Former child actress: Attachment parenting consistent with feminism, if not liberal feminists
We care about what hormonal contraception does to your body and your brain. We research why doctors prescribe birth control to teenagers and adults who don’t have a “regular” menstrual cycle.
We object to routine inductions with pitocin and interventions during labor because of the risks to the mother and the baby. We believe that breast milk is biologically and nutritionally superior to anything formula manufacturers tell you is equal to it, and that sleeping next to your baby releases positive hormones that facilitate bonding.
We have empowered ourselves and refuse to endure a male-centered obstetric history that has taken women’s bodies and molded them to their preferences for their convenience, their comfort and for their world view.
Now tell me how attachment parenting is inconsistent with feminism?
~ Former Blossom child actress Mayim Bialik, as quoted by Opinion L.A., May 11
[Photo of Bialik’s book cover via motherloveblog.com]
Jill Stanek is a nurse turned speaker, columnist and blogger, a national figure in the effort to protect both preborn and postborn innocent human life.
“We object to routine inductions with pitocin and interventions during labor because of the risks to the mother and the baby.”
I understand why they would object to routine induction but interventions? My wife would have died without an emergency section with our second baby.
I think routine also modifies interventions. I don’t get the impression that she is opposed to life-saving interventions.
JackBorsch, it’s ‘routine’ interventions that are objectable. Interventions, including c-sections, are awesome when they are required. But in most hospitals interventions aren’t used because they are needed, they are used because the doctor/nurses are bored, or because it’s ‘hospital policy’ or because mom is ‘taking too long’. To put it in perspective a c-section rate of about 3-5% is sufficent to bring maternal mortality as low as c-sections can accomplish. A rate between 5-15% is niether positive or negative. It saves no more lives than a 5% rate, but it looses no more lives either. But abover about 15% maternal mortaliy starts rising again, because c-sections are major, serious, life-threatening surgeries. The U.|. C-section rate is nationwide above 30%, and approaching 50% in some areas (with some specific practicies above 70%!). Besides ‘interventions’ means everything from forced fasting, continuious fetal monitoring, pictocin, episiotomies, all the way up to c-sections.
I was a SAHM for 10 years. I breastfed all 3 of my babies. I used cloth diapers and the sling and the Baby Bjorn. I made my own baby food. But at the end of the day, those babies were going in their cribs! (File that under: how can i miss you when don’t go away?)
Another thing to feel guilty about. (Not to mention I wanted every conceiveable drug pumping thru me during labor…but that’s another story.)
It’s too bad many would have less interest in reading this and listening to a honest debate about that subject than what Time offered…
I don’t like her comment about “male centered obstetric history” because it sounds like she’s saying male OBs don’t care about their patients. I totally agree with the comment about c-sections though. So many women get unnecessary c-sections without thinking about the complications even into the following pregnancies, like placental accretes which can be life threatening and require a hysterectomy. They are putting their ability to have more children in jeopardy and most have NO idea because c-sections have become so common for convenience.
Bravo, Mayim! It is true that so much of modern obstetrics is designed around the doctor’s convenience and preferences, and not respect for the woman’s body. No doubt thanks to lawsuits which have doctors constantly worried about themselves first.
Ultimately what matters is that I had three healthy babies, but oh how I wish I’d had different, better birthing experiences. Something very intimate, organic and precious is lost amid all the medical interventions and manipulation.
Mayim Balik is pro-abortion. Just sayin’.
Doctor-centered obstetric practices are completely apparent when the vast majority of American women think that giving birth on your back in a bed with your feet in stirrups or being jammed back by those around you to be completely normal. I don’t say “male-centered” because female OB’s are frequently worse than male OB’s.
As a society, we have lost a lot of what it means to birth normally, and I am thankful that we are at least having the discussion. God made my body to birth babies, and I don’t need a doctor to “deliver” me of my child.
Janet writing, It is absolutely criminal that human development is so poorly understood by people in general including the medical profession. Human beings grow and develop at different rates throughout life from conception to death. I have memories of my high school home economics teacher telling the girls in her classes, ” You girls think the big athletes are so glamorous, you need to know, it is the “Late bloomers” that make the best husbands”. Boys especially can physically grow up to age 30. Why are they being labled at preadolescense as less than masculine? We need to become focused on what constitutes optimum conditions for growth and development of all humans through the life span instead of artificially caring for people in artificial ways and labeling them in ways that does not support optimum growth and development according to God’s plan for their lives.
All very interesting. It’s nice that we’re discussing the best ways to give birth to and raise babies instead of talking about killing them.
Amen Susan! Amen. My mom had my brothers in the 60’s. She labored naturally the whole time and then right as the babies were crowning they put a mask over her face and put her under. She never heard their first cries and was struggling up from the anesthesia when they were minutes old. What was the point of that? The men OB’s did that.
I labored naturally with my first son and I hated it because I was flat on my back hooked up to ever monitor known to mankind. It was excruciating because it was an unnatural position.
With my second son i took charge. I let the doctor know how I wanted it to go. She followed my birth plan and I was allowed to stay on my feet out of bed. Consequently I had a 4 hour labor as opposed to 13 hours the first time. I was able to birth naturally and nurse immediately afterward. Because I’d had no drugs my baby was alert and I felt like dancing a jig the moment he came out.
