but always a blessing. God Bless Your Day.
Yeah, it’s getting a bit hysterical.
Fantastic, my post was deleted.
Rae’s post wasn’t offensive.
I guess “fricking'” is offensive.
Eileen F.,
Thank you for your thoughts.
Apparently!
Ann coulter’s latest:
a must read:
Last night was truly a historic occasion: For only the second time in her adult life, Michelle Obama was proud of her country!
http://www.anncoulter.com/
DeeL,
Thank you.
I think you are right about the “present” votes. Political maneuvering. “No” is “no”. “Present” is pretty much a cop out. See below.
. . . . . . . . .
Hal,
Looks like he was trying to make his record look better than it really was on pro-choice issues. NPR is a liberal radio station.
Excerpt From
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=18348437
….To register a vote in the Illinois General Assembly, lawmakers have a choice of three buttons on their desk. The “yes” button is green. The “no” button is red, and the “present” button is yellow, says Rich Miller, who writes and publishes The Capitol Fax, a daily newsletter and blog on Illinois politics.
“There’s a saying in Springfield that there’s a reason why the present button is yellow,” Miller says.
But Miller says that not all “present” votes are cowardly, including those cast by then-state Sen. Obama.
“After having put some thought into it, I don’t think that Barack Obama was necessarily a coward for voting present on those bills. In fact, I think he believed that he was doing the right thing, because something, in his mind, might have been unconstitutional,” Miller says.
Miller points out that, at times, Obama was the only lawmaker voting “present” on bills winning near unanimous support, even on issues he supported and on one he sponsored.
Chris Mooney is a political science professor at the University of Illinois, Springfield.
“A person as cerebral as Sen. Obama might be prone to such a thing, thinking things through a little too carefully,” Mooney says.
Mooney and other state capitol watchers and players say Illinois lawmakers often vote “present” as part of a larger party or issue bloc strategy.
Pam Sutherland is the president and CEO of the Illinois Planned Parenthood Council. She says Obama voted “present” at least seven times to provide cover to other abortion-rights supporters on such bills as the “Born Alive Infant Protection Act.”
“Senators didn’t want to vote pro-choice anymore, because they knew these were being used against them in their campaigns,” Sutherland said.….
. . . . . . . . . . .
(The title and author for the excerpt above)
ELECTION 2008
Examining Obama’s ‘Present’ Votes in Illinois
by David Schaper
Jan 23, 2008
All Things Considered
What you would rather have a total uninspiring person try to unite people just so you know they aren’t hitler?
Ha, PIP! I suck at art so I guess I’d better lay low. I mean, I wouldn’t want my total inability to draw a convincing bowl of fruit to somehow be mistaken for a desire to kill millions of Jews.
IMO we should really be keeping an eye on this website: http://www.catsthatlooklikehitler.com
Kitler may already be among us, meowing evil disguised as inspiration, as we speak.
Eileen F.
Great post. I just finished listening to the teleconference. It helped get things back into perspective. I particularly loved what David Bereit had to say, especially the reminder that in the past 40 days, a minimum of 543 babies were saved and one “clinic” is now closing! A reminder that when God closes a door, he opens a window. And so we continue as we have, one baby, one heart at a time.
Janet,
That’s too funny about the “Present” button actually being yellow! I did a legislative internship with a state senator in the early 80’s, and I don’t remember seeing those. Perhaps they weren’t there yet, in that technological stone age. Ahhh. Illinois politics, you gotta love it.
On the upside, Mr. Obama will no longer be my senator!!!!! No more condescending form letters from him telling me that “although we fundamentally disagree on this issue” he does appreciate hearing from me. Yadda, yadda, yadda, blah, blah, blah. Downside, who knows what lower than pond-scum parasite Blagojevich is gonna dredge up from the cesspool? Who knows, maybe he’ll find a way to appoint himself.
Alexandra! THAT WAS AWESOME!
Kitlers are so cute…
And now for some UBER CUTE: SHIBA INU PUPPIES!
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/shiba-inu-puppy-cam
“IMO we should really be keeping an eye on this website: http://www.catsthatlooklikehitler.com“
HAHA those guys are a menace!
WOW.
I checked in to see how you folks were handling it – wasn’t planning on posting, but I have to say, the dramatics and hysterics going on are far beyond what I would have pictured seeing here in my wildest dreams.
How silly are you all going to feel when, just like every other presidency, nothing major really changes?
Are you all just really hoping this leads to the Rapture? Not being snarky – legit question. It’s the only thing that explains the level of hysteria.
No Shep, don’t want anarchy or rapture. Just don;t want more Planned Parenthood abortuaries popping up all over under cover of darkness like they did in Aurora IL.last year.
And Robert Berger, you have got to be nuts if you think they are promting and building abortuaries in cities and towns all over America ibecause they expect fewer numbers of abortions.
Posted by: Robert Berger at November 5, 2008 5:45 PM
Posted by: Mary at November 5, 2008 4:44 PM
His questionable associations. Who cares?
(Well, if you mean..say, Bill Ayers.. well, Obama was eight when all that stuff went down with Ayers. What has happened in the last .. say, 25 years with Ayers? He’s a very respected professor and board member at the University of Illinois Chicago.. a pretty prestigious school. I don’t find that questionable at all. They met while serving on a committee together. That committee also consisted of Republicans.)
His desire to destroy the coal industry. Who cares?
(Tell me where exactly he says those words. If we see him say “I desire to destroy the coal industry” then we’d believe it.)
His raising taxes in time of economic downturn. Economic disaster. Who cares?
(He’s raising taxes on people who are well off. If those people have been living within their means, they will do fine. Maybe they’ll have to buy a Volvo instead of a Mercedes next year? I don’t know. I can say personally that my family will get a significant tax increase, but I know he won’t give up Mercedes.)
His talk of a “civilian security force” gets him applause. What briliance! It makes my skin crawl.
His elitist contempt for “bitter clingers”. who cares?
(Have you heard him speak of this since the one time he mentioned it?)
His association with anti-semites. Who cares?
(That anti-semite he was linked to… you do know that Senator McCain gave that guy a little bit more than $400,000..? I’m sure you knew that though. I’m also sure you saw the episode of Keith Olbermann when Olbermann asked Michael Goldfarb who Obama hangs around with.. if you don’t believe there is only one, watch the clip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2VEg7hip1w
…. it doesn’t start ’til the 50 second mark.)
Truthseeker, let me get this straight man, you are justifying this hysteria by saying you’re afraid of ….the same thing that happened under pro life Bush? Heh. Interesting.
