Jivin J’s Life Links 8-15-11
by JivinJ, host of the blog, JivinJehoshaphat
- I’m not sure who came up with the title for the AP article, “One-child policy a surprising boon for China girls.”
Yeah – 43 million girls aborted because they were female, coercive family planning measures, being less likely to have siblings, family members who are bitter you’re not male, etc. – and in return the policy may have played a small role in the increasing number of Chinese women going to college and getting degrees. Doesn’t really sound like a boon to me.
- According to ProLifeCorner.com, the Northern Illinois Women’s Center abortion clinic in Rockford (pictured left; known previously for its rubber-chicken-as-crucified-Christ antics, among other things) failed an inspection in June:
Below are listed some of the frightening violations documented by the State of Illinois about Rockford’s abortion mill:
The Northern Illinois Women’s Center did NOT meet the requirement of a sanitary facility.
It was determined that “3 of 3 operating rooms inspected failed to ensure a sanitary environment.”
NIWC failed to prevent potential contamination of clean equipment.
Gynecological cannulas were stained with a “brown substance.” (Cannulas are surgical instruments inserted directly inside a mother.)
- Three Milwaukee teens have been arrested for the murder of a pregnant woman:
34-year-old Sharon Staples was killed early Sunday morning after she refused to give her purse to two armed robbers. Staples was 4 months pregnant. The fetus didn’t survive. Staples also left behind 7 children ranging in age from 4 to 13.
Wisconsin has an unborn victims of violence law.
- A Catholic church in the Philippines is set to rally against the government’s lack of action in preventing sales of illegal abortion pills:
[Msgr. Jose Clemente] Ignacio recounted that he earlier received a text message from the police reporting that authorities had apprehended two vendors selling Cytotec, and had subsequently cleared the area of others suspected of vending the tablets.
“I said I was not satisfied… they need to capture all distributors, all suppliers and close down all abortion clinics in Quiapo,” Ignacio told reporters in an interview.
Ignacio said parishioners and devotees of the Black Nazarene have decided to mobilize a rally on Friday to express their outrage on the continuing Cytotec trade in Quiapo despite repeated calls for authorities to act on the problem.
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
“Doesn’t really sound like a boon to me.”
Well, you’re not a Chinese woman who has been given educational and social opportunities that she never would have had a few generations ago.
Why do I even bother? No one here is even remotely capable of approaching this topic rationally, lest they be forced to admit the obvious: even if you disagree with the methods used to implement Chinese family planning policies, it is an inescapable fact that they have resulted in sustained social and economic dividends to Chinese society. But it’s much easier to criticize a government and culture that you don’t understand the first thing about from over 10,000 miles away.
Thanks for the tip on the Rockford mill! AbortionSafety.com volunteers are on the case.
I would like to ask joan one question – HOW and WHERE from is she so educated and so informed about China? Been to China? Lived there? All your friends are chinese? Studied chinese culture/politics/etc in college? Just curious!
Yes, why do you?
It must be because we pray for you and all the other abortion advocates who daily walk in darkness. Despite your protesting, you do keep returning here.
There is yet hope for you Joan, while you still live.
joan,
So you are arguing that sexism at its most vile, the deliberate destruction of females, can in fact be a social boon?
Joan’s ignorant statements have all been answered already by an experienced activist in the field (on another thread). Don’t know why she doesn’t just give up.
“it’s much easier to criticize a government and culture that you don’t understand the first thing about”
Exactly the same sentiment declared by slave-owners in 1860 to New England abolitionists.
Hi Eric,
Excellent point. I also hope joan doesn’t criticize cultures where girls have their genitals mutilated with rusty razors, are married off at puberty, abused, stoned for “adultery”, raped, and denied access to education and opportunity.
After all, “it’s much easier to criticize a government and culture that you don’t understand the first thing about”.
Right and wrong are different if you’re far enough away, huh? So, if murdering an adult in cold blood is wrong here in the US, can I just take my victim on a trip to a foreign country? What is the mileage limit on legal murder? Am I guilty of a crime if I take him less than 5,000 miles, but ok to murder if it’s a minimum of 9,000 miles? Am I guilty only of manslaughter at 6,500 miles away? And where is the center of this hypothetical moral center? Joan’s house?
What is the mileage limit on legal murder?
0.000189393939 miles, roughly, if you’re pro-legal-abortion.
“Doesn’t really sound like a boon to me.”
Joan: Well, you’re not a Chinese woman who has been given educational and social opportunities that she never would have had a few generations ago.
While China’s population-control methods are not the end-all of that equation, yeah – talk to a Chinese woman – things have changed for the better.
Mary: I also hope Joan doesn’t criticize cultures where girls have their genitals mutilated with rusty razors, are married off at puberty, abused, stoned for “adultery”, raped, and denied access to education and opportunity.
After all, “it’s much easier to criticize a government and culture that you don’t understand the first thing about”.
I imagine Joan would be pretty critical of them. What do you think?
“Well, you’re not a Chinese woman who has been given educational and social opportunities that she never would have had a few generations ago.”
And you’re not a Chinese woman who’s been dragged out of her home, strapped to a table, and forced to abort, much like Wang Liping, the woman mentioned in that blog post last week. But you’re not about to concede to being in any less of a position to extol the virtues of forced abortion, are you, joan?
Between (A) the case of a woman whose government has provided for “educational and social opportunities that she never would have had a few generations ago,” and (B) the case of a woman who – in accordance with orders by that same government – was beaten up and forced to abort her 7-month-old fetus, and listened to her aborted baby cry for some minutes before it was wrapped in a plastic bag and left next to her: I personally think the latter makes a more compelling commentary about that society, but see, that’s just me.