A lot of times doctors want you to deliver on their schedule instead of following the mom’s schedule. I remember my friend telling me that nurses told her they would have to give her pitocin to speed things up because they were having a shift change soon and wanted her delivered so they could complete what they had to complete before they left. Thats just wrong!
As to co-sleeping. I am not into that. I would be too afraid of smothering my baby.
I used to be very into the “doctors are bad, interventions are unnecessary” mindset. And I don’t dispute that some doctors are clueless jerks and some interventions are unnecessary, but I think these claims that “most of the time” interventions are because of [insert invalid reason here: boredom, impatience, money…] is a false and unproven claim.
For a different viewpoint that’s usually well-backed up with scientific facts, I’d suggest going to read The Skeptical OB, a blog written by a female doctor. (Warning: Like Bialik, she is pro-abortion.) She provides some pretty compelling studies and facts about the dangers of homebirth and the proven reasons for various interventions, and also runs a blog called Hurt by Homebirth, which compiles stories of babies who died or suffered severe brain damage due to the unavailability of intervention that could have saved them.
Sometimes I think that the people who are so into this whole “Doctors are unnecessary! Women have been having babies for thousands of years!” shtick must not be very knowledgeable about history. I do a lot of genealogy, and I’ve seen how many of my female ancestors died in childbirth. Even more of them had babies who did. The medical establishment has plenty of problems, but it has transformed our lives (positively) in ways that we spoiled 21st century people can’t even imagine. The “modern medicine is bad” mindset comes from a place of blind privilege, IMO.
Katey, the vast reduction in maternal mortality came with the introduction of antibiotics and universally better nutrition. The lithotomy position and unnecessary interventions had nothing to do with it.
The author of the skeptical OB is one of those aforementioned female OBs who is worse than a male OB. She is a fearmongerer and manipulates both emotions and statistics to “prove” her tenuous positions.
Fact is maternal morbidity, including unnecessary c-sections, is through the roof, and many women are unwilling to accept it. This is not being spoiled, it is choosing better healthcare for yourself, your child, and future generations.
Katey, I have to agree. As much as I would love to live as naturally as possible (I plan to breastfeed, want to eat *very* healthy when I’m pregnant, etc.), I think there is a place for modern medicine. heck, I would be dead without modern medicine, and that’s a fact.
While I do think that many doctors may be motivated by factors such as boredom, money, etc., I honestly believe that most of them are motivated by the patient’s best interest.
Women *do* need to be informed about risks of certain procedures and see if they want to take that risk (such as c-sections, etc.), they should still have the right to do so without being condemned by the all natural mothers. There are risks, yes, and I know there are many tests that most pregnant women are told to get that I will be opting out of when I have little babies of my own. But we shouldn’t just bash modern medicine and doctors on the whole. And we also should bash women who choose c-sections etc.
Also, you’re absolutely right about the fact that, well, yes, women have been birthing for thousands of years, but also, the mother and infant mortality rate was enormous. If you’re going to do home-birth, know the risks and make sure you do it right.
Susan, I don’t agree with The Skeptical OB on everything, that’s for sure. However, she absolutely has studies to back up some of her positions, such as that babies are statistically more likely to die in homebirth than at the hospital.
And attributing the drop in maternal mortality rate ONLY to antibiotics and better nutrition is dishonest. There are MANY different conditions, some of which can occur suddenly in otherwise totally healthy pregnancies, that require immediate emergency intervention that was not available before medical advances like C-section. My older sister–who has always had low blood pressure, is a health and nutrition nut, and had a perfect pregnancy–had sudden-onset high blood pressure at 8 months that nearly killed her before she could get to the hospital. One of my best friends had a sudden placental abruption. Another had a baby whose knotted cord pulled tight during labor, cutting off his oxygen completely; that was discovered immediately because of the monitors, and he was C-sectioned before permanent brain damage could occur. It isn’t fearmongering to acknowledge that these things exist, occur, and MUST be treated immediately with major intervention to prevent death or serious damage.
And the accusation of fearmonger, it seems to me, can be thrown by either side. The natural childbirth side screams, “Here are the horrible unnecessary harmful interventions that happened to me, and they’ll happen to you too if you go to the hospital!” And the pro-medical side replies, “Here are these babies who died in homebirth and yours will too unless you go to the hospital!” Honestly, I prefer to go with science as much as possible. Real science. And so I try to educate myself as much as possible about what interventions really aren’t necessary (believe me, I’m absolutely against unnecessary C-sections!), without throwing the baby out with the bathwater and condemning modern medicine completely.
Katey, no one has condemned modern medicine completely. Modern antibiotics are what has improved maternal mortality statistics, and that is great! Good thing I don’t have to birth in a germ-ridden hospital to get them :)
To each her own!
I have been witness to some people condemning modern medicine completely, but I’m definitely not saying you’re one of them! A lot of what I said was in response to some of the fringe extremists of the natural childbirth movement (which I feel Bialik probably is), and certainly not at you personally. To each her own, indeed. You have to do the best you can to weigh the risks and make what you feel is the most responsible decision for yourself and your family, and it sounds like you’ve done that.
Thanks for being so civil and kind, and hope you have a blessed day.