Shep,
I for one will be pleasantly surprised and greatly relieved if he turns out to be just another president. Like I told Hal, I would love to eat crow on this one!
As for the rapture. Nope, sorry. Faithful Catholic. We don’t really have the same understanding of the end times as our Protestant brothers and sisters. Just very nervous about electing a poorly vetted man, who by federal standards should not even qualify for security clearance, to the most powerful elected position in the world. I’m probably just a drama queen like Carder, LOL.
The Doug defense, of always thinking that no one has a argument against him, they just think they do.
yllas, that’s silly. Hal has seen through you, like just about everybody else.
There are plenty of arguments on both sides – no doubt about it.
Posted by: Doug at November 5, 2008 3:11 PM
Do you realize “your words” I have appropriated, is a mockery of you Doug? You know, the paraphrase of the “no one has a argument against him, they just think they do”.
You have just castigated yourself as being “silly”.
And actually Dogma Doug, your projecting upon me, what everyone at this site has written ad nauseum to you, as being able to see through you Doug.
And you must realize by now, that no one has a good argument against you Doug, they just think they do.
And your point is dude?
Not realizing yourself in my mockery of you, dude? Again?
But, being that you work in a industry that is totally fascist, does make one unable to see your cruel industry as a source of denying a human right to not freeze to death, as a minimum.
Energy should be a human right, that can’t be denied by the cruel fascist industry of energy, and the billions in profit taking from the desperate humans who depend on not being froze.
The taking from the poor, and giving their meager wages to increase the wealth of the fascist Doug’s of the world. Who then use that collection of those meager wages, to jaunt about the world, abusing citizens of other nations with his booty, and crow about some wine that Doug swished about his palate, which ends in a attempt of high Epicurian silliness, written by Doug.
It began with the murderering God of Doug’s youth, and blooms into taking any matter which Doug wants or needs in life, by justifying in his mind what his youth told him is objectively true; God is a murderer from the beginning and nothing I do is worst then that God from which I still imitate in my life, as a fascist worker, and pro-murderer of innocent human life.
Truthseeker, let me get this straight man, you are justifying this hysteria by saying you’re afraid of ….the same thing that happened under pro life Bush? Heh. Interesting.
Posted by: Shep at November 5, 2008 11:58 PM
No Shep, I am afraid that an Obama presidency means a federal funding bonanza for Planned Parenthood and they use those fuds not only to put up abortuaries but also to tie up things like parental notification laws in the courts. Also, I am really concerned that under Obama the anti-life dems will try and pass legislation that will allow fedral funds (my tax dolars) to be used to pay for abortions. That would be a untolerable to my conscience if the work of my hands went to pay for women to submit to getting their babies torn from their wombs. It just ain;t right by me and I couldn’t tolerate it.
“And now for some UBER CUTE: SHIBA INU PUPPIES!”
Rae,
My neihbor had a Shiba Inu dog, he was a tough little runt, he use to terrorize my german-shepard-mix.
Jasper, my fav’s from Ann’s column:
This was such an enormous Democratic year that even John Murtha won his congressional seat in Pennsylvania after calling his constituents racists. It turns out they’re not racists — they’re retards. Question: What exactly would one have to say to alienate Pennsylvanians? That Joe Paterno should retire?
Sarah Palin is destined to give birth to a new movement. That’s why the Democrats are trying to kill her. And Arnold Schwarzenegger is involved somehow, too. Good Lord, I’m tired.
Haha, Patricia, saying that JoePa should retire DOES alienate me. :)
Although it doesn’t help that I’m sitting in the heart of PennState right now. GO NITTANY LIONS!
Josephine, 11:32PM
Please, you can’t be this naive.
Obama was not 8y/o when he graced Bill Ayers’ living room with his presence for his political launching in 1995. Now I don’t care if he was there for a political launching or an afternoon tea, he obviously knew and was friendly with both Ayers and his wife Bernadine Dohrn, once called “the most dangerous woman in America” by J Edgar Hoover.
Tell me Josephine, do you hold events of any kind in the living rooms of people you barely know? Do you do the same in your own living room for people you barely know?
A repected professor? This guy is an unrepentent terrorist who has written books, so Obama can’t be as blissfully ignorant as he claims. Ayers dedicated one of his books to Sirhan Sirhan, the killer of Democrat icon Robert Kennedy. But I suppose that doesn’t matter since Senator Kennedy was killed over 40 years ago.
Ayers was a bombmaker. Some of his cohorts blew themselves to hell using Ayers’ recipe for bombs. They planned to plant nail bombs at a Fort Dix dance, killing both soldiers and civilians.
Yeah Josephine, Ayers is a real prince among men.
Concerning the coal industry, kindly refer to Bethany’s 12:32PM post 11/5.
Raising taxes only on the well off? Let me give you an Economics 101 lesson. In time of economic downturn you let people keep their money and spend as much as possible!
Who do you think will buy the most goods and services and keep people in business producing those goods and services. Bingo! Those eeeeevil “rich” people. They may have to drive a volvo instead of a Mercedes? What about the working people who produce the Mercedes? You know, the guy with a lunchbox, a mortgage, and a family. They get laid off.
My favorite example is when singer Madonna bought a palatial home in Florida. I remember people who thought this was a little much. I said, well let’s see, Madonna needs a household staff, she needs security people, she needs groundskeepers, she needs decorators and furnishings, she pays property taxes which pay city employees. Easy to see how Madonna is generating lots of employment. I say let her keep her millions and buy all the houses she wants.
You tax corporations they take their business elsewhere, like overseas. You tax “small business” making x amount of dollars guess what, they lay people off.
Also Obama can’t seem to keep straight who the “rich” are. It varies from $100,000 to $250,000. Whatever Josephine, increased taxes are passed by business onto, you guessed it, you!
Trust me, the middle class will be hit.
About the civilian security forces. Josephine you should be concerned he even said it! Obviously he is giving it consideration. Oh he won’t trumpet blast it, that might make people nervous. It will be a subtle suggestion and action here and there.
About the bitter clingers, maybe he’s just more careful not to be recorded saying it again.
The anti-semite is his pastor as well as his pastor’s association with Louis Farakkhan, to him he issued an award. In case you’re unaware, Farakkhan referred to the Jewish faith as a “gutter religion”. Certainly Obama should have found this repugnant but obviously didn’t since he sat in the church for 20 years. Oh that’s right, he never heard a thing his pastor said! By the way Josephine if you believe that I’ve got some ocean front property in Wyoming to sell you.
This other character you’re talking about, Kahlid Rashidi, I think there was a video of Obama at his birthday party and Obama had a personal relationship with him. I understand McCain gave the money for elections in Gaza or the West Bank. Whatever McCain’s relationship(s)does that excuse Obama? Isn’t he supposed to be above all this?