“No one here is even remotely capable of approaching this topic rationally, lest they be forced to admit the obvious: even if you disagree with the methods used to implement Chinese family planning policies, it is an inescapable fact that they have resulted in sustained social and economic dividends to Chinese society.”
No, I fully admit to that fact. Just as I admit that rounding up and executing the poor would eliminate poverty. And rounding up and executing the physically and mentally disabled would get rid of the societal bane of disability. And if child support laws were repealed, deadbeat parents would no longer be in child support arrears as a result and therefore would no longer be deadbeat parents. We’d all love a world free of poverty, disability, deadbeat parents, etc., right?
Gotta hand it to you, though; the “pro-choice” camp puts on this face that does its damnedest to be distanced from the idea of forced abortion, but not so with you. The face of the pro-choice camp purports to be just as much in favor of choosing an alternative to abortion as choosing abortion, if not more in favor of choosing an alternative to abortion than choosing abortion. “After all,” they say, “it’s called ‘pro-chooooooice.'”
But the reality is that there is this widespread belief among “pro-choicers” that women have an obligation – a duty, even – to abort in adverse circumstances. With regard to any circumstances where abortion is being the least bit considered as an option, there’s this underlying attitude that favors abortion, and this attitude is driven in large part by the notion that every time an abortion happens, abortion is validated or destigmatized a little more. But some things in this world will never be completely destigmatized, and rightly so.
At any rate, your support of “the methods used to implement Chinese family planning policies” demonstrates your unequivocal preference for abortion, as opposed to an underlying, insidious preference for abortion. As an ardent pro-lifer, I find that unequivocalness refreshing and sincerely appreciate it. And I thank you for “keepin’ it real,” as the newfangled expression goes.
Doug 9:34PM
You are referring of course to the Chinese women who have not been disposed of because they are female. So Doug, like joan, you have no issue with sexism at its most vile, is that correct?
Doug 9:37PM
Why on earth would joan be critical of these practices? Did she not say “its much easier to criticize a government and culture that you don’t understand the first thing about”? joan sounds to me like a bastion of tolerance.
How are these practices any more repugnant than female genocide?
Disturbing, to say the least, that economic improvement is a rationale for forced abortion. The economic improvements don’t reach the aborted baby lying next to the woman on the bed in the photo, just like the South’s economic boon from slavery never reached slaves. Apologists for genital mutilation, abused women, pubescent marriage, etc (great list Mary), would say those practices stabilize marriage, improving the standard of living, at least for the husband. Defending forced abortion, slavery, and genital mutilation on the basis of “economic improvement” is just plain Machivellian.
Hi Eric,
Since you mention slavery, another argument along this line was that slavery actually did black people a great service. They had been “Christianized” and “civilized”, though one could argue there was nothing Christian or civilized about the brutality of slavery. Certainly it was “known” that black people couldn’t possibly fend for themselves as free men and women. What a great service to keep them in chains!
Free black men and women proved themselves to be a remarkably resilient, resourceful, and successful group of people once the shackles were off.
Hi Meredith 9:52PM
An outstanding post.
Exactly Mary,
Well written post with the conclusion of slave owners — basically “better a slave than uncivilized’ – reminds me of abortion defenders who say, “better dead than poor”.
Thank you Eric,
Also, notice that slavery and dying are beneficial when its them.
A man about 40 minutes from where I live decapitated his 7 year old son. He cut his head off and dismembered him. Put his head by the road so the boys mom could see it. The killing had something to do with his son’s disability. His son had cerebral palsy and a weak heart. He was in the 2nd grade and went to a public school. Perilous times.
“While China’s population-control methods are not the end-all of that equation, yeah – talk to a Chinese woman – things have changed for the better.”
Mary: You are referring of course to the Chinese women who have not been disposed of because they are female. So Doug, like Joan, you have no issue with sexism at its most vile, is that correct?
Several things here, Mary. Any issues I would have don’t necessarily matter to the Chinese woman, and I maintain that few Chinese women would want to exchange the current times for decades or centuries ago.
I’m certainly not for abortions being forced on women who don’t want them. I’m okay with abortions to a point in gestation if the pregnant woman herself or the couple wants to end the pregnancy. I’m for leaving it up to them – and obviously some cases will include gender-selection.
That said, I think that selection is a “worse” reason for choosing abortion versus some other things, an example being abnormalities or deficiencies in the fetus where most people would find having an abortion to be entirely understandable.
As for the practice itself of choosing boys over girls, it’s demonstrably causing problems in some countries. On its own, I think it’s bad practice.
____
Mary: I also hope Joan doesn’t criticize cultures where girls have their genitals mutilated with rusty razors, are married off at puberty, abused, stoned for “adultery”, raped, and denied access to education and opportunity.
After all, “it’s much easier to criticize a government and culture that you don’t understand the first thing about”.
“I imagine Joan would be pretty critical of them. What do you think?”
Why on earth would joan be critical of these practices?
Because she would not think there is a good enough reason for them. You can always ask her…
____
Did she not say “its much easier to criticize a government and culture that you don’t understand the first thing about”? joan sounds to me like a bastion of tolerance.
How are these practices any more repugnant than female genocide?
I’d say ask her. She has a point about being quick to judge different cultures. That doesn’t mean she’ll necessarily be for or against a given thing within that culture.