Katey, Dr. Amy (the Skeptical OB) is not a reliable source of information. Statistics can be twisted to say anything, and she definitely twists them to her advantage. She ignores or attempts to discredit all studies that show homebirth is as safe as hospital birth, and she also ignores the illnesses/deaths that occur in the hospital environment due to unnecessary interventions.
For example, a woman is induced via pitocin, which necessitates an epidural, which causes the baby to go into distress, which necessitates a C-section – and then she credits the C-section with “saving the baby’s life” – but ignores the fact that the baby would never have been in danger in the first place if not for the cascade of interventions.
I’ve had 4 unmedicated, vaginal hospital births — a great experience each time. However, I researched the hell out of the subject and even hired a doula for the last two. Docs are so afraid of lawsuits these days that they push intervention after intervention for fear they’ll get sued for something they *didn’t* do.
http://consumerreports.org/cro/2012/05/what-to-reject-when-you-re-expecting/index.htm
This is a great article from Consumer Reports about interventions. Sad news is that many women will just blindly follow whatever the doctor says, and many would put more effort into buying a car than preparing for the delivery of their child.
The US is 41st among nations in maternal mortality. All these interventions are not helping as much as the AMA or ACOG or skeptical OB says they are.
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We have empowered ourselves and refuse to endure a male-centered obstetric history that has taken women’s bodies and molded them to their preferences for their convenience, their comfort and for their world view.”
That is a perfect description of Big Abortion. Men created abortion and men benefit the most from it.
I think unassisted births are foolish but who says home births are bad? I’ve had many friends who delivered at home with midwives and had no complications. I know couples (2) who delivered in a hospital and because of medical incompetence their perfectly healthy baby boys died.
I delivered in a hospital and never wanted to do a home birth but I don’t think there is anything wrong with them. I believe in modern medicine. I just don’t like the “lets operate or give you pill to pop” for everything. There are natural remedies that are less invasive that work just as well but drug companies and doctors don’t make money off of them. Not to bash the medical profession, just saying I see it a lot. Case in point, my husband had a sore shoulder and went to the doc and he tried to convince my husband he was depressed and give him an anti-depressant. My husband was like “No, my shoulder is just sore. Seriously.”
I wouldn’t believe anything a pro-abort doctor says anyhow. If they can’t even understand that life begins at conception and its wrong to take a life then how can I believe her opinion on home births etc??? She has already shown she has no logic or common sense or morality.
Attachment parenting as described by feminists — at least the bed-sharing –makes sense in a pre-industrial agrarian society. In an industrial or post-industrial society, attachment parenting can become narcissism.
“Attachment parenting becomes narcissism.”
What? How is doing what’s best for babies narcissistic?
If Mayim is indeed proabortion, her defense and promotion of AP smacks of irony. Because parenting begins when the baby is actually attached to you.
Katey says:
May 15, 2012 at 10:41 am
+1
I certainly don’t agree with “the Skeptical OB” about everything, especially abortion, but her advice could possibly have saved my daughter’s life. Midwives don’t always follow appropriate treatment guidelines for testing during pregnancy for things like GB Strep. I had a bad experience in the hospital the 3rd time around and was considering a midwifery practice this time around. I never did switch because of financial issues and I am so glad I didn’t switch. when I was only a few weeks away from delivering I found out I was GBS Positive (I was negative for the first three children). Because of this foreknowledge, I was able to be treated during delivery and did not have to risk my daughter’s life because of my own ridiculous birthing preferences. And my hospital experience was wonderful this time around. The local Army hospital L&D unit has made a vast improvement since my third child was born there 2 years ago. If a midwife would have tested me at all, chances are high she would have ”treated” me with hibiclens douches and garlic suppositories, which would have been worthless.
I think there’s hope for Dr. Teuteur (probably spelled her name wrong) on abortion though. She already has a foundation of wanting to care for the infant’s well-being and not wanting to see careless decisions jeopardizing a child’s life. I think God just needs to help her realize that properly respecting the life of the fetus isn’t just about proper prenatal and delivery care. She already knows these things, she just needs her eyes open to the understanding of the fact that the embryo/fetus is just as much a valuable and important human being as the child who is closer to term. The “Skeptical OB” is sold out to pro-“choice” ideology but so was I, years ago. God works miracles!
Army wife, don’t assume that midwives don’t know how to treat for GBS – they can and do all the time. With simple antibiotics. Did you doctor share with you any research-based evidence on the use of IV therapy during labor? Seriously, slandering an entire profession based on the website of a hatefilled, non-practicing OB is not a good idea.
How about the women and babies who have lost their life due to MRSA and meningitis in the hospital setting? This goes both ways, and calling valid, fact-based choices “ridiculous birthing preferences” does nothing to advance the dialogue.
Again, less than 1% of births in the US are outside of the hospital setting and we are 41st among nations in maternal mortality. Clearly, the medical community has a lot of room for improvement, and should put their own house in order before casting aspersions at midwives.
Katey, you’re prejudiced against midwives for something that MIGHT have happened had you gone to one, with no evidence at all to support your belief?
In the UK, pregnant women are not routinely tested for Group B strep for myriad logical reasons, and there are not massive amounts of babies dying as a result. I was never tested for Group B strep prior to my 2nd birth (he was a month early) and yet both of us survived. Amazing!
“Attachment parenting as described by feminists — at least the bed-sharing –makes sense in a pre-industrial agrarian society. In an industrial or post-industrial society, attachment parenting can become narcissism.”