Please Josephine open your eyes and ears. Obama is telling us exactly what he has planned for us.
Patricia,
Obama said he was targeting the Pennsylvania economy by intentionally attempting to bankrupt the coal industry, and yet the state went for him. I do believe that the good, hard working people of Pennsylvania probably voted for McCain. I suspect it is the moronic youth, who pay little or no taxes, have no understanding or memory of the oppressive USSR, and who desperately wanted to be “part of history” with their first vote that foisted this tragedy upon us. That includes the retention of Murtha. Very few of them have given a thought to what this might mean for them once they get out of college and are actually earning money and paying taxes. Duh! Oh, well, “stupid is as stupid does”.
Of course, the Black Panthers at the polls, threatening Republican voters with billy clubs was probably helpful too. : )
DeeL 8:20am
Just another indication of Obama’s sociopathic charm. People will follow their “messiah” to their own destruction, just as the Germans did.
Mary, I’ve said it before and I’m saying it again…you are my hero!!
Comparing the election of Obama to Hitler’s rise to power and election?
Unbelievable. You anti-choicers have really gone off the deep end. What weed have you been smoking ?
Like him or not, Obama is no demon or ogre. And if you consult the REAL left-wing blogs and websites, Obama is much too CONSERVATIVE for them. Pretty ironic.
The conservative public in America has been swallowing all the lies and wild exaggerations about Obama like yokels gawking at the fraudulent wares of a travelling quack selling snake oil.
And you think Obama fans are gullible ?
Comparing the election of Obama to Hitler’s rise to power and election?
Unbelievable. You anti-choicers have really gone off the deep end. What weed have you been smoking ?
Like him or not, Obama is no demon or ogre. And if you consult the REAL left-wing blogs and websites, Obama is much too CONSERVATIVE for them. Pretty ironic.
The conservative public in America has been swallowing all the lies and wild exaggerations about Obama like yokels gawking at the fraudulent wares of a travelling quack selling snake oil.
And you think Obama fans are gullible ?
Comparing the election of Obama to Hitler’s rise to power and election?
Unbelievable. You anti-choicers have really gone off the deep end. What weed have you been smoking ?
Like him or not, Obama is no demon or ogre. And if you consult the REAL left-wing blogs and websites, Obama is much too CONSERVATIVE for them. Pretty ironic.
The conservative public in America has been swallowing all the lies and wild exaggerations about Obama like yokels gawking at the fraudulent wares of a travelling quack selling snake oil.
And you think Obama fans are gullible ?
Comparing the election of Obama to Hitler’s rise to power and election?
Unbelievable. You anti-choicers have really gone off the deep end. What weed have you been smoking ?
Like him or not, Obama is no demon or ogre. And if you consult the REAL left-wing blogs and websites, Obama is much too CONSERVATIVE for them. Pretty ironic.
The conservative public in America has been swallowing all the lies and wild exaggerations about Obama like yokels gawking at the fraudulent wares of a travelling quack selling snake oil.
And you think Obama fans are gullible ?
Comparing the election of Obama to Hitler’s rise to power and election?
Unbelievable. You anti-choicers have really gone off the deep end. What weed have you been smoking ?
Like him or not, Obama is no demon or ogre. And if you consult the REAL left-wing blogs and websites, Obama is much too CONSERVATIVE for them. Pretty ironic.
The conservative public in America has been swallowing all the lies and wild exaggerations about Obama like yokels gawking at the fraudulent wares of a travelling quack selling snake oil.
And you think Obama fans are gullible ?
Bethany,
Thank you! You;ve made my day.
Josephine,
McCain was chairman of the International Republican Institute which distributed a $450,000 grant to study sociopolitical attitudes (stupid waste of money, as if we don’t know what the attitudes are) in the West Bank. He did not have personal ties to Khalidi.
Obama, on the other hand, became friends with Rashidi in 1996, while they both worked for the University of Chicago, Obama as a law professor, Rashidi a guest lecturer. They built a personal relationship and Khalidi, like Obama’s other terrorist friend Ayers, hosted a political fundraiser for him in 2000, when Obama was running for the US House of Representatives.
In 2001, the Woods Fund, which was set up to provide assistance to disadvantaged neighborhoods in Chicago, began donating money, in the form of grants, to the Arab American Action Network, another “community organizing” group of which Khalidi’s wife was president.
AAAN is an Arab advocacy group that has worked closely with Mexico in an attempt to open US borders (to terrorists?) and force US taxpayers to provide services to illegal immigrants.
From 1976-1982, Khalidi was the director of the PLO’s (terror organization) press agency WAFA in Beirut, which was, in case you don’t know, when and where they bombed our Marine barracks.
Khalidi is openly anti-Israel and anti Jew and, as with all his terrorist friends, Obama shows poor judgement in maintaining a personal relationship with him, yet there he was at his birthday party. And therein lies but a brief explanation of the huge difference.
And Ayers is not a reformed, respectable citizen, he is unabashedly unrepentant to this day. I will concede that the University of Illinois has propped him up as a distinguished professor, but that is only because he is the typical left wing, Marxist that elitist “educators” (indoctrination specialists) love to embrace.
Do you seriously not believe you can tell a lot about a man by the company he keeps?
Robert Berger,
The lefties are only claiming he’s too conservative because he ran for president as a moderate, which of course is a big fat lie. He’s as moderate as Mao.
Robert Berger,
No I don’t think Obama fans are gullible. I think they are overwhelmed by his charisma. Mesmerized in fact. Obama is no ogre or demon certainly, but he is a very charasmatic man who people follow to the exclusion of all else. Just as Germans did Hitler in Nazi Germany.
Obama threatens the coal industry. The coal states vote for him! He condescendingly attacks the residents of these states as bitter clingers. Just a slip. It can happen to any messiah.
He talks of a civilian security force. He’s applauded. Oh, he doesn’t mean it. I mean, only dictators have their own police forces, right?
Obama openly associates with anti-Semitics. Jews vote for him 2 to 1. Israelis are nervous.
He associates with an unrepentent terrorist. Oh come on, Obama just waved to the guy when he took out his garbage. Obama also launched his political career in the Ayers’ living room, but, well don’t we all hold events in the living rooms of people we barely know?
Obama as a US senator consults political fixer Tony Rezko, who was under federal indictment, about buying a home. Don’t most people consult real estate agents? However Obama does admit it was “bone-headed”. Actually he got caught. And besides, real estates agents must have been on a major nationwide strike at the time.