Eric, what utter nonsense. Babies are neither aware nor care about the state of our industrial-ness. They only know that they need Mom and Dad and they want to be always physically close. It is actually absurd to think it’s best for the baby to leave baby all alone in a crib all night long. Countries where most parents co-sleep with their babies have the lowest SIDS rates in the world.
*GROAN* you guys named ‘she who must not be named’! Invoking the name of ‘she who must not be named’ ends up with her nutso, non-practicing, anecdotal-evidence-over-studies self frequently appearing in person to troll.
The *scientific fact* is that countries that embrace midwifery care for standard pregnancies have much better maternal/fetal outcomes than OB-centric countries. Worldwide studies have repeatedly been shown that midwifery care, in a homebirth or birth center setting, is as safe or safer than hospital care for normal pregnancies. And midwives know when to transfer. If an 8 month pregnant woman suddenly spikes pre-e, the midwives send her to a hospital. Midwives monitor babies and moms during labor, have access to the same prenatal tests as OBs, and can treat standard issues like group B strep, UTIs, minor hemorage, etc just as effectively as OBs can. Midwives are not for everyone, but using an OB, who is a surgical specialist, for a standard pregnancy is like using a developmental pediatrician as a babysitter for movie-night.
Is it *wrong* to want to give birth in a hospital with an OB? Of course not. Provided that is the parent’s decision and not something mom is being forced into. Just like there isn’t anything ‘wrong’ with wanting an epidural or agreeing to pictocin or continuious fetal monitoring. But if those things are getting forced upon you by hospital/doctor policy (which they are in the *majority* of U.S hospitals) then there most definately is something ‘wrong’. Nor is it wrong, neglectful, or abusive to consider you and your babies health and choosing *not* to risk a OB-centric model for prenatal, labor, and delivery when a midwife-centric one is proven to be as good or better.
Oh, Jen. At the risk of sounding like one of my pro-abort cohorts, I put my babies in the crib down the hall (when they were about 9 weeks) because it was the best thing to do for ME. I got up for night feedings, sure, but I had 2 babies back to back, and I was attached to them from dawn till night. I needed some unattached time, desperately. Plus, looking back (the youngest is 9), they learned to soothe themselves back to sleep if they weren’t sick, wet, or hungry. The only couple I’ve ever known who co-slept had their child in their room until 5th grade, and they rue’d the day they decided on the AP, in terms of sleeping arrangements.
who is she-who-must-not-be-named?
I’ve co-slept (or, more accurately, bed-shared) with all 4 of my kids because it helps me get the most sleep. Right now my 6-month-old sleeps in a pack ‘n’ play next to our bed, but if he does wake up to eat I just keep him next to me. He’s just now starting to sleep through the night on occasion (we both slept from 9:30pm-4am last night, woohoo!), so once he does so consistently we’ll probably move him in with one of his siblings. While he was still waking up at night to nurse, though, I got more sleep by having him in our bed with us so I didn’t have to get up and out of my bed when he woke up; I could just pop him on the boob and go back to sleep. I was more rested and a better mom as a result of bed-sharing, for all of my kids.
If a kid is in the 5th grade and still sleeping in the parents’ bed, it’s a discipline problem, or a problem with setting boundaries, not a problem with AP.
So I guess what this proves is that we have all found different things that work for us as moms.
I became a mom when everyone started posting stuff on the internet. It amazed me that all our choices as moms are SO politically charged: work vs. SAH, breast vs. bottle, to circumsize or not, cloth vs. disposable….
My first introduction to AP was a piece Diane Sawyer did, and the families she interviewed had older kids, some even teenagers, and they all coslept–had a big room and pushed all their beds together.
My life is all about my kids. But especially when they were little, I needed them to know that there were a couple hours each day that were NOT.
One thing I can’t stand is when women say they have this plan for their birth or that plan for their birth. First, it’s not your birth, it’s your baby’s, and your ONLY job is to deliver a healthy baby. I have no problem with a mom who wants to labor naturally, or in a tub or whatever. The problem I have is when a woman will refuse to do something her doctors deems necessary when the baby shows stress. I have seen women yell at doctors and nurses because they want herto deviate from her birth plan.
They have refused ultrasounds which can detect vasa previa, oligohydramnios, polyhydramnios, and a host of other things, some of which can be corrected prenatally for a healthy baby. All in the name of “natural” pregnancy and birth.
I have 7 children and never went into active labor with any of them. My water would break and I would never have a contraction without pitocin. Should I have not had my doctor administer the drug? Which would have been more harmful?
Susan, Group B strep can cause death from newborn sepsis. It’s not something I want to play around with. I’m not “slandering an entire profession”. Many homebirth/midwifery advocates suggest that vaginal garlic suppositories and hibiclens douching is an effective treatment. It has zero effect on GBS. The problem with midwives is that it’s like picking apples out of a barrel in a cellar with a blindfold on. You won’t know until it’s too late whether it’s a bad apple or not. I’ll take an antibiotic over a newborn dead from sepsis any day. It’s a reliable and effective treatment for GBS. And please note that I didn’t say everyone with birth preferences was ridiculous. I said, and I quote, “MY ridiculous birthing preferences”. MINE. I decided that I personally would rather not risk my child’s health by making the birth something that is “all about me, me, me and my experience” and instead be thankful for access to modern facilities with good medical care.
There’s no one correct way to parent. I chose the path I felt was best for myself and my children after prayer, soul-searching, and research. I’m tired of the currently trendy mindset that the only valid choices are attachment parenting, drug-free labor at home or in a midwifery practice, cloth diapering, and exclusive breastfeeding. It’s OK if other moms choose those things – I have done all of those except giving birth at home or in a birth center. And the birth I had with IV antibiotics, an epidural, and an OB on staff was the best I’d ever had (side note: the person who actually caught my baby was a midwife who is on staffin the L&D unit at the Army hospital here). I used to be an insufferable snob when it came to organic food, natural birthing, exclusive breastfeeding, and cloth diapering. God has taught me so much about these things in the past year. What really matters is that I love and care for my child and make the best choice possible using the grey matter God gave me. My way isn’t the only way. I prefer a more eclectic approach to parenting – there are elements to many methods that I agree with and many that I don’t. This isn’t an all-or-nothing proposition.
I’m thankful to have had a healthy, happy baby and an emotional as well as physical healing experience, finally free from the pain and anxiety caused by my previous natural-or-nothing extremism.
No, it’s also a woman’s childbirth experience. She gives birth to a baby, who is born.
“The problem I have is when a woman will refuse to do something her doctors deems necessary…”
That’s the problem. Necessary, why? Maybe it’s only “necessary” because the OB has a tee time he doesn’t want to miss. “The baby shows stress” – how? Why? Through what method?
Regarding refusing ultrasounds, many of the conditions you mention can be detected without u/s — that is, a u/s may be needed to confirm the diagnosis but there are indications or risk factors for those conditions that indicate a medical need for a u/s. But if there is no medical need for a u/s, why should a woman have one?
Regarding your births, if it was your choice to get pitocin, good for you. But many doctors will order pitocin when mother and baby are doing perfectly fine, just because THEY want the birth to go according to THEIR schedule, regardless of risk to mother and baby.
Courtnay says:
May 15, 2012 at 3:01 pm
So I guess what this proves is that we have all found different things that work for us as moms.
+1
A much less long-winded version of what I was trying to convey. :-)
Kristen, the problem is that the threshold for comandeering a deliver is way too low.
Birth is stressful. Using “stress” as an excuse to intervene is what got us to a 35% c-section rate in many hospitals in the US.
Some doctors say things like “it’s not your choice whether or not I do an episiotomy, it’s up to me.” There is no evidence that episiotomy is a useful intervention in 99% of births, but some docs do them all of the time. They will even lie to women and say they don’t and then cut one anyway. Since when is it OK to mutilate another person’s genitals without their permission? Only in births and circumcision is that OK. I yelled at the doc who cut an epi without my permission in my second birth.
Are you saying I should have lain there and shut up while he mutilated me because my only job was to deliver a healthy baby? Hell yes, I yelled. Wish I could have returned the favor to that misogynistic bastard.
So don’t tell me that all doctors and nurses know best and that mothers are just following their whims with their birth plan. It’s not that simple. You better have a plan when you go into the hospital or you have a 1 out of 3 chance they will slice you open like a Thanksgiving turkey. And if they do, expect no sympathy, because “at least you have a healthy baby.”
No thanks, women deserve far better than this.
I’m not really sure WHAT to do, should I ever manage to get pregnant again and carry to term (or almost to term, in the case of my daughter). Since I had an “emergency” c-section after 19 1/2 hours of induced labor. Induced because I developed pre-ecclampsia in my 7th month of pregnancy.
Some doctors ok VBAC (vaginal birth after c-section), and some say it’s too hard on the uterus..too risky.
The particular hospital at which I delivered (and would again) is known as a “teaching hospital”. All the ob/gyns seem to “circulate”. The doctor I picked only saw me ONE time, and was not the one who delivered our daughter.
What would you do in my position ladies? Would you want to try for a vaginal delivery..or would you just go for another c-section?
Because I’ve heard pros and cons to both.
I would find different providers, as a doctor you have only seen once can not possibly have any type of relationship with you. This type of random approach to women’s health care is the same type seen in abortion “care.” A decision between a woman and her doctor my foot.
How much counseling did you receive about nutrition your first pregnancy. Did they talk to you about your protein intake? Were you advised to get 100g a day?
If it were me, I would study up on nutrition, find a midwife, and learn everything I could about natural childbirth, including active positions for delivery to mitigate any possible risks to myself or the child.
Goodness, she’s beautiful. The producer of Big Bang Theory has to work really hard to make her look plain. She’s Gorgeous!
I’m diabetic, Susan, so I’ve studied up on nutrition.I see a doctor/diabetic specialist for all that. I’ve “studied” Natural childbirth . My labor with my daughter was without pain medication of any kind. They HAD to give me an epidural for the c-section, though.
That wasn’t really the advice I was asking for, but thank you just the same.
Pamela, sounds like you have it figured out! If I had it all figured out, I wouldn’t ask for advice on the internet!
If you are happy with the care you are getting from your assortment of doctors, then just do whatever they recommend.
Although I wish everyone were pro-life, it is beneficial to have pro-choice people express their concerns about hormonal contraception. I especially appreciate that she even has doubts about the health reasons for hormonal contraceptives. Many refuse to listen to any concerns about contraception because that would lump them in with pro-lifers.