RB, I have to wonder what Obama supporters are smoking when they give their blind allegiance to a man like this no matter what he says, does or stands for.
Mary,
They know all this and they
Dang, it cut off half my post.
They know all this and they heart their guy anyway. Love really is blind.
The Doug defense, of always thinking that no one has a argument against him, they just think they do.
“yllas, that’s silly. Hal has seen through you, like just about everybody else.”
“There are plenty of arguments on both sides – no doubt about it.”
Do you realize “your words” I have appropriated, is a mockery of you Doug?
Well, you lie about things, and then pretend it’s what others have said. If you think that’s “mockery” then that’s on you. You’re not appropriating anything, you’re just being silly.
If you were honest in quoting and using things in context, it’d be at least a little different….
…..
no one has a good argument against you Doug, they just think they do.
So you say, but yours is not the only opinion about it. People that make different valuations will often begin with different premises, and “good” is in the eye of the beholder. It’s silly for you to presume any differently.
Do I think that anybody has a good enough argument against abortion (to viability, to be clear) that we as a society would take away the freedom that women have in the matter of ending unwanted pregnancies? No.
Same as I don’t think there is a good enough reason for not allowing women to continue wanted pregnancies.
Doyle: Now that they have control of the oval office and both houses, the Democrats will have to put up or shut up. Any problems that remain after the first day of February will be laid squarely on their doorstep. It ALL belongs to them now, and I for one intend to hold their feet to the fire for as long as they control our government.
Doyle, you’re smart enough that I imagine you’re kidding, somewhat.
Either way, there indeed will be a lot of what you describe – yes, just having something be “on one’s watch” is a heavy thing.
yllas: Energy should be a human right, that can’t be denied by the cruel fascist industry of energy, and the billions in profit taking from the desperate humans who depend on not being froze.
In the midst of your incoherent ranting, do you actually believe this?
As I was discussing with Ken, there is a mixture of sentiment in the US – we’re not going to “let orphans freeze,” for example, as stated policy anyway, and most people don’t get too bummed out with their tax Dollars going for such, but at the same time “there ain’t no such thing as a free lunch,” so where do we draw the line?
We all don’t draw it at the same place, but by and large it’s there for all of us.
Obama is no ogre or demon
Ha! Pretty good, Mary.
…..
Obama threatens the coal industry. The coal states vote for him!
This is new to me. What’s he really proposing that “threatens the coal industry”?
It’s not like we’re going to quit burning coal, and a LOT of coal, for a long time.
Doug, 10:26am
Please refer to Bethany’s post of 11/5 12:32PM.
Don’t be so sure Doug.
I wonder if McCain supporters would be as gracious as most Obama supporters had they won.
“as with all his terrorist friend”
I’m going to have to use a phrase I don’t use often- “lol”… did you watch that video clip? you’re apparently just as clueless as Goldfarb. Are you really saying that you are, apparently smarter and a better judge of character.. not only than the president, but the like, every university minus the Christian ones?
Will you find an example of a “terrorist” that’s done something within the last thirty years? Aren’t Christians supposed to believe people can change? I sure do see a lot of this “he did this 40 years ago, he’s a bad person!”
Mary, okay – valid point, and kudos to Bethany for posting it.
“they’re going to be charged a huge sum for all that greenhouse gas that’s being emitted”
What I question is the “huge sum” part.
I know guys that work in power plants, and there is already so much done for pollution control (that it just about boggles the mind). One guy, used to be a co-worker of mine, said that 2/3 of everything in the plant has to do with pollution control. Whew.
Heretofore that has not been “greenhouse gas” control, however.
It may be that some power plants collect, solidify, even inject into the ground, rather than release the CO2, etc., so I doubt they would be charged for emission like the “normal” plants now apparently would be. That process is being worked on.
Aside from that, the “huge sum” is doubtful, IMO. Coal is just too big, and the price increases in people’s electric bills would provoke enough ire that I don’t think it’s politically possible in the US.
Reminds me of the “Kyoto Protocol” which, IMO, would have been silly for the US to try and follow.
In any case, while Obama may have said that about a hypothetical power plant, I don’t see it as going to “bankrupt” anybody in the real world, and when all is said and done I see almost no chance that he’s going to signficantly impact the coal industry.
Josephine 11:50am
You miss the point. He remains unrepentent.
The NY Times “I don’t regret setting bombs, I feel we didn’t do enough” (Bill Ayers)
Yes I consider myself a far better judge of character.
How about 34 years. Up until 1974 Ayers’ weather underground was bombing police stations, banks, jails, courthouses, the Capitol and the Pentagon. Not to mention the private residence of a judge while he and his family, including young children, were sleeping.
Then there’s that book by Ayers’ dedicated to Robert Kennedy assassin Sirhan Sirhan, who blew away the senator, leaving 11 children fatherless and a family and nation devastated. But that happened 40 years ago so I suppose that doesn’t matter.
Doug 1:13PM
You can analyze Obama’s words and what he “means” any way you choose. Yes there may be pollution control, but our fearless leader has “alternatives” to energy on his mind.
Obama apparently has no issue with skyrocketing electrical rates, no matter how hard these hit the low income and middle class, of whom he is the champion.
Doug, look past his flashy smile and charm and see the real Obama.
Josephine,
Could you make comments on just one thread without talking about how dumb we all are compared to “University students” or how “wealthy” your family is? You seem to take that for granted, almost like you deserve all that you have. Do you give ANY credit or appreciation to your parents who have GIVEN YOU EVERYTHING? Do they know that you advocate Obama’s high taxes on the wealthy?
It’s not until about the age of 25 that kids mature because of the relative pampering they receive from parents and teachers, etc… in our culture. Being only nineteen, whether you realize it or not, you have not reached that point. You are still in a stage of rebelling against your rich parents, having joined the National Guard to be independent of your parents’ money although they have the ability to provide you with the funds. Then you complain that McCain will send you to war. The war started 5(?) years ago. Are you aware of that? Could you possibly show some humility appropriate for your age? I am shocked at your arrogance. You must be a member of mensa.
lol Janet.
My PARENTS advocate it to. THAT was my entire point! They think it’s RIGHT. What do you mean, “everything I have”? Do you know what my parents have given me? Really? What do I have because of my parents? Let me tell you: nothing. THEY have money. That doesn’t mean *I* do. Okay sweetie? Stop assuming things.
AND I’m REBELLING?? What are you TALKING about? I joined the National Guard because I had to pay for school, my dad doesn’t believe in handouts. Trust me, I love both of my parents to death. I didn’t want to vote for McCain because he wanted to DOUBLE the number of troops. Obama wanted to slowly withdrawal. I like peace better than war. It’s a shame you don’t. Are YOU aware that in 2003 Bush declared the “war” won? Do NOT act like I’m unintelligent because I’m young. Tell me, where did YOU go to school? What did YOU study?
And, Mary, all I asked was for more names? I believe I was told he hangs out with lots of terrorists. I was just wondering who? Annnnd, apparently Christians aren’t all about forgiveness anymore. Did he say he wishes he would’ve blown up more things? Did he say he wishes he would’ve killed people? I don’t think he did. You can correct me if I’m wrong. :)
**too, not to
and, I just scrolled up. I don’t recall seeing where I said anything about University students being smarter? Would you mind showing me? You seem to know me better than I know myself. ;)
Josephine,
I didn’t say he hung out with a lot of terrorists. I only know of Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dohrn.
Joephine: DO NOT act like I’m unintelligent because I’m young. Tell me, where did YOU go to school? What did YOU study?
First off, if you are as intelligent as you claim you must surely realize that school has little to do with it. Many unintelligent people complete college and some even go on to become doctors. On the other hand many extremely intelligent people forgo the college/university experience all together and go on to be very successful.
Second, intelligence in and of itself means nothing without a heavy dose of common sense and life experience. The first of which you demonstrate little and the second you lack simply by virtue of your age.
With regard to “all his terrorist friends”, perhaps the wording should have been “as with his other terrorist friend”, because honestly, I don’t know exactly how many terrorist friends he has. I know he has at least two, and I know that even one is more than I am comfortable with. By the way, he also has a relationship with Alexi Giannoulas, who isn’t technically a terrorist, but he is a Chicago banker connected to the mafia.
As for change, yes, I firmly believe that people can and do change all the time. It is hard, however, to give them the benefit of the doubt when they routinely make public statements indicating they have no regrets or continue to call for the elimination of Israel. Call me crazy or a bad Christian, but I don’t think they’ve changed, and like it or not, Obama shows poor judgement in his continued relationships with these men.
With regard to being smart and a good judge of character, the two don’t necessarily go hand in hand. I’m not certain as to which president you are referring. If you mean the president of the United States, I would have to say no, since I sincerely doubt he voted for Obama. If mean the president of your univiersity, then, while I may not be smarter, I would very comfortably say I am a better judge of character. As for state run universities, I believe they are nothing more than leftist indoctrination centers that long ago shut down the free exchange of ideas in favor of moving America toward a “progressive” (which is code for socialist) society. I have yet to meet a sate college/university student with critical thinking skills, but I have met many who are able to carry on condescending, angry rants. Guess which category you appear to fall into, Jospehine.
Mary,
I think you’re very intelligent…and ,more importantly, INFORMED!; )
the majority of Americans are pro-life?
LMAO!
Nope. Sorry to burst your bubble.
he majority of Americans are pro-life?
LMAO!
Nope. Sorry to burst your bubble.
Posted by: dana
Actually most Americans are pro life as long as there is an exception for rape and incest.
I have yet to meet an unintelligent medical doctor, first of all. Do you realize the kind of thinking capacity that takes?
And, let me see the study that says most Americans are pro-life? Because… heck, the voters seem to not know that. Even the red states kept abortion!
Oh, about my “life expierience”… well, let’s see. I’ve been all over the world with my family. I went to boot camp and AIT. I went to Belize with the National Guard for 2 months. I grew up near Chicago, a pretty diverse place. During high school, I was part of a group that went to the city and helped kids in under privileged schools. Just because I’m not middle aged doesn’t mean I don’t have life experience. I’ve probably don’t more things than many 50 year olds. That’s not really a good card to play with me.
As for your view on personal character.. how do you know what his character is like? You don’t know him. You’ve never met him. You’re judging him SOLELY based on things he did 30+ years ago.
Josephine,
I apologize if I assume too much. Sometimes your points are all over the place. Maybe I misunderstood what you are trying to say. Some day maybe you’ll understand where I’m coming from. God bless you.
Josephine: And, let me see the study that says most Americans are pro-life? Because… heck, the voters seem to not know that. Even the red states kept abortion!
Wow. Good thing you’re pro life. I’ll find it and get back to you after I come home from Vespers.
As for the rest of it. Whatever. If you want to go through life deaf, dumb and blind, so be it. But, keep in mind, you’re a university student, Josephine, just like millions of other kids, and I’ll let you in on a little secret, some of them are even smarter than you. You’re not a Nobel laureate, you’re not even in med school yet, heck, you haven’t even received that diploma you’re so impressed with. So here’s some friendly advice, get over yourself. ; )
Did I say I was like, the smartest person ever? I don’t remember saying that. I think a lot of people are smarter than me. And, I have received my associates degree. So.. I do have a diploma. I’m just going to need two more. :) Annnnnd, well, what exactly am I blind to? I mean… you apparently believe you’re smarter than every American that voted for Obama… so, you’re smarter than 63 million people? Not to mention almost every world leader… every other country is so happy we finally made a good decision except the McCain-nuts in THIS country.
Also, it was you that commented on me not having life experience since I’m young. Exactly where do you get off saying that? Do you have more life experience than me? I’d believe it if I saw it.
lol
DeeL 5:10PM
Thank you for your kind words. :)
Well, you lie about things, and then pretend it’s what others have said. If you think that’s “mockery” then that’s on you. You’re not appropriating anything, you’re just being silly.
Posted by: Doug at November 6, 2008 10:16 AM
But, my lies are your lies Dogma Doug. You believe your lies, and that’s what the mockery is all about. Again, you are able to read my mind, and know that my writing is not a mockery of your silly nope-a-dope replys to posters here.
I have appropriated your style of sophistry, and am mocking you in every post in matters of those attributes assigned to you Dogma Doug.
You pretend to deconstruct any argument of a opponent, and construct in your mind a winning argument for yourself, which is your sophistry on display, and my mocking such dogmatic closed minded sophistry. Or, no one has a good argument against Doug, they just think they do.
Even some podunk waiter, in some backwater town, in denying you a drink because your a fat boy, and fat boys always can comsume more booze is a argument for the dogmatic sophist named Doug.
I say there, here, here,I demand to see your superior in sharp fashion. You are being warned, I shall unleash my devastating mythological logic on you, and why I shant be denied my taste for liquid vice, which has made me a fat lout, demanding more booze. Think of the English Parliment while you read the above in a white wig.
Are you not a fat boy Doug? Are you not a lout when jeopardizing the liquor license of some podunk bar/resturant for your demand for liquid vice?