I do like the idea of AP, but I think to do it 100% is quite hard and not neccessary, you can pick and choose whatever suits you. For example – I do exclusively breastfeed, I co-sleep with my baby for a few hours every night (usually), and I do “wear” her in a sling whenever I can (She’s too heavy to be in a sling or in my arms all day), I don’t use cloth nappies, but chose the most eco-friendly disposables I could find and will try to do baby-led weaning, with just some pureed food now and again. So it doesn’t have to be either-or. I am a strong supporter for natural birth though and all the research I’ve done throughout the years points out to the fact that these days labour and birth are way over-medicalised. I do think there are situations where medical intervention is neccessary, but that is small minority of all births. Personally – I had a 100% natural vaginal breech delivery with a midwife and couldn’t have a better experience.
Pamela says:
May 15, 2012 at 3:52 pm
Hi Pamela, I think you might find this blog useful and interesting – http://birthwithoutfearblog.com/
Lots of stories of successful VBACs and the ladies on the page are always ready to support, encourage and advice if you need it.
Susan and JoAnna,
By “stress” I mean the baby’s heart rate has dropped, either with each contraction or continually. This happens more often than most people think and it IS a cause for intervention.
Who the heck cares if you get an episiotomy? If you don’t want one don’t get it. If you yelled at your doctor, fine by me.
My last child had her cord wrapped around her neck and a decelerating headrests with each contraction. I have seen women tell the doctors this is normal, and I’m not saying some dip isn’t normal but they are not doctors and I have seen mothers refuse intervention when the heart rate is dangerously low and doesn’t pick up. When the doctor FINALLY tells the mom we are delivering NOW and then there are complications with getting the baby breathing or whatnot the mothers want to blame the doctors. No, sorry, it was the 1/2 hour he spent trying to tell that moronic mother her baby is in distress and needs help now.
Of course this is assuming that she’s willing to be hooked up to monitors in the first place. Something I find to be of little inconvenience for the safety of the baby. And you cannot detect accretes without and ultrasound.
And I didn’t choose to have pitocin. I NEEDED pitocin the risk of infection was too great especially with my third baby when my water broke at 9:00am and I still had no contractions at 11:00 pm when the hospital finally had a room to give me. My only concern was for my daughter.
Pamela, while I *personally* have a medical condition that would probably necessitate a repeat c-section (due to difficulty healing) if I have a primary c-section, while I would look into vbac i’d probably end up with a repeat c-section. However, in general, the risks of VBAC, when handled properly, are less than the risks of repeat c-section, and even the ACOG (gold standard for OB practice) states not only are VBACs safe and appropriate but even VBA2C. Having a prior c-section is not a *medical* reason, in and of itself, for a repeat section. VBACs are difficult not because of medical evidence but because of insurance liability. As long as you can avoid an induction/augmentation the risk of rupture is very, very low. The ICAN website has some wonderful information and can really help with questions, statistics, studies, and even finding a decent care provider. There is a blog called the Unnecessarian which is very good too (although she isn’t always talking about c-sections specifically).
In short I would absolutely advize someone to seek a vaginal birth after a cessarian provided there were not secondary concerns such as placenta previa or acreia (sp?), pre-e, or a necessity to induce.
Courtney, ‘she who shall not be named’ was named above in reference to the Skeptical OB blog. She’s well know among birth, pregnancy, and parenting blogs and is known for starting a lot of tollish arguements whenever her name is found in a post or comment section. It’s a joke that she must google herself for new hits because it’s bizarely common how frequently she shows up in even out of the way blogs after she’s been mentioned. There are several pregnancy/birth sites I read that simply refer to her as ‘you know who’ or ‘she who shall not be named’ to avoid a visit.
“When the doctor FINALLY tells the mom we are delivering NOW and then there are complications with getting the baby breathing or whatnot the mothers want to blame the doctors.”
See, my wife’s blood pressure was through the roof with each contraction, AND my daughter’s heartbeat was dipping down low. Since she was too out of it so the doctors asked me to give my consent for her surgery, I said “heck yes, immediately” because I wasn’t excited about seeing my wife and baby die. Since she is so obsessed with the natural childbirth stuff, she is still upset about the c-section, over 1.5 years later. I mean, I think it’s great to be all natural, I am half a hippie lol, but they are doctors for a reason.
‘she who must not be named’
Ok, I give up.
Who is ‘she who must not be named’?
Hats off to all you veteran birth moms.
I was a ‘coach’ at five drug free, natural births.
We successfully resisted one doc’s pressure to induce.
As soon as ‘he’ left the room the nurse gave us high fives.
We left the hospital and returned a week later when at the natural onset of labor.
Again, less than 1% of births in the US are outside of the hospital setting and we are 41st among nations in maternal mortality. Clearly, the medical community has a lot of room for improvement, and should put their own house in order before casting aspersions at midwives.”
I wonder how much the U.S. birth mortality/morbidity rates are skewed by pregnant ladies who come across the border just for the birth and who have not had any pre-natal care and adequate nutrition during their pregnancy?
JB,
She [and your baby] are alive to complain about it.
Count that as music to your ears and living proof that you made the best decision you could given the circumstances.
“She [and your baby] are alive to complain about it.
Count that as music to your ears and living proof that you made the best decision you could given the circumstances.”