Am I pretending that your a lout Dogma Doug, when told that you may not have another drink, but make that into some silly argument for nothing more then your demand for being a loutish drunk arguing for “just another drink” and make it snappy, you worthless low life waitress. Your tip depends on my interpretations of YOUR RIGHT to not serve me another drink.
Notice the words, YOUR RIGHTS, dogma Doug?
Hey, did you tip her well Dogma Doug? Fitty cents?
We all get it dude, your for the legal murdering of inocent human life from a act of vice. That the final act of that act of vice is a blood sacrifice for that innocent human life is your reasoning for legal murder.
But, have you ever wrote one word which was not the truth, in matters of abortion, Dogma Doug?
What sophist denial will you make for writing a word of false truth in your worship of the legal murder of innocent life, or as you wish it to be euphemized, Abortion?
Or to lower it to your level of simple sophistry.
Have you ever told a lie in your preaching for abortion?
PS. How many Yankee’s has your fascist energy overlords froze, and then denied as a heart attack, to get you to some foreign nation where you can insult those waitresses in denying you some silly drink Doug?
Or, do you get their confidence before you get too drunk to hide your loutish demands for “just one more drink”?
That’s how most drunk are, nice, until you limit their wants and demands for more pleasure in a bottle.
Energy is a human right which should be free to all.
In the midst of your incoherent ranting, do you actually believe this?
Posted by: Doug at November 6, 2008
Anymore then abortion is a human right which is funded by the government to its citizens.
When it comes to making your energy industry free to all humans, and a human right, you think it is “incoherent”.
What a hypocrite you are dude. If abortion is free, by the funding of the government, so should energy be free, by funding free energy for the citizens.
And since all those energy users are viable, your actually a cruel, money grubbing, tight fisted fascist worker, who must have froze many customers for your fascist overlords to think what I wrote is “incoherent” concerning free energy to the citizens of the USA and Canada.
Or, it’s incoherent to allow citizens free abortions, and yet deny them a more basic human right,Energy, which allows those viable citizens to live.
Are you going to deny that humans can live without Electrical Energy?
Free Energy is a human right.
Not to mention almost every world leader… every other country is so happy we finally made a good decision except the McCain-nuts in THIS country.
Posted by: Josephine at November 6, 2008 6:31 PM
Josephine, they are laughing at our choice of Obama. The ONLY good thing I see about his presidency is that it should put an end to those who would say America is an ethnically intolerant country. We didn’t need to prove that by electing an anti-life political insider crook from the sesspool of Chicago politics to run our country though. We are in for a rough road of change, and by the time his term is up we will be longing again for the kind of stability and experience that a leader like John McCain could have brought to our country. Obama looked like he was ready to lose his lunch when he came out of that CIA briefing today. All the free passes that the voters and the MSM gave him will NOT serve him well as he faces our enemies.
On a less import note, his background in Chicago politics will allow him to show the rest of America how Chicago pay-to-play politicians can take corruption to a level Washington hasn’t seen before. Are the MSM gonna give him the same level of oversight and hold him to the same level of responsibility while he oversees the distribution of the economic bailout funds. Chicago politicians are going to take Washington corruption to a whole new level. Sorry America, you don’t deserve it but your ignorance is outstounding. For crying out loud, there were so many signs. The guy he bought his house and property from is in jail for political pay-to-play politics. If he wasn’t in jail yet then he would have a position in Washington. Obama and his friends are getting together and saying “yes we can”, “yes we can”, “yes we can”. I hope you ready for change?
On a personal note, I could personally live with the political corruption and thievery, but what concerns me most about this presidency is the safety of our country and the welfare of our fighting men and women. I am sorry Josephine, I truly hope I am wrong and that he doesn’t mismanage you and the rest of our fighting men and women the way I think he will. But he has already dissed our miltary men and women by saying they fly over cities and bomb civilians. And now leaders like Karzai in Afghanistan are calling him out about our operations there at a time when Obama says he plans on tripling the our military forces in Afghanistan. He doesn’t have anywhere near McCain’sexperience and ability to lead our troops and nobody who voted seemed to give a shit about that.
It’s amazing that the fact that Iran and other such countries are thrilled over Obama’s being elected doesn’t send red flags to people.
TS, Josephine, and Bethany,
How true, the world is laughing. The Russians are already on the move and Putin wants to step back into the Russian “presidency”.
The Israelis are nervous.
One Israelis gov’t official said that in the Middle East willingness to talk is viewed as weakness. Obama is just itching to talk to the Iranians.
The Europeans having Obasms will likely be caught in the middle of an American-Russian confrontation.
Al-Qaeda is overjoyed.
Why do you suppose this is? Its because tyrants and despots know a novice and weakling when they see one.
Even the media is expressing some reservations. Hey folks, you had two years to do you job and didn’t.
I defer. Sadly America is indeed trending “pro-choice”, the silver lining, the majority of Americans still favor some restrictions.
The other good news, over time the deathies will abort, contracept, euthanize and same sex union themselves out of existence and America will again be pro-life. In the long run, their policies are self defeating. After all, a culture of death brings, well death.
http://pewforum.org/docs/?DocID=350
At least one European leader sees Obama for what he is.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1031943.html
And I’m pretty sure Pope Benedict is not doing any happy dances.
truthseeker, Bethany, Mary,
Sobering comments.The People have made their choice, largely to preserve the “choice” for abortion, so what should we expect but a scary, uncertain future for our country. I can only pray that Oprah will FINALLY address the abortion issue at some point. Perhaps it’s time to flood her mailbox again will pro-life literature and letters.
It’s also time to pray as a country like we’ve never prayed before.
Obama announced his intention to raise taxes, I don’t recall him even talking about abortion. The American people have been caught up in a Messianic trance and I think concerned themselves little with much of anything he stood for except “hope” and “change”.
They didn’t care about Rev. Wright or Bill Ayers.
The media is surprised he picked a partisan pitbull like Rahm Emmanuel. Chicago politics comes to Washington.
People hope he will govern from the center.
The media is finally acknowledging they don’t even know who this guy really is.
We have people on this blog who think Obama doesn’t mean what he says.
Maybe, finally, we will have to begin taking this guy very seriously. I fear for my country.
DeeL 9:21am
An excellent and informative article. Thank you. Apparently Putin does as well since he wants to resume the “presidency” of Russia. He must foresee a real cakewalk.
Abortion is worse than slavery and has done more to kill minorities than lynchings and the Holocaust combined(for more information contact Life Dynamics at 1-800-800-Life)!!
Would anybody reading this like to work in an abortion clinic? Life begins at conception and ends at such a death camp!
And who benifits from and are empowered by the killing of unborn children? Sexually irresponsible
men!!!
“Well, you lie about things, and then pretend it’s what others have said. If you think that’s “mockery” then that’s on you. You’re not appropriating anything, you’re just being silly.”
yllas: But, my lies are your lies Dogma Doug. You believe your lies, and that’s what the mockery is all about.
Nope, again – you’re the one with the dogma, not me.
I acknowledge when a thing is my opinion, and don’t engage in the falseness you do.
…..
Energy is a human right which should be free to all.
In the midst of all your fruitcakery, this is somewhat interesting – do you really think that?
If so, do you think it’s possible to achieve that?
Ugh. I’m having internet issues. Just as well, I need to finish up with my daughter’s lessons and then I’m out to lunch, literally not figuratively, ha ha.
Have a great day everyone. God bless, and keep up the good fight.
yllas: Energy should be a human right, that can’t be denied by the cruel fascist industry of energy, and the billions in profit taking from the desperate humans who depend on not being froze.
“In the midst of your incoherent ranting, do you actually believe this?”
yllas: Anymore then abortion is a human right which is funded by the government to its citizens.
The legality of abortion can be argued all day. It’s a matter of opinion whether the status quo is good, bad, or at least better than the alternative, etc.
I wonder if you are really thinking about your statement. How would we make energy be a “human right”?
…..
When it comes to making your energy industry free to all humans, and a human right, you think it is “incoherent”.
No, you are very often incoherent, etc., but your idea of free energy is okay to discuss.
No, you are very often incoherent, etc., but your idea of free energy is okay to discuss.
Posted by: Doug at November 7, 2008 11:23 AM
What hubris.
I don’t have no need or want to discuss free energy with a person that knows no one has a good argument against him, they just think they do.
And ignores the RIGHTS of a person of less wealth, who must meet his incoherent demands for “just another drink”.
I say there, here, here,I demand to see your superior in sharp fashion. You are being warned, I shall unleash my devastating mythological logic on you, and why I shant be denied my taste for liquid vice, which has made me a fat lout, demanding more booze. Think of the English Parliment while you read the above in a white wig.
Are you not a fat boy Doug? Are you not a lout when jeopardizing the liquor license of some podunk bar/resturant for your demand for liquid vice?
Am I pretending that your a lout Dogma Doug, when told that you may not have another drink, but make that into some silly argument for nothing more then your demand for being a loutish drunk arguing for “just another drink” and make it snappy, you worthless low life waitress. Your tip depends on my interpretations of YOUR RIGHT to not serve me another drink.
Notice the words, YOUR RIGHTS, dogma Doug?
Hey, did you tip her well Dogma Doug? Fitty cents?
Notice how Doug ignores his fascist character and personality in his reply to me, and then changes the subject into nothing more then “what he wants to discuss”.
It’s part of his sophistry which some waitress had to endure when a want is denies a fascist that knew she had no good argument against Doug’s demands upon her, and Doug knowing, “she had no good argument against Doug, she just thought she did”.
TS, Bethany… are you both crazy? It’s a BAD thing other world leaders are happy with our choice of Obama? It would be better if they were angry and thought we made a bad choice. Did ANYONE watch the Iraqi president on CNN yesterday?? Wow, I’m so embarrassed for any American that thinks it’s bad that other world leaders approve of Obama… that’s really ridiculous. I mean, why would it be bad to have a President that is well liked all over the world… a President that other world leaders WANT to work with.
And Janet, guess what: not EVERY American put one thought towards abortion. I mean, was that a BIG part of either candidates campaign?? If it was, I sure as heck don’t remember it…
Josephine,
Who said they were embarrassed because other world leaders like the fact that we elected Obama? I just said they were laughing at us cause we elected such a inexperienced, convictionless, BS spewing, insider politician from the sesspool of Chicago politics.
Oh, but I a embarrased that we elected a president that is liked by 99% of the French.
“No, you are very often incoherent, etc., but your idea of free energy is okay to discuss.”
yllas: What hubris. I don’t have no need or want to discuss free energy with a person that knows no one has a good argument against him, they just think they do.
:: laughing ::
Well, you brought it up. If you want to retreat into your usual baloney, okay….
“The People have made their choice, largely to preserve the “choice” for abortion”
And Janet, guess what: not EVERY American put one thought towards abortion. I mean, was that a BIG part of either candidates campaign?? If it was, I sure as heck don’t remember it…
Posted by: Josephine at November 7, 2008 4:39 PM
Whether a conscious decision on the voter’s part, or not, the result is the same. I think you’ll agree.
Truthseeker,
I understand your point about the French, and I don’t disagree.
However, I do want to share that last spring I was blessed to visit both London and Paris. Contrary to popular belief, the French were much more warm and welcoming than the Brits. Even our cab driver, who obviously had little regard for Bush (or Sarkozy) was amiable, pleasant and helpful. While I enjoyed the London sights (I was a history/poli sci major, so, whats not to like?)the people were a cold and a major turn off, thus I can’t imagine returning. But springtime in Paris? Mais, oui. C’est la vie! I’d go back in a heartbeat. ;)
I do think Sarkozy is a step in the right direction.
“The People have made their choice, largely to preserve the “choice” for abortion”
Thank goodness for that.
Dee L.
The French outlaw all abortion after the 10th week unless two seperate physicians certify a serious health risk to the mother. If I hadn’t followed Obama so closely and I only listened to his speeches I wouldn’t know how radically anti-life Obama is either. So I guess I shouldn’t diss them all. All they have is his grand speeches.