Lol Ken, that might be the first time I have ever agreed with you. Cheers.
Kristen, I guess then your comment was aimed at me. I was monitored but not hooked continuously to them. I don’t see how natural birth is bearable when you’re flat on your back. I did it the first time. I wanted to be up and able to be in positions that felt right to me (I labored on all four for a long time). Every once in a while they’d put me flat on my back to check the baby’s heart. Midwives also check the babies heart. I think monitoring is prudent but you can do it without being hooked up to a million machines.
I wouldn’t believe anything a pro-abort doctor says anyhow. If they can’t even understand that life begins at conception and its wrong to take a life then how can I believe her opinion on home births etc??? She has already shown she has no logic or common sense or morality.
Here! Here!
Ken the Birther, oh for goodness sakes, it’s one of those jokes where you either know the person and get the joke or it’s very hard to explain. I’m refering to A m y. T u e t e r, a retired OB who seems to spend most of her time trolling the internet telling women who don’t think birth should be about scheduled elective c-sections and obeying their OBs every desire as if they are gods that they are abusive, neglectful parents who will end up with dead babies because of their own selfish desire to have a “spa treatment”. (And yes, that is quoted) she was mentioned, as was her blog towards the top of this discussion. In most of the blogs/sites I read it’s considered a huge faux pas (sp?) to mention her by name.
JackBorsch, Just because your wife’s c-section was necessary doesn’t mean she can’t mourn the experience and be upset by it. and just because she is upset over it doesn’t mean she doesn’t appreciate the necessity. My 1st was in the NICU for 32 days, it was a life-saving, necessary, and awesome thing to have availible. But my husband and I still mourn the bonding, time, and the ‘what if’ that might have been if it hadn’t been necessary. I didn’t even get to hold him for over 2 weeks. It was devastating at the same time as it was life-saving. The two aren’t mutally exclusive. It’s hard recovering from birth, even harder doing so with a surgical wound! And many/most c-section mothers are separated from their baby for hours afterwards, many report difficulty with breastfeeding. That all adds up to a lot to mourn when you were hoping for a safe and gentle beginning to motherhood to share with your newborn. My 2nd child was taken by the doctors, against my will, for all of about 10 minutes, and 2 years later it still ticks me off. Those first moments should have been spent in my arms. (In some ways it’s worse than with my 1st as there was no medical need for the separation, it was just ‘policy’ and I wasn’t in any positive to walk across the room and take her from the offending doctors).
I strongly recommend, if you feel your wife has any left-over angst about her birth experience, to direct her to http://www.solaceformothers.org it’s a wonderful peer to peer site for women who are/have dealt with a less than ideal enterance into motherhood and helped me greatly when I was struggling with the trauma, depression, and angst surrounding the birth of my 1st and his extended NICU stay. It’s a good community that has really helped a lot of women.
Kristen,
I have had 7 kids, and they have all had cords around their necks. It’s amazingly common. Number 5 had a true knot in his cord.
The episiotomy I had with #2 as described above was against my will. So no, even though I yelled, I could not keep the doctor from doing it. My experience is not unique.
Continuous fetal monitoring in labor does not lead to better outcomes. It leads to more interventions. If it makes you feel better to have it, I am glad you have that choice, but it does not mean that those of us who choose intermittent monitoring are not as concerned for our child’s welfare.
Some heartbeat decels can be treated with a change in position. Difficult to do with a numb mother or with one who is tethered to a bed with monitors and IV poles.
Some women go days without labor after their water has broken. If you are not in a hospital, you have less risk of infection, so many women choose to wait for labor to begin naturally. Of course, if any beginning signs of infection are noticed, that would be an indication to treat.
It comes down to perspective. Either labor and birth are natural processes to be left alone unless a need to intervene arises, or they are dangerous illnesses which must be medically managed in order to prevent certain peril. I’m in the first camp, but I respect people’s right to be in the second.
Amusing when proaborts blather on about ‘attachment’ when attachment and dependence are the very things they use to justify the act of abortion. Because *my autonomy*. Bialik may have good intentions, but her being prochoice is a willing admission she’d have been ok with killing those two kids at any time during pregnancy because they were attached to *her* body. Proaborts are not a credible source for parenting advice-they discredit themselves by their willingness to dehumanize and reduce their own children to the status of property to be disposed of unless they are wanted. Real love is not subjective or conditional. Prochoice love is. If they don’t value the life of their child in the womb, they won’t value it fully outside the womb.
We need to learn acceptance. Some mothers need or choose to use drugs during their labours, while others choose homebirths and/or minimal intervention. Some mothers continue the bonding processs with their baby once born by breastfeeding and co-sleeping etc… (attachment parenting). Other parents leave their children to cry in a cot in the hope they will become independent, or in the hope they will enjoy the break from their child. While we don’t need to accept behaviour from anyone which is against God’s will (especially abortion), we do need to accept the person. It is only by doing this that we will sow the seeds for change.
Going back to previous generations, parents did bond with their babies: breastfed them for as long as they needed it (4-7 years), co-slept with their babies and young children (to keep each other warm and protect them), and carried their babies about (also for warmth and protection). With the advent of contraception and other abortion methods, our society has lost the ability to bond with their babies/children, as the value of their lives have been devalued by our culture of death (consciously or subconsciously). Even some pro-lifers have been subconsciously brainwashed about child-rearing from the media and others involved with the culture of death.