I have a daughter who has Trisomy 13. She is 22-years-old and is doing amazingly well. Thankfully, I chose not ot have an AFP test, and I did not know about her condition prior to birth. I have since learned that I would likely have been heavily pressured to have an abortion. I know this to be true, because I am part of a messageboard for the families of children with Trisomy 13. The majority of the families were encouraged, even pressured, to abort their child and, often, continually shamed by doctors for not doing so. Many were pressured to have “early inductions,” in order to deliver their child before viability. This sometimes leads to a live birth and to the type of situation that led Obama to indicate that these children should receive no treatment if they survive an attempted abortion. He was given three opportunities to vote to protect these children; and, even after being presented with a bill containing a “neutrality clause” protecting Roe v. Wade, Obama still chose not to support the right of these children who survive an attempted abortion to be treated. He would, apparently, rather see them die among the soiled laundry of a hospital. There is a child form Canada on the messageboard I spoke of, whose parents can prove (yes, prove) that she was killed at a premier children’s hospital in Canada with a massive drug overdose, while she was in the hospital being treated for a respiratory problem. A DNR was also signed without parental consent, so alarms were silenced, and ahe died while her parents were briefly out of her room attending to other matters. Why don’t they simply sue the hospital? Try doing that in a country in which the government runs the healthcare system. I can tell you that things are already getting worse here, with abortion being touted as the answer the majority of the time when one is pregnant with a child with Downs Syndrome (Trisomy 21), Edwards Syndrome (Trisomy 18), Patau Syndrome (Trisomy 13)and many other chromosomal conditions. On the website which serves the Trisomy 13 community of families, there are 80+ children who are long-term survivors, many far-surpassing in lifespan and milestones what was predicted for them by doctors. Still, doctors routinely tell parents that there is “no hope” for their child. My daughter is verbal and ambulatory and can read, write, and calculate. Most of all, she just enjoys life, and we enjoy her greatly! Even among the children on the site who are Full T-13 are those making incredible strides. One young man (age 13) is the PECS (Picture Exchange Communication System) champ. When his card for a specific food item was missing, he pulled his spoon card, then took Mom by the hand and led her to the item he wanted in the kitchen. There ia also a Prenatal Album on the website off of which the messageboard operates and a Treasured Memories Album for families who desire to honor the memory of their child with T-13 who has passed away. We have now elected a man who would deny the most basic of rights to child born alive.
I have a daughter who has Trisomy 13. She is 22-years-old and is doing amazingly well. Thankfully, I chose not to have an AFP test, and I did not know about her condition prior to birth. I have since learned that I would likely have been heavily pressured to have an abortion. I know this to be true, because I am part of a messageboard for the families of children with Trisomy 13. The majority of the families were encouraged, even pressured, to abort their child and, often, continually shamed by doctors for not doing so. Many were pressured to have “early inductions,” in order to deliver their child before viability. This sometimes leads to a live birth and to the type of situation that led Obama to indicate that these children should receive no treatment if they survive an attempted abortion. He was given three opportunities to vote to protect these children; and, even after being presented with a bill containing a “neutrality clause” protecting Roe v. Wade, Obama still chose not to support the right of these children who survive an attempted abortion to be treated. He would, apparently, rather see them die among the soiled laundry of a hospital. There is a child from Canada on the messageboard I spoke of, whose parents can prove (yes, prove) that she was killed at a premier children’s hospital in Canada with a massive drug overdose, while she was in the hospital being treated for a respiratory problem. A DNR was also signed without parental consent, so alarms were silenced, and she died while her parents were briefly out of her room attending to other matters. Why don’t they simply sue the hospital? Try doing that in a country in which the government runs the healthcare system. I can tell you that things are already getting worse here in the USA, with abortion being touted as the answer the majority of the time when one is pregnant with a child with Downs Syndrome (Trisomy 21), Edwards Syndrome (Trisomy 18), Patau Syndrome (Trisomy 13)and many other chromosomal conditions. On the website which serves the Trisomy 13 community of families, there are 80+ children who are long-term survivors, many far-surpassing in lifespan and milestones what was predicted for them by doctors. Still, doctors routinely tell parents that there is “no hope” for their child. My daughter is verbal and ambulatory and can read, write, and calculate. Most of all, she just enjoys life, and we enjoy her greatly! Even among the children on the site who are Full T-13 are those making incredible strides. One young man (age 13) is the PECS (Picture Exchange Communication System) champ. When his card for a specific food item was missing, he pulled his spoon card, then took Mom by the hand and led her to the item he wanted in the kitchen. There ia also a Prenatal Album on the website off of which the messageboard operates and a Treasured Memories Album for families who desire to honor the memory of their child with T-13 who has passed away. We have now elected a man who would deny the most basic of rights to child born alive.
Glenda, God bless you!
“At least slaves got to live”. Sure, but many aborted fetuses were spared lives of abject poverty, malnutrition, woefully inadequate education, and the total lack of opportunity.
The slaves who” got to live” lived lives of back-breaking labor, poor and insufficient food, no education (remember it was a crime to teach them to read and write), humiliation and whippings, sexual predation by their owners, and all of that misery and hopelessness. What a great life.
Robert Berger, are you saying that it would have been more moral if the slaves had been killed?
Because at least then, they would have been spared lives of beating, whippings, humiliation, etc. Right?
Would you have been supportive if all who were sold into slavery had been killed by their masters instead?
Sure, but many aborted fetuses were spared lives of abject poverty, malnutrition, woefully inadequate education, and the total lack of opportunity.
Inadequate education is a reason to be dead? Why don’t we kill all uneducated children then, to spare them the inadequate education they’ve been receiving.
“Total lack of opportunity”? What country do you think we live in?
Bethany, 9:19am
This sounds to me like a number of social problems and injustices to be addressed. Not a reason to kill.
I didn’t say that the slaves should have been killed. What I meant is that many of those who were aborted WERE spared lives of utter misery. It’s extremely harmful to society when large numbers of poor, unwanted children are born.
This only increases poverty, unemployment and crime. That’s why we will never create a more just, equitable and prosperous society unless we see to it that poor children are better taken care of. The republican social and economic policies have not done this; they are extremely counterproductive.
Robert Berger,
A certain number of people are going to die in car accidents. A certain number of people will get sick with cancer. A certain number of people will grow up to become suicide bombers. Do we simply abort every conceived child because, to fail to do so means we have an increase in traffic accidents, disease and terrorism?
Utter silliness.
And you should try to get your facts straight. Conservatives, who tend to vote Republican due to the flawed two party system, donate significantly more of their incomes to charity than liberals. In addition, Catholic Charities and other faith based organizations (supported by those Republican/conservative donations) are on the forefront of disaster relief, medical care for the needy, crisis pregnancy services, adoption services, foster care, orphan care, soup kitchens, providing food and clothing to the poor…the list goes on. And they do it with a human face and a gentle touch which. They provide significantly more relief to human suffering than any bureaucratic, money sucking government agency could ever hope to, and they do it on a personal level, which recognizes and respects the recipients’ personal dignity.
Again, utter silliness on your part.
Great post, DeeL. And Mary, it seems like common sense, doesn’t it?
Robert:
I didn’t say that the slaves should have been killed. What I meant is that many of those who were aborted WERE spared lives of utter misery. It’s extremely harmful to society when large numbers of poor, unwanted children are born.
And this couldn’t have been said during the time slavery was legal?
Any slaves who were killed were simply “spared” lives of utter misery, according to your logic.
So therefore, slavery was a moral good.
Correction: I meant to say therefore *killing* slaves would be a moral good.
Thanks Bethany, as are yours. ; )