Of course attachment parenting is consistent with feminism! That may sound strange to some of you. As a female: I have the right to be born. I have the right to breastfeed for as long as I need to, to feel close to my mother and receive optimum nutrition which only the breast can provide. I have the right to not be offered an abortion at any stage of my pregnancy by anyone. I have the right to choose where and how my baby is born (unless mine or my baby’s life is in grave danger). I have the right to breastfeed my babies for as long as I want to breastfeed them. I have the right not to be pressured into bottlefeeding my babies. I have the right not to be pressured into accepting free formula samples from hospital staff who are sponsored by formula companies. I have the right not to even be offered free formula samples, as one artificial feed can damage my milk supply, and put my breastfeeding relationship with my baby in danger. I have the right to co-sleep with my baby without being told lies about how it can increase the risk of sids, when I know from reliable research the opposite is true. I have the right not to have to return to work or be pressured into doing so. I have the right to not be pressured into using contraceptives after the birth of my baby. I have the right to take my baby wherever I need to go. If I need to be admitted into hospital, I have the right to take my baby with me so we can continue our breastfeeding relationship. I have the right to take my baby into any public place and breastfeed him whenever he is hungry or needs some extra love. I have the right to live, from the moment of my conception until my natural death!
As a child psychologist and a mom, one of the things that is so misleading about attachment parenting is the name. It is only called attachment parenting because of the theory it was based upon. It is not called this because it is the only form of parenting which allows parents to develop a secure attachment relationship with their children. There are numerous ways to develop a secure attachment relationship with our kids. I explore more of this myth here for anyone who is interested:
http://www.themommypsychologist.com/2012/04/15/what-does-the-mommy-psychologist-have-to-say-about-attachment-parenting/
It seems totally normal for mom and baby to be attached. If God hadn’t intended for mom and baby to attach, wouldn’t He have made them grow somewhere other than the womb? There’s another parenting philosophy in recent years (can’t quite remember the name), but I’ve had friends that adopted this parenting style. It was all about parent-directed feeding, getting your newborn on a schedule, and etstablishing that parental authority, etc. I did not agree with this detached type of parenting, although some may disagree. My doctor friend saw babies that were malnourished and failing to thrive because of this philosophy, the opposite of attachment parenting. Seems that getting a baby on more of a schedule would be more realistic when baby is around 6 months or so. Of course, there are probably exceptions.
Well in my opinion, having one or more kids attached to your boobs at all times is anti-feminism. How can a woman have a carear and be a milk machine at the d=same time? How can a woman have any kind of intimate relationship with her husband when the kids are in the bed every night? How is letting you rkids run your life without diciplining them ever not anti femnist? In my opinion attachment parenting is just going to turn kids inot spoiled bratty little mommas kids. They will have no sense of independance because they are getting a boob shoved in their mouth at the slightest whimper and if they act out well, hey thats ok, no dicipline here!!! So to be able to be a “natural parent” you must givie up any job or schooling dream, and beome a 24/7 milk machine…and dont even dream of saying “Np” to your kid! Thats not accepted, it might cause them to feel “shame” such bs!! hearing and saying “no” is part of life, these kids are goingt o grwo up with a false sense of reality and security! Mommas “milkies” are not going to be there forever to comfort you! welcome to the real world! Attachment parenting was made up by a MAN yet it centers around a WOMAN stying home with kids (litterally) attached to her at all times, weather by a “baby wearing garment” or suckling on her breast…hello!!! am I the only one that sees that this is So anti feminist!???
Well in my opinion, having one or more kids attached to your boobs at all times is anti-feminism. How can a woman have a carear/job/go to school and be a milk machine at the same time (extended breastfeeding)? How can a woman have any kind of intimate relationship with her husband when the kids are in the bed every night (co-sleeping)? How is letting you rkids run your life without diciplining (gentle dicipline) them ever not anti femnist? In my opinion attachment parenting is just going to turn kids inot spoiled bratty little mommas kids. They will have no sense of independance because they are getting a boob shoved in their mouth at the slightest whimper or boo boo……… and if they act out, or behave horribly well, hey, thats ok, no dicipline here!!! So to be able to be a “natural parent” you must givie up any job or schooling dream, and beome a 24/7 milk machine… I have seen online videos of todlers literally yanking their mothers breasts out in public to nurse or demanding to nurse right then and there, who cares if it is inconvienint for the mom! and dont even dream of saying “No” to your kid! Thats not accepted in attachment parenting, it might cause them to feel “shame” such bs!! hearing and saying “no” is part of life, these kids are goingt o grwo up with a false sense of reality and security! Mommas “milkies” are not going to be there forever to comfort you! welcome to the real world! Attachment parenting was made up by a MAN yet it centers around a WOMAN stying home with kids (litterally) attached to her at all times, weather by a “baby wearing garment” or suckling on her breast…hello!!! am I the only one that sees that this is So anti feminist!??? How does having your body belong to your childern and having to give up your life to stay home with them to have them “attached” to you at all times seem progressive in any way??? UUggg attachemnt parenting makes me sick! I hope my entire identity never becomes “mom” and thats it. I know you cant see it right now because your entire life is your baby(s) but There is much more to life than kids and having babies ladies